Nobody is Free and Nothing Works: How Biden's America is Like the Soviet Union
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Hey, everybody, debate prep with Sean Spicer. And then also Helen Andrews joins the program to talk. Are we turning into a Soviet country? Email us as always freedom at charliekirk.com. Subscribe to our podcast and get involved with Turning Point USA at tpusa.com and become a member at members.charliekirk.com. Buckle up, everybody. Here we go. Charlie, what you've done is incredible here. Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campus. I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk. Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks.

I want to thank Charlie. He's an incredible guy. His spirit, his love of this country. He's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created, Turning Point USA. We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country. That's why we are here.

Joining us now is a great American patriot. I've known him for quite some time. He's a great man, Sean Spicer. And he's a great

and he has a very important new movie he wants to share with you on Salem Now. That is SalemNow.com. Sean, welcome to the program. Tell us about your movie, then we'll play the trailer. Always great to see you, Charlie. Thanks. It's called Trump's Front Row Joes. We spent about two years following the Front Row Joes, the people who are the backbone of the MAGA movement, who are at every rally. We wanted to understand why they followed Donald Trump, what made them unique, what made them love Donald Trump.

We sat down with Donald Trump at Mar-a-Lago, asked him about the movement, and we finally put it together and launched this movie, Front Row Joes. It's available, as you said, at Salem now, but it's the first inside look at the movement. And Charlie, I've been doing elections for 30 years. I know I don't look it. It's a moisturizer. Anyway, this is the greatest political movement of all time, and I know you can attest to that.

And I felt like if we didn't document this, that we would never understand for history who these people were. And whether it was Steve Bannon or Donald Trump, they keep referring to it. It's like a rock band or the Deadheads who follow the Grateful Dead. And I've never seen anything like it. You can have enthusiasm for a candidate, but the movement that Donald Trump started is truly historic.

I totally agree. And I want to play the trailer here. We've never seen anything like it in American history. You know this in politics, Sean. When you run a political campaign, you're worried if people are going to show up.

That's always, no matter, Trump has a different problem. He's worried if the venue will be able to fit all of his supporters. It's a phenomenon the likes of which we've never seen. And it has taken a life of its own. I want to play 93. It's beautifully cut. Again, it's salemnow.com. That is salemnow.com. Our wonderful partners here. I love Salem and the Salem Radio Network.

St. Louis News Channel. So let's play cut 93. You have Donald Trump, you have Steve Bannon, you have Marjorie Taylor Greene. This is a phenomenon. I want to get into the psychology of who are the front row Joe's.

I've met them a couple of times. They will show up days ahead of time. We'll get into all that. But first, let's get the trailer here. Cut 93. From the backbone of the greatest political movement ever, the front row Joes, the foundation of the Trump faith. Who are they? You had to love the United States of America and you had to love Mr. Donald Trump and support Mr. Donald Trump's reelection. And where do they go next?

For the first time ever, a behind-the-scenes look into the energy that's changing the world with Stephen K. Bannon, Marjorie Taylor Greene, and Donald J. Trump. They're incredible people. And the Front Row Joes are, you know, in a certain way, I guess they're very successful people. Friendships I've made over the years as a Front Row Joe, it's probably the best part of it. Go to frontroadjoes.movie to experience the movement.

the kind of basis for all the rallies. And they've been, I mean, they're just like dead fans. So SalemNow.com, Sean, tell us, how did they get the name? Who are they? How many? And what does it mean to be a front row Joe? One second, I want to make a point or a hit on something that you just said, because earlier you said something, and I think your audience probably gets this, but for most candidates, when they want to have a rally, they'll spend money. They'll send out flyers. They'll do digital ads.

and hope to get enough people, right? They'll be like, can we offer pizza or we got a band playing or whatever. Trump literally sends a tweet out and they have to hope that they have enough capacity. And that really, the point that you made is so important to understanding this movement because the folks on the left and the media dismiss it.

And so we sought out these guys, the men and women who make up the Front Row Joes start going to events and the ranks grow. They meet each other.

