Don't Cheat Tomorrow for Today's Whims
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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, this is The Ramsey Show. It's where we help you win, folks, in your life. We do that by helping you win with your money, in your work, and in your relationships. 888-825-5225 is the number to jump in. We'd love to help you today. 888-825-5225. I'm Ken Coleman, joined by my dear friend, the incomparable, the graceful Ramsey.

Rachel Cruz, ladies and gentlemen. I love all the adjectives. There it is. Every time you host, Ken, I appreciate it. I like a good adjective. I also like helping people out. You ready to go? Let's do this. All right, we're going to take your money questions. Rachel's going to be your money expert today. We'll take any work-related, big or shovel questions. I'll help out on that. And she always weighs in on anything I say, so it's going to be fun, I promise. Let's go to Kisa. That's a very interesting name. Love the names. Kisa.

Kisa from Little Rock, Arkansas. How can we help? Hey, thanks for taking my call. Yeah, so my question is, I work as a traveling nurse right now. In traveling, I make probably around $120,000 a year, if you average it up, working full-time, not taking too much time off between contracts.

I would like to, I'm single right now. I'd really like to settle down and have a family, have children. You know, that's really where my heart is. I don't have like anyone in my life right now that I would,

get married to, have children with. That's what I want to do. I'm also paying off debt right now. I owe like, I think a total of less than $38,000 between student loans and a truck payment as well.

And I'm set to pay all that off by August because I'm putting like $5,500 a month into that. Yeah, I don't spend too much. I'm pretty reasonable with my finances. But my thought is like, okay, should I – because I do want to settle down. I do want to have a family. Should I leave travel nursing after –

and get like a core staff position after I pay off this debt and then start working on, you know, like the 15% into investing and saving for a house and stuff like that? Or should I keep traveling? How intense is the traveling? How much does it affect you?

I mean, I like traveling. I enjoy traveling. I make friends really easily. I guess I just, I don't know, I'm getting to that point in my life, you know, where, yeah, I don't know. You just want some more stability. Yeah, I get that. Yeah, in a sense, yeah. Well, the reason I ask that, Kisa, is because I'm curious how much you would make less, because you're making $120 as a travel nurse. How much less would you make if you played out the scenario you asked us about and now you take a staff position? What would that pay look like?

It depends on where you live. I'm from Arkansas, and so I would think probably if I was to be core staff in a hospital in Arkansas, I'd probably make, I'm guessing, like $60,000. Okay. So I'm curious to know what Rachel thinks, but I'll jump in really fast and say just from a professional and financial standpoint,

Um, if the, if the travel nurse is not affecting your ability to date, you know, and, and, and we, I hear you want to settle down and make social sense, but I also didn't hear a person who's, who's feels like their soul is sucked out of their body because of the traveling. You're like, I like the travel. I just want to settle down. I want to have my house. I want to have my backyard. I get all that. But until we got that, you know, that relationship thing going, um,

And me personally, I'd keep doing the travel nurse. And hey, if I'm traveling, that means I get to meet a whole lot of people and hopefully that life partner. And I would be focusing on my relationships and putting myself out there. It's not a dating advice show, but I would keep stacking the cash, Rachel.

And then when we find that significant other, then we settle down. Because I just think that not only can you knock this debt out really fast, I'd love to see that fully funded emergency fund, Rachel, and then she gets going. What are your thoughts on that? Yeah. How old are you? Can I ask? 29. 29. Okay. Yeah. I mean, I think if you're still enjoying the travel nursing career,

I mean, I would keep doing what you're enjoying because you're going to, after the debt's paid off, like Ken said, and yes, if you have that emergency fund, I feel like that frees up even more options for you. So I'd probably let those be my two goals that are driving me to stay in the high-paying job to get through that and

And then you're going to look up and be in your early 30s and you may say, gosh, I'm tired of this. I'm in my mid-30s and we have friends that he changed jobs because he was traveling a ton. And he was like, I kind of just want to, yeah, I don't, I'm just tired of it. So I do think there gets to a point in your life that you may not enjoy it as much anymore. And then you're going to have the freedom financially to

to be able to say, yeah, I'll live on 60 grand and settle down, regardless of having somebody in your life or not. I would kind of drive my financial goals to keep me motivated to stay in that high-paying job. And then once that's reached, yeah, then you're able to say, gosh, I'm good cutting my income in half because I can. And I want to just settle down more and be in one place. So that's probably what I would do. Does that sound...

around kind of what you're thinking or do you want to just like quit tomorrow? No, no, I wouldn't, you know, I want to like pay off my debts first for sure. So I'm not going to quit right now. But you know, like I think it sounds, I think it sounds really reasonable. I guess it's, and,

I mean, obviously, like, I believe in God. Like, I believe that, like, it's kind of divinely appointed, you know, partnership and stuff like that. But, you know, as a traveler, like, you know, you don't necessarily, like, build, like, long-term. Yeah. I hear in your voice that you want to pay this debt off and then you want to slow down. That's what I hear.

You want to pull back from the traveling. You want to establish some roots. That's what I hear. Is that how you felt before you called us?

Yes, roots. I want my roots. Yes, I don't have any roots. I don't have a problem with that. We're not trying to talk you out of it. I think it's great. I think I would push to get through baby step three, which you just say three, I would say three months of expenses and then, yeah, and then settle down. But stay, stick with this maybe for another year or like, you know, map out, okay, when can I, you know, get this paid off and all of it, but have an end date. So at least you're looking towards something because of what you're really wanting and

Yes, and I'm not one to give dating advice. I haven't dated in 16, 17 years, but... I haven't been on a date since 27 years ago. Henry Cloud, though, I will never forget. We were at a SMART conference, and Dr. Henry Cloud was saying, even though, yes,

we believe in a God that orchestrates and knows our story and all of that it is still our free will to get out there you gotta go fishing yeah I gotta put yourself out there and so I remember Henry saying that he was like you know he talks to people and they're like well I just go to my small group do women ask men out these days Kisa what's your what's I'm I've literally been married 25 years I don't have a clue I don't think so I'm just asking Kisa what's the play do you ask dudes out or you just gotta be what's the how are you gonna get a man what's the what's the strategy she's gonna be her and

And she's going to be awesome. Hold on. And some man's going to be like, Kisa. Do you ask guys out? Do women do this? I mean, I don't. I'm kind of more traditional. Good for you. So am I. That's what I like. You know, people ask me out. Well, I'm going to say this. If you're in Little Rock, Arkansas, I don't know Kisa's last name, but it's pretty unique.

And she's got a great salary. Great career. She's going to be debt-free soon. She's smart. Look up Kisa, all the single guys in Little Rock. Give her a call. This could be great. This is the Ramsey Show.

I've been doing this show for over 30 years and some of the saddest calls I have taken are from situations that are completely preventable. Yeah, and what's so hard is I feel like one of those, especially the ones that I'm like, oh, it's terrible, are people that call in and their spouse has passed away suddenly and they don't have life insurance. When you have to think through how am I going to pay my bills? How am I going to pay my bills?

I'm going to eat next week. Yeah, in the middle of all that grief. Like it's just, it is, it's terrible. So life insurance is the one thing, especially as a mom with three little kids that I'm like so big on for people to get because it's inexpensive. Zander is the place that Winston and I actually get all of our life insurance. And it doesn't cost much because Zander shops among a gazillion different companies. It doesn't cost much. You just have to admit that someday you're not going to be here.

You've got to say it out loud, and you've got to say, I'm going to say I love you to my family by taking care of them and taking the time to put this stuff in place. The cost of a stinking pizza. To get a free quote, call 800-356-4282. That's 800-356-4282, or go to zander.com. All right, America, you can win in your money, you can win in your work, and you can win in your relationships, and the Ramsey Show is committed to helping you do that. So excited that you're with us. We're honored.

My name is Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz is my co-host and dear friend joining me in studio today. The phone number is 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. And if you've been listening or watching just for a small amount of time, it's nerve-wracking to call. We totally get it. We're going to take really good care of you. We're for you. And we'd love for you to jump in today. And let's get some hope based on some practical steps that

that you can take to move forward. The Ramsey Show question of the day is brought to you by Neighborly, your hub for home services. Winter is the perfect time to freshen up your home's interior with a new coat of paint. Five-star painting can paint your walls and doors, even those difficult cabinets and trim. Find a locally owned five-star painting near you at neighborly.com slash Ramsey. And today's question comes from Hillary in Wyoming.

We have had a shift in our income and our mortgage is now about half of our take-home pay. We bring home around $5,500 a month and our mortgage is $2,300. We currently are a month behind on the house and a truck payment, which is $683 a month. We have another car note and a tractor payment. Our $100,000 RV is in the process of being repossessed.

Between the mortgage utilities, groceries, insurance, credit cards, and student loans, we are at a deficit of $400 a month. When do you just throw in the towel and sell your home? Gosh, Hillary, y'all have a lot of stuff happening. I would say, I mean, just to answer your original question, the main question, when do you sell your home? Unless you see your income going up

double and getting back to where it was. Meaning if one of you all has lost your job, but you're in the process of finding one and you think you'll find one here in the next, you know, 30 days, 60 days. But if something has shifted that, you know, okay, getting our income back to where it was is probably not realistic. Then I would sell. And, and,

And again, you don't want to be in a rush with something, but then also you guys need to have a level of urgency about you with these other things. I mean, the truck, the other car, everything.

The even the RV and the tractor, the tractor, you know, if you can stop this, this repossession, if you can somehow sell it. I mean, it's in the process of it. So maybe it's too late at this point. But anything you can do to not have things on your record, right? Like like having on your credit reports, because it's going it's going to ding you in life. And we're not about going and taking out debt anymore.

But in general, if someone pulls that for a job or anything, they're going to be able to see these elements of your life. And so if you're able to avoid all of this, and especially a foreclosure, and that's what I don't want for you. And so I would make the decision to move, again, if you don't see your income doubling anytime soon, and get rid of some of this stuff, Hillary. I'm like, you guys...

Because you can't afford your truck. You can't afford the tractor. You can't afford the stuff. And so selling it, it's going to get you to a more peaceful place when you don't have all these payments. Yeah, it's tough stuff. Before I'd sell the house, I'm with Rachel. I would try to. We have a deficit of $400 a month right now. And so if we can flip that.

Just flip that. My goal would be, okay, now we have a margin of $400,000, then what do we have to do to make it $800,000? We have to make it to make $1,200,000 all while trying to get that income back up. But one of the things we need to mention here is

We're in a country right now that has an unbelievable employment market. We have 3.7% unemployment. Here's what that means. There are part-time jobs, gig economy type jobs that are available. And even if you had a major loss of a job, which sucks, and that takes time to fix sometimes, but going

going out and making $20, $25 an hour. Yes. Brings a lot of relief short term. That's right. Just something to think about. Getting one or two of those. Yes, that's right. It may not be the job, but it's a job. You're making an income. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Let's go to Seattle, Washington. Olivia is there. How can we help?

