The Celtics Win Banner 18 With Bill’s Dad
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where we have a bunch of basketball pods. You can listen to all of them. Please do, because the Boston Celtics have won the NBA title. I have a new rewatch of us coming tomorrow night. That's why we did the Longest Yard. You like the Longest Yard? We've watched that one a bunch of times. I like the original one. Yeah, that's what we're doing. 1974 Longest Yard. That's coming Tuesday night because we had to do a special Monday night podcast because the Boston Celtics won their 18th NBA championship. My dad is here. That's all next. First, our friends from Pearl Jet. ♪

All right, I'm here with my dad. It was 11.44 Eastern Time. What happened today? You know, I'm still nervous. Did we actually win that game? The game's over, right? The game's over, right? It's over. We didn't give up that 18-20 point lead, right?

16 years ago, same day, June 17th, 2008. We were there. We were there. And the Celtics, you knew within probably the midway mark of the second quarter, it was like, they're definitely winning. And then the Lakers, you could see that. Celts were up by like 40. The whole second half was a party. Never a doubt we're going to win. This time around, we're up 21 with three minutes left. And you and I are like, we got to stop Luka this time out. He might hit seven threes. Even when we were up by 21 at halftime,

I had still had trouble getting Friday night's game out of my head. I know. And what an anomaly that whole game turns out to be. We were terrific tonight. And I thought Tatum played the game of the year. Yeah, that was the most proud I've been of Tatum after a basketball game, including the 50-point Philly game, including game six, Milwaukee. This was such a great, we're going to talk about him later. I mean, the big thing.

Pritchard hits that three. Oh. Heading into halftime. He comes in with four seconds left. I think Luka's shooting free throws. I think it was like three and a half seconds. And it was going to be 64-46 at halftime. Right. Pritchard comes in. He hasn't played the whole first half. He comes in. Everyone in the crowd, everyone who's ever watched the Celtics team this season knows what's going to happen. They're running some sort of Pritchard play. Dallas knows it. The Celtics know it. And Pritchard makes the half court shot. And that was Bird steals the ball loud. Yeah.

And that was the first time I really was like, I think we're going to win. I think it might have been louder than Bird steals the ball because this is game seven of the finals. No, it wasn't. That wasn't the finals against Detroit, that series. Nothing was louder than that. We thought the balcony was going to collapse. I thought this was pretty loud. This was pretty loud. It was definitely the loudest.

You've been at more games than me in this building. That was the loudest I've ever heard in this building. Let's say it's the loudest since Bird stole the ball and fed Dennis Johnson. What would have been a louder moment in the new building? Nothing. The last 20 years? Nothing. I can't think of anything. Nothing. Because like you said, the 2008 game six was not a close game. No. So there was never that opportunity for the crowd.

to roar. That was a roar in that crowd. Yeah, because people knew he was going to take a crazy shot. He pulled up even 12 feet further away than I was expecting, nails it, and the whole Celtic bench ran to him like it was a game right here. It was halftime. It wasn't even off the backboard. That was swish. Yeah.

18 titles for the Boston Celtics that we miscounted. You've been a season ticket holder for 51 years for so long that we thought it was your 10th final. This was actually your 11th. My 11th final. Seventh title. Seven and four. I think that's a pretty good record. And that was, we were in the house when they won in 84 and in 86 and in 08 and this one, four. This was a team that

We were with for a long time with Tatum and Brown. And I think the difference between this and 08, where we had Pierce that whole time, but really that was it. Everybody else kind of showed up. They showed up. Hired guns. Yeah, Garnett. This time, the Tatum Brown we've been with, you've been watching those guys since they were 19. Right. Although again, Porzingis, White,

Drew Holiday, they did come on board from elsewhere. - And Big Al, who was here for a while, left, came back, so he's kind of the third longest. - You know, of all the, everybody looked so happy on the stage. Nobody looked happier than Al Horford. - Yeah, it was, I mean, the best part, 'cause we've been fortunate enough to have been to a couple of these, the best part is when the starters start coming out one after the other, which is, if you win a title and it's a close game,

You don't have that. And this one, it was like, okay, the Dallas, Dallas waved the white flag under three minutes left to take Horford out. And Horford just walked over the scores table and he just looked at the whole section, had his hands up. And that guy's never won a title before. So that was great. Tatum and Brown came out together. Right. And then Drew and Derek came out together. It was a nice way to do it. Porzingis had come out earlier. I guess this may be the second happiest person. Everybody was happy, but Porzingis,

turning when they're on the stage, turning to the crowd, waving to people in the crowd. Guy was so happy. And I don't know if there's ever been a home Celtic player like him that engaged with the crowd. Right. Almost like watching when you're at like a fifth grade play and one of the kids is like waving to his parents. Well, he might. And his mind is he must be saying last year I was in Washington. Right. Now I'm here. I don't feel like he's probably ever really, truly been appreciated on a good team because even when he was on the Knicks, those teams were

- Fans love him. - He was in Dallas. - Fans love him. - Yeah, he came out before the game and the team's out, they're shooting and shooting around and then Porzingis, 'cause he's doing whatever, his treadmill thing, whatever he does. - He has two doctors out there trying to decide if it's okay for him to play. - Right, so he came in late and he walks in, the crowd goes nuts. - Right. - And then he just turns and he's just like waving. He's like this, "Hey guys, I'm here." - Kid in a candy store. And you know,

statistically it wasn't a great game, but he made a difference. He made a difference in second half. There was a stretch in the first half. He was a little rusty. Yeah. He came in and Josh Green had two threes and somebody else had a three and he gave up a layup and Dallas was just like, we're attacking this guy. Cause you could tell he couldn't totally move and he was rusty. Yeah. He couldn't move laterally the same way, but second half, he seemed to loosen up and I thought he played a lot, but he had a couple of blocks right at the rim. Um,

It definitely was a difference than game four where you had those Tillman minutes. Tillman didn't play tonight because it was just a bad matchup. I mean, some of the stuff that was sitting there in game three, game four, like how impactful Lively was, wasn't impactful tonight. Well, we kept looking up at the stats. The whole night, the Celts were significantly out-rebounding Dallas. And when you think about the Friday night game where we got killed on the boards, this was totally different. 51-35 rebounds.

