Shownotes Transcript
This is the Ramsey Show. It's where we help you win in your life. Winning with your money.
winning in your work and winning in your relationships. The phone number for you to jump in to get coached up is 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Alongside the incomparable, the fabulous, the fantastic Rachel Cruz, I am Ken Coleman, and we are here for you. Thrilled that you're with us, America. Let's get to it. We're going to go to Sky, who's joining us in Salt Lake City, Utah. Sky, how can we help?
Hi, so I was calling in because I was involved in a romance scam probably about four or five months ago and it ended up getting me into like $45,000 worth of debt. Oh no. Sky, what happened? What do you mean? Was the person fake? Like it was like an internet thing? Yeah.
Yeah, it was an internet thing. So I don't know. It was like over the course of several months, like nearly a year that I was catfished into believing this person was real. And it was weird because like he would do FaceTimes with me and it seemed like the same person every time. And it was like, it didn't seem fake to me, you know?
And to me, it was like we were setting up a life together. And so I ended up spending most of my money to this guy. And it's weird how it can happen to anyone because I'm pretty young and I didn't recognize this as being a normal thing.
So, Scottie, I don't want to bring up all this pain, but I do think you just said something that I agree with, that this can happen to a lot of people. And without going into the entire detail of it, what were you being asked to send money to him for? I'm just curious so that people can hear this. Yeah, like his bills, like what was he asking money for? Yeah. Yeah.
Um, so it was more so like just to set up a life together. It wasn't really anything particularly like, it didn't seem like anything crazy. It was like, Oh, well we should get a house and we should get like things going. And so you sent him money for a down payment on a home. It wasn't necessarily that, but it was just like a co a collection of like things. It wasn't just one specific thing.
I don't want to say like one specific thing. It was like a whole bunch of like little things that combined to be a lot of money, you know?
Okay. All right. Man, I'm so sorry. So sorry that happened to you. Yeah. So how can we help today? So I guess my question is, is how do I get in touch with the right people to fight this? Cause it seems like I take it to the police station and I take it to people who are supposed to know how to handle these situations and supposed to know how to help. But it doesn't seem like anybody is like, well, sorry, this happened. Sucks to be you, I guess.
Yeah. Well, there's a reason why you're getting those answers. So you went to all those authorities and that was pretty much the answer? Yeah. Well... That and he stole my identity too. Like, he's been hacking into my bank account and stuff with it and opening like random cards. Still? I have a person down in Georgia who's using it for unemployment. Right now? Yeah. And they told me S-O-L. Okay.
Okay. Well, I mean, that end we can help with the identity that the money that you've paid some random person, it's gone. Yeah. I mean, it is, Sky. There's not like a legal battle to be fought. There was not a contract in place. There was nothing that's going to hold ground in court. It's just you made a mistake, a $45,000 mistake. And I'm so sorry for that. How old are you, Sky? Okay.
I'm 21. Okay. Okay. I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. He totally, yep, picked you out, knew what he was doing, and yeah, you got scammed. Did you learn anything from this guy?
I think I learned a lot from it, actually. Good. Yeah. Okay. So on the other end, though, your identity being stolen, now that's a separate... You can do something. Yeah, there's something there that you can do. So I would go in and freeze, pull all your credit reports. You can do this for free at all the three different credit bureaus. So you can just go online, Experian, TransUnion, any of those. Pull your credit report and see a detailed list of your credit, okay? Mm-hmm.
And then you can freeze your credits so no one else can be taking money out of your name. Now, the unemployment, Social Security, that gets into the government side of your identity. Right. So there's a there's a whole IRS situation there that you would have to untangle as well. So do you have family that like your parents and stuff? Where's where are they?
So I'm actually living with my parents right now. Okay, what are they saying about all this? Is your mom and dad helping at all detangle this or do they know about it?
They do know about it. And like my mom, she just like last week helped me get LifeLock on all of my accounts and stuff like that. Good. It still sucks because you can't just change your social. And I had him like after I got LifeLock, he called my bank using like a recording of my voice that you know how like AIs can go in and like make voice backs. Oh my gosh.
Yeah, so he did that, and then he called my bank and used my social and got another, like, $300 from my account.
Okay. Wow. Well, I would even switch banks. I mean, I would do some, some pretty drastic things where he can't, where he can't find you in that way. Um, and Hey, Scott, and you may want to contact Xander. Um, they have a great identity theft program. They have insurance, which you're probably going to buy after we get off this call, but even them hopefully being able to direct you and untangle some of this as well from the identity theft side of it. Um,
But yeah, I mean, if I were you, I would change banks completely. Change everything. I would freeze my credit. Yep. And yeah, I mean, and then from there, yeah, I mean, I would call Xander and get some direction on the things like the social security, the unemployment, all of that, because that's the government side of this. But gosh, I, yeah, I'm so sorry. Yeah. And it's just a good lesson for those of, you know, watching and listening that,
We always say you don't give money to people you're not married to. Even if you're dating, even if you're engaged, you don't combine finances at all. You don't pay on each other's debt. You don't do any of that until you're married. And then, I mean, I guess it just has to be said out loud. Until you meet someone in person, yeah, we're not going to. You can't believe you got to say it, but don't send a nickel.
To a person that you've not met. You just can't do that. This is not even the person that's scamming her may not even be a man. You don't even know like all of this AI stuff and all of this. This is very, very,
Very sinister stuff right here. It's getting worse. Well, the fact that he used her voice recording. This is a pro. I mean, that's AI. I mean, like that is, yeah. That's not like USPS texted me. This isn't your garden variety catfish. No, I thought, yeah, USPS. I got a text like two months ago that they lost the package and asked for all my information. And I can't believe that I did it. Because you trust the postal service. It said, have a nice day at the end of the day. Did you really?
Did you not know that? We had a whole segment about this. I wasn't on with you. Can you believe? Did you get scammed? Can you believe it? Nothing's happened so far.
Poor Winston. He must have had to eat a bottle of Pepsi at AC. I had to ask him for his debit card. He was like, babe, my debit card won't go through this. Oh, he went along with it? No, no. My debit card stopped, would not go through on this website that was sent to me by the quote-unquote USPS. And Winston was like, babe, that's a scam. And I was like, what? I fell for it. You got a text from your friendly... You are. And then you look at the email above and it's like 89423 at...
Gmail.com. I mean, it's stupid, y'all. I fell for it, so I'm saying all that to say. Smart people can fall for stupid stuff, so watch out for the scams. They're everywhere. He's speechless. I've never been speechless. I'm going to have to take a commercial break to recover. We'll be right back. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. Thrilled to have you with us. 888-825-7000.
5-2-2-5 is the phone number to jump in. We want to help you win with your money, win in your work, and win with your relationships. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz is alongside. Hey, we're heading into the fall, and it feels like everybody's kind of starting to put the serious hat back on. We had some fun in the summertime. People started to focus on their money. You've got the holidays that are right around the corner.
And it's time to get your money in the right place if it isn't. And we want to let you know about a free live training on Monday, September 16th. This is at 1 Eastern, 12 Central. So I would turn it into a lunch and learn if it were me. You can join George Campbell and the EveryDollar team for this free training.