Hi, I'm just kind of stuck in a pickle. I'm on step two and our monthly income is $4,300 a month and I'm not sure whether or not I should be selling our truck so we can get rid of the $800 a month payment.

or I should cut up my credit cards because my husband is now starting training and we don't have the money in our savings to pay for this training. But after the training, he would be getting a significant pay increase. Okay, walk us through some of these numbers. Give Rachel the numbers. So talk about maybe let's talk about income first, what he's at now and what he's projected to be at.

Okay, so starting pay right now, or his ending pay in this position is $30 an hour, and that's the max he can go. The starting pay on this new position is $32 to $34. And what's the training going to cost?

And the training so far, it's already cost us $1,500 and I had us on the every dollar budget app. So every dollar was accounted for. Um, and so I had a, like, I was thankful that I didn't cut up my credit card, but this morning I was so distraught that I should have cut up my credit card and just tried to figure it out or something. Yeah. You working? And he works, he works, I am not working. I'm a stay at home mom, but he works, um,

um mostly overtime i don't know if you've heard of like the north slope on alaska so that 32 an hour is like a significant increase compared to 30 yeah okay and um how old are your kids i have one child and she's two she's two okay and how much debts you guys have left we have a total or just a car a total

69. Okay. And what is that in? And what's that in? 17,000 on a credit card, 3,000 on another credit card, 5,000 student loan, and then 41,000 on a car. How much? 41? Yeah. Which is just outrageous. Oh my gosh. What's that car worth?

34. That's where I'm really struggling. It's just dropping like drastically. Yeah. There's so many people underwater on cars right now. But honestly, I mean, Olivia, yeah, that car is, is when you guys probably make $800 a month. Well, I mean, you make around probably 55,000 a year before taxes. And I mean, that's 89 before taxes.

89, yeah. Do you have time, and I very much honor stay-at-home moms, do you have any kind of time during the week where you could pick up some part-time work, even if you're doing it from home?

I've been looking. I'm just having a hard time coming up with anything. I don't have anyone to watch her, and I don't want to put her in a daycare. And I've been trying to find something, but I haven't been able to find anything. Okay. Well, keep looking. Be encouraged. You know what your boundaries are there, but any of that will help. And I'm glad you're looking. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the $41,000 car, I mean, ugh.

I just don't know if I should sell it. That's what I thought. Yeah, it's just right on that line. And there's a part of me, Olivia, that what sucks is you will have to take out a probably $7,000 loan to make up the difference.

but that feels so much better seeing $7,000 versus 41,000. And it's a car. And you guys, I mean, you've been in this habit and you said it earlier. So I'm going to just repeat back what you said. You know, well, we just kept the credit card around. Something came up and, you know, it's going to be good for us. So we're, you know, the training and all of it. And I understand how you can like rationally get there. But until you guys make a mindset shift of,

This is now how we handle money. We don't use debt regardless of what it's going to bring to us in the future. Until you have a strong line like that, Olivia, you guys are going to continue to creep back in to these habits. You really are. And so there's a part of me for selling the car

it's kind of like shocking the monkey. It's like this, like, oh my gosh, it just like, it shocks the system of what you guys have been living in. And it forces you to say, okay, we are doing, we are literally acting different right now. We are selling a car that we, that we should never have bought in the first place. We're cutting up the credit cards and we're just saying no. And you have to have that hard line because this whole like wishy-washy way with debt, it

It's going to find its way back in. And you guys will look up and the habits haven't really changed. And so having that hard line, I think, is what I really want for you guys. So, yeah, I would sell the car, Olivia. I would start working to pay off that credit card next to the student loan, then the $7,000 loan that you'll take out for the remaining of the car. And then you guys go and attack this big credit card debt of $17,000 and get rid of them. I mean, I just, I...

Again, when we have the ability to go back in, it's the easiest way in the moment. It's okay. We'll just, we'll just swipe it. We'll just go back in. That's what people find. And when you don't have that option anymore, it forces you to look at other options, which there are other options out there. It may take more patience, but there's other options. Thanks for the call, Olivia. You got this. Focus. This is the Ramsey Show.

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NMLS ID 1591. NMLS ConsumerAccess.org. Equal housing lender. 1749 Mallory Lane, Suite 100. Brentwood, Tennessee 37027. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz joins me. The phone number is 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225. Taking your questions, let's go to Zella, who is on the line in Indianapolis, Indiana. Zella, how can we help?

Hi. Hi there, Ken. So my question is, my husband and I do not live in the same country. He's in Canada. I'm here in the U.S. And we're on board with combining finances, married couples, and marriage.

taking down debts first and not using credit card and all that. But we each have our own debts that we bring when we got married. We're on baby step two, which is paying off the debt in the snowball method. My question is, do we tackle our debt first?

In combination, like do we list it from small to big, like his debt and my debt in Canadian dollars and US dollars combined? Or do I send him money transfer and does he send me money transfer to pay that? Or do we tackle our debts separately? Okay. Because we're not combining our checking account yet because we haven't found a bank that would accept both currencies yet. All right. A couple questions before we dive into that part. How long have you been married?

Six months now. And the plan was to live separately the entire time? No, we are currently working on getting him here to the U.S. We actually have our application now and it's in process in the immigration USCIS. It just takes a while, about a year or two. Even though you're married, even though he married an American woman, it's still taking about a year.

I'm not an American citizen yet. I'm just a green card holder over here. Okay. All right. That's why I was. Okay. Gotcha. Wow. Rachel, I don't like that they have not combined accounts, although you're saying this is a legal thing. Well, there's a logistical thing, I think, when you're working for two separate countries. I mean, yeah, you guys may not find a great solution to actually share a physical checking account together until he comes here. What does he make and what do you make?

financially for him i converted the fee with dollars for his salary is 60k he has dollars mine is 80k and he has about also 64k of total loans debts and i have about 19k in debt okay how long um i'm just curious how long were you guys how long did y'all date for

We only officially did for two months before we got married, but we've known each other since we were kindergarten. Oh, okay. Okay. So you guys have had history. So you knew going into this that you would be in this situation from a long-distance standpoint. You've known each other since kindergarten. So are you Canadian? No, we're both Filipinos. We just migrated to different countries. Okay.

At some point in our life, and we met here in the U.S. What country were you in when you met as kindergartners? The Philippines. We both grew up there, and then our families migrated to different countries. So he goes to Canada, and you go to America. The U.S., yes. Yeah, okay. Are you sending, the way you asked this question, I'm just curious, are you sending money to him? Well, right now, we are currently...

In doubt on whether to pay his loan first or to pay mine first. So I was sending him money. How much? To pay off the smallest. Well, I just sent him $100 this month. It's not constant. Like, just to pay off the smallest debt that he has. Yeah, but how much money have you sent him, ballpark, since you've been married? Uh...

Not much, like $200 maybe in total. Okay, all right. Yeah, $200 in total, I guess. Okay, and this is such an ignorant question. I probably should know this, but your marriage license, when you guys got married, is it...

Our marriage license is here in the U.S. Okay, okay. So once he comes here, okay. Trying to put all the pieces together. So was he on a visa to be able to come over here and get married? A travel visa? No, he's a Canadian citizen now. So Canadian citizens can come over to the U.S. for six months at a time. So he just visits. We see each other one week a month.

Because that's just how the border allows them to come. Okay. One week at a time. Well, this is complex, Rachel. This is a little complex. Yeah, well, I mean, there's a reality that, yeah, if you're in two separate countries with two separate currencies, yeah, you may not be able to share a physical checking account. I mean, that's obviously the goal once you guys get into a place that you're actually living in the same country.

That's what we want to work towards. But since you are married, seeing this as a holistic picture, though, that for you guys combined to look at your income as one, I would take all of your debts and I would combine them and say, okay, let's list out the smallest debt to the largest and

When you get married, it is. You are one in every aspect of this. And so I would be paying off the smallest debt first, regardless of if it's his debt or your debt. And my hesitation when I'm saying all this is,

yeah, for all of you listening, though, you don't do this unless you are legally married. You do not do this if you are engaged, if you are dating. But for a married couple, this is what you do. And so combining, but yeah, I mean, in a perfect world, you guys would be able to

you know, see each other's accounts and you're very much on the same page with your budget and what he's going to be spending, what you're going to be spending. It's just a really kind of weird situation. Being in two, living in two separate countries for what could be two years and you're married. I'm like, man, that's terrible. Zella, I'm sorry to keep asking. You said that you guys are on board. You said that we're committed to this. Yes.

A hundred percent, both of us. So you're seeing progress. You're seeing his budget based on his $60,000. And so you're sending him the money for what? What was the reason for sending him money again? Just to help pay down the lowest, the smallest debt? Yes, so just to help...

So you got evidence. Great. So you guys are on the same page, and we are attacking this thing as though we have the same account and we're in the same country. It's just separate. So if you're doing that, then that's fine. But he's got to be fully on board, 100% on board. Yeah.

Yeah. Wow. Very interesting. That's great. Yeah. Well, keep going. I know. Good luck. Max communication. That's hard. Yeah. Wow. That's hard. I mean, dating long distance is one thing. Being married long distance. Well, you think about how many couples struggle with finances when they live in the same house. Yeah. Yeah. So I think, yeah, just a lot of communication between you guys. Yeah. And yeah.

The reason we would say you don't combine accounts, because there are reasons, there's asterisks to this, right? If you are in a dangerous situation, if there's abuse, if there's an addiction that's not being addressed, if there's reasons to protect yourself, then that's what you need to do, right? I mean, we've even said on the show, there's some spouses that will not...

be on board at all on any level of the same page with money and they go out and rack up all this debt on their own and there gets to a point that like you even have to you know there's a level to protect yourself so like always remember that and so that's why I even said if you're not married you don't send people money because this is just an I mean they've been married they dated for two months live separate countries and yeah you just want to make sure that it is

you know, everything is okay. Yeah. I mean, I don't want to play armchair quarterback, but Zella, if I could have talked to you six months ago, you know, I think I would have said, look, you're in America on a green card. He's a Canadian citizen. Let's think about where we're living a little bit further. Let's, let's, let's, let's play this out here and let's do what's best for our marriage. Yeah. It just causes some stress. Yeah. Just a lot of separation here. And I, and again, this is fascinating to me. Um,

This is otherwise a very nice couple. These are good people. And a year and a half for him to be able to get what paperwork he needs is

In light of the fact that we have people crossing our borders just freely, I just don't understand how the government can't figure out how to help people who are trying to do it the right way. Like, what paperwork does this dude have to fill out to be with his wife? It's the government, Ken. It irritates me. I'm not an anti-government rant right now. I just kind of go, I hate that, you know? Yeah, totally, totally. They've done everything the right way. That's right, that's right.

Yeah. Can we fast forward this, please? I hear you. I know. If you're not a bureaucrat in D.C. or in Canada. Somebody listening. Come on. Help Zella. Zella's husband out. But listen, Zella, in all seriousness, make sure you guys are really dialed in to an online group. Get in a class. You guys need that extra accountability just given the complexities of your relationship. Don't move. More of The Ramsey Show coming right up.

