Jack Black
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Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert. I'm Dax Shepard. I'm joined by Monica Padman. Hi. Hello. Oh, this was a long time coming. In fact, I think I even flirted with this around the strike time when I had gone and done a charity event on stage. And I told the story about chatting with him backstage. And we were both like, well, when's he coming on? And now he's finally here. He barely does anything. He does. It was very flattering that he came here. Jack Black. Oh, my God. Do I love Jack Black? Who doesn't love Jack Black?

He's an award-winning actor, a comedian, and a musician. Kung Fu Panda, Nacho Libre, Juicy.

Jumanji, Welcome to the Jungle, The Holiday. And he has a new movie out in theaters this Friday, the 9th, called Borderlands. Dystopian, futuristic tale. He plays a robot. Oh. Yes. I love Jack Black. Me too. He is, I think, one of the most likable celebrities. He is.

And he also. Is a rock star. Tenacious D is. He's a rock star. So kick ass. It's crazy how good his voice is. Yeah. He sang a little bit. He did. Yeah, he sings a little bit, which is fun. Yeah. I listen to him sing all day long. Please enjoy Jack Black.

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Oh my god, what an entrance. I'm so sorry.

Good to see you. Good to see you. I like the suspenders. I wanted to be playful and cute for you. The engineer pantaloons. Pantaloons. Jack almost drank some of our spoiled milk. Thank God we caught it in time. We have spoiled? We offer spoiled milk? Yes. I didn't even know that was an option. There were three different flavors of spoiled milk. Oh my goodness. I like to come and throw people's spoiled milk away.

What are you drinking there, a coffee? Coffee. I knew it. Just a little giddy up and go. You want to know what I'm working with? Yeah. The remains of my pre-workout. Oh, yeah. You ever fuck with pre-workout? No. Oh my God, Jack. I do get my steps. In fact, I got some steps on the way here. You walked. But we live so close to each other, I did not nearly get enough steps. That's how close we are together.

I was with my kids. I bet it was three weeks ago. It was like on a Sunday and we were coming down Vermont and we were right at Finley and we saw old Jack Black on the corner adorned in tie dye, like a middle of a Sunday. That's how I do. About to cross Vermont on your own. And I don't know why it made me so happy. Did you give a shout out? I didn't. Do you wrestle with this? I'm like, this man gets shouted at. I shouldn't shout at him. I wanted to very badly.

And this is a little bit of a pattern we've already developed. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, I have the headphones on, so I have plausible deniability. Oh, smart. Genius. I can always pretend like I didn't hear the shout out. Have you ever thought about incorporating blue blockers as well so that there's no way eye contact wise we know if you saw? Yeah. I like to go noise cancellation and listen to whatever I'm listening to, my book or music, and then I will still hear a shout out. I shouldn't even admit this, but sometimes I hear a shout out and sometimes not. Sometimes you don't. Probably.

I don't know. I don't know when I don't hear it. That's a big question mark. How would you? But I plow forward nine times out of ten just thinking, if I actually know that person, they'll hit me with a text later. I'm not going to stop and chat if I don't have to just because I am, like, scared of the stranger danger. Yeah, sure, sure, sure, sure, sure. You should be. Well, there's a lot that happens. I would imagine you have the same thing I do, which is like—

There's some commitment to deliver. It's not like they're meeting Daniel Day-Lewis and they're expecting a somber smile. It's like, you're a good time, Charlie. You're fun. And I feel like I better give that to you. And then the question is, do I have the energy right now to give that to you? That's the thing. And also, are you on your way somewhere? Sometimes you gotta be rude. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, I like that. Unfortunately, you've got to be rude. It's 100% part of the job, and I love my job. It's a small price to pay for the incredible life that I've had. I will stop and chat with anyone who loves my junk. It's a bummer when you stop and chat because they've shouted you down or chased you down, and then you realize they don't really know who you are. They're just like, I know you from somewhere. Can you tell me everything you've done?

- Yeah. - Nope, nope. Keep going. Oh, I have a friend who says something great. Michael Rosenbaum, he was Lex Luthor on Smallville and he always had his head shaved. So he definitely gets it bad where people, they know they know him, but he doesn't have his head shaved. And his go-to is they'll go, "Where do I know you from?" And he'll go, "Did you see Seabiscuit?" And they go, "Yeah." And they're so excited about remembering Seabiscuit.

That then he's just moving on and he's not in Seabus. That's a good move. That's a good pivot. You're so distinct. And my guess is that you might struggle with like, I could go out and not be distinct, but then who are you? Do you struggle with that? Yeah. No, I don't know how to go out not distinct. I don't think it matters what I wear. I think they can tell from my gait and from my shape. Have you tried camouflage?

No. But I have worn a Stormtrooper mask. I've done stuff where it should be. You can't know who's under there. I don't think I would do well on the Masked Singer. I think everyone would know. But wouldn't it be cool if you had a button where it was like...

And then turn it back on when you need it, when you've got an event where you have to turn on the mustard. Yeah, like a cloak, a visibility cloak. But if I had to choose, the button only goes one way for the rest of my life, I'd leave it on. I like the life. I mean, I'd leave it off if it's an anonymity button.

I'd rather be known. Oh my God. Knock on wood. I shouldn't have even played with that. But definitely be careful what you wish for. Yes. Yes. It'd be like Twilight Zone episode. Dude, that would be a good Twilight Zone episode. Do you want to reboot Twilight Zone? Wait a second. We should talk to Jordan Peele.

Oh, that's whose hands we would trust it in. Well, he did do it for a season. Maybe he just dipped his toe in the Twilight Zone waters. Because I think he was like the new Rod Serling for a minute. Remember? I don't remember that. Are you sure it's out yet? Let me tell you something. I love me some Jordan Peele. Same. Me too.

And you've met him, I'm sure. I never crossed paths with him. Never met. Have you met him? We interviewed him, and I think you would like him 10x if you sat and got to know him. He's a very special and sweet person. Yeah, I've watched all of the movies several times, and I always find deeper layers in every watching.

And top 10 funniest people of all time. Yes. Dude, Key and Peele. Oh, forget about it. You don't get funnier than that. And when I see them scrolling through the TikToks or the Instagrams, I'm like, it's getting funnier. That hat making sketch, do you remember that? The best. Unreal. The cap outdoing each other. The competition of the caps. There's a woman making it on his head. He's got a whole sweatshop on his head.

There's a handful of sketches that made such impressions on me throughout my life. There's a couple Mr. Show sketches. Oh, yeah. Just brought one up with Polar she was on, but do you remember the sketch? You were on Mr. Show. Yep, I did a little thing here and there. Where...

Dave Cross was hosting a talk show and he was answering questions, but the questions were given on the previous episode. And so he wants to remind the callers to not ask questions about the pets because that was last week's episode. And it starts and he's completely disheveled and falling apart. And then he pans a TV around and he goes, see, this was last week's. And he looks a little better. He's like, just to remind everyone the concept of the show, you're going to be calling pets.

For this episode, right? Yeah. We're trying to delay the questions. They've only done five shows, and every time he turns the TV, he's getting better and better looking. And then the first show, he looks great, and he's so excited about this new concept. Well, we're not going to take callers today, because I'm going to give the topic for next week's calls. That's more than comedy, though. It's math. It's mind-blowing, you know, like a mathematical equation and surrealist genius. They are one of my favorites of all time.

not only because they were so funny and brilliant, but also they kind of gave me my big break.

It was Mr. Show that discovered Tenacious D and gave us a platform. They put us on HBO right before them, or was it right after? I can't remember if we were the caboose or like a little cartoon right before Mr. Show, but it wasn't animated. It was me and Kyle doing Tenacious D. That's what really got my career started. I had little parts before that, but that was the big break. Jack, I was front row for all this. You were there at the tapings. I did go to a taping, but I...

I moved to LA in '96. I wanted to get into comedy. I didn't know what to do. I started at the Groundlings. I had one friend who was dialed into y'all's scene, which was the Largo scene. And I went to every show at Largo and I saw you numerous times.

and I was enamored with you genuinely. And then you were a guy I would be around in real life who then was all of a sudden on HBO. And I was like, oh my God, this guy from the alternative comedy scene. Like I was watching so excited that people like you were coming off of that stage and getting on HBO. It was so thrilling. That was an exciting time.

The alternative comedy scene, you could feel it at the time that it was a movement and it was kind of springing out of alt rock, the tail end of that. And that was the world I had been submerged in in Detroit. And I was like, oh, this is weird. This is like comedy and punk rock. Some of them like Bob Odenkirk came from the Saturday Night Live world, but he kind of came out of there with a chip on his shoulder and an edge and a fire and maybe a little burn in his gut.

And he wanted to flip it over and turn it upside down and give it back to them in a subversive, brilliant way. It was fun and exciting and anyone could get in. It didn't really matter where you were from. I didn't have any in with that crowd. But me and Kyle were from this theater company, Actors Gang Theater Company, and we started writing songs and playing songs. We had one song and we went to this place called Al's Bar.

in the middle of downtown. It was a total dive. Hipster, stoner, drunk people, like maybe 12 people in the audience. - Sure, sure. - And we played "Tribute," our one and only song.

And who's in the audience? David Cross. Wow. So lucky. And he was like, you guys are great. I have a comedy troupe. You guys should open for us. We're called Mr. Show. I didn't know who they were. And I had spent the whole decade before that scraping and surviving and going on every audition, turning down nothing. I do everything. But you landed in some of my favorite stuff. Northern Exposure is like my all-time favorite show. Ha ha ha!

To this day, I can't rewatch that, but thank you. I'm gonna take the compliment. Okay, why can't you rewatch that? I just remember at the time being so horrified and embarrassed by my performance and the weird way I looked. I was like, oh!

What was the part? What did you play? I was just so nervous, and I had a hard time finding my voice in that character. It was kind of the lost years. My 20s, where I didn't really know who I was yet. I got some little parts here and there, but I always felt like I didn't quite nail it. It wasn't until Tenacious D that I started to feel like, oh, this is my voice. And that's why, if anyone ever asks me, how'd you do it? What do I do? I want to be an actor. I always tell them, start writing.

Find your voice that way. I know it sounds really really simple and yet It's probably the most elusive thing your voice and you can weirdly when I look back before I found my voice as an actor till after when I listen I'm like, yeah, that's actually not I mean figuratively and literally learning how to talk the way you would talk to your friend takes a minute the early days you have to just be a puppet and

in someone else's vision, you're always just coming from a place of giving them what they want. You don't exist. You're just a vessel. It's not until you start to get a little more self-confidence and participate in the creative process where you're doing a dance with the director and they're like, okay, so that's what you want. Here's what I want. And then you kind of meet each other in the middle. That's a spark of something good happening.

Yeah. And your voice. You're right. You spend the first part of your career trying to figure out what they want. And you literally never ask yourself, well, what would I want to see myself do in this? Which is tricky because the reason they want you is because of your voice, but you haven't had time to show your voice. Like it's this bizarre cycle. It's a catch-22. It's a big J.D. Salinger. Yeah. I want to start at the beginning. I'll go wherever you want. Before we start at the beginning, I just saw you recently and we just kind of touched on it.

where I saw you on the street and like, I didn't know what to do. And then I had seen you backstage at this thing we did some fundraiser recently downtown. Yeah, for Paul Scheer. We were doing it for the crew. For the crew. All the crew that were hurting during pandemic times because they were all out of work and everyone talked about how the actors and the writers and the directors were out of work, but no one was talking about how the

- Right, right. - Probably hurting the most. So that was a great cause. - Yeah, it was. And then we were both there. - But it was weird 'cause pandemic was still going on and we all kind of crowded into that backstage area. There's like a hundred comedians all like nose to nose. - Was it for that or the strike? - It was for the strike. - Oh. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - You're right. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. - Which would make more sense. - It was for the strike. - Yeah, 'cause it was recent. - You know what it was? In my mind, I was still in the pandemic.

I felt weird about being with people. Yes, well, that's kind of what we talked about. So I was crossing the green room to get myself something to drink. I spotted you on the couch. And honestly, I even talked about it on the show after this happened. I had a moment where I was like, I feel good about going and talking to Jack finally. And I'm going to do it. First, I'm going to get a Diet Coke.

and you saw me look at you and then you could walk across the room and you go, hey, don't ignore me. You saw me. And then I was like, no, no, for real, my game plan is I'm coming directly to you after I get this Diet Coke.

And then I sat down with you and we chatted for a minute. And yeah, just to bolster your claim, you were like, yeah, I haven't been around this many people in a long time. Well, it felt like a super spreader. And I kind of settled in. And I, unlike the rest of the world, was enjoying my isolation, staying in my bubble. I'm always in there anyway. You're built for it. It was good to hang out with you. And it's funny that you were planning on coming back to hang with me, but my insecurity forced me to yell out to you, I know there's cooler people on that side of the room.

This is my question. When you were around that Largo alternative scene, were you intimidated or did you feel comfortable? I never felt really part of the alternative comedy scene. I felt like me and Kyle were kind of

these theater nerds on the outside of it, but I loved it and I loved them and I loved that world and Largo was the best. The layers of perspective are just so funny because of course from my vantage point, I was like, oh, these two are so dialed into this whole world. They're like the mastheads of this. Well, we had a sweet golden ticket thanks to Mr. Show. We became fast friends with Flanny, Mark Flanagan.

The owner of Largo. What a guy. That was the hot spot for all of the comedy that I was checking out. Can you relate to, from the outside, you're in that core world. You start on Mr. Show. You work with Stiller. There seems to be all these yummy clubs you've been invited into and you're in that.

But do you still identify more with I'm a theater nerd musician and I'm not named the comedian? Yeah, I guess my core is theater nerd that goes back to my roots in high school. That's the fountainhead of my creativity.

I used to have dreams. I remember when I was in high school, I went to Crossroads for my last two years of high school, a little private school in Santa Monica for the arts and sciences. A lot of famous alum. Yeah, Jonah Hill came from there. I don't think he's been back to visit, though. I think he's like, fuck that school, a bunch of rich kids. I don't think he really would claim it. I claim it because it was a huge part of me getting started on my journey. I had a great teacher there, Scott Weintraub, who was real challenging. And high schoolers don't usually do a production of Caucasian Chalk Circle by...

Bertolt Brecht, really heady stuff. Yeah. Great material. And I got over huge stage fright. Like I wasn't going to do the first show. I was like, I'm quitting the show the day before the show. And he was like, Jack, meet me at the Ray's Cafe. Let's talk about it. And he talked me off the ledge. And I just went through huge personal demons at that school and that theater.

And I remember I had dreams there of being in the theater and having the power of flight. Like I could fly like a superhero when I was in the theater. I was like, I'm going to use my powers and I fly out of the theater doors and then immediately lose my powers of flight and just be a regular human. And that was just a perfect dream that I still remember that captured the power of that creativity. The theater and that world will always be the main thing. Well,

Well, an apple's probably never fallen further from the tree than your parents, both being engineers in the aerospace industry. Your mother in particular, it's very rare that I research someone and their mother has their own Wikipedia page.

with a hyperlink. So your mom was a fucking gangster, worked on Hubble. Apollo 13, she helped with the abort guidance system. In the MANA something, nuclear missile tracking system. Probably, now you know more about it. I need to go back and read that Wikipedia. There's probably some additions in the last few years. Your mom was born in 1933 and she's a fucking engineer. She doesn't meet a single other woman.

becoming an engineer, getting her double masters. Your mom must have been a very unique human being. She was a badass. She was super smart and she was super fiery and passionate. She had to decide when she was a teenager between ballet or music.