15 offensive. The guards were getting... Holiday had four offensive rebounds. Derek White had four offensive rebounds. Derek White had his block. That was my favorite bet of the day. Celtics to win with a white block was like even odds on Fandle. So they fixed a lot of the stuff, the issues they're having in game four. And then the other thing is, I thought in the first half, they really were like, we're not

We're not letting Luca have 25 points in the first half. They were picking him up full court. Jalen, and we'll talk about the finals MVP later, but one of the great things he did in this game, he didn't shoot well, but he was full court with Luca, really trying to make him work a little bit. So they had to go to the side guys. Green hit a couple threes, like...

But it just wasn't the same. And Kyrie sucked. He was another stinker for him in Boston. A stinker and a couple of hero attempt three-pointers that didn't go in. He was five for 16. You know, Green hit those three three-point shots. They made a difference a little bit, but...

I just thought Porzingis was a little bit out of sync in the first half in terms of where he should be defensively. And they kind of cleaned it up in the second half. Yeah, it's interesting. He played 60 minutes, five points, one rebound. They didn't credit him with a block.

But he's plus eight. I guess maybe he didn't touch the ball, but he changed the... He had that big dunk off the brown pass for the alley-oop when it started to feel like in the second half. But I thought when you think like he came in and they immediately went on like an eight, nothing run, but then it was plus eight for the game. So he was a little impactful. Let's talk the Tatum game. Tatum was 45 minutes tonight, 31, 11 assists. I don't even remember him coming out of the game.

So he did come out for three minutes? I think he came out in the first half. 31, 11 assists, eight rebounds. He had nine assists in the first half. And two big boy drives in the fourth quarter. When Dallas... Luka was doing the Michael Myers thing. He just...

You chop his head off basically to get, to get rid of him. He's pretty scary. I'm going to have nightmares of him all summer. He's really scary. He wins by, I mean, just eternal respect. It's like two years ago with Giannis and the Milwaukee series when we beat Milwaukee and we were like, we're going to use we this whole podcast. He just got no help. I mean, Kyrie was on the road. Nothing. Yeah. I mean, they made some threes at a couple of corner threes, like we said, but, uh,

But Tatum. It was all Luca. And I thought Brown did a tremendous job on him despite the fact that Luca scored. I mean, he made him work. By about five minutes left in the fourth quarter, Luca could barely get up and down the court. He was gone. Yeah. I thought both sides seemed really tired in the fourth quarter. That thing...

And we've been to a few of these big games over the years. The energy of games like that and the games just feel longer than they actually are. And you keep looking up. That was one of those games. It reminded me of Game 7-04 Yankees-Red Sox when it was like,

We're up nine to two. We need nine outs. And then you're just looking at it. It's like, now we need eight outs. And it just felt like it was going on for seven hours. And here, I'm watching the clock. Yeah. I remember looking up. And it's not moving fast enough. I looked up at one point and it felt like the Mavs were starting to get ideas. And there was like four minutes left in the third quarter. It's like, oh my God, I feel like we've been here for five hours. You know, it's so significant though, 10%.

to have that 21-point lead at halftime. Yeah. I mean, I guess we shouldn't have been so nervous. It would have been awfully hard for Dallas to come back. But that's the thing about this team.

Basically tonight, and we got to talk about Tatum because now I forgot to do it twice. But this team all year felt like they were up 20, 75% of the season. And you're always like, I wonder if they're going to finish this. I wonder if the other team's going to go. It was just weird because I think when you're tied to threes and the offense would slow down sometimes. It was weird. The crowd was excited but nervous in the fourth quarter.

Yeah. Which I think was probably mostly Luca. I mean, you and I said before the game started, this crowd is nervous. You could just feel the nervous tension in the crowd to begin the game. Before the game, I mean, I got there almost an hour earlier. It wasn't the loud crowding as we had in games one and two. This was a nervous crowd. You didn't want to go with me into the game because you were like...

I don't, I'm going to show up before the game because I'm nervous. I don't want to be around anybody. And then you showed up with like 45 minutes before the game, just throwing popcorn down like a champ. Sitting in my seat. Yeah. Yeah. I wanted to watch some of the players warm up. You know, and it's interesting. Pritchett probably tried that shot three or four times because he's the only guy left out there before the game. Yeah. And that's his shot. The crazy, the crazy half court shot. Yeah. It's funny. Like,

So we had an 84 in person. That was just a bloodbath of a series and a really, really great, exciting game seven. But you know, those teams are really even. 86, there was just no question we were beating Houston. Like the Samson punches each thing in game five. It's like, we're definitely a hundred percent beating these guys. 08 felt the same way. Felt like we should have finished it in five in LA. Felt like we were better than laid the smack down.

This game, because how bad they looked in game four. Right. There was a weird energy. There was like walking around. There's a lot of people like, what do you think tonight, Bill? Nobody was like, we're going to do it tonight, Bill. Yeah. When I came in, the guy said to me, you know, we're down by 48 points on Friday. What do you think? Yeah.

You know, that didn't help my nervousness. Well, and then I talked to a bunch of like people who weren't rooting for either side, like NBA people, people working for different media and all of them were just like, you don't want to go back to Dallas on Thursday. And I'm like, I'm aware. I'm positive. I don't want to go back to Dallas. But it was one of those things, the things we were looking at were,

I remember texting this to one of my Celtics threads, rebounding. Rebounding. Can we take care of that? Rebounding for me was the key.

Drew Holiday revenge game for how bad he was in game four. And in the first half, he did good stuff on Kyrie defensively and made a couple shots around the basket. So that was a plus. He missed three little bunnies. Yeah. And he doesn't usually miss those. But he made a couple in the first half. The threes we were watching, they were 12 for 23 at one point. And then they missed eight in a row. Yeah, they missed eight in a row. But the threes were good. And then the big thing was Tatum. Yep.

He was like an orchestra leader out there, wasn't he? It was all the best parts of Tatum. And, you know, at the end of the first quarter, he had to do the quarters winding down. I'm going to take my step back three and he missed it. Right. And then in the second quarter, same thing, he made it. And then the Mavs came back down. Luca had the free throws. Yeah.

