Cut Debt out of Your Life, One Credit Card at a Time
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Welcome to the Ramsey Show, where we help you win in your life. We help you win with your money. We help you win in your work. And we help you win in your relationships. All three of those are so connected. And we want you to have peace so that you can live the life that you desire to live. I'm Ken Coleman, the incomparable, the fabulous...

Jade Warshaw is joining me. She makes me look so much better. I'm always happy when you're here because you make me sound better. You're helping them win with the fashion. Look at this jacket. You like the jacket today? All right. All right. We're off to a good start, folks. 888-825-5225 is the phone number. 888-825-5225. Jade's going to help you out, lead on the money questions, and I'm going to help out and lead on the income questions.

question. We want you making mo' money so we can get rid of those money problems. Heidi's going to start us off in Columbus, Ohio. Heidi, how can we help today?

Hi, thanks for taking my call. So it's kind of a two-part question. We have two special needs kiddos. They're little, but we know going forth we're going to be dealing with this at least the rest of our lives with helping them with their health needs. But we're strapped right now. I've taken about a 20-hour workweek job because I wasn't working.

and we have no margin. So I'm struggling with, is there a way that I could maximize my 20-ish hours of work time? Because when I work more...

things just fall through the cracks. That's what we've been finding because my husband can't hold it down. My husband has been at his job for nine and a half years and he's not getting a big raise. So we're just, you know, looking at it from, okay, how do we, we're living at, we have cut everything, but this is going to be our lives like with the kiddos. So how do you guys have any tips or help or any ideas how we can maximize? Because I guess,

We aren't even able to really save for retirement at this point. So it is overwhelming. Yeah. So if what I'm hearing, you guys have cut to the absolute bone. So this is 100% about we need more income. Is that what we're hearing? Yes. Okay. What does your husband do? What space is he in?

Yep, he's an analyst, and he works in food distribution. So he does a lot of problem solving and analyzing things. What does he make? He makes $62K a year and no real bonuses. Okay, $62K a year, and he's an analyst. Is that on the technical side, or is it on the logistic side? Logistic side. Okay. Okay.

Well, so there's two things. Very simple. Okay. And it's going to sound simple when I just say it, but now we've got to actually go do what I'm going to tell you. And so if he were sitting with me right now, I'd say, okay, you've got experience and you've got skill as an analyst. You're in logistics right now, but you could probably...

move over into the technical side of things and technology right now would be one space that I would have him look at because he can get trained and qualified pretty quickly.

And, again, he has transferable skills and experience with a path upward is where technology is going. And he's kind of in process, not kind of, he's in the process type of work. And I just think he has to upskill. And that's going to take a little bit of time.

And unfortunately, some money and Jade can weigh in there. She knows how to. I'm telling you, she can find money and I want her to weigh in on that. But I would be looking for him. He needs to be adding 20 to 40 thousand dollars to that income would be his goal. And that would make a sizable change in your life. Yes or no.

Oh, that'd be huge. Okay. So he's, because of the kiddos, because you're the CEO of the house and you've already said this lovingly, when you're out, it drops through the cracks. And that's what it would be like in Stacey and I's relationship too. If Stacey was out there doing stuff and I was left to try to figure it out, Jade, it'd be a four alarm fire. You know this to be true. So I get that. So I think we want to focus on him right now. And so he needs to be thinking about where can I pivot

so that I'm on a ladder and I'm making six figures. That is not an aggressive goal. I think it's a very realistic goal. And so I'm going to do a couple of things here because I want to get Jade in here on the money thing, because here's what I want to bring you in on. And I'm going to give her something really quick. But mentally here, there's potentially a minimal cost

for him to do some upskilling. And so I want you to weigh in on that because she's already feeling like, but real quick, right-handed to Jade. Heidi, we're going to give you, when we put you on hold in a second, I want to give you your husband the Find the Work You're Wired to Do book and it comes with the Get Clear Assessment because it's going to help him not be so intimidated as it comes to ideating what are his options right now. And then not only will we give you that, Christian will also set him up if he'd like to call my show.

where I can actually coach your hubs directly because I believe that we can actually help him map out, and I've helped a lot of people increase their income. So I want to do that because I can't do that with him right now. Is that okay? Can we do that? Oh, that'd be great. Yes, thank you. All right, so I want to bring Jade in here. Jade, what do you see in here? What are your thoughts? Ken, I think you're exactly right. We talk all the time about getting your income up, and it's usually divided between two

ideas. It's either side hustle, which is kind of a short-term way to accomplish some goals. But if your core income isn't right, the next way is your core income. And that's really the problem here. But to your point, it's true. When you set out to get your core income up, you have to know this is a journey over time and you're going to have to make the investment of time

And money, you're probably going to have to get your skill sets up. That might cost some money for some people is, yeah, it's upskilling. It's getting a certificate. It might be continued education for some people. It's the job market I'm in is not great. And so let's move to a place where there's a better job market. So just understanding that it's not a light switch that you flip that immediately, you know, you're upping your income by $40,000. This is a journey. That's right. And Ken,

Kudos to you for offering that coaching. That's very valuable and I think that that's going to... We can get him there. Now, one other thing I want to mention, Heidi, with Jade here, because you're a full-time mama and a full-time pro. Working on it. You got two youngsters. Yeah. She's had some unique challenges. That's right. What I want you to address is, okay, she needs to keep working those 20 hours and it's really hard. What

What are some options to get some help, Heidi? Is there a grandma in your church or a lady who, she's raised kids, and she could step in that gap to where your husband's not feeling all that weight? Because we still need those 20 hours of income right now. We do. And I think it's important, the same way we're looking at how to maximize his income, there probably are ways that you can maximize your 20 hours. What are you doing right now and what are you getting paid?

Yeah, I'm a front-end helper at a local boutique studio, so I get paid $15 an hour. I do get a little commission, but it's still irregular. I can't even, sometimes it's $30, you know, a month. But it was the most flexible was working more the nighttime shifts, you know what I mean? So that was why we took it. What does that nighttime shift look like for you? Really quick, we only got about a minute. What's that nighttime shift look like?

I've been working 3 to 8 or 2 to 8 because he's at home in the afternoon. 2 p.m. to 8 p.m.? Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. You know, here's what I'm going to recommend. I'm going to recommend a Target, a Walmart, a big box store. Make $18, $20 an hour. To where we could get a couple more bucks an hour because everything matters right now. It does. That's a big difference. And the more experience you get, who knows, you might be able to pop into, you know, another type of job that you're doing.

remotely that they have the ability to pay you more because it's remote work. So look into that. Virtual assistants make a lot of money. Hang on the line, Heidi. We're going to get that resource for your husband and I'd love to schedule a call with him. We can change his name, location, all that to protect the privacy there, but he can be making more money and should be, and that's going to change your life. Thanks for trusting us. Thanks for the call. Hang in there, mama. It's going to get better. You guys are doing a great job. This is The Ramsey Show.

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Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman and Jade Warshaw is with me. The phone number for you is 888-825-

888-825-5225. We'd love to get your question. You know, we talk about this all the time, Jay. The best way to make the most of your money is to create a what? A budget. Oh, she's the budget queen. She's the budget queen. And our signature, and we believe the best budgeting tool out there, is EveryDollar. It's going to make it really simple for you to do that very thing, to budget, to plan your spending.