Going into engineering school, she decided that ballet didn't have a very long career path and engineering school had more possibilities. But if she really had it her way, she would have done both. There's a little bit of a call to the theater in a way. I inherited that part. She took off to find the lights. What is it? She took off to find the footlights.

and I took off to find the sky. I know you know what it is. You don't know what he's singing, do you? Harry Chapin. I don't know. Wait, who? Tex? Terry Chapin? Harry Chapin. Oh, man. Now you've found the limits of my theater, Fred. I thought for sure that would be you. Is that from Trip the Life Fantastic? I go flying so high when I'm stoned. Ha!

Oh boy. You know this fucking song. I'm gonna listen to it as soon as this is over. Hairy Chapin by Fuzz and Stone. Yeah, he falls in love with a girl. She goes to chase the footlights of the stage. Oh yeah. And he takes off. He was gonna be a pilot.

But all that ended up happening is he gets high in his cab, but he picks her up one rainy night from the airport years after they had their romance and he drives her home. Is he a stoner? Yeah, big time. And she's into theater? She became a very successful... And he's like, I'm just a stoner. I can't help it. And then she goes, she leaves him for the white hot lights of Broadway.

Yes. And he just stuck smoking a joint on his couch. Well, he was going to be a pilot, but he never got it together. And then he was humbled by having to drive her as her taxi driver years later. What an incredible emotional song. I can't believe. Well, you know, Cats in the Cradle. But then he became a rock star to get the last laugh. He did. That's the good news. Monica, cut this entire thing, please. I'm not. This is fascinating. Salvin, no, this is gold. You know, of course, Cats in the Cradle. You like that one, though. That same guy? Yeah, Harry Chapin. Okay, I know the hit.

Okay. I know the hit. Yeah, this one you'll recognize. Is it going to be the second song on when I go to Apple Music? Yes, it will be. Okay, okay. And it probably charted in the 50s when it was out. So you've heard it. But Cats in the Cradle became more famous not because of his version, right? Didn't a 90s or 80s rock band cover it? Cats in the Cradle. Yeah, that's how I know it. Are we not talking about the same? No, no. Poison? No, no, no, no. Oh, fuck. Not No Doubt, but it sounds like that.

The guy had really long hair. We're so sidetracked. Rod, do you want to find it? Cat Stevens? No, not Cat Stevens. Fuck Cat Stevens. Get him out of here, Rod. Now, wait a second. I love Cat Stevens, Yusef Islam. What's your favorite song? Dude, anything from Harold and Maude. Oh. Trouble. Trouble. And well, where do the children play? Hey, hey, hey.

Oh, fuck yes. That dude's a master. I like the one in Rushmore the most. You really pulled a U-turn because you were anti-Cat Stevens a second ago. Oh, I love Cat Stevens. And now you're back. He had no place in the Cats in Cradle conversation. Well, Cat Stevens can't do Cats in the Cradle. That's too redundant. Too many cats. You just said cat. We hate cats. Homeboy came in with Cat Stevens.

But I like the one that's in Rushmore the most. Oh. It's the most beautiful Cat Stevens song. I don't even remember that Cat Stevens. You know it. I'm failing to remember. I love Rushmore. Isn't that the greatest? Oh, such a good movie.

Wind? Wind. Oh, wind is great. I'm living by the wind of the wind of my soul. Where I end up, where I go, only God really knows. You got it.

I can't sing, but I got the lyrics. You used to sing it to the kids. You made it to the next round. Do you remember that? Or maybe Kristen did. I used to sing it to the girls every night before bed. Jack, I don't. I just advanced you to the next round. Oh, fuck. Can you be my coach? How does it work? Can you advise me? You have to wear a mask. I'm not sure yet. I haven't pitched it yet to the studios. All right, we're back. Now, Dad was also an engineer. Yes. Did they meet on the job? Weirdly, my mother was an aerospace engineer. She was really into Middle Eastern folk dancing.

here in Los Angeles. And my father was a master electrician and he was also weirdly in the Middle Eastern folk dancing. And that's where they met. Wow. Through their relationship, he became an aerospace engineer. They both ended up working at TRW. And she had already had a husband and had your three siblings. Correct. My half brothers and half sister. So again, this is a woman born in the thirties who becomes an engineer and also kicked the guy to the curb in the sixties, which didn't happen.

Right. Exactly. What a renegade. She started off living in Brooklyn in the 30s.

So she saw World War II come up. She saw all of that crazy shit go down. And she would get on a train from Brooklyn to Manhattan when she was like nine years old by herself to go to ballet class. Can you imagine a world where a nine-year-old gets on a train? It was a different New York. Yeah, kids can get on trains by themselves. Why not? So she meets my dad and they're both brainiacs and they're both into crazy dances from all around the world.

They both had little bits of the arts. They were dancers, but I did fall pretty far from the tree. Neither of them had ever been in the theater proper, and I didn't have any connections in that world. I was not a nepo baby. The opposite, quite in fact.

But they were super supportive of me. They never pressured me to have something to fall back on. But they were, I found out years later, worried. Of course they were. They kept it from you, which is great. That's what a good parent should do. You said something about alternative comedy as if...

Normal comedy is not hard enough. He's chosen an alternative comedy route. Did you excel at science? No. I'm guessing no. That was the other reason they were worried about me, like his grades. We're brainiacs. How come he's not getting straight A's? Jack, when you think about how different your kids might potentially be from you. Yeah.

If you're the first female to be an engineer and your kid can't get through chemistry... I mean, they're literal rocket scientists. Let's call it what it is. It's rare that you can say this. Yeah, you can barely ever say it, but here we can say it. Yeah. And their kid...

Can't do it. Just can't get it done. Do they have an explanation? It just goes to show you never know what the next generation is going to be capable of, no matter who their parents are. It can come from anywhere. But they came to every performance of every show that I did through high school. And my mom, God rest her soul, never blinked once when I had to keep on coming home in my old room all through my 20s. It wasn't until I was 30 that I really got my proper foundation.

footing. Really? Yeah, well, Tenacious D, right when I came up on your radar is when I was finally getting a foothold. I would love a baby like Jack. He could come stay back at my house anytime. I bet she just adored you. I was a handful, though. I had struggles with drugs, and there was lots of reasons she should have, would have, could have kicked me to the curb, but she didn't. Coconye. Coconye. Oh, the devil's dandruff. Oh, the boogie shoogie.

I don't have another one. What a product. I wish I could have kept on going. Colombian flake. Ah, you've got more names. Shall we powder our nose? The embarrassing conversation you realize the next day you shouldn't have had, drug. What I read was you were very advanced. You got into it well.

way earlier than I did. - Yeah, it did. And acid too. My brains should not have survived. And in many ways they didn't. - Or set you on this great trajectory. But in rapid order, you grew up in Hermosa, you moved to Culver City at 10, mom and dad get divorced, you move in with dad. - In fairness though, I was getting bad grades before that. So that's not why I became a dumbass. - We're not gonna blame that. - Sorry, go on.

but still disruptive. Very much so. And when you get to Culver City, is it a much different vibe than Hermosa? Were you doing well socially in Hermosa? We moved out of there, I think I was 10. I never really fit in Hermosa because I was never really a surfer. I went out with a couple friends once and I got like a rash on my belly and I had a waterlogged surfboard and I didn't like getting up at five in the morning. There were so many reasons I just never fit in with that surfer crowd.

And even though it is the hotbed of punk rock, I didn't know about punk rock. I was there in the 70s, but I didn't know Black Flag. They weren't on my radar. Is that where Black Flag's from, Hermosa Beach? Yeah, because Keith Morris, who is a Hermosa native, was there with Black Flag at the very beginning. There was all kinds of radical scene happening there.

but I was never really part of it. And then moved to Culver City, went to junior high there and started dabbling with the devil's dandruff and all kinds of... In middle school? Who introduced you to the devil's dandruff? Once I got my bar mitzvah at 13 years old and became a man. You're a man.

I was now ready to experiment. And also, I was just getting into heavy metal music, and I don't want to blame heavy metal music for my dark path, but it was definitely a rite of passage in a Beavis and Butthead way. Yeah. Yeah, this is what it means to be a man, to be in the...

devil music and just be hardcore. The same way my kids, I think, got really into super scary movies when they were like 12, 13 years old. And I was like, this is a little too scary for a kid. It's a rite of passage. So you want to go to the dark side to prove you can survive it.

And so I went down that road and the more dangerous, the more attractive. It shows your bravery more and more. I don't think people who are not, all right, so you're exactly my brother's age and I don't think people understand how present the devil was in our culture. Yeah. The devil moral panic was nationwide at this point and,

You had many, many popular metal acts that were proclaiming their allegiance to the devil. You had Rodney James Dio. Friends of mine's older brothers would have upside down cross posters. I remember being pretty terrified at 10 or 11 years old of how much satanic shit was swirling around.

It kind of is a way to show that you were brave, right? You weren't afraid to dance with the devil. That's right. And it's funny because I've been doing a lot of research lately, just going down rabbit holes and reading books about that era of rock and roll. And Black Sabbath was the first one to really embrace it, even though Led Zeppelin had a little bit of that. It was more about you heard rumors that Jimmy Page was into the occult, but there were no songs that were like Satan King.

and spread his wings that never happened in zeppelin you attribute that to zeppelin because their sound was so hard rock and the angel on the album was a little yes like fallen angel was it lucifer it was a stretch but black sabbath they went all out the gate their very first song black sabbath on the first album they kind of threw down the gauntlet but even black sabbath they were like no we never wanted to celebrate the devil we were just doing like a horror movie music

But the marketing team, the record label were like, no, we're going to lean heavy into this devil thing. And this is your album cover. It's like a haunted house. And there's a lady that looks like a witch there. It worked. Well, Upside Down crosses everywhere on all the albums of that day. Lots of pentagrams. But then they were so anti-Satanism and they were like, that's not who we are. We're putting on a show, you fucking idiots.

And like when Anton LaVey or some of these hardcore Satanists actually started rallying around and putting on parades, oh, Black Sabbath is coming to town. We embrace your Satanism. They were like, no, you fucking idiots. They started wearing right side up crosses to ward off the evil spirits. Ha, ha, ha.

I'm just fascinated with that movement in music. Alistair Crawley, like he would hang out? But that marriage never really happened. Maybe there were some bands that fully embraced it. Who were your bands in junior high? In junior high, before I found heavy metal, I was all about like Styx, Lo,

Loved The Grand Illusion. Loved Yes, great band. I loved Journey. The softer side of rock. Your real soul. The little boy we all want to be before we get to junior high and we realize we're going to get destroyed if we don't slay some lions in the jungle by committing ourselves to the devil. I was into sticks before the Domo Arigato Mr. Roboto misstep that they had that kind of destroyed them. No, there's some damn good sticks. You'd rather be a blue-collar man

Great songs. And then I remember I went to the record store in Culver City to get The New Journey. I was going to expand my journey library, I remember, because I loved Escape. What a great album. There's a dude there who's wearing like a flannel and it's like, nah, here, this is what you should get.

And he handed me Ozzy Osbourne, Blizzard of Oz. All right, this guy seems cool. I'm just going to do what he says. And again, so Ozzy's still musical. It's like still good music. I'm going to say great music. Okay, great. Even better. Because I took that home. Now, I'm only 13 years old, mind you. I took it home and I listened to it and it was the best thing I'd ever heard. Is Crazy Train on? Of course Crazy Train is on it. Yes, Blizzard of Oz, baby.

It was a masterpiece. And Randy Rhodes, that guitarist who was with us too briefly, died in an airplane crash. Up there with Cliff Burton. Was a genius. He was right there with Eddie Van Halen. Those two would have been duking it out all through the 80s if he had survived. Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert. If you dare.

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So Ozzy was kind of the gateway. He was the gateway. And really, it wasn't true metal. There was a lot of pop music hooks and beautiful sections in there. It's more classic Rocky to me. Yeah. So that opened it up, and I was like, I got to see everything that Ozzy's done. So I went back and discovered Black Sabbath retroactively, and then Led Zeppelin, and

And do you start wearing shirts declaring your allegiance to them? And does that attract other boys? And then once again, the cooler, the better. Because if I had the Black Sabbath with Ronnie James Dio era Black Sabbath, the mob rules. There's like a dark imagery and it looks like there's a Satan, but it's subtle. And people give you the nod of like approval. Like, yeah, yeah, we're in the club. Okay, so who breaks out the blotter or the devil's dander first? I was introduced...

To LSD, I guess I was maybe 14 or maybe 13. It was a friend of mine. I'm not looking for a name. I'm just curious. Were you hanging with a 26-year-old dude that was a tradesman? He was older. I did look up to him like a big brother figure. I had a thing where I wanted a father figure, even though I had a great dad, but I wanted the dark dad. I wanted the one that was going to show me the ways of the dark side. Sure.

And this guy filled in that role. We did Acid, and I remember that night laughing as hard as I'd ever laughed and having this strange feeling of being whole for the first time. And suddenly this big, dark, mysterious universe that I didn't know how I fit into, it all felt right. Laughing till I cried and having kind of a weird spiritual experience afterwards.

But then it led to the darkest day or night of my life where it wouldn't stop and it stopped being fun. And it was so bad that I was locked in this insane brain prison where all I could see was chess pieces going off into infinity, playing a game with myself forever.

And I had this terror that I was never going to break free of it. And it was like, as good as that first hour and a half was, it wasn't worth it. And thank God I made it through the night. I don't think I slept a minute. Once the thought enters your mind, this may be permanent. The second you have that, you're fucking cooked for hours. Yeah. You're like, oh shit. You're remembering stories you heard growing up of like,

You know Mike Benner. I saw him at the gas station. He's been tripping for four years. You have this one story, and you're like, oh, wow, this is happening to me. I'm going to be him. So you stopped doing it after that, or no? I might have done it again after that. Sure, sure. Why, of course. I was like, no, I think I got some bad acid. That's what I heard. Sometimes you get the bad one.

There was a few hallucinogenic experiences, mushrooms and acid. But coke, now that's a sexy dance partner. Well, I was just down to clown with anything that my big bro or my crew of heavy metal maniacs were into at the time. It wasn't a gang, but it was like a brotherhood. There was some coke. You know, when you first take it, there's an initial rush and a feeling. It's similar in that...

doorway opens in your brain and you're like, I fucking get it now and I have a lot of brilliant things to say really fast. And you go for hours and hours and you say some things where you're talking about love and you're talking about connections and you're talking about things in the future that you're going to do. And it's, in retrospect, so embarrassing. It is. Thank God there was no recording. But it actually would have been nice if someone had recorded it just to play back as a cautionary tale.

of how ridiculous you can sound. I witnessed myself a single time I had been recorded by my girlfriend, and it's a bummer. I mean, I think that might be the lowest feeling I've had, is looking at my face and going...

How I thought I was coming across versus what I'm seeing now, what a gap. But I would say the thing I liked about it most is I'm not optimistic. I'm very pessimistic. Couple toots of that stuff. And I'm like, you know what? Everything is going to work out. I got spiritual. I like talking about God and stuff that I don't usually talk about. And I don't really feel a connection to. I'm definitely leaning atheist. But for some reason, once I get all cooked up or

whatever the drug may be. There's a version that brings out a nice side of yourself, which is like, I'm so interested in whoever I'm talking to. Someone will be telling me that their father was a firefighter. And I'm like, wait a minute. And this is sincere. I'm like, oh my God. So your dad was like a firefighter? Yeah. And I'm in it. This guy's dad was a hero. Tell me more. And I want to know about the movie of their life where their hero dad was. You already want that.