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show America. Thrilled to have you with us. We're here to help you win in your life, specifically with your money, in your work, and in your relationships. All three of those areas.

are really connected. And if you're losing in one of them, you might be losing in all three. We want to help you win. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz joins me this hour. The phone number to jump in is 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. All right. So those of you interested in real estate, thinking about what your real estate strategy is going to be, Dave Ramsey's got a brand new quick readout called

The, what is it? Oh, Real Estate, The Ramsey Way. This is fresh off the press. Like, I haven't even seen this. And look at Dave, million-dollar smile. Just happy to talk about real estate. He's so happy to talk about real estate. We call these quick reads. These are very, very accessible. And this is taking Dave's decades of experience with real estate, putting it all in one short read to help you with buying, selling, and investing. It's only 70 pages long.

Home ownership is still possible. You can turn that home into your biggest asset. It can be done, but you've got to do it the right way. So you can get your copy now at ramseysolutions.com slash store. That's ramseysolutions.com slash store. All right, Kylie's up next in Dallas, Texas. Kylie, how can we help?

Hi, thank you so much for taking my call. I was calling in because my husband and I are at a pretty good stage in our life where we have bought our second property and we are looking to build. There were some circumstances that happened to cause us to move a little bit faster on the build than we would have liked. So our first home is completely paid off. We just have a mortgage on the second property that we bought.

And the mortgage on that is about $310,000, and we're looking to build a house that's about $300,000 on that property. We have a couple different options, and one of those options was to take out a HELOC to cover about $200,000 on our first property to cover the cost of the build because we have about $115,000 saved up to put towards it.

So I was just looking for some direction, but really not sure kind of which way to turn. What's the end goal? What's the end goal? What are you trying to pull off here?

So this is essentially kind of my dream property, the second house that we bought. We're needing to build because right now my father, he is 100% disabled and it was unexpected. So we're needing to have care for him. We don't want to put him in a home. We want to keep him with us. So that's the reason for doing the build now because he does not fit in our current home. It is too small and it is not comfortable.

We've made adjustments as needed. Yeah, it's very admirable of you guys. Yeah, for sure. So the second property, is there a house on it now? There's a mobile home on it, which presents some struggles to get a construction loan. A lot of people don't like that. And the HELOC, they're willing to just give us without any of the red tape. Okay, and why are you keeping the first home then? Yeah.

We're currently living there in the first home and we intend to live there through the build. And then once that build is complete, we could either sell it or keep it as a rental. I prefer to keep it. It's in a great location and it could rent and give us some really great money. How much could you get for it if you guys sold it today?

Probably in the range of like $300,000. Oh, just enough for what you need for the new house. Okay, Kylie, here's what I would do. I would not go take out a HELOC. I would not continue to go into debt when you have an asset like a house. Now, if you guys had everything paid off and you were going to be, you know, you had money saved to be able to cash flow the build of the new house and you wanted to keep this as a rental, that would be okay. But you're sitting here and you're trying to kind of piecemeal all this together where you could make it

Pretty simple. It's not going to be the plan you want, but...

I would sell. I would go rent for a while. I have to while we build. So it may be a 12, 18 month rental situation, making sure that it's enough room for your dad and everything. Right. So you guys will have those parameters. Cash flow the house as you build. And then, you know, the 310,000 that's for the land. Yeah. Then you kind of take that as the mortgage and say, OK, that's then what we're going to continue to pay off. And so I would not go get out a second

I would not go get a HELOC or go around that way. But I mean, that's personally what I would do because I would not continue to go deeper in debt if I don't have to. And you're in a situation that, yeah, you have a great asset of a home. And I mean, I would use it to further the cash flow that you guys will be able to pay this property down quick and

And then you have free, you're completely debt free. You have no mortgage or anything right after that property is paid off. And that's what we want for you. We want you to get to that point fast. And this is the fastest, best way to do that. And, you know, in real estate, so hard because I feel like to the idea of having a rental, right?

passive income, like this whole dream. Oh, it sounds so exciting. And it's great. Like we love investing real estate, right? The real estate quick guy. Like we are not anti-real estate people. We are pro real estate people, but doing it in the right time and the right stage of your life. And for you guys, and here's the other thing, because I, Kylie, we built a home in 2018, moved in in 2019. And I'm telling you, when you have

that you are working with, you stay in budget. Suddenly, the upgrade of the tile, oh, this, this, and this, do we have the money for it? I mean, it really gives you this hard and fast rule because it can be so easy to say, okay, we'll just get a little bit more and the bank will be willing to, you know, we'll, we'll,

we'll get maybe $40,000 more to do some, you know, you continue to uptick. But this really, it's an accountability thing when you're working with it. And what a gift to be able to do that. I mean, that's really how I would look at this. And Kyle, I just add very quickly, you said that this second property that you need for your father

I'm glad you can do it. And Rachel's 100% right. You need to sell the current home and do what she does. Here's why. You would still owe on that house. And now all of a sudden, this dream property...

The whole thing could become a nightmare if you get somebody in renting your house. And believe me, when something goes wrong with the roof or the toilets or whatever, they're calling you. And all of a sudden, I'm a landlord. And you have $600,000. And you're $600,000 in debt. And so this is a no-brainer. Sell now.

rent, Rachel's 100% right. Focus on this dream, this dream property that also is going to be a blessing for your dad in his time of need. Don't muck this up. It just doesn't need to get that complicated because here's the other thing, Rachel, that kills me. And people go, oh, you know, we can rent it. And I always love to do the exercise of, okay, what's the mortgage on the rental property? Do they tell me? And what are you going to clear each month?

And, you know, it could be $300, $400. Oh, so we're going to take on all this risk and all this pain in the butt to be a landlord for what amounts to $4,800 a year? Right, right, right, right. And that's assuming you have no expenses. Yes, that's right, that's right. So this idea that I'm going to get rich. But hers is paid off, her specific situation. Oh, her house was? I think so. Oh, I didn't realize that. Well, everything else I said is true. Yes, yes. But I would use the money. The point is we don't want her to go into debt on the new property. That's right, exactly, exactly. And why be a landlord?

Carry debt, be a landlord is the point. Don't do that. That's right. 100%. It's crazy. People get sucked into that and it's just, there's so much that can go wrong. So hard. Yep. That's nuts. All right, let's go to Chandler in Salt Lake City. Chandler, we only got about a minute and a half, two minutes. What's your question?

Okay, so getting right to the point, I'm a PhD student and I'm studying the skills to be a high-level quantitative researcher, which includes statistics, research methods, programming, this kind of thing, right? My particular subfield is political science and criminal justice. I also work a full-time job in an unrelated field. While it's really hard and I have to maximize my time,

I'm more than capable of following through with this. My question is, would it be a better time investment to drop a full-time job and put that towards my quantitative skill set? In the short term, that would put me in a much less fulfilling and more difficult financial position, but I can see how it would pay off in the long run. When you say more difficult, are we talking barely scraping by?

Or just a little uncomfortable? Yeah, it would be like barely scraping by on a student stipend. You have no debt. Do you have cash? You got an emergency fund? Yep, full six months. What's the timeline? You're the quantitative guy. Give it to me fast. If you do this move that we're talking about, how long am I in this uncomfortable, barely making it by before it pays off and I'm making more dough? The payoff would be about four to five years. Okay.

I wouldn't do it. Not for that long. It's too risky, man. One major life thing happens and you're whacked and it's just, what do I do? And I'm trying to recover. I'd stay in the day job, finish the PhD. That's hard too, but it has way less risk. And so let's step our way into this new future. Stay in the day job. Do not take that risk. It's not worth it. You're trying to exchange time for a ton of risk.

And oof, I wouldn't do that. Good hour, Rachel Cruz. Thanks to Austin, our fearless leader, and the guys in the booth. This is The Ramsey Show. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, this is The Ramsey Show. It's where we help you win.

Win in your money, win in your work, win in your relationships. The phone number is 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. I'm Ramsey Personality, Ken Coleman, joined by Ramsey Personality, Rachel Cruz, and we are here together for you this hour. We'd love to help you out. Let's get it started. Oh, one of my favorite cities of the South. We're heading to Savannah. Savannah, Pennsylvania.

Otherwise known as Savannah, but I like to say it that way. You always love a good city accent. I just love it. Savannah's a great city. Ebony is there. Ebony, how can we help? Yes, thank you for taking my call. How y'all doing? We're doing great. How are you?

Awesome. My question is, I am finally starting to make money and I am trying to figure out how can I finally become financial free? I don't have like anything to my name whatsoever. What kind of money are you making now that you're finally making money? What's that number? It'll be $32,000 a year. What are you doing?

A marketing company, storage clerk for U-Haul. Okay, good. And do you see a path forward with them? I don't want to get locked in on that, but I mean, do you see opportunity for promotion there? I do see growth with the company. It's actually a good company. Great. Well, congratulations. Yeah, that's great. How old are you?

Okay. All right. Good for you. Good for you. Thank you. Okay. So we, you know, at Ramsey, we always talk people through having a really intentional guided plan because that's probably one of the best things that you can do with your money is what you're

what you're calling in for, but it is to have direction. Right. And so part of that is saving. Part of that is getting out of debts, investing, homeownership, like all of that is at play. So right now, do you, do you have debt right now? I do. Okay. I purchased a vehicle. I had to give it back. Something happened to the car. And then I have school debt as well. Cause I dropped out of school. Okay. How much, how much do you owe on the car?

18,000. 18,000, okay. Did you say you gave it back, though? You don't have it? I don't have the car no more. What happened? A company did an oil change and messed up my engine, and unfortunately, I could not afford to get the repairs. They were pretty high, so I asked them to pick the vehicle up, and they came to pick it up. And they're just... Who's they?

I don't want to say the company that did it, but it was a company. Okay, like a mechanic. Yeah, so when I was supposed to be legit, it was a new store, and I went there, and they messed it up. So I'm trying to just figure out really quickly, do you not have any, I mean, what are we doing here? Like, you should be compensated for that. They ruined your car. I didn't know until later on down the road that I could have done something. It was too late.

Okay. I found that the last minute. Okay, but I don't want you to have given that car. Like, I want that car back. Yeah. Because you own that car, and that is an asset. How much will it take to fix it? I cannot get that car no more. It was, car lot has it, and that car lot is no longer available in my city. Okay. All right, so it's gone. It's gone. Oh, man. It was last year. Do you have another, do you have a car right now?

I do not. I'm actually in the process of looking for one that I want to do with cash. Yeah. Yeah. How are you getting to work? The bus.

Okay, great. Yeah. That's awesome. Okay. That's good news. I know. And I don't want to keep harping on this car, but it is $18,000 of debt with an asset that at least if you get and you can't fix it, you could at least sell it for less and try to get something out of it. I don't really know how that happened. Yeah. So we won't stay on that because I want to continue to help you. But I would go back and kind of retrace those steps, Ebony, because again, that was in your name. Unless it was repossessed and you couldn't pay the payment or something like that happened. But okay.

Overall, if you can find out a way to get that car back, I want that for you just so you can even just sell it for cheap and make some money on it. Okay, and then you have your student loans, and how much are those? $13,000. Okay, perfect. And any money saved? No money saved. No money saved. Okay, great. Okay, so what I would do is...

