Deep Dive
Shownotes Transcript
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This fall, we're heading to cities that we didn't get to visit earlier this year. We'll be coming to Austin, Tucson, Boulder, Portland, Oregon, Detroit, Madison, Northampton, and Atlanta. Lauren and I had so much fun telling these seven brand new stories that we decided we wanted to go back out on the road again. Tickets will be on sale Friday, July 26. If you're a Criminal Plus member, keep an eye on your email. You can get your tickets even earlier, starting on Tuesday, July 23rd.
You can find all the details at thisiscriminal.com slash live. See you on stage very soon. What is it like being so close to a hippo? What do they smell like? What are they, what's their skin like? The skin is not so nice. Sorry. When they get hurt in the wildlife, hippos, they have this, thinking the skin like, like, like blood, but it's not blood.
Dr. Gina Paolo Serna is a wildlife veterinarian. She spoke to us from her apartment building, where there is a lot of construction. The name hippopotamus comes from the Greek for river horse. Hippos spend most of their life in water, in rivers and lakes. When they're out of the water, their skin dries out and can burn. They make a fluid to protect their skin.
So they are like sweaty all the time. Hippos can grow to be over 16 feet long and about 5 feet tall. Male adults weigh about 3 or 4 tons, about as much as a large SUV. They're the second largest land mammal on the planet, after elephants. Hippos are very territorial. They've been known to attack lions and hyenas, and sometimes people. In 1996, during a canoeing trip, a man was partly swallowed by a hippo.
He said later he could feel the water from his waist down, but from the waist up, he said, quote, I was warm, and it was just incredible pressure on my lower back. I tried to move around. I couldn't. The hippo spit him out. He survived. Many hippo attacks are fatal. Across Africa, it's estimated that 500 people are killed by hippos every year. Were you scared the first time you got close to one? Yes, yes.
They are not nice. So I'm always really, really careful about how I work with them. And I'm really, really scared every time I'm approaching a hippo. Scientists think that the hippo's ancestors were one of the first large mammals on the African continent, before lions, giraffes, and buffalo. Most wild hippos are still found in Africa.
But there is a group of wild hippos in South America, in Colombia, where Gina lives. We have hippos in Colombia because Pablo Escobar brought four hippos. And the actual population of hippos that are here in Colombia are from these animals. How many hippos are there now? About two years ago, I participated in a study
And we count more or less 160 hippos. So from three to 160. Yeah, and that's, I think, now are more. Pablo Escobar bought the land to build his ranch, Haciendanopolis, in the 1970s. It contained a mansion and several separate residences, a sculpture garden, a motocross track, 27 artificial lakes,
It had its own gas station and airfield. He kept a collection of classic cars there and built life-size dinosaur sculptures. And then Pablo Escobar got the idea to build his own zoo. For his zoo, Pablo Escobar smuggled in over a thousand animals from wildlife breeders in other countries, like Brazil and the United States. Most of them had to be flown into the country late at night on military transport planes.
Black parrots, ostriches, elephants, rhinoceroses, camels, dolphins, kangaroos, and hippos. I'm Phoebe Judge. This is Criminal. Growing up, Gina used to visit the zoo at Haciendanopolis. She was always interested in animals. She went with her father when he drove out to their cattle farm, but her father never let her do any work.
He said that girls are not made to be in the farms. But look at me, I'm a wildlife vet, so... The farm was in Doradol, a few hours outside of Medellín, near Haciendanopolis. So every time we go to the cattle farm, we stop in the...
Hacienda Annapolis Zoo because it was open to the public. So anybody can go there and visit the animals. So because of my love for animals, I always say to my dad that please stop there. So we were going like every two weeks, more or less.
I did not remember the hippos. My mom remembered, but I did not remember because for me it was not like so cool. For me, it was more cool or big animals like elephants and giraffes.
So you always went straight for the elephants. Yes. Well, what did the zoo look like? It was an open zoo. Did not have a lot of cages. So you can go through the road and you can stop and see the animals and touch the animals. Well, the animals that you can interact with. The wild animals were like far away.
You can see it, but it was not like in big cages, no. It was like completely different from the other zoos that I used to visit in Medellín or in other cities. Did you know that it was owned by Pablo Escobar? No, it was like a small girl. And at that time, Pablo didn't have...