Imagine it squared. It gives you a brief energy that lets you delve deeper than you normally would with other people. Maybe that's why Freud supposedly used it a lot in sessions. Oh, yeah. So that they could go deeper than they usually would about themselves and about the nooks and crannies of their personality. Was the move to crosswords crossroads? Crosswords. We should open a competing school across the street called Crosswords. Yeah.

But were your parents sensing we need to put him somewhere else and get him out of this crew? Yeah, but in the midst of all of that turmoil and darkness, there was someone from the crew. This dude was into this thing.

who we had all met when we got on a bus and went to the arcade in Westwood. It was called Westworld, back when arcades were a thing. Play your favorite tabletop video games. And we met these girls, and we both fell for the same girl, and he kind of called dibs or whatever, and I was like, dibs? Mibs. And then...

I started a romance on the side and he didn't know. And then when he found out, he wanted to kill me. And then he did beat the shit out of me. It wasn't over yet. There was going to be some more ass kicking. My parents just noticed that shit was going sideways and they were like,

we got to get you the fuck out of there. And I was like, yeah, I agree. I don't want to be here anymore. Were you so relieved because you maybe wouldn't have sent up the white flag? I don't know what would have happened there. So I went to this little tiny school called Poseidon that was on Pico between Bundy and Barrington. It's not there anymore.

And it was a school with a lot of kids that had been kicked out of their schools from all over the city. And it was kind of a last chance kind of school. Yeah, it was the island of broken toys. Yeah. Misfit island. But it had some great teachers in it. There was a theater teacher named Deb Devine who I latched on to and she taught us all improvisation games and viola spoling games and stuff.

got us all thinking about telling stories. And it was kind of like theater therapy. You could work out some of your demons by playing roles and just coming off the top of your head with shit you're going to say to the other person in the scene. It was kind of amazing. And she is still a great theater force in Los Angeles. She's got a theater called 21st Street Theater here in downtown LA. She has outreach programs to kids all over the city who come and learn theater. She's an awesome lady. That's so cool. Yeah.

There was also like a therapist in the school. There's only like 20 kids in the school, but the therapist was a bodybuilder also. Oh, wonderful. Because sometimes he would have to defend himself. There's some rough characters at this school. Mixed messages. Yeah. Were there smoking breaks built in? I'm being sincere. There was smoking. And there was kids going in to see him and talk to him. And I was like, what's going on in there? Because there were some kids that it was compulsory. They had to go talk to the therapist.

a certain amount of times a week. And I was not in that group. And I was jealous. I was like, I want to talk to the muscle building therapist. Yeah. I talked to him just on the side. I was like, how do you get into there? And he's like, you can come in if you want. You want to set an appointment? I was like, yeah. And I went in there. I just wanted to see what was going on in here. And we got to talking. And then it only took me about a minute before I started spilling my guts about how I had stolen money from my mom and all the shit that I was carrying around, how guilty I was. Doing drugs. The drugs, but mainly the betrayal of my mom.

who just was unconditional love for me. And she didn't know that I had stolen money to get the drugs. And I just bawled my eyes out. I cried so hard and it felt so good because I grew up with a Jewish upbringing and I learned a lot of my value system there, but I didn't have confessional. And there was something about just sitting there with this therapist and just confessing my sins or whatever you want to call it, my guilt.

That felt so cleansing. Your shame. Yes. I saw him for the next year once a week and it was like a major turning point for me. Yeah, that's really lucky. I don't know if this is exactly what you're explaining, but I had this struggle with my mother who loved me beyond measure. I was the golden child. She believed I could do anything. Juggling the duality of wanting to live up to how much she loved me and then also fucking running with the devil any chance I could.

Trying to fuck, do drugs, just living with this kind of dualistic identity was rough. I felt a lot of deep shame that I wasn't really...

behaving in her absence the way I did in her presence. Did you hold on to shame and guilt for years? Like when did you have your muscle building therapy moment of confession? 29 when I got sober and started going to AA. So I just kept racking up. I just made it worse and worse and worse. I just moved across the country so she couldn't see. And then once every few years, I'd have such a bad bottom where I almost OD'd that I'd call her crying and go,

"All right, here's what I'm really up to." And I can only imagine how terrified she would be listening to whatever update. I would just hold it for like three years and I'd call her in some terrible spiral. "I'm gonna die from this." And then not call her for two weeks 'cause I felt better. - It wasn't until you're like 29 that you found someone who was objective

from the situation that you could spill your guts to that was there to just listen. Well, like you, at 29, I go into AA and I start admitting to all the shit I'm carrying, stealing from people. 10 years of addiction, I racked up some stuff I had to get off my chest. I was just walking around like, I am a piece of shit. And yet the weight that gets lifted, it's kind of crazy how effective saying out loud to somebody your thing is. Yeah.

You're suffocating under it. And then you say it and it's like 80% of it's gone. And then it's kept at that. And then it gets kind of easy. Nothing compares to the first time that I confessed to that therapist. That was the big one. And the rest of the time I was kind of chasing the dragon. And I never quite had that same release. That explosive waterfall of emotions. Did he try to get you into lifting? No. Because if I were him, I'd have been like,

Jack, I think you could put up some serious weight. I should get into some lifting now because the steps program is not getting it done.

It doesn't matter how many steps I get. I can never catch up to the caloric intake. Because speaking of which, you want to talk about addiction, that's my heroin. It's my yummy, yummy cheeseburgers or whatever the fuck it may be. It doesn't matter how many salads. That's making me nauseous. I want the good stuff. Cheeseburgers is my favorite thing in the world. It's the best sandwich. It is. It is. Obviously. I was just telling Monica two days ago, I put a ribeye in the fucking grinder. What?

A ribeye, Jack, like a $50 ribeye. Oh my God. And I turned it into three hamburgers and I was thinking people would be so mad I did this. But then I was like, who cares what shape the ribeye's in? But it was so good as three burgers and I ate two of the three. Did you put cheese on it? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So that's actually interesting because if you had a regular ribeye and you put cheese on it, people would be mad. Yeah, they'd be upset. They'd be like, you're ruining it. Interesting. Even if it was an aged cheddar? I mean, not for me. I love cheese.

The more, the better. But when did the food come into play? Food was always a problem. From the get-go, I remember when I was around 10, going to Mickey D's and crushing like five Filet-O-Fishes. And that was back when they had the Styrofoam boxes. And then I would literally crush the boxes with my thumb to see if I could pierce all five in one crush.

- Oh, that was so much fun. And that was back when they had the deep fried cherry pie. Yeah, I would dip my finger in there just to get the, I didn't care about the crust. I just wanted that hot cherry jam.

Well, I don't want to psychoanalyze you, but your first memory is 10 of the five filet of fish and mom and dad are getting divorced. Yeah. It's not too hard of a leap. There might have been something there. Some regulating. But I remember years before that of them fighting all the time. So it was kind of a relief, too. They got a divorce. Like, good, get the hell away from each other. Divorce is always a crazy thing, how it's going to affect the kids.

because you want them to stay together on some deep level because that's where you came from. But you also want to get apart if it's toxic. Okay, so after Crossroads, so Deb Devine says, what are you doing here, Jack? You got to go to Crossroads. It's just a few blocks away. It's the best school in the city. You've got it, kid. You've got something here. I told my parents, I want to go to Crossroads. And they were like, all right, we'll pay for that. It's expensive. Then after Crossroads,

I went to UCLA. Things turned around in a big way because I was a fuck up and now all of a sudden going to this. It's Ivy League adjacent. I was at UCLA theater. I ended up there too. You were there too? Yes. There's another overlappy thing. I too went to UCLA. I think I'm a little older than you. I was there during Aikman years. Were you there for Aikman and the football program? No, Troy Aikman went there. I didn't even know that. Yes, he was the quarterback. So yeah, I think it's Ivy League too because I went there. Yeah, I'm going to burst a big bubble here. Uh-uh.

As the only one who didn't go to UCLA, it is not considered Ivy League, but it's a very good school. It's right next door. They say it's better than Berkeley now. What's the second best weed that it could be? Not Ivy. Yeah, Holly. It's a Holly. Ooh.

That doesn't sound right. But I was a horrible student at UCLA also. I just didn't do well with academics in general, and it didn't change when I got to college. I would always, same as high school, fall asleep. There was something about a classroom environment that didn't jibe with my brain for learning. I learned a lot better in the theater, on the job, doing the thing that I loved. Your circadian rhythm was triggered by the classroom.

Yes. It told you it was nighttime as soon as you got in one of those desks. Could be narcolepsy. No, it's not. Do you think it was ADHD? Because as soon as the class was over, I was a huge burst of energy and I'd go running into the sculpture garden ready to smoke joints and high five and talk about a show. Let's put on a show.

There was something about actually being in a production, in a show, where I could be working on the most difficult, heady stuff, doing Shakespeare, stuff that was way above my grade level. I had a great experience meeting other theater people, and the social element was hugely beneficial, but...

As soon as I had an opportunity to do theater outside of school, I jumped on that. How did you discover the Actors Gang? The Actors Gang Theater. So there was a writer from the Actors Gang Theater Company who was a high school teacher at Crossroads. And that's how they first got on my map. And I would go to see their shows when I was in high school. I was like, oh, man.

And someday... Was Tim Robbins performing in those shows ever? He was directing some of them, but he was overseeing. He was kind of the overlord of the whole theater group and the creative director. But he was also really busy with making movies at the time. Then I was at UCLA doing theater there, but I was still keeping an eye on the actors' gang and going to all their shows.

And then an opportunity came up to get a little part in one of their plays called The Big Show in Santa Monica. And I came in and I had some songs and I got some songs into the show. So I quickly became one of the musical people in the gang. Really quick, how long had you been singing at that point in a way that you thought like, yeah, I'm a singer?

Or had you yet? I only started singing where I really identified as a singer in high school at Crossroads. I did some musical theater. I did Pippin and another show called Carnival. And so there was an opportunity to go with the actors getting to the Edinburgh Theater Festival.

Oh, wow. In 1989, which is the mecca of the theater universe where people from all over the world come to Edinburgh, Scotland. Dan Lewis might be there. Daniel Day. Yeah, Dan Lewis might be there. I especially love Daniel Day when he plays Americans from 1901. Yeah.

That's when he really thrives. Bill the Butcher. 1888 to 1901. I'm an oil man. There will be Blood and Lincoln. Those are two. Well, and Bill the Butcher. And Bill the Butcher. Yeah. All around that time. Why is he so good at that time? He was born in the wrong century.

But once I got to that theater festival, no looking back. And I was not going back to UCLA. And I didn't tell my parents for a while because I knew how much they wanted me to get that degree. And I didn't have the heart to tell them that it wasn't in the cards. How long were you hiding this secret? I hid it for a good year. And were you updating them? Yeah.

Your grades and what class? No, I mean, they knew that I was at the Edinburgh Theater Festival. And at that point, my dad lived in France. They had moved to France. So I was kind of like, my life is my own. But I still didn't want them to know that I had dropped out. Like, this was a thing I was doing and I was going to go back to school. And I just never went back. But that's where I met Kyle.

and that's where the seeds for Tenacious D were first planted. Do you shift gears from acting to, I'm going to be in Tenacious D and I'm going to be a musician, or are you thinking I'm going to do all things? At that point, I'm just turning 20. There's a little dream that

oh, maybe I could be a rock and roller. Me and Kyle could start a band. We could be a rock and roll comedy team. He's a great guitarist. He was going to give me some lessons. He's going to teach me how to rock. It was just this weird, dumb, impossible dream. But there was also something, even before we had played for anyone, I was like, there's something very funny about you and me

getting up on stage and rocking really hard and being rock stars and wanting to be rock stars and thinking we're rock stars. It's so dumb and so wrong. This is a bad idea. And there's something hilarious about how bad this idea is. And I knew, I just felt like there's something here. There's something magic. I can't even put my finger on it. So that's another thing I tell people whenever they say, hey, I like your career. How do you do it? And I was like,

You got to find yourself a Kyle because there's things that I will do with Kyle that I would never do alone. There's things that I don't feel I have permission to do alone, but with me and Kyle,

That's different. I credit my entire personality to my best friend, Aaron Weakley, who I met in seventh grade. If I hadn't met him, I'm not sure who I am. Because I was like, oh, if we're both acting this way, I don't really care what anyone else thinks. I would have never had the confidence to explore who I was without that safety net. I want that for my kids so fucking bad. And it's not my business to tell them, but it's like, I just want them to find their safety net.

that gives them the confidence to be the weirdest version of themselves. It is a gift. You hope that everyone can have that time in their lives when they meet that person that opens up the universe. Yeah. Okay, so you guys are performing. You're doing, as we said, you get on Mr. Show. Also, I'm assuming Tim Robbins is seeing you at the Actors Gang perform because you end up in Bob Roberts and the great Sean Penn. Oh.

Oh, Dead Man Walking. Dead Man Walking. Oh my God. You end up in Dead Man Walking. I'm going to take that compliment that you liked Dead Man Walking. You haven't actually said you liked me. I do. You're the weird brother that shows up. You're giving me a compliment. Yeah, I can see you in my head. As I already told you though, I was a Jack fan from 96. Okay. So I'm like, oh, this motherfucker is here now too. Dead Man Walking. Once again, I'm going to say this was before I had found my voice and I had some ideas, but I didn't speak them out loud because I was,

afraid that they would be dumb ideas but that was a great movie and it was a great lesson in acting and watching Sean Penn do his thing and Susan Sarandon and Tim Robbins but I would be fine if they deleted my scene from the movie in fact if there is a way that I could erase it I would I

You might be able to say, tell AI, show me Dead Man Walking without Jack Black. It might be able to do that. We're so close to that. Wait, what's the first movie that you don't feel like that about? Bob Roberts is my actual first movie. And that did end up being a really good calling card. I'm proud of it.

It was a moment in time where I was so terrified of fucking up and so terrified that there's a camera on me and that there's a full crew of people here. It was so alien and foreign to me. I had done theater, but this was a whole different animal. And...

My character, luckily, was terrified in that moment of being in the presence of this godlike figure, this Republican politician rock star named Bob Roberts. I just want to be him so badly. And young Jack Black really was feeling that same way about Tim Robbins. Yes. So I was able to channel it and plug right in. Also...

I did a take where it was like, "Hmm, that was okay." And then Tim was like, "Okay, guys, let's do it again. Way faster. That's the only note, just faster. And action." And then we did it again and I did it faster and I was like, "I think that was too fast. I just did it faster, but okay. And great, we got it. Moving on." I was like, "Wait, wait, moving on? Oh, fuck. I'm too young to ask for another take. Okay, we're moving on." And then I saw the movie and I was like, "Oh, it's pretty good. I wish they had used the other..." And then the editor came through with another cut of the movie

And it just clicked in and my part was perfect. So the lesson was just be open. And I don't know what the lesson is, but one of the lessons is editing is hugely important. Well, I think, can I interpret one of the lessons for you? Which would be when you're there, the entire thing's on your shoulder.

