Raging Moderates — Democrats Point Fingers as Trump Assembles Cabinet
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Welcome the rain moderate and galloway .

and i'm just got love.

how are you?

I'm OK. Yeah, i'm here. How I would describe .

my condition is stable. okay? Yeah, i'm still processing. And James actually outside yes, I got about sixty.

So it's like that the equipment of a besa for a london and I had lunch. I was social. I didn't order alcohol.

I haven't been watching netflix non stop. Some of my stocks are down today. So it's back to kind of regular times.

Why are stocks going down? Are we not trumpy anymore? Or.

well, they up three or four days, a rit of, at least my talks are down there. I don't know. I know what's gone on. But in general, this feels like, slowly but surely, just amazing me that you always, always restin ate the impact of everything in the moment. One of my learning in life is nothing is ever as good or as bad as IT seems. And I think you always estimate the ripping effects of things that seem big in a moment and underestimate the knock on effects or second order effects of things that don't seem that big at the time.

Yeah, the long the long tail and despair maybe that will be coming or the long tail of despair .

as my biography, you just titled my biography, the long tail despair.

I want to write IT though when IT comes out. But I I think that probably is happening for people because they don't want to do twenty sixteen again, like however you felt about IT, we can all agree that IT was a colossal over reaction or under reaction depending on what camp were in. And I think people these days wanna seem really cool and together, like, let's be real guys, the sun will shine tomorrow. I will get out of my stretchy pants and I will have lunch and won't have a cocktail like Scott galway, but your lunch cocktail will probably come in like three months when the deportation force starts and the long .

tail e of despight ed for force .

mean they do know branding, right? Like these are great marketers over there and trumpet queue.

okay? And today's episode of raging moderates were discussing democrats start the blame game, trumps cabinet starts to take shape and how we think the media should should handle little code coverage moving forward. And we try to end on a positive note.

So Harris conceded last week of my this is my favorite stat. Did you see that that bargrave h of mentions ons of election interference on twitter and how, which is enormous. And then about the moment IT became clear he was gonna win, they just, they just stopped.

So when the democrat has a shot, there's election interference anywhere. When there were republic is winning its democracy at work. Anyways, sorry.

that works. Plus, right, right.

Uh, so anyways, they began pointing trigger ous democrats behind the theme, subbing, buying for running at all, saying you should have step aside sooner others argue here, you should have been tough on the issues, including attack. Can trumps billionaire just what do you think? I think it's more product actually to talk about why he won and why SHE lost.

But anyways, we're not here to be productive. We're here to be entertaining. Where do you think the real blame lies here? What do you think happened?

Well, too many things happened for the way that people are doing the blame game. Like picking a lane is not smart here. There are, you know, in taxes, their highways have like six lanes on each side.

That's basically the road to loss here. And I think the road to winning for trump as well, since we should do this evening. And I, like you, are framing about how he won as well because I chose the democrat weakness in all of us.

And i'm really in two minds about IT because, on the one hand, what looked like a monster landslide on election night is not that once all the votes are counted, and this was part of the the fake results are the the blue pilling of IT, where people like, well, where do those fifty million votes go? You know, because by an on election night, kala had fifty million less boats, and biden had gotten, but they hadn't counted the west coast and some states go more slowly at sari. And now it's looking like it'll be a little bit less than IT was in twenty twenty.

But his win is going to be about one point five percent in the popular vote, which put his margin at number fifty among all fifty five presidential elections. And as electoral college, when will be number forty three amongst all sixty presidential elections? I'm not saying that to minimize what Donald trump pulled .

off because putting you, I am trying .

to be a real less in the sea of hyperbole about this and I think IT is important that people who care about this election, who dedicated their time, who got out there and docked on doors and main phone calls, its that I understand that this was not the biggest show action that ever existed. IT was a loss and IT was really bad because I was to donal trump. But that's a big part of IT.

I think we got the absolute should kicked out of us. And election isn't the popular vote. It's the electronic vote. But the bottom line is day when one hundred percent where I mattered, and we were all I don't about you, but all my friends were texting me from the ground, and scant and pencil vintage, where ten to one knocking on doors, you know what, technology did not work, knocking on doors.

And in an age of polarization in this type of divisiveness where everyone's in their own bubble, I don't never think you're going to see forty five, fifty five or sixty forty like you did with L. B. J.