This bad image. For the people of Colombia, especially in the Medellín zone, Pablo Escobar was like a hero. So for me, he was only a nice guy who have a lot of animals and you can see it free. Pablo Escobar said, this zoo belongs to the people. As long as I'm alive, I'll never charge an entrance fee.
This is a big question to ask, but tell me, who was Pablo Escobar? Pablo Escobar was born in Envigado. Envigado is a city next to Medellín. Right now, they're the same metropolitan area, like it's the same thing. But in those days, Envigado has its own thing, has its own vibe. It's a city that...
It's like, I don't know, Manhattan and Brooklyn, right? You know where you are when you are there. Jorge Caraballo is a journalist from Medellín. And Pablo Escuadro was from a family that was very humble. Eventually, when he was young, he started leading this little gang, and they used to steal cars. That's what they started doing. And then eventually, he got connected to...
the big business in those years, this is the 70s, the big business in those years, which was marijuana and later cocaine. He started dealing with these drugs, moving these drugs. And I say that it was a big business because
It was not that huge problem in the public health, in the newspapers, in the politicians' agenda. I know people, for example, that in those years told me that they carried cocaine from a plane
from Medellin to Miami in a suitcase, like no hiding it, no nothing. And there was no problem. There was no problem in taking drugs from Colombia to the U.S. because there was like not that security infrastructure that you see today. So he started doing that. Pablo Escobar started moving drugs from Colombia to the U.S. mainly. And he started making a lot of money.
And he was not hiding it. I mean, how much money are we talking about? We're talking about millions of dollars. Eventually, billions of dollars. In 1987, Forbes magazine listed Pablo Escobar as one of the richest men in the world. He would stay on the list until his death. He made so much money that he didn't have time to launder it all. Instead, he would bury stashes of money around Colombia.
Pablo Escobar's brother and accountant, Roberto Escobar, said that every year he would write off 10% of the cartel's profits from cash being lost or damaged from water or rats. Pablo Escobar started building
complete neighborhoods for poor people and like developing neighborhoods for like people that had no money. He started building houses, buying planes, buying farms, helicopters, animals. Like this is something that was kind of like he was extravagant and everyone in the city knew that. And people said that this is an incredibly
smart businessman. He knows how to do business. That's why he's rich. He's a developer. And if you... Yesterday, I was talking to this woman who told me that in the 70s, she heard about Pablo Escobar. She had nothing. She was living basically on the street. And she went with this friend every single day to a shopping mall that he had built in downtown Medellín.
just to see if they found him and ask him for money because that's what he was famous for. Like if you met him, he was so warm, he was so helpful, he was so generous that he would give you money. He would just give you money away. Like he would give you a pack of bills for you and your family. He could even give you a house. Like he was that. He had so much money that he was just giving it away in...
ways that people found almost fantastic. Like, is this real? Yes, it was real. He was giving that much money to people in the city. There were covers of magazines talking about him, talking about him as Paisa Robin Hood. Paisa is the way that people call people in Medellín, in my region. We are the Paisas. So he was the Paisa Robin Hood. And eventually what happened is that
In his plan, it was not enough for him to be extremely rich, to be extremely popular. He wanted more. So in the 80s, early 80s, he started a new campaign, a new mission for himself. He wanted to become Colombia's president. He started by running for Congress. He won as an alternate representative in 1982, but
He pushed for the Colombian government to back away from a treaty that would allow the United States to extradite drug traffickers. And there was nothing, nothing that a drug dealer in Colombia feared more than going to the United States justice system because they had no power there, right? If they were caught in Colombia,
There was a way, there was usually a way for them with so much power, with so much cash to get out. But if they were caught and they were extradited to the United States, that was the end of them. As a member of Congress, Pablo Escobar had parliamentary immunity. He was also still running the Medellín cartel's operations. The Minister of Justice, Rodrigo Lara Bonilla, criticized Pablo Escobar for being a drug trafficker.
But in public, Pablo Escobar responded that he had no record of any drug trafficking charges. Then, the Colombian newspaper El Espectador ran a front-page article about him, saying that in 1976 he'd been arrested for possession of 39 pounds of cocaine, and that afterwards, the government agents who arrested him were killed. After the article came out, a judge reopened the investigation into their deaths.
Pablo Escobar's immunity was revoked, and shortly after, he resigned from his post in Congress. A few months later, while on his way home, Justice Minister Rodrigo Lara Bonilla was shot by two gunmen on a motorcycle. It was believed to have been retaliation from the drug cartels. The Colombian president declared war on drug traffickers. He promised to arrest and extradite all drug traffickers to the United States.