And you really forget, oh, well, Tim Robbins is in the mix. A great editor's in a mix. Yeah. A great DP's in the mix. There's going to be a great song or score in the mix. What you come to realize is like you're a part of this and these other elements can lift you way beyond what you assessed your thing to be when it happened.

And by the way, faster is about the best note that can ever be given in anything. It was a great note because he got us moving faster than our brains were moving. Yeah. And sometimes that's when the good shit happens. And it doesn't trigger any insecurity. He's not telling me I wasn't real or I didn't blah, blah, blah. It's just like, oh, tempo is fine. I can modulate that. Let's go from 33 to 45. But do the same thing. But it's not doing the same thing.

That movie, I saw the cut and it was like, "Oh, my part is fucking great. It's small, but it really pops off the screen." And they were going to Cannes, the Cannes Film Festival. My part was too small to get invited to go along, but my dad lived in Cannes.

I was like, I'm going to visit my dad and showing up. I got there and I called Tim and said, can you get me on the list? I'm flying myself. And he got me into the show. So I went to see the movie and I ended up on top of a mountain smoking a joint with Tim Robbins and that

That great director who directed The Player and all those great ones. Oh, Robert Altman. Yeah. And Giancarlo Esposito. We were all up there overlooking Cannes. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Devil's Cabbage. This is it. I am here, and I wasn't here. It was an illusion. I thought this is the beginning of my career, and it led to 10 years of not being able to get another good role like that. But...

Bob and David remembered my little part from Bob Roberts 10 years later, and they gave us our break partially because of that, I think. It wasn't just in Ashes Deep. So it's like you do some good work, and sometimes you expect it to just launch you, and it doesn't. But those things still linger around like burning embers sometimes. Yeah, it's like you're just putting breadcrumbs on this thing and then hoping to hit critical mass, and you just don't know what the thing is and what's going to pay off next.

seven, eight years later. It's impossible to see it in the moment. But then in retrospect, you're like, oh, right. That's for every job. It's not just creative. Anyone can have this sort of moment where whatever you're doing now, you don't know how that's going to impact the future, which is important. So what do you do? You put your head down. You keep on doing you. This is an important thing. I don't know why I'm Mr. Telling People Lessons.

I don't do very many of these where I talk about myself. I was going to start with that. You don't really do this. Nah. You're an enormous star, and I got to say there's the least amount of interviews available of you of almost anyone else I've researched of your caliber. And I did want to know off the top.

about that, but I thought we could earmark that. Well, I just feel a little embarrassed and a little shy and a little unworthy of tooting my own horn and telling my life story. It's just not what I usually do. I will say this. This is the last time I'm going to do this. No, it's not. When people ask me, what do you do to get what you got? I want it.

Important career lesson number four is figure out what you want to do, not what you want to be. I want to be a famous actor, a famous rock star. That's not going to get you anywhere. Do you want to play music in front of people? Good, do that. It doesn't have anything to do with what level of success you get to. Because if you love doing it, you do it for no money and you're happy.

same thing with acting. And at the end of the day, that's what gets you to the good stuff, the juice. And as a byproduct, you probably will have some success. I'll even add the stuff that you thought you were doing in route to somewhere in retrospect of your life will be some of the things you enjoyed the very most and would go back to. For me, Groundlings, I don't think it ever got better than doing a show on Sunday nights to a hundred people. Couldn't believe it was sold out because it's,

There was no illusion of anything beyond that. It evaporated that night. It was like Buddhism. It happened on Sunday. It wasn't recorded. And that was it. It was for the pure joy of doing it.

And I don't think it ever got better than that. I think that is part of why theater saved my life because there was that therapist, but there was also that theater teacher, Deb Devine. And when I got up in front of a group of people, it didn't matter how small the audience was, and I got into a groove and I started jamming, I felt this incredible high and adrenaline escalating.

And self-confidence, I think theater saved my life. There's something about that groundlings and about improv in general. You tap into a thing and it's a mix between acting and writing. I don't think that improvisational actors get enough credit for writing the movie or the thing that they're doing. The director's like, no, that's part of the job of an actor is you write. No.

it's not. If someone's getting up there and saying the first thing that comes to the top of their head, they should and sometimes do get writing credit, but most times not. It's very, very rare. It is writing. Yeah. Well, you enter a scene and then you end up exiting the scene. You didn't say anything that was written yet. You conveyed the goal of the scene. Is that what happens on those great improvisational movies like Spinal Tap? Did everyone get writing credit? Oh, that's a good... Who wrote that?

I don't know that it would be the fault of the producers or director anyone nefarious the guild itself is really challenging, right? They're very protective of whoever wrote the first draft or the outline so it's like you would have to petition There's some percentage you'd have to prove I've been through this process where you give them both scripts and they go through it and determine whether you Warrant to writing credit. So the fact that the improv is not even written I don't even know what you submit to the guild and also

I had a phase in my life where I was like, I improv in every one of these movies. And then that stopped. And I was like, I have a fucking awesome job. I get plenty of credit. I'm the one who gets to say it. Good if that writer gets another job. I'm getting enough fucking pats on the back. Yeah. And even better, I got to do the thing I wanted to do, which is way more important than anything else. Yeah.

To be trusted to do the thing you want to do is the ultimate. Yeah, keep the credit. But have you written? Yeah, I've written and directed three movies. So you were able to transition from improvising and writing off the top of your head, as I like to call it, into writing everything in advance. I've only written one movie. It was Tenacious D in the Pick of Destiny. Yes. And I had so much fun writing.

Writing it that process you write it with Kyle We talked out the story but then the actual writing came with me and Liam Lynch the director at his house every night and

for 40 consecutive nights. I have a little OCD. I like the round numbers. But I had so much fun cracking the code on that and that process. And I was like, I think maybe this is what I'm going to do. And then the movie didn't do well. And no one ever asked me to write again. And I never did again. But I think maybe I would like to jump back into those waters someday. Stay tuned for more Fire and Fire Expert. If you dare.

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to get out there and hike and take some time where I'm not looking at my phone or doing anything work related. Get your legs moving. Get my body moving. Me too. Well, my wogs, as everyone knows about, help me with my self-care, but also baths and skincare routines. Yeah. But look, I get it. Life is hectic and you let things fall by the wayside. It's during those times, though, that it's more important than ever to take some time for yourself.

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Do you find a special kind of satisfaction when you're writing your movies? If I had to list the things I'm proudest of in my life, writing's way above acting or directing. Yeah. Do you have a partner when you write? Mm-mm. No, you go solo. Yeah, I go lone wolf. I go to a hotel.

I go for four days, I write, I come home, then I go in another spell. And when I'm there, I just write all day long. I've got a whole little routine. I can't do it without someone else. Yeah, that's fair. I need them to say, what do you think it should be? And then me to say, no. That sucks. Wrong. Here is what it should be. I can't do it without them. You need the catalyst. You need the bad idea to shoot down to get to your good idea. And vice versa. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I want to shoot down my dumb ideas I don't realize are dumb. You're not a control freak, I'm guessing? I am a control freak.

I'm a control freak. You are, interesting. But I need to have someone else there to control. So Monica had asked you a question and I'm gonna guess at the answer, which was she said, when did you feel like you were in your voice and found your voice acting? I'm gonna guess it was High Fidelity. Yep, that was the big breakout. And that was John Cusack digging my stuff with Tenacious D. Can we take two on John Cusack? John Cusack was everything I wanted to be when I was a kid. Oh yeah. He was the coolest. Brilliant and cool.

and funny. - And he hand selected you. You were his idea, right? - Yeah. Well, we had a brotherhood through the actors gang 'cause he and Tim Robbins were tight back in the day. And he in fact started his own splinter group called New Criminals in Chicago. They were like the Chicago wing of the actors gang. So I hadn't really done any time with them like hanging out, but I knew and he knew that we were both from that theater group. He reached out and Stephen Frears, the director,

who I loved 'cause I love dangerous liaisons with my favorite actor, John Malkovich in it. So all signs were like, of course I have to do this movie, but I was so scared of fucking with my Tenacious D cred and this new thing that was burgeoning. I was like, wait, I'm in a rock band that's really working right now. I don't wanna do a movie about rock and mess with my actual career as a rock musician. And then eventually I realized, oh, I'm just terrified

of failing. Right. I have to do this. It's Stephen Frears and John Cusack. So I said, yes, I'll do it. I heard you say that your initial fear was you're going to be playing a guy that just shits on all music. Yeah. I can see how you would think that would nullify what you're doing over here. There was also certain bands that I just worshipped that I didn't want to talk about. Yeah. Because even saying their name out loud on film, it was like a holy ground. I didn't want to touch it.

It's like Screaming Macbeth in the theater. Exactly. What was the most offensive one? I didn't want to talk about Kurt Cobain or Nirvana. I don't even know if that ended up in the movie in the end, but there were certain places where I was just, that's just... Sacrilege. There was a few places that sirens went off in my head when I read the script, but

Thank God I got over that because it was the first time that I had really found my voice in a movie. It was my breakout. And then after that comes really quickly, I'm just going to kind of list them, but Orange County. And why I want to earmark that is I want to talk about Jake Kasson because I love him and I've worked with him. What a special dude. And you have many times, but we're earmarking that. But then Shallow Hell is right after that. You go on a fucking pretty bonkers tour.

ride. This pattern emerges, which is Jake's part of it, right? You work with people. And I like this about you from the outside, people who work with people and develop real friendships and keep coming back and working together after all the cash and prizes are obtained and they don't fill the hole. I think the one thing you really can look back on with enormous pride and gratitude is playing together and

with like-minded people for many times. That's the big victory in this. - I do feel that way with Jake because we started off with Orange County early on

And we had such a fun shorthand. And the thing that was really fun with Jake is every take he would go, now try it this way. Now try it that way. And it was almost like we were just doing it for fun every take. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Not so much improvising, but yeah, playing. Like a science experiment. Let's turn over all the rocks. It was not an indie film. It didn't have that big budget production.

pressure. We felt kind of loose and free and we're having fun every day. Had you seen Zero Effect? Because that was my favorite movie for like 10 years. Yeah. And he was 19 or 21 when he made that movie, impossibly. He had a full head of steam coming in. And also it was Mike White who wrote Orange County.

who was a big factor in that great experience. And he, I ended up working with on School of Rock. - So you work with Jake as a director, you end up working with him a bunch more and then yeah, Mike White writes it. And then he obviously kind of falls in love with you because he comes to you with the idea of School Rock. With Rudin? - Yep. - Those two are together and they wanna make this movie. And then the most unlikely character enters the scene, which is, again, you're so fucking blessed.

Richard Linklater, what a spirit. Did you see his recent movies on Netflix right now? It's really good. Hitman. That's him? Yeah. Oh, that does not look like a Linklater movie from the poster. No, I know, because it's a big crime thriller action comedy. I think Boyhood is one of the most beautiful movies ever.

ever made. Also, can you imagine the patience it would take to do a movie over the course of 12 years? It's mind-blowing. It's a different kind of cat. Can I tell you, this is about me, not you. I'm going to Bogart your interview. Do it. When you think about saddest missed opportunities type situations, the second movie I wrote and directed, it's Screen It South by...

and I was seated next to somebody, I didn't know who, this movie I made hit and run plays, it finishes and the man next to me immediately is like crazy effusive about the movie. But I have unfortunately, back to your noise canceling headphones, I've a little bit shifted my mind of like, I gotta get out of this theater. When you star in a movie and you're in the theater, it gets really dicey afterwards, right? So unfortunately I've already clicked into the like, be polite and also get out of here as quick as possible.

And as I exit the thing, Mike Judge was there and he goes, what did Dick say to you? And I go, who? And he goes, we were sitting next to Linklater. And I was like, oh my God, I had a moment to like suck up some praise from Linklater and I just thought he was a fucking bogey.

What a regret. Just goes to show. I mean, I would have stayed there all goddamn night. Oh, man. It does go to show. Don't be a big shot. Always take them in. You never know who they are or who they'll be. And it's even embarrassing that I would prioritize his praise over anyone else's. There's a lot of ugliness in this story. I like that my judge calls him dick.

I know, me too. I'll get a link later. Those guys are two peas in a pod. Partially, I think they live right next door to each other in Texas. Yeah, and Rodriguez is in that mix too. The three of them are like these bandits living down there just doing whatever they want to do creatively. It seems so dreamy. I think it's okay. You can pick up the

phone and leave a nice message for Dick. He can pick up where you left off and just say, so what were you saying about my movie? Remember 12 years ago? I think he's working on another one of those 12 years or maybe 20 year projects. Sign me up. I'll commit to a 30 year pro. I mean, I'll have to keep myself alive. What a relaxed schedule. You only have to work...

What days am I working? Well, we got you scheduled for a week in 2028. Exactly. I need some time off for my kids' graduation. Oh, that's fine. You're not working for six years. Oh, my God. Okay, School of Rock, I'm delighted to hear this because you said in one of the three interviews in your life you've done, you said that that is your proudest moment ever.

Because you live in that neighborhood, you must be aware of there's like a school rock. My kids were in school rock. Oh, nice. Like there's a cool little punkish. Do you know about this here in Silver Lake? Yeah. But isn't that Fleas Silver Lake Conservatory music? Incredible. Yeah. Yeah.

What a fucking beautiful movie written by Mike White, directed so beautifully by Linklater. You're so fucking good. That is my proudest moment. It's the one where there's a tangible feeling of accomplishment just because of kids and parents that come up to me and go, my kid started playing guitar because of that movie. And that feels like...

It affected a positive change in the world of a lot of kids, which is the best. You're the center of a nice ripple. That doesn't happen often in life. It's kind of paying it forward because theater maybe saved my life and changed my life. And if it does a little bit of that for other kids, then mission accomplished. Okay, so...

I don't wanna lose you. I don't wanna be your science class. I just gotta-- - You're just kidding? - Yes, I just gotta-- - Because I finished my coffee. - Do you want another one? - Yeah, we can give you another one. - No, no, no. - I'll go pee-pee and I'll make you another one. - I don't need it, I don't need it. I'm here. - Would you enjoy it? - I'm afraid that it might be too much. 'Cause to be honest with you, I had a big cup of iced coffee before I even came. So this one was questionable.

The third cup is where my heart explodes. Sometimes I close my eyes just to focus. I've detected the difference. I know when it's hardcore thinking, and I know when it was like, I could go for a five minute. I haven't yawned yet, you guys. I'm still here. I feel your presence. You want to go pee, though. You want to break your poop. I would do it. I'm going to pee right here. There's no door there. I'm going to see you pee. I'm going to go peripheral. We're invited to.

I'm gonna do the same thing after you. Okay, great. Yeah. Is that gonna be uncomfortable? We all step out. We do this all the time. Come on, step out. I'll hold you. You don't need to step out for him. He doesn't care. I want to be a tinkle. I want to get some fresh and stretchable legs anyways. Okay, great. I'm gonna take a bite of a kind bar then. Beautiful backyard area.

Okay, thanks, you guys. I'm done. I did it. I did the deed. I tinkled. I made water. I didn't even really realize I've had this set of cans here the whole time. I could have been listening. I was so curious why you weren't wearing them. You know what? I'm going to wear them now. Oh, this is going to kick into high gear now. Part two. It really will. I was going to suggest it, but then I thought you were making a choice.