$1,000 live webinar. You can register at everydollar.com slash webinar. That's everydollar.com slash webinar. And this is the number one way to learn how to eliminate debt is through a budget. You got to know where your money is. The number one way to build wealth is through the budget. And the number one way to get on the same page with your spouse about money is to budget. So budget, budget, budget, budget, everydollar.com slash webinar. It's free. You
Monday, September 16th, 1 Eastern, 12 Central Time. George Campbell and team will be there for you. All right, let's go to Philadelphia next where Jen joins us. Jen, how can we help today?
Hi, guys. So I had a quick question. I'm currently working on baby step number two. And I've been presented with the opportunity of purchasing a property that was my grandmother's and is currently my father's. Unfortunately, he got screwed over by whole life insurance. I was a mock and he's in litigation with all of that. But it was either for my dad's retirement. He sell the property.
Or I assume the mortgage payments and will it inherit it in its entirety when he passes? And he would basically be taking it is rented currently. He would be taking that monthly rent and utilizing that for his retirement rather than the lump sum from the property. No, I would not do that. I would. He just needs to sell it.
Yeah, if there's an emotional tie or something, I think it makes it more difficult. But honestly, Jen, I wouldn't want you dependent upon your dad's retirement. Because if you look up in three or four years and realize, oh my gosh, you know, I want to go and I want to have my own house, right? I want to build equity into my own. Yeah, you currently own a home?
Yes, ma'am. And even with both properties, I would be under the 25% recommended house buying. So the only debt that I currently have is student loans. It is about $45,000, but I was able to pay off approximately $12,000 within getting Gizelle and Tense. Good for you. Yeah, that's great. In the past four and a half months, I have a side hustle that's making an additional $10,000
Um, six to 700 a month on top of my standard salary. Right, Jen. That's awesome. And I, that would be without roommates, uh, either, which is a potential. So that's why I kind of don't want to walk away from
You know, if you're getting a half a million dollar property, the remaining mortgage on the home is only $100,000 and it is already in his living will for me to inherit it in its entirety. And I'm under that 25% recommended mortgage. Is it a mortgage investment or is it truly an investment property? Is it like paying off your mortgage, which is a later baby step, or should this be viewed as...
Well, it would be a second property for you, correct? Correct. Yeah. So that would be, quote unquote, be an investment property. Eventually, yeah, it'll be in your name. So if I were you, I would simplify it and I would have him just rent it out to someone else. You stay in your current home and I would keep living there. Let him do his thing with the home, with your grandmother's home, renting it out. That's part of his retirement. And then when you get to a point that you...
I guess want to move in or, but you can't because you'll always be paying rent to be funding his retirement. So I don't, yeah, I wouldn't do that. I don't pay the, there's a third party that's paying rent. So like the rent is only a matter of, or the mortgage payment on the second property is only a matter of $800 a month. So you won't be living there? A renter, a third party will be living there? Correct. And you're considering that his retirement? He's not making enough on that.
There is our, he has other like retirement, but it is generating $2,600 is what he's running it out for a month. And the mortgage payments are only $800 a month. Okay, but let's run the numbers on that. Let's run the numbers on that. So if I heard you right, he's clearing $1,800 a month before any of his own expenses on the home, correct? Correct.
Yes, ma'am. Yes, sir. And he is still working. Okay, great. So $1,800 a month, and it's not $1,800 a month because, again, he's got upkeep on the house. He's got other things that are associated. So when you take the actual cost of owning the home and you start to amortize that over that 12-month period, he's not making $1,800 a month. So let's just say for round numbers that he's only clearing $1,500 a month.
That's not a large sum of money. I wouldn't even consider that real retirement money. I'm with Rachel. If he really wants more money, then sell it and invest that money. If not, then it is what it is. He's just holding on to it for a little bit of spending money and he gives it to you upon his death. Am I understanding that?
Yeah, I guess I was just thinking about how real estate continuously increases, and it is guaranteed. Yeah, but hold on a second, Jen. I know, but you're getting it in the will, so the value of that property is going to continue to go up. Why do you have to buy it now? Because the other alternative is to sell it. Why doesn't he continue to rent it? Yeah. I think it's just the overhead cost of...
renting it plus the other like retirement. I just, I think he's concerned about his own retirement. Okay, so your current house, what is it worth and what do you owe on it? It's worth $370,000. Okay. And I currently own or owe $220,000 approximately. Okay, okay. And then your grandmother's home,
Which, again, you mentioned something about that being part of his retirement. So he's using the rent and all of that to live off of. Correct? Mm-hmm. Okay. He does work a full-time job, and my mom is still married, happily married. She gets Social Security. So I think he's just looking at it for how can he continue to...
live a comfortable retirement. It's 18 grand. He's making, if my numbers were probably conservative, but he's making $18,000 off this house. A year, yeah. We're back to the same thing of you feel like you got to buy it
But you can't. You're in debt, and you're making a case for doing this, and it doesn't make any sense for you to buy the house for us. It doesn't make any sense at all. Either he sells it, he takes the profit off of it, and he invests it, and that's going to do more for him than the $18,000 he's making over the course of the year. What would he stand to make on selling the house today, the grandmother's house? Um...
$486, I believe was the last Zillow that I had maybe a week ago. No, no, no. What would he make after he sells it? So if it's $486. Oh, $100 left on it, so he'd make $386. Yeah. That money, Rachel, invested over 7 to 10 years, it's just a better play than holding onto the property for rental income. Okay. Yeah.
Yeah, that's what I would do. And I think, Jen, where it gets complicated and where my hesitation is, is whenever you layer these generational, you know, ideas, it just starts to get more complicated. It's just not as clean, right? If he didn't need this money and then
this house he could rent it on the side for fun because he's got his other stuff over here and he's fine he's just doing it for fun and he's gonna leave it to you when he dies so eventually you will get the house you know in 20 years 30 years like you know if you want to keep in the family like all of that is clean but the idea that he's needing this money I don't want you attached to your dad's retirement I gets really messy really fast so he needs to do what's best for him Jen and what's best for him is
if he doesn't have enough in retirement because he's still working, it's to sell this asset and invest it and start living off, you know, the interest gained and run into the sunset and then for you to continue on your path. And if he leaves you money upon his death from this house and the proceeds that he doesn't end up using, then that's great, you know, gravy for you. But...
But yeah, the cleanliness of all of this makes it less dramatic and again, gives you more confidence and control over your own future that you're not tied to this asset that your dad's dependent on for retirement. Quick break. We'll be right back. This is The Ramsey Show.
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Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz is alongside, and we are here for you. 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225. Henry's up next in Tampa, Florida. Henry, how can we help? Hi, everybody. Thank you so much for taking my call. How are you guys? Good. How are you today?
I'm all right. Question for you. Quick and easy question. I mean, not easy question, but I have a lease that I purchased in the last year or two there, but just heard about you guys. The lease is for the next two more years left on it there.
I am wondering if I should ever get out of it, pay out of the lease there to get some money, not necessarily money back there, but pay a lease there. I mean, sell the car or get out of the lease to be able to pay some of my debt. Yeah, it's a great question. What are you paying a month? $1,500. Oh. Oof. What kind of car is that? Mercedes GLE 350. Okay.
Yeah, it's pretty nice. Pretty nice car. Good taste, Henry. You got some good taste. Thank you very much. Thank you. But it's eating you alive and it's not worth it. Yeah, it's not worth it. We got to get it out of here, right? Yeah, I just... There are a lot of... Give us the terms of where you are. Walk us through the terms.