Pablo Escobar went into hiding. He was so powerful that he was like, okay, you think I'm hiding? I'm going to show you that I'm here. So he started this cruel war against everyone, against everyone.
the government against the army, the cops against the judge. Every judge, if he needed something and a judge resisted, he would kill the judge, he would kill the journalists. He started this war to pressure Colombian government to not be extradited. In 1985, guerrillas took over the Colombian Palace of Justice and held 300 people hostage, including the country's Supreme Court justices,
The United States and Colombian governments suspected that the guerrillas were working with Escobar. In the end, after the Colombian army retook the building, a hundred hostages had been rescued, but many had been killed, along with many of the guerrilla fighters. In the 1980s, many officials involved in investigating and prosecuting drug traffickers were killed.
In 1987, the New York Times estimated that 50 judges had been killed because of drug violence. Some Colombian judges resigned in protest, and even more threatened to resign if the government didn't give them more protection. Eventually, Colombia granted anonymity to judges. They were called faceless judges.
What did your parents tell you about what was going on? How did they explain it to you? It was complicated. It was complicated because, of course, I was too little. So they didn't say that much. I knew that we were in a dangerous territory.
And I know it because I saw it. I know it because I heard the bombs. I remember one night when this huge explosion, this tremendous explosion blew out the windows of our house. We are...
surrounded my mountains. So this loud bomb resonated for seconds, let's say 10 seconds. So it exploded and then you were inside of it for 10 seconds. I was sleeping in the bedroom next to my parents and I ran to their bed and I was shaking and they were like, don't worry, we're fine, we're fine. And then we went out to the street
Later, Jorge's family heard that the explosion was from a car bomb at an army base near their house. People said that the Medellín cartel had put it there.
In 1988, Time magazine reported more than 3,000 people had been murdered in the past year in Medellín, a rate five times higher than in New York City. In 18 hours, the police reported 13 murders. Time called the city of Medellín the most dangerous in the world. We'll be right back.
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Pack your bags with high-quality essentials from Quince. Go to quince.com slash criminal for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. Spelled Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash criminal to get free shipping and 365-day returns. quince.com slash criminal In the 1990s, Jorge Carvajal's father was a doctor, and his mother did x-rays and ultrasounds and other diagnostic tests on patients. Every single day.
her patients were wounded people. Wounded people by gunshots, wounded people by knife, wounded people by bombs, explosions. And my mom has something in her is that she is the best person I know asking questions. Like she can get into intimate conversations in one minute. So she was seeing patients that were
hitmen of Pablo Escobar. She was seeing cops. She was seeing military. She was seeing civilians. And then she would get home and every day at dinner time, she would tell me about these hitmen, how they were scared when they were doing what they were doing. My mom would reprimand them and they would say like, yes, but there is no alternative for me. If I don't do this, I will also be dead.
They would say to her how much they loved their mothers or their children and how what they were doing was for them. She was seeing how everyone was involved, was part of it, either as perpetrators or as victims. But there was no way in Medellín in the late 80s, early 90s, there was no way to be outside of the conflict. It wasn't possible.
When the war began in Medellín, especially with this narcotraffic people and all the bombs started and all the problems in the city that you cannot go anywhere because it was a bomb or a shooting, something like that.
In one of the bombs, my dad died. My mom was also in that bomb, but she didn't get injured. It was only my dad. Gina Serna was 14 years old. After her father died, her family sold their farm in the country. I'm the oldest of four siblings. So I have to help my mom with my brother and my two sisters. And...
For me, it was like, how do you say it? I did not see my family again. My family was with my dad. That was my feeling. When my dad was gone, my feeling of having a family disappeared. Were you still, after he died, really interested in animals? Did that change at all? And what were you like as a teenager?
I think that's why I decided to study philosophy because my interest in animals disappeared. Well, a lot. I love animals, but it was not like that time when I was little. And how I was a little bit rebel, punk rock rebel. You can say it like that.
