You Might Also Like: Levels to This with Sheryl Swoopes and Terrika Foster-Brasby
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I'm NK, and this is Basket Case. What is wrong with me? A show about the ways that mental illness is shaped by not just biology... Swaps of different meds. ...but by culture and society. By looking closely at the conditions that cause mental distress, I find out why so many of us are struggling to feel sane...

what we can do about it, and why we should care. Oh, look at you giving me therapy, girl. Listen to Basket Case every Tuesday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16th, 2017, was assassinated. Crooks everywhere unearthed the plot to murder a one-woman WikiLeaks. She exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country

into a mafia state. Listen to Crooks everywhere on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

This week, Charlemagne Tha God sits down with Vice President Kamala Harris for a conversation you don't want to miss. The things that we want and are prepared to fight for won't happen if we're not active and if we don't participate. They tackle the big questions, politics, policy, and what's next for the country. Doesn't the Biden administration have to take some blame for the border, though? Charlemagne, first thing we dropped was a bill to fix the broken immigration system.

Which, by the way, Trump did not fix when he was president. Don't miss this in-depth interview with Charlemagne Tha God and Vice President Kamala Harris, only on The Breakfast Club. Catch the full interview now on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, everybody. I'm Tarika Foster-Brasby. And I'm Cheryl Swoops. And this is the Levels to This podcast. This is a show where we are going to share that it's levels to the shit that women go through. And I know that we've got a great show lined up today. But first, my girl Cheryl, we got to check in. How are you? How are things going? What's good, girl? Life has been life-end. Life has been life-end. But listen.

that damn Detroit cap off of your head.

I'm in my feelings because y'all gave the Astros a nice little beating. You did. You did. See? Yeah, folks. For folks who don't know, at the time of this recording, my Detroit Tigers are out here doing the damn thing and shirling her feelings. And that's fine. It's cool. I am very much so in my feelings. We have not been a winner in 10 years. Y'all going to let us have this. Oh, that's right. Y'all haven't been. Y'all let us have this.

Y'all haven't been, but we, okay, okay, okay. I'm going to let you make it on that one. Cheryl, you know what? That's why folks throwing you under the bus now. That is why folks are throwing you under the bus now. Well, please do tell because I've kind of taken a couple of days off from social media. So I don't know. I don't know. What did I do? What did I do this time? What did I do?

Oh, so you're not sure why you're trending. Okay. Well, let me fill you and everybody in on exactly why you're trending. You're trending because again, at the time of this- Oh, wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. I'm sorry. Can we just do a toast? Oh. Grab a glass. We can definitely do a toast. Yeah. Grab a glass. Cheers. What are we toasting to? It's Friday. It's the weekend. Are we toasting to every-

It's the weekend and we're toasting to everybody having your name in their mouth. There we go. That's the toast. Yeah, let's do that. Cheers. That's the toast. That's the toast. I like that one. So, you know, it's the end of the season, fans, and now people in the WNBA are receiving their awards. And so we know that Asia was the unanimous MVP. We know that Nafisa Collier won Defensive Player of the Year. Um,

Dejanay Carrington won most improved. Cheryl Reeve got coach of the year, executive of the year.

And it was just recently officially announced that Caitlin Clark earned the rookie of the year. So shout out to Caitlin Clark for winning rookie of the year. However, Congrats to Caitlin. Why? Congrats to Caitlin. Much deserved. She received 66 of the 67 votes. So apparently Cheryl, you are the person who was the hater of Caitlin Clark.

that gave Angel Reese. Angel Reese is the other person who got the one vote. So clearly it's your fault that she is not the unanimous rookie of the year. You are such a hater that you can't stand it that you decided to give your vote, waste your vote on Angel Reese. Now I'm wondering who going to tell the people. There's a lot in this. Yeah. First of all,

Congratulations to Caitlin. Very well deserved. Had a hell of a rookie year doing things that just hasn't been done by a rookie before. But I hate to disappoint the people because

I don't get a vote. Y'all cannot. I'm laughing because it's funny. Y'all cannot blame this one on me. I don't get a vote. I've never had a vote in any of the awards. But I, too, like everyone else, would love to know who that person is. Maybe it's the person that gave Asia Wilson a fourth place vote last year.