I don't think there's getting around that. The democrats are trying to say, well, slow. Your role wasn't as big of Victories you think they fucking .

destroyed as just I said, i'm in two minds and you're .

only picking on one of my money. Give the money. Give the money.

That's correct. Obviously, an sweeping all the battlegrounds. I mean, that was the number one model out of need, silver probability model.

And the number two model that happened the second most times was coming here. S wins or seven states. And that's what happens when you have a margin of error race.

I was just saying, like in wisky, for instance, he got more votes and joe biden did in twenty twenty and the margin was like thirty thousand votes. My point is that that is a that could have been winning. We're not talking about IT. He won three hundred thousand more votes in wisconsin or something like that.

But I know almost .

well with concert matters a lie every four years to people's IT should matter more in general on the slacking front.

I think this coalition that he put together, if IT holds, will cause one of the biggest political realignments certain that we've seen in modern history and that there appears, besides having more of a working class economic message, which Frankly, I think by diners had a decent amount of, I mean, they're walking picket lines, right? They're talking about raising the minimum wage. They're given the teamsters their pensions at ta and truth up their lake.

I should cut taxes. As for my pals, I don't know how you put that back together and I was digging into because we definitely have to talk about the men. The man are not all right, as you're always saying, but the women weren't already.

They're the Young women. I'm not just talking about, you know, jane, women in the suburbs who were like, you know what, maybe I had an abortion referendum that I could vote yes on, and then i'm going to vote for trump time out. Jensie women went seven points in his direction.

So yes, the spread was still massive between them. But Young people, I think, because of how they are consuming information, and the data on that is wide, that like if you read newspapers or watching your T, V, you are voting for Harris. If you watch youtube, listen to the podcasting, go on, read IT, then you're voting for trump.

And the level of misinformation that I was like they did the washing posted a blind test. Of all the policies, the most popular ones were commonly Harris policies. And then there was also a survey that looked at IT what republicans and democrats think about reality, like where the economy is, where crime is, and we live in to absolutely dietrick opposed worlds, one of which accurately reflects the numbers out there.

That's the Harris voters. And this, and then one that reflects a different reality that I don't want to say isn't real, but it's A A lived experience that doesn't with the facts on the ground, I guess, is the polite way of saying IT. But I give you to, you show alker.

So like you ve brought up a couple different special large scripts, which are worth talking about, unions, the sister soldier moment that I think they should have had and that i've been talking about, I got a diamond of push back, is that unions are now a failed construct. And they continued to cater to nine percent of the workforce, or three and a half percent of the population, because they do give a lot of money.

And quite Frankly, this campaign, they were threatening, they were flirting with the other side. I just don't think it's I don't think the juice is work to school use. Now minimum wage needs to come up substantially in this falls into the special inta groupe.

There should be one union, in my view, in the U. S. To meet the U. S. Federal government.

The pays people raises minimum wage such that if you were forty hours week, you're not in poverty. Pretty simple. Now would be like twenty box in some states, twenty five and others.

And if the minimum way you just kept pace with productivity or inflation, IT would be there ah because in my view, the majority of unions are disorganized, inefficient and there's also a decent DNA of corruption ahead of U A W. IT seems like a bright guy, such as constitutions. Well, the former co present the U A, W in prison in the former C, E, O before him is also in prison.

So I just think they were stupid not to continue to hander to units. I'm a hammer. I ideological.

Everything I see is a nail in the sense that I genuinely believe everything came down to. Almost everything here came down to one thing, and that is a thirty old. Another woman isn't doing as well as his or her parents were the age of thirty.

And that has disproportionate, impacted Young men. And if you look at the age group, but swang, the most violent IT was Young people who swung eleven points towards trauma is twenty twenty. And in the second group, that one was violently, was forty five to sixty four.

In the the thing that kind of drove me a little bit nuts was stuffy rule, who I door had a guy on her program. I forget his name is a town to guy. You get this very impressive speech for amErica doesn't to face the hard reality that they're just not comfortable with the Browning of amErica and they weren't comfortable.

With a black president. And quite Frankly, I just don't think that's true that not only is an accurate, but he continues to promote a trope that hurts us and that is a democrats continue to see everything, the land, through the lens of identities, specifically race, which is implicity accusing the other side of bigotry. And the other side will say in what I believe with some credibility.