And then the Pritchard three. So there's like a flurry of action, but he actually made this step back at the end of the quarter. I was like, oh, he's feeling it tonight. He did make it. And then, as you said, Bountrick had the free throws, but he missed the second one. And the second one bounced, got the rebound. And they weren't ready. And they weren't ready when Pritchard had the ball, bring the ball up the court.

Yeah. They cut Pritchard's minute. Pritchard got cut out. Tillman was cut out. Porzingis played. They basically went seven. Hauser was big. Hauser had a couple of huge shots. In the first half. And then in the second half, he missed like two threes that would have just basically ended the game. And they rolled around. Both threes rolled around the room. Yeah. But Dallas, I felt like Dallas was just searching. Kidd was still, it's game five and he's like, ah,

Exum? Gafford? And he was playing roulette with all his role players and he couldn't find five guys. No, he was hoping one of the role players would get hot. It never happened. Yeah, because Hench texted me, my friend Kevin Hench, that the Mavs averaged 93.5 points in the four losses, which in the modern NBA...

is basically a catastrophe. And that's a high scoring team. Yeah. So they took away the threes, they took away the role players and they kind of held on for dear life. We took away Lively in this game and Lively was terrific in a couple of the other games. Yeah, he was never good in a road game though. It was interesting. It was the home games and that's the thing. It's by home court advantage matters sometimes, especially with young guys and role players. Especially the young players and the role players. Yeah. Let's take a break and then let's talk about the MVP thing.

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All right. So my dad, we talked about it after game one, that if Joe Missoula led the Celtics to an NBA championship, my dad was going to officially promote him from second row Joe to first row Joe. I was, for the record, I was all in on first row Joe after game one. I thought he coached a really good game tonight. What was interesting is he extricated himself from a couple of bad decisions. Like they went small ball,

um in the second quarter at one point and it just or the third quarter and just it just didn't work they took Horford out they didn't have Porzingis out they played Tatum then Gafford got two dunks right uh somebody else got a layup at the rim and he just immediately got out of it a couple other good timeouts too which he just didn't do last year but that example of small ball is a great example of maybe Missoula's growth because you're right it was a it was a bad move um

Dallas immediately scored, I think, eight points. He called a timeout and we never saw a small ball again. No. You will never hear me say second row Joe again. Oh. He's, he, he. I thought he did a great job. I thought he, he coached a great game tonight. I guess, you know, we're 16 and three in the playoffs. Right. We had a, a,

a sweep and three five game series. 80 and 21 for the season. It's going to go down as statistically one of the best teams ever. A little like the 2015 Warriors where I mentioned this the other day on the pod. People didn't really know what to think the whole time. I'm not going to even call him first row Joe. He's coach Missoula now.

Oh, this is really, I'm like welling up. Jesus. I didn't realize this was the end of Terps of Endearment. Yeah. Unbelievable. We won a championship. He's just Coach Joe. He's Coach Mazzola. Coach Joe Mazzola or Coach Mazzola. The team, I got to say, and I spent a lot of time with Boston people when I was in Dallas and I just heard the same thing over and over again. The players love him. The players respect him. He's really earned the admiration of everybody around him. And

I can't remember. Obviously we're hard on coaches and managers because that's what we do. That's what we do. We just like complain. They know way more than we do. We don't care. We complain about them, but I can't remember. We've been the first season. I remember anything was like the 74 Bruins and Celtics and just all the way through. I can't remember a coach or manager that we felt like this guy just doesn't, just doesn't have it. Who then did a 180. Can you?

Certainly didn't happen to the Red Sox. No, I can't remember. I mean... Patriots. Heinsohn, I always felt, knew what he was doing. Bill Fitch, knew what he was doing, but he wore it as welcome. Casey Jones...

Was he great with the players? I'm not sure he was a great technician, but... Yeah, he kind of killed us in 87. Well, he really killed us in 88. He didn't play Reggie Lewis. I'll never get over that. On my deathbed, it would be like the 11 thing I think of. Like, why didn't he play Reggie Lewis in the 88 playoffs? The first thing I'll think of on my deathbed is Magic's hook shot in 85. 87. Oh, 87, sorry. No, I'm sorry. There's...

Bruins coaches, I can't think of another example of this, but you know, we weren't, we were kind of out on Joe, but not all the way out because he was put in such a bad position last year that that was the hope. It's like, you know what? Nobody was ever in a worse coaching spot with that, with a team built to win the title and

Eme gets bounced right before the season. We lost Will Hardy from the season before too, who was the number one. So now we're down the top two coaches. He's got Damon Stoudemire leaves during the season and it just felt like

We would look at the assistants on the bench and we were like, who are these guys? Well, not only that, but they all had been hired by the previous coach. Right. It wasn't Missoula's staff. And, you know, the end of the season, last season, they all left for the most part to go to Houston. Yeah. And Missoula and Brad Stevens got to hire new assistant coaches. And they were terrific. And I thought they really helped Joe Missoula

mature as a coach this year. You can't put that aside. But some of the stuff we complained about with him last year, he just stopped doing. The stubbornness about, I'm never calling a timeout. The guys have to play their way out of it. And it was like, no other coach does this, Joe. You can't, you have to. And he did. He called, even today, he called a couple of momentum stoppers. But I would say that the assistant coaches and Brad Stevens helped him learn those nuances of the game.

And then the other thing, he was just so committed to the threes. And it's not something we certainly, that I certainly grew up with. And you've spanned all eras of hoops. But it just seemed like, can you really win just jacking threes? How many did we jack up there tonight? Because we also went inside a lot.

Really did. 13 for 39 from three. So we were. 33%, yeah. But we were 12 for 23. So they were one for the last 16. And that's what started to make us nervous. Yeah. When they missed eight in a row and stopped going inside, inside out or outside in. Yeah. I'm looking at the play sheet and it's just a lot of, a lot of misses at the top of the key actually. It feels like we missed like all the top of the. Well, most of those might've been Jalen Brown. Yeah.

did he make any threes? Yeah, it wasn't. So Jalen finished seven for 23, um, eight rebounds, six assists, five for six. And he was two for nine from three for nine. Yeah. So we both, and I don't really care. And what sucks about this is that once again, that there were, this is now a Tatum Brown conversation because this is what the national media will do coming out of the finals. Probably they'll wait a day. Right. And then it's like,

Who's the best part in this team? Is Jason Tatum going to like the fact that he didn't? Is this going to split the team up? I think those guys are super tight. I thought it was close. I thought Tatum's game tonight combined with all the other stuff he did in the playoffs, like the first half he played in game three, which he was exceptional, didn't have a good second half. Brown had the better second half.