All right. So if I were to terminate my payoff right now, it would be about $60,000 there to pay off there. I've heard you guys talking about it. So I looked on the Kelly Blue Bucket and it's about, you get $46,000, $47,000 on it. Was that private sale? Was that? Private sale. So I would leave you with $13,000 that you would owe, right? Right.
Yes, yes. And do you have any cash, Henry? Not much, no. Okay, what do you make a year? So I make about $250,000. Oh, that's good news. Yeah, that's great. So you would need another car, correct? Correct.
To be able, yeah, to replace it. Yeah, so we've got to replace it. So we've got the $13,000 that you would then owe, and then we've got the cost of a replacement car. But with your income, you can get something decent if you really work on your budget, right? Yeah, that would be my goal because two more years of this, I mean, that's a lot, right? It's a lot.
It's a good amount. Yeah, for sure. So that's... I mean, according to you guys, I mean, I was just, this is the first time I ever thought that I'm broke, but I do have a good amount of debt as well, too, over a million dollars debt. Okay, so tell, yeah, give me the rest of your financial picture. I'm just curious where you're at. So I, student loans, $180,000. Credit card debt, about $70,000. Okay. And then mortgage is about $690,000.
Okay. Henry, you've been living the life, haven't you? Yes, me and my wife. So I guess, let me rephrase that because I know you mentioned total income. My wife is making $100,000, so a total of $350,000. Okay. So I'm $250,000. You guys have plenty of money. You just got to get under control.
Yes. And you know, and that's the other thing too, they're trying to go from that life to hearing about you guys and changing lives completely. I'm like, let's go hard. And I, and my wife is like, what are you talking about there? So, you know, it's definitely different and hard there to actually talk to her about it as well. She was just a budget.
Yeah, totally. And I think, Henry, too, just as a piece of advice, usually when people are in your position, the one that kind of hears, okay, there's a different way we can do this, and you go in and tell your wife, we're going to stop shopping and stop eating out, she's probably like, what the? Henry, what are you talking about? You've lost your mind. So I think approaching her in that aspect is the why. So I am curious, Henry, for you, what...
what has caused you up to this point living the way you have with money, both of you. And then you hear us, which is very counter with how you've been living. What's been appealing about that? Like, what is it in you? That's like, Oh my gosh, I want that side of money. Not what I've been doing.
um, that idea of freedom. I'm like, I'm like trying to talk with you, but I'm like holding my breath and like the heaviness of just owing so much money. Like the fact that I'm like, wait a second. I'd never thought about how much I owe and how much debt I'm in. I have always been thinking about right now, how much I owe for the month versus like when I calculated all after talking to you guys or listen to you guys, I was like,
I owe a million dollars. Like what in the world? Yep. Yep. And so, and I'm like, I can't do this anymore. Especially when the wife says, Oh, I'd love to have a new summer kitchen. I'm like, what are you talking about? We have no money. Yeah, that's right. That's right. So Henry, that's, that's what I want you to communicate to her is I can't breathe. Like I, I, and we hear that a lot. Henry, you're not the only one. It's, it's this level of stress and anxiety and weight that,
Because you don't own your life. Somebody, these credit cards, right? Everything owns you. And it's exhausting. To your point, we work hard and I feel like I have no money, right? When I ask you how much money you have saved, it's like, I don't have it. That's what I'm thinking. We work so much hard, like overtime sometimes too. And I'm like, how do I, and I'm like having nothing at the end of the paycheck here. I'm like, right.
Right. Is this what everyone does? I don't understand this. Right. Exactly. So how much do you guys bring home a month? I was trying to do it with taxes and everything. But when you guys get paid, how much per month are you bringing in, both you and your wife? So I think I'm about $12,000 to $13,000. And she is about $4,000. So I would say about $16,000, $17,000, $16,000. $16,000. Okay. And that's after taxes. Are you guys funding retirement? Yes. Okay.
Wait a second. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. You make $350,000 a year. You do. Yes. No, no. Yes. So total. Total. So I don't understand those take-home numbers. What is your take-home? Yours, just you. Just me? About $12,000 for me.
And you're off of gross. So what's your gross? Your gross and her gross?
Total gross is $350,000. Right. You're $250,000. She's $100,000. And then after taxes, retirement, insurance, like after all of that, right? I just felt like her take-home was really low off of a $100,000 salary. Her take-home only being $4,000. Yeah, that's true. That felt low to me. So I just don't know if you know your numbers. And the reason I'm calling that out is part of this problem is you don't really know your numbers.
Yeah, yeah. Or she's having way too much withholding taken out. And at this point, you're brand new to us. Rachel, explain the retirement should be paused and all that right now to bring in as much as they can. Yeah, for sure. So, yeah. So, Henry, the whole concept, you guys really need to dig in because if you're getting a big tax refund every year, that's money back in the paycheck that may not be shown here. I would be pausing retirement. I'd be pausing everything.
And you and your wife again sitting down.
and saying, hey, together, it's going to be really hard to do this without her. So I want Henry to be as honest and vulnerable with her tonight and just talk about how scared you are, honestly. Can you guys be on the phone with me? I know. We'll coach you. We'll coach you. Probably should have had her on this call. Yeah, and to show her and show her the realization. And the truth is, Henry, for your own mental sake, you guys can't keep doing this, right? I mean, you're going to hit a breaking point eventually. And so...
For you guys, it's going to look different. And so I would sit down with her and just say, hey, here's where I want to go. Here's the goals I want to have. And you can kind of map them out ahead of time just to say, okay, you know, we have, gosh, yeah, almost a million dollars, not including the mortgage, but the credit cards, the student loan, all of it.
mapping it out to say with our income and doing a budget and saying if we just cut everything and Henry to your point this is going to be a 180 from the lifestyle you guys have been living you've been living kind of the high life and enjoying life and it's going to get out of this we always say you can wander your way into debt you cannot wander your way out
And so there has to be an intentional plan. That's right. But gosh, I mean, in three or four years, you guys could have a completely different life, financially speaking. Oh, I think so. And you getting a side hustle, Henry. I would love that. Yeah, adding more income and all of that. So if you stay on the line, Henry, Christian is going to pick up and we're going to give you Financial Peace University for you and your wife to sit down together and
and go through it. It's our nine-lesson course, and this gives you the basics, and so it can be, she can get mad at us, not you, delivering the information. And Henry, I would say this. I think, do what Rachel said as far as your approach to her, but I think you need to show her you mean business by you getting rid of that car. Yep. That will show her you're not just talking. Get it out of here. You're making some sacrifice. And then one of these days, you'll be driving one of those bad boys again, but it'll be cash. This is The Ramsey Show.
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The Ramsey Show continues. So glad that you are with us. Rachel Cruz is alongside. I'm Ken Coleman, and we're here for you. 888-825-5225 is the phone number. And, of course, you know, we're so blessed to have a very large audience, very dedicated, a lot of questions. And we have limited time, obviously, every day, and many times we'll miss your calls.
825-5225. And you leave voicemails, and we want to be able to get to some of those. So we've got a new segment called Sorry We Missed Your Call. And our first one, this is a voicemail. This is from Michelle. So let's go ahead and play this, and we'll answer. Hello, my name is Michelle. My husband and I are disputing what you mean by saving 15% for retirement. He calls it, I have girl math, which he's right. But...
So when you say 15% of the household income, if him and I put together make $81,950 per year...
Do we do 15% total where it's like 7.5% each person, or do I put away 15% and he puts away 15%? Wouldn't that count as 30% for the household? My husband says, no, your girl math is not working. He said it's 15%. That's it. So he would have to do 15%. I do 15%. But I'm saying, no, we have to do 7.5% each to equal 15% for the household.