In 1989, a Colombian presidential candidate named Luis Carlos Galan was shot and killed. A group called the Extraditables said, "Now the fight is with blood," and that they planned to continue targeting Colombian officials. The Extraditables were drug traffickers, including Pablo Escobar, who had declared total war on the Colombian government unless they outlawed extradition. They said,
We prefer a grave in Colombia to a prison in the United States. Less than a month later, a van parked next door to the offices of the newspaper El Espectador exploded. The explosion left a 10-foot deep crater in the street. One person was killed and 80 people were wounded. In November, a passenger plane flying from Bogota to Cali exploded just after takeoff.
TV and radio news stations received calls that said the extraditables were responsible for both bombs. In 1990, police in Medellín estimated that over 4,600 people had been murdered in the city and that many had been killed because of violence related to the cartels. The next year, Pablo Escobar began speaking with a priest. He said he might be willing to surrender under certain conditions.
In June of 1991, the Colombian government rewrote the country's constitution to make extradition illegal. A few hours later, Pablo Escobar turned himself in. He said he would go to jail, but he wanted it to be a jail that he had built. And that jail was called the Cathedral, La Catedral. And the Cathedral was apparently a jail, like a very...
high security jail. But inside of it, it was just another mansion for Pablo Escobar, where he could do whatever he wanted and where he controlled everyone, even the militaries that were supposedly guarding him, right? So he was there for some months and there were some scandals in those months because he was bringing friends, he was bringing prostitutes, he was bringing...
Anything he wanted, it was like his house. So when the scandal became so big for the government that Pablo Escobar was living in luxury, they tried to move him to a regular prison. And the day that the operation was meant to happen, to move him to another prison, he escaped, of course.
I remember like that's the year when I started to remember things more clearly. I'm four years old and I remember, uh,
that there were helicopters all day long on the city. There were like strong military presence on the streets. You would see on the news these advertisements like, "We are wanted." And you would see Pablo Escobar picture and they were offering 2,000,000,000 de pesos, which is like 2,000,000,000 pesos.
Pablo Escobar had been on the run for 16 months. When the Colombian government traced phone calls from him to a building in the middle of Medellín, his family had tried to seek political asylum in Germany, but had been turned away.
Pablo Escobar had been trying to pressure the government to provide protection for his family in exchange for his surrender. Colombian special forces shot Pablo Escobar on the roof of the building where he had been hiding. He was killed December 1993. And that day, I remember that day, it was the craziest thing in the city because people
It showed how fractured we were as a city. In part, like in the middle class, in the high class neighborhoods, people started shouting with joy, they kill Pablo Escobar, they kill him. And people were celebrating. People felt that they had been freed of this monster, of this threatening presence that had made their life impossible for a decade. So there was a huge celebration. I was in that part of the city celebrating.
But the other part of the city, the neighborhoods that were excluded systematically by the state, those neighborhoods were crying, literally crying, because they had Gil Pablo Escobar. And on his funeral, and you can watch the videos, on his funeral, there are thousands of people crying,
next to his body, next to the case, because he was loved. He was loved by many. What did you think when you heard that Escobar was killed? I have that not in my memory. I don't know in what moment my mind decided that all the narcotraffic and narcotraffic war stayed out of my system.
So I don't remember that. I don't remember when the war finished. I really didn't care about that because it was like really painful for me. Actually, I don't see movies or series or read books about narcotraffic or Pablo Escobar or drugs. I don't, I'm not interested in that. 35 years after Time magazine called Medellín the most dangerous place in the world,
In 2023, they called it one of the greatest places to visit in the world. Jorge still lives there. What is the city like today? Medellín is a city that is extraordinary in its transformation. I still can't believe it. I have been here most of my life. Millions of dollars were invested in great public transportation, public transportation that allowed neighborhoods that were pretty far away and that were pretty different...
in income to be connected. They did that by investing a lot in parks, in neighborhoods that were very disadvantaged. They did that by investing in libraries. So the investment in the urban design of the city that lasted from the early 2000s to, let's say, 2012, 2014, was what made Medellín unique.
known today as a city that changed itself, that transformed itself and that became a real city, right? A city that has been struggling to understand what happened. That's still an issue. That's still something that it's in the process because many people don't want to go back to see those years and remember those years and analyze or interpret those years and to understand the history of the city.
Does it still feel like his city? Yeah, I do think that Pablo Escobar is still very present in Medellín. You will see it in stickers in the street, in graffitis, everywhere. In the most popular neighborhoods, he is kind of a god. Like, I don't know, if you go to Buenos Aires...