See where the money's going through tracking the expenses. And this is going to allow you to have the margin you need to save for what you need to save for, obviously to get you through the baby steps. And that's how you're winning with money. You can download every dollar for free in the App Store or Google Play, or you can click in the link below.

in the description here in the show notes if you are taking in the show via YouTube or podcast. And if you are setting up your budget for the first time, George and I, Ken, did a video that shows you exactly how to set up your every dollar budget for the first time. It literally takes five minutes. So if you're looking at the Ramsey show on YouTube, just...

search it in there and you'll find it setting up your every dollar budget. All right, let's get back to the phones. Toronto is where Jason is joining us. Jason, how can we help? Hey guys, thanks for taking my call. Actually, I have some questions in regards to

I wanted to consolidate a lot of my debt into my mortgage because I'm finding I'm doing a lot of Peter Pays Paul and I'm not really being anywhere paying off my debt. My bank has actually suggested a home equity line of credit, which I believe is known as a HELOC. Now, George, I believe you're not a fan of HELOCs and I don't know enough about them. Well, George is not with us, but you are correct that he is also not a fan of it. None of us are a fan. Nor are we. Here's the thing. So...

Let's let's let's stop right there, because you told me you're doing a lot of robbing Peter to pay Paul, right? Yeah. And this is essential. This would be you continuing that pattern if you do this, because you'd be robbing the equity in your mortgage to pay. And I pay in air quotes because you're not really paying it off. You're just moving the debt truly to a more risky place.

You're moving it from kind of having a freestanding location out there in the abyss to now being connected to your home, which means if for some reason you fall on even harder times and you have a hard time paying that debt, now your home is at risk.

Whereas before you could have chosen, hey, no matter what, I'm paying my mortgage. I'm keeping these four walls. And that's what I'm doing right now. So for that reason, it's not a good idea. Tell us more about your debt and let us offer a situation that's going to give you less stress. Sure. I mean, I currently got 18 years left on my mortgage, which is at $134,000. And then I have a truck loan that's out there at $56,000. I've got five years left on that. $56,000? Yeah.

$56,000. Okay. And then I have a couple of line of credit, personal line of credit and a couple of consumer cards. Tell me the personal line of credits. Yeah. So I have a personal line of credit that's at $16,000 at 9%. Okay. And most of my percentages are all at 10 and 9%. Yikes. Okay. For interest rates. Okay. Not over that. My truck loan is at 3.9%.

So basically totaling all my personal debt is $78,000 right now. So you got $78,000 and it's between trucks, personal loans, and what was the last thing? Just trucks and personal. It's all trucks and line of credit. I have three different line of credit. And can you tell me the amounts on the other line of credits? You've got the $16,000. Tell me the others. Yeah, sure. I got $16,000. I have one that's at $26,900.

And I have one that's at $84. $84. Okay. Well, we're paying that one off. I'm working hard. I'm paying those. That's right. Okay. Gotcha. Okay. So I get what, I see your line of thought. Your line is like, let me simplify this. I'm going to throw it all into one payment. Let's consolidate this. But honestly. By doing that, I figured I was saving myself roughly $750 a month. Yeah. You're filtering it through. You're filtering it through interest rates.

And you're filtering it through, like I said, kind of like a simplicity mindset of like, I'll put it all in one spot. But psychologically, you're putting yourself in a tougher spot because what's going to happen here is you're going to throw it onto the mortgage. And not only are you putting your home at risk, but now it's kind of like out of sight, out of mind. It's not bothering me. And you've pulled it out of your equity. Right.

So there's many, many ways I could coach you here. I'm not going to go into the initial purpose of buying a house, but just really quick. Remember the reason that you bought a house is because you wanted stability and it was a way for you to build wealth. If you roll this into your home, you're eliminating both of those things.

You're eliminating the stability that you had in your mortgage and you're eliminating the wealth and the equity that you'd built up in your mortgage. So just throwing that out there. Let's talk about a way that we can do this that psychologically will allow you to accomplish it faster. So tell us about your income.

So income is roughly about $45,000 a year. My monthly expenses is $42,058. Okay. What do you do for a living? Bookkeeping. Bookkeeping and tax person. Okay.

I do have my own corporation and my corporation pays me out in dividend. Got you. So anything that my corporation has, I pay myself and whatever the profit. Are you maxed out right now as far as clients and time? No, not. I am still expanding because I'm still relatively new. COVID actually was a good thing for me being that I was able to start this own business because I had two part-time jobs and now I've gone to one full-time, which is this one. Okay.

I am expanding yearly. In the last three years, my wage has gone from 50 to, like, my business-wise has gone from 50 to 70 to 85 last year. But that's not what you're paying yourself. But that's not what I'm paying myself. That's correct. Can you pay yourself more?

Or there's nothing there? At this present time, no. At this present time, no. That's why I'm still expanding my clients. Okay. So, and Ken's going to talk to you more about this, but the glaring problem here is your income.

That's why this is strangling you. And so there might be, Ken's going to advise you on that, but it might be something that you pick up something else until you can get this income up. But for you, even a side hustle at this point is just a bandaid because until that income gets up to a point where it's not, you know, very...

very, very difficult to handle this, it's going to be a problem. Because at the end of the day, what we're doing is we're listing these out smallest to largest. But if there's no margin to make any payment beyond minimum payments, then we're treading water, right? So, Ken, give them some juice. Well, with somebody with your experience, you need to be doing way more. I'm a numbers guy. Yeah, but you need to be doing way more work.

You need to be offering your services. You need to max out. This working for yourself needs to feel like overtime. Yeah, because is that 45 gross or is that what you're netting, your pay? That's what I'm netting.

Okay. 45 is what I'm adding. Okay. Okay. Still. Still. So basically I'm paying myself about $5,000 a month and I've got about $4,200 in expenses. Right. But are you paying yourself everything that comes in the door out of this business?

Yes. Yeah, that's what I thought. So we've got to max out. So essentially, basically what it is is I've got 15% going to the government, 25% is going to my corporation to cover some of my house bills because I can run some of my business. No, we get it. Yeah, we know. We get it. We get it. What I'm saying is – The rest of it is mine. I get it, but we're on the same page. But you've got to make more money.

And there needs to be some intensity, not just on walking the baby steps out, as Jade has told you. There needs to be some intensity for you right now to dig yourself out of this. And with your bookkeeping experience, all the number crunching, you need to be offering your services left, right, north, south, all over the place.

And I might even consider a part-time job, you know, if it's not just a contracted new client. Don't limit yourself to your traditional business model right now. You need to be working because you, my friend, have over leveraged yourself and you got to stop this stuff right now and you got to have money to knock it out or else this is going to take way longer than it needs to. Yeah. Do you file? I mean, tax time is going to be coming up. Do you file taxes? Do you do returns and that sort of thing? Yes. Yes. And that's my prime time.

Okay, that's your prime time. Yeah, I do both. I have my regular monthly clients, but then I'm doing hours of overtime to get all my income back. When is that? What time of year? Our season is Family Day, which is mid-February to the end of April. All right, so you already know that's your hot zone, but I'm talking you've got to create a hot zone right now. Right now. This is all about income. This is all about income. You've got to get your income up.

And then Jade, what does he do with all that extra income? Don't fool yourself by consolidating this. We found that people who consolidate their debt feel like they've done something. And especially when you roll it into your house, you feel like the debt's actually gone. And then you end up going deeper into debt again. So cautionary tale, I'm telling you because I know we take these calls day after day. I'm not making this up. Don't consolidate your debt. Pay it off smallest to largest. Thanks for the call, Jason. Appreciate it. Get after it, my friend. That's your theme right now. This is The Ramsey Show.

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Welcome back to the Ramsey Show, America. Thrilled that you're here. We want to help you win with your money, win in your work, and win in your relationships. The phone number is 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225. I'm Ken Coleman. Jay Warshaw is alongside. Yay, yay. And in the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt-free stage, we've got Jeff and Carrie. Hello, guys. Hello. What's up? Where are you guys from?