Anyway, so if you could please answer that That would be amazing I'm staying away from that one I don't want to even touch that with a 10-foot pole On the girl math Yeah, I just think it's appropriate for you to answer And I'll weigh in Yeah, well it's 15% of the household income So if you guys make
$100,000, that's $15,000 that goes into retirement. So in this case, they make $81,000. Let's round it down to $80,000 just for simple math. It's 15% of the $81,000. So you're looking at $16,500 each. Not each. Sorry, sorry, sorry. Yeah, yeah. That's where her math was off. Sorry, I didn't mean to say each. I love how she got there, though. I love how she was like, well, no, it's...
Well, never mind. I said I'd stay away from it. Look what I did. Almost walked right into that one. Fantastic. But no, it is the household income, combined income times 0.15. Keep it simple on the calculator and there's your answer. That's it. That's it. All right. Good stuff. All right. Our next one, this came in from Kevin.
Hello, Ramsey team. My name is Kevin. I know Dave said to, you know, baby steps to work like you're crazy from Monday through Saturday. But, you know, being a Christian, we have Bible study on Wednesdays and like prayer night on Fridays.
And I want to work Monday through Saturday for my second job. I have about $30,000 left in debt. I want to knock it out by God's grace by January or February. You know, being a Christian, I just want to know, is it? Why is this still continuing, working Monday, Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday? Or should I just go work Monday through Saturday until I'm deaf? We then go and start going back to Bible study,
and, you know, play your service on Friday. Okay. All right. I mean, I don't think there's a black and white answer here. It's just the idea that, you know, if depending on how intense you want to do this is how quickly you're going to get out. And I don't think either side of it, right? One part of me is like, I mean, you need a level of like,
sanity during this process, right? I mean, like, I guess some people can just white knuckle it and just do it, which you can. But I mean, if there's a level of you that's like, hey, I'm committed to this thing and it's really good for me and it's helping me in life, you know, maybe you can stick with that. But also, I think you can still be a Christian and not go to Bible study and not go to a prayer meeting for six months.
Yeah, I think I think you're fine. I think you'll go to heaven and everything's going to be OK. And you can still grow spiritually like you. You can do that. You know, all of those things. It's your call. I mean, yeah, Dave is speaking in a generality of saying you work as much as you absolutely can to get out as fast as fast as possible. That that's the spirit of that statement.
But I'm with you, Rachel. Does it make you a bad Christian if you miss Bible study on Wednesday and prayer night on Friday? Those are functions of the church. They will continue with or without you. And there are still other times that you can study your Bible and pray. Yep. That's what I would say. So I'd be careful on the ritualization as it relates to guilt.
But I'm also with you to say, if that really gives you that refreshment of your spirit. Yes, keep it then. And just say, okay, God forbid I have to pay off debt three weeks later because I'm taking two hours on a Wednesday night to do Bible study. You know what I mean? It's your call. So it's not a gray area. But anytime we talk about the spiritual end of this, because this is a big part of Ramsey, God's and Grandma's ways of handling money, right? Our spiritual lives are very important to us.
So I think it is key. But anytime there's like any level of legalism, Ken, I don't know why, I just like shudder. So even with tithing, people are like, oh my gosh, should I tithe this or that? I'm like, whoa, okay. Just the spirit of why God has us to give in the first place. Let's go back to that, right? So in that same concept, the spirit of getting out of debt and being free is
means that you're going to have to work extra. And so what does that look like for you? Right? So tying legalism into it, I don't want for you. I want the freedom to say, hey, God's not going to be mad at me if I don't go to Bible study on Wednesday nights for six months because I have a job because I'm trying to hit this goal and get out of debt. But if it's good, but if it's something that you really feel like, gosh, it's so good for me to stay sane in this process, then all for it. Just say, all right, I'm not going to work Wednesday nights. And keep in mind, getting out of debt and doing what it takes to get out of debt is a biblical thing.
I mean, that is a positive. So I agree. I don't like the legalism side of this. I mean, I grew up in that world. Like Sunday morning, Sunday night, Wednesday night, Thursday night visitation. What? Oh, yeah. I was pastor's kid. What's visitation? It means you're going out knocking on doors telling people about Jesus. Oh, yeah.
Our little evangelism, Ken Coleman. I'm telling you, man. I mean, look at him. I was wearing polyester leisure suits before they were popular. All right. But to your point, in Proverbs, shall I quote? You shall. Give no sleep to your eyes, no slumber to your eyelids. Deliver yourself like a gazelle from the hands of the hunter, a bird from the hands of the fowler. And Proverbs says, if you have signed surety, my son, that's the beginning of that, meaning you've gotten yourself into debt. You do this. You give no sleep to your eyes, no slumber to your eyelids, and you deliver yourself like
Like a gazelle from the hands of the hunter, a bird from the hands of the flower. So the picture Proverbs gives you is that, yeah, you are running from, you know, we always say the cheetah, right? You deliver yourself like a gazelle from the hands of the hunter. Well, gazelles, you know,
from the the national geographic they're they're hunted by cheetahs so like that's the word picture you ever watched one of those proverbs gives us yes i have when the cheetah chases something down yeah it's pretty wild and the gazelle is literally running for its life yeah i mean we hear dave say that a million times but that's like the other day i was actually walking through the living room and i think my wife had a show on for the dogs by the way my wife leaves the tv on for the dogs
Sounds like George Camel. Little rabbit trail. I'm like, George would do that. As if the dogs feel better because there's some type of nature show on. It drives me nuts. I'm not going to win that battle. But anyway, I'm walking through because I got home. And she has the animals on. No one was at home. And the animals are on. And in National Jury, and I saw one of those little gazelles. Yeah. And would you believe the episode I saw? He got away. He did? Yeah.
I was like really happy, you know? So good. That's a 50-50 proposition right there. Rating for that gazelle. Depending on the head start, you know? That's right. The cheetahs get off the blocks quick. But I digress, but the point here is in this situation, I want to come back and say, I think that God honors and or is okay, depending on however you want to look at this, with someone working that hard
and missing times of worship in order to free yourself from that bondage. I don't think he's upset one way or the other on that. I think, do you know what I mean? Like, and I want to hit that again. It's like, there's no right or wrong here. It's like, what do you believe is best for you in your debt-free journey? Yep. That's it. A hundred percent. Or else you're just going to walk around with guilt all the time. And keep in mind,
People who are really serious about getting out of debt deal with a level of guilt anyway. I know that we did. When we woke up to all this many years ago, I was like, man, I feel like such an idiot. What a moron. Stacey, I led you poorly. All that stuff. That's just kind of a natural thing. You don't need any more God guilt over whether or not...
you're doing enough with the resources he's giving you. It's like, no, no, no. The stewardship issue is what's huge. And being a good steward of your money is getting out of debt. Yes. You're not doing things with action that's harming. Yes. It is helping and relieving, which is a beautiful thing.
Here's to all those little gazelles that are going to continue to get away on National Geographic. They represent all of us. I toast you, little gazelle. Good hour, Rachel Cruz. Always fun. James Childs, our fearless leader. Thank you. And thank you, America. This is The Ramsey Show.