They hang out with each other. One event in the movie, we go to a rally in Pennsylvania, and it's pouring rain for days, not the day of, for the days. And they're there three, four, five days early, sleeping in their car, putting on plastic bags over their head and in there under their shoes so they can stomp through the mud. I mean, when you watch this, it's amazing. I wouldn't have gotten out of my car. I mean, let's be honest. I'm a wuss about that. These guys are there four days early helping to set up –

They treat this like, as Bannon said in that trailer, like deadheads. They'll go there early and they grow in ranks as people start to meet them. They're the people that will show up early because they want to be in the front row. Somebody will say to them, gosh, I'd love to do this. And they say, well, join us. And so then they'll come to the next one. There's one scene in there where a woman sets up a boat parade in Stewart, Florida and starts to invite all of them. And they end up getting a boat, chartering a boat for 172 people.

It's not like there's membership. If you want to be a front row Joe, there's a Facebook page. You can go. There's no requirement. There's no membership card. You just show up and you start going. I mean some of these people have been to 50, 60, 70, 80 rallies. One guy in the documentary tells us how much he spent over $50,000 a year going to them. They just love Trump and what he's doing.

And they will go to rally after rally after rally. These are our neighbors, the people that are in the pew next to us at church on Sunday, the people in the businesses that we shop at. It is amazing, young, old, black, white. And you see it all in the documentary.

I love it. It's SalemNow.com. That is SalemNow.com. Now, Sean, changing gears here about the debate here tonight. What are your first impressions here? Who do you think has the most to lose tonight? That is the question of the day. There's no question that that's Joe Biden.

Donald Trump, everybody knows Trump, right? And I keep saying, which Trump is going to show up? It doesn't matter. The guy's going to show up. He's going to come out. I think he'll say some stuff. And then if he gets attacked, he'll do what he does every time. He'll fight back. He'll punch back. It's Joe Biden that has a lot to lose. Everybody knows Trump. They have an expectation of what's going to happen tonight with Biden. Everybody's trying to figure out which Joe Biden shows up.

After five, six days at Camp David, I got to imagine that a well-rested Joe Biden shows up. I think Joe Biden's going to do fine tonight. It's not that hard to stand in the place for 90 minutes and recite some talking points. If he screws up, he has a lot to lose. I just don't – I don't have real high expectations for tonight, Charlie. I think to me, I'm going to be watching the moderators. I'm going to be watching what CNN does to bring up issues, to go after Trump, to silence Trump.

I think that's where I'm going to be more fascinated. Maybe that's just because of my background. But I don't really think the needle is going to move that much tonight either unless something catastrophic happens. I think that this is going to reinforce what everyone thinks and supports about Trump and the Biden people will get what they want unless Trump hands, which is very possible, a couple zingers in there. But the people that are going to move the needle tonight are

Are the people that are – have already – they know both candidates and they're looking for a policy prescription on something. I just don't think that there's a lot of room. This is the first inning in a nine-inning game that ends in November, and we're in June.

You're going to have a VP pick, a convention, and a ton of get-out-the-vote efforts. I know Turning Point's extremely involved in that effort as well. But people aren't going to wake up after one debate tomorrow morning and say, you know what? I've changed my mind. Maybe a smidge.

But this is just – I mean this might even be the first inning. This might be batting practice of the first game. So we need to keep tonight's debate in context. I don't expect a lot to change unless there's that moment that everyone goes, holy smokes, we didn't see that coming.

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Sean, because of the new Mike rules, there will not be a lot of interrupting. Let's go to cut 15. This is back from the debate in 2020. You should go out and vote.

You're in voting now. Vote and let your senators know how strong you feel. But vote now. Make sure you, in fact, let people know you're a senator. I'm not going to answer the question. Why would you answer that? Because the question is, the question is, the question is, will you shut up, man? Who is on your list, Joe? This is so right. Gentlemen, I think this is so unprecedented.

We have ended this segment. We're going to move on to the second segment. That was really a productive segment, wasn't it? Keep yapping, man. The people understand you. 47 years, you've done nothing. So, Sean, there will be no... The interrupting will not be like it was last time. Your thought, your reaction... Remember, Trump had COVID during that debate last time. People forget that. And so...