Salt Lake City, Utah. Salt Lake City, Utah. All right. So give us a story. You're here for a debt-free scream. How much debt did we pay off? We paid off $353,000. Wow. And how long? That took us just a little over nine years. Uh-oh. I sniffed something out right here. I know. Ask away. Does that include the house? It sure does. Okay. Woo!

That's amazing. That is amazing. It puts you in a really rarefied class. Dave likes to call those people weird people. It's his line. I can't take it. Do you guys feel weird or do you feel great?

Our kids would tell us we're super weird. Nice. Well, by the way, all kids think their parents are weird. So that's a good sign that you're doing something right. Nine years. That is a journey. I mean, you're sniffing a decade right there. Yeah. Yeah. It felt like it would never end at times. So take us back to nine years ago. What was the impetus for this journey?

Okay. So what happened was we got out of school and we had purchased this house. And between the two, we just felt like we were kind of drowning in debt at that point. When we went through school, we took out a $54,000 loan by the end of it. And we took as much money as they would give us so that we could raise our family because we didn't want our family not being able to eat, not being able to have the things they need. And so...

We didn't know about Dave Ramsey at the time, and so we just took everything we could and got mounted up quite a bit of debt. All right, so let me jump in here. What do you guys do for a living? And I'd love to know the range of income here now that we got the start of this journey. So we're both software engineers. Okay, wow. And then when we started... Yeah, when we started, we were only... When we moved into the home, I was making $85,000, and Carrie wasn't working. She was home with the kids. Sure. And then...

we're all the way up to 325,000. Whoa. Mama. I mean, those are great, great jobs. Yeah. With, with a lot of opportunity. Wow. That is really interesting. So, okay. So much like everybody else in the culture. Yeah. It,

they say, if you want it, we've got it. We'll give you a loan for it. And you guys kind of fell into that trap. Like so many, what was the moment that you were like enough of this? I'm tired of playing this game. I want to opt out. Tell us about that moment and what caused it, what spurred it. Yeah. I just remember sitting at home and thinking we have this huge student loan and, and,

we somehow need to pay this off before our kids start going to school. So we kind of set that goal of how can we pay these loans off before our kids start going to school? Cause they're going to need debt too, to finance their lives. And that's kind of the mindset we had is we just need to start paying off the debt so we can eventually finish at some point. So stop the cycle. Right. How'd you discover this plan?

So really, I was just talking about this problem with my sister and she's like, hey, have you ever heard this guy named Dave Ramsey? I was like, no, never heard of him. And so she said, yeah, he wrote this book called The Totally Money Makeover. You should go read it. And so I read it and immediately was like, yes, this is a plan. And just, I think our kind of analytical brains started kicking in and, you know, that's kind of how we think about it is step by step. And so it totally made sense for us. It took

took Kerry a little bit longer to get along. He had to get me on board. I didn't think we had a problem because you hear like credit cards are bad, credit cards are bad, but you never hear like student loans are bad. Sure. So I was like, we don't have credit card debt. We never did that. Yeah. We just have this one student loan.

Yeah, and you're right because that's a very interesting point, Jade, because a student loan is tied culturally to a very good thing. It's an investment into your education, yes. Yeah, that is interesting. Yeah, that's real. So you both do the same type of work, but like when you were computing, do we do this plan, it kind of, it didn't hit you the same, Carrie. Yeah, it didn't hit me the same. Well, I was running the numbers of how long it would take us and he would make spreadsheets and charts and...

That's a long journey we're signing up for. Yeah, you're busy as it is. Yeah. And adding all the sacrifice in there. All right, so once you got on board, how intense was it? I mean, how intense? Because we got the student loans, and then eventually we decided to take care of the house. Yeah. Like, once he got me on board, it was like, and we had the momentum from finishing the student loan. It was like, why stop there? You know? And I kept hearing, you know, Dave say, like, get a bigger shovel. And so...

I went back to work full time. So that really helped. Yeah. To me, it was seeming like, how are we going to get to the end of this? And we were only about maybe a year and a half, two years out at that point, but we were walking down the street one day.

And she looked at me and she said, you know, what if I went back to work full time? And that thought had never crossed my mind. Are you serious? As a dude, are you shooting me straight? That did not cross your mind? Hey, when we've got five kids, two girls going to dance, dance is not cheap.

Oh, no, I get it. And you're shuttling them around everywhere, competition. They were constantly being shuttled. But hey, we realized that, hey, it's worth it and it's going to change our lives forever. And we need to do this. At what point in the journey did you go back to work in the nine years? So it was a year ago. Oh, wow. How much did that juice the income? By how much? So I make $135,000. Sweet. Sweet.

That's a big deal. I'm giving you mad love on this, Jeff, because as a guy, maybe this is me, but I know she was busy. Carrie, I know. But I'd still be going, man, she's got a great degree. I mean, that income's real, Jay. That's real. Because the way I look at that is we teach we here. So I'm going, we could get a $135,000 raise. I'm impressed with him. Yeah, that ain't a little bit. Because I promise you, if she'd have said that to me on the walk, I'd have fallen over.

So, and this might be a loaded question, but I relate to the journey. And so a lot of these were really hard years. Like you guys were cutting back a lot. And of course it got juicy in the last year. During the, what I'm going to call beans and rice, rice and beans years, what was the hardest part? I mean, what were the sacrifices? Because you had to have been cutting it thin with five kids and one income. Yeah, I think some of the biggest ones are probably the cars. Yeah.

So, you know, at work they've got the parking spots that you can reserve, but it turns out you can only reserve them if you have certain years models of cars. What? And so mine was the 2005 CRV and they said, sorry, your car doesn't qualify. This is car discrimination. That's like when you go to the valet, like you go to a nice restaurant and you valet the car, but they only put the nice ones like in the front where you can see them. Like put that one in the back over there. Put that one where the staff parks.

That's a trip. I've never heard that before. Oh, my gosh. All right. So real quick, I'd ask you if you two are both going to tell people the key from your own perspective to actually winning in this journey, what's the key for you guys? I think it's, you know, don't give up. It's like it's a long journey, you know, and we live in like instant gratification. I want it now. I want it now.

But just keep going. Like once we decided to do it, like we're doing it. Like you can't keep changing your mind. Like is this really worth it or not? You know, you have to be committed because it's a long journey. Love it. All right, so we got the kiddos with us. Let's get them up on the stage and get them ready for the screen. Tell us who we got. So we have Bradley, who's 16. Emma, 15.

Alyssa, 13. Christopher, 11. And Dylan, who is 9. All right. Is everybody practiced? Are they ready, we think? They are ready. Okay. All right. Let's get to this. We got Jeff and Carrie along with Bradley, Emma, Alyssa, Christopher, and Dylan, all from Salt Lake City. They paid off, Jade, $353,000.

Yeah, yeah. Over nine years, and that includes, folks, their house. Jeff and Carrie and fam, take it away. Let's hear your debt-free scream. Okay, one, two, three. We're debt-free! Woo! Wow. Yeah! I mean, that's a chorus. Ha ha!

That was impressive. They were all in sync. They were. I think the kids are excited about it. Yeah. I mean, because we got some teens and preteens, and usually those age groups, they're not excited about anything. No, no, no. They could care less, but this is a big deal. What a great family. The whole house paid off almost a decade. That is what this is all about. Thank you all so much for sharing that with us. All right. Quick break. We're going to go out and high-five this awesome family, and we'll be back with more of The Ramsey Show.

I've been doing this show for over 30 years, and some of the saddest calls I have taken are from situations that are completely preventable. Yeah, and what's so hard is I feel like one of those, especially the ones that I'm like, oh, it's terrible, are people that call in and their spouse has passed away suddenly, and they don't have life insurance. When you have to think through how am I going to pay my bills...