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This is the Ramsey Show, where we help you win in your life. We want you winning with your money. We want you winning in your work. We want you winning in your relationships. 888-825-5225 is the phone number for you to jump in on the conversation. We're here for you to coach you up. And I don't know if there's anybody that's more enjoyable to do it with than my colleague. My co-host today is Rachel Cruz. Oh, Ken Coleman, thank you. She's got a sweet, kind spirit about her. Makes me look crankier than normal.
but I'm here for you as well. We're going to lift you up. We want you to win. 888-825-5225. All right, let's start it off with Meg in Cincinnati, Ohio. Meg, how can we help today? Ken and Rachel, hi. It's so nice to talk to you guys. Nice to talk with you. What's going on? So my husband and I have been married for almost 11 years. We have one son, and we're debt-free besides a little bit of mortgage left. Nice. Congratulations. Yeah.
Thank you. A little bit of a relationship question. I'm the oldest of three. I have a sister who is single and a brother who's married with three kids and my mom and dad married.
are fairly wealthy. And I found out a few years ago that on accident that my parents actually purchased the home for my brother and his wife. And, um, ever since I found that out, little things just keep happening that are bugging me. Um,
And I just keep thinking to myself, why are they, they're essentially financing my siblings life and their lifestyle. And I just have had this feeling. I'm not jealous of their lives, but I'm just like in my head, I'm like, when will they, when will they, when will they take responsibility for their own lives? And so I'm just calling to see if you had any advice for me on these feelings I'm having. I've got some questions first. Sure. Is this the youngest?
I am the oldest. Yeah, but you're the sibling that they're supporting. Is it the youngest or the middle? Oh, both of them.
Oh. I've found out things along the way. I don't know if anyone planned on me ever finding these things out, but I have. Are they brothers or sister, brother? What is it? I have one brother, and he's married with three kids, and then I have a sister who's single and lives on her own. And so they're supporting them in every way, essentially? They finance their homes for them? I mean, are they giving them a spending account? What are we talking about?
I do know that they both have a credit card linked to my parents' account. And I know we were at a Bengals game the other day and my sister said, I'll pay for it. And I said, no, it's okay. I'll get this one. And she said, no, I have mom's credit card. And it's just like little, like my brother and sister-in-law will show up. They'll eat all the food that we all brought, drink our drinks, but they don't provide anything. And I'm just like, why are you living? Let me ask you this. I think I know where this is going.
Are you and your husband successful financially? Yes. And throughout... We have about, we're hoping to pay off the mortgage next year. And I'm guessing that growing up, you were also probably the, maybe if not the best behaved, but certainly less drama with you. Is this true?
Very much so, yes. So this is a pattern. It's just, it happened when you were in the home when they were younger. Now that they're adults, it's continuing. Is that what I'm getting? Yeah, yeah, exactly. So the reason I'm digging into this, Rachel, I'm going somewhere with this. I'm going to take a guess, and I'm not defending your mom and dad, Meg. I'm actually very much team Meg here. I think that's irresponsible, right?
It's irresponsible in that it's stunting the growth of your siblings, number one. And it's irresponsible for this very reason that if you can't cover it up and you can never cover this stuff up and it gets to you, it is deeply hurtful to you. And I'm going to challenge you to own that, that it is very hurtful.
Because I think it is. It is. All right. So here's the deal. I have like the strong anger. I feel like it's anger, but I don't always know how to describe it. Oh, I think it's a good mix of anger and hurt. And usually, yeah, I was going to say the hurt. Usually anger, I'm not a psychologist, but so I've read in therapy, is that anger is usually a secondary emotion. So it's usually always tied to something else. Fear, sadness, hurt, like anger.
There's usually a deeper emotion there and it may come out as anger, but usually there's a primary emotion, Meg, and yeah, it hurts. And I want to touch on that. I think it is, why would they do that for them and not do it for me? And I'm not trying to defend your mom and dad. I'm going to take an angle here. Rachel, you just smack me verbally. I'll smack a Meg for you. Don't worry. Meg, you come at me too, but give me 20 seconds on this. I believe that they actually, your parents...
don't worry about you at all. And it is in their lack of worry about you in the fact that they did good with you. They look at you and they go, did good with Meg. And I think they are overcome with guilt. Meg's fine. And I think they're overcome with guilt about the other two. And so they're trying to fix Meg.
what they feel they messed up. This is a take on this. This is a hot take. Sure. And as a result, they don't see how this could come across to you. They're not even thinking. And I don't think they, it is not that they love you less than the other two. I actually think it's what I just said. I think that's what's going on. And so I say all that to say this, I think if you can get to a place of understanding that mom and dad are dealing with their own guilt and trying to fix some stuff that they can't fix and actually make it worse. Yeah.
that they are weak. They have a deficit here on how they're supposed to handle these other two siblings. And I hope it'll allow you to forgive them a little quicker and to understand that your mom and dad are operating from a place of pain
and and a place of deficit and i think they're trying to fix it that's my take yeah i think there's a level of them that probably feels still a level of responsibility that if their kids aren't okay we're going to still step in and help and that comes out of a really unhealthy place right they're doing it and with unhealthy patterns that's not good for their adult children but that's the that's the route they've chosen to live right and and yeah not to like psychoanalyze you meg but
But I have the same birth order. Sister, sister, brother. My family and my current kids. And I just even know about the textbook oldest daughter. There's kind of that whole family archetype. The idea that
you know, they're, they're probably seen the least. And I mean, that's how mine is. I mean, my Amelia, she's just quiet kind of off to the side. My middle's insane. Like I was, and then we have a little Charles, but I'm, you know, but the idea is that you're not, but, but I think Megan kind of goes back to all of this and we could be off on this, but truly it's like you were responsible even from a kid, right? A kid, you know, an age of a child taking care of yourself and doing what you need to do. And, and,
And now you're like, does anyone see me? Right. And there's probably a feeling that when you were a kid, does anyone see me? And now you're like, are you kidding me? Like,
Does anyone see me? And it's not that you probably just want all this money. You don't want your mom's credit card. Even if she gave it to you, Meg, you're probably like, no, thank you. But it's just the idea. You just feel neglected in a sense. Like we're like, oh my gosh. But I want to encourage you. And everyone else is in a secret that you're not. So I don't like that, Meg. So if I were you, I would communicate that to your parents. I would sit down and say, hey, I'm hearing this. And just out of communication that I know that there isn't secrets and things being swept under the rug as a family. Which is true.
Will you just tell me what all you've done? And I don't want you to not say, but just, hey, I want to know about all of this because that's fair from your family dynamic, I think. I like that. And let me encourage your heart, Meg. Meg, listen. Okay, go ahead. Because we're going to break, so I just want to tell you this. Sorry, Meg. Sorry, Meg, but listen. They do see you. Rachel's calling this out. I think she's spot on. But I want to tell you, they do see you. They actually hold you in a level of high esteem. They're trying to help the other two get where you are.
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Download every dollar for free on the App Store or Google Play. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz is alongside, and we're here for you. 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225. We're taking your money calls. We're taking your work and income-related calls today, and then we'll weigh in on some of those relationship issues around money as well. Gentry is now on the line in Wichita, Kansas. Gentry, how can we help?
Hey, excuse me. Thank you for taking my call. Um, my question is about, um, buying a house. Um, we've been renting our home for six years, um, have a really good landlord and community and, and love our home. But, um,
Just renting doesn't seem like the best long-term strategy. We even got a pre-approval and looked at some houses with a realtor, and it was just like any house that felt like we could afford it seemed like a gamble. In what way? Just...