I would figure out, okay, how can I get $1,000 quickly? That's going to be your first starting point is to be able to get that emergency fund. And I would probably honestly do that before you save for a car. I want some cash in the bank that's just cushioned to the side. And again, this may look like,

working a part-time job at night for a little bit, finding if you can sell something. I mean, like anything that you can do to get that $1,000. And I would do that as quickly as possible. So that would be the first step I would do. Then I would probably say, I would start saving for a car. I would have a goal-

to get a great used car and to be able to pay cash for it. And it's not going to be a pretty car. It's not going to be a great car. I'm going to look up some used cars in Savannah. Yes, there you go, Kenny. It's my favorite thing. But it's going to be the best thing, yes, is to get that point of transportation for yourself. And then the next goal would be to start working to pay this debt down and pay off the smallest amount, which will be those student loans first.

And maybe in the meantime with that, I mean, this will take you some time, right? This is this will take some patience and it's not going to happen overnight. In the meantime, again, I would I would circle back with the whole car thing, because if there's any way you can get this eighteen thousand dollars down, it's only going to it's only going to be for your benefits.

So I would look into that. And then beyond that, Ebony, you know, you want to start saving up for a fully funded emergency fund after you're out of debt. And then you can start looking at saving for a down payment and investing. But all that may be a few years down the line, which is totally okay because you're starting somewhere. So that's the overall plan. It's called the Baby Steps. And I'm going to have Christian pick up and give you Financial Peace University, which is our money course. It's seven lessons. So you can watch all the videos, really get

a basic knowledge of all of this and every dollar premium. Because the next thing I really want you to do today is sign up for every dollar premium and start budgeting. So you're going to take this income that you're making and actually have a plan for it. And within that, you're going to be able to see, okay, here's how much I have for groceries. Here's what I have for that. You can go down the list and really see here are my expenses. And that's going to help you save that thousand dollars as well. Because you're gonna be able to say,

you know, I'm going to save X amount a month towards this thousand dollars. And you're going to really just kind of be on that plan. And so I'm excited for you. It's going to create new habits and kind of a new way of looking at money for you. But I think that you're, you're at that point. I could even hear it in your voice when you called in and you were like, I'm, I'm ready to do something. And, and I think it's awesome. Yes. You're emotionally drained. Is that what you said? Yeah. I've been crying. Cause it's, it's, I feel like I've done,

Yeah, that's, yeah. Let me just be your friend, though, for a second. And that's a lot of shame. I should have. I wished I have, right? We all have regrets, and we all, no one is perfect with money. But I want you to be able to say,

Okay, from this point forward, I can do something. And you're only 36, right? People call us at 56. You can still be a millionaire. What you got? Well, I was going to say, if you save about $4,500 to $5,000 up, you can get a decent car. But I would also say, if the bus is safe and it's convenient, I'd keep stacking cash. And one little encouragement I want to add on to what Rachel said, Ebony.

You're going to get through this debt quicker than you realize. And if you start just basic small investing, you're going to be a millionaire by the time you're 65. I hope you hear that because it's true. We're going to guide you. You can do it. Yeah, hold on the line. Christian will pick up and give you that stuff. This is The Ramsey Show.

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Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. Thrilled to have you with us. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz joins me. We're here for you. 888-825-5225 is the number. You got a money question. You got a work question. You got a relationship question. We'll take them all because they're all interconnected. 888-825-5225. Ann is now with us in Salt Lake City, Utah. Ann, how can we help?

Hi, Ken. Hi, Rachel. Wanted to get your thoughts on a potential kind of big decision that me and my husband have that might set us up. But to give you a little backstory, we're both 35. We're kind of at baby step six. So we don't have any debt. We're really just putting a little bit extra towards the mortgage at this point.

We have some money set aside for the six-month savings. So kind of working our way through. We've been listening to you for about a year, so it's been good. That's awesome. I'll say a lot of, yeah, a lot of I think our success is, at least my success anyway, my mom's pretty smart financially, so I take a lot of her advice. On this potential decision, though, she's not very much on board, so I wanted to get maybe a third opinion.

Okay. Well, we'll give you our thoughts. That's right. I promise you that. We don't know how much it'll help, but go for it. All right. Give us the scenario. Of course. Of course. So right now, we bought and took advantage about three years ago of the really low interest rates. We bought our home that we have now. Obviously, we've made some equity on it now with prices going up. We bought in a pretty decent area. So we have probably...

I think probably about 350 that we could get out of equity if we were to sell. So that's kind of where we're at right now. We owe quite a bit because obviously we're only a few years into the mortgage. We did go with a third year, which of course I regret now, but that's in the past.

So we're kind of at a standpoint to try and decide to sell, you know, take quite a bit of amount out of the equity, buy something for less in a more rural area, which is something both me and my husband, you know, are interested in, or stick with the mortgage at a really, really low interest rate. We got a hold of a 2% interest rate.

And, you know, kind of just stay here and light it out or pay it off early, right? So obviously listening to a lot of the conversations and, you know, tips that you guys have, I lean towards, you know, sell, take the equity, take some of our savings and buy something where we'd be mortgage-free.

my mom says to stick and don't lose the 2% interest because we'll never see that again. So curious yourself. Okay, I'm not going to talk about the money side. I'll let Rachel weigh in on that. But it sounds to me like you guys want to live in a rural area. That's kind of the life you want to lead.

Yeah. Well, that's the no-brainer. We've kind of got a hobby farm going now, and so maybe delve a little more into that. And can you get what you want for that $350,000, $400,000?

So for $350,000, probably we have about $150,000 saved. That's in a high yield savings. That's above your emergency fund? That's kind of the other question is like, if we don't do something with that, maybe what should we do with those funds? Okay. Yeah. Is that above your emergency fund, the $150,000?

That includes it. So I would say we could easily take probably $100,000. So for $450,000, could you get what you want in a rural area and where you guys want to live? Have you looked at houses out there? Yes.

Yeah, I have. And there's quite a bit of availability. It's a no-brainer, Ann. Ann, do what you want to do. Do it. And financially speaking, 2% is worse than 0%. I know. So poor mom. We're blowing mom's advice out of the water. Yeah. And listen, Ann, and this is where we're the weird people in the space when it comes to this stuff. But we, I mean, when you own your home,

It's not even a financial move at that point. It is a true emotional, spiritual. Something happens when you don't have a bank in your life. There's not a mortgage company in your life. Ford Motor Company is not your life. You don't have other people in your life. It is just you. Because how much do you guys make a year? So I bring in about $75,000 and my husband brings in $85,000-ish. That's amazing. You're living where you want to.

debt free and i don't even make a hundred and sixty thousand dollars a year yeah god bless your mom and if you said like yeah you know what we really want we probably need to take out of you know fifty thousand hundred thousand dollar mortgage i'd say okay i'd say do that too yeah i'm like because you want to live there at that point yes like you know you would be able to afford that too but if you can just straight up do this in cash i'm like that's the dream and like that's what people that that's what you work towards is to have nothing and you guys make an incredible income all day

All day. I'm living out. Oh. And? Winston would be running for the hills if I said we could live in a rural area. He would be. He'd be like, yee-haw. You just see him in the distance. It kind of threw me back because, you know, he's always been the one to pinch pennies and, you know, don't take out credit card loans and go to school debt-free and stuff. Yeah. So it threw me off a little hearing this from her. That's so funny. Well, and it's good that your mom, you know, has such a positive voice in your life, but also, Ann, you're a 35-year-old woman. Yeah.

So mom's not going to agree with everything all the time. Can you imagine? It doesn't matter. Like she doesn't get a vote, right? And you and your husband, I'm assuming are on the same page. Like you both want to make this move and you guys are excited about it.

Absolutely. So, Ann, do this, but just imagine 20 years from now, you're talking to Rachel, you see her somewhere, you're talking to a friend and you go, yeah, we had this opportunity 20 years ago to buy this great property cash, live where we wanted to live. But, you know, my mom talked us into keeping the 2% on this house we have. Could you imagine how much you would resent her? Does that sound silly to you?

Yeah, it does. That's where it's like this internal back and forth. It's good to get a third party. And what do you want to do? Forget what me and Rachel think you should do. What do you and your husband want to do?

Oh, for sure. I think that's been our dream. I mean, we've worked from, you know, we've been together 15 years and, you know, worked our way through this and kind of... Y'all have done an incredible job, Anne. Great job. And one year of listening to this and doing this plan. I mean, you've made it. You made it through all three, seven baby steps. Cue the Disney music. Yeah. Right? It's time for dreams come true, pixie dust. Let's go. It's great, Anne. Let's go.

Fascinating. Just have your mom out for a great dinner at the new place. Yeah. I got to ask you a question I think really hits our broader audience. The influence of family. And let's also throw friends in this bucket. You've been coaching a lot of people for a long time. What are your thoughts on this as to why we have a hard time allowing our heart to overcome the influence of family?

what family members say like the heart's totally in yeah but then it's like what why do you think that is you know I mean I think that there's a level of acceptance we all want and I think for our parents from a parent to a child relationship I think a child regardless of age you still are like isn't that are you good you know like so true so you think it's approval I think there's a level of approval there I also think you know in Ann's case her mom she's

sounded very wise with everything else. So she probably genuinely thinks, okay, or, and believes, cause it probably is very true that she's a really wise person with money. So I am going to take what she says really seriously. But the problem is, is when all of that starts affecting our day-to-day decisions and our life decisions and, and for, and, and kind of court and parents, um,

And you're not like at that point, like, yes, I understand you're still their parent, but you're not their parent anymore. You have an adult in your life and you don't get a vote either. Right. So it's interesting, isn't it? And I do think parents, there is something about the relationship. I feel like even with my friends and I can say this even about my own parents.

as better of a job as your kids get older and especially when they start having families of their own and you become more pure like you just enjoy I think you enjoy each other's company more versus like I still need to teach you and I still I'm still being in this role the kid the adult kid always ends up feeling like oh my gosh I remember dad mom and dad have done they've done a great job with that they I remember even coming to dad about a money question Winston and I had been married probably 18 months it was about a mutual fund or something and kid he would not give me the answer he's like what do you what do you and Winston want to do what are y'all gonna do

Wow. I was like, I have Dave Ramsey sitting in front of me. Should I just call the show and make up a name? You probably should. This is Sarah from Dallas. You should have. Sarah from Dallas. He pushed us a lot of like, you got to make your own decisions. I think inquiring minds want to know, if you and Winston were to move out into the wherever, rural area, what animal would you not allow on the property?

Oh. Do you have a hard and fast? Or is there an animal you'd like to have? I feel like a rooster would be tough, right? Yeah. Waking you up. Three in the morning. Yeah, what about you? I'll tell you. I'd have chickens, though. I'd like some goats. I'd have to bring in a rooster. I'd like some goats. I like the little noise they make. No, what would you not do, though? Cows. They stink. This is The Ramsey Show.

Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. So excited to have you with us, America. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz joins me. The phone number is 888-825-5225. So Rachel and I were just talking. We're going to get to the phones in just a matter of moments, but we were just talking during the break. We love getting out amongst the people. I am a self-fashioned man of the people, and I think you are a woman of the people, whether or not you would ever refer to yourself as that.

But I love being out. We love hanging with you guys. We love doing events. Yes, yes. And being with you guys. So we're very excited. We're not going anywhere, but we are doing an event. You might be coming here. What are we talking about? Brand new event called Total Money Makeover Weekend. It's May 10 and 11. It's going to be right here on our campus, just south of Nashville in just God's paradise of Franklin, Tennessee. It's just fantastic. It's a one-weekend event. You're going to crash course on everything we teach about money, finance,

every side from the big shovel to getting out of debt saving investing the whole nine yards so no matter what baby step you're on this is going to light a fire under you there also be a lot of q a so when we're speaking we're also going to be taking questions live in the crowd we love that early bird tickets start at just 99 but this is going to be for a limited time so if you want to get the best deal on tickets this is it and

And the Ramsey Event Center, by the way, brand spanking new, only holds 2,400 people, so it's limited. So get your tickets now at ramseysolutions.com slash events. That's ramseysolutions.com slash events. It's going to be fun. Yeah, it's going to be a great weekend, so come hang out with us. Let's do it. All right, Henry is up in Las Vegas. Henry, what's going on?

Hi. So my wife and me have about $125,000 in household income, $305,000 in a mortgage, about $35,000 in student loans, no other debt. So we're foodies. We like to go out and enjoy food.

But that's really our only, I guess you could say, vice. I got my student loans. I'm comfortable with just paying the $420 every month. She would like us to more aggressively pay off our debt. And I kind of agree, but at the same time I don't, because I don't want to...

I don't want to not live as well. I want to enjoy life. We have about... I think she had 20-something in her Roth. I have about...

30 35 in my retirement we're putting 10 percent um so we're we're doing the baby steps and we're going along the way we have about 100 in cash 100k in cash so that's about three years worth of if god forbid we lose everything we can still pay all our bills to include the mortgage

utilities, and food. So I think we're doing good, but she wants to be more aggressive versus I don't, and sort of we're

We're at an impasse of how to, you know, it's not really about having one person be right or wrong, but it's about maybe finding a balance, right? You know, because it's all about balance in a relationship. Yes. We're not arguing anything like that, but just trying to. That's okay if you are. Couples argue. We're okay with that. Rachel and I like to argue. Okay, Henry, I missed how much the student loan payment is, or I'm sorry, how much debt total student loans are. Okay.

$35,000. Is that all the debt you guys have? And then the mortgage is $305,000 and the house is worth about $365,000. Good for you guys. Henry, I'd pay off the student loans today. Okay. You have $100,000. Okay.

in the bank. Pay it off today and you have a fully funded emergency fund. Now you guys are, and then bump up your investing 5% to 15% of your household income and you guys are freaking going to do incredible. What are you paying? What's your student loan payment every month? $420. You just get a $420 a month raise on top of everything. Go out to eat with that. Yeah. That'll buy a nice steak. Maybe a tomahawk. Yeah. Well,

Let's throw another weight, Rachel. Because here, the $100,000 though, I want to address that because I so appreciate it, but the, I so appreciate the $100,000, but the reason why is that it's a three-year emergency fund and he said in case something happens and for three years, Henry, for three years, you'd probably be moved

and living off the lands. I mean, like if it gets to that point in life that you can't find a job in three years. So I'm just saying that it's an unnecessary amount of emergency funds for that reason. And so use it to your advantage. You guys worked and saved so hard for that. I mean, it's incredible. So use it to benefit you guys in the present. This...

takes away all the questions on your aggression on paying off debt because it's paid off. It's paid off today. Henry, pay it off and then get a nice bottle of champagne tonight and celebrate. You're debt free. I love that. And the Tomahawk steak. That's amazing. But Henry, let me throw something out you here. What if you invested that $420 a month? You're a real safety guy and you're a numbers guy. Is this true? Yeah, she's the more aggressive one. Right, but hold on a second. What if, yeah, but what if you did what Rachel said?

And you've been, well, no, you said pay off the loan, but he's still going to have my math, $65,000? Yeah. Okay. So, Henry, what if you had $65,000 in the bank, okay, and you had no debt other than your home, and you were able to invest $420 a month starting tomorrow? Extra. Yeah, extra. How exciting is that?

Yeah, by the time we retire, we'll definitely be millionaires. Dude, Henry, that's not even up for vote. So your cautionary...

This cautionary narrative is actually holding you back, and I'm trying to flip your brain on this. You're going, oh my gosh, I don't want to give up $35,000. And I'm going, you're not giving up $35,000. You are creating total freedom. You're freeing up $420 a month to invest, do whatever you want. I mean, this is a no-brainer for you, and you're still safe.

Trust me, $65,000 in your emergency fund, Henry, is plenty for you. You know how I know this? Because if you were to get laid off tomorrow, you would be getting a job as fast as you possibly could. You are not a guy who likes risk. Correct. So what are you going to do, Henry? It's your life. Did we convince you? You're an inch closer. I don't want to lie to people and say yes 100%. What are you so afraid of? This

So I'm afraid of us getting into a bad situation and my wife craves stability. What would be the bad situation? This is really fun. Not making fun of me. What's the bad situation? Describe it. We both flew, you know, well, she already lost her job. It's been about nine months. So that's creating a stress for her. And, you know, God forbid I lose my job. I'm the stable one right now. If

If we lose that, that 65 can go real quick. Okay, but wait a second. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. What has kept her from getting a job for nine months? In the industry of recruiting, it's a little bit difficult right now. Okay. Has she been doing any work? Oh, yeah. She has part-time work, so she has income. Okay, here's my point. This is what I want to say.

If that were to happen to you right now, you would go get a full-time job or you would get a part-time job or another part-time job. And I would say she needs to get another part-time job right now. She actually doesn't have to because you're in such great financial shape and you can live off your income. But my point is, I'm trying to play this out for you, Henry, that let's say both of you lose your job. You could still not touch that emergency fund if you went and got busy. You may have to use some of it, but you're not going to blow through $65,000.

Yeah. That would be you guys just sitting at home doing nothing. Literally not even trying to work. Yeah.

That's not going to happen. So I'm trying to walk you up to the threshold of hell here. And you look over and go, what has to happen? I love you because I feel like we're usually the ones telling people to like slow down. We're the conservative ones. I don't want to pay that debt off. You guys are crazy. We're so aggressive. We're the aggressive ones. That never happens. It really never does. But listen, here's what's great about Henry. He's never going to make a dumb financial move.

No, no. So it's now just building up that muscle. And listen, here's my thing too. The way you guys live and your ability to save what you guys want to do, pay it off.

And if you really keep losing sleep at night over that $35,000, then just build it back up. Well, okay. I love this. Great advice. Let's take the $420,000. Let's round it down to $420,000 to make easy math. Okay. Over the course of 12 months, that's $4,800. Okay.

But just taking that loan payment and putting it into savings. You could do way more with the 420, obviously. But you're fine. I would be so happy to get rid of that student loan. It'd be a party. I like the champagne idea. Yeah, thanks. And maybe the tomahawk is a little too much red meat. I don't know. But something.

Go enjoy. Go celebrate. You're debt-free, Henry. Well done. You've got to cut the check first, Henry. Get yourself a Pepsi at AC. It'll help. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. So excited to have you with us, America. 888-825-5225 is the number. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz joins me, and we're here for you. Ryan is up in Raleigh, North Carolina. Ryan, how can we help? Hey, Ken. Hey, Rachel. How are you today? It's good to talk to you. Good to talk to you. What's up? Oh.

Thanks. So my wife and I have been followers of yours for years, and I have a question about retirement that I don't know if I've ever heard you answer. Okay. Between the two of us, we make about 280 base and then up above 300 with both of us.

bonuses. And that's pretty recent that our income is not that high. So for the past couple of years, we've had to transfer what we were putting into a Roth IRA just into a regular IRA because our income was too high for the limits. And I was wondering if we should start foregoing the IRA altogether and just maxing out our Roth 401ks. Well, you can do a backdoor Roth IRA. Okay.

Do you know that? Right. But yes, but we're not at baby step seven yet. No, but but instead of. Yeah, but you said instead of. Yeah, I said I would be putting towards the taxes and instead of putting it towards the mortgage. Wait, say that again. So I didn't want to take the extra money that because if we do the backdoor rock, then we have to pay the taxes that are due on it. Sure. Right away. Correct.

Well, if you've converted. Yeah, baby step are five, I guess, six, the mortgage. So that's what I'm kind of wondering if it would be better to just, because we're very happy with our 401k options. What percentage does that get to? If you guys both max out your Roth 401ks, what percentage of your income would that be?

Like, will you hit that 15%? Well, I think it's 22,500, so it's about $45,000, which is almost exactly 15% for us, yeah. Okay. And then how much do you have saved total in your 401Ks? So our total retirement is probably around $500,000. Yeah, but I'm asking specifically, I'm going somewhere with this, how much do you have of that $500,000 between the two of you is in your 401Ks, the Roth 401Ks?

I think a 401k is probably $250. Here's why I'm asking that question. Do you work with a smart investor pro? Yes. When was the last time you met with him about the strategy? I actually was just talking with him about transferring over.

our Roth IRA to a normal IRA because our income exceeded the limit. But I didn't ask him about this. So I'm wondering if it's not... This is real high-level math here, Ryan. But if you guys are making $300,000 a year, then you should be investing over $30,000...

Together household income And in that I mean the max I think is $23,000 For your 401k Max Roth is $7,000 So that's right at I mean you guys could both You could max out both of these accounts And do the backdoor Roth Yeah you pay taxes on it But I would go ahead and just do that Because you're still within the 15% of your income Into retirement So both of us would be $45,000

$45,000. And we can do $22,500 each into 401ks. Yes. I'm going to throw out to talk to you. Exactly to our 15%.

That gets you to your 15%. Right, which is why, if I can jump in here, I would like for you to talk to your SmartVestor Pro about, do we diversify because you've got a good chunk in Roth? I'm just wondering, not recommending, I'm wondering if it wouldn't be a good idea to do a joint brokerage account here. It gives you some other tax options and you can invest that. Since you've got so much Roth invested, do you start to diversify that? It would be a question that I would ask.

Yeah, yeah. But I'm saying I think they can still do both. They might be. Yeah, yeah. I'm just throwing it out there that like, because the point is... My goal for you guys, Ryan, would be to max out the 401k, max out the Roth by doing the backdoor, and then if you have something above and beyond that, then that's when I would look into it. Just the diversification there. Right. Because it does give you some... But maxing out our Roth 401k gets us exactly to our 15%. Yeah. But we wouldn't need to do an IRA at all. Oh.

That's what he's been saying. He's already there. Which is why I'm bringing it up. Yes, I probably would at that point. Match beats Roth beats traditional. When you look at that, if you have the Roth 401k, and if your income goes up though, Ryan, I would look at the backdoor Roth.