But folks, you guys are the guys, you guys are the folks, obsess with race, not us. Your thought, yeah. I think the .

race of realignment, especially with the lino population, we should be specific that the only group were a majority, went for trumper cubans. So that breaking IT down that, you know, is important, that of time. This is a model made in fifty three percent of venezuela's, but sixty six person, sixty seven percent I think of cubans stead um which makes a lot of sense, kind of looking at people's past where they came from and where they live.

But I think honestly, the answer to this question and and the republicans are going to have work to do as well in twenty twenty eight when they don't have trump running because the republican brand itself is not a good one. It's not as bad right now is the democratic brand. But we need to really get rid of all of the labels on this and the success stories that have come out of the democratic side in this election, like colorado, which is the only state that moved to the left in fall.

And jared police, the governor, give an interview about IT and said, well, you know what I did? I built affordable housing and I cut taxes and I baLances budgets and I told people, know what, you're actually in charge of your family, not the government, right? If you want your kids to play unsupervised on your coals to sack, that's none of my business.

And anyone who is knocking on you, I don't really care, right? Or pat ryan, the congressman from update new york, one, I think, by thirteen points. And he reaches, ran on common sense.

And he's like a campaign with A O C. When IT made sense to campaign with the A O C. And I leaned in to the moderate, winning the party when I needed to do that. And I almost feel like we should become like a blind taste test election system in this country, like what dane osborne was doing in nebraska, where the guy was getting within two points of a two term sitting senator running as an independent, where he just said, this is who I am and this is what I believe in and you put that into whatever box you might need to but like, just check my name and i'm going to deliver on these things um last week I talked about that prison guard who was interviewed and said, I think the democratic party doesn't respect me.

They don't like me very much and there was a focus group over the weekend, cn ended and a woman was asked to described trump and the geo pean Harris and the democrats as well and he called the G O P. Crazy and the democrats preachy. And when they asked for her preference, SHE sounded broken, having to say this, but he said, crazy doesn't look down on me.

Pretty does. And I think that all of these people just took a flying on a guy who, yes, is position as a successful business man in the economy is a top concern. So you think that that's gona work out, but someone that they genuinely don't believe actually cares that much about them as an individual, like how they live, who they love, what they practice. They're Donald trump.

T he just exists, right? And he doesn't align with anything. He like summer republicans.

He hates other republicans. Like he's not a party guy. And you saw, like in nava, this was crazy. Jacky rose, and the democrats was able to hang on and he won her race.

There are seventy thousand people who shot have been voted for Donald trumpet and didn't bother with the bottom of the ballot. 嗯， what what do they care? They're just voting for the guy who managed to convince us like koala brocket trump al fix. There's no party attach to that. It's a one man brand.

Okay, let's take a quick break.

Stay with us.

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So I wonder if I don't think that.

for example.

he's going to get through these terrorists because something I keep thinking about is I think is a lambda president. After about ninety, he's gonna a lamed up president. And around economic issues, I think, and it's going to be such a close call.

I'm not as certain about that because I think especially when IT comes to terrorist, there's a lot of republicans to understand economics and I think they'll decide IT would win in their distract to talk about a popular argument of this is nothing but attacks increasing. I'm not down with this and he doesn't have the same power to ruin careers, especially post twenty twenty six. You really had to kiss the ring here because people republicans saw accurate, quite Frankly, that he could ruin their careers.

I think he's not going to have nearly, nearly the power. The question one question I would have for you is, uh, as both of us juice, do you think that her stance on israel, gaza play a role? Do you think SHE should have taken a more supportive position on israel? People including jackie rosen, Alexis and and joash din all out performed her. Do you think SHE should have been more more serve around support of israel or more supportive around her support the palestinians?

This is where if we're doing the blame game, I actually have some shared that I would like to throw at the biden camp, because now all of this internal polling that they had is leaking out, and they knew that we were losing muslim voters that, like dear borne, could have gone for trump before october seventh, right? This isn't something that just popped up.

And when you look at a majority muslim district like that, that ends up going for Donald trump, o is set things like i'm going to turn gaza into a parking lot. You have to think that that's bigger than what one person, even if they are running for president, is saying at their campaign speeches, right, like that. That is something that was almost preordained in a different kind of way.

But yeah, I think that she's probably looking at IT now and thinking we like her. And biden should have been tougher out of the gate about the college campus protests. I think that one of these noches in the disorder belt, as they were, where people just feel like what is going on in this country, right, that there are kids being blocked from going to the cafeteria or to their libraries, or being beaten up in the worst case scenario. And you look at these other open sciences that outperformed her am in jackie rose. I mean, SHE was the president of her synagogue, which is probably the hardest job you could possibly have.