Some people say it'll help Biden. Other people say it'll help Trump. Your thoughts, Sean? So first of all, I want to know what the over-under is that Trump just doesn't walk over to Biden's podium and start speaking from that mic. He's always got something up his sleeve. Trust me, the thing about Trump, and he did this the other day when he invited the head of the Teamsters to the convention. Trump always, he gets the showmanship better than anybody. And trust me, remember Bannon brought the, uh,

Clinton accusers to the, to the first debate last time or to the St. Louis debate, there's always something going on. And I don't know what it is now, but I think tomorrow morning, we're going to wake up and go, I did not see that curve curveball coming. That being said, I will tell you that I think it's still benefits Trump because one Biden's going to react to whatever he's saying. We might not be able to hear it, but Biden will be number two.

It's not just the verbal that it's those facial expressions. It's the hand gestures that Trump so masterfully uses that those also have an impact. And so we'll still see a split screen and we'll know that Trump is reacting and he understands the full spectrum of tools, right? So it's verbal, it's visual. And I think at the end of the day, it all benefits Trump because he knows how to use it better. And frankly, that's never been Biden's thing.

I still think tomorrow morning, when you think back through history,

Nixon, Kennedy, Reagan going after Mondale about age, Kitty Dukakis, the question about Kitty Dukakis that Bernard Shaw offered to Michael Dukakis about rape. There's no question tomorrow we're going to be talking about some clip. And my guess is that that clip will be Donald Trump going after Joe Biden in some way. I think you're right there, Sean. So let me ask you this. If it's a tie, I think it's a win for Trump.

Biden needs to win 75-25 for this to move the polls. Is that right?

A hundred percent. Right. And I would just caution people when you see the CNN flash poll tonight, don't believe it. It doesn't that won't the flash poll. Look, the one thing I will tell people, Charlie, I've been doing this a long time, is that this tonight is like watching a game. First of all, it's an away game for Donald Trump. I mean, he's playing at CNN headquarters with two CNN hosts.

So this is a total away game. That being said, if you're a fan of a team, like I'm a Patriots fan, I can at least acknowledge begrudgingly that the Jets have a good game once in a while. That doesn't mean I'm a Jets fan. That doesn't mean I want them to win. Yes, Jets.

How they do tonight doesn't necessarily change the trajectory of the race. Even if there's a good moment, objectively, as a Trump supporter, you could say, oh, that was a good answer by Biden or – that doesn't change it. I think overall, net-net, if Trump does what you were saying a moment ago –

and comes out in the way that I think a lot of us want him to, which is to focus on the record, which is unbelievably compelling and heads and shoulders in every aspect above where Biden's is now. He wins all the time and he just needs to remind people of that. So I think that the, the, the,

The deck, quote unquote, might be stacked against Trump, but the issues and the playing field are stacked against Biden. So he's gotten all these advantages logistically, that being Biden. But you can only do so much of that. Right. And that's why I think I think even though all of these things favor Joe Biden.

At the end of the day, if the only two things – he's going to say three things tonight and probably in this order. Convicted felon, abortion, and democracy under attack. That's all he has. He can't talk about immigration or open borders. He can't talk about the economy. He can't talk about the world being safer. So he's going to say those three things over and over again. Convicted felon, abortion, or reproductive rights, and democracy under attack. That's right.

That's right. That's well said, Sean. And if Trump can navigate those with just some whimsy, some smile, don't take the tax too seriously. They're not resonating right now in the polling. They're not resonating in the body of politics. So don't let them resonate with you. It's okay to shrug your shoulders and say, look, that's all you got. Honestly, people are going to be richer. We're going to bring our country back. And Joe, that's your thing. Then you can't talk about real record. Just kind of let it slide. Just be slippery.

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TNUSA.com slash Charlie. That is TNUSA.com slash Charlie. TNUSA.com slash Charlie. You have no idea how Soviet we really are. I saw this article and I immediately told my team, get Helen on the program. Helen Andrews joins us now. Helen, tell us about your latest piece. Thanks a lot, Charlie.