- Me too, 'cause I'm like this guy's so audio inclined. He records music, he's got a whole take on why he doesn't wear headphones. - I usually wear the headphones, but it makes me a little more self-conscious. Might be better without it. - Oh really? - I don't know. - Let's give it a try. - Well, you start listening to your own voice a little bit more. - That encourages me. I'm like, I sound official. I like it, it gives me confidence.

Or if you're listening to yourself, this sounds a little nasally. Let me modulate my voice to make it less so. I don't want to get into that whole thing. But you must have spent a great deal of time in front of a mirror fucking around with your voice. Lots. That's the start of every career. I agree. In the industry, you got to be in front of the mirror looking at how you look and how you must look to the audience. Yes, exactly.

Oh, real quick. Did you do Letterman in the day? I did do Letterman several times. Okay, so you don't love doing press, but the only reason I wanted to be in show business was to be on Letterman. I didn't understand how I would get there, but 10, I want to be on Letterman. Yeah, Letterman, that was a big one for me. It was not the first one. The first talk show I did was Conan, and that was a

huge one for me and in a way nothing has beat the conan experience because he was so down to clown and i was like would you mind if i do a little sketch right not just come out and talk my thing is putting on a show and he was into it and their producers

Smiley? Did you ever deal with that? Smiley or Smigel? Smiley was the producer. Okay. And that's who I talked to as like the interview before the show. Mine was Dan Ferguson always. Okay. Because he was also there. I probably talked to Fergie as well.

And those shows always didn't feel like, oh, I'm going to tell my life story. I'm going out there, not so much as an interview, but I'm going out there to put on a show because it's part of the job. I have to go out there and sell this movie or this thing, and this is what they paid me for, so I contractually have to do it. Right, right, right. But I've never done one of those in-between movies just to be like, oh, yeah, I'm just going to do this one for fun just because I love it. Have you?

Done a talk show for fun? Oh, yeah, you do all this time. Yes, a ton. Jack, I've been on some of these shows like 38 times. That sounds crazy to me because it's such a pressure cooker. It is, and I kind of love it. In fact, I'm much better at being on a talk show than I am about being in the movie I'm there to promote. For whatever reason, the talk show for me is like my sweet spot.

You crush on talk shows. I'm shocked that you're not more... I have had some good ones. Yes, and this is a brag, but I so relate to the Conan thing. Most talk shows, if I go and I do everything I hope to do, I basically executed what I was hoping to do. On Conan, numerous times I've been like, well, that was 20 times better than I was even hoping for, and he took it in a bizarre place, and I happened to work well with him. I've left there going like...

"Wow, we found some real comedy here that I hadn't even considered." Where I'm proud. I really do feel like

It is the exact same beast as going out there with Tenacious D and performing live in front of an audience. It's putting on a show more than anything. And if it goes well, I get that same rush. I get that same feeling of, wow, we really crushed it out there. And still, that hasn't dissipated at all because you guys are, what, on 25 years of this? Yeah. We've been having great adventures still. We went to Europe just a month ago. Actually, our best...

place in the world is England. That market, for whatever reason, that's where we feel the most love. That's where we sell the most tickets. The audiences are ravenous and it's changed over the years. At first it was the United States. We played all these great cities here. And then for some reason, Australia was our place to go and we were crushing it in Australia. And then it was England. Has Tenacious D been the safety net? Or let me first start by asking, have you had moments in your career where you were scared?

Yeah, where it feels like, oh, I think it's over. You try to put a good spin on it, which is, I want to view this as that was a damn good run. Be happy with that. But I always felt heartbroken by those moments. I didn't feel like, oh, I got to play in the NBA, now I'm retired. I was like, oh, I got kicked out of this party I was once invited to. Yeah, I feel terror when I feel like, oh, it's over. I have felt that a few times. I'll get on the horn with my agent and be like, okay.

Can we get something going? I need to take some meetings or start developing something because this thing feels like a red alert. I think I'm done. My career's over. I'm not feeling that way right now. In fact, right now, I feel like I'm getting too old for this shit. Maybe I'm done and I'm happy about it. Right, right, right, right, right. But then I know as soon as my Google calendar gets empty, it will be right back to the panic mode and I'll be back on the horn saying, where's my old man movie? There's still rolls for...

Would you agree there's almost no sweet spot? It's either you have too much or you don't have enough. Or are you in a sweet spot? I'm in a sweet spot right now. My cup is full of performance satisfaction. I kind of sidetracked you. I was wondering if Tenacious D was kind of that safety net. Even Tenacious D, I feel sometimes like, uh-oh, is this the end of the line for this band? We definitely had our moment in the sun. I always feel blessed when it's like, oh my God, we're still selling out this or that venue.

In terms of a job, playing in front of an audience, playing music, and doing comedy bits with teenagers is the best. You only work a couple hours a day. You get to travel to a different city every day. You take a nice, comfortable bus. You lay down in your weird coffin bed. And you get to a town and you have time to take a nice, leisurely walk around London or Birmingham or wherever we are. Find a nice patch of grass to throw the frisbee. And you're hanging with your friends. It's just...

the best life. - Yeah, I'm very envious of the sensation you must have when you're actually rocking an audience, like the way Bon Jovi said, "And I rocked 'em all." That must be a very tasty feeling. - It feels great when you're in a groove and you're jamming, and it also feels great if you are putting on a show that's got some new elements to it. You're trying to blow their minds, and some of them, you know it's their first concert they've ever been to, and other ones, they've been following you for 20 years.

It's a great feeling. My eight and 11 year old know the words to probably six Tenacious Ten songs from start to finish. Wow. So don't rule out you doing this at 78 because like I know you have another wave coming. Well, you know, you got that Rolling Stones still going. I got to start doing the yoga, I guess. Get into some yoga. Okay. The only other thing I wanted to ask you about is, and my wife is in this situation, right? You hit the lottery.

in that she gets this gift frozen.

And it might just hopefully and likely go on forever and ever and ever. Kung Fu Panda, is that a little safety blanket? Oh, my God. Every few years they call. Well, I never count my chickens. They haven't called up and said, hey, that thing was a hit. We got to do another one. I'm not assuming that that's going to happen, but it has been an amazing ride. That thing is going on. Yeah, that's 16 years you've been doing this. But about 20 since I first was pitched the idea because the first one took a few years. And it is.

a great job. I'm so spoiled. When you go in to record some voice work, when you go in and it's just you and the microphone and the director and they're telling you, they're setting the scene, they're showing you some artwork and they're giving you direction and you're doing the vocal performance, I get the same buzz. I get the same high. And when I feel like I'm connecting and making the people in the control booth laugh, I'm like, ugh, this rules. Yeah. The actual workload is pretty light. It's about as good as it gets in show business. Yeah. Speaking

of Cannes, I saw one of the Kung Fu Pandas at Cannes in 2008. Wow, yeah. The first one then. Would it have been the first one? Yeah, 2008. I don't remember. That's the first one. That must have been the first. I was begging for tickets on the side of the street and I got one to Kung Fu Panda. I was pretty excited.

Were you smitten as hell when you saw it? We were all like, wow, this is great. We were all so pretentious at the time. We were like college students on a study abroad. There to see the fancy French movies. Maybe a Dan Lewis film. Hopefully, God willing. We're all leaving being like, Kung Fu Parasite!

I remember that one. Jeffrey Katzenberg was always real big on the pulling stunts to get publicity. And he would put all of his voice actors through the motions. And he had me marching down the street in Cannes.

with like a hundred costumed panda people, dancers. Oh boy. And I was just marching down the Champs-Elysees, or wherever we were. Oh my God. White hot embarrassment in my face. That's when you know that it's working, when it's so humiliating. This is gonna get some clicks and some likes.

Oh, fuck. That just gave me PTSD. The first movie I ever did was Without a Paddle, and we got sent to every city in America to promote it because none of us were big stars. And there was a bear in the film, Bart the Bear. Yeah. And so they were like, you know what would be a great idea is we get a guy in a bear costume on the red carpet with these guys everywhere they go. And I would be so embarrassed. I mean, a level of embarrassment. I'd rather be shitting myself in public, baby. Yeah.

And eventually I was like, if I see the bear again, I'm gonna leave. I can't do the guy in the bear costume anymore. Those things that are part of the job, get out there and dance like a monkey. I've come full circle because there was a time when it was just like,

I gotta get out of this business. And now I just kind of weirdly embrace it when they're like, it's time to promote Kung Fu Panda. Will Tenacious D do a song? We want you to do a cover of some kind. And we were like, we think it would be fun to do a Britney Spears song. I'm just sort of engaging in the promo. And so then we're like making a music video at the red carpet.

at the premiere. Oh wow, that's high stakes. It turns out to be like a really funny thing. It's like if you're scared of an animal, you're more likely to be attacked by it. Right. The public can sense your guilt, so you're like shame and they'll destroy you. But if you don't feel that kind of weight and you're just having fun. I'm there. My wife and I do a ton of commercials together. As long as I'm like going all out, who gives a fuck if it was here, here or here. Okay, Borderlands. Yeah. That is coming out in August. Right out of the gates,

And I think maybe I forgot. This is not your first go-round with Cate Blanchett. She's probably my favorite actor alive. She is the best. What a crush. What was the thing you did with her before this? It was a little movie called The House with a Clock in Its Walls.

Wow. By the same director, Eli Roth, as a matter of fact. Oh, he did that as well. And that was a horror film for kids, kind of in the vein of Goosebumps that I had done a few years before. You played R.L. Stine, right? Correct. And this was based on a fun, cool, scary book. What's Borderlands based on? Borderlands is based on a great video game that came out like a decade ago.

And now they're on like part three of the video game. I'm a gamer. And so I was aware of the game and I loved it. It's technically like a sci-fi Western, but it looks and feels like a post-apocalyptic desert film like Road Warrior. Yeah, it looks very the newest Mad Max. It looks visually very Mad Max. And they've taken some elements from 80s metal. There's like muscle bound shirtless berserkers, they're called with

hockey masks. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's peopled with robots. And I kind of play the R2-D2 of the movie, but it's more of a punk rock foul-mouthed R2-D2 where he's got a lot of attitude. He's this robot that's helping, but also kind of wishing that everyone would just die. Do you have a throwaway line that's like, whatever reason, this robot has been programmed to make jokes. Correct.

He is a comic relief helper, but he also hates the world that he's stuck in. And it's a sweet story in that this little robot that you play, you have been dormant for like 37 years. And then Cate Blanchett returns to her home planet on a mission. And then you come back to life.

We don't know why, but you are inextricably linked to try to save and protect her. It's funny because I loved the role and I love the opportunity, but I didn't have to be there. Everybody else went to Bulgaria and worked in the harsh elements. And I'm friends with Jamie Lee Curtis. We follow each other on Instagram. And I get this DM from her where she's like, where the fuck are you? I'm knee deep here in Bulgaria working my ass off.

And I just found out you don't have to be here. What order did they do it in? Because they're acting against you. They had all of my performance. So you did it before the- Yeah, they were able to act off of what I was doing. But still, I get it. I was feeling for her. Are you at all sad because this Ariana Greenblatt?

First of all, did you see Barbie? Yes. What a movie. Incredible. I'm on my fourth viewing. It's so fucking good. And she's so wonderful in it. It's a psychedelic trip through a childhood fantasy, but it's also part of a movement. You know how I was saying alt comedy came from like the movement of alt rock? Barbie feels like it's part of a movement also.

of "Me Too" and "Girl Power" and like this wave, it would be any other time I feel like a great art film that had a big budget. 'Cause it feels indie. It's got that kind of- - Irreverence and fuck you. - And they're not feeling the big budget pressure, but,

It's a Goliath. It's a huge hit. Yeah. And in fact, I lament a lot of times and you must too, like the days of the $30 million comedy coming out and making a hundred million dollars and there being eight or 10 of those a year, it's just so gone. And it's been gone for six or seven years. And I'm like, God, there's no comedy. And then all of a sudden I was like, no, Barbie's a hardcore comedy. I don't think I've laughed that hard. I loved being skewered in the way that we got skewered in that.

I'll tell you the funniest moment. We're on our way home from the movie theater and my 11-year-old says to Kristen, Mom, has dad ever played his guitar at you? And Kristen goes, oh yeah. Fuck.

And I just started dying laughing of embarrassment. Yeah. I've told someone the value of Godfather. Yeah. Oh, man. Whoopsies. Dude, who was first, though? Was it Barbie or White Lotus? Because White Lotus went straight at that, too. They did. They were first. Mike White, by the way. Yeah, that's our favorite show. God, we love that fucking show. Oh, brilliant. Wait for the next season. Me, too. Oh, another entire.

Yeah. I don't know if I'm supposed to know that, but there are times. No, I think it was. I think it's out there. It leaked. You can't keep that kind of secret. But.

But back to your movie and Ariana Greenblatt. She's so great. I bet you wish you would have had some scenes with her. I know. It would be cool if I could have jumped on a jet plane and been in person. And this is your fourth thing with Kevin Hart? Yeah. And Kevin Hart is pulling an action hero, different kind of character than he usually does. And if you look at the history of comedians who change gears and then go action hero,

The first one I think of is Eddie Murphy in 48 Hours where he's still funny as hell, but he's also legit badass, can fight, will fight, does get into scrapes, and is a hero. How about 48 Hours too? Let's put that in the barrel. No, I did say 48 Hours. You thought that I said

I did. I went straight to 48 hours. Oh my God, that's so weird. Yes, but Beverly Hills Cop and 48 hours. 48 hours, he's a convict. So I feel like that's where Kevin Hart is with Borderlands. More power to him and he does kick ass. The thing that he has to jump over a hurdle that Eddie Murphy never did is that he's also way shorter. I feel simpatico with him because I also am way shorter and I feel like us shorties, we got to stick-

Short kings. Oh my gosh, short kings. I think you're writing a new movie with me and Kevin Hart. We just need one more short king in there. I'll pretend I'm a short king. There it is. Short queen. But I'll pretend like I made that up, but I didn't. That's an Instagram thing, right? Short kings, they're in. But you don't present as short. How tall are you? Five foot six and a half. You know when you put the half on there that you're short. You're desperate, yeah. I do the same thing.

I would round up to 5'7", but I don't feel right doing it. So when you and Kevin are in Jumanji, are you looking eye to eye, basically? I might be like an inch taller. I don't want to talk about who's... It's a game of inches. The introduction to his character in Borderlands is he arrives to rescue Ariana Greenblatt. Roland is his character. Great, tough guy name. Yes. So Roland rolls in, and he says, your father sent me to save you. And she says, oh, great. He sent his shortest soldier.

And you go, wow, even in this movie, he's not going to catch a break. Right out of the gate. Well, it's good to let it out right out of the front. Get it out and talk about it and then move on. And then I guess just Cate Blanchett is so fucking radical. She's just always the best actor in the room. When was the first time that I noticed her and thought, you know when it was?

was Lord of the Rings. I was like, who's that incredible vision? Her delivery and her presence. But then maybe my favorite performance of hers. Can we say it on three? I'm sure we're gonna have different ones. Well, but let's roll the dice. Because no one agrees with me on this one. Hold on, hold on. I gotta think of the exact title. Okay, so you count us down. And then I'll say three, two, one, and then you go. Okay, ready? Are you gonna throw one in too? I'll throw one in. All right, good. But I don't think it's my fave, but I'll try. All right, good. Okay, ready? Three, two, one.