If you know you no.

like the senate is nothing right? Dealing with those characters and all the high profile juice were just fine, and they never wafer on this. Of course, they supported the first amendment, but they were twenty four hours a day bring them home.

We supported two state solution, and they did really well. And we should note that jewish voters came out for comas. So seventy one percent. I think it's the tally as of now. So we'll see where IT shakes out.

But you know how much?

Uh, it's about the same. He got like seventy percent. So there was no mass exodus. And I think that that is a lot of that has served by jewish women, which were of the second most supportive group for her behind black women by american judaism, and is now intertwined with a lot of general liberal values.

right? Like it's not just about what do you think is going to happen in the middle ast in the next four years. IT has to do with supporting education, a woman's right to choose that people have a Better quality of life, cutting taxes for middle as people raising taxes on those that can afford IT.

I mean, that's all part of as a drew myself as part of my identity, and people voted accordingly. I think they also saw trump p as someone that talks out of both sides in their mouth, right? And today he sounds really good for us.

But what does he sound like tomorrow? And what will he do to our life at home here in the U. S.

That's going to make IT. So whatever is offset by what's happening in israel isn't necessarily worth IT. So yeah, I think he could have leaned into that more. I don't know if I would have made up the difference the you know of fifty thousand, eight, sixty, seventy, I think in pennsylania, ia, but I would have liked that.

I mean, we talked about this as a moral issue of our time, right? Almost came to being pro life and saying if we end up losing elections because of this, because of our pro life stands, so be IT because it's that important. And supporting israel at this moment, I think, is a bit of a pro live stance. And that doesn't mean disregarding the palestinians who have needlessly passed away and the children in its horrific. But I would have like that, what about you?

I think voters would rather disagree with you on the issue as long as you seem resolute. yeah. And that is to be, in my view, to be supportive of israel, full throated support of israel.

And this is the problem. They were, biden Harris actually were more supportive of israel. Anytime anyone gives gay biden shed for israel, like who's been more supportive, who else sent two Carrier strike forces to the mediterranean and the tel around the city? Fact down.

Who else did that? They, they were. But they couldn't, they couldn't get credit for because I kept conditioning. Everything was, I don't like the way of prosecuting the war. And if you look at reagan, I think of him, people would read his issues and really stood.

And the majority of americans disagree with them, but the majority of americans voted for him because he seemed very resolute. And the ultimate example that was bush w. Never seem to waver over what is arguably the greatest geopolitical catch.

Fictions are entry into a war in south iannis, the southeast asia, vietnam. He's seeing very resolute about iraq, probably the stupid as war we've ever fought. Americans want someone is resolute.

So I believe supporting israel would have been the best move. Quite Frankly, the second best move probably would have been going on in and saying, we need a ceasefire now. We are putting huge pressure on them.

This is not humAnitary, you know, really gone and very propane estonian. The worst thing that could have done is what they did. And that is they came across his million mouth.

They came across as, yeah, but and I just think i've made them look week. And what's interesting is the stuff i've seen, the exponent i've seen around muslim americans, a surprising number of the michigan went trump. And the the interview I saw, the guy said i'd rather be stabbed in the face and stabbed in the back. And then the other point that you I don't know that you inspired red, I love more in doubt and every time I mentioned her name, I can't cut over the number that amount of hate male and I think she's talented woman .

and she's actually quite little little personally yeah and he has incredible talented but the more .

double anger goes back to the eyes. I just, I I love her writing. And he wrote this interesting article basically. And Walker's broke and IT wasn't her article, but there was a common in there, I thought was show, incredibly intelligent.

I wish I had the person's name, but they basically said this was a vote against hypocras y and that is, democrats believe in free speech until a cena right conservative person shows up my campus. They believe in rule of law til people start brazenly and openly stealing from stores in democratic cities or trust passing on campuses. They believe in covent lockdowns until there's a black lives matter much.

They believe in science until someone born with a peano wants to play in women sport. You want to talk about a layer for the republican party to let people born with a penis have testoon flow over their bone structure and muscle structure, and then compete in women's sports. I mean, have we got fucking insane? And then, I mean, there was a so many kind of lay ups anyways, this point was saying, we just come across ses as hypocrites.

And I IT really struck me. I thought, wow, that was a really precise point that the individual I was making. But I don't think that I was that he lost juice.