I'm going to eat next week. Yeah, in the middle of all that grief. Like it's just, it is, it's terrible. So life insurance is the one thing, especially as a mom with three little kids that I'm like so big on for people to get because it's inexpensive. Zander is the place that Winston and I actually get all of our life insurance. And it doesn't cost much because Zander shops among a gazillion different companies. It doesn't cost much. You just have to admit that someday you're not going to be here.

You got to say it out loud and you got to say, I'm going to say I love you to my family by taking care of them and taking the time to put this stuff in place. The cost of stinking pizza. To get a free quote, call 800-356-4282. That's 800-356-4282 or go to zander.com. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman and Jade Warshaw is with me and we are here for you. Triple A.

825-5225. Rick is up in Syracuse, New York. Rick, how can we help? Hey, how you doing today?

I'm kind of in that struggle of being in college and not being sure what I should do next. I'm a professional athlete as well as playing collegiate sports. I play collegiate and professional lacrosse. And I know that's not the moneymaker, but I'm just not sure if I should continue studying or if I should find another venture outside of school. How long have you been in college?

This is my second year. After this year, I'll get my associate's degree. It'll be in business administration with a heavy course load in accounting and communications. Okay. Well, no matter what we come up with here in the next few minutes, my advice is since you're almost there to the two-year associates, I'd go ahead and play this part out for sure.

because there's some value to that. So the question is, when anybody asks me this, is should I go to college or should I drop out? The answer is, is college the only way? In other words, the degree, the four-year degree at this point, is it the only way to do what you want to do, or is it the best way to do what you want to do? That's my two-part question. It's never going to change. I'm never going to change on that, because to me it's all about practicality. It's time and money you're spending right now,

And so the question is, and I think I know the answer, do you have a clear idea or do you have a couple of ideas that are floating around in your head about what you would do outside of being a lacrosse player?

Yeah, I have a couple ideas, but nothing really concrete, I guess. All right. Give me the couple ideas, and we'll go idea one, then idea two. If I were to get my associates, and then I would go to a four-year next year, most likely on scholarship. That's the one thing. Because of being an athlete and having good grades, I have little to no debt, and I will have little to no debt, even if I pursue more school. Okay, that's a good option.

So, and then, so it would be by, I think, halfway through the, if I were to take a trimester on my junior year, at the end of that trimester, I would be able to sit for the CPA exam to become an accountant. Okay. So, idea one. I thought about that for a while. You thought about that for a while. Okay. And what's idea number two?

Idea number two is some sort of business venture into the sports world, whether it's coaching younger kids or connecting students to college coaches or professional coaches or something along that nature. Okay. And is there any other idea that floats around or pops up from time to time that we might call idea three? It's okay if there isn't. Yeah. Okay. I can't think of one. All right. Let's stay with those two. Okay.

I don't know about my good friend, Jade, but Jade, I see two very, very, very of the spectrum on idea one and idea two. Idea one is accounting, which is very process-driven work. Idea two, which was kind of a nebulous description, but it would be in the sports world, some type of bridge, but it's very people-driven. So I see process work.

and I see people work on the ends of the spectrum. Do you see that part? I see it. That's very interesting. So, Rick, my question is, which one of those would you choose if you could only choose one today, and on the end of that choice was absolute success and terrific meaning? Which one would you choose if I said you could only have one of those? Sports, for sure. Yeah, I knew that. I could hear it, number one, in his voice, but what I think has got you –

kind of stuck in why you called today is because that sports direction, that's all you gave us was kind of a direction. It's not the clearest path. And therein lies, Rick, why you're feeling stuck. Because the other one is super clear and definable. I go and I sit for my CPA exam, and that allows me some pretty clear options going forward. The other one, the way you described it, you just haven't figured out what a destination could be.

And I think you've got to come up with a couple of real tangible destinations. In other words, and I'm not going to hang these on you, Rick, because I don't want to.

But one idea would be, do I become an agent? Another one is, do I become a coach? Another one is, do I step into some type of advisory role? You know, another one could be athletic director. And then the other one could be because of NIL, do you combine? And this is an idea that I had, Jade. So I'm going to throw this to you, Rick. Do I combine that ability to crunch numbers? Because I think that's what's leading you down the CPA path. You're good with numbers. Is that true or false?

Yeah, pretty good with numbers. Yeah, pretty organized dude, aren't you? Yeah, pretty logical. And so I wonder if some type of role in NIL, because you're a college athlete, you have entree into a world that I do not have entree. I would have to kick some doors down. Interesting. And I wonder about NIL and the money side of NIL and athletes and how these athletic departments, because Jade, as you know, this is the wild, wild west. Thoughts, Rick?

Or questions for Jade and I? Yeah. He's processing. I guess I really haven't even explored because I've just been kind of stuck in the midst of everything moving so quickly. Right. So, Rick, here's my actual advice, okay? And I want Jade to weigh in. My advice is exactly what you just said. I was pointing out to you that you have to explore and explore intentionally and intensely right now.

Because I'm not at a place where I can say yay or nay on should you drop out of the next two years of school. We've both told you we think you ought to finish the associates because you're there. But I am going to say I'm not sure. And I'd say hold on deciding about finishing the four-year program.

Because I first want you to determine what are my options in the sports route. You have already told us that you would prefer to work in the area of sports. Bingo. So now we're clear on that part. Now your homework assignment is to do the research and actually talk to real people, men and women, who are holding down positions that

in the multiple different jobs or career paths within college sports or pro sports. Make sense? Yep. So here's what this looks like because I want to simplify this. Make a list.

And I started a list. By the way, you may cross off every one that I gave you, which is okay. But that's the exercise. Would I be interested in being an agent? Go do some homework, talk to somebody. Would I be interested in being an athletic director? What do you think, Jade? I think that's his homework assignment. And then we come up with two or three that we're actually going, I would be fulfilled. And I think I've got the chops, the talent to do that. And so now I ask the question, do I need to finish the degree?

I I'm 100% with Ken. I think when you're looking in an area that's a little bit more vague and it's not the career path that everybody's suggesting job after job after job, you kind of have to do your research. I think.

I think it is in many ways like excavating, like you start in one layer and the more you dig in, you find all these new opportunities that people just aren't talking about in day-to-day conversation. It doesn't mean that they're not there. I experienced that in music. It was like, well, if you want to be a musician, everybody was telling me kind of like these top layer superficial jobs that felt way out of reach. But when you keep digging, you find there's a whole world of opportunity. If you just dig in, you start making connections. And before you just keep

My husband and I had this framework of thought. If there's a door handle, we turn it and we find out what's behind the door and what the opportunity is. You learn more about it. You give it a try. And then that leads to another door of opportunity. Real quick, tell your story. That's how you get on cruises and make really good money and pay off half a million dollars. You never saw that, did you? No one was talking about that. When I was in school, Rick, it was like, okay, if you're in music, you're going to be a teacher. You're going to be a band director.

Maybe you'll become Britney Spears or Beyonce. And if that's not the case, good luck to you, right? No one talked about that there's a whole world. You can work on cruise lines and you can work in theaters and you can be a talent agent and you can be a booker. All these things. Nobody was talking about that. It wasn't until we dug deeper into Ken's point. You find people who are doing what you want to do and you interview them and you go to work with them and you do all those things and you see a whole world.

a whole Pandora's box of opportunity. You and Sam both. Rick, both Jay and Sam have been individually and then together they've been wildly successful in what would be a non-traditional entertainment gig. That's right. And the proof is in the pudding. So Rick, hang on the line. I'm going to give you a copy of my number one bestselling book. It's called The Proximity Principle. And it's going to make all this connecting things strategically to see what opportunities are out there really simple to follow. So that's my gift to you. So head up to

Don't sell your soul to the safe accounting job. Not yet. I don't see it. Not ever. I don't see it. Thank you. I agree. Good hour, Jay Borshaw. Thank you, America, for listening. This is The Ramsey Show.