I think a lot of Americans don't think of the collapse of civilizations as something that could happen to them. You hear collapse of civilizations and you think that's something that happens to the Roman Empire or the French monarchy. We forget that we saw the collapse of an entire civilization within the lifetimes of people now living, within my lifetime. And that was the collapse of the Soviet Union. So I was delighted to see the eminent historian Neil Ferguson write a brief

somewhat cheeky column wondering whether America today is in the same position that Soviet Union was in 1989. And I absolutely knew I had to chime in and support that comparison because I think it's spot on. The essence of being in a late Soviet state is that nobody's free and nothing works. And I think both halves of that equation apply to America today. Nobody is free.

and nothing works. Tell us more. That is a brilliant distillation of the madness that we are living through right now. Tell us more. Well, I don't think I need to convince anyone on this, anyone listening about the nobody's free part. When you have a regime that's trying to put the main opposition candidate in jail on trumped up charges, that's pretty transparently unfree. And I also don't think I need to tell anyone here that you can't trust what you read in the New York Times today any more than the average Soviet citizen could trust what they read in Pravda.

But when it comes to the nothing works side, I think that's actually someplace where Neil Ferguson, the great historian, underplayed his argument a little bit. He drew the comparison between America today and the Soviet Union then by looking at the size of government, that our deficits are on track to be 5% of GDP. That's certainly bad, but that doesn't get to the heart of the problem. People

People forget that what killed the Soviet Union wasn't big government. Obviously, they did have a big government, but the bigger problem was that they were a command economy. All of the incentives in their economic system were oriented towards greater production, and none of the incentives were towards greater efficiency. Another aspect of the Soviet Union was that they were bizarrely a net food importer.

Which, if you think about it, is one of the strangest things imaginable. Russia has some of the most fruitful farmland on the planet, and yet they were importing their food. And that's because they forgot that it's actually really important to be able to feed your own citizens from your own land.

When I look at that aspect of the Soviet collapse and then I look at America today, it makes me think of deindustrialization. We've forgotten as a country that you actually can't have an economy based on services and advertising and finance. It really matters to be able to make stuff in your own country.

We instead think that the industries of the future are going to be things like higher ed or healthcare, which are two of the most dysfunctional and least capitalist parts of our modern so-called capitalist system. So when healthcare is one sixth of our economy,

and no aspect of how people get paid in the healthcare system makes any sense at all or is connected to any kind of market mechanism, that looks to me like a society where the economy is just fundamentally not working in the way that the Soviet economy was. Yeah, and so this is a very important point. You would know this better than I would. Would the 1% of the 1% in late Soviet times

did they think things were going well? Because that is really the interesting phenomenon. The richer you are and the more cloistered you are, the better you think things are going. Was that the case also in late stage Soviet Union?

Absolutely. I was a little bit annoyed to read some of the responses to the column that I wrote. Somebody said, how can we be in a state of collapse? I just ordered dulce de leche ice cream on DoorDash right to my door. And I thought, well, OK, I'm sure it's great for you that you can do that. But that doesn't mean things are going well as a country. In the Soviet Union, you're absolutely right. The privileged people are

led lives of great privilege. So it was easy for them not to notice how badly things were going. The other thing that camouflaged how badly things were going in the Soviet Union is that prior to the 1980s,

The record of the Soviet Union in improving the standard of living was actually pretty okay. A lot more Soviet citizens owned televisions, they owned cars, they had more disposable income to spend on food. If you were a Russian citizen who had lived through, say, World War II, and then compared that to your life in the 60s and 70s, you would have thought the socialist system is actually doing pretty okay by me. And so the Soviet leaders used that

to kind of pressure people into thinking the system was doing better than it was. They said, don't you remember all the good things we've done for you? Isn't your life today so much better than it was back in the bad old days of the siege of Leningrad or whatever when you were starving? And I see our leaders doing a little bit of that today. They say, aren't you grateful for everything capitalism has given you? And I think, well, yes, I think America's economy has done great things, but that doesn't change the fact

that the record of governance of our leaders since at least 2000 has been very poor. Well, it's also, what are we thankful for? We're thankful for, we're drawing down an inheritance that this current ruling class had nothing to do with. We're drawing down the inheritance of probably 50 or 60 years or even hundreds of years removed. And it really makes you wonder without abundant natural resources,

and us being the global reserve currency status, how we can keep this up. That is a theory that I have is that we have it so well in the West that the woke is only possible. And again, this is a filler term. I know that people don't like it, but I use it just as a cutesy filler term. It's only possible when you're able to have a economy configured the way we have. And so you say, nobody is free and nothing works.