All the stuff he was doing with Dallas's defense, they were geared toward Tatum specifically, I thought, for a lot of it. And I just thought he should have won. But I'm also fine with Jalen and I'm happy for that dude too. Well, after game four, when we talked, excuse me, after game two at home and then game three on the road, we talked and we both thought Jalen was heading toward the MVP. Yeah.

But tonight, after that horrendous game on Friday, for Tatum to lead the team like he did tonight and play the kind of game he played tonight. And again, it was like the person leading the orchestra all night long. I might have leaned Tatum's way. You know what? Now that I'm looking at it. So Tatum was 12 for 38 in the first two games. And for the series, he averaged 22, 8, and 7. And then Jalen averaged...

21-5-5. That's pretty close. Could have gone either way. Could have gone either way. It was one of those where it's like, can we just have them split it? Can we just have a split vote? I'm good with it as long as Tatum's good with it. You know? I haven't really wavered with this because this happened, I remember, in 07 with Tim Duncan, where Tim Duncan was the winningest player in the league in the 2000s and was the best part in the Spurs by far.

And they sweep a terrible Cavs team and Parker played really well. And it's like, our finals MVP is Tony Parker. And it's like, this is why in my book, I did a whole playoffs MVP. Cause I was like, cool. You have the MVP for a series, but we should also have a post-season MVP. And I think Tatum was the post-season MVP, right?

Or would you say Jalen? No, I'd say Tatum. But ironically or interestingly, Brown got both of the MVPs. Yeah, maybe you're right. I really hope this doesn't start shit. Who votes on the MVP? I was mad. I blame Tim Frank, whose son listens to this podcast. And Tim Frank didn't give me a vote because he said I didn't cover enough games. Oh. Yeah, I didn't get it. Okay. Sorry. So you might have made a difference.

I think I would have voted for Tatum because I thought he was so spectacular tonight that I feel like that would have swung it for me. Well, that was my thinking that after that debacle on Friday, for Tatum to play the kind of game he did tonight, it was so meaningful. And I didn't think Brown had a good game tonight. I mean, he didn't shoot well. He didn't have a good offensive game. He did have a good defensive game. He played really, really hard. Yeah, and I thought he did some good stuff on Luka. I mean, so it's 98-75.

And I'm still nervous, 98-75. Well, I was writing down notes. 98-75, 631 left. That was when Tatum had a three-point play and a two. And was just kind of... Nobody else could make a shot anymore and the offense got stagnant and he was kind of just carrying it. Well, did you know the first three minutes of the fourth quarter, we scored the only two points? Right. Yeah, it was 86-67. Nobody could score. Yeah, forever. But then...

Tatum then had those two fantastic drives in a row to make it 102-78 with 439 left. But those were like, I just don't think he would have done that two years ago. I think he would have done step backs. Those were bully ball drives to the basket. He wasn't going to be stopped. And this is the thing with him. And I keep saying this, every time, Russillo and I always argued on my pot. I just feel like he's so not a finished product yet. Right. I think he's going to be stronger. I think he's going to have a post game. Well, I think these, you win a championship.

Now the narrative is they're world champions. They're going to come back differently, I think. They're going to come back. They'll work hard in the game, I hope, this summer. And they'll have so much more confidence as a world champion. Well, can I say selfishly, it might be a good thing that Tatum didn't win the finals MVP?

Cause now it's like a little carrot. Yeah. Now it's like, okay, we, even though we won a title, I'm not the finals MVP bird didn't win in 1981. And it was an interesting one. Cause Maxwell was really good in that series. Yeah. He was really good. But bird was the best part on the team. Right. Um, I don't know. It's, it's a weird one because if you're just voting for the series only, um,

And you're kind of ignoring who the actual best player on the team is. I just hope it doesn't become an issue. And I hope... Oh, you know, the local Boston shows tomorrow, you know, they're going to have a... That'll be like the second segment they do. Yeah. Could this be it for Tatum and Brown? Those guys, I was watching... First of all, Tatum, I think...

if I had to rank the happiest guys coming up, I think he was out of the five starters. I thought he was going to start bawling. He was so happy. He was hugging everybody. Yeah. I thought he lifted Mazzola off the, off the ground. Right. He was so happy. Yeah. And then just in general, like first, I mean, we got to go through some of the dudes, Derek White,

who it seems like is looming now for Team USA because I had heard that before. I had heard that before too. If Kawhi doesn't play. He hit a couple of key three-point shots when Dallas was making those mini runs they make with Luka. Terrific season.

Yeah, wait. And we better extend that contract. Yeah, I don't think that's a question. And then Drew Holiday now. Four more years. I think with the way the...

barrier for the hall of fame has dropped like Michael Cooper made it. Drew's probably a hall of famer now. I think two titles for two different teams. He was the third best player on the bucks and. Right. Yeah. And also the way he changed his game to play for this team. Yeah. I mean, he, he, his game with Milwaukee was completely different. Uh, I mean, he was a second option scoring. Yeah. And had the ball a lot, had the ball a lot. Um, this team that wasn't the case, uh,

There was a selflessness with this team that I think was my favorite thing about it. I didn't always love the style of what they played, but I really feel like I thought every single player sacrificed something. Tatum, I think Tatum, if he wanted...

could be a 30 plus point a game score. Right. If he was just jacking up shots, Carmelo late 2000s style. He did have that season over 30, didn't he? Yeah. Or close. Yeah. And I think Jalen could be in the high twenties. Yeah. Drew could certainly score more. Porzingis on a different team could have been like a 25 points a game guy. Um,

My favorite part about this team is we sit near the bench and watching the closeness of the teammates, the camaraderie. It's so apparent. You don't see it on other teams. We certainly haven't seen it on certain Celtics teams. No. Oh, no. Yeah, there was when Hauser came in, he had his first three and Brissette was standing next to Mazula. And Brissette, who I thought could have played more in this whole playoffs and was probably the biggest player

perplexing thing for like we just like why don't that guy's energy and he rebounds he tries hard why does he play more but he was always locked in as a bench guy right and hauser was shooting that three and brissette was next to him you could probably watch them equip he's just jumping up and down like he's like a like a cheerleader uh the chemistry in this team was unbelievable unbelievable uh and what what's your phrase about uh when a team wins

how hard it is to keep that camaraderie the second time. The secret. Well, it's the disease of more. Yeah, the disease of more. This team will not have the disease of more. No, I don't think so. Jason Tatum's going to get a $350 million extension probably tomorrow. Right.