Things that are going to need fixed over time, major issues with the house or just they all, it was just, I'd walk into a house, it's like, I'm not going into debt to live in this, like, does that make sense? It does. How much money do you all have saved for a down payment?
Not a lot. I mean, not, we have like $3,000 in the bank and they've kind of just stayed at that point for a long time. We'll save some money and then, you know, like saving for a down payment has been very hard to get. What's the most you've ever gotten accumulated for a potential down payment?
We had about $8,000 a couple years ago, but now we have about three. What did you do with the five? Well, if I'm 100% honest, I probably haven't been the best budgeter. We've got two kids. Listen, no criticism here, but your whole setup of your question gets down to
Do you really want a home? And I think you do. Is it the best long-term strategy? The answer is yes. You identified that in the setup of your question, but you guys haven't done what it takes. So what you've done is you've now created a narrative, which is we can only get this type of house based on where we are now. And that type of house has got all kinds of fixer-upper risk, and you're correct on that as well. But you've created a false choice. Either keep renting as we have,
Or we buy something that could be a bit of a money trap as opposed to going, all right, if we change our lifestyle and we get really serious and serious could be a second job, could be radically changing our budget. And we begin to save instead of 8,000 over six years, we save 8,000 a year.
And let's say in five years we got 40,000. Does that change the equation on the type of house we're yet? But I think you've just got to, you're missing intentionality is all this is. I just see that as the bridge from where you are to where you want to be. Yeah. It just doesn't sound like a goal, but you're motivated to even save for it. Right. Is that right? Yeah.
Yeah. Well, yeah, I guess another thing that maybe I just need to get this other, I don't know, I guess your input would be good. So my in-laws have, I think this is kind of what's hung me up on just, okay, we, we buy a house. So my in-laws and we have a great relationship with them. They have farmland. They've told us that, you
We're welcome to be out there, and we've looked into trailer homes and shed homes and different things like that because that's where we want to be permanently eventually out on the family farm, but that's just...
I don't know if that's even like, if I should just get that, trying to do something like that now, or if I should just put that way on the road and buy a house. Let's come at this another direction. What's your household income? About $70,000 a year. Mm-hmm.
And how much of a house, realistically, would you like to build? Forget shed houses and all these other nonsensical things you just laid out. Those are horrible. It's going to go down in value. What would be a reasonable number that you would love to have? What kind of house in your area, you know the market better than us, on that land, long term? A lot. To build a house on that land? Yes.
I mean, it would. What's a reasonable? At least a couple hundred thousand. Okay. Yeah. And you can get a construction and all that, but you don't own that land either. So like there's a couple of pieces in here, Gentry, that I'm. It is true. Yeah. I want to sort through. There's female family and relational things involved in that as well. Yeah. And they own the dirt. It's a good relationship, but it's definitely. That's true. I thought they were going to give you some of the land. No? It's complicated. Huh? They're not going to give you the land? No.
Well, it'll end up our land eventually, but that's hopefully a long time from now. My husband's on the... It's not the deed. I don't know. But here's the thing. I don't. Gentry, you're sounding like $200,000 is this insurmountable mountain. Like you just were like...
I thought you were going to throw out $2 million the way you answered my question. You're like, well, it's $200,000. I mean, at a $70,000 income for a $200,000 home, if you guys got your budget and if they got discipline, Rachel, they can get there. That is not a long way away. Yeah, for a down payment on a construction loan and stuff, if you go that way. But I think, Gentry, I think that mathematically, I think what you have to understand is when you
owning a home and you guys are renting and we are not mad at renters, right? We say on the show all the time, renting is a great place to be if you don't have the money to put, you know, if you're not in a financial situation with no debt and emergency funds and all of that, rent while you do that, rent, you know, if you're moving to a new city, rent for a year to kind of see what part of the city, I mean, there's reasons to rent, right?
But long term, the goal is to be a homeowner because that rent check that you've been paying for six years is going nowhere for your future versus it going into equity into an asset for your home and your home expense on your budget. That line item is the largest expense ever.
that you're going to pay a month, right? For most people, that mortgage payment, that house payment, that rent payment, that is the most. And for it to continue to increase year after year versus having a 15-year fixed rate for 15 years and hopefully paying off that home sooner than that,
You've you know, you've lowered your risk and locked you into an asset where you guys that's not what you're doing. That's not your plan. So I would challenge you guys to say, yeah, you've been renting for six years and homeownership. It's just a good piece of your overall financial plan that you guys need to have. I really do believe that when you're financially ready and you don't you're not ready right now. You have three thousand dollars. So you need a fully funded emergency fund. I'm assuming are you all debt free consumer debt? Yeah.
Yeah, I have $20,000 in student loans. Okay, so you got to get that cleaned up first, and then I would go get a fully funded emergency fund. And then your next goal, Gentry, is that... And here's another thing. Having financial goals is getting y'all somewhere. For six years, you guys have kind of just floated, right? I mean, you've been sitting here with student loans. You're like, I think we kind of budget. We kind of have a little bit of money. Yeah, we did.
Two kids in that six years. Yes, which I, yes, totally. I hear you. I hear you. But also we're kind of like, okay, well, we're in a place where we're not in baby, you know, crazy land in our house. And anything in life, Gentry and Ken talks about this so much, but you know, you're not going to go where you want to go on accident. Like you're, you guys will not wake up in 10 years and be like,
well, look, we're getting closer to retirement. We're able to do what we want. This is so fun. You're not going to just wake up and that happen. You're going to wake up exactly where you are today unless things change. And the most motivating thing to change is to have goals out there that you want and to create a plan and do that. So I almost want to take like the stagnant feeling a little bit of you guys financially and just kind of shake it up and say, hey, put some life back into this part of your life and and
and shoot for a goal. And for you guys, getting rid of the student loans is a great goal. You know, saving up some emergency fund, like getting your guys in a good place. And then homeownership will come later. But I don't know. There's just something in that, Gentry, I hope is just kind of motivating because I think you guys can do great things. Yeah. I think you've got to believe that you can get there. And I got news for you. If you think you just got out of crazy town with the kids' age, wait till they get to middle school and high school.
You don't even know crazy. It's crazy town in all caps. I say that to say life is going to happen to you or you are going to happen to your life. And I'm encouraging you. I'm not upset at you. I just think it's that. Turning that dial to we're going to happen to our life.
And we're here to help on that and get out of debt. So hang on the line. Christian, let's get a one session, our gift to them with a financial coach just to help them get that budget set in some real direction and some extra motivation. I think that'll help. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, guys. Dave Ramsey here, and I got a big announcement. I'm coming to a city near you live on the Money and Relationships Tour with Don
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Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. So excited that you are with us. We're here to help you win with your money, win in your work, and win in your relationships. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz is with me this hour. 888-825-5225. It's time for our Ramsey Show question of the day brought to you by YRefi. YRefi refinances defaulted private student loans and builds a custom loan based on your ability to pay.
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Today's question comes from Natalie in Rhode Island. She says, my husband's job awards company stocks as part of his compensation package. The problem is that their stock has a lifetime history of negative returns. Oh, gosh. When the stock's best after three years returns,
We sell them because we know that they are bad investments and we don't do single stocks. Do you have any tips on negotiating salary to include more cash and no stocks? He makes about $100,000 a year and receives an additional 15% in stocks. And that portion of his compensation isn't available until three years have passed.