If your income grows, yeah, and you guys have more percentages because it's just a great vehicle. And I don't know. I mean, I have no reason to say this. I just have a hunch in life. I'm like, I don't know how long that, I don't know if they'll have that forever and ever, amen. Like, I don't know. It's just, it's such a great, easy retirement vehicle to throw some money in. How much do you guys have left to pay on the house?

About $300. Okay. It's worth about $750. Awesome. Great job. You should have that done in seven to eight years. Okay. Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah. So I would, yeah, go ahead and do that. And then obviously if something changes with jobs or whatever it may be, um,

then you would move, yeah, that 401k into just a traditional IRA at that point. But that's obviously not, hopefully won't happen. So sorry, Ryan, I was getting mixed up with my numbers in my head. So yeah, I would go ahead and do your 15% all in the Roth 401k. Now for everyone else out there, the only reason I say that is because it is a Roth.

Roth is a beautiful thing. So if you just have a traditional 401k at your job, you go up to the match, up to that 3%, 4%, 5%, 6%, whatever they give you, and then the remaining of your 15% go back, go to a Roth IRA, max it out. And if you still have percentages of that 15% left, go back to your 401k. But he has a Roth 401k situation, which is awesome. Yeah, very good. Let's go to Harrisburg, Pennsylvania now where Caleb is. Caleb, how can we help?

Hey, guys. Thanks for taking my call. You bet. What's going on today? So I'm wondering what I should start saving for first. Actually, my wife and I finish off paying off our debt. There's a lot of things I could save for, and it feels overwhelming because we don't make a ton of money, and I'm just looking for any advice you have. So you paid off all your debt. Does that include your mortgage or no?

But we rent right now. I'm 24. My wife's 25. We've been married for about two years. Congratulations. When will you guys be debt-free? They just did. Well, we have a little over $20,000 on a student loan of hers left to finish. But once you pay it off, you're asking what to save for. What are the things you guys are... What are y'all wanting to save for?

Well, uh, we, we have two used cars that have no payments. Mine's close to 200,000. I don't know how much longer it's going to last. I wanted to save for a home. I know we're supposed to save for retirement. We want to have kids and, um, we make about 3000 a month. And so it's an overwhelming prospect that I don't even know where to go. I have two months of emergency expenses. We built that up before we started hammering the debt. But, uh,

Yeah, that's great. I'm just not sure where to go next. Yeah, yeah. I would bump it up to three months of expenses after you pay off the debt, and that'll kind of cover, that can be the first goal, is to get that fully funded emergency fund. And then I would see, yeah, where you are with your cars. I think a car purchase is always a great thing to be saving for and kind of just, I would Kelly Blue Book your current car and say, okay, how much is it? I wouldn't do it just because it doesn't have, just because it has 200,000 miles. Obviously, it needs to be in a place where

the repairs are getting so much and you know it's starting to fall apart on you then i would replace it but i would i mean i would drive them as long as long as you can and some cars nowadays they but they're built so well that they do last i mean and it depends on the type of car may not be that expensive do you have a line item in your budget to rachel's point for car repairs

Yeah, we put a little bit away every month for maintenance, and that's done me well so far for tires and anything that's come up. Okay, that's great. Yeah, so I think, yeah, saving up for a car, but that'll be a faster goal to save for. And then, Caleb, after that, so you got your one more month of emergency fund to save to get to your three months, saving up a little bit for the car, and then I would look at Baby Step 3B. Okay.

And that is where you save up a down payment on a home. So if you're a first-time home buyer, as low as 5%, you can go to put down on a house. But that would be my next goal. And you guys have plenty of time for investing, but I would get those kind of buckled in and then start saving 15% of your income into retirement. Thanks for the call, Caleb. You guys are going to do it. It's going to be fun. Rachel Cruz, thanks for co-hosting. What a great hour. Thank you, Austin, for keeping the plane in the air. This is The Ramsey Show.

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, this is The Ramsey Show. It's where we help you win in your life, very specifically in your money, in your work, and in your relationships. 888-825-5225 is the number. 888-825-5225. Hey, we'd love to hear from you. Always fun to be sitting alongside my good pal, my friend. I don't know if you can call a lady a pal. Just an old pal. Just my old pal, Rachel Cruz. Old pal. Known each other forever.

And we love, love taking your questions. So let's have some fun. Let's get some hope established for you so you can move forward. Let's start off in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, the city of? Brotherly love. There it is. She used to make fun of me. You're welcome. I think you've been paying attention to my little quotes. That's it. You're so happy about it. Melanie, how can we help? Hey, guys. Thank you so much for taking my call. I'm excited to talk to you both. Well, we're excited to talk to you. What's happening?

Awesome. So I'm in a little bit of a professional conundrum. I love a conundrum. You do. Great word. I'm currently working two full-time remote jobs. That has been great for my family. Wow. Kids in school and all that. I've been fortunate to find two remote jobs. Hold on a second. Hold on. This is fascinating. I've got to know. Do both companies know about the other companies?

Of course not. So you are a professional polygamist. Are you aware of this? Can we say? Yes, you can say. They're in two different fields. Melanie, I am so sorry that you have to deal with him. No, she's not offended. She's not offended at all. I expect Ken to give me a hard time.

I listen, not even doing that. I just wanted to say professional polygamist because you've got, you, I've got two, you got sister wives, you got two companies that you're working full time for and they don't know about the other. And I'm not even trying to, sister wives knows about each other. That is fair. You get my point. It's a fun little metaphor. How are you pulling this off? How long have you pulled this off? Um, I've been doing it now for a year. Exhausted. And are you tired?

I'm a little tired. Yeah, I'm not going to lie. I mean, two full-time jobs. Yeah. And keeping them away from each other. It's like having a mistress. It's exhausting. It's a lot of great time management. That's all I can say. You must be incredible. So what kind of money are you knocking down? So I'm netting $96 a year. Okay. All right. So what's your question?

So I've just been offered a different job that will cause me to be hybrid, three days in the office and two days working from home, with a base pay of $100K and with up to a potential of getting a 20% bonus of my base pay. Oh, wow. And what has kept you from saying yes to that offer? Well, because I technically would be netting less, right?

Um, I guess, you know, right now my husband and I bring home about 12 a month. And then if I take this, we'd be bringing home about 97. Why would the net be less? That's not including the bonus though. Yeah, exactly. And you're not cheating on another company and thus risking getting fired from one or both.

Yeah. And, and also I think professionally the job that just offered me this position would be a step up for me professionally. Um, great. But,

But I just, I don't know. I just, I'm a little nervous about giving up to remote jobs and, you know, flexibility with the kids because I do have like school-age children at home. Let me ask you, Melanie, let me ask you a real question. And you've been a great sport because Rachel thinks I'm being mean. I'm not. I'm not judging you. I'm just trying to coach you. How long do you think you're going to be able to keep this up and then not find out about it?

How long do you think you got? Not very long. I mean, honestly, I think it's more just to do the debt snowball for my husband and I. We're a baby step two. I don't think you understand the concept. Hold on a second, Melanie. I don't think Rachel understands the concept. She's working two full-time jobs. I hear that. It'd be like you being a personality for another company and they not know about it.

It's it's it's she knows she can't keep this up because she's going to get found out and then she's fired. Yeah. But wouldn't it be like having a part time job, but you're just doing more hours? Yeah.

It's pretty much what it's like because they are in two different fields. No, no, no, no. Okay, hold on. Just for point of emphasis here, okay? We're not going to get stuck on this, but I've got to help my friend Rachel. And Melanie, I'm going to help you. Rachel has to help me here. No. No, she doesn't understand it. Once she understands it. Rachel, listen to me. Here's what's happening. One company, let's call it ABC.

is paying Melanie to work a full-time job. Yes. That's, what, 40 hours a week minimum, Melanie? Roughly? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Company XYZ is also paying Melanie to work 40 hours a week. And, Melanie, just tell us, how many hours you work in a week for both companies? 80. 80?

Now I didn't see that coming. She's trying to get me out of technicality. I still think it's unethical that they don't know about each other. Yeah, I can get the secret. And again, not to judge you, Melanie. There's no judgment. It's more protection. So we've already covered. Now do you get my... No, I always have. But in my head, if she's working, I get the secrecy, right? But if you're working both...

Full time. Okay, I said, I acknowledge that she kind of had me on a technicality, but it's still dishonest and we still have an ethical issue that she could get penalized for. Which all I care about is Melanie. But if ABC Company doesn't care that she's also working for XYZ, it doesn't matter. How do you know? Because they don't know. No, but what if they're not? Then in your book, is it okay?

If they're okay with it? Yes. If they're okay with each other? 100%. So it's the secrecy that's bothering you that they don't know about each other. It's not bothering me in a sense that I think she's a bad, it's just, it's risky for Melanie. Yeah. I'm literally playing defense lawyer for her going, I'm not going to tell you what you did was wrong. My job is to help you keep

getting paid and not get fired yes so now the question is do I take this other job which has a bonus above and beyond the 100 base right plus a path for growth Melanie you said this is a job that's a better play for you long term yeah Melanie it's a no-brainer yeah now I'm not working 80 hours a week yeah now you're not working 80 hours a week and you're not cheating on another company and you're and again it may be a lifestyle shift because it's a hybrid I

But maybe you get into that and it works and it's great and you figure out the logistics with the kids and your kids are in school, which is helpful. Yeah. Or you pan back a year from now and say, wow, this is hard. So maybe I go back to...

L-M-N-O company. You find another job. Right. But Melanie, you do know I'm on Team Melanie, right? We love you, Melanie. I do. I do. And I just wanted to make sure that I'm not kind of shooting myself in the foot with the $3,000 less that I'd be making. Yeah, but you told us you're not including the bonus in that exercise. I'm not. So you've got to put the bonus in, amortize that over 12 months.

And then you start looking at the monthly. It's not quite 3,000 because you said 97. So it's, yeah. So my point is, I think it's all in all, it's not going to be that much of a difference at all in the short term. And we know long term is better if you take this new job. And just for your own benefit. So you're not working 80 hours a week. You're working 40. Yeah.

That's true. That's true. Freeze up a lot. Thank you so much. I appreciate your input. Yeah, Melanie, take the job. Man, you've got to get out of jail free here on this one. I mean, whoa. By the way, this is a new trend. She is not alone. There are millions of Americans that are professional polygamists. They have two full-time jobs and they don't know about each other. And it is cheating. I don't care how you slice it. I'm all for you getting them paid.

But man, you could get fired and it makes me nervous, you know? Oh man. This is the Ramsey Show. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz joins me this hour. What do you think, America? That last call, it was really fun. We had a good debate. We really did. In the lobby with some people that are here. Yeah, and make no mistake, I want to say again, I got a t-shirt on, it says Team Melanie.

I just don't want her to get fired. And I feel like we got her a path to where she's going to escape and nobody hurt. But again, it's fascinating. What do you think, America? Comment. Get out there on YouTube and comment. Do you think it's okay to have two full-time jobs and both companies don't know about each other? Okay, the don't know thing, just so everyone's clear. They don't know about it. I know, I know, I know. And I would say that's...