Life Aquatic. But that speaks to her power. We got three different movies. Three different people, three different movies. Yours was Blue Jasmine. Yes. That's a good pick. She crushed it. Did you hear mine? Nope. You didn't hear mine. Life Aquatic. Oh, yes. Steve Zizzo. With Steven Zizzo. Oh, what a movie. That movie, would you agree? I saw it in the theater and I'm like, um, I don't know. No.

Not my favorite West movie. Yes. Then I saw it again two years later. I was like, hold on a second. This movie is very powerful. That bears repeating. By viewing five or six, I'm like, I don't know. It might be his best movie. It might be your favorite one? So good. Okay, I'm going back. You got to go back. It's so bizarre and wonderful. Because for me...

My favorite gotta be that hotel one. Grand Budapest. Grand Budapest. Yes. That is a good one. Wow. It's a good one. I was watching it last summer on vacation. My daughter was then 10 and she came into the living room and she sat down for about four or five minutes and she was watching and she said the most dreamy question your kid could ask. She goes, wow.

"Wow, what's going on with this movie? Why does it look like, what's happening?" And I'm like, "Oh, pull up a chair." This is like the dude in Barbie. I'm like, "He loves set design and he starts with wides and he pushes in and the sets move." And I'm starting to explain all the unique touches of Wes Anderson.

And she and I went on a three month ride where we watched all the Wes Anderson movies. And she got it. That's such a great thing to do with your kid. I could have died at the end of it. Oh my God. What was her fave? I'm a Royal Tenenbaums girl. Oh yeah. I love it too.

It's so sad. It's so sad. It's hard to get away from Bottle Rock at the beginning. I know. It's so pure and brilliant. It is fantastic. How about the choice in songs? I wonder how much of that is West. There's a great Cat Stevens song in that one. And there's a great song by Love. Yeah, there's a fun day. Rub-a-do-ba day. Oh.

I can't remember any of the words. I love when you're singing. Me too. Such a treat. I wish you would sing for three hours. You know what I've been doing lately? Do you do this? Because I kind of got away from music. I realized I'm only listening to like books and podcasts and I'm not listening to music anymore. I was like, I'm going back in. And here's how I did it. Chronological marathons.

I pick a band that I love, but I've never done the marathon. And I go, I'm going to listen to every album in chronological order and see if there's some songs I've never heard by this or that band. And I love it. I'm right in the middle of Queen right now. Oh, what a great band. And I haven't even gotten to News of the World yet. It's like those first five albums are...

are masterpieces. There's tons of songs I've never heard before. Do you remember the album cover that had the robot on the cover and it's holding bodies, bloody bodies? That's news of the world. That's the one with most of their big hits. And that's a fun thing to do when you do the chrono marathon, when you find that period where they're really in a window, where it's like now they're busting out on all cylinders. They're high fidelity. Exactly. Yeah.

They got their 10,000 hours. Exactly. This is my hack because I get in musical ruts too. Yeah. And what I like to do is go on Spotify and take a song I'm in the mood for that I love and then make a radio station out of it. Yeah. Do you do that? I have done that. That's like a party trick if you don't want to go through making a playlist for the whole party. Yeah. But I'll discover things that way. It's not like I'm listening to the radio anymore.

And that's the only thing I know how to do to find new stuff. My wife kind of steered me away from doing that, though, because sometimes when we're on a long drive, I'll just tell my Tesla, you know, I like to mix it up and listen to some jazz once in a while. I'm like, play Miles Davis. And it'll just start playing some random Miles Davis. And Tanya's like, no, you can't do that. And she knows way more jazz than I do because her father. Exactly. Charlie Hayden, great jazz bass player. She's.

She is totally against that random thing. It's like, if you want to play a great song, so we've been going the other way. I feel like if we have a gathering, we'll just put on a record and let it play that whole side. It'll play that 20 minutes. And then you'll know when the silence comes, oh, time to flip it. I find this troublesome. I'm doing the same thing where I play records and then the 20 minutes, it's too fast. You are,

I'm up by that record player 400 times during the party. I'm not loving it. I hear you. It's an interactive experience. But if we're honest, it's more like 10 times, 400 times. That's a long party. I have really long parties. It wasn't 400 times 20 minutes, please. Math. Her parties always start at 8 a.m. 8,000 minutes? That's a sleepover. I have cool parties. So...

Are you inviting him or no? Of course. I feel like it's rude now to talk about how great and long your parties are and then not invite Jack. You're invited. And you're right down the street too. You're even closer to her. That's right. Oh my God. Are we all in the neighborhood? Well, she's building the house two over right here. There you see a big house looming over our- But I also currently live down the street from you as well. Are you? I'm not going to say that. I won't say, but I am on that major street. Oh my God. Do we ever cross paths when I'm walking? Have you ever seen him? I have.

- I get my steps, but I am pretty stealth. I stick and move. - I'm also not very observant, so there's a chance we could have crossed paths. - Do you get steps? Is that like your way also of getting your exercise? - I go on wogs, which is a couple rounds of walking and some rounds of running. It's a mix.

Oh, yeah. I don't jog. I probably should to get that heart rate pumping, but I don't like the way it makes my bones feel. It does hurt. It's starting to hurt more and more, but I do feel like I've really worked out if there's a run in there. I should figure out a way because when I just do my steps...

It takes a long time to get the right amount because 10,000 don't do it. So I'm trying to get between 14 and 16,000 steps. That's a lot. 15,000 is the right amount of steps for me. It's going to take two hours. And the size of the rectangle that I have to make through the city is so huge. It's so much. And it's like I'm going to have to pee or maybe poo at some point. Right. And one time I didn't poop my pants, but I had poop.

This is embarrassing. We talk about this all the time. I pull my pants once a year, so you're in a safe space. Oh, thank you. Yeah, yeah. Not really, though. The microphone's here. I did buy a ticket one time to the Vista movie theater just to go in and drop a look. And relax. But then I did go in and watch some of the movie, so they didn't know. That's why. That's the problem with being famous, because otherwise nobody...

No one would care. You could slide in and out. The movie's already started. Yeah, no, I've already seen it several times. I'm kind of a film buff. Can I have the ticket real quick, please? I have a couple favorite scenes. I know when the scenes come up, so I'm just here for those favorite scenes. And by the way, if you're ever in the neighborhood of Vista, great restroom. Great, great. I want to close the loop on music and ask a kind of dangerous question because this is a very polarizing group. But if I had to say one group...

Oh my God. Owns my soul and my vibe. And I need to know if you like them or not. Wait, can I guess? Yeah. Radiohead. Nope. Wait.

Okay, I'm not guessing anymore. I just wanted one guess. I like that. I could feel it coming, and I was wrong. Steely Dan. Oh, dude, are you kidding me? Steely Dan for me. What the fuck? Dude, Steely Dan is the radio head of the 70s. In a way. I guess you could make that argument. Do you love Steely Dan? In fact, I think Steely Dan might have been my first chrono marathon. When Steely Dan hits you, you're like, good lord, Pegg?

Oh, hey. They're touching God. It's that good. And I was like, you know what? I need to one time listen to everything they've ever written because their genius is so apparent. I wonder, there must be nuggets that I've never heard. There's not a bad song. That's what's crazy is there's ones that you don't recognize are not hits, but you're never suffering through a song till the next one comes. Right. Everyone has value. There's never a bad one. But-

Uh-oh. But just like every band that's ever existed, there's a window. Now, that's a bigger window because they got so many great albums, but there's a window where they were clicking on all cylinders. It is a fun marathon to go through. It's one of my great regrets is I never saw them live in their full capacity.

And now one of them is in the hereafter, so it'll never be. Wait, have you seen them live? At least five times, I think more. Did you see them while they were both there? Yes, only when they've been both there. Did you see them at the Hollywood Bowl? I've seen them in Irvine three times. I saw them back in Michigan probably three times. I have seen them at the Bowl. I want to say I saw them in Santa Barbara at this weird outdoor thing. And their musicians were always the best.

very best studio musicians in the world. Like anytime their drummer had a solo, you're like, keep going. Yeah. 14 minutes. That was their MO the whole way through because it was those two and whoever was the best available musicians at the time. Yes. Do you know the origin of the name? Burroughs. Yeah. William Burroughs. The vibrator. I don't remember.

I don't remember why I know that. Oh, it's because I was listening to Naked Lunch. Right. This is a book that had always haunted me because I'd heard people I respect always cite it as the best book ever written and that they're just obsessed with this book. And the thing that's great about Naked Lunch is you don't read it chronologically. You just open it up randomly and just start reading the page and then close it.

And then come back and randomly open it. I was like, what? Why? And they were like, that's how it was meant to be read. And it didn't make any sense. And because I have such severe ADHD, if I just listen to it, it's going to be like I'm listening to random chunks of it anyway. Right. Because I'm going to

phase out and be thinking about something else so i just listened to it and i popped in and out and i was like oh i get it i'm not paying attention to it now i'm listening and it's a random place just the language is great and the characters are intense and the thing that popped out was steely dan i was like wait a second this was written before steely dan and then i found out oh

that's where they got the name. It's from this book. It's such a weird thing. It's like a vibrator, right? Big metal vibrator. I always loved the idea of Burroughs. I like Burroughs as a figure. Don't like the writing all that much. I wanted to like it. Well, that book is tough. It's impossible to comprehend for me, but...

a great book by burroughs maybe you don't agree junkie oh that is the most for me approachable and it's really just his experience with drugs and his journey and it's so raw do you know you're one of three people in this industry that has the reputation of being just the nicest guy has that gotten back around to you i think that that's a double-edged sword though i have heard that before

and it was when I was being roasted, and I didn't want to be roasted on television. They wanted to roast me at the Friars Club in New York City, and I was like, okay, I don't want to say no. There's so many legends that are part of that club, and I was like, do you ever do them where they're not televised? They were like, yeah, and I was like, let's do one of those shows

And so I got roasted and they reach out to different people in the industry to try to get people to roast you. And I had a good deus. And they got some videos from different people too that couldn't be there but wanted to contribute. And Seth Rogen was one of the people and he was like, I mean, I don't know really what to say. He's such a nice guy. I don't want to say anything shitty about him. I like him. He's a nice guy. So, uh...

Fuck you, Jack. Love you. All right, bye. And it was sort of a non thing. And I was like, oh, that's cool. He doesn't want to hurt my feelings because he likes me and he sees me as just a nice guy. But if you're just a nice guy, there's a barrier between you. That's a protective thing that I've set up, I think, so that no one hurts me.

And maybe I'm missing out on a couple things because of that. If you're brave enough to be an asshole sometimes and put yourself out in that other way. I know what you're saying because we just talked about, like, I'm interested in Burroughs. He was a horrific human being. Horrible. He shot his girlfriend down in Mexico. Horrible. Yeah, yeah. I mean, he's a monster. I couldn't be more interested. I know. Right? There's something about the honesty of being horrible. Bukowski was my favorite writer all growing up.

Like, you know, I like that. Well, there's a lack of intimacy. I'm too sensitive for a roast, Jack. I couldn't do it. I would be thinking about their jokes for like two years. Yeah. Have any rattled around in your head post-roast? No. It rolled off like a duck's back. That's another bad movie, but we could make it post-roast. Post-roast. It's a guy who gets roasted and it changes the whole course of his life. It never recovers. No. No.

Okay, you've been here for so long. I really appreciate it. I do want to just point out, so here were the fun parallels. We had some cocaine you use. I like that. We had UCLA, which is fun. Tim Robbins, I was in the other Jumanji, Zathura. Yes! With Tim Robbins. Oh my God, we're both in the universe. Chris Von Allsburg universe. We are both in Jumanjis that don't feature Robin Williams, the original Jumanji master. Yes, yes.

It's taken many of us to replace the one Robin Williams. I love your sci-fi Zathura. Did you see that? Yes. Oh, wow. I watch it with my boys who also love it. And that's why I always say that I'm in Jumanji 3 and 4. I appreciate that. Yeah. Yeah, because ours didn't do so high.

You know why? You guys didn't call it Jumanji Part 2. It's true. I think Favreau would be the first to admit it to you. Why did he want to get away from that? Let's not even mention. It's Zathura. But listen, we did that in 2005 or 4. You did it in 2019.

We were pretty close to it. And that movie was done to perfection. It would be like remaking Fletch and calling it, you know, it's dangerous. But you would have to call it Fletch 2. You wouldn't call it. Well, there was a Fletch 2. Well, one of the problems was the title. People were like, they couldn't pronounce it. And they're like, I want to see it, but I'm not going to step up to a ticket counter and fuck up this name of this movie and embarrass myself in front of my family. But we have that. Yeah, you're the astronaut. I sure am. But this one really leapt off the page for me.

This is really weird, I think. We have the exact same love trajectory. You and I were both in nine-year relationships that started in 1996. Wow. Mine was Bree. Still love her to death. She's a wonderful woman. You're one year ahead of me.

But then I've been with Kristen for 17 years. You've been with your wife for 18 years. Tanya. That's a weird parallel. That is a weird thing. Laura Keitlinger was my girlfriend for a long time. Nine years. And I did want to ask you this, and I think I know the answer because the fact that you ended up with Tanya and you had met her in high school. When Bree and I broke up...

My number one panic was I hated the notion that whoever met me next was going to meet me already as a guy in movies. Yes. Did you have that? Of course. I didn't trust anyone. Even beyond trust, it was like, I need you to know the guy that was the struggling piece of shit. Yeah.

That was hopeless. I need you to know where we started or you can't know me. I definitely had that. And do you think that's part of why the fact that Tanya's from high school? That is part of it, that we have deep roots. And I also just remembered in high school before everything, we didn't date or really even talk. But I remember her and her sister. She's a triplet. Oh.

And just loving the whole family. I just thought they had a real vibe. And that's a big, important thing in a Hollywood town and a Hollywood school where you feel like they're rooted in something real and not part of the industry, really. Even though their dad's a famous musician, it's not that kind of phony bullshit. Did all three go to Crossroads? They all three went to Crossroads. Are they all girls? Yep. They have an older brother, Josh Hayden, who's also a great musician. Are they identical? No. No.

They're the other kind of thing. Fraternal triplets. Fraternal triplets, yeah. I don't think I've ever met a triplet. Yeah. Oh, natural. In the 70s when they were born. Organic. They're organic. A very rare thing. And I kept in touch with them and I would see them performing sometimes. They would go out and sing and they have those beautiful blood harmonies that you hear about with the family members that sing together. And they would do these beautiful old country jams.

you know, like Carter family era songs. And I just was always in awe of them. And we would cross paths and I had a girlfriend and she had a boyfriend and it was just a little talking here and there. And then that day came when neither of us had a significant other. I had always been so kind of intimidated and never really wanted to really approach. Risk making the friendship weird. She made the first move is the point.

We were at a birthday party, a surprise birthday party for someone else, a mutual friend. And she came up to me and said, hey, do you ever want to go get dinner or something? I should give you my number. And I was like, oh, my God. Heaven opened up above my head because it was like this is the thing that I would always want to happen.

And things moved fast. We started getting very serious and the relationship hit the ground running. It's like we were making up for lost time. And was that driven at all too by a desire to have kids? Because that's what... You see, I'm closing my eyes right now. It's not because... I didn't detect that. It's not because I'm tired. It's because I'm embarrassed to talk about things that are real and personal. And also because I'm trying to just go back to exactly the time and the moment that our relationship started. We were together 24-7.