You will see Maradona or you will see Messi in Argentina as semi-gods. Well, that's Pablo Escobar in Medellín. Of course, all this tourism has arrived because the city, there are a lot of drugs and Medellín is still that. Medellín is still a city that has a deep connection with drug trafficking and all those problems. Jorge started noticing ads for something called Narco Tours, promising to tell the story of Pablo Escobar.
Some let you hike Pablo Escobar's escape route from jail. Some are run by a man known as Popeye, one of Pablo Escobar's hitmen. A few years ago, Jorge decided to go on one himself. It was me and a German tourist. It was only the two of us. And it was a driver and a woman. Both of them said that they had worked with Pablo Escobar.
And they took us first to Edificio Monaco, which is the building that he built in the heart of El Poblado, the richest neighborhood where he lived with his family. And it was the building where the first car bomb exploded in Medellin because the first car bomb in Medellin exploded next to the building because the Cali cartel wanted to kill Pablo Escobar and his family.
So they took us to that building, which was empty by the time. There was nothing there. So we were not able to get in. We were just like parked outside of the street watching an empty white building. And they were telling us
All the stories, the woman and the driver were telling all these stories about Pablo Escobar and all the money he had and all the cars that he had in that parking lot. Then they took us to the cathedral, to that jail. And it was funny because that jail in 2018 was a nursing home for old people. So they took us there. And the first thing I saw when they took us there was a sign saying,
on the parking lot saying, do not believe what the tourist guides are telling you. If you need real information, come to the administration. So the nursing home was so tired of people going to their place to listen to the most outrageous lies that they were like, if you really want information, just come to us.
After Pablo Escobar was killed, the Colombian government had to figure out what to do with his estate, including the zoo. While Pablo Escobar was alive, the government would sometimes raid the zoo. Once, they confiscated the zebras that lived there. He bribed a guard to let him take the zebras back in exchange for 12 donkeys that had been painted black and white. The government relocated many of Escobar's animals to zoos,
But they left the hippos. They leave hippos in the lake because hippos were really difficult to manage. They are really aggressive. They kill people. I think they thought they were going to die.
And 10 years later, when they called the local environmental office to go and see what is happening there, they saw there was like a small population of hippos. They reproduced them and then they started to spread out all over the region. We'll be right back. Support for Criminal comes from Greenlight.
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Gina Paloserna says after her second year of college, she decided she wanted to become a vet after all. In 2013, when Gina finished school, she started working at a government environmental office on conservation of big cats like jaguars and pumas.
But the Magdalena, Medio region, where these animals are, also the region where the hippos are. They told me, like, you are in the zone, like, please see where they are, how they are moving, where can you find them. So I started, like, to see how these animals move, well, etc. Gina set up trail cams to see where the hippos lived and how they behaved.
It's like a hippo paradise here. They have water and food all year long. They have no predators and people love them so they can do whatever they want. At night, they go out and they eat.
They are looking for food. So imagine a three-ton hippo going out of the water, eating grass, so they compact the floor. So now we have some sites around the lake that we cannot see grass or you can see nothing because it's so compact that...
nothing can grow. They displace animals. They are from our country, wildlife animals like the manatee, where the hippos are because they are so territorial. The manatees decided to go all to other place because of the hippos are all day in the water. They do all the natural things in the water. So the feces, imagine a
10 or 20 animals in a lake doing feces all day. So the quality of the water go really, really low. So all the fishes and all the animals they are all around this lake die. And also all the birds that
go and take fishes for food, go to other lake because there are no fishes. So there's a lot of problems for the environmental. They are really, really aggressive. They attack people. So in some regions of Colombia, for example, the Magdalena River, they destroyed all the boats where the locals go to fish.
So there's a really, really big risk for the families, for the children. Some of the hippos were still living at Haciendanopolis years later. Some families who had lost their homes during the war were given places to live on the estate. One man said the hippos, quote, used to be nice and tame. Now they are wild. The government also turned part of the estate into a theme park.
They put up a sign that warned people to stay in your vehicle after 6 p.m. Hippopotamuses on the road. But some of the hippos had followed the Magdalena River and made homes miles away. In 2009, the government declared the hippos in the area of Porto Berrio, a town 80 miles from Haciendanopolis, a danger to the people living there. They'd killed several baby cows and destroyed crops.
