Al Pacino
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I am Al Pacino. And I'm hopeful about being Conan O'Brien's friend. That's really nice. You want a friend of Stutters? Yeah, I think I'm out, by the way. Fall is here. Here

Back to school, ring the bell Brand new shoes, walkin' loose Climb the fence, books and pens I can tell that we are gonna be friends Yes, I can tell that we are gonna be friends

Hey there, welcome. Conor O'Brien needs a friend. The podcast that casts that pod like no one else doesn't mean anything, but if I say it with authority, we'll get away with it. Joined by Sonam of Session, loves to keep telling people she's from Armenia. And Matt Gourley. Matt, how are you? I'm fine, but she is from Armenia. I know. I'm not from Armenia. Oh, right, sorry. Oh my God, I was born in Manabelo. Manabelo is in Armenia.

in Armenia. No, it's not. It's an island off. It's off the 60 freeway in Los Angeles. The 60 freeway goes that far? It crosses the oceans? Oh my God, you had me believing it. Oh no, it's, no, I mean, whatever. Okay, change your story, whatever you want to do. Okay. I'm changing it.

Have you guys watching? It's very popular these days, this chimp crazy documentary. I actually have it. Okay, it's this documentary that's on Netflix and it's by the same filmmaker that did Tiger King and now it's about

basically it's about women that become enthralled with chimps and form these really strong relationships with them and coexist with them and in some cases love them even more than their own children. They say as much. What's that? They say as much. They say it. It's crazy. Is it like sexual?

No, no, no. Don't take us down that road. No, no. I mean, there's a point where you kind of go, is it? No, no, no. It's, it's, um, listen, that's probably where your mind goes. Anytime you see a person, an animal, but I, what I will say is that it's just about this incredible attachment they have to chimps. And, um, so I watched the whole series with my wife lies and she went, oh, that's like me. And I said, what? And she said, you're basically a chimpanzee.

And I'm like, what? And then she sent to my kids, she sent like, there's the picture of the woman and the chimp and

And there's the poster of the woman and the chimp. And she sent it to the kids and she went, look, it's me and your dad. The kids are like, yes. And there's this total agreement that life with me is like life with a chimp, except the chimps show more self-control. That explains why I do kind of fear my face and genitals being ripped

off every time I'm with you. I have taken a swipe. Oh, my God. I've tried to swing at your genitals several times, but no, it's funny. She said it, and I immediately thought, oh, my God, she's not wrong. Yeah. I'm constantly...

skimpering and skimpering around the house making noise I do throw feces occasionally for fun and when I'm angry not mine I have it shipped shipped in yeah they're gonna do a documentary on on you at some point well they did like as in as in like oh at home not on tour you know what I

Like what went wrong kind of thing? Yes, sort of like that. Or it's going to be a snapped baby. Yeah, one of those things where I'm just, but you'll see lots of footage of me going around the house. And Liza going, come on, let's go, let's go. Get your diaper on. Yeah. We got to go. You know, but anyway, that was, that's the lens through which my wife viewed Chimp Crazy. She saw it as the depiction of our marriage. It's perfect. Yeah.

Well, there you go. Oh, wow. Oh, what's this? Are you giving me a like a... We gotta do this. You just... I'm gonna talk about this. I thought I just said, you know, having a conversation. And Matt Gourley, his face just suddenly died. Well, because you put a big... Hold on. Did he not lull? No, no. Did it not lull? It did kind of lull. No, no, it lulled for a second. But I saw your face go... All animation left your face. It went blank and you went...

"Do this." And you handed me the introduction to Al Pacino. Oh my God. Which I'm thrilled to do. I'm glad he's here, but it was just chilling. You were like, "Yeah." If you look this up on, look up the video of this, all animation left.

And you stared at me and you went, do this. And handed me a paper. No joy. Really? And no even attempt to go, ha, ha, ha, ha. Okay, well, moving on. No, you could have done that, but you didn't. I think because I thought we were cut. No, no, no, no. And then people can see behind the scenes that I just turned into a bowl of sadness. Guess what?

We're going to keep that in. Okay. And people are going to know what it's like to work here. You're just a robot. Okay. You know, you might as well just be one of those things that cleans the bottom of a pool. Just, you know what I mean? You said we're going to keep that in. He edits it. He could take it out and change it. And you, there's nothing you can really do about it. Yeah. Oh, I'm very much involved in the editing process on this show. You don't know what any of the final product is in this thing.

You are cut from every episode. Hey, name a time I haven't met you when it's time for the audio editing of this podcast. A time when I haven't driven out to your studio at your home and sat there with you as we painstakingly make small audio trims and fix little audio bumps. That is hard to refuse. I'm there too. Remember? We're all doing it together. You're there because you take the freeway from Armenia every day. All right.

Conan went too far. Conan went too far. I should probably do it. And what an intro this is.

This is a huge one for me. And me. Well, no, more for me. Oh. And me. I idolize this man. I idolize him. I guess today as a Hollywood legend, sometimes people, you say that about people and you go, yeah, maybe again. No, no. This is maybe the Hollywood legend. He starred in movies like The Godfather and Scarface. Just even mentioning his movies is insane. That's crazy. He now has a new memoir, which I've read, and it is absolutely fantastic. Uh,

read this. It's entitled Sunny Boy, Honor of a Lifetime, to be in a room with this gentleman. He's here today. Al Pacino, welcome. All right, I got to tell you something. I've never said this before on the podcast. I've talked to everybody. I've talked to presidents. You, sir. Yes.

You, sir, put your phone away for this. Put your phone away for this because this is a huge honor for you, what I'm about to say. It is an honor. This is no higher honor than what I'm about to say to you. You are my favorite actor, and this is the most excited I've been to talk to anybody. This is a big fucking deal for me, Al Pacino.

I'm blessed that you are here. Oh, well, wow. Thank you for that. I'm taking my sunglasses off now. You did. That one got them off. Thank you so much. And I want to say this. So you've written this book, Sunny Boy. It is your story, your autobiography.

And they got me an advanced copy. I hold myself up in my room and I read this thing. And it is a spectacular book. This is the best biography I can remember reading. It is such an amazing story. I thought I knew everything about you. It's an incredible book. Congratulations. Oh, thank you. That's a wonderful compliment. Thank you. Yeah. And that's all the time we have. Yes. It's been nice having you here. Hi.

I'm not having that kind of luck today. Let me tell you something. I'm hard-pressed to think of anyone who's had more iconic performances than you. It's just such elite company of actors, 20th century, 21st century actors. And I read this story and...