You got married within a year of that moment, right? We were dating for a few months and we were both talking about how we both would like to have kids, but we didn't get married because it was like, don't really believe in the contract and that whole thing. Too pedestrian. Why is it necessary? And then as soon as she had a baby in her belly, my brother was like, what the hell are you doing? You marry her. He's like, you're right, dude. I'm going to get her. Are you fucking stupid? Yeah.

You're having a child with this woman. Marry her. I got on bended knee and she laughed and said yes. Oh, this is lovely. And you have two masculine boys that you love. We have two boys. They're 16 and 18. Why do you have to say masculine? Godfather. I always think of the godfather. May he be a masculine boy. Was that a- Luke Obrasi. Oh.

So it wasn't Marlon Brando that said that. Luca Brasi's talking to him. Oh, yeah. May they be blessed with children and may it be a masculine boy. Oh, I forgot that part. Yeah. Okay. Well, Jack, this has been delightful. Pleasure was mine.

I think my marching orders leaving this interview are, first of all, what a slam dunk on Steely Dan. That makes me feel so much safer around you. Have you done the marathon with Steely Dan? What a great idea. I've never done that. And a thousand percent, that's my next. Because I'm a little in a rut right now. I was feeling it working out today. I'm like, listen to my shit. I even made a station. In fact, because you were coming, I'm like, I'm going to listen to Zeppelin. Oh, that's a great marathon. That's the first thing I was obsessed with.

obsessed with, like, learned the musicians' names, got all of the stuff. That was probably my first marathon, actually. The best rock band ever, in my opinion. It makes me want to bust out my marathon list of all the marathons. Yeah, I want to hear a couple more, because Queen's a great idea. I think it's for another time. Okay. Okay.

Next time. Well, that means you're coming back. Yes, we're wrapping up to be continued. Comeback for Minecraft in 2025. Yes. Directed by Jared Hess. I love this plan. A re-teaming with you and Jared. Well, now we've got all the ground work done. We'll hit the ground running on the next one. Yeah, we'll go into the future. This was kind of a walkthrough history. It really was. This was like some time with my muscle-bound therapist.

You know what I mean? Thank you. That's what I said when I first got here. I was like, this couch, I could lay down here and it really would be therapy. All I would have to do is turn that microphone that way. We would love that. And maybe on the 2025 trip, we get you supine. Yes.

Generally when people return, we'll write so and so returns, but this time I think we'll write Jack Black Supine. That's a tasty title. All right, everybody please check out Borderlands. It's wild and ambitious and colorful and will remind you of Mad Max. And of course, Jack is hilarious. It has our favorite actors in it, Cate Blanchett, Kevin Hart, Jamie Lee Curtis, Ariana Greenblatt. Now, second marching orders from now on when I see you on the street,

I am going to holla. Please. Okay, wonderful. Holla. And I may pretend it's very rare that I crack my concentration on my chrono marathon. But Pink Floyd is a great one. Really good idea. Oh, my God. You know what would be a great one? Or I'm asking, have you had the same thing like

I had some revelation at some point. Fleetwood Mac was like a kick-ass rock band before they were the Fleetwood Mac I grew up with. Yeah. I can't sing, I ain't pretty and my legs are thin. Oh, yeah. Don't ask me what I think of you. Isn't that early Fleetwood Mac? Is that Fleetwood Mac? If it's not, that's on the handy. There's no way that is Fleetwood Mac. I'm going to go back and listen. I'm going to go find that. It's not. Can you sing it again?

Don't ask me what I think of you. I might not give the answer that you want me to. That should be enough. Yeah, Oh Well by Fleetwood Mac. Wow. Can you hit us with one second? That is so not what I think of. Right? Oh good, so you haven't had that revelation. No. So I had that about three years ago. I was like, holy crap.

Hold on a second, this is fucking Fleetwood Mac. They used to rock the shit out of. Yeah. And so that would be a great chronological one because God knows what else is on the album that that great song comes off of. Wait, is that before Stevie Nicks? Before Stevie Nicks. And Lindsey Buckingham joined the band? 1969. Because I feel like they were a package deal. 1969, the year of your birth. That's before.

They already had a huge hit on their hands. Yes. But Rumors is the album. That's when the window really opened up. That's an impossibly perfect album. You and Kyle should play this song. This is a great one.

This is nasty, Jack. This is dirty, nasty shit. This is good driving across the country music. This is why Mick Fleetwood was like...

Look, you kids are talented, but I'm driving this shit. Who here has a number one hit single? It's me. Not you, Lindsay Buckingham. And not you. He was in full control. I can't sing, I ain't pretty, and my legs are thin. That's the description of me. Who was singing? Who was that? David Lee Roth.

All right. Much love to you and yours. Take care. He is an armchair expert, but he makes mistakes all the time. Thank God Monica's here. She's got to let him have the facts.

It's Olympic coverage time. Yesterday was a spectacular day. Yeah, a few days ago for our audience. Our ladies won gold. Yeah, it was so exciting. Gymnastics team gold. They swept it, swept the floor with these other girls.

Countries. Well. Yeah, they did. They did. They really came in. Hot. They weren't even close. What was the final score, though? The second place was only five points behind out of like 114. That feels kind of close. No, for gymnastics. They could have fallen. It was a thrashing? Yeah. Okay. We had a fall. Which one? We had a fall on beam.

Oh, yeah, on the getting up there. Yeah, they call that the mount. Oh, the mount. Yeah. Yes, that was Jordan. Jordan Childs. Yes, I was very disheartened. As I said, I'm a big fan of Jordan Childs. But you can still be a fan of her. Not anymore, Chappelle. No, do I ever say that ever again? Oh, I'm cutthroat. I'm cutthroat. If you fall one time, I'm out. No, you're evil. No, no, no, no, no. I was just sad because I'm rooting for her so much. Of course. Oh, the stress.

And then I was caught up to speed. They did a great job with those interstitial packages to tell me all of Sunni's stories about her kidney issues. Yeah. She gained 45 pounds. I was thinking like on someone her size, what is she, 4'10 or something? If Biles is 4'8. Yeah, I don't know. Five foot. Five foot. 45 pounds on five foot is a lot. Shorter than me. That was probably like almost a 50% increase. I mean, that's significant. Yeah, kidney issues, ouch.

And then she's back. Really incredible. Yeah, I loved it. It's a good team. It was really fun to watch. I watched real time. I watched live. I did too. 9.15? Yeah. I mean, I started like at probably 9.45. So I started at the beginning. I was able to fast forward through commercials. But by the time I ended, I pretty much timed it perfectly. It was great. It was great because it was long and I worked out the whole time. But I just kind of slowly worked out and then I would stop for an event.

And then it was great. It was great. I've also been watching some swimming. I really enjoy watching the swimming because I can't swim. Yes, it's that much more impressive. Yeah, the two things I've watched a bunch of the swimming and I like it a lot. And then, as I said, I think last time, this two woman beach volleyball is so impressive. You know, I respect all the sports. Have you tried it? Yeah, well, I tried watching men's last night. Don't watch men's.

Volleyball's not for me. Okay. I know you want it to stop. Could you try the women's? Maybe just give it a shot. I'll try because I support women. Yeah, you got to support women. I will watch. They're so good. Oh my God, are they good. It's wild. And then opposite of gymnastics, you get some tall gals up in that volleyball match. It's a wide range. Six four, six three.

Total opposite. Sports are interesting in that way. They really are. You kind of have to be built a certain way. You're not going to be a 6'4 female gymnast. It would be very hard. It's definitely a biological advantage. Being short is to gymnastics because...

That's a lot to be like swinging around. I've heard that the activity itself somehow stunts your growth. I would love to have a doctor explain that and whether or not that's... Accurate. Yeah. Yeah, I've heard that too, but I think it might be pop science. Or poppy cock? Pop science. Okay, pop science. Yeah.

Is that a term? Yeah. It is? Yeah. Oh, thanks for teaching it to me. Could you elaborate on it? Pop science. Just like popular science. Okay. That's not science though? It's like this is of the moment. My favorite gymnast who I told you about, Dominique Mociano. Romanian? She was American, but she is of Romanian descent. Okay. Because she was in 96. You were nine.

I was seven. I was seven. I was about to turn eight when the Olympics happened in 96. Okay. You were born in 87. So 96 is nine years away from, yeah, so I don't know. I mean, I respect your story and your experience, but also 96 and 87 is nine years away. And they happen in the summer.

Yeah, but it was right before I turned an age. Yeah, I think it was right before you turned nine. I guess maybe it was. Anyway, she was 4'6 or something at that time.

She was 14, though. But she was like 4'6 and 70-something pounds. And now she's 5'3. So it probably did stunt her growth. She grew after quite a bit. Yeah. I mean, I guess she hadn't even maybe hit puberty. My two obsessions currently is I need to stand next to George Kittle. Okay. And I need to stand next to Simone Biles. Both those people. I really want to, but.

I'm going to put a lot of effort into it. Okay. You should put it on your vision board. Manifest it. That'd be a fun thing to put on the vision board because I could put a little, I'd cut out pictures and I could see how close it really was scale wise. I guess I won't tell this story on here because I don't know if I should. What one? But Dominique Mochianu had a sister who her parents left at the hospital. In Romania? No, here. Oh, okay.

What the fuck? What do you mean they left her at the hospital? Because she had no legs.

And now there's a doc on it. So I do feel like I can talk a little bit about it because there's a doc on it. Okay. Wow. I know. You can do that? Just leave a child at the hospital? Well, she got adopted, so maybe. I mean, I imagine, I guess you can say I'm not fit to be a parent. I'd like to give this child up for adoption. But keep this one. But I want to save these other ones. She has like another one too, I think. Oh my goodness. Really sad. Anyway, they found each other though. Oh, they did? Yeah. They reunited? Yeah. Oh, good. Yeah.

And it feels so good? I was going to say that, but it's not the time. Okay. Also, she became an aerialist. Oh, the sister that had been left. Yes, exactly. And so they both kind of like... Found their way to athletics. Yeah, in sort of a similar kind. Yeah. So very nature versus nurture. We love that. Yeah, and it's on the nature side this time. Yeah, it is. Oh, I saw Deadpool. Oh, how awesome.

How was it? I want to say that. Yeah. It was spectacular. Did you see it, Rob? No, not yet. Oh my God. It's so funny. It's so funny. It's so meta. It's constantly making fun of itself and acknowledging that it is a Marvel movie. And yet the emotional parts work when they need to work. And it's also making fun of itself the entire time. So many spectacular cameos. And then the cootie-graw.

Wolverine, Hugh Jackman, he gets that top off and I almost squealed. He looks so good. Oh my God. I do really wanna see it. What a physique. And I like it's hairy, which is kind of cool. I know this is back to back fact checks. I talked about penises last time and now I'm gonna talk about Hugh Jackman's body for the next seven to nine minutes.

I'm just kidding. I'll try to keep it under 25 seconds. But what a physique. Oh, my God. And then there was flashbacks at the end, like all this footage of the beginning, the very first Wolverines and stuff, and all the X-Men. Oh, that's fun. Yeah, that's been going on for so long. Hugh Jackman was so young. You're right. You just kind of lock him into your mind of whatever he is currently. I do. And then looking back, I'm like, oh, he's way younger than me in there. I mean, he's young.

That's cool to be still playing the same character for that one. Yeah, that was one of the jokes in the movie. He's like, Disney's gonna make you do this till you're 90. That's funny. Like right in the movie. Oh, so funny though. And I also didn't know Sean Levy directed it, which that was, you knew that. Great job, Sean Levy. Really, really well done. You've worked for Sean. Twice. Oh, twice. Three times.

He was on an episode of Punk'd. Oh. I was in Cheaper by the Dozen, my first time in a movie. Oh, that was his? That he directed. Oh, my God. He gave you your first movie role. He did. Yeah. Oh, that's really nice. Because we met on Punk'd through Ashton. He had already done with Ashton some big hit movie with Brittany Murphy. Just Married. Just Married. That was Sean Levy, too. I know. I loved Just Married.

Yeah, it's a goodie. Yeah, and that came out right when we did the pilot for Punk. So somehow I met him and he was in the da. And then, yeah, and then this is where I leave you.

Yeah, that's the one I was referring to. Yeah. I didn't know about those others. That's cool. Yeah. It was pretty funny when my kids were watching Cheaper by the Dozen and they just stumbled upon me. They're like, Dad, is this you? I'm like, yeah, that is. That's me. Learning how to do it in real time in front of everyone. Yeah. That's a ding, ding, ding because Jack Black was talking about that with Northern Exposure and some of the other things he was doing that he wishes he could sort of remove from

Remove.

Yeah, because he doesn't feel good about his performance. Oh, performance. Because he was like kind of learning. Yeah, it's rough. But yeah, Jack Black was great. Oh, I love Jack Black. He's so sweet. I saw him on a bird scooter yesterday. Oh, you did? Oh my God, ding, ding, ding. Oh, that's great. It was by Brom Street and at the light there. I just saw someone like tearing down on a bird scooter. Wow. And got closer. He was wearing the same- Tie-dye? Same tie-dye shirt and headphones. I think he lives in tie-dye.

Really quick, because this is hanging out. You weren't there, Rob. You were on the Family Feud. I don't think we didn't debrief on that. No. When was that? It was like four months ago, maybe. Five months ago. Four or five months ago. And who was your team? It was with Rachel. Rachel and you, and who else? Her brother and her two best friends. Rachel Bilson. Yes. And so you were a family member. Yep. And how did you guys do? We did terribly. You did terribly? We lost every round. Oh, no.

I thought you won. No, my buzzer, we lost the buzz in almost every time. Oh, because you couldn't figure out how to. Apparently, the other team practiced and was really fast. There's supposed to be some trick on Jeopardy that way. Like it doesn't work until he's stopped talking or something. There is some hack there. Who was your opponent? Walker Hayes. He's a country guy. Okay. And he mopped the floor with you guys. Yeah. Okay. And who had he brought?

His wife and manager. Okay. What were the categories? Well, my question was, after God, whose word do you trust most? The guy buzzed in and said Oprah. Oh, wow. Not mom or dad.

Well, I then responded Obama. Oh. Oh, wow. You got really thrown. I got thrown. So you buzzed in with the intention of saying Oprah and then you said Obama. No, he was going to say you. The guy said Oprah. So it made me go to like, I guess we're. A famous person. I guess we're naming famous people. You got to be. O'Reilly's auto parts. Yeah. You have to go in with real conviction. Can't get thrown by these other people. They do that on purpose. I got thrown by the God thing too because my family's so religious. I was like. Sure. You were like dealing with some trauma. It was parents.

On there? Yeah. Mom, dad, brother, sister, aunt, uncle. Oh, my God. There was Steve Harvey's inducted in the Hall of Fame for what? Oh. Like mustache. Comedy Hall of Fame. Sure. That's hard. Yeah. And self-serving. Is Steve Harvey the host? Yeah. Okay. Okay.

That's fun for him. Yeah, it is. He deserves it. I like him. One time when I went to a live taping of Ellen in my early days of living here in Los Angeles, big deal to get to go to a taping. You went as an audience member. Yeah, and it's a really big deal. Um...

And, you know, you wait in line, you get to do this whole thing. Yeah, yeah. And Steve Harvey was one of the guests. He was one of the guests. Yeah, and it was fun. And when she came down dancing, did you dance? I mean, I think I danced, but not enough to, I would never want to be on camera. Get the solo shot. Oh, my God, no. So you have to figure out how to blend. Right. You don't want to stick out for not dancing. You don't want to stick out for dancing too hard. Correct.