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Welcome to the Ramsey Show, where we help you win in your life, America. Specifically, winning in your money, winning in your work, and winning in your relationships. The phone number for us to coach you up is 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225. The dynamo next to me is the one, the only, Jade Warshaw. I'm Ken Coleman.

She'll take lead on the money calls and help you manage the money. And I want to help you make more money. So it's a good combo. Let's get right to it. We're going to go to Denver, Colorado. Peter is there. Peter, how can we help today? Hi, guys. Thanks for taking my call. You bet.

So I'm calling in because my wife and I are in baby step two and trying to get out of debt. And about a year and a half ago, I got my wife a horse lease started because she loved being with horses and working with them. She was at the time volunteering at a horse center for people with disabilities. So she got to...

basically just shovel poop and be around horses, but didn't get to ride ever. And I saw how much joy that was bringing her. So I got her this horse leash. What's that mean? Can you explain that more to me? Yeah, I've never heard of that.

Yeah, so basically we pay $350 a month and she can go out to this property and ride the horse whenever she wants. Her, myself and the kids actually. So it's been a lot of fun, but I'm wondering if we're being irresponsible since we're in baby step two.

Um, is it, can I ask more? I'm just going to dig deeper on the horse lease real quick. So is it, there's several horses on the property and she can ride any horse or does she kind of get assigned a horse that's like, that's her horse? Tell me more about it. Is it personal? Is it? Yeah. So we just have the one horse that we have access to. And how long is, how long have you been doing this? About a year and a half. Year and a half. And the idea of her giving this up is met with what kind of reaction?

Um, not great. Uh, a lot of tears and, um, she feels like it just helps her a lot emotionally. Um, yeah. How, and wow. How long would you have to give it up? I mean, how long is you guys' journey? Are we talking? So I don't, so we have like 21,000 in debt. I've got 3000 on the last credit card. Um,

$5,000. Maybe it's over $21,000. So $5,000 on my truck. And then I just got a personal loan for $15,000 to cover last year's taxes because that was the first year we'd ever had to pay taxes. Okay. So you're at $23,000 now. Yeah. Okay. So is that it or is there more? That's it. Okay. And what's the income? Sorry, Ken. No, go ahead.

um make about 120 000 oh okay so why this is going to be gone in a year you're going to live on 100 and you're going to knock this out in one year or less yeah shooting for like nine months yeah good for you can she work or does she work outside the home uh so she homeschools our three boys and stays at home um that's not what i asked can she work

She does sometimes. I'm a trim carpenter, and so when we're done with houses, the general contractor that I work for will hire her to go in and do the post-construction cleanup. And what kind of money does she make, and how long does it take her to make this money?

It's very sporadic because it's just when we finish houses. So it could be like three right in a row or like the next one we'll have is maybe two months away. How much time does she take when she cleans? One to two, one day usually. One day. And so she's able to do this with the kids? Yes.

Yeah, usually we just have my father-in-law babysit. All right. I'm gathering information over here. I mean, I'd simplify it. I'd simplify it like this, and some people might hate this answer. Technically, if you're in baby step two, you cut out things like this. Now, you guys aren't

you're not burning like some people are in debt and you could be if you choose not to go hard on this but you're going to be out of debt so quickly what i'd say is if you want to spend 350 and keep this horse lease up with this horse that you've probably established a relationship with just earn the 350 a month earn it back i was go out and get a job i am shocked right now but i love it you

it you know because i thought you were gonna go hard on this one it's an amount of money that's that is truly not going to make or break them to that extent yes but i'm with you i want to make sure the audience hears this i want to make sure that peter hears this i love this idea because that's what i was gonna say go on it mama needs to go make the 350 yeah or there is no horse yeah if because you gotta cover the horse but i do have one question on that peter um let's say it takes you nine months and all this is clear is that what you is that the number you gave us mm-hmm

That's what we're shooting for you. What's the name of the horse? Jesse. Is Jesse going to be available for lease nine months from now? It's certainly not guaranteed. Is Jesse old? Well, that doesn't make any difference because if Jesse dies, we can't lease him anyway. I know, but I'm just saying maybe she wants to live out Jesse's last nine months. I'm going to throw a wrinkle into this, Peter and Jade. I'm going to throw something out and let you two discuss it. Okay. You ready? Yeah, I'm ready. I like your idea.

But I think the better idea is to go talk to Jesse's owner and tell Jesse's owner what the story is and say, nine months from now, we're going to be debt-free, and this is super important to my wife. I need to know that we can jump back into the contract and lease Jesse nine months from now, and I would take the $350,000, and I would help Mama get motivated to knock this debt out and say, we're going to stop riding Jesse for nine months. Okay.

Okay, but I'm just throwing it. I'm throwing a hard alternative out there. Peter J discuss. So Peter, are you saying that if you were to cancel the lease, are you worried about Jesse not being available in that somebody else would take the lease spot? Is that what you're concerned about?

Essentially, yes. Yeah, she could just lease her out to somebody else. Which is why I have the conversation with Jesse's owner. Yeah. Well, but if I'm the owner, if I'm Jesse's owner, I'm like, you want me to hold the horse? But how can she not lease him out to like 50 people? How many times can you ride Jesse in one month? I mean, you've got to be available.

By the way, I should point out to people who just jumped in. Jesse is a horse. We're talking about riding a horse. I should have probably made that clear. I'll refer to him as the horse from now on so as not to confuse everybody. How many times can you ride the horse in a month? She goes out like once a month.

Right. Twice a week. Okay. Twice. Oh, that's a lot. Twice a week for $350. And I don't want to get too deeply into your business, but I did want to ask, cause you kind of alluded to it. Does your wife struggle with like some, anything mentally? Cause you said it helps her mental health.

I don't think it's so much like a mental health problem so much as just like she's with the boys constantly. She homeschools. Totally. And that's kind of like her. No need to explain. Yes, our children drive us crazy. She needs a little time with nature. Come on.

Okay. I, I listen, I think Ken's idea can't hurt. It can't hurt you to go by and say, Hey, we've got a nine month window. We've been working with you guys for a year and a half. We love it. Can we need to temporarily suspend this? And then we'll be back, you know, give them the date and time. If he says, yeah, say yeah. But if not, yeah. Tell mom and be like, Hey mom, if you want to keep this going, you just got to fund it because we're,

We decided that our priority is paying off the debt. And so we decided that that's the priority with our current income. And I want to stand by that. And if you want to do something more. Go clean some houses. Mama got stuff funded. Go clean some toilets. It doesn't have to be toilets. That's the last thing I'm going to. That's the last job I'm taking. I'm trying to make a point. She really wants to ride the horse. You got to pay for it. This is the Ramsey Show.

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Welcome back to The Ramsey Show, where we help you win with your money, win in your work, and win in your relationships. I'm Ken Coleman. Jade Warshaw is with me. 888-825-5225 is the phone number to jump in. Let's get back to the phones. Chris is there in Columbus, Ohio. Chris, how can we help today? Hi there. How are you guys doing today? We're doing great. What's going on?

Well, straight to the point, I got into some credit card debts. How much? About $50,000. What happened? Yeah.