And there's so much despair in it. There are highs, but there are lows. To people like me, I think about Al Pacino, I just think, oh, it's just been. What a miraculous, never-ending series of successes. But

your childhood in the south bronx yeah i'm reading about it and it could have been the 1890s i mean i know it's the 1940s early 50s but you're running around like one of the dead end kids with a gang do you know what i mean it's absolutely incredible and you're constantly almost getting killed i mean well it still goes on yeah yeah on the way up here you

Yeah, this is a tough part of Central Hollywood right here. You know, in Beverly Hills, there are some sections, but... Oh, we're going to dodge those lattes. But no, I mean, you're talking about this period of your life, and it is...

It feels like it could be a hundred years ago. It's such a crazy experience. And what you went through, your father leaves when you're two years old. A little less. No. Yeah, a little. Yeah, two. Let's just go with two. Let's go with two, please. Okay. Let's just go with two. It's an even number. You were 1.9. Your father left and your mom has mental health issues and then she passes away when you're still a very young man. And you...

kind of a chaotic young life. It was a real surprise to me. I didn't know that. Really? Yeah. Had you ever heard of any part of my life at all? I knew that you had been in theater. It always felt to me that the Al Pacino story was young guy doing theater, gets the godfather, hits it out of the park, and then the rest is spectacular. I read this story, and it's almost miraculous that

that you get out of childhood. Do you know what I mean? That's the feeling I had. Yeah, that's good. I didn't mean that for you to have that feeling, but it's great you had a feeling, you know. I haven't had a feeling in a very long time. I know. I'm trying reading the first two chapters of my book. I'm doing the audio of it now. And it's really a knockout. It really knocks you out. I mean, you start seeing your life and you, you know, in order to read a book,

You have to act the parts because you just read a monotone. Some of the monotone readers are wonderful. I mean, I really get the great...

Sean Penn reads Bob Dylan. I read that. Did anybody hear that book? I haven't heard that one, no. I've heard Sean Penn sings Bob Dylan. I don't recommend it. I don't recommend it. He ends up punching the microphone. Oh, my God. Well, he got Bob Dylan. He really got his tone. And so I'm reading these stories, and, of course, I lived through them, so I was sort of reliving them.

And it's tough. I would think it's tough because you run around with this gang of kids in South Bronx and you point out that your mom did keep an eye on you. You did feel that you were more supervised than some. A lot of your friends don't make it. They die. They die. They get into heroin. And it's very poignant because you start the book with them. And then at the end of the book,

After this incredible career, you go back and kind of dedicate it to these guys that didn't get out of the South Bronx, which is very powerful. Yeah. I don't know if you felt like, and I might be reaching here, but was there a little bit of survivor's guilt there? Like, how did I get out and they didn't get out? Well, I always thought about that. Yeah. The thing that was so interesting to me that I recalled was one of my friends dying.

And being buried and around it with these just—you remember the one I say about this sort of cold January morning or something? Bleak. Bleak. And Bruce is lowered, and the mother's crying, who I knew, of course, and this aunt or somebody I never saw.

starts to relate her feelings about Bruce and what she thought happened to him. Yeah. And it was so profound. And this is someone I knew. I did comedy routines with her. We used to do that stuff. And she's so...

Out of nowhere, I just read him so wonderfully, and I learned about him, and it was shocking to me. You talk about it in the book, and it's interesting because obviously so many people are going to pick up this book and say, I want to hear about it.

And these are things, you know, I want to hear about the Godfather movies. I want to hear about, you know, all these iconic roles, all the people you knew, all the people you met. But to me, in a way, the most fascinating aspect of it is that you start with these people.

You get out. And when I say you get out, you are, none of us understands why. I mean, I've had some crazy good fortune in my life and I don't understand why. And I stopped trying to figure it out a while ago. I was driving here today. I have a ritual with my brothers where we watch the Godfather movies religiously. We can quote them from beginning to end. We always quote them to each other.

And I'm talking to my brother, Luke. And I said, guess where I'm going? I'm going to work today. I'm going to talk to and interview Al Pacino. And my brother said, I'm very proud of you.

but who the fuck are you to talk to Al Pacino? Why you? And I said, Luke, I don't know. But I'm just going to go with it. Well, I think he should be here. Let's bring him in. He's a criminal. He's welcome. He's in prison right now. Luke, we're thinking of you. You know, it's interesting because you're...

You're grabbed by the theater. You're this kid, as I said, who you start reading Chekhov. You start reading the classics and it grabs you and you start seeing some productions. You get into theater and

You have so many go nowhere jobs just to stay alive. I mean, you're delivering papers. You're, I'm trying to think what you're, you're a building superintendent for a while, but not a good one. I don't think. Never, never. The guy came out and started talking about me a few years back. Yeah. Saying he was a terrible super.

or something like that. And I thought, why? Why would he say that? Who's a terrible super? I'm sure there's a lot around. I mean, you know. No, I saw that. There's a really old man who was like, I remember him. He was a terrible super. And I'm like, okay, take his Oscar back. Fine actor, terrible super. Christopher Walken, bad mechanic.

Robert De Niro, that's just an awful substitute teacher. You know, it's like, what the fuck? What are you talking about? So you come along, you're doing theater, and then this thing that people dream about happens, which is you get noticed. Francis Ford Coppola is going to make The Godfather, and he says...

I want this guy, Al Pacino. And the studio says, fuck you. Of course. We want Robert Redford. We want, you know, we want, we want, you know, we want someone who's been a success. We want someone who looks a certain way. We want someone probably blonde hair, blue eyed, whatever. Sorry. Yeah, exactly. I'm looking at you when I say it. I'm sorry. They wanted me.

You wanted me, actually. You know, my grandmother. I was eight at the time, yeah. My grandmother on my mother's side has blonde hair and blue eyes. So just to note that. Yeah, it's in there. It's in you somewhere. Yeah, it is. But what I'm saying is. I had to put it in. They don't want you, but, and they, I've seen the screen tests where they're saying, okay, well, how about Jimmy Kahn? Is Michael Cole? How about, they're trying everybody. They're throwing everybody in there. Yeah.

But Francis Ford Coppola sticks with you. They start shooting and you can tell, you read in the book and it's riveting on the set. People are like, I don't know about this guy. I don't know about this guy. I don't know what, and you can feel it. Yeah, well, they were giggling. You heard giggling. Yes. So here's what's amazing to me. These scenes that I've watched and that everyone's watched in this room 100,000 times,

that are now iconic masterclasses in how you play a character. You're doing it and people are going, "Oh man, let's hope they get a real actor in here soon." Which is unbelievable to me. Was it that severe, Conan? I was an eight-year-old kid, but I was there.