I think he lost a lot of voters because he came across as trying to dance between the rain drops. And I hate to say that, but a guy who says, turned the place into a parking lot, yeah, you go. That's not a very thoughtful sight, but I appreciate his balls and his willingness to say this is how I feel.

I'm not, i'm not. I'm not morally struggling with this. I have moral clarity on IT, and i'm not saying that's the way people should vote. There's a new answer here. There are this is a complicated situation, but I think that even more muslim americans are anticipated that people want a president who is resolute, not necessarily a president who is right.

Well, that that speaks to this feeling that's been communicated across all minority groups, which is the belief that actually everybody is racist, that black voters are saying, latino voters are saying as not as if we think democrats aren't racist. It's just package up instead of told to our face. Like he said, the step in the front was the step in the back.

And one thing that i've been thinking about a lot is this pervasive feeling of betrayal that core democratic voters have been feeling and has been been up for years, going back to covet policy like you can be with your loved ones as they're dying. Your kids can be in school. We need to shut everything down.

Inflation is transitory. Oh, the border is in open. Ojo biden is fine until he's not fine.

And I feel part of the problem for sure, because I I definitely SAT on T. V saying, like he can do this job. And I think generally he could with the support of his cabinet, once the debate happens. IT was obviously the right thing for him to not be running anymore.

But taken together with how people were feeling that we were repeatedly asking them to not believe their lying eyes, right? What they had seen on the subway to the grocery store, sera long, well from the buller, has at this great lines, was being interviewed and said over, over and focus groups, people didn't know what a thora italian meant, but they could tell you exactly how much their eggs cost, right? The disconnect between the messaging on that.

But over the weekend, he leaked out that know this wasn't exactly Nancy polo cy and obama's plan, that they wanted biden out and they were supposed to be a primary and as kind of like an F U. To them by an endorsed koala and sent us on this journey. And I think that that, you know, SHE did run is good of a campaign agas. As was possible considering the time frame and also certain issues that he had like not being able to answer questions directly, like on the view, which James carvel says it's really you know, the moment this ended essentially one Sunny and was like how will you be different than by and SHE couldn't do IT.

Let's take a quick break. When we come back, we will talk about our trumps cabinet is taking shape. Stay with us.

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Welcome back. Trumps transition efforts are aren't full swing at his morale ga residents. He made his first major appointments, selecting suzy wells as his White house chip of staff, making her the first woman in history to hold this position.

Trump also announced the tom homan will oversee the nation's borders and offered rep at least defending the role of us ambassador, the U. N. He's expected to announce Stephen Miller as deputy chips of staff for policy, and he ruled out cabinet positions from mike pompeo and nikhil, who held top foreign policy rules in his previous administration. What do your thoughts .

on this pick so far? Well, I think it's cool that susie wiles is the first female chief of staff in american history. I am not one who says that he deserves to be on the cover of vote just because that's what the democratic version would get of this.

But I do think that moves towards parody should be celebrated. And susie wiles did an incredible job, right? You got someone like Donald trump had high unfavorably, who people think as a massaging is in a recess, and all of these things elected president. So hats off to use susie. And I think that i'll run a tight ship and IT feels like there will be order, even if it's in order that I do not enjoy.

Nicky hai, you know, was IT worth IT, right? Whatever you just went grow over the last year and a half or two years to be publicly embarrassed once again with the first thing he does, basically saying, you're not going to get anywhere near my new house or my administration is embarrassing and my pop people had kind of norm. Republicans had hoped that he would play a big role in this administration because he seize the world as kind of A A traditional neocon, I guess, who has destroyed the maga vibe.

But very pro ukraine, you very pro israel, know, thinking about secretary of state well, that end up being a record or uh tennessee senator bill hagerty who came out a bush world but is very maga he was trump's bassam or to japan but he's very pro ukrainy which is good that was top line but to find to the U N. Is interesting to me because SHE, one of her big issues is that if the U. N. Continues to be so anti semitic, c, maybe we shouldn't be there at all. And I feel like that's probably one of the reasons that he put her in that role yeah, that definitely .

Sparks are going to apply at the U. N. And I can't figure out i'm two minds around the U.

N. And that is it's so important and such took so much effort to get everyone together. And I think it's important that people get together and talk even.

But what i've been committed the U. N. Recently for me has been to such blate nani cemeteries. M, I think why are we participating and our funding this place or or not funding IT, depending on who is being to you? Uh, she's an interesting one.