How should he go about negotiating cash instead of stocks that we have to wait years for them to process and they're always at a loss? This is just a good old-fashioned conversation to say, okay, here's the reality. As I look at these numbers based on the stock and here's what it looks like, are there alternatives to the compensation plan?
You just got to ask. You don't demand. I can tell you that. My guess is that this is just a part of their deal and they're going to look at you and go, well, you know, we plan for this to happen and this and that and this happens. So I think what you have to do is you go in and you ask a lot of questions. And to the extent that you can always put your leader in a position that you are occupying by asking questions, right?
you know, hey, what would you do if you were me? I'm stuck and hung up on that a massive part of my bonus is a negative stock price. And this is just what I'm going through psychologically. And you know more about it than I do. Maybe you don't. You're my leader. What do you think on this? Because I can tell you this, in this situation, I doubt that this is the person directly responsible for this. Sure, yeah. So what you want to do is you want to be heard.
And the only way to be heard is to be asking questions so that it's very obvious what your emotions are and what your thoughts are without demands. That's all you can do in a compensation situation like this. Now, it would be very different. My advice would be different if it was, I don't think I'm paid fairly.
Then you got to go get market research and you come in and again, same kind of posture. Hey, what do you think about these numbers? I did this research. In this case, this is a company policy. It's how they pay. So you got to raise your hand and not raise an alarm. And that's the only way I know how to do that is through some thoughtful questions. Here's how I'm feeling about this.
Is this a long-term strategy? Is this how it's always going to be? What do you know about it? Yeah, yeah. And then when the leader doesn't feel like they've been put on kind of blast or put in a position where they're in a situation where they don't want to say something that is looked at as... Yeah, you don't get to the right person, right? Whether it's HR or whoever's doing that. They've got to be careful, too. They don't know what you're going to say. So it's one of those deals where I don't think you've got a lot of wiggle room, not knowing any more than what's on the paper here.
uh, if you're not happy with the answer, you're looking for a much better compensation situation somewhere else. Yep. For sure. And if you love the job, but you just hate that part of it, then I would do exactly what you guys do. And after they've asked after three years, cash them out, put them somewhere else to actually make a return and call it a day. Yeah, that's right. It's good. Brandon is up next in Orlando, Florida. Brandon, how can we help today? Hey guys. Uh, my question has to do with single stocks as well. Um,
So, uh, what I did is probably about five or six years ago, I invested maybe like 40 grand in Robin hood stocks, um, single stocks. And, uh, I think two or three of them, uh, went bankrupt and I had about 14,000 in those stocks combined. So they're,
They're at zero now. So I got in touch with the SmartVestor Pro and took some of the money out from my Robinhood that was doing good and that I made profit on. And so my question is, if I have some stocks still left in Robinhood that are like bigger companies, I'm not really afraid of them.
going under. And I don't know if I should leave them in there to hopefully recoup back some of that loss or just take everything out and put it into the mutual funds that I had set up.
Yeah, I mean, I always, I don't own any single stocks, Brandon, because it's just this concept that all your eggs are in one basket and it's what you experience. I mean, the worst of the worst is what you experience of you put your money in and you lose it all because it was all just in one stock. So, yeah.
The idea of diversification, it's boring. It's probably not as exciting, but it lowers your risk. And over time, I mean, we see over and over again, whether it's the S&P 500, the Dow Jones, I mean, it's that 10 to 12% return that you're going to get
Again, where your money is mutually funded versus that single stock. So if I were you, Brandon, in your shoes, yes, I would take money out of Robinhood. That's one reason I don't care for Robinhood is because it makes the average person feel like, oh my gosh, I can do whatever I want with investing. And they put their money in, $14,000 and...
don't realize the risk or know what's going on and then they lose the money. So our investing advice overall, Brandon, is not the coolest, flashiest, most exciting advice that you're going to hear. It's pretty boring.
But it works every single time. So I would put my money, which it is, in a good mutual fund, even in an index fund if you want to do that, like a Vanguard kind of account. You could look into something like that too if you wanted, but the idea of diversification is really key. And so that's what I would personally do. How much are you making a year in general with your salary and everything? Probably about $85,000. Okay. Do you have debt? No.
No, no debt. No debt. And do you have cash savings? Just liquid if you need it? Yeah, I have...
I have enough in like a high yield and then just a regular savings account. Okay, great. Yeah, I mean, the only time, Brandon, I would... And I put crypto in this. I put single stocks in this. I put gambling and a good game of craps in Vegas in this. Like there is a section that once you're debt-free, you have a fully funded emergency fund. You're funding retirement, 15% of your income. Like, you know, you're being wise with 98% of your money. If there's a little bit on the side that if you want to just...
gamble it away is literally what that is. You can't, right? And if you lose it, it doesn't, it didn't take you out because everything else is fine. And again, this is after you're funding retirement and you're doing what you need to do with money. If there's like a little bit of money on the side that if it burns in the middle of the floor tomorrow, it doesn't change your life and you want to kind of play around with stuff, that's,
At that point, that's where I'm like, yeah, that's where crypto comes in or single stocks or gambling. You're like, whatever you want to do just for fun. What do you still have in those single stocks that you still have money in robbing it? How much is that? It's about 20 grand. And on my total returns, I'm down about 9,500 now. So I've made some back, but I don't know if it's going to make it. And you're saying those single stocks of the 20 grand, they're in large companies. Yeah, larger than what I lost money on, on the smaller ones.
I mean, again, you've already talked to a smart investor pro. I'm pretty sure I know what they told you in this situation. I know what you're feeling. You're kind of going, man, sure would like to get back to at least break even. And let me ask that question. Let's say you got back to break even tomorrow. What would you do then? I'd take all the money out and put it in my pocket.
a mutual fund i'm not a lawyer but i would love to play one on tv and that was my best leading question there and so if that was if that's what you do tomorrow that's what i do today okay makes sense yeah yeah thank you yeah not trying to trap you there
I think Dave would have yelled at me from Scotland talking about crypto and gambling and all of it. I laugh all the time because I always say that, and I believe that. But if there's a little part, if you're doing everything else and you want to go just do what you want to do with it, do it. I think that holds up. And I have him in my ear being like, why would you choose to lose money? So, America, I'm just saying that for safe cards. You know what my response to that would be? It'd be like, have you ever played at a great craps table? Because kid, I have.
And it's fun. It's fun. Especially when they get hot. You're right. If somebody gets hot, everybody's having a good time. And if it's in the blow envelope, I don't know what the problem is. I'm there with you, Rachel. Maybe I won't be in the doghouse. This is the Ragey Show. Listen, the housing market is crazy. And if you've been on the internet, here's the sentiment. Affording a home is impossible and you're doomed to be a renter for the rest of your life. Right? Wrong. George Campbell here. Listen.
Listen, finding a home you love within your budget is possible, and I'm excited to help you get there with our brand new course, How to Buy a Home You Can Actually Afford. From saving a down payment that fits your budget to making an offer that sellers can't resist, we'll cover it all. So if you're ready to seal the deal on the right home for you, take the course at ramsaysolutions.com slash course. That's ramsaysolutions.com slash course.
The Ramsey Show continues. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz is with me. We're here for you. 888-825-5225. We were just in a meeting the other day, Rachel and I were. And boy, oh boy, the Live Like No One Else cruise is on its way. I feel like the boat is on its way. Set sail. We are. Captain...