And Porzingis has been paid. Drew has been paid. Derek White has been paid. Well, Derek White needs to get the extension. Well, but he's going to get paid. They're giving it to him. I will say this, that Wick, who you could see, he had the cigar out. He had the cigar out with two minutes to go. He's a freaking character. Just eating it up. He was so happy. I think his original production company was called Banner 17.

Or his company or his LLC. Then it became, I don't know what it is now, but that was 16 years. It was a long time, man. When they won the 2008 title, my son was eight months old. And now he has a summer internship and he's driving. We also thought in 2008 that we were going to win the next two titles. I mean, we had the same team. We just had some bad health issues. Well, weren't you thinking about that in this run where it's like,

Yeah, I don't know if Porzingis is going to ever be healthy for an entire season again. Drew's in his mid-30s now. We had really good health luck this year, except for Porzingis. You know that could go sideways. Should we just save Porzingis for the playoffs? Is that possible? Could you pay somebody $30 million a year? Just to play 16 games? I mean, that's kind of what they did in this playoffs. Yeah, but I mean, it wasn't planned that way.

You know, we only lost four regular season games at home. Is that true? Yeah. That's my memory anyway. I don't think that's true. Is that accurate? No. I like that you think that though. No, let's see. Oh yeah. 37 and four at home regular season, but then they lost to Miami. Well, I said regular season. Oh yeah. 37 and four. And then in the playoffs, we lost two games. But only the one to Miami at home.

So they went. We lost game two against Cleveland at home too. Oh, that's right. Yeah. So six losses. That's pretty good. Pretty good. When did you think this team could win the title? I always thought this team could win the title. Do you want me to go throw my text?

I don't remember texting anything like that. I thought the addition of Porzingis and Holiday just made this team so different in terms of the approach. My concern was we're so three-point happy. I mean, that's always been my concern throughout the season, but I thought this was possibly a championship team. Mike, the other thing that I did bring up to you repeatedly was I don't know if we could beat Denver.

And neither one of us wanted to go near Denver and we never had to go near Denver. So that was fortuitous. I'd like to thank the Minnesota Timberwolves for coming back from 20 in a game seven. Yeah, it was a little rock, paper, scissors-y with Minnesota, Denver, and Dallas. Because I think Denver would have been Dallas. And for whatever reason, Minnesota was able to beat Denver and ran out of gas. And I keep thinking big picture about

Who knows? We talked about the health stuff, but then you think about Milwaukee. They're going to be back. They're going to have the eye of the tiger. We'll see what Philly does, if they can get Paul George or whoever. Miami can always pull like some crazy move out of their ass. Who knows if Orlando is going to sign somebody. So these will definitely be better. And then the Knicks, whatever they do, they're going to be a problem. So we should have six teams plus whatever happens with Cleveland. Then the West,

You have Denver, Dallas. This Dallas team now have a full year and I'm sure they'll add somebody. Minnesota, OKC, which I'm sure is going to do something. Memphis is coming back. But the good thing is- The league's loaded. Only one team can come out of the West, fortunately. They knock each other off. You know-

A lot of outside of Boston people will say we lucked out. We played a Cleveland team where Mitchell got hurt. We played a Miami team where Butler didn't play. Yeah. We played an Indiana team where the point guard. I don't remember anyone saying this about the 2013 heat. I'm saying that it's- When they were beating the Pacers without Danny Granger. And it was basically just Paul George, Roy Hibbert, and David West. And there was like no other competition really. Right.

I want to repeat one thing we talked about in the other podcast because Adam Silva said it today to the team that's won the most championships, 18, won more than the Lakers. Yeah, the Lakers cheat though. Can we throw away the Minnesota championships?

They count like five Minnesota championships. You know what I heard? I think they're going to count the in-season championship too. So I think the Laker fans think they're still tied. Cut this out as a social clip.

You guys can't count the Minnesota titles. They don't count. And you can't say- You stole the team from Minnesota. You don't get to count the titles. And you can't count the in-season tournament as a world championship. Every time I argue with the Laker fans about this, because I know a bunch of them obviously live in LA and they're like, well, we're still called the Lakers and Elgin was on the Minnesota team. And I'm like, okay, okay.

Do OKC fans count the 1979 Sonics team as like, ah, well, we got that one title with the Sonics. Like, no, they don't. Yeah. So in my mind, they can screw off. In my mind, it's 18 to 12. I took a lot of shit from the Laker fans, both in my life and people who listen and read about how we had only won one title since 1986. That was a big, big thing. 2008. Right. Yeah. But it was like last 38 years, one title. Oh,

By the way, our drought's over. Our five and a half year Boston title drought. I know you're starting to get hairy about it. Well, I'm already thinking about the parade on Wednesday when it's 100 degrees out. It's going to be an interesting day. Are you going to go? You got to go. It's going to go right down the street.

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slash BS. There's no safe, like simply safe. Today's brilliantly boring segment is brought to you by PNC Bank. Some things in life should be boring like banking because boring is pragmatic and responsible, level-headed and wise. All things you want your bank to be. So this Celtics team, which I think people were bored by the fact that they would just take these leads and

People are always expecting like, well, I don't understand this team because who's like, how can you win if you don't have one of the best guys in the league and Tatum's not one of the best forward? I think there was something boring about them because basically their top six was way better than anyone else's top six. And that could overcome the fact that they don't have like Luka on their team. Yeah.

which is kind of boring to talk about. Well, it's how we won 16 games in the playoffs. Right. It's a team. I mean, we didn't rely on one person. No, you could win. This team could, the Mavericks, they could not win a game if Luka or Kyrie sucked. In game three, Holiday had 26 points. Right. I mean, so I think he was a high scorer for the Celtics. And the next game or tonight, I don't know what he had, but.