And I had a lot of pull with the studio. I called Paramount and I was like, I don't think he's got it. Who is this? Eight-year-old Conan O'Brien. What are you? It'll be a big deal someday, you'll see. Why aren't you using a real phone? Why are you mining one with your hands? Oh my God. It's funny. But no, and the thing is, which is to me,

To me, I look at that performance and as you say in the book, your concept, which was clearly the right one, which is

You got to slowly see Michael come to this position. And then there's the iconic scene where they're all trying to figure out after Vito has been shot, what to do. And you are sitting there with your broken jaw and you say, okay, we arrange a meeting and the camera's pushing in. I can't watch that. And I can't talk about it without tingling because I think it is a beautiful way to tell a story through acting and,

But it takes patience. And the studio was saying...

I thought about it on my long walks in Manhattan. You talk about it. You would take long walks. You'd get the film, but it hasn't started shooting yet. You took long walks. Yeah, I would go all the way from 91st to The Village and back. 91st and Broadway. And I'd just think about the part. Think about it. I still do that with Will's.

I just think about him and it's fun. It gets me through the walk. Yeah. You get your step. I'm glad to know that in coming up with who Michael Corleone was, you got your steps in. Yeah, there it is. I managed not to get hit by a car. In those days. They should make a Fitbit that tells you, you have achieved the character.

10,000 steps. Stop. Stop walking. Stop now. You've nailed Michael Corleone. You've got it. I love it. But you know what's fascinating to me that I didn't know is that they, Coppola wants to show the studio, so it wasn't supposed to shoot yet, but he moves up.

The famous scene in the Italian restaurant. I think he said he didn't do that. So I corrected in the book a little bit. It's a good story. Let's go with it. But it is. I think it's true. I think he was sensing it. But the conversation in the Ginger Man. Do you remember the Ginger Man in Manhattan 64th? Yeah. That's where he called me in. And he was sitting there with his family and eating. And that's a great.

It's a bar and grill that I frequented, and a lot of people did. It was beautiful. Did you ever go there? I didn't go there, but you talk about it, and it's kind of very well-known. It's kind of an iconic place. It was a hangout, a watering hole. I mean, Bernstein would go in there, and great music. Because the Lincoln Center was across the street from him, so you'd see people who collaborated with him.

on things. So I walked in there again. That was a big thing for me to walk into Gingeman because, you know, I didn't go there because I didn't have money to buy the drinks. So I went in there and Francis was eating with his family and I was standing there and he says, we had a talk.

So I thought, well, where are we going to go? You know, we're not going to go anywhere. He didn't say that, but he's he didn't. Thing is, you're standing. He's sitting and he doesn't invite you to sit. Oh, my God. That's the first sign. This is important. You're standing there and you've been shooting for a couple of weeks now. Yeah. He tells you. Well, he tells me, you know, I had faith in you. I believed in you.

I said, yeah, I know. He says, well, you're not cutting it. I thought, oh, what do I do now? What do I say now? I said, well, I guess that would be a problem, I guess. I mean, so tell me, what do you mean? He says, I want to show you the rushes, meaning the footage that we had shot already and that I was going to see something.

I said, "Well, can I have some of that hamburger?" This retrospect, you know. I love to think of what I might have done or wanted to do. So I went to the Paramount Theater that they had this screening, and I sat there. I wasn't used to looking at myself on screen. I just didn't want to do that.

I had done Panic in Needle Park already, so I was—I don't know if you've seen that film. And you'd had a little bit of experience, but not much. Not much at all. That was my first film. Or a Patty Duke film. I had a couple of lines in. But I went and saw The Rushes, and I'm looking at the screen, and I'm seeing the takes of different things. I'm thinking, well, that is not spectacular. No.

But why should it be? Because I'm trying to see. I was hoping that I could blend in with the scenery and everything.

Not be seen specifically or, you know, spotted and wow, you know. Right. I just wanted to just blend and just be natural. And I thought, well, I know that's the way it looks now, but that's part of what is going to turn into Michael Corleone. And that's going to be the impact because where did this guy come from?

Where did this guy come from? And he's an enigmatic kind of character anyway throughout The Godfathers, one and two especially. So I thought that was the way I was going to go. So, of course, I said to Francis, naturally, the actor's instinct, I just said, yeah, I see what you mean. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah. That always quiets everybody down. I see what you're saying, yes. I think I'm a pretty chill person, Sona, but there's one thing that freaks me out when I have to wait a long time for furniture. I know. You ever have that happen? All the time. If you hate waiting for furniture...

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LinkedIn, the place to be, to be. Then I thought I was out, and I sort of wanted to be out, in a way. Yeah, I did. I thought...

What am I doing in this place? And those guys in the restaurant with me, the great Sterling Hayden. Sterling Hayden, yeah. And little Al Lettiri. I mean, they were amazing. Salazzo, yeah. Salazzo. I mean, the thing is, you shoot that scene, which is, you know, to this day, I can't watch that scene and not...

have my eyeballs fall out. You're sitting across from him like Salazzo. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And don't let this man go to the bathroom. I know. We have an old chain flusher too. This is bad. The old kind of, when you pull the chain. So I, I don't like repeats. Then you're safe. You're all right. So, so you shoot that scene. They send that, send,

Yeah. To Paramount, to the suits back in LA and they go, oh, okay. Well, you have to understand one thing because I, after I shoot these two guys,

who I really love, by the way. Yeah. And I shoot them, and I'm running out, and I sort of drop the gun, and I go into the street and jump in the moving car. Right. So they didn't have a stuntman for me there, or they didn't. They didn't want me to. Maybe they assumed that I would jump and get hurt, and I'd be out of the film. No.

Just coming to me now, Conan. That's an old Coppola trick. He put me in a film, it wasn't working out, and he threw me out of a car. That's got to go into the box of resentment. But anyway, I did miss the car.

What? Yeah. And I fell. It's in the book. We forget those things. I saw that. Yeah. So I fell and I was hurt. Kind of my ankle was hurt somehow. It slipped. The car had one of those side things that you could jump on and then jump in. So I was just looking up at the sky and I said, thank you, God.

This was my thought. I actually said, thank you, God. You're going to get me out of this film. Unbelievable. That's how much I wanted to leave it. I said, this is from heaven. Yeah. And people just all got around me and they said, he's hurt. Yeah. So I said, oh, yeah. And then they put one of these big fat needles in my ankle.

so I could finish the day. And they kept me. They kept me because they saw the rushes of that event. Of that scene, and they knew. And what's so amazing is, movie comes out, and this surprised me. Movie comes out, it's a phenomenon. I remember it, it was 1972. I would have been nine years old at the time. All anybody did was talk about that movie. People quoted it. It was, I mean, it just...