I I feel as if his pigs are sort of more performative than anything because if I know trump, ninety percent of them be gone within eight months. Mean, he just he just turned through people like there's no tomo. I don't I know nothing about a chief of staff.

She's she's probably in terms of a ratio to people who are important in history who had at least well known she's right up there right now. Nobody knows who he is and that sounds to me like SHE just schooled uh, the democratic Opera ads on how to run a campaign and um you know, people said they weren't discipline to whatever my senses. He was a lot more discipline this time.

And even the decision not to debate again, while we were outraged by the decision not to have to put that many resources around a ground game. Or aren't they idiots? Well, now IT ends up SHE was a lot smart of them. We were. So I ll be, i'll be very curious, you know, what happens there? I also heard rumblings that I might be Steve munson for treasure secretary.

Oh, I didn't. I heard that if he comes back yet, that would feel orderly to me.

Yeah and I think people, journal speaking, think pretty well of him.

Tom holman, thing that we got a double click on that or whatever the return is, it's interesting to me. So tom holman, who was ahead of ice, has some of the most anti immigrant views of anyone. I have listened to, give interviews, and he was made borders are, they didn't try to get him to be the homeland security because that requires confirmation.

And that right away set up the that signal, right? That this is a work around to get the guy and who talks about the deportation force all the time. And if you haven't seen tom homan, who by the way, is associated with the heritage oundle and project twenty twenty five, check out his sixty minutes interview. Where is being asked about family separation, which is usually something that people don't want to happen, right? And this is a also feeling a lot of the anger within latino families.

You see a lot of content online of Young women who are mad at their brothers and mothers, mad at their sons and their husband's, in some cases in like you just voted to deport x member of our family, mother and uncle, whatever IT is but tom home is asked my family separation and he said, of course i'm not for family separation and the interview, I forget who IT was assays well then what's the planned? And he said, they can all go. So you are now talking about a landscape in which people who are naturalized american citizens and may be far shout of the country with their family members.

And of course, the talking point today is we're starting with the bad guys write the bad ombre IT will be the criminals, you know, the people who are violating our laws, not the original set, crossing the border, but actually committed a crime here. But that was what they said in twenty sixteen as well. And that is not how I turned out. IT just moved into deporting people who are here illegally, red, large. And i'm very concerned about tom hoban.

Do you think? And credit, I don't want to I don't wanted in any way diminish the prospect that we'll do what he actually says. He's gonna.

But when you talk about the logistics here, potentially, the blow to the economy, the cost, the idea that anything that looks of putting people in any ringfence geographic area for deportation is going to feel erly similar to a concentration camp, or take us back to, at least at a minimum, the very dark spot stain in our history. And that was when we turn japanese americans who were good citizens. yeah.

In the his lack of focus, especially on things that are this logistically complicated, do you think IT might not just be easier for him to make IT even more difficult to get into the country, maybe do away with asylum, uh, or reforming a silent system, as opposed to actually knocking on doors and taking grandma luiso away, whose kids are citizens here? And again, I don't want, anyway, reduced the thread of him doing. I didn't think the republicans would actually ever go after row.

And my park cast cast cares said, yeah, they will. These people know they are that. So I am not suggested. We don't take what he says seriously. I just wonder if logistically it's so complicated, so expensive, so ugly that I might not actually happen.

You think the sky home man will actually executed plan that involves you, I mean convicted baLance or whatever, who get deported back to their home country? I would imagine the majority americans aren't worried about that. We're gona rise up around IT. But when the mother of there, you know, their home health worker, who has kids here, i've son, gets a knock at the door and is told, report to the center and somewhere outside of, I don't know that could to me, that could get very scary.

very fast, what your thoughts that really shakes the foundation of what the country is about, right? Which I don't think protecting someone who committed a crime here is. And that's why you did get broadband support for trump in this.

And I was interesting looking at the fox news voter analysis, which is a huge pole to talk, like a hundred and twenty thousand people about this. Still, a majority of people wanted to find a pathway to citizenship for those who are here and are working and are valuable members of society. That actually how americans feel about this.

But one of, if not the smartest st thing that republicans ever did about the border was busting migrants, two cities like mine, and making this a national problem, and not just a localized problem along the border. And you know, air atoms has already, you know, first thing, maybe he wants a partner when that when that comes, but you know, immediately congratulated trump in saying that the debit card program for people who are here undocumented is going away, right away. And there have been across a number of different issue areas.