That's a lot. What took place? It is. So, all right, about 2021, I bought a house, went into it having a little bit of credit card debt. When, what I didn't realize is when buying a house, there's stuff that needs help. You know, I had, it's, you know, I went in like, you know, maybe $8,000 in credit card debt. And,

And had it sitting on a 0% balance transfer, you know, I wasn't that worried and it was great. I still think the house was a good investment. We got in sub 3% on the interest rate and value's gone up by like 25%. But the cost of ownership, the cost of owning the house, a lot of times that just fell to the credit cards. Yeah.

Yeah. Was that because, so the question I have, is that because you didn't have any margin in your paycheck when it came to everything else? And so any kind of house repairs or all that was just a squeeze on you? Or was it because you had a new house and you're all excited and you guys wanted to start doing some projects and you didn't have the cash for it. So you thought, well, we'll just put it on the card. Was it that? Some of both? What are we talking about?

A little bit of both. I mean, so, you know, I got young boys. They are, when we moved in here, they were eight and six. And man, that's really the perfect time to build a tree house in the backyard. So, you know, guess where that went? That went to the credit card.

Okay. You know, we got a half bath downstairs and I'm pretty handy. I can do a lot of stuff myself. Well, what percentage of your... It's real easy to... What do you take home every month? What's your take home pay between you and your wife? So I'm making about a hundred a year. And that's just because of a new position that I've taken this year. Last year and when I bought the house, I was making about 85. And what's your take home pay? What do you see on your check every month?

Uh, let's see. I make 13 and change every week. Every week? 1,300? Yes. Okay. And then what percent, how much is your mortgage? 2,400 with taxes. Okay. So 5,200 net, right? Yeah. Wow. So that, that's, that's a little bit, tell me again, I'm sorry, Ken said something. Tell me again the, what your mortgage is every month?

$2,400. $2,400. Okay. I think that's where some of the problem is because you're getting really close to that being half of your take-home pay. Yeah.

It very much is. And so that's where we get into this. Because I mean, think about it like this. And I don't think people take enough time to think about these ratios. We say, all right, your mortgage should be no more than 25% of your take home. So there's 25 there. If you're a giving person, you're probably doing around 10% there. And then when it comes time to do your investing, you're doing 15% there. That's 50% right there. So if you mess around and your mortgage creeps up,

25 more points you're at 75 percent of your income and you haven't even done anything yet so yeah no wonder you would be going to credit cards right because you haven't even bought groceries you hadn't you know taken a vacation you've done nothing so i think that what's really really squeezing you is the mortgage that's probably thing one and then if you're not on a really tight budget then this money just disappears are you guys doing an every dollar budget

We're very good about budget. We're both emotional people and so occasionally do have some impulse purchases that take us outside of that budget. And you're aware of it. Oh yeah. So what it might be for you guys... Okay. But that's not sustainable. So what it might be for you guys, it's one of two things. The first thing is

If we know that we're on a tight budget and we knowingly say we can't afford this, but we're going to put on the credit card, you know, we're going to do that. So you've decided that. And so for that reason, then you need to say, OK, this is a habit we have and it's not working for us. Let's cut up the credit card.

That way, when that sneaky feeling of let's build a treehouse sneaks up, you can't put it on a credit card because you ain't got a credit card, right? So let's take the cookies off the shelf so you're not tempted by them. And then you're forced to stick to your budget. And then what will happen is you'll go, man, I'm just...

I'm not happy with something with our lifestyle. We want more money. And then your creative brain will kick in and go, okay, what can we do to bring up our income? And you won't be dependent on these credit cards anymore. I think you should cut your card up right now on the air. Uh-oh. Uh-oh. I double dog dare you. Did you hear the chuckle? No.

That was the respectful chuckle. It's an uncomfortable laugh. Where's the credit card? I'll take it. Do all of them. Cut them right now. Yeah, I know. Yeah. You know what? I would. Honestly, we've stopped using them. I used to be in the habit of, you know, we put everything on the credit card and we pay it off. But, you know, just a couple of those times where it has leaked beyond where we were able to find it.

will we pay it off? Chris, you're not ready. He's not ready. Chris, you're not ready, buddy. You just said I would, but... You gotta get... Here's the problem. I don't think you've hit... I don't think you're ready. Yeah. I don't think you've hit that moment of... 10 more grand? Should he charge 10 more grand? Let's get it to 60 grand. I mean... What's gonna make you miserable enough? Something's gonna have to make you so uncomfortable with these things that you're like, no!

That's what we find. Ken, that is what we find on this show. I agree 100%. You're not there. You're not there yet. You called us. So what is the reason for calling us? I feel pretty close. What's the reason for calling us? So my question is dealing with the credit card debt. I feel like I've got three, well, maybe four. We just told you. We've got to stop using them first.

And then we pay it down. Roll this over in your mind, Chris. Roll this over in your mind. You cannot solve a problem while simultaneously creating it. So as long as you have these credit cards, you're creating the problem. So you'll never solve it. It's infinite. It's the cat chasing its tail, dog chasing its tail. So you have to stop the crazy cycle. And the way you stop the crazy cycle is you say, I'm not going to keep contributing to this problem.

I'm not going to keep adding to the pile. I'm going to stop it, turn off the faucet, then you can clean up the mess. Yes? Absolutely. And so what Ken and I were... I think I'm at that point, and that's kind of why I'm calling. Then you got a cup. Snap them up. Yeah. Put them through the little... Dude, I'll cut them up right now. Yes! There we go. Because you guys got an impulse problem. Yeah. And you just said that. Those are your words. You got them right now? We got about a minute and a half. You got them on you?

Yeah. You want to check the hards? Let's go to town. Yeah, do it. Do it. And you're going to be in the fetal position later today. You're going to maybe sob in the shower because you're going to realize, oh my gosh, this was a security blanket. All right. So you got some scissors? Hold on. Okay. Tell everybody what's happening right now. Describe what's happening. We've got to make this exciting. Okay.

Should I use names? Okay, which one do we got here? Hold it up. Tell us what it's called. Chase Visa. Chase Visa. Hold it near the phone so we can hear it. Okay, hold on. Chase, this is a Chase Visa. Let's see if you can hear that. Yep. You catch it? We heard the cut. We heard it. And we heard the exhale. Are you sure you weren't giving yourself a haircut? That sounded like barber scissors. We got to go. We got about 45 seconds. What's next?

Options for getting at the credit card. I don't want to do something stupid, but I mean, with these, they're charging 30%. Cut it. Stop talking and cut it. What are you cutting? Cut it. I'll cut another one. Come on, man. What is it? Which one are you cutting? Tell us quick. Hold on. City card. City card. Go. Yes. Out of here. We won't wait for the sound. Just tell us when it's cut. Oh, yes. There it is. It's gone. It's gone. That's great. How many more you got?

Keep doing it. Keep going. Keep going. Well, you know what? We're a cash business, and we got a lot of people that need to hear these advertisements coming up, so we got to take care of business. You, my friend, need to keep cutting. Yeah. Keep cutting. Don't stop. Good job. Good job, Chris. Love it. Did you hear that every time he cut one? He went, he went, oh. Yeah, it's painful. It's visceral. You feel it.

That is so fantastic. Keep cutting, Chris. Yes. All right, we'll be right back. This is The Ramsey Show. We'll be right back.

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We're thrilled that you are with us. 888-825-5225, 888-825-5225. I'm Ken Coleman. Jade Warshaw is alongside. It's time for a question of the day brought to you by YREFI. Student loan debt is an epidemic, and defaulting on debt makes you feel even worse.

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Today's question comes from us from Bethany in Arkansas. She says, three years ago, my husband changed jobs to work for a guy who does home renovations. Their verbal agreement was that my husband would work for a year, then become a partner in the business. The partnership offer never materialized, but my husband is no longer interested in that because their leadership styles are very different. He often complains because he does all the jobs while the owner goes on leisure trips.