The Environmental Ministry approved an order for a special hunt of the hippos. That summer, the Colombian army and professional hunters killed one. He was known as Pepe. When photos of soldiers posing with Pepe's body appeared in the news, there was a public outcry. People in the area said they considered him a neighbor. They said he would spend his mornings in the river and his afternoons grazing. One resident said he was a beauty.
Then a judge ruled that the Colombian government had to stop hunting hippos. But they could stop them from reproducing. They decided to try to sterilize the hippos. Gina was one of the vets who had to figure out how to do it. They asked me what
do I think we can do if we can start to sterilize them? Say, okay, we can try it. Then we started to capture them. To capture the hippos are not easy. You have to like take it to a boma and then or a corral, and then you can do all the procedures there. But it's not easy. Hippos are the most difficult animal to put in anesthesia in the wildlife. Gee,
Gina talked to veterinarians in Africa to get advice. She asked if they'd ever sterilized a hippo. All the vets in Africa told me, why? Because I cannot kill them. No, are you crazy? So we started to do these procedures. They are really risky, and they cost a lot of money. After tracking the hippos, Gina would set up corrals with food the hippos liked.
Once the hippos were inside, the corral would be shut. They have this automatic door. When the hippo is inside the closed door, and it's really high so they cannot jump. When they are in the bowman, in the corral, you cannot be by the door because they start to fight with the door to try to get out.
Because hippos are so large, the surgeries have to happen wherever the hippos are caught. So we have to do all the surgeries in the open field. I have to take all my people there. We have to take all the instruments. In the open field, we don't have electricity. We don't have electricity.
like potable water. So you have to take everything there. And so it's a lot of people and a lot of the medications are really, really expensive because we don't have animals of that size in Colombia. So for us, it's like the double of difficult to do that here. And how long does the actual surgery take? Is it a difficult surgery?
If it's a male, only the surgery is like three hours, three or four. If it's a female, it's like five or six hours. To do a surgery in a female, it's really difficult because most of the time you are cutting all the skin and then the muscles to go inside where you can find all the organs. So they have a really, really big skin.
And then you have to stay with the hippo until he's up in his four feet and then he's in four paws, sorry. And he's really, really alert because you cannot liberate a hippo that is still processing the anesthesia because he can drop. Gina estimates that each surgery costs about $10,000.
and that catching and operating on and releasing a fully recovered hippo takes about three days.
But you have to prepare the procedure. So it's weeks of work, weeks of following them with the trail cameras, and then putting the food in the corral so they can get it. For one surgery, it's like two months of work. Everything gets difficult, expensive in hippos. Name it, and I'll tell you why it's difficult and expensive.
Every time I'm saying, this is the last time. Why are we doing this? This is not the solution. They keep growing. The population keeps growing. Everyone knows that hippos are Pablo Escobar hippos, right? Like there is no, whenever people talk about hippos, Pablo Escobar comes after.
Every couple months, a new story comes up. And of course, Los Hipopótamos de Pablo Escobar. Pablo Escobar, Hipopótamos. So yes, everyone knows that this is a problem that started with him. And it's interesting because...
These are animals that are huge, that are powerful, that are voracious. These are animals that are into hiding, right? They're not easy to detect. They attack from nowhere and somehow they are like
The Colombian government is hoping to sterilize 40 hippos a year. They're also considering relocating some of the hippos to sanctuaries and zoos in Mexico, India, and the Philippines.
In 2023, Gina stopped working with hippos. She now works for Panthera, an organization working on big cat conservation in Colombia. Do you think you're really done with hippo surgeries now? Yeah, I don't want to do. Is it harder to catch a hippo or a jaguar?
A jaguar. Harder. It's harder, yeah. But you'd rather do it. You'd rather be catching a jaguar than a hippo. Yeah. Yes. Criminal is created by Lauren Spohr and me. Nadia Wilson is our senior producer. Katie Bishop is our supervising producer. Our producers are Susanna Robertson, Jackie Sajico, Lily Clark, Lena Sillison, and Megan Kinane. Our show is mixed and engineered by Veronica Simonetti.
Special thanks to Stan Alcorn. Julian Alexander makes original illustrations for each episode of Criminal. You can see them at thisiscriminal.com. Jorge Caraballo reported an episode about narco tours for the podcast Radio Ambulante. You can listen at radioambulante.com. And you can sign up for a newsletter at thisiscriminal.com slash newsletter.
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Criminal is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Discover more great shows at podcast.voxmedia.com. I'm Phoebe Judge. This is Criminal.