Correct. I would love when I was backstage at Ellen watching the audience and them finding those great dancers that would pop up and put on a show. They would get so excited. They would. Yeah, it's cute. Such a party. She said she regretted that because it was so painful. Like she did it on accident during one of the early pilot. They shot a few and she danced once and they were like, that really works. And then she was locked into it. It's like a lot of times she had back pain or she got to keep dancing. Yeah. Should I dance on this show when we go to video? Oh, God.

I know you want me to. Okay, I'll do it. I'd rather not, but because you're so hellbent on it, I'll do it. We had to fill out a questionnaire for our new employer. Yeah, we did. And it asked like, what would you want us to know about you that we might not know? And I wrote, I'm an incredible dancer. What did you write? I don't remember that question. I must have skipped it. You might have skipped it.

How many did you skip? I thought I did them all, but I don't think I did. But that must be because I think they know everything they need to know about me. Yeah. Yeah, we both had to fill out this questionnaire and I was doing it and I thought, oh my God, Dax is going to hate me.

Uh-huh. And then you texted me that you had so much fun filling out the questionnaire. I was like, I don't want to fill out this questionnaire. And then I found that I was really having fun doing it. Yeah, it was a real role reversal. It was. Because I didn't enjoy it. You didn't enjoy it. And you love online surveys. No, I don't. Oh, I thought you did. No. You love going on and taking the personality test. Oh, I mean, I love that.

Yeah, to me, that's what it filed under. Because all it got you to do is talk about yourself. Well, I know. Because I was like, what products do you love? I'm like, oh, let me tell you. I love so many products. Let me hit you with it. And like, what are your hobbies? Why have so many hobbies? Can't wait to list those. I know. I guess I was like, I don't want to think about me. Yeah.

Okay. Right now. Okay. Because when we do the surveys, it's to find out about you. It's not to talk about you. Right. And I like that. I don't love to an extent, yes, but that's – I prefer finding out things about me. Well, that's interesting because I think you do. Yeah.

You know, if you were to ask me, do you, well, that's a bad example because I would probably say yes, I have a lot of hobbies. But to have to write down everything and then look at the list and then I go like, oh yeah, I do a lot of fun stuff. Like it made me feel good. When I see it and it's totally, it's the same way in a bad way, like the Hazelden worksheets work when you're getting sober. And it's like, list all the drugs you've tried. And you might think you've done a few drugs, but if you have to sit down and list it, I'll look at that list and I'm like, wow, that's,

Or like when at the doctor, they ask you how many drinks per week. You already know that about yourself, but you actually learn it about yourself by seeing it in its totality and writing. Another one that gets scary when you're writing is that there's a question that's, I forget it exactly, but it's like, what drugs have you used in combination? Oh. And so-

Yeah, there's been some events where it's like, it started with drinking, then I took a couple of these pills, then I did ecstasy out of nowhere, then I'm doing cocaine. And then I look at that totality, like all the things I had taken in one stretch. Yeah. And that's very alarming.

Oh, I did like 15 drugs that binge, you know. Yeah. Hazleton's a recovery place, right? It's a treatment center in Minnesota, and I think it has the best recovery rate. But does everyone in AA take that survey regardless? Well, they made like a workbook that helps going through the steps. So a lot of sponsors will send that to you when you're trying to do your first step or your second step. It's a cool little worksheet. I see. Yeah. Cool.

The big book of alcoholics, Anonymous, which is the only official literature, well, there's some other stuff, but

When they're explaining how to do the steps, there's not a ton of detail on how to exactly do that. So these people have like put into action some, and they're great. That's cool. They were for me. I liked filling out. And I've given them to guys and they seem to. How much do they cost? I think they get downloaded off the internet for free. You downloaded them? I think I did, yeah. And printed them? I think you could like go download right now Hazelden step one or step two. You never print.

I try to really conserve my ink. You're right. I'm shocked you've done this for people. One of my many scarcity things. That's where it'll bubble up. I hate printing stuff. I hate when I see Kristen printing a whole script on the printer. I'm like, oh, my God. We're going to run out of ink. And then where do you get it? You get a printer and then they go obsolete really quickly and you can't track down the ink. Yeah.

I have a lot of anxiety about it. And Kleenex. Yeah. Oh, fuck. Yeah, you do. I put three boxes under my nightstand yesterday because I've only had a dwindling box on my nightstand. I had it in my mind that no one had gotten more. And I've been panicked for like eight days. Why don't you just order more? I do do a lot of that. It's in your hands. You know, I do do a lot of that, though. And then my family makes fun of me because we have a couple thousand toothbrushes and so much Crest 3D white.

Because I'm so panicked. I'm going to go to brush my teeth one morning and there won't be any toothpaste. Toothpaste, yeah. I need toothpaste and Kleenexes. You know me and my Kleenexes. You love Kleenex. I can't live without them. One time you were at a hotel and you were noting that the quality of the hotel was so bad that it didn't have Kleenex. Kleenex, yeah. And I had never thought that in my life. I've never looked for Kleenex.

But I think you've changed me because now when I go to hotels, I look for them. It's a demarcation. I look for them. Yeah. There's all these rungs of hotels. Yeah.

It's like, what kind of linens are you getting? What kind of pillow do you get? What kind of, is there Kleenex? Is the toilet paper like fucking transparent and useless or is it good toilet paper? That's for me a big indicator, but Kleenex never was, but now it is. And now I have Kleenex by my bed. Oh, wonderful. Yeah. Just one of the many ways you've affected me.

Okay. Jack Black, Jordan Peele, Twilight Zone. Yeah. He did in 2019, he did two seasons. As a producer or director or what? He hosts and narrates. Hosts and narrates. Yeah. Okay, great. It was created by Rod Serling. Sure. Back in the 1600s.

No, in 2019. No, Ron Serling created Twilight Zone like in the, I don't know, 50s or 60s. Oh, yeah. He's black and white. He's the original, yeah. He's black and white. Back to the Olympics. Wouldn't it be fun if people were black and white until color TV happened? I really wish that was real. Yeah. I wish life was more fun. Pleasantville. Yeah. Yeah, that was fun. When things started turning into color.

Back to the Olympics. How familiar are you? Oh, you are because you watch Sprint. Do you think Noah Lyle looks like... Don't say it. Donald Glover? I was going to say it. I'm sorry. I was going to guess it. You love to guess. I do. Yes, I do think that. I do too. Yeah. It's like, oh, what would Donald Glover be if he's...

An Olympic athlete? And Noah Lyle answers that. I'd like to stand next to him too. Although Donald Glover looks like an Olympic athlete in Mr. and Mrs. Smith. Wow.

Yeah. That's what you... He's always in his little panties. He encouraged me to try some littler panties. He always wears... He doesn't wear a boxer brief. He wears like a brief. Yeah. And he looks very sexy in them. Yeah, he does. And I was like, you know what? I'm going to... MeUndies has some options that are tinier and I'm going to try them. How'd it go? I've liked them. Oh, nice. And it's all based on him. So... Oh, yeah. He's a role model. Yet another thing we could talk about, Donald, if you came on. Yeah.

Our men's panties. So he was a member of the Actors Gang, and he kind of threw that out there. But the Actors Gang is very substantial. It has a lot of people who were a part of it. Hit me with some alumni.

Jack Black. Beast. John Cusack. Beast. John C. Reilly. Helen Hunt. Kate Walsh. Jeremy Piven. John Favreau. Whoa. Tim Robbins. Tim Robbins. That's the main one. Yeah, he's the godfather of the actress gang. Yeah, isn't that cool? It is. Makes me wish I was a part of it. It's never too late. It's too late. It's actually too late.

Okay, now some other famous alum of Crossroads. Can I pause you for one second? Sure. Because it's a ding, ding, ding. Because Jack and I were trying to think of all the names for cocaine, and he said Devil's Dandruff, which is good. And there's a section of Deadpool where they say probably 50 names for cocaine, and it's so great. And I was like, I wanted to be writing them down. Like, oh, I don't want to forget any of these. These are great. Were most of them new to you? A lot of them were new to me, yeah. Cool. Very creative. Okay. Okay.

famous alumni from Crossroads, high school here in Los Angeles that he went to. On the west side. Very popular. Michael Bay. Really? Oh, I didn't realize it was that, around that long. Careful. It opened in 1971. Oh my God. Okay. So easily accommodate Mike Bay.

Jonah Hill. Sure. Kate. Hudson. You knew that. Okay. I knew that. Oliver Hudson. Caden Oliver. The basketball player. Oh my God. Maya went there. Rudolph. Yeah, yeah, yeah. LeBron's son. No.

No, this is when Kate was going there. They were classmates. Sharif O'Neal? No. Baron Davis? Yeah, Baron Davis. Jessica Yellen. I love her. Liv Tyler. Really? Jason Ritter. Oh, Ritter. Yeah. Sweetest Ritter. Gwyneth. Pimple.

Paltrow. This is school. What of? Treasure Trove. Sam Ohai, too, though. I mean, a lot of it's just because it's L.A. Sam Ohai? Yeah, because that's where you had Downey, the Estevez, Rob Lowe, Trilling. That was of a certain... Era. Kiefer. Yeah, but that... I know. I know. I know.

Sorry, but they were all from Samoa. Also, they were in Malibu, I thought. That is what's confusing. A lot of them were living in Malibu but going to school at Samoa. I don't really understand that. I hate that it's called Samoa. I like it. Santa Monica High School. Okay. Samoa. Okay.

If you lived here, then you would have hated Sammo. That's half of the pleasure of moving to new places is you don't inherit all that crap. Yeah. You know? The privates here are very distinct. I do think people don't understand necessarily the situation. In LA? Yes. That when all these people are sending their kids to private schools, it seems crazy and it

seems very, it is extremely privileged, but it seems like outrageous that everyone's sending their kids to private schools. But the public school system here is rough. Yeah.

It really is. And so I understand this push and pull. Yeah. What do you do? Yeah. In my neighborhood, all the public options, with the exception of charter schools, which is why our kids go to charter school. Yeah. They're in the lower like third of the state testing. So you're a little bit like, well, that's. You're like, are they going to get what they need? And I never had that problem. The public schools in Chicago.

Gwinnett County are fantastic. And so like, there's no never. Yeah. Yeah. It could even be a step down. Exactly. Yeah. Like if you went to a parochial school, it might not even be that good academic. Yeah. Does parochial mean religious? I think so. Yeah. All right. Let's see. Okay. The Harry Chapin song you were talking about. Oh yeah. I think it's called Taxi. It is. I couldn't believe he didn't know that. He didn't know it.

You want me to play it? Sure. Okay. It was raining hard in Frisco. I said, do you want me to play it and not sing it? I needed one more family. You sang it in the episode. Yeah, yeah. The other time I felt really bad is when I sang in front of the German supermodel. And she's like, that's terrible. Heidi Klum, yeah. She was so fun. I know, she was. She blasted me. It was raining hard.

In Frisco I needed one more fare To make my night A lady up ahead waved a flag Me down She got in at the light Oh where you going to My lady blue It's a shame you ruined Your gown in the rain She just looked out The window She said sixteen Pops I've paid for

Something about her was familiar. I could swear I seen her face. But she said, I'm sure you're mistaken. And she didn't say anything more. It took a while, but she looked in the mirror. Then she glanced at the license for my name. A smile seemed to come to her slow.

I promise I'll stop after the chorus. No, I want to hear it. Oh my gosh, they're autobiographical. It's a hundred. A hundred minutes? It's a hundred minutes.

That's the song. I can't believe he didn't know. I mean, it's that and Cats in the Cradle for Harry. Right, well, we also were confused about that a little bit. Who was? All of us. Really? Cats in the Cradle and Silver Spoon? We know it, but we didn't... You didn't know it was Harry Chapin. Right. Yeah, maybe that's common. And then, because remember, because he said, didn't it get popular with it from a 90s band, which I looked up. Oh, no doubt. No, it's not. Okay, we are safe. Do it again.

- There's a band that sounds just like-- - Ugly Kid Joe. - Oh, Ugly Kid Joe. - That's who it was. - That does not sound like No Doubt. - Ugly Kid Joe, 1992, included a cover of the song Cats in the Cradle. - Yeah. But did I tell you that during the sleepover with the six kids, I discovered that one of Lincoln's playmates, this girl, she loves Cats in the Cradle, her and her dad. And then so I put it on the Sonos in the kitchen.

And Lincoln came down and me and her friend were singing the song, "We Both Know the Lyrics." And I don't think she liked it. Yeah, I think she's like, "Why does this girl know a song my dad knows and I don't know?"

I mean, I'm really projecting probably, but I- Well, you know if she's unhappy. Because she and I know all the same songs. I think she was just a little bit like, what's going on here? Did she say anything? It felt like a violation. No, it's just a vibe I got. I was like, I think she doesn't like this. I wouldn't have liked it. Can you imagine if you came downstairs and Ashok was singing with one of your friends? Yeah, I'd be like, the fuck? That would just never happen, right? Who are you? Go back into your office.

But yours would be more unique because how many songs did you and your dad share? We shared a song. What one? We shared... Oh, I didn't even know Ashok liked music. Does he? Yeah, he's a person. Seems like such a waste of time. Like music, what a frivolous... We went in the car when he would take me to daycare, I guess. To your grandparents? No, I guess it was daycare or school or something. He would play on a tape...

I got it on cassette tapes. What is the song? Oh, boy. Something about a rainbow. No, I Can See Clearly Now. I can see clearly now the rain has gone. Yeah, we played that a lot. And when you guys sing out loud, it's going to be a bright, bright.

I think we sang silently in our head. But we played it. It was our song. An Indian sing-along? Yeah. How do you know an Indian sing-along? Because you can hear yourself breathing. No, Indians are very jovial. You remember that. I know. I was there. You were there. They're living out loud just like those Italians. Yeah. But yeah, that was our song. I'm going to send it to them. No.

Oh, no, that's a betrayal. He might be mad if I was like, I played that song for dad. That's our song. Yeah. I hate music. This is why I don't like music. It's so frivolous. I could have built five buildings in the time that. Also, we would listen to Clark Howard.

What's Clark Howard? Clark Howard was a local. Sports comedy. Not sports. Kind of like NPR. Oh, yeah. Okay. Oh, my God. My dad would listen to it nonstop. Yeah. And I hated it. That makes sense. I have your dad very much as a talk radio person, not a music person. But music in the morning. Any moment he could be getting more information that he wouldn't be would be a waste. That's true. But music in the morning for his baby. Yeah.

Oh, you make an exception. Yeah, I wonder if he was like Paul Harvey. Do you remember Paul Harvey? Paul Harvey was great. He gave the news and he was kind of nationally syndicated and he was a real playful guy. Paul Harvey. It was Clark Howard-

Can you see if Clark Howard was- Was real? Like a personal finance guy. Oh, your dad was- Like a Dave Ramsey. Learning how to invest. Maybe. Okay. It was so boring. Oh, I bet. Do you think anyone in the backseat of their parents' car getting driven home from school- Oh, that'd be fun going, well, I hate this. Yes, they are listening. Do you hear her that you trust her? Well, trust me. This sucks.

Put on Rainbow. I hate this. Rainbow song, please. Play Rainbow song. Okay. All right. Love you. Love you.

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