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National Association member FDIC. Could you say brilliantly boring or no? Probably not. I probably don't want to do it right now. Bob Cousy, no chance in his prime. By the way, shout out to Bob Cousy. You know. 95 years old Bob Cousy. He was like, I just want to see one more title. I loved the long statement he had.

a few days ago about one more title, please, at the age of 95. I feel the same way, by the way. Well, I was thinking about that. I mean, you're in good shape and good health, but we're getting at an advanced age. The last one happened when you were 60.

Same day, by the way, June 17th. June 17th. 6-1-7 area code, which I thought made us invincible. And then one of my friends pointed out that we lost game seven in the 2010 finals on June 17th. Oh, really? Yeah. So maybe at home in 6-1-7. Well, that was a road game though. Yeah. Yeah, that was a road game. So at home, we're invincible. All right. So rank the teams. Let's hear it. Favorite Celtics teams of all time. Favorite champs. We have seven to pick from. 74, 76, 81, 52.

84, 86, 08, and 24. I'd say... Because think of us as your top three. I don't want to have a number seven and then... I'd say 86 is my top. The bird apex season. Tonight's 2024 is my second top. Really? Over 81? And 81 is my third top. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Because I...

I just always hoped for one more championship. And, you know, it's so hard to get there. It's so hard to get through all the rounds you have to get through hoping that you're going to stay healthy. The Western teams have been pretty tough this whole season. So whichever team we played was going to be tough. And injuries, the Porzingis injury,

Kind of made us take a step back. You know, is this going to cost us a championship? And it's so hard to win. It's just so hard to win. And the other thing is, I'm so happy that Brown and Tatum have been elevated. Yeah. And I mean, it's great that Horford won a championship, but for Brown and Tatum, they had to get over the hump nationally. And I think nationally, they're looked at differently as of tonight.

They're champions. Yeah, we've seen that happen a few times over. Like, definitely 100% happened to Giannis. Yeah. Happened to Kawhi. You've seen it happen. I'm trying to think of other ones. That first Warriors title. It happened to Joe Mazzola tonight. Happened to our guy, Joe. Yeah, I was thinking about it. I was walking around. I was so nervous today.

I walked around all of Boston. I walked to Cambridge. I walked through Charlestown where I used to live. I literally, I think I walked 27,000 steps. So you were as nervous as I was? Yeah. Well, Luca, it was so easy for him to score in game four that I just couldn't stop thinking about it. I was like, Luca might have like 48 tonight and just like suck our souls out. And the history of basketball is sometimes if you have one guy on the other team, it was just awesome. They could just, so I was just walking around and thinking about that. And I was thinking about

All the things that happened since we won in 08 when we felt like, ah, this team's got at least one more, right? Then 09, KG gets hurt. 2010. Perkins gets hurt in game six. Perkins gets hurt in game six and freaking Rashid Wallace who we couldn't stand that year. And then he has to play 35 minutes. We blow game seven. Artis hits it. Crazy three. 2011, make the Jeff Green trade. Rondo hurts his elbow in that Miami series. So that one's out. 2012,

We're up 3-2 and LeBron just sucks our souls out in game six, then Bosh hits him three in game seven. 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, we weren't gonna win those years. 18, really good chance, Kyrie and Hayward's first season. Hayward's out in six minutes.

We take Cleveland to a game seven anyway, and LeBron was just unbelievable. Beats us. 19, 20 in the bubble. Eh, maybe. But that team didn't feel like... No, that didn't... Kemba was really bad in the bubble. Our defense was bad. 21, bad year. 22, I remember walking home with you after game five Milwaukee, and we felt like we lost a title. Right. Because we were like, the league's wide open. We're going to get this. Then they come back and win that.

And then Golden State just gets their mojo and they take it from us. 23, we lose a game seven at home in Miami. It is weirdly like a lot of downers. It's weird. You made me do the podcast after we lost to Golden State. That was a tough one. Yeah, that was almost a human rights violation. I couldn't believe you pulled it off.

It was tough. I mean, I really thought we were going to win that year. Because one thing about my dad is he's still 100% in. My friend Hershey was telling a story about when we were in the 2013, I was doing the finals for TV. So we're in San Antonio. Oh, I was there. And we watched the Bruins-Blackhawks game in the hotel lobby. Right. And it went in a double OT, I think, and the Blackhawks scored. And really, that killed the Bruins season.

And you just said, I'll see you guys later. And you just left. And Hershey looked at me. It was like, I just want to care about sports that much when I'm older. And now 10 years later, still there. But I mean, when we left game seven last year that Miami, Tatum gets hurt in eight seconds. It was awful. And we were just like, what's going to happen to this team? The chemistry was off with Marcus and Grant. Right.

You got to credit these, the moves they made. The trading Marcus was, Marcus's name wasn't mentioned for the last two weeks, but remember they trade him. Everybody's like, who's hard and sold the team. You know, you just remind me of something. You know who we haven't talked about? Brad Stevens. We should have. I mean, the moves he's made. Yeah. After that horrendous seventh game loss to Miami last year. And obviously he knew that team.

wasn't going to get over the hump the way it was constructed. Which is how we felt as well. And we felt as well. But not every general manager is going to make the moves he made. I mean, they were risky. It started with the Horford trade. Gets Horford back, who seems like he's on his last legs just to get rid of the Kemba contract. Gives up a pick for that. The way trade...

I remember when we found out there was a pick swap and it was only top one protected and like five years later and we were like, oh my God, what if Tatum's not here? That's an awful lot for a guy we never heard of. Yeah, we were like, I like Derek White, but Jesus. And then the Porzingis trade, which was just a great trade. I still can't believe we got picks on that. And then that led to the Drew trade, which was the all-time no-brainer. Of course we have to do that. But yeah, he did a great job. Great job. And a bizarre...