I have encouraged my husband to start his own business, but he feels guilty because his boss taught him how to do everything. How can I encourage him to leave his current employer so that he can make more money doing the same work, but for himself instead of for someone else?

Well, Bethany, I don't know that you're supposed to be encouraging him to leave as opposed to just being supportive and allowing him to come to that conclusion. And the way that you can do that is by asking questions, not making suggestions. I would have a sense here, Jade, that the excuse given, I'm not going to leave,

because I feel guilty because my boss has taught me how to do everything while he's griping to her.

about the fact that he does everything while the other guy leaves. Here's what I think. I think he's afraid. Yeah. And which is why I'm saying I'm trying to help Bethany out. I think he's afraid to go out on his own. And while he's miserable, he's more afraid than he is miserable because we're more afraid of the unknown. So we'll stick with the devil we know, if you will. And I've just coached so many people who are in this situation. So in her situation, and I love her and what she's trying to do, it's like,

You can't push him because he's afraid. It's like trying to get your kid. Remember the first time that your kids jumped in the pool and you caught them? You can't force them. As a parent, you got to just encourage them by saying, I'm here. I got you. I promise I'll catch you. You can't make the kid jump. And in this case, asking him questions like, what would it take?

uh, what would make you feel comfortable to actually leave? I get that you're guilty, but, and asking questions like that, having real conversations where he feels supported and he feels heard. And, and I guess my point, I'm making you and I coach people all the time. A good coach doesn't tell their client what to do. A good coach asks a lot of questions. Um,

and lets that person come to the awareness of, oh, if I were to go do a couple side jobs and get 15 grand in the bank and line up a pipeline of work, I'd feel more comfortable leaving or whatever that is. That's my take. What do you think? I'm going to go out on a limb here and I'm going to take a hot take on this. I like it. I kind of feel like if somebody's got to convince you to go into business for yourself, you're probably not cut out for it.

because I kind of feel like like if they've got to really prod you and push you because I think like that true spirit is kind of innate and it's like oh if I want something I'm going to go out and get it I'm going to go out and take it and somebody needs to convince me why I can't I feel like it's got to go the opposite way I like that and so there's I don't disagree but I would the only caveat to that would I would say is that I think some people are cut out to do it but

but they're scared to death. I do think that fear can play. Just like the kid can ride a bike, the kid can swim, but they got to get to a place where they jump or where they get on the bike. But the spirit that you need to be successful long-term is definitely an innate spirit that says, I do things afraid and I don't let fear stop me. I agree with that. And then there's the other part of this. This is just the practice.

Practicality side, just because you're good at swinging a hammer and good at home renovations does not mean that you'll be good at running a business because you know, Ken, there's all the back end stuff that has zero to do with the skill on tap. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. There's a lot going on. There's a lot going on here. But do you agree, though, that he's not moving because he's scared? Yeah. Fear is whatever's going on. It's that fear is the bigger thing. And yeah. Yeah. Yep.

All right, let's get to the phones, 888-825-5225. Lindsay's up in Washington, D.C. Lindsay, how can we help? Hi, it's so nice to talk to both of you. Good to talk to you. What is going on today? Well, I'm calling because I want to better understand how to move from baby step three to four when you have competing priorities.

And you're trying to build thinking funds to actually take care of those things should they come up. All right. Give us those priorities.

And, by the way, tell us who's competing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We need to know. These are, it's the inevitable, right? So we have two 12-year-old cars. Okay. Both of which we've been told will need new transmissions. Oof. Yeah. We have two kids that will be entering braces. Okay. All of those fun things. How much will the braces cost? One.

Um, the first estimate we got was about 3000 for a year to start. And how old are they? How old are they? 11, 10 and 11. Okay. Okay. Keep going. So two old cars, two sets of braces.

A 30-year-old air conditioning unit. Oh, man. It's always the AC. Okay. That's coming right next year. Okay. And these are all, you know, like $10,000, $15,000 problems. The transmissions are that much?

Um, the recommended work is upwards of 11 on one car and 7,500 on the other. Well, what is a car worth that they want you to pay 11K for? What's it worth? They're not, they're not worth that much. Okay. So we'll talk about that. Yeah. That seems high, doesn't it? The gear heads in the booth in there, that feels high. I would at least get, I don't want to spend a bunch of time on this.

I don't want to spend a bunch of time, no time, but I would say I'd get a couple more quotes on that. So let's walk through this. So you've got three, do you have the three to six months? What do you have saved? 36,000. You've got 36,000 saved. Now let's talk about this a little bit more. Tell me your income and tell me what your margin is every month. So we take in about 12,000 a month.

Okay. And often we have leftovers somewhere between $500,000 to $2,000, depending. What's wrong? $5,000 to $2,000, depending. Okay. So you're spending, it takes $10,000 at least to run your budget? Well, $2,200 of that is savings, automatic. Okay. But you've already hit, when you say savings, do you mean investing or do you mean savings? Savings.

So we I take twenty two hundred per month and I put it into our emergency fund. OK, kind of just just reached what we would need for three months. OK, so you have the two twenty two thousand that you're already used to saving plus another two thousand of margin. So about four thousand. Is that fair?

Yeah. So 4K of margin that you could save if you needed to. So if I factor this through emergency fund thinking, which emergency fund for me is it's totally expected, it's completely urgent, and it's time sensitive. Those are the three factors. You mean totally unexpected? Yeah, totally unexpected. I'm sorry. Totally unexpected, totally necessary, and there's a time factor. Those are the three things that filter everything.

that I have to check the box up to say, I'm pulling this out of my emergency fund. So let's talk about, do any of them actually fit that I have to go into the emergency fund? The two old cars, is that unexpected? Is it completely necessary? And is it something that is completely time sensitive? You tell me.

Well, it's all about timing. I would think no. I would rather prep for that. Okay, so that already tells me. This is something we can cash flow. We can cash flow one at a time. Do what Ken said. Get some quotes. Cash flow one at a time. Same thing with the braces. They will be fine if they wait a little bit longer. So I don't think that that falls into emergency fund. The only one that might is the AC. That's the only one that gets the green light for me that it might be. But I think you saw this coming.

So I think there's a way to cash flow this and make it work. It's just going to be long-term. Yeah. You've got a lot to take care of, but $4,000 a month adds up. It sure does. And then you'll start your investing. Yeah. All right. You got it. Good job, Jay. This is The Ramsey Show. Folks, changing your family tree takes more than rice and beans and side hustles. It's also about transferring the big financial risks off your family by having the right kinds of coverage in place. That's why my team created the Coverage Network.

checkup quiz. It only takes about five minutes to find out what types of insurance you need and don't need to protect your finances. Make this quiz one of your regular checkups starting right now at ramseysolutions.com slash checkup. That's ramseysolutions.com slash checkup.

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. So excited that you are with us. I'm Ken Coleman and Jade Warshaw is in studio with me as well. 888-825-5225. Hey, the Get Clear Career Assessment, what is it? It is a 18 to 20 minute self-awareness

test if I were going to define it and I designed it so I'm gonna define it you do that and It's gonna help you figure out what you do best what you enjoy doing most and the results that motivate you Those are three things that you need to know to figure out the work that you're wired to do I remember Davis said for decades your income is your greatest wealth building tool and I believe that and that's my role here on the Ramsey shows to help people find that work that they can do best so that they can get paid the most and

for themselves to live the life, fund the life that they want. So this has helped so many people, and you can get it at ramseysolutions.com slash get clear, ramseysolutions.com slash get clear. Who needs it? That would be the person who feels stuck, somebody who feels like they may want to pivot, somebody who's looking for some confidence.

a student in college or high school. We have a student version ideal for high school students and college students. And then we have the adult version as well. RamseySolutions.com slash GetClear. Love that. Good job, Ken. Thank you. Thank you. Alex is in Dallas, Texas. Alex, how can we help? Hey, guys. I appreciate you taking my call. Thank you. What's going on?