I don't know. I don't know. I'm going to take a drink. I'm going to take a drink. I'm going to take a drink. I'm going to just take a sip.

funny to me because last year folks told folks to just get over it. Just get over it. It's fourth place. Just get over it. But this year all hell has broken loose because folks want to know who gave Angel the vote. And my thing is so what if Angel got the vote? It's not like she wasn't deserving of a vote. I mean she did have a hell of a rookie season.

So why? I'm surprised she only got one vote. You know, I am a voter. I voted for Caitlyn Clark. I thought after the Olympic break, she separated herself from the pack. But up until that time, I was neck and neck. I was like, this very well could be Angel. This could be Caitlyn. Wait, it's Angel again. I was going back and forth. So I don't understand why folks is mad. Can't nobody explain why Asia got a fourth place vote. Like you can't, you can't justify that. No, you can't. But you're off the hook because you just said you voted for Caitlyn.

So we can mark you off. I did. Let's just keep going down the line and figure out who that person is. So let me also say this. Whoever that person is that gave Angel a vote, I agree with you. She's been very deserving of a vote, right? I, like you, the beginning of the season was like...

Could be either. It could be Angel. It could be Caitlyn. And I'll also say this. If Rekia Jackson would have gotten more playing time in the beginning of the season, Rekia Jackson would be in this conversation. But I digress. Anyway. Absolutely.

I thought at one point I did. I was like, Angel Reese has my rookie of the year vote because she set the double double record. And for a rookie is impressive. And I thought she was playing very well. Had Chicago looking really good at one point. Right. Or at least good. Not really. But good. I agree with you. After the Olympic break, Caitlin Clark got some rest, got some food, got some

got some vacation, got some, oh no, I ain't all up in her business like that. She got some whatever it was. And she came back and completely separated herself from all other rookies in the league. So congratulations to Caitlyn, y'all.

Can't get mad at me. I don't get votes, so it wasn't me. It wasn't Sheryl. So stop the narrative. Stop trending Sheryl. If you're trending Sheryl on Twitter, it better be because you listen and love our podcast. Not because y'all got in this foolishness. Let's go. Stop it. Let's go. Stop it. But I'm glad that you brought up Chicago because I think it's time for us to take it to the next level.

All right, so on September 26th,

The Chicago Sky decided to part ways with head coach Teresa Weatherspoon after just one season. They even released a statement that said, after careful consideration, we have decided it's in the best interest of the organization to part ways with head coach Teresa Weatherspoon. We are deeply appreciative of Coach Teaspoon's contributions to the Chicago Sky and the energy and passion she brought to the head coaching role.

Apparently, folks was not aware that this was going to go down. Angel Reese, the star of the team, and usually these types of decisions don't happen without the star player on your team knowing about it. But the star of the team tweeted that she was heartbroken. Other people in the organization, Kennedy Carter, had comments. There were folks that were just confused. And then, of course, us on the outside are like,

Is this the same? Are y'all watching the same T-Spoon or looking at the same organization that I'm looking at? Because I don't understand how I don't understand how this happens. Now, I know you have a relationship with Spoon. And so I know you were also somebody that was like pissed off that this happened. Pissed off is an understatement. T, where to like begin with this?

Even now, just hearing you say those words and what you said, like, like this shit makes me emotional for her. It makes me angry. It makes me sad. It makes me frustrated. It pisses me off. I guess my thing, like Spoon and I had a conversation and I'm not going to share stuff she told me because it's not my story to tell.

But she did give me permission to talk about certain things. Here is what I will say. If, and this is if, if you hired her under the conditions of if you don't make the playoffs or if you don't win a championship, we're going to fire you. Right? Like, I'm hoping that's not why you hired her because how ignorant is that? They were what? Two, I don't know, one, two games out of that eighth playoff spot.

And when you think about... They had that playoff spot. Oh, they did. They did, right? But here's my thing. When you think about what all she had to deal with, let's just start from the beginning. She's a new head coach. She pretty much has a whole new damn team. She has a new team. You drafted two rookies. You brought back Kennedy Carter, who hadn't been in the league in a while. And you still almost made the playoffs.