It's hard to describe today what a huge cultural moment it was. And you, in the book, talk about how uncomfortable you were. Yeah. You know, it's the thing. We live in this society now where everybody wants to be famous. And people would think, oh, my God, if I could be a young Al Pacino who's just done The Godfather, oh, my God, would I tear up the town? You hide. You don't love it. And you're drinking a lot. I think it was that period, that time of life when this wasn't...

In our social understanding, we didn't care about fame. As a matter of fact, it was somewhat in the... Hollywood somewhat was frowned upon in the theater, by the way. And they gave us this great entertainment, these great actors on the screen. But it was...

a kind of folklore for us. If you go to Hollywood, you lose your talent and something like that. That spread around. But also, I was extremely, I was a bit embarrassed about

Because I heard something like, Kerouac, you know Jack Kerouac? Yeah, of course I do. So he goes and he drinks his life away because he felt this embarrassment. I don't know where that comes from, self-esteem, whatever. But I felt I didn't want to be noticed. Part of my thing was I just wanted to creep around, you know, just do my thing. And so one time I'm at a light, actually, and

I'm at a traffic light, and I'm standing there across the street in this kind of gorgeous, you know, redhead. I'm sorry, it wasn't you, Conan, but it was another redhead. I'm a man. Excuse me. I'm about as much man as it gets. You're still a gorgeous redhead. I'm a gorgeous redhead. Yeah, she didn't look like you. I'd just be straight with you. That ruins the story. It ruins the story if it looks like me. So she says hello to me. She says hi.

I thought, oh, wow. I said, wow, hi. She says, hi, Michael. And it was as though I said, this is crazy. She's calling me Michael because she knows me.

She knows me from the film. And I just retreated. I just, I couldn't understand that. Nobody did that to me my entire life. Nobody responded. Oh, wow. You know, they never said that. No, they said, get away, you know. So I was kind of shocked and I retreated. And then I start seeing it happen again.

throughout, you know, in these various pockets. There's people, a woman kissing my hand, people treating me. And my friend Charlie's there, and the woman comes up to me and says, is that Al Pacino? He says, yeah, yeah. She says, is that Al Pacino? He says, well, somebody's got to be, you know. Yeah, fame has freaked you out. It freaked you out. You Al Pacino? I said, yeah. She says,

Congratulations. You look like your order. You do look very Al Pacino-y. I thought so today. I was like, that guy's

Reeks about Pacino. You know, it's funny because then you have what I think is any actor would give their left arm for this string of, you know, it's Serpico, it's Dog Day Afternoon. Those performances, I watched those performances and they're so electric and you had this energy

There's this energy that comes off of you, which it still does, by the way, but there's almost electrical manic energy that comes out of you, out of your eyes, out of your, I mean, I was watching Dog Day Afternoon the other day and just, you can tell that you're so inhabited by that role and by that moment. And after all these years, it's still spectacular, but you have this string. Thanks.

this string that's just unprecedented. And I'm reading about it in the book and the whole time you're, you feel very detached from it. Like you're not reveling and going, yep. I mean, I'd be out on the street going, yep, that's me. See that guy up there. That's me. Frequently are. I'm frequently up. And the sad thing is I'm pointing at you. Al Pacino, that's me. See? And then I go to the hospital and I get treatment. But,

You have this string and it leads to more drinking, more drugs, more unhappiness, more feeling of being disconnected. Which I have to say surprised me. I wasn't aware. Yeah.

Well, it hit me. It just did. I felt the kind of isolation from it. You know, I often talked about it as something like one has to earn one's relationships with friends and stuff. You're with people because you like being with them. You know, you share the same thoughts about things. But if I entered a room...

And all of a sudden what I had to say became important or, you know, they all were looking and letting me talk. And I sort of never had that experience. And it was uncomfortable. And I thought, well, we don't even know each other yet. And so to adjust to that.

That's the, I've heard it said before, people adjusting to being famous and being accepted wherever you go. And so I remember, I don't know if I told the story about

Marty Bregman, of course, was my producer. You guys did so much together. Yeah, we did. And so, oh, my God, I'm sorry about this. That's okay. That might be for me. No, it's not. So, hi, honey. Hi, baby. I can't talk now. I'm with Conan O'Brien. Yeah, hear it? Yeah.

Yes. I'll be finished in a minute. Sorry, Conan. No, I'm just joking. I can't believe you call Coppola honey. This is my daughter. Oh, that's your daughter. Okay, okay. I'm glad. She's in a new apartment. You're not the superintendent, are you? I fixed the pipe. I could be. I got to talk to her first. There's still a couple of people in that building who still think Al is the superintendent. Yeah.

I'll be there. I'll be there. I'll fix it. It's steam heat. It takes a while. Give it a second. You know what's crazy to me is...

And again, I was unaware of this, but you have this Scarface. You make Scarface and it is, at the time, critics are savage about it. And it has since become, in a lot of ways, I mean-

financially your biggest movie. It's huge and it has a, it has this kind of enduring place in the culture which nobody could have seen at the time. Is that, is that fair to say? That's fair to say. Yeah. It's, you know, it seems like it,

is always there. There's a guy who wrote the Scarface Papers. I don't know if you've ever heard of that book, but it explains some of the stuff about its consistency and why it's still around. And we got a lot of help from hip-hop and from the rappers early on and the college kids and then other things started happening. And then we went into that VH band

That started to catch the VHS, and that's what blew it up. And then it went across...

you know, went over the ocean into Europe and Asia and everywhere. And so it's like this thing. It's fascinating because it's so... You know, Oliver Stone wrote this script. Yeah. Brian De Palma directed it. And they hit something. Nobody could be more different than the three of us. And Bregman. Yeah, we were just three different planets. And there we were. And somehow...

It just made it work for some reason. You know, Brian De Palma threw Oliver Stone off the set. He couldn't be there, you know. And having it was that kind of thing. But it's a beautiful script when you read it and when you see what Brian has done with it. You know, what's amazing is, because I didn't know this, this was in the book,

One of your big contributions was you knew that Tony has to have a scar face. He's got to have a scar. And you said you thought of the idea that it should come across the eyebrow. Yeah.

And you said in the book you did that because you thought that that showed chaos. Yes. And I thought, I read that and I thought, yes, it does. That's fantastic. You don't know what you're going to get. This is chaos. It's disconcerting. I don't know how you thought of that, but the fact that an eyebrow is cut in two is on a level very disconcerting. Yes. In a subtle way that you didn't get a giant, you know, you didn't do that. And it led me back to, it's a theme in your book.