I'm going to call you Captain Cruz the entire week. It's going to be great. Are you going to have some sort of nautical style going on? You're always recommending clothes on the old Insta. I see you with some type of nautical flair. Look, everybody, I got this dress at Walmart for only $7.47.
And it's on sale. Hey, it's going to be a lot of fun. I might wear some nautical-themed clothing. I promise you that right now. The Live Like No One Else cruise is almost sold out. 90% of the cabins are booked. You don't want to miss this chance. This is for baby step four and up because you can do it.
And why would you do something like this? Like minds, you know, like values, having a good time. You can afford it. We're going to be going to Turks and Caicos, St. Thomas, Puerto Rico, and the Bahamas. And I'm told you don't need a passport. So if some of you are like, I don't have my passport. I don't want to have to deal with all that junk at the post office. You know, you don't have to have it because we're American port to American port, I'm told. I don't even know if I said that right, but you don't need your passport to
All food is included. It's going to be the pools, the hot tubs, all kinds of fun stuff, and pickleball courts. If you're a pickleball enthusiast like I am, I challenge you. By the way, it's on my desk.
Oh, you should bring it next segment. I didn't bring my trophy. All right, next segment, I'll bring the trophy. He got a trophy, yeah. By the way, for those of you who have not heard, I won the first, hopefully it's an annual Ramsey Personality Pickleball Tournament. I won. George Campbell and Rachel Cruz were the first opponent for me and my brand leader, Damon Gallad, and we dispatched of them within eight minutes. It's the quickest pickleball game in recorded history. But when you spin the little ball, it's very difficult to hit.
That's all I'm saying. So Rachel doesn't like it when anybody hits the ball with any spin. It's not fair. You can't hit a ball and not spin it. Do you want me to show? I can demonstrate. You just hit a ball without the spin. But that's your problem, not everybody else's.
But I digress. Here's the cruise dates, March 22-29, 2025. March 22-29, 2025. All the Ramsey personalities, Trey Kennedy, great comedian, Stephen Curtis Chapman, Manit Shohan of the Food Network, Deanna Carter, the legendary country music star and more. Ramseysolutions.com slash cruise. Ramseysolutions.com slash cruise. I'm going to teach you how to spin the ball. I was going to say, all the food's included. It's going to be a really fun time so you don't have to be in the kitchen.
literally and on the pickleball court. Oh, I see what you did there. She's got jokes. I am going to teach her how to hit the ball with some spin. Then all of a sudden you'll be pro spin. There it is. Michael's up in Charlotte, North Carolina. Michael, how can we help today? Hey, thanks for taking my call. So I need some advice. Right now I do have $406,000 worth of debt. Does that include your mortgage, Michael?
Yes, that includes my mortgage. Okay. So I have $102,000 in student loans. Okay. $222,000 in my mortgage. Okay. $43,000 on a HELOC. Okay. $13,000 on my auto loan. Wait, how much? $13,000? Car? $13,000 on my auto. Okay. Personal line of credit. No, personal loan, $2,900. Okay.
$8,000 in credit cards, and I have about $24,000 in savings, and that's including stock accounts and high-yield savings and all the different savings. Oh, that's great. Okay, okay, that's great. Okay, hold on. I'm making a list real quick. One second. How new, while she's writing that down, how new to our program are you? So I learned about Dave Ramsey last year at church, and I did Baby Step 1.
I actually taught an SPU class at my church in our group, but I found myself not actually living up to that standard, so I need to take a step back and get my stuff right before I teach others about how to live. So this is fun. So if you were leading the class and someone said, hey, I have $24,000 in savings and I've got all this debt.
and you yourself accomplished baby step one, what would you tell them to do with the rest of that $24,000, that $23,000? What would you tell them to do with it, Mr. Teacher? I would tell them to list their debts on small lists to large lists and start knocking them out. Man, that's pretty good advice. That's pretty good advice. Michael, how much do you make a year? My base salary is $108,000. Attaboy.
Yeah, do you get extra? Yeah, so with bonus around $125,000. I guarantee. And I also sell real estate. So this year I made around $18,000 doing that. Oh, good for you.
I started the year off with about $12,000 in credit card debt, and I was intentional about selling some houses and using that commission to knock down that credit card debt. And I did, but I built it back up. But I'm paying it off next week.
Okay. Yeah. So, I mean, yeah, I mean, if I were you, gosh, I mean, you today with that 24 grand, you can get the car, the credit cards and the personal line of credit paid off with the 24,000. So that's done. I mean, just, you know, speaking. And then, I mean, if you made 145 coming up and let's just pretend, you know, you lived on 75 and after taxes, that's a
I mean, yeah, you got 45 freed up. So in a year you can get the HELOC paid off. And then you got a 102 left in student loans and you could do that in probably two years. What do you, what do you mean? So what do you mean? Here's the, here's the, the, the wrench in everything I just said. Okay. Give it to us. So in July, I went on the contract for a new house.
I have $8,400 invested in down payments and earnings money. $400? No, no, $8,400. $8,400, okay. Yes. So the house's new construction is being built. It won't be finished until next year.
the reason i did it was because i've been paying this he locked um it was originally 2800 28 000 but the banker convinced me to roll win of a debt into the he lot because it will save me some money which it did but when i think about it now i'm paying around 4 430 a month on a helot which is mostly interest and the principal isn't really coming down so
I bought my house in 2020. I have around $135,000 of equity in the house. When I sell it, I'll be able to take care of the HELOC, the car payment. I'm calculating, hopefully I'll have around $60,000 left after I use the $20,000 for the house. So I'm using $20,000 of the principal, $20,000 we're going to
the down payment on my house because that's the principal I paid for the house I live in now. And I roughly have around hopefully $50,000 to $60,000 left over and then I'll still have
I roughly have around like 30 left in my savings. I mean, around 30 in my savings. Okay. Which I was going to use that for my emergency fund. Here's my only thing. Here's my only thing. I'm going to give this to Rachel, but I got to jump in here. What I don't understand is, is you taught FPU, you believe in it enough to teach it, you did a portion of it, and while you were paying off debt, you start this process and then you go right back into credit card debt. So all I'm saying is this selling the house is the easy way out, but I'm just curious how
why it is that you just keep backtracking. It doesn't make any sense. So the credit cards are gone. I know, but my point is you jumped them back up. You told us I paid them down, then I jumped them back up, and you've got 24 cash in the bank right now. You could have paid three of these line items off before you even called us. I'm just curious what's holding you back from going all in.
What's holding me back from going all in is I just don't, over the last couple of years, even the last couple of months, really, I've been having like emergency expenses coming up and $1,000 in an emergency fund wouldn't cover some of the expenses that I think incur such as
Yeah, so Michael, I think, sorry, we're going to a hard break, but I would just encourage you that when you get focused and get all this debt out of your life, it frees up your income and you don't have payments anymore and you're able to use your income to then fund things in your life. So you're just kind of doing it the opposite way and I would reverse it. Good hour. Hey, the rest of the show, you can only get at the Ramsey app, network app. Go get it at the App Store or Google Play.
Hey, you're still here? What are you doing? You do know that the rest of today's show is playing right now over on the Ramsey Network app, right? All you got to do to finish the episode is search Ramsey Network in the App Store, Google Play Store, or just click the link in the show notes to download the app for free. Yep, you heard me right, for free. Then right there on the home screen, you can watch the rest of today's show. Bada bing, bada boom. All right, I'm getting out of here. Enjoy. We'll see you on the app.