You traded Marina Mabry right before the Olympic break. Izzy has been injured, not healthy all season. Elizabeth Williams goes out with a season-ending injury. Camila Cardoso, the beginning of the year, misses I don't know how many games because she has a shoulder injury. The end of the year, Angel gets hurt. She breaks her wrist. Kennedy Carter misses some games because she has, I guess, COVID or whatever they called it.

Help me understand what more could she do with what she had to work with? Right. And and on top of that, how did y'all help her work? Like, how did y'all help her be successful? Because your front office is shitty.

So what did y'all do to help her be successful? Horrible. It's horrible. Like, that's what I don't understand. Like, y'all not only didn't put her in a position to win, but she still found a way to be damn near in the playoffs and still found some level of success despite all of the shit that she had stacked against her. Yeah. And this is how you were. Yeah. No, I'm saying she walked into a mess. Yep.

She walked into an entire, and it's not the first time, right? Like it's not, it's not the first time. And it leads me, it literally leads me to this larger, because we say it all the time that like sports is a microcosm of real life society. And it leads me to this larger conversation of why do black women always have to deal with this kind of shit?

Like, why are we always expected to make something out of nothing? Why do we always have to work twice as hard to get half of what other people get? And when we don't deliver on what that whatever unreasonable expectation is, we're the ones that have to take a hit. We're the ones that lose our jobs or we're the ones that don't get the

promotion. We're the ones that don't get seen, don't get recognized, whatever. Just recently, there was a conversation on Sue Bird and Megan Rapinoe's podcast, right? And they were talking about a lot of the racism and the things like that that has happened in the WNBA. And it pissed me off to no end because they were 100% correct on what Sue was 100% correct on what she was saying. But we

Black women have been saying this the entire time and nobody was listening. So it's, it's, it's this thing that is ever present. It's never gone away. And teaspoon is just another example of unreasonable expectations that are put on us that are not put on anyone else. I ain't trying to say nobody else should lose their jobs. Cause I ain't the one that's out here calling for people's jobs, but I,

Latricia Trammell in Dallas. What's going on down there? I ain't saying Latricia should lose her job. I'm just saying, why nobody calling for her head? Christy's side started this year 1-8. I don't see Christy losing her job. I'm just a little concerned as to how the goalposts just continues to move for Black women. Ooh.

Listen, I'm just over here because you are hitting the nail on the head. I don't get it. And it doesn't matter what your profession is. Black women are expected to work miracles with a lot less, right? And when we don't, we're fired, we're let go, we're questioned, we're not good enough. I'm there with you, right?

It's a conversation that a lot of people don't want to have, but it's a conversation that needs to be had. And when you look at the WNBA as a whole, from the beginning, T, from 1997 when the league started, Black women, for whatever reason, just haven't really been given the same opportunities in the WNBA as their white counterparts, whether that's a white female or a white male.

We just haven't been given that opportunity. And when we are like, there's a, there's a microscope on us where they're watching every little thing we do and not, not allowing us to be who we are. Right. Spoon, one of the fiercest competitors I've ever played against. One of the best people I've ever known that I know. And when you have,

a rookie in Angel Reese who speaks up and says, damn, I want to play for her. And her seeing the talent in Kennedy Carter to say Kennedy Carter needs to be in this league. I agree a hundred percent. There are not a lot of coaches in this league that can coach a Kennedy Carter, but Spoon was that one. Not only was she just another player that played in the WNBA, she's a

- Freaking Hall of Famer. One season? - One season. - You gave her one season. - One season. - Like, please make that make sense. - I don't see how any coach can turn around a franchise in one season, but certainly not under the circumstances that Spoon was under.

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I'm NK, and this is Basket Case. So I basically had what back in the day they would call a nervous breakdown. I was crying and I was inconsolable. It was just very big, sudden swaps of different meds. What is wrong with me? Oh, look at you giving me therapy, girl.

Finally, a show for the mentally ill girlies. On Basket Case, I talk to people about what happens when what we call mental health is shaped by the conditions of the world we live in. Because if you haven't noticed, we are experiencing some kind of f***ing conditions that are pretty hard to live with. But if you struggle to cope, the society that created the conditions in the first place will tell you there's something wrong with you. And it will call you a basket case.