They hire him as a college coach. They're going to tank for a couple of years. And he's such a good coach that they kind of audible in his second season, remember? They traded for Isaiah Thomas. And I think they got the eight seed and we were supposed to be losing intentionally. And it was like, he was too good of a coach. And then ran his course like a lot of coaches did. It kind of ran his course in a weird way that you mentioned it earlier. The Kyrie Irving stuff.

Would kill any coach. Yeah. Would you feel, Kyrie genuinely seemed remorseful about how he behaved when he was here. And I didn't know. How about with two minutes to go when, two and a half minutes to go when Dallas emptied the bench, brought the starters out, and Kyrie went to the Celtic bench and hugged every Celtic? Or, yeah, and then he realized that would be ridiculous. I mean, really? Yeah, there was like two and a half minutes left.

We're up 20, but still nervous somehow. Yeah, still nervous. Coming out of a timeout and Kyrie just go and he's hugging Joe Mazzola and he's hugging Tatum. And we're like, what the hell is he doing? And then we realized white flag and you're like, we just won the championship. I'm not nervous anymore. See, Kyrie, you knew when you saw Kyrie that we would win a championship. When he started hugging people and kissing people, I knew we won the championship. Yep. Trying to think what else we have to cover. But what happens now? Well, you know,

almost the whole team comes back. Yeah. And we didn't talk about Witt Grosbeck, who I've gotten to know over the years. I give him so much credit for spending the money he's spending to give us this championship team. Yeah. Yeah. Because you go back to the 2000s and he made all the typical usual mistakes a new owner makes. Yeah.

Then eventually the 08 happens. But I think he's clearly one of the three best owners in the league. But all you can ask for from an owner is like, do you give a shit about the team? Will you spend money? Is money no object to get where you need to go? Are you going to hire the best people around you? One of the things that I, because I hung out with Boston people a lot when I was in Dallas. This organization has been together. It's really rare to have people

an organization of people that have just been there for a while. Like they have the president, the CMO, the CFO, like you go on down the line, the head of sales, they're all the same people that were there in the 2000s. And they really value like loyalty, continuity, the people they hired, like they're all in on the team and it's really hard to pull off. And he pulled it off. No, you're right. I remember in 2010 when, uh,

I went out to LA for game six and seven and got a chance to meet all those people. They're still here. They're still here. 14 years later. It's incredible. And I think...

Just big picture, like you have guys like Tatum or Brown. They really do value certain character guys. And maybe they learned the hard way that that's a good thing to look for. But I think Brad, I think that's why you go after White. That's why you go after Drew. So I don't know. Character guys. Yeah. Character guys. And character coaches. Well, I was saying to somebody who was talking about Drew with a basketball friend of mine, I was just like, Drew is like exactly...

the 03-04 Patriots when we won the two Super Bowls. And we had all those dudes like Vrabel and Bruschi and Rodney Harrison. And it was just like guys who just wanted to fucking win. And that was it. And Drew's just like that. He didn't care less what his stats are. It's like, what do we need me to do tonight? Do I have to guard Luka? Do you need me to actually handle the basketball? He just doesn't care. He's going to do what it takes. And it's obvious his teammates really, really

love him and he impresses them with his character. Yeah, he was kind of like the quiet leader of the team. And then White was just such a delay. What a rollercoaster ride with that guy. Remember in 2022, we were like, is this guy, can we play this guy in the playoffs? Can he score? Can he shoot? Can he make a basket? He went cold for two straight weeks. We were talking about like the Derek White face. Shaved his head. It feels like that helped him. It must have helped. And as a family now, he's a family man. I don't know.

He got so much confidence this year. Yeah. He credited Missoula for all of it. He's like that. Missoula's willed me to be a great guy. And I watched when White came out tonight, he went over and he and Missoula really very affectionately hugged each other with respect. Yeah. So for popular Boston teams, 04 Red Sox is at the top top. Always will be. Yeah. We're never topping that. Yeah. The 15 Pats.

the, the, the, uh, deflate gate and then beating Baltimore at home, beating Indianapolis and then beating Seattle coming back in the super bowl. I feel like, and then having the whole deflate gate thing and it became less against them. I think that was the most popular of all the pets teams for me, just like, and Brady's at the peak of his powers. And even though Oh one was amazing, but that was like a sports movie. It didn't almost feel real. Um, Bruins, uh,

2011 for the modern version. And then if you're going backwards, there's some of those late 70s teams or even the older teams. Unfortunately, in the last 13, 14 years, they just can't get over the hump. Right. They don't have the speed that all these other teams seem to have. But, you know, you said it earlier, Celtics haven't won in 16 years. That's a long time. This means a lot to the city. Yeah, Tatum was 10 when they won. This means a lot to the city of Boston.

And people listening to this are throwing up right now. They're like, you're fucking kidding me. How many titles? Two, six Pats, two Celtics, four Red Sox and a Bruins. So we've had 13 titles this century.

So I have like, I mean, I have like a Knicks, Jets, Mets fan. Yeah. Friends of my life. I don't have to worry about what you worry about. I don't have people in other cities. Yeah, that's true. You only get to see people from this city. I mean, I only see people in Boston. So, uh.

I'm sorry that you have that problem, but I don't have that problem. But see, we're on the cover of the Boston Globe on Friday. I was on Friday. They wrote a piece about longtime Celtics fans and ticket holders. And somehow there's a photo of you just staring out the window. It was a good photo. Do you think anyone under 50 saw the people under 50 get newspapers? Well, it was also online. People read it online, but I might've bought a few copies of the newspaper. You got to start thinking about your personal brand now. You're like Tatum.

Well, I've been asking for my own podcast and you seem to be denying it. The blue plate special. I think out of all the biggest surprises from this year, if you had told me when Jalen got that contract, how is this going to go? There just would have been like, well, there's one scenario where they actually win the title and he's the second best player. There's another scenario where

He tries to justify the deal and it screws up our entire season and we trade him in the summer. I did not have the scenario where it's like, he's going to go up a level. He's going to be one of the best two-wear players in the league. He's going to become one of the best forwards in the league along with Tatum. And he's going to win the conference finals MVP and the finals MVP. I did not have that on my bingo card. No, I didn't either. And I thought the first quarter of the year, he was trying to justify that contract. Yeah, no question. And then eventually...

somebody must have gotten to him or whatever, but he's, he played differently in the second half of the year. Cause he's one of those guys. He was always in the border of frustrating Celtics territory. Right. Cause I remember going way back when we had the tickets in the late seventies, early eighties, Rick Roby. And I remember there was a couple of people in our section. They'd Rick Roby just drove them crazy. Yeah.