You see an immediate impact of the trump of facts. Like cutter has said, homos has to get out here. Like you have twenty minutes to get out here.

whatever the amount of time.

I understand that. But IT came right after the election and that will be to your point about people are not following the complicated story. They're not following the diplomacy of IT. They're looking at who said a thing and then I had a direct reaction and Donald trump a thing and I had a direct reaction. And that's how I think, honestly, a presidency that was pretty mediocre.

His ends up being lionized in a lot of people's eyes because he is a person that scares the shit out of so many people, because he is so frantic and frenzy. I mean, he was being interviewed by the water street journal editorial board, and they asked about his foreign policy that how you gona pull this off and he said, what people know, that I am crazy, that things that like an assad says right can drunk on. And I think that's what people even voting for him thought this, I this guy is crazy.

And so he might be able to pull this off crazy versus preachy. So I I just can't believe we miss the boat on dealing with immigration to this level that we're having a conversation now about whether homa and his deportation force will be able to pull this stuff off. I mean, if we had just acknowledged a real problem and talked to people like Normal human beings and accept IT a little bit of blind even, you don't need to take the whole show bang, but just say, I understand that this is problem.

There's a border town. Majority, let know, ninety seven percent support for trump and on, they will take matter on the view. Eliza griffin says, why do you think that happened? And Sunny hostel says, racism and he goes, it's the border. This is not. Racism is not msg e.

We, we, we fall absolutely into their talking point when I go to is to immediately accuse the other side of being racist simo genius IT IT is the worst thing we can do. The democratic party has decided that the kind of the self appoint a cop for social justice and no one appointed them. Um i'm curious, what do you think of the idea? I'm trying to think, you know how we move forward.

What do you think of the idea of the U. S. Being a platform? And IT really is for two things. First, inform mas to defend americans, defender our shares, but two, to provide economic security for americans and their families.

And that's not to say we shouldn't laws around civil rights and equality in their still important issues we need to discuss. But to move back, the democratic party should embrace an active foreign policy. Sticks to that.

I think that's the right idea. But really trying embrace this notion that we are going to be the party that provides more economic opportunity for Young people and be the adults in room. Talk about the deficit, talk about occasion programing, talk about national service, talk about a tax policy that doesn't run the credit card of our Younger people to pull prosperity forward. For older people who now control forty percent of government spending, which is not a real investment, is true of spending sounding things like arana er education. How do you think the democratic party real lines in terms of a message moving forward?

I would love that because the economy is the grounding of everything, of every issue that we talk about, and there is very little way for people to feel good about their lives if they don't feel like their economic future. And the economic future of those that they care about is in good hands or is going to see brighter days. And I I think that that's great. That is you know at core of White berny standards has been saying forever but said in that little manifesto that he put out after the loss, I think he's always too quick to to pick on the party apparatus and that people haven't been buying what burnley is selling for a long time and he always kind of skips passed that at least on an national level. But I think yeah, if we had an easy to understand slogan like we'll make you richer, it's a kind would be great .

yeah you know, I love I don't know if you are about this, but portugal, I think this is a great idea. Portugal is uh, becoming sort of it's done really well on the whole, but they recognized that they essentially becoming a place for rich experts, had fund managers that want to avoid taxes and tourism and seniors because they are very general social service programs. I think sixty percent of employment there is civil servants.

And anyone whose really talented in Young has one thing in, they leave, they go to school in another country and they don't come back. So they even announced A I think I don't know how long it's going to last, but anyone between the ages of twenty and thirty, zero taxes. What do you think of that idea? Because I wouldn't have so much, because people twenty to thirty to make that much money, but say we need to level up Young people take read the tea leaves in this election, no taxes, no federal income taxes between the ages of twenty and third.

I think it's great. I think I mean, lowering also the barriers to getting decent jobs like this was actually one of the impacts of josh po on camera because he is a policy in pensylvania. You don't need a college degree to get a government job, which you shouldn't need.

There all sorts of people are very qualified for those things. So yeah, thinking outside the box about how to get people to stay and to be happy should definitely be a priority. But I also think, and it's connected to this, like how do you make people love their home again, love their country again?

Like, I want abroad for school, and I wanted to come home because I love where i'm from, and I love the people in my orbit that made growing up fantastic, that had great impact on me. And that's part of the issue, is a wonderful thing about the eu pean union. And I wish that the U.