Listen to Basket Case every Tuesday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This week, Charlamagne Tha God sits down with Vice President Kamala Harris for a conversation you don't want to miss. Listen, I feel very strongly I need to earn every vote, which is why I'm here having this candid conversation with you and your listeners. They tackle the big questions, politics, policy, and what's next for the country.

I am running to be president for everybody, but I'm clear-eyed about the history and the disparities that exist for specific communities, and I'm not going to shy away from that. Don't miss this in-depth interview with Charlemagne Tha God and Vice President Kamala Harris, only on The Breakfast Club. Catch the full interview now on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. ♪

It just truly bothers me and baffles me because I don't understand why the expectations for us are always different. I recall reading an article from the Sports Business Journal that came out a couple of years ago, maybe about two or three years ago now. And they talked about how when you look at players and player marketing in the WNBA to the point that you mentioned earlier, there were 212, I believe, articles that were written that season about

about the WNBA and of the 212 articles that were written, black players were only mentioned 44 times. The leading players that were mentioned in that season. And I believe this was, it was the, I'm saying 2021, but it might've been 2022. It was the county, the 25th anniversary season. So that was the season where it was 212 articles written. Black players were mentioned in those articles 44 times.

Now help me do the math because there are 144 players in the WNBA. 80% of the players in the WNBA are African American or women of color. You could only talk about 44 of them in 212 articles.

And that's not even 44 different players, that's just 44 different mentions. So probably the same player mentioned multiple times. I'd give you maybe, you know, Asia Wilson, maybe probably a Jewel Lloyd or, you know, maybe, you know, I don't know. Alyssa Thomas might've got a name in there. I don't know. I can't be sure. At that time, they probably were still ignoring Connecticut. So ain't no telling. But the point that I'm making is, is that it has never been fair as it relates to race.

And folks don't want to tackle race because it makes them uncomfortable. But that's exactly the problem. You need to be uncomfortable. You just need to be uncomfortable in having this conversation. And I even know from personal experience, coming through this business, as I was making my way through this industry, there were opportunities that were presented that I would apply for and I would not get those opportunities, but they would use me to train the white man or the white girl that they hired in my place.

And I was mad confused. Like, wait a minute. Or, you know, this person could continually be late, continually be late, continually be late. If I show up five minutes late one time, it's a warning. Yeah. How did I? Like, the goalpost keeps...

It keeps moving. And so it gets me to a point where I just always have to ask, like, what can we do? Like, at what point does the responsibility shift from us needing to meet a specific expectations to folks understanding the expectations they're setting is unrealistic? Chicago should have known that there was no possible way that they were going. And from my understanding, the person who released this

was also a black woman right so now we really playing that game now we really playing that game right where yes we're really playing that game now like this is smooth over better if she says it yes or if she does it because it won't look like we're the ones that's really behind the bullshit so you know what you're gonna take the black woman and put her out in front

and let her release the statement because it's a black woman you're firing, right? So you think that we can't see through the bullshit. Like we see what you're doing. Also want to, God, this is such a deep topic and conversation, but it's one that needs to be had. Because I also want to go back to like the whole Christine Brennan thing

not even interview, but her questions for Dejanay Carrington, right? And I know there are a lot of people who are like, no, Christine, she did nothing wrong. She said nothing wrong. Everything, that question and the follow-up question was wrong. And it was the way you ask it.

Yes. Christine Brendan's been in the game for a very long time. I don't know how much she's actually covered the WNBA in its 27 years, but okay, whatever. But you, you, you came at her, you came at her and, and basically said, you,

I poked her in the eye. I also heard someone on ESPN or CNN or somewhere say you stabbed her in the eye. CNN. Yes. CNN. Yes. Like you stabbed her in the eye. I'm like, no, she didn't. First of all, Kate herself said, this happens all the time. But you come at her like, oh, Dejanay, can you tell us if you intentionally meant to hit Caitlyn in the eye? So I...

I asked this question. Did she go to Caitlyn and say, Caitlyn, did you purposely hit Dejanay in the eye when she lost her contact? Thank you. Thank you. Did you? Because the question is, no, you did not. Right. No, of course you didn't. Of course you did. Of course you did. It's stuff like that, T, that as a black woman, and I don't care what profession, even me as a former professional athlete, like,

You know, when you're playing and you're at the top of your game, everybody loves you, everybody wants you. And when you're done, I can't tell you how many times I personally have tried. I've tried and tried and tried to get on staff, not even as a head coach, but as an assistant coach with a WNBA team. Now, don't come at me and say you don't have enough experience.