I don't know if this is conscious or unconscious. I know you've done a lot of therapy, but it does feel to me like there's some part of you that likes chaos. Oh, come on, of course. I mean, without chaos, where are we?

We're floating. I just love to think, where are we? No, but the kind of chaos, you know, it's... That's why I always ride the 5 p.m. subway in New York. I like to rush out. You know, sit around, here they go, you know. The door's open, you know. It sort of gives you a lift, you know. You just feel...

I'm alive and it's coming. I don't have anywhere to go, though. I shouldn't be doing this. I don't want you on the 5 o'clock subway anymore. I'm going to come with you. I'll be like, Al Pacino's with that gorgeous redhead. You know, it's funny. You know what shocked me is, again, and I think I speak for a lot of us when I think type up...

put your name in and you're just going to see one of the great, if not the most influential actors, blah, blah, blah, blah. You in the 80s,

hit a cold spot. Yeah. And you talk about it in the book. Yeah. And you think, well, my movie career is over. And you are kind of out of it for a little bit. Yeah. You're trying to do some theater and stuff, but that's shocking to me now because that wasn't something, you felt it, you lived it. Well, I thought, I don't know what's going on. I thought, uh,

I don't want to be doing this anymore. There's something going on. Things are not working. Scarface was such a disaster when I thought it was a good film. I mean, it was going to work, but it didn't. And it actually made money. It was the critics sort of took a dislike to it. But at the same time,

I just didn't know. I didn't want to do it anymore. I thought, well, let's refresh and let's go back and do some of the things that I started with. That fed you. Things like theater. Of course. Getting there, being connected to people, get away from this stuff. Talking through things, pieces of work, whether it's Oedipus or whatever, because I

You know, when you do those kind of plays, they're always in translation, of course. Translation means everything. Who's the translator? And so spending time with that stuff, whether you're doing Chekhov or Strindberg,

Or some of the great plays, American plays, you know. So I liked getting involved. And that's what happens at the Actors Studio. You're able, that's what we do there. And so I did a movie called Looking for Richard. I was going to bring this. This is what I was going to bring up. And I was going to bring this up for a reason. You did this project called Looking for Richard. Mm-hmm.

And it's about Richard III, and it's so many things. It's a fascinating movie because you see different performances for Richard III, interpretations of it throughout the film. But you do something that I have some familiarity with, which is a big part of my career has been leaving the studio, getting a camera, finding real people and trying to make something happen. And I love that part. It terrifies me, but I love it. And it's been...

I don't know, maybe 70% of the work that I've done that people really like is that kind of work where I'm out there doing this stuff and things are happening in real time. A big part of looking for Richard

There's a thread that runs through it where it's you on the street talking to people about what does Shakespeare mean to you? And you are so quick and funny and vulnerable. And I was watching that part going like, damn it, he's good at that. You know, I mean, that's the one thing that I can relate to of all of your work is going out there with a camera. And I was blown away. You're talking to people. You're getting them to talk about

Shakespeare, you're on the streets of New York, you talk to some young kid and you say, what do you think of Hamlet? He goes, Hamlet sucks. Hamlet sucks! But it's wonderful. It's fantastic. It's you out there. And what I love is...

You keep stripping it all away and saying, let's lose all this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oscar iconic films. Let's lose all that. I'm going to put on a baseball cap backwards and I'm going to walk through the streets and talk to people about Shakespeare and we're going to get our hands dirty. And that, I mean, I know that that project meant a lot to you. I was sort of driven to that by having what you had just said, that you want to have a

piece of yourself in this. You want to, you're tired of just doing stuff that's not giving you what you need as in your, in your creative, that creative gene we have. And it's just not being supplied with stuff because it, it happens to everybody. So other actors too, you know, you, you, you, that's why some actors, I talk about that in the book will repeat the,

repeat roles because they scored in them and they did well in them and they continue to do well in them, but they're capable of doing much more. And it's hard to grow if you don't keep challenging yourself. You got to challenge yourself. That's why I like chaos. Yeah. Well, you're in the right place. I certainly am. And that's why when I looked at you and I said that to you.

I, the other day I wanted my son who's 18 to see, I wanted him to see real acting, real writing. So I said, come with me. My wife was out of town. It sounds like I'm gonna show him pornography, but that was, but no. She's out of town.

This is an, oh, this is a movie. This is called Debbie Does Dallas. No, I showed him the movie, Glen Gary, Glen Ross. Oh, yeah. And he's riveted, I'm riveted. It's such an incredible cast, the whole thing. And the next morning I go,

And he's blown away. And I'm like, okay, you get it? That's, that's, that's, and he loved it. And the next morning I go to get breakfast and I run smack into David Mamet. Wow. Yeah. And I said, hey, last night, and he was like, please leave me alone. No, no, he's always been very wonderful when I run into him, but I could just,

tell all of you were so great in that film, but your character so intimidates me. He's charming, but he's intimidating at the same time, you know? And it's, you've got this, I don't know. That's one of my favorite performances too. Absolutely incredible performance. I thought Jack Lemmon, as time goes on, he really steps out in that part. Jack Lemmon. Yeah, absolutely. I tried doing that part in New York on Broadway and,

doing Jack's part because they did a production. You were Richie Roma. I was Richie Roma. Yeah, in the film, but then you switched and you did his part on Broadway. On Broadway, and I did his part, and I thought I could do his part somewhat. It's a good part. Let me try that. It's so totally different than Richie Roma. So I started it, but I didn't realize this is Mamet, and you have to have time to, you know,

acquire the taste and be able to live through this part. And we had three weeks rehearsal and I didn't have any lines that I was able to say, you know, so, but at the same time, I realized how great Jack Lemmon was in this role. And I thought, wow, I should have watched it before I did it.

But I didn't know where I was on Broadway, and that's a tough thing to go through. But I did remember that I said, look, I don't know what to do here because there's times I don't know what the lines are. This is Mammoth now. It's like rewriting Shakespeare. But I started saying things that came to me. That's my new thing, which—

You know, we go through various phases where we go a little nuts and then we start doing nutty things. And sometimes things come out of that, you know. Oh, I'm familiar. You get a little cherry, you know. So, but you start ad-libbing Mamet. So now, yeah, I thought, I don't know why I can't get this monologue at all. I can't get it. And it's, I don't know what, how it's written in a certain way. So I said, I'm going to start saying my own words here.

St. Amal, the actors with me were so great. I mean, they were right with it. I didn't even say things on the stage. Then I started dancing on the stage. You started doing soft shoe. Soft shoe in the middle of the play. Because I'm a real believer in we have things with acting that all of a sudden the unconscious comes out.