First off, I was just looking for some advice. I just turned 23 and I hit a financial goal of mine in savings, but I still live with my family. I was wondering if what y'all would say, do I take the financial hit and move out like in favor of personal growth? Yes.

Yes, Lord. Yeah. I mean, the answer to that is always going to be yes. Sometimes it's yes, and then we need to figure out when. But what you've presented to us is that you've been saving up a bunch of money, and you've hit a goal, and it feels like you're absolutely in a place financially where this is a good move. But give us the picture. Okay. So my financial goal was $100,000, and I just hit that. In savings? Yes.

It's a no-brainer. Oh my gosh. It's a behind-the-back pass. I just said yes at $1,000. Yeah. Tomorrow, instantly. No, truly. Way to go, by the way. Can we just stop and say $100,000 and how long did it take you to save that? About five years of working. Wow. How old are you now? 23. So you started at 18 and you have amassed $100,000 in savings. Wow.

Yes, sir. Yeah, bro. Wow. Get out of the nest. That's impressive. That's goat mentality. That's very, very good. No debt, right? No other debt in addition to... No, no debt at all. Most of it's in like a Roth IRA and then a 401k Roth IRA. Oh, so this is retirement. This isn't in savings.

So in actual cash savings, I have a brokerage account with about $35,000 and then my checking account has about $7,000. Okay. And the rest is in retirement?

Yes. Okay. Seven grand in the account. Okay. So you're in great shape. You did it a little in a different kind of order. It's $100,000 nonetheless. Uh, but the truth is not as much of this as liquid as I thought, which is fine. You can still get into an apartment. Um, what was the goal? Was the goal I'm going to buy a house or I'm going to just move out into an apartment? What was your goal? Um, I don't think I can afford to buy a house at the moment, unfortunately. Uh,

the way things are. So I mean, if it was liquid, you could. But since you locked in retirement, yeah, you cannot. What do you do for a living and how much do you make? So I do marketing. I'm an associate marketing manager and I make fifty five thousand a year. Cool. So, yeah, if I'm you, I would probably save up the equivalent of three to six months of expenses. That would be my last thing that I do under my parents roof is

And you should be able to do that lickety split. And I would keep it liquid. He's already got it. He's got $35,000 in cash. It's in a brokerage. It's not in index funds.

So some of it is. I think I probably have about half of it invested right now. Yeah. Oh, I thought you said 35. Listen, if it's invested, I don't... For my purposes, if it's invested, I don't care for you to pull... I mean, I think you're in a place like, hey, I can save this up right quick. You don't necessarily have to pull it out. If you wanted to, if you're in a hurry, that's fine. It's not...

retirement money um but what i would do this right now yeah you're you're you're obviously in an environment where you can stay with your parents and it's not caused a problem but if i were you i'd take you know a little bit longer i'd save up three to six months whatever is liquid put that all together and then i'd move out okay yeah so what's the timeline you tell us

Yeah, I mean, I was thinking basically the most that I was thinking about extending it was a year because I was thinking, hey, my car's pretty old. No, that's too long. Yeah, you're too comfortable. That's the problem. I mean, I've got mad respect for you.

I mean, I really do. Of course. You are very disciplined financially, but I think from an emotional and a maturity situation at your age, you're a little too comfy hanging out at mom and dad's. And extending it another year, I start to get nervous about that. Yeah, I mean, you've already got 7,000 liquid. I mean, what do you need? Another 10,000? Yeah, my only concern is my car. Like, it didn't start yesterday. Okay, but at that point, now we're just in big boy mode.

Like, you can't say I'm going to make all of my financial worries go away at my parents' house. It was really just the intent was for you to kind of set yourself up and give yourself a little foundation to take off. And then you're off into the world. I want to throw something out here. Jade may disagree with me on this. Because his money is in a brokerage account, so it's after-tax money that he's put in. Yeah. I would pull some of that money out and get a car. Yeah, the brokerage.

Brokerage account, yes, 100%. You agree? Yeah. And now he's got a reliable car. And then I'm just putting that into the front of your plan. Yeah, I would do that. You said there's 35 in the brokerage account and then you've got the car that's acting up now. If you sold it now as is, what would you get for it?

Off. Nothing? Maybe a grand and a half. Okay. It's a piece of junk. So we're starting over from scratch. Get a $10,000 car. What do you think? Leave $25,000 in? You know what? What do you think? He's done such a good job. $15,000? We're negotiating over how much he's going to spend on a car. I love this. Hot take. He's done such a good job. Oh, don't say it. That if you're able to save up three months of expenses...

I would say that if you want to spend $30,000, you could. I wouldn't want to buy a new car, I don't think. No, I didn't say brand new. I said used. He has the money. He's got $100,000 saved. Who are you and what have you done with my friend Jade? He's got three... I don't recognize this person. Check the boxes, Ken. He'll have three to six months of expenses saved. I'm with you. He'll be investing 15%. Totally with you. He'll be living out on his own. He's got $100,000.

$35,000 saved and he's 23 years old. That's a slam dunk. No, you got to read the room. This guy, he's uptight. He's uptight and he doesn't need a $30,000 car. I'm saying he could. I know, but I thought that's what you recommended. I'm going 15 max, Alex. I'm saying he could. Listen, if you've done the work

If you've done the work, somebody hit me in the comments and let me know that I'm not losing it. Anybody who's watched you on this show for any amount of time is in a state of shock. No, they're not because they know that. $30,000. Because they know that I'm not frugal to a fault. They know that at the right time when you've saved the audience. I'm talking to the studio audience at this point. He's 23 years old. He saved $100,000.

$42,000. The people are already speaking before you can even get your point out. I see mama in the back is like, oh no, you said no. No, they're thumbs down. What? $15,000. What? Here's why. Let me explain my take. $15,000 gets him a very nice and reliable car. Of course it does. And it leaves a good chunk in the brokerage account. He doesn't need it in his brokerage account. He's 23. He's got $100,000 invested.

He does need it in there because it's going to continue to pile up. So is the $100,000. He doesn't need it. He does not need a $30,000 card. He's 23. If he was 42, this would be a different conversation. I can see this is going nowhere. He makes $55,000 a year. Alex, what do you think?

I think I would have a little bit harder time spending about $30,000. You don't have to. I'm just saying you could. Right. Listen, I'm the fun parent. Y'all are tripping. I think 15 is more into my... Yeah. Backed up by being frugal, I think I'm comfortable there. Trust me, Alex. I know. Then you do what you're comfortable

comfortable with? First of all, I love this version of Jade. I'm not throwing shade at Jade. I'm just saying I'm shocked because I'd like to see him be more conservative because he already is. I think 15 makes him uncomfortable. That's why. He has proven to be a conservative, responsible guy who

I'm not worried about him. He's doing all the right things. You've got to celebrate a little bit. I'm going to celebrate the fact that the studio audience is in favor of me. I'm never that right. So I want to just soak in the moment. It'll never happen again. It won't happen again. She is the incomparable Jade Warshaw. This is The Ramsey Show.

You're still here? What are you doing? You do know that the rest of today's show is playing right now over on the Ramsey Network app, right? All you got to do to finish the episode is search Ramsey Network in the App Store, Google Play Store, or just click the link in the show notes to download the app for free. Yep, you heard me right, for free. Then right there on the home screen, you can watch the rest of today's show. Bada bing, bada boom. All right, I'm getting out of here. Enjoy. We'll see you on the app.