That's the part for me that I'm like, yeah, you can't. But if both companies are okay with it, I say get after it. Okay, there you go. So yeah, we're more on the sea. We're more aligned. I knew we were. This is America. We're America right here. You think you're on two separate sides and actually in reality, we want the same thing. If both companies are okay with Melanie. Yeah, it's the secrecy. I get that. Then I'm like, fantastic. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Go get you some money.

For some companies, what your position is, you're a graphic designer and you have these projects and you got to do it. And if you get it done in 30 hours, 60 hours, you're getting paid for that position too. You know what? I want to get your opinion on something really quick. This is fun. I'm going to bring you into my lane for a second. Career, leadership, work. Listen, listen, listen, listen. I think the 40-hour work week is an antiquated metric anyway.

Meaning? I feel like most people work more.

I think that, and here's what I'm going to say. I love that you're on this. I think that if you look at the world of work in Americans, it's either you work more than 40 hours or you work less. I don't think there's anybody that's knocking out 40 hours. Let me explain why. If you work an eight-hour day, you're taking a lunch break, which is probably an hour. That's not eight hours. You're seven. So I'm just going. And then you start, we know the data. Don't look this up, leaders. The data on how much time people spend on social media during the workday. Oh, sure. Yeah.

So now you're way below 40 hours. Sure. I'm just calling it out to say, to your point, I thought you made a good point. It's about the production. Yes. Not the time clock. That's right. That's right. So you agree? I do agree with that. Yeah. The world of work is changing. You do know this. Oh, gosh. It's crazy. Have you heard about four-day work weeks? Have you heard about the four-day school week?

Oh, the school week? There are school districts now that are testing a four-day school week because of shortage of teachers. No way. So anyway, I digress. The world is changing right in front of us. Always. COVID did it too, right? Wouldn't you say? I mean, it fast-forwarded everything. Boy, we are really in alignment today.

You should keep making predictions. If we were a car, just... It's great. I agree with you. I think COVID literally is like a fast-forward button on change. And I think, too, for people...

And depending on how they're wired, it works. Like I have so many friends that are hybrid. I have so many friends that want to be in an office and they're like, get me out of the house. There's no way I could work from home. Some that are like, nope, all I want to do, I will only find work from home job. I mean, like, yeah. And so it just gets, I like it because it gives the variety to fit within your life. And, you know, I feel like a lot of, uh,

Gen Zers, we were talking about this with a recent article, but they really see work as a means to an end versus it being part of this life. It's fascinating. Yeah, I see that. There you go. So anyway, America, we want you to sound off. We love it. Get in the comment section. Tell us what you think about Melody. It's always fun. And just for...

For the record, Rachel agrees with me. Took her a minute, but we got her there. You came to my side a little bit. Was that what it is? Whatever. Okay. So I'm going to capitulate again. This is all I do. I've been married for 25 years. I have a teenage daughter. I'm always giving in to the women in my life. What is going on? Can I not be right once? Yeah. So fantastic. Tiffany, rescue me from this. Tiffany's on the line in Houston, Texas. What's going on, Tiffany?

Okay, so I actually wanted y'all's input on something. So me and my boyfriend have been kicking around the idea of, you know, renting or should we buy like a mobile home and just stick it on a piece of land? No, never. Because there are mobile homes around here for like $24,000. Yeah, and guess what it's going to be worth in six months after that?

They go down, down, down, down, down, down, down in value. It's one of the worst investments you can make, honestly, Tiffany. It's like buying a giant cannonball and trying to hold it in the water. It's just you're going under. You can't keep the cannonball up there. It won't float, folks. So I'm just telling you, why would you do that? It's not a good investment. I'd rather you rent and keep some stability but not buy an asset that's going downhill.

And don't buy something together with someone you're not married to as well, Tiffany. Oh, yeah, that's a good point. So don't put both of your names on something. I mean, it needs to be very separate. Have you ever lived in a mobile home? Yes. Did you like it? Well, I was pretty well too young to remember. Okay, did it have a Redwood deck, while I'm asking? As far as I remember, no. It had like a...

That's a Sammy Kershaw song, I think it is. But the point is, is that you're trying to figure out a way to cheaply live as opposed to doing what it takes to live smartly. And what I mean by that is you're going to buy an asset that goes down. And instead of people think, well, I'm renting, I'm throwing money away and renting gives you options and renting gives you stability.

And so I just don't understand why you would consider it other than it may be in your family or it's just something you think is a normal thing to do. I actually had a couple of people in my family to buy them, pick them up and then sell them for like twice as much as they put into it. I don't believe that. Do we have paperwork on that? Yeah. They bought a mobile home and sold it for twice as much. Who'd they sell it to?

Now that I don't know. They showed me the paperwork. They sold it for like $50,000. They only had about $20,000 in it. Tiffany, how much do you make a year? Just me. I make about $50,000. You're $50,000. Okay, that's great. Yeah, so Tiffany, what I would do, honestly, yeah, I would rent you. What kind of debt do you have? So I have like two credit cards.

They have like $1,000 on them. Okay. Collectively. Okay. Both of them have $1,000. So $2,000 in credit card debt. What else? No, it's like one has $500, one has $400. Oh, okay. Oh, I'm sorry. Okay, okay, okay. Perfect. Okay, what else? Um...

I have like a payment to the electric company that I have to make when me and my ex-husband split up because my name was on the utilities. Okay. He couldn't keep it paid, so I just had him shut off. Okay. Do you have a car payment? Well, my boyfriend does. Your boyfriend does, but you don't? Not in your name? No. No. Okay. So, okay. Well, you're in a good spot. Do you have any money saved? No.

I'm working on that one. Yeah, that's great. That's great, Tiffany. Well, I think, you know, one of your first goals is to get $1,000 saved. I would not combine anything with your boyfriend. You want to keep finances separate when you're not married for many reasons, but one of them easily is just the legal reason. I mean, if you put your name together on something and then you guys break up, he stops paying. We get that call all the time. You're stuck with it. So...

Keep everything separate. My first goal, Tiffany, would be to save a thousand dollar emergency fund on your own with your money and put that away and then cut up these credit cards. You could probably cut them up today. I would just get rid of the credit cards and

And pay off that debt after that thousand dollars is saved. And then bump up your starter emergency fund to three to six months of expenses. So kind of starting to get you a strong foundation financially for you where you don't have payments. You have some good savings in the bank. And in the meantime, Tiffany, then I would rent. And again, I'm not going to say that.

on the lease or whatever, I would not sign something together. Let it be in one of your names and if something happens to the relationship, then that person is the one who will live there. The other person will have to find somewhere else to live, but just don't

merge your life and act like you're married when you're not because from a financial standpoint it gets people in a lot of trouble so just protect yourself in that Tiffany financially but I would rent I would not buy a mobile home we just see please do your research yeah we see the stats on it yeah it just it's not a great investment long term I would love for you to own a home and save up for a down payment here in a few years all right we'll be right back don't move this is the Ramsey show

Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz joins me this hour. The phone number is 888-825-5225. So glad you're with us. Let's go to Fort Myers, Florida now, where Tracy joins us. Tracy, how can we help? Hi there. Thank you for having me. My husband was in a near fatal car crash a little over a year ago. Oh my gosh. I'm so sorry. Is he okay? No, thank you. Yeah, God is good. Oh, wow. Yeah.

So he suffered with paralysis at the accident. And a month later, he coded and he blew a stroke, which gave him brain damage. Oh, no. So he was the breadwinner. He was the breadwinner. And so I'm just, I'm sorry, I didn't know I was going to cry. You're okay. No, listen, you've been through a lot. That's a lot.

So anyway, we have a 22 and a 20-year-old. So anyway...

All that to say, I homeschooled the kids, and then I was just working at just a fast food restaurant takeout for about six months until the accident, and I left and I never returned. I just started an entirely different part-time job, and

Just about a month ago. And so I don't make that much. It's about 24 hours. It's part-time, obviously, because I'm with my husband on Wednesdays and Thursdays in Tampa. And so anyway, I make roughly about $1,700 a month through that position. And so I'm just...

I'm just wondering what I can do to sustain our house. I want to be able to keep our home. I'm not quite sure if I'm going to be able to, but there is debt. I have about $17,000 in credit card debt. Our mortgage is at a good rate. It's 2.875%, and our mortgage is $1518 per month. So, I mean, those are very comfortable numbers to me, but when I don't have...

income really slowing. I do have a stable amount in savings, but it's going to go. I mean, it's already been dwindling. How much do you have in savings? About $8,000. Okay. And so what have you been doing for income since this stroke?

Um, his, um, the truck that he, um, totaled in the accident. Um, I did get money back from that and I got scared. Um, I'm still paying on that as well. Um, it's like one 80 something a month. Um, I used to basically, um, live on. Um, and so I had that in actually, um, you know, um,

Friends, you know, through different churches were so gracious. And my daughter actually created... Tracy, did you say, because you're in Fort Myers and he's in Tampa? Yeah, so Fort Myers is our nearest city. So how far is he from...

Distance-wise, how far? About two and a half hours. Okay, and he's there obviously for medical reasons? Yeah, he's at the VA in Tampa. So that means his expenses for care are covered? For now, until they switch him to perhaps a long-term because he needs 24-7 care. Will he be in Tampa? Do you think he'll be there? No.

for the foreseeable future, or will he be coming back closer to you guys? I don't... I'm able to... I would rather him stay there. I mean, well, actually, I'm torn about that. He would end up in a nursing home, probably, if it would, you know, be near us. Because my question to you, Tracy, is, I mean, have you thought about moving towards him, if he'll be there? You know, to tell you the truth...

I'm not quite sure about that for different reasons. Did he have any retirement or any, where were you guys at on that? I'd like to get a pretty high level picture of your finances. Did he have retirement? Do you guys have retirement? What's that look like? No, it doesn't look like anything because we just don't have that. And how old are you? I'm 57. How much is left on the mortgage, Tracy?

The current balance for the mortgage is $233,778. Okay. What was he making before the accident? He was making roughly like $4,000 something a month. Okay. Take-home pay? Yeah. Okay. And how much is on the truck? How much do you owe on the truck?

To tell you the truth, I don't have the balance. I've been paying it for, I mean, he was already paying on it. So it'd been like two years loan and it was only a $5,000 loan. Okay. So probably not much left on that. Okay. I want you to find that today. I think as much details as you can have about your money situation is

Usually kind of just the more peace that you have because it takes all the guesswork out so you're able to see. So I want you to find that today if you can, how much is left on that truck loan. And then the credit cards, the $17,000, is that just lifestyle? Is that just to keep you guys keep the lights on and

throughout this last year, or did you guys have this debt before the accident? We had some of it before the accident. We usually like to use cash, but it just got up. So, I mean, just out of note, but I also used it this past year, you know, just for different things. Yeah, for sure. It feels like you have been scraping by. Do you have a pretty good budget? You know exactly where the money's coming and going?