You free yourself so your unconscious starts to, you know, express itself. And I was walking down the street after I realized that I did what I did. I said, what? Why did I do that? And then I said, wait a minute. My dad had...

who I didn't know much. You know that. He left early. But he was a salesman. He was a salesman and he was a great ballroom dancer. So you think you maybe channeled him a little bit? I channeled him. Of course I did. Don't yell at me. How come you don't know that? You see what I mean? You got to get out there, Conan. Oh, my God. Express yourself.

No, but it was interesting. You know, there's another thing. I'm doing a play, a Shakespeare play at the Public Theater, and I'm tired. And, you know, all of a sudden you're doing eight performances a week. Who invented that? That's the worst thing that could ever happen to anybody. It ruins all actors. And I'm doing eight performances a week.

And I'm not doing really well. So I'm doing it, but I'm getting through it. And with me, everything is time. I believe that's why I love the theater so much, because it's time. I mean, I did American Buffalo over four years. I did movies in between. But by the fourth year, I didn't have to do anything when I went on stage. It was in your bones. It was in your bones. It entered the bones. But I'm doing Shakespeare, and I have this huge...

a monologue talking to a lot of people and I'm tired, but it's maybe a matinee on Saturday or Sunday, I don't know. And I'm talking and I'm talking and I start thinking, wait a minute.

I'm repeating myself. Every line I'm saying, I've said right before. So I'm saying it twice. And I said, oh my God. And I'm saying the lines. To me, I'm saying them twice. And I'm thinking the audience is being friendly. They're sort of scared because they think, I think this actor is

Losing it. I think we're going to have to carry him somewhere and take him to a hospital afterward. He's crazy. And I got really scared.

And then it took me a while to recover. I don't know if I ever did, but at the end of the show, I didn't, I wasn't doing that, but it felt like it. This is what exhaustion on the stage means. You know, I mean, it really is, especially with the big roles, you know, so I just, I just refused to do that. And then I just said, don't pay me.

Don't pay me and I'll do six a week. Right. Now I do like three. Right. Don't tell me one. You know, one of the things, there is a thing that happened where because Robert De Niro came along at the same time and he's in Godfather 2 and you talk about it in the book, there was always this

De Niro, De Niro, Pacino. And you said you guys were always friendly. You admired each other's work. You boosted each other. But of course, the media likes to try and make it something. And you say in the book, I think it's just because both of our names ended in a vowel. That would help. They should throw in Dustin Hoffman.

but his name didn't ring a bell. Well, they changed it at Ellis Island from Hoffman O. Oh, yeah. But I'm just curious, like, you finally, the first time you worked together, you have it, is in Heat, and you have that scene, and I, God, that's another movie I've seen a thousand times, and we'll see a thousand more, but you have that scene where,

in the diner, which is such a great idea where you just pull over De Niro. He's the bad guy. You're the good guy. You're the cop. He's the robber. Let's talk. And the two of you sit down and...

It's such a spectacular scene. And in the book, you reveal that De Niro said, let's not rehearse it. Let's just do it. No rehearsal. And it's one of my favorite scenes. No, he was right thinking that way. It was perfect. I mean,

to do it that way. These guys. Yeah. And what a great idea to have the two characters. Let's take a second. Let's sit, sit down and tell each other who we are. And then we will shake hands and go back to trying to kill each other. Yeah. Which is a beautiful, you know what I mean? Yeah. It's a beautiful idea that I thought was just, uh,

And the fact that you just did it, is that the one take or you did it many times? Oh, many times. This is Michael Mann directing it. Oh, okay. You get to do it many times. Yeah. You were there for six years. Yeah, yeah. You had long beards at the end. They're doing a take later. I'd like to do this again. When I come in, can I do it? What's that? As Michael Chekhov said, the great acting genius.

And Pissarro, he was... The actress comes in the door and says, oh, Dr. Maestro, I really want to be an actress. You know, I really want it. I want it so much. He says, yes. Go outside, come in again, and do the same thing, and I'll tell you if you could be an actress. Wow. Can you do it? Yeah. I want to slap him in the face for doing that. That is so...

pompous and assholey. I don't do that. I was thinking, yeah. But I'm kind of an asshole. No, somehow it works. Asshole just came in my head just now while I was saying it. I said, it sounds... When I first heard it, I thought, a lot of truth in that. But now I'm an old fellow.

And I think it's disconcerting, to be honest with you. I've gone so far in my brain. Are you able, after writing this book now... To write another? I am really ready. It'll be about this show. How could I not? Yeah. I'm just curious if you are able to now look back...

this process had, you have to be able to look back now and go, Jesus Christ, what a, what a ride. What, I mean, and, and,

I'm Al Pacino. I'll tell you the truth. I was doing it, doing it, working on it, working with some good people, and I devoted myself to whatever I did. But as soon as I finished it, I didn't want to look at it anymore. It was done. It was over.

I said, you know, it's like when I did Looking for Richard, I would sit in – they had these audiences would come in. I don't know what you call them again. Test audiences? Test audiences. And they would write it. And I'd be sitting there, and I was thinking –

I don't want them to come. I don't, we're not ready. The film was at the editing room, by the way. I thought somehow from the editing room to the theater where it was going to play, someone would change it and make it better, you know. And then I wanted to tell them, remember that in the book? I wanted to tell them, you know, I was just, listen, don't take this seriously. I was just trying to put something together. I mean, it's fine. I'm just trying. You don't have to stay. You don't have to.

You don't say that to a test audience. You shouldn't probably see this. This was a mistake. You should go now. I don't think this is for you. There's a nugget in this book that is so, it's such a great visual that I just had to bring it up to you, which is the moment where

you're making the Godfather and Coppola says, "You should talk to Brando. You guys should get to know each other a little bit." And you're shooting the scene in the hospital where you go and you end up saving Vito's life.

But he says, you should go talk to him. So they arranged for you guys to have lunch together in one of those hospital rooms. And you said, it's such a great picture. You're not saying much. Brando's talking to you. And the whole time he's talking, he's eating chicken cacciatore with a lot of sauce with his hands. What? With his hands. And he's talking to you and you...

And then at the end, he says, like, kid, I think you're going to be okay. I think you're going to be all right. And then you describe what he, you're wondering the whole time, he doesn't have a napkin. His hands are covered. I'm wondering what I should do with that chicken ketchup. I got mesmerized. Didn't hear anything he said. Yeah, yeah. But, but. He's probably giving you the greatest acting advice ever. And you're like, whoa. He is? That looks like it's got extra Parmesan. It has.