K. Was obvious ly still part of IT. But with the mobility options that you could just go off and go to school in germany, or you could go to school in france or whatever, they had to work harder to make sure that people come back and invest and where they're from. And there's there are so many people, especially Young people, who just they don't get how great amErica is like. Bill gates always talks about this.

Like, what are you guys talking about that this isn't the greatest nation in the world that has delivered the best results at home and abroad? And that kind of project, reinvigorating the american dream, I think, could be a great piece of what the democrats build going forward and to hopefully help them win elections. But just to make us feel Better about where we're from and what we're all about.

So we're still we're still watching the final uncalled legislate races to see if republicans will retain control the house representatives, which would, if that happens, complete an electoral sweep. What's going on? What how does that look to you?

Less Sunny than I did, which is kind of the theme for the selection, and came in, you know, big smiles, oh, what a beautiful Sunny day and left depress IT would take a bit of an electoral miracle for us to be able to hold their much closer and for the races that are outstanding, you need stuff like you don't needs to win seventy three percent of the outstanding ballots and things like that. Not completely impossible, but very unlikely.

I'm kind of taking solace in the fact that when they had control of all three branches of government, when trump first came in, that they only got tax cuts passed and didn't get anything else done, they, I mean, they voted to repeal obama millions of times, but that never happened. So I think it'll be much of the same to your that's your lame duck point, right? That the hope is that he can actually accomplish all that much. And this tom human thing, appointing people for non confirm able spots, I think, is going to be his approach. That's how R, F, K, junior will get in that, how you on mask, and as how time home and gets.

So before we wrap up here, how do you think the media, as a member of the media, I should approach covering trump this time around corner free to store ve made the case in the atlantic that the media should treat them like a Normal president, especially sense an opposition that claims to defend democracy can just ignore the legitimacy of someone who's once. So clearly, just what you take on that.

I think that's generally right. I think outrage and meltdown has failed us and that we have also revealed ourselves to actually not fear him that much. My colleagues on the five always say to me, well, what are people gonna? Now you've called him, hit her, and you have to have T N crumps with him because you need .

to show around the office and CER.

Well, he repented earlier than we did. But I think that people stopped believing us that he was fascist, that he was authoritarian and they just said, well, he's going to fix the economy or i'm going to be Better off than I was before. So yeah, I would like to treat him Normally which doesn't mean not covering the things that he is doing.

But I cannot be a daily meltdown. The public will not have IT. And I think that links to the way that they're consuming information. Like I was took a step back and I thought, oh, the liberal media is so powerful, we have all these ways to reach people.

But then you look at the kind of content at least Younger people are taking in with this podcast most time when they end up getting a political message, just not because they listen to a political podcasts, because they list to a wellness podcasts that's arted talking about something ark junior likes. I think joe rogan is not a political poca. And until we can get a good foot hold in that kind of space, I think that we have lost that battle. And then if the main stream media, whatever that means, these is, is only saying that this is we haven't seen this since the nineteen and thirties. We're never going to win an election again.

What do you think? Yeah, I think that that feels right. But but just I feel the need to I feel we are literally like debby downer and my disaster, debby here I do want to highlight that there was actually several historic Victories among L G B T, Q candidates this election, uh, including the first trance center candidate elected to congress a black game and elected to the torture al legislature.

There were some bright spots here, and I think it's important to keep i'm also already i'm wondering if this will be really healthy for the democratic party to get back to the good work of just helping being instead of trying to be righteous all the time, be effective, something I struggled with my whole career, is a difference in me, right, being effective and focus on things like the economy and starting ling Young people. And i'd like to think this is just setting. I saw americans like reversion to the mean. They like a baLance in a weird way, i'd like to see republicans get control the house because I think it's more symbolic than effective. I think he'll be a lame duck president and a lot of republicans will find their backbone in terms of not just being a blank check for him that might be naive and that this is going to set up if we get our act and our messaging together, I think it's IT sets up incredibly well for twenty twenty six, which we will start getting pelted with ads and .

about six are we recording yeah.

yeah, it's already happening. Commit .

positive point. And you may fun to me at the start of the podcast, yeah, we then lose by that much.

all right, defined by that much White woman.

that much, that much. Anyways, that's over the episode.

Thank you for listening. The marriage ing moderates our producers, our Caroline shagger and David toledo. Our technical director is tuberous.

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