I do, but I just know that with me being out of work and him for over a year, we really, I mean, we took a big, big hit. No, no, I get it. But what I'm getting at is this. If you have a really good grasp of your budget, then you should be able to say, all right, I have to bring in this a month. So for instance, all I'm doing is looking at the one bill, which is your mortgage is $1,500 a month, and you're making $1,700 a month.

So obviously, we've got to come up with a number where you say, I have to make. And I'm just going to put a number out there. Don't freak out. But if it's like, I have to make $4,000 a month or $3,500 a month just to have some breathing room. But in this situation, Rachel, I'd love to see if maybe selling the house. Well, what's hard, Tracy, is I think with these numbers, as Ken was pointing out, that working part-time,

long-term is not that can't be the solution it's not the option so that's why I was asking about you moving closer to Helm so that you could work full-time and be close to Helm and but there's those decisions they have to yeah and that's what's so hard Tracy and I commend you I can't even imagine I can't even imagine what you've walked through the last year and

And like you said, and I feel like this is so true for a lot of women, they leave the workforce and they raise kids and then you get put in a situation and you think, oh my gosh, I have to go back to work. What am I going to do? So Tracy, I think it would be a good goal for you just from a... I'm going to give an example here in a minute. Yeah, but you're the job career expert, Ken, so you can speak into this. But Tracy, I would want you to have a timeline soon. It's February and I don't know what that looks like for you, but...

Where you feel like, okay, I can now step in and get something more full-time. And even if it's a receptionist job somewhere or anything that has benefits that gets you a stable, good income and use the gifts, everything that you have, it is marketable. I'm like, to run a household and do what you're doing. Yeah, let me give you a couple things here, okay? So $20 an hour job, Tracy, okay? Yeah.

40 hours a week, that's going to gross you $3,200 a month. That's a sizable raise. That's at $20 an hour. I'm giving you examples. You have companies like Walmart, Target, that are paying really good hourly rates between, let's call it, $18 to $22 an hour. You don't have to have a ton of experience. They want somebody who they can count on, and believe me, they can count on you. They also give great benefits. And right now, because of your husband's long-term situation,

I'm not just thinking short term when I give you this advice. I'm thinking long term. You can get in, start getting some good benefits, right? And maybe you sell the house as an option and then maybe you rent something. Maybe the 22 and the 20-year-old, depending on what they're – they've got their own life too. But maybe you get a roommate if your husband's living – we've got to do everything we can right now to lower your expenses as low as possible.

While increasing your income, Tracy, to your max of what you can do where you are right now.

And then you can build out, you can get out of this hole. You can pay off the debt. You can begin to invest. You can do this because you're going to have to, Tracy. It's on you now and you can do it. Hang on the line. I want to get you with one of our financial coaches that'll just further help lay out a path. Let's also give the full suite, every dollar, total money makeover, financial peace. Let's come alongside Tracy in this situation. So sorry. Thank you, Tracy, for calling. This is The Ramsey Show. ♪

Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz joins me. And the phone number to jump in is 888-825-5225. Our scripture of the day comes from Romans 12, 9. Don't just pretend to love others. Really love them. Hate what is wrong. Hold tightly to what is good. And our quote today, from your friend...

Rachel Friend makes the quote today. Candice Cameron, is it is it or or do you know? That's how I say it. Sorry, Candice. I don't know if that's right or not. Your integrity is worth so much more than proving a point or having the last word. That's a good point. Great quote. That one kind of gets me because I tend to be the last word guy.

You know, I've had to learn in my marriage to let Stacey have the last word. What's the quote? They say it on Bluey. You can either be right or have fun or something. I don't know. Generally for me, it would be I can either be right or wrong in Stacey's eyes, and then that ends up being right. You know, happy wife, happy life. You know, just be wrong. Just be wrong. It's easier, guys. Tiffany is up in Atlanta, Georgia. Tiffany, how can we help?

Hi, guys. So about five years ago, my husband, myself, and my then 10-year-old son were in a really, really horrible car accident. Oh, my. Yeah, it was really tough. My son was in the children's hospital for 40 days, 28 in the ICU. Oh, my goodness.

I'm so sorry. I say he's great now. He's a thriving, like, 15-year-old freshman in high school. I say he suffered the physical wounds, but my husband and I suffered the emotional wounds. Oh, without question. We have done a lot of work, but he received a settlement from that accident that after attorney's fees and insurance companies negotiated, totaled about $180,000. Yeah, his dad and I are financially, like,

debt-free, stable. So we have like college plans for him. We have no need to access that money. So as far as we are concerned, it's his money and it's been invested for him. It actually has had some growth. It's worth about $215,000 now. Wow. Yeah. So my concern, well, it's kind of a twofold question.

That money becomes his at 18. And so I'm not sure there's any way I can legally kind of safeguard it to protect it from, you know, decisions that 18-year-old boys can make other than we've tried to raise our son to be fiscally responsible. And then also, what is the best avenue for that money? Do we continue just to keep it invested in the market or is there something we can do about it? What kind of fund is it in right now?

I'd have to go look. I mean, I think it's in like kind of some mixed index. We had our financial planner just invest it. Okay. Okay.

Yeah, I mean, that's pretty significant growth. Yeah, well, yeah, and the market, you know. But you opened the account in his name, or do you guys have any authority over it? It seems like you have the authority over it, yes? I do, but from what legally was explained to us, that I'm the trustee, it becomes his money at 18. At 18, because the lawsuit was in his, yeah.

I don't know the answer to this, Rachel, but could she as a trustee put that in a trust? Put it within? I don't know. I would get legal advice. I really would. I would sit with one of your... We would send you to SmartVestor Pro. I would get some legal advice on this. That would be the only thing. And I don't know the answer, but I would go, okay, as the trustee...

I have authority over it until the kid turns 18. Yeah. So what decision? So this is the, I don't have the answer, but I think I have the right question. I want Rachel to correct me if this is the wrong question, but I would be asking, what can I do, he and his father, me and his father do as his trustees with that money to further protect it?

Okay. And that's what I would look into. You may not be able to do anything. I just feel that there's got to be something that you guys can do with that money as the trustees that would maybe push it out, maybe to maybe put it in a trust. Yeah, somebody can answer that question. I wish I knew the answer, but I would be looking into that. Rachel, you agree? Yeah, because, yeah, and I think the goal, you know, because it's amazing you guys have college and all of it is that

is he doesn't touch it. I mean, the only reason I would use that money if I were him, and you could kind of walk through this with him, which I know you guys probably have had these conversations, but I'm like, you know, if you're a 25 year old kid and you can buy a house and start your life off debt free, you know what I mean? Like the things that you can try. So would you put a limit on it? What gauge would you, I'm curious, what age would you recommend Rachel that he have access to these things? I would like him to be out of college.

I think that would be ideal, right? So 21, 22 years old. What do you think, Mom? Is that where your head's at? Well, yeah. And his dad and I, like I said, we have a 529 plan for him. We're debt-free. We have a large net worth ourselves. And so he doesn't have to worry about finances through college. And so ideally, I think...

What we would like him to do is to have it to start his life with. That's right. When he's done with grad school or college, he shouldn't have a need for it before then. That's right. That's right. Yeah, I agree. And so to start your life debt-free and then with a chunk of money that has continued to have compounded growth over the next 20... Because if he's 15 now... 10 more years. Yeah, 10 years. Yeah.

It's wild. That's going to be some really nice money. Yeah. Tiffany, I think that's the question to ask. And again... And if you can protect it, that doesn't feel like overly controlling. I mean, if he's 32 and you're like...

I'm still pretty, you know, like that's one thing, but to get them out of college, like, yeah, I feel like in college, everyone just doesn't make smart decisions between 18 and 21. So it's like, Oh yeah. And I should correct myself for these. We have people listen. I said 10 years. I was thinking 25, give it 10 years to grow. And now he's, you know, he gets out. Cause, and I'm not disagreeing with either one of you ladies, but,

But there's part of me that if I'm putting myself in this situation, I want him to come out of college, which you guys have been so amazing to save up for him. I want him to get out there and make it on his own for a couple years before he comes into this wealth.

Yeah. Yeah. I see where I'm going. I'm not saying delay it to 35 or that. No. Right. Right. Right. But either way is right. But the point is, is that's what you got to figure out is how can you extend it beyond 18 if you can. Yeah. Yeah. Until he's out of college would be my goal with it. It's a lot of money to start with. But from a legal standpoint, I mean, like, like an up my account, like all that kind of stuff, it does turn over, you know, but I would sit down and have a real mature, mature

conversation and even show him i mean i don't know how intrigued a 18 year old would be at that point but but pull up an investment calculator and just say hey if you just you don't need this money let's pretend it's not there and when you're 22 23 24 like when you can watch it uh as it grows and at that amount of money you're it's gonna well you know you make a great point tiffany does he know about the uh 215

He is aware of it. He does know about it, and he's actually seen some of the financial statements just because he's a very intelligent 15-year-old, and he has his own checking and savings already because we wanted to teach him fiscal responsibility, and he's actually a great saver. And so he enjoys seeing this growth already that it's had. So we're trying to instill those values because we felt like,

that it's better to use this to help teach lessons. Yeah, sure. So that's why I ask. I'm wondering, are you guys sitting down with him going, hey, so $215,000, it could be this in three years or five years. What do you think you do with that? Are you having those conversations just to see where his immature, even though he's a great kid, he's still 15, where does his head go on these things? What does he say?

He says to buy a house one day. Yeah. Good. That's a great answer. It's a great answer. He didn't say buy a Porsche, which isn't a bad idea, but the point is, it's like, that's a pretty mature response. So I think talking with him about it and letting him take some ownership before he ever can touch it is an interesting way to go about it, Rachel. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm like, you know, which the,

judicial system did its work. But I'm like, as a 10-year-old kid, what you went through, like, you know what I mean? Like this money, it's not that it heals, you know, the wounds and the scars and the memories of what happened by any stretch of the imagination. But for him to feel the weight of what you, you know, this is,

Again, I don't even... I hate comparing money to like a medical situation. But we don't want to go and waste all of this because what you went through, this money is worth more than that. You know what I mean? That's a great point. That feeling of what you guys went through as a family. I'm like, honor this money because it came...

because of a horrible cost and we don't want to, you know, and I would say the same is true with inheritances. When people get an inheritance that, you know, use that to further that person's legacy and something that they would be proud of, you know, so you kind of take it in that vein as well. But to me, I'm so thankful you guys are okay and that he's okay. And,

And great parenting. Model the way. By the way, you guys have done a great job. Your financial situation is great. So that's what we want you to do. Go talk to people who know the answers to that locally on the ground, and you'll know what you can do next. Rachel Cruz, great show. Thank you, my friend, for always hanging out. Great time. I want to thank Austin and the team for keeping us on the air. This is The Ramsey Show.

Hey, folks, Dave Ramsey here. You know, budgeting doesn't have to be boring. You just need a budgeting app that's made with you in mind, and that's EveryDollar. The EveryDollar app has helped millions of people work the baby steps and take the stress out of planning and managing their money. Start budgeting with EveryDollar for free right now. Just go to RamseySolutions.com slash EveryDollar and download the app today. That's RamseySolutions.com slash EveryDollar.