But then you describe what he does. His hands are covered in sauce, and you're like, he doesn't have a napkin. Yeah, so he doesn't have a napkin, so he puts his hands on the bed sheet of the hospital, white bed sheet, and wipes them on that. Oh, my God.

I mean, it's such a bad thing. No, no, no, but it's funny. You had to be there. I would do it too today. No, no, but you know what's so funny? They send me to lunch and you don't give me napkins? That's simple. But you know what's so funny, Al? What's so funny is in the book, you were like, you see him and he finishes and he sees he's on this white bed and he does that and you went, that's a movie star. Exactly. That's a movie star. Well, this will work. Is that what movie stars do? I'm going to be one. I got to be one of those.

No, he was the greatest person you ever wanted to know. Did you get to know him well? Oh, well, of course. I was with him a lot. You know, just being around him, there's such warmth to him. I mean, he's so sensitive, how he sees you, especially other actors. He was so wonderful to me and everybody.

but he was particularly funny with Jimmy Kahn because the two of them had done films together. So he was... Comfortable with Jimmy Kahn. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Much more. And I was always sort of sulking somewhere. LAUGHTER

I never knew if I was coming or going. You know, I was always just like there somehow saying, okay, I got away with that. What's next? But one of the last things he said to me,

I was on 79th Street outside in, you know, the summertime, wherever it was, along Columbus Avenue. I don't remember the restaurant or whatever, but I was out there by myself, and he called me. And I said, well, you know, he wanted something. I said, sure. And then he said, Al, you know. Al? Yeah?

Stay out of court. I said, no, he knew me. I can't go to court. I can't go to court. Now I'm going to go to court. I'm sure they just cut this out. What are you talking about?

That was his advice to you, was stay out of court. It was like he meant divorce court. Oh, I see. See, that's what he meant. I see. Yes, yes. Well, that's a good idea. I think it's a good idea. Here's the big tip from Marlon Brando. I could, unfortunately for you, talk to you for 40 hours and never be happy, but I want to let you go. Oh, you're throwing me out now. No, no, I'm not throwing you out. This reminds me actually of...

I said at the beginning, I don't really get starstruck. I've met everybody. Not long ago, I'm in New York on business. Someone says, hey, come with me, go to dinner. I think we go to Polo Bar. And I'm walking out and I see...

out of the corner of my eye, an iconic figure, and I look, and you are sitting in a big banquette, and you're by yourself. I think you were with people, but they had just used the bathroom or something, and you're just sitting there, and you point.

And I think he's pointing at someone. And I do the classic thing of I look behind me and you go, you, you. And you go, come here. And I go, me? Yeah. So I go over and you go, Conan, how are you? I won't do you. I won't even tell you how much I love you. I really do. You know, it's so crazy. So I'm talking to you and I'm just thinking the whole time, because you talk about this a lot in your book, how you always think,

I got to get out of here and no one really wants to see me. So you're talking to me and you're telling me, you know, about, you're going to show the Godfather. You're going to show it up at, uh,

somewhere in Northern Manhattan. They're going to have a big screening of it. And you're talking to me. And I said, that's such an honor to see you, such an honor to see you. And I- You're talking too much, Al. No, no, no, you weren't. I was just thought, Conan, don't overstay your welcome. He just wanted to say, hi, get out. So I say, such an honor. You take care, Al. And I leave. The next day, by pure coincidence, I run into one of the people who had just joined you at the table. And they said-

I just got there and you were walking away and Al went, what happened? He fled. And I was just thinking, I don't, it's Al Pacino. Don't fuck this up. Get away. But the next time I see you and I'm going to follow you and see you and I'm going to haunt you, I'm going to sit down. Okay. Okay. You don't seem thrilled about it. No, you're going too far. You're going to get salazzoed.

I've got to use the bathroom. I'll be back with a gun. The book is Sunny Boy. It's the best thing I've read in a long time. Everyone's going to read it. Everyone's going to buy it. And I'm blessed to know you. I really am. Thank you for being here. God bless. I'm so happy I did your show. I really am. Thank you. Oh, this is, I mean, I'm done now. This is my last podcast. Thank you. No, don't go that far. Okay. Please. Thank you, sir. Thank you.

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Well, Al Pacino was just here. Let's just. That was incredible. Yeah. He's my favorite actor. Oh, he's an actor. Oh, my God. Who is this man? He is my favorite actor of all time. And I was just so electrified that he came in and he was so fantastic. It was so much fun.

And I remembered just before the interview, we had this big talk because I think people were a little on edge today.

Yeah. Well, it's a big day. It's a big day. You don't know what you're getting. Aaron Blair wore a blazer. Whoa. And look at him. Thank you. Which is, and listen, to be fair, I read his book and loved it. I was rewatching movies. I was thinking a lot about Mr. Pacino, Al. I was really preparing for this. And yeah, it's called Preparing Summer. I was going to say, I am preparing. You feel like you're? Yeah. You didn't just walk in.

I like to be prepared. It depends, you know, who it is. You know, when it's the cast of Selling the O.C., maybe I wing it. Shocked. Shocked you know that. Oh, my God. You have no idea what I know.

But when it's Al Pacino, I don't need to prepare because I feel like I know his career cold, but I really wanted to read the book and think about it. And everyone was a little, everybody was in a slightly different mode today. I could tell. There's also 40 more people than is ever here too. Yeah. It was really something. Suddenly people are here who've never here before. Like I'm here to fix the cigarette machine. Yeah. We don't have a cigarette machine. And that was De Niro. Yeah. Yeah. It was De Niro. And so-

But then we get in here and...

We start talking about like, let's not make him wear a headset like we always do with people. But then we get into this classic conversation that we've had many times with Eduardo because these are directional mics. Eduardo, I give it up for you. You're a brilliant guy. You built this place. Thank you. You did a wonderful job. Sometimes you're a little, and for a reason, these are directional mics. Correct. But you want everyone's lips to be on mic. Yes. No, he just wants people to be on mic.

be on mic. Yeah, he just wants people to talk into the microphone. Thank you, guys. When the police are trying to bug an apartment, they put a little bug, you know, up in the lamp, and then they hear them saying, yeah, yeah, we'll kill him, yeah, and then they arrest them. That's why it's never admissible in court, because it's like, okay,

Well, they put plenty of mobsters away using the same technology. Anyway, we have these microphones that you really need to be close to them. And the fear is that maybe, you know, any of these actors that we have on or anybody might just be talking and they may lean back. They may drift from the mic. Billie Eilish. And Billie Eilish. It's happened plenty of times. So you were saying that if they wear the headsets.

They know when they're wandering away from the mic. But I didn't want that. So I was trying to think of a way that we cannot wear headsets. Because I don't want to talk to Al Pacino while he's wearing what like a submarine sonar guy would have in a World War II movie. Yeah.