Remember the Goldbergs? Yeah. And it would be like, Roby would just fumble something out of bounds. And the guy who was like the nicest guy would be like, Roby! He was just so mad. And over the years, you have these frustrating Celtics. And part of me always wondered is Jalen...

that so he's going to be this guy who's 20 points a game and a really good player but frustrating. They had a... When they had the draft where we picked Jalen Brown. Yeah, they booed. They had a draft party and I took your daughter. I took my granddaughter Zoe to the draft party. Oh. And...

I guess the fans who were at the draft party wanted Murray. And when they picked Jalen Brown, they booed. Which was stupid. Really stupid. But that's what you get with those stupid gatherings. But yeah, that wasn't a great way to start. And obviously he knows all about that. I think a couple of times he's referenced it actually. You know,

He does so many things within the city. And I think people know some of it, but not all of it. He's been one of the most valuable off the court Celtics ever. And that's something I've talked about in the pot over and over again. Like you don't want to lose dudes like Tatum and Brown. I mean, part of me thinks like now that they've won the title, they're not going anywhere. These guys could, this could be a bird McHale situation. I saw, I saw Wick when I was in Dallas and,

I don't think I'm betraying his confidence by telling this, but like, you know, when, when that Brown extension comes up. You mean the Tatum one? No, Brown. Oh, last year. Last year. Okay. You know, you could haggle with that one and try to get them for $299 or $289 or whatever. And,

I think he would probably say this. He was like, you know what? We're paying him what the extension is. Like he's worth it. He's one of the best players in the league. We're doing this. They didn't want to, because that last contract he had,

was a little bit of a discount. Yeah. Right? And it's like, he's like, this is one of our guys. We're not, I'm not trying to save a couple million a year on the salary cap. I want this guy to make what he's worth because he's worth that much to us, which I think is a really great thing to do. And they're going to do with Tatum too. And I think as an owner,

his relationship with the players reflects that kind of a decision. Yeah. I think the players... Also that he knew the salary cap was about to go up. Well, in five years, that contract is going to look like a discount, ironically. Right, when Luka's playing for $100 million a year on Dallas. When the new television contract is settled with the three different bidders, it's going to be crazy money. Well, I wonder, one of the things that happened with the Pats...

And this is like, I know one of the dumb topics this week will be, is the Celtics, are they going to be a dynasty? We do this every year. I remember doing a segment about Denver last year. Could they be a dynasty? It's really hard to just keep winning titles. But I think one thing that might happen is you might be able to grab a vet

in a way like the way the Patriots were always able to grab these dudes. Because they want to play for this team. Like, oh, Junior Seau, want to try to win a title with us. And I wonder if that could happen because one of the best things with them is the East is...

probably a little easier in the West. Like which conference would you rather be in? I'd rather be in the East. And with Philly, who knows with Embiid, Milwaukee's old, Miami's Butler's in his mid thirties. You start going down the line. It's like, this is the safest bet in the East. Right. So could they steal somebody? There's some second apron stuff with them that it takes. I think they could make it hard. Even with the second apron stuff, that's going to surface. You could see a veteran taking a discount. Um,

I'm not sure the role players that we have now, who's coming back. I know- Well, they can, they have, Howes are in a team option, so he comes back. They signed Pritchard. Cornette is a free agent. Cornette, maybe not. Maybe not, but I'd like to see him come back. And why wouldn't he come back if he got a fair offer? Yeah, it seems like everybody loves those. Yeah. Do you, my daughter is Zoe Simmons, who was a fetus during the 2004 Red Sox run.

And then showed up and within a couple of years, the Celtics won and they just kept winning titles. And we always call her the good luck charm. And then she goes to school in Boston this year. She saw a lot of games with me. Starts going to Celtic games with you. Yeah. And then they win the title. I just, another feather in her cap. So we should give her all the credit. We'll give her a little bit. You know what I noticed? She didn't fly back for game five. That is true, but I'm not sure she had a seat either.

Are you going to give her your seat? Probably could have found one. Probably, yeah. But she was a good fan. She's a good fan. So this, you had the combo of like, you got to go to a bunch of games with her, with your wife. We got to go to the finals. This is a great start to finish season for you. Perfect season. And our drought's over. I have no complaints. I'm in on the coach. What more could I ask for?

51 years, 11 finals. Seven victories. Seven titles. What kind of hat, t-shirt thing are you capable of? I'd like one of those white championship t-shirts. Yeah, those are pretty nice. They look kind of neat. Yeah. All right. Well, thanks for taking me to all these games over the years. You're welcome, son. It was...

I still think 86 was my favorite. I said that as well. Yeah, I think that was the right call. The 81 whole playoff run was probably my favorite. The 81 is... Beating Philly was still my favorite series we've ever won. Beating the conference finals against Philly is my favorite series. Yeah. But it wasn't... I moved this one up as my second favorite championship. And then probably best individual finals game we ever went to.

I would say it was the heat game in the 84 finals game five when it was like 130 degrees and somehow Bird wasn't tired.

Yeah. That was a great one. And all the great stories. But this is, we'll remember this one, this game, game five is, it'll be the Tatum game, right? It was like, we wanted him to big boy game and it happened. Well, also it comes on the heels of a debacle three days, three nights earlier. That nobody will ever remember. Nobody will ever care about again, but it made me, you walked around Boston all day today. Yeah. I couldn't even watch TV. I was so nervous. So yeah.

That's all gone. We won the championship. All right. All right. Year 52 next year for you. Dad, thanks for coming on. We did it. Seven titles. This podcast was produced by Kyle Creighton and Steve Cerruti. I don't know when I'm coming back. It'll be at least two days, but thanks for listening. Go Celts, and I'll see you later in the week.