MVP, a four-time Olympic, excuse me, a three-time Olympic gold medalist, a four-time WMA champion, a three-time defensive player of the year, but we ain't gonna keep going. Run them credentials, Cheryl. Run them shit, Cheryl. I may not have the so-called coaching experience, but I have the experience. You know the game. You know the game. You know the game. But you will go, yes, but that's not good enough. That isn't good enough.

Another example of this is just last season. Last season, how many Black women head coaches could we have had in the WNBA? But instead, the Phoenix Mercury hired Vanessa Nygaard. That part.

There were coaches out there who won from college, players like, you know, former players like yourself. There are so many different people. But instead, you went with Vanessa Nygaard. Now, that franchise was already going through whatever they were going through because clearly they were dealing with the Brittany Griner situation. They were dealing with the Skylar Diggins-Smith situation. They already had enough on their plate. And rumor has it,

that Nikki blue who essentially took over after Vanessa was fired was the person who had the ear of the team anyway. So my question from the beginning was why, who also was someone who had more experience, why was she not already considered? Why was she not your first go-to? It's just like, we have to continue again to work twice as hard and not get half as much.

That's not even talking about those who have to worry about pay differential and those who have to worry about recognition. I recall one time sitting in a meeting with my former employer. I was sitting in a meeting and I brought up a really dope ass idea and folks questioned my idea like 10 times. They found every hole that could be poked in that idea. A month later, we come back to our monthly meeting and a coworker of mine

He mentions the exact same thing, but shifts maybe one or two words. It was the greatest thing since sliced bread. And I could not contain myself. I quickly stood up in that meeting and I said, hey, guys, I'm not even trying to be funny. But for real, for real, I said this same shit last month. So what's the difference between last month and now? Like what makes it different now? Because he said it.

Like that's what makes it different because he said it because he did it. And so the point is simply this, we're always ignored, but the expectation never changes. I'm still expected to produce at the same level and the same rate as

my white male and female counterparts and i get sometimes that you know as women we have to always stick up for each other and stick together but there is definitely a difference at time in the expectation even between white women and black women right and it's we have to acknowledge that we have to because here's the thing if this was a white head coach to say the opportunity to coach again

It's not at all the same as it is with Spoon. We don't know if Spoon going to get an opportunity to coach again because the door is not always reopened for us. No, and that's the problem. You're 100% correct. Just like back to the Nikki Blue situation, right? Nikki Blue was good enough.

to be the quote interim coach and get you through the season and be there through the Brittany Griner situation and tackle the Skylar Diggins questions when she wasn't the one who was the head coach, right? She's good enough to get you through the season, but she's not good enough to be your next head coach. That's the part. And where is Nikki now? Don't know. I looked up because I was curious, right? The league started in 1997.

And I was fortunate enough to be able to play quite a few years. But I looked this up because I was curious. It said of the black head coaches, 21 have been black men and 20 have been black women. Now, mind you, this is since 1997.

So this is this is on Google. So anybody can look it up. It just said in a league made up primarily of women of color, just twenty one point five percent of WNBA head coaches have been black women in the league's 27 year history. You mean to tell me that we're not good enough or we're not qualified enough to be in charge and to coach a team as a head coach?

And you know what happens, T? When a situation like Teaspoon happens, it puts a bad taste in our mouth. Like, I see what happened to her, and in my mind, I'm like...

hell no, I don't want to be the next one. Yeah. But what it also does is it makes you feel as if that door will never be open for someone else. Like, I don't want this to be... And granted, if it was a situation where she just truly did not perform, and if it was a performance situation, that's one thing, right? And I say that to say...

There's head coach Tanisha Wright. Head coach Tanisha Wright was also let go this past season from the Atlanta Dream. Head coach Tanisha Wright was a Black woman and she had three years to build in Atlanta. And unfortunately...