I want to talk to Al Pacino. So I was hoping, let's not do that. Let's just not do that. And then I came up with an idea for a fix. Which we thought was a real idea when you first said it. And I told these guys. You set this up so early. I set it up so well. I say, guys, guys, I have a way to fix this. It's a technological fix. And you guys were actually looking at me like, well, he probably does have something. I knew you were. You probably knew. I knew you were not serious. Okay, but I think, Eduardo. I was.

He intrigued. Blay? A thousand percent. And what about you? I just wasn't listening. Okay. So anyway, I said, no, no, I'm really serious, guys. This is what we should do. We should get a little, just like a little clip and we have, it's tied to a nylon cord and we,

clip it to them and it's really secure. And you guys were still looking at me like, uh-huh, where's he going with this? And then the clip attaches to a little wheel right here and then it runs underneath the table and Eduardo has it. If someone starts to drift off mic, he can pull on it and they're like, anyway, I just need to... And suddenly...

We should do that with him. So Al Pacino would be like, and then I was saying, you know, I was talking to him, when we shot the Godfather Part II, I go, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh,

And then I'd wear it a little bit and then I'd tug to remind him who's boss. I love the idea. So I think we do this idea. Can you do that but it actually pulls him away from the mic? Even better. You know what? I'll have... So great. You all have wires? Yes. So I'll start... So... I have no wires but I'll be like, yeah, another thing, Sona. Yes!

Or, oh, well, Gorley, I think. I love it. I'm just kidding. You guys are just yanking me around. Oh, my God. And all the people here is. Oh, my God.

Can we just talk about how personable he was too and how he would talk and, you know, listeners don't know this, but there are two types of guests on the show. Those that just kind of come in and they're tunnel vision. They look at you. And then those that are like really talk to everyone in the room. And he was one of those people that would just make eye contact with people. I don't know if you could tell, but I started to build a brick wall so that he couldn't see you guys. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I have, because I keep bricks here. Yes, I know that. And I have a lathe and I was just quickly as it, no, he was, honestly, comes from the fact that

that when you read his book, yes, he's an iconic film star, but in his heart, he's a guy who wants to go to the theater and work with everybody and figure it out. And you can tell that's what he loves is he loves this kind of communal. And I think that's his instinct is he's not here just to talk to me. He's here to have an experience with us. Well, you know how you can tell he's a man of the people. When his phone rang in that interview, I looked over and his phone case is

is all Shrek heads. It's just printed multiple sized Shrek heads all over. Yeah. He's a dad with some kids. I love it. And he's got new Shrek heads. Yeah. Yeah. Unbelievable. Yeah. And then his phone went off midway through the interview. That's happened before maybe. I don't know. But when it rang, my heart dropped because I was like, please don't let it be my phone. It's usually Sona when it's happened. What the fuck?

No, no. To be fair, it was Al Pacino's phone, but it was someone calling. Asking, who are you? Can you just tell me who you are real quick? What did you act in? Which reality show were you in? Keep at it, buddy. I'm sure you'll make it. I definitely had a minor panic attack when a phone went off because that's always something I'm constantly worried about or whatever. And then as soon as it was his phone, relief. Yes, I'm the same.

I love when it goes off and it's your phone. That's hardly ever happened. That's how... And then you get mad and then you realize it's your phone. My phone is always on, but no one ever calls me. You also had these glasses on the table just like Mo Green in The Godfather and I kept expecting you to put them back on and... Yeah. It's so...

Those movies are so seared into my brain. And not just those, so many of his movies. And, you know, I... I'm serious. I know who he is. You guys are making this up. Yeah, yeah. Matt looked at me like, Sona, do you know what the Godfather is? No, it was your... It wasn't me being kind of sending you... I can't hear me. I don't have headphones.

headphones on. But I will say he's multi-generational. Like, yeah, it doesn't because Eduardo, you were saying for you, it's Scarface for me. Yeah. And, and, um, you know, I remembered, uh, when I was in college, yeah, the Godfather one and two is a big thing, but,

But Scarface was huge. Michelle Pfeiffer. Some of my best friends were, friendships were formed over that movie. Really? Yeah, it was special. Oh, I thought you said some of your best friends were dealing cocaine in Miami. Yeah.

and shooting each other. He did not say that. Yeah, no, but it was, uh, uh, it's, and then it just keeps going because I was talking to a friend of mine who was like a workout fanatic and he's in his, he'd be in his thirties and he was just saying like, I said that I was gonna be talking to Al Pacino and he said that speech he gives in any given Sunday. And I thought, oh my God, you can, it just goes and goes and goes. Uh,

It's incredible. And then into the current day with the Irishman and Once Upon a Time in Hollywood. Yeah. And he's the voice of the new Shrek. That makes sense. Yeah. Donkey, what are you fucking doing? Hey, Donkey, why don't you go out in the rowboat and say a Hail Mary? I killed the fucking donkey! I've lost my soul!

That's a Shrek turn I haven't seen. Oh, my God. All right. Well, that was really, wow. That was fun. That's a high. It is pretty surreal. That was nice to experience that. I hesitate to do this, but I have to thank you for bringing these kind of crazy experiences into my life. Oh, my God, I know. I mean, it's amazing to be able to sit by and watch this happen. Well, I think he was here to see all of us die.

That's absolutely not true. We were waiting for the, I was waiting for you to finish. I was going to slam you at the end, but he didn't give me a chance. Oh, yeah, he wasn't. That's bullshit. I think I wanted to cut it off. It almost makes me. He outside was saying like, I don't want anyone else in the room. And I said, it's kind of how we do it. And he went, well, I don't like Gourley. I've heard his other podcasts. He does something about Bonanza. And I was like, no, no, no, no. It's too niche. It's too niche what he does.

Who wants to listen to him and Andy Daly? Just puddle on! And I said, Al, Al, just come on in. And Sona, what's that all about? I mean, did she land her ass in butter or what? She's a bad assistant and now she gets a job for life? And I said, Al, Al, just come on in. And why is Play wearing the blazer? That's not who Play is. Everyone turns into Nixon, too. Let me tell you something else.

Let's get Haldeman and Ehrlichman and let's start a mob and we'll take over the five families. Everything is nix.

Take it away, Jimmy. Take it away, Jimmy.

Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair and our associate talent producer is Jennifer Samples. Engineering and mixing by Eduardo Perez and Brendan Burns. Additional production support by Mars Melnick. Talent booking by Paula Davis, Gina Batista and Brit Kahn. You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts and you might find your review read on a future episode.

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