Even when she was given some additional pieces, I think the addition of an area of powers, granted she has some injuries, but an addition of an area of powers, Jordan Canada, like, you know, the way Ryan Howard continues to dominate. Alicia Gray truly came out of her shell this year. It felt like you had the pieces to at least take your team to the next level. The next level being the postseason, maybe even get a first round win. You had the pieces. So no one's going to put up a fight

about the dismissal of Tanisha Wright because I think most people who know the sport know, well, sis, you were given an opportunity. You didn't make good on that opportunity. And so this happens.

Right? But I do think that Tanisha should get another job somewhere because I don't think she's a bad head coach. Just maybe this wasn't for her. I look at women like Vicky Johnson. She was on her assistant coaching staff. She should absolutely get another head coaching position. I don't feel like she shouldn't be a head coach anywhere. We talked about Nikki Blue and that's the thing. We can see the recycling of coaches over and over. But do we continue to see these additional chances given to

to us. And that's what is disappointing. When that door closes, exactly. When that door closes, that door is closed. Like that shit is closed. It's shut. It's shut. And listen, when you talk about performance, I don't really give a shit what their reason is. It was wrong. It was wrong. You cannot expect Spoon to come in there her very first season

And really make the playoffs, win a championship, whatever. It's crazy. Like, my mind is blown. Like, I saw that and I was like, oh, this got to be a different Teresa Weatherspoon. Because I know it ain't the head coach of Chicago. There's no way. Yeah. I also need the players involved.

to understand how much power they hold in their voices. And when shit ain't right, y'all as players, y'all gotta speak up.

Yeah, that's all. That's all I'm going to say, because I'm not sure a lot of the players truly understand the value that they hold when they speak up. They use their voices. They all come together collectively. They can make a lot of changes. And if Spoon is not given, I'm sorry, if Spoon is not given another opportunity to coach, and not an assistant, if she's not given another opportunity to be a head coach in the WNBA,

Shame on them. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's a good place to leave it. So stick around. Fans will be right back after this with a little bit more. I felt too seen. Dragged.

I'm NK, and this is Basket Case. So I basically had what back in the day they would call a nervous breakdown. I was crying and I was inconsolable. It was just very big, sudden swaps of different meds. What is wrong with me? Oh, look at you giving me therapy, girl.

Finally, a show for the mentally ill girlies. On Basket Case, I talk to people about what happens when what we call mental health is shaped by the conditions of the world we live in. Because if you haven't noticed, we are experiencing some kind of conditions that are pretty hard to live with. But if you struggle to cope, the society that created the conditions in the first place will tell you there's something wrong with you. And it will call you a basket case.

Listen to Basket Case every Tuesday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey there, I'm Dr. Maya Shunker, and I'm a scientist who studies human behavior. Many of us have experienced a moment in our lives that changes everything. A moment that instantly divides our life into a before and an after. On my podcast, A Slight Change of Plans, I talk to people about navigating these very moments.

The last couple of years has been the hardest season of our marriage for sure. I'm surprised our marriage survived it. I think we both are. I think we both were barely holding on. Nothing compares to how hard this is. Their stories are full of candor, awe, and hard-won wisdom. And you'll hear from scientists who teach us how we can be more resilient in the face of change. True behavior change is really identity change. Every action you take is a vote for the type of person you wish to become.

Listen to A Slight Change of Plans on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This week, Charlamagne Tha God sits down with Vice President Kamala Harris for a conversation you don't want to miss. Listen, I feel very strongly I need to earn every vote, which is why I'm here having this candid conversation with you and your listeners. They tackle the big questions, politics, policy, and what's next for the country.

I am running to be president for everybody, but I'm clear-eyed about the history and the disparities that exist for specific communities, and I'm not going to shy away from that. Don't miss this in-depth interview with Charlemagne Tha God and Vice President Kamala Harris, only on The Breakfast Club. Catch the full interview now on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Welcome back, guys, to Levels to This with Sheryl Swoop, Cesarica Foster-Brasby. And, you know, we have had quite a much needed and maybe to some uncomfortable conversation around, you know, the expectations around Black women and specifically coaching in the WNBA. But one thing that I want everyone to take away from, you know, this conversation is that things can change, but it starts with you. Like, you have to be up for it.

person to, as you mentioned earlier, Cheryl, use your voice, right? Players got to use their voice. I love seeing the WNBA Players Association utilizing their platform to speak up on behalf of what they felt was right. I love it when people are not afraid to challenge the status quo. I think that's the first way that we can really start to bring about some form of change and

And you know better than anybody, this league has been a league where its players have been on the forefront of changing things and changing narratives for years is what they do. So I think that has to be one of the ways that we start to say, hey, y'all,

Y'all can't keep doing this. Like y'all can't keep acting like this. Front office can't keep, can't keep acting like this. I'm not going to continue to play for like in situations like this. Right. So I definitely love the idea of using the power of your voice. Yeah. And, and T what I, there's so much that I took away from our conversation and, and,

you know, just being able to talk about real life shit. And it's not just in sports. This is, unfortunately, this is the world that we're living in today. - It is. - But I think one way to make a change

is just that, having the uncomfortable, tough conversations. Because if you just continue to keep it inside and be mad and be angry at the world, nothing's ever going to change. But you also can't be afraid to speak up. You can't be afraid to have those conversations. And I also look at it and say, one thing I know about the W, and you just said it, we know that the WNBA is predominantly a black league.

But I also know that the white players, international players, they are all a big sisterhood. And they all have shown before that when the 144 comes together, they can make change. And that's one thing that I would love to see them do more of is just speak out, right? Race, politics, religion, those are some uncomfortable conversations, right?

but they're conversations that have to be had. Yeah, 100%, 100%. And so usually I always say something crazy like, oh, you know, I apologize if I offend anybody, but no, I don't apologize at all because if you're offended by the conversation that we just had, if the conversation made you that uncomfortable, then this conversation was for you. It was for you. You are the exact target audience that we were looking to get to. Period. And that's the bottom line. But-

As we are leveling off from today's show, Cheryl, I know you got something to help our fans level up for the next week. Do I, do I, do I? Listen, you know, what I have for the people today, for my sisters today, and you know what? Just for women in general, period. This is what I got for you. And it's called This Woman.

It says, this woman has fought a thousand battles and is still standing, has cried a thousand tears and is still smiling, has been broken, betrayed, abandoned, rejected, but she still walks proud, laughs loud, lives without fear, loves without doubt. This woman is beautiful. This woman is humble. This woman is you. Ah, Cheryl, where do you find these?

Don't tell me. That's what I got for you today. But I needed that one. I needed that one. I did. I needed that for my soul. Yeah. That was a good one. That was a good one. We're getting ready to head out of town. And so that's kind of those things that you need to like take with you as you like, you know, get on the plane and be like, I got this. I got this. I think sometimes...

We question ourselves, right? And we talked about this on our last episode. We question a lot, but I don't know how many of us haven't been broken, been doubted, been questioned. And we still find a way, like Maya Angelou said, and still I rise. We find a way to keep rising. So to all of my sisters out there, y'all keep doing you, keep being you, and keep rising. That's what we do.

That's what we do, y'all. Well, everybody, thanks for listening to Levels to This. We'll be back next week with more next level conversations about the real shit we go through as women. But listen, this isn't just our show. It's our show. So we want to hear from you. Leave us a review and Apple podcast. Tell us what you thought of this week's show and what you may want us to talk about next. But until then, keep your mentals ground level and we'll be back next week.

I'm Sheryl Swoops. And I'm Tarika Foster-Brasby. We know Elf Beauty isn't just a beauty company. They're here to change the game for women's sports. Did you know that 84% of sports fans are into women's sports, but they only get 15% of the media coverage? And Elf wants to change that.

As a founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports, they're shining a light on stars of women's sports. When it comes to female athletes, anything is elfing possible. Join Elf Beauty in shaking things up at elfbeauty.com. I'm NK, and this is Basket Case. What is wrong with me?

a show about the ways that mental illness is shaped by not just biology, swaps of different meds, but by culture and society. By looking closely at the conditions that cause mental distress, I find out why so many of us are struggling to feel sane, what we can do about it, and why we should care. Listen to Basket Case every Tuesday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16th 2017 was assassinated. Crooks Everywhere unearths the plot to murder a one-woman WikiLeaks. She exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country into a mafia state. Listen to Crooks Everywhere on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.