Is there ever a breaking point where when things really stop working, we're going to decide to reverse course? Or do you think this is just the beginning of a slow motion collapse? I think we absolutely will reach a breaking point the same way the Soviets did. And the only question is whether that'll be a breaking point in a good direction or in a bad direction. One of the more obvious parallels between us today and the Soviet Union then is that our leaders are really old.

We all know the jokes about Brezhnev and Chernenko and Andropov falling asleep in the middle of meetings. There was a stretch of decades there when everybody who ran the Soviet Union seemed to be aged about 93. Well, you look at the White House today and Congress today and you think our leaders are getting pretty old too. And one of the reasons why...

garantocracies develop in political systems is because the older generation is clinging to power and they don't trust what the younger generation is going to do with it. In the Soviet case, it was because most of the younger generation was just too cynical. They saw what socialism was producing and they just

didn't believe in it anymore, somewhat naturally, since it wasn't working. So the older generation resisted handing off power to them. I think there are similar pathologies here in the United States. And once we finally reach the point when generational turnover is unavoidable, when the older generation of congressional leaders have to hand off to somebody younger, I think that might be the breaking point. No, I see, Helen. These people are so...

These people are so craven. I could see Mitch McConnell uploading his consciousness to some form. No, I'm not kidding. Some form of chat GPT or Elon Musk's thing. And it's just a box and it's just Mitch McConnell serving in perpetuity for the next hundred years. I mean, these people will never give up power. They're going to try to fight death. That's what they do every single day. And this ties with your other book.

which I think is important, Boomers, which is a fan favorite of our audience, which we always receive nasty emails about. So I was just at an event in Sun Valley, and it was amazing. And there was a lot of anxiety from the audience, more than I thought about the direction of the country. But some, not all, some would take me aside and they'd say, Charlie, the bombast and the

The idea that America is the Soviet Union is an exaggeration. It's hyperbole. Do you find that the older you are, the less willing you are to acknowledge this? And if so, why? That's the number one reason why boomers are the way they are. When you think about everything that comes to your mind when you hear the term boomers, it's because they inherited a civilization that was prosperous and cohesive and

And almost the best civilization that has ever existed on the planet, certainly in the top five. And they thought that that was the natural order of things. They thought it would always be that way. And so they lacked an understanding of how badly things can go, how you need to really avoid making mistakes in order to prevent your civilization from going off course. One of the criticisms or the pushbacks against the Soviet comparison that I hear most often from boomers is that

The Soviets had to build walls to keep people in, whereas we in the United States, we need to build a wall to keep people out. There are tons and tons of people who want to come here. And that certainly wasn't true of Moscow in 1985. And I hear that and I think I know why that line makes sense to you.

But the fact that millions of people are flooding into our country and our leaders are doing nothing to prevent it actually doesn't make me feel better about the state of our civilization or the trajectory it's on. Did you come up with that nothing works and no one is free and nothing works? Or is that a Helen Andrews original? That is. Well, I am going to give you credit because I think it is brilliant.

Nobody is free and nothing works. And just as an example, why does it take a decade to build a new lane and a highway now? I mean, ever since I've moved, it's a decade, a little bit of an exaggeration, but not really. Ever since I've moved here in Arizona, these numbskulls have been trying to add a lane to one of these highways. And I tell you, it has been perpetually under construction.

And Ryan and Blake know exactly what I'm talking about here. It's as if you move in and it's just the decade of slow motion building. We are not a serious country. That's right. Blake says this. He says, the road outside Turning Point has been getting work done since I moved here. I'm telling you, but at least you guys can get your ice cream and a pride flag in six hours or less brought to you by DoorDash.

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Omega oils, digestive enzymes, probiotics, and antioxidants. Dr. Black is offering you a free jumpstart trial bag. So fetch your free jumpstart trial bag. Just cover shipping. Don't change your dog's food. Just go to roughgreens.com slash Kirk, R-U-F-F greens.com slash Kirk. So, so Helen, let's talk about this continually culturally. The, of all the groups, and again, I'm not here to boomer bash. There's a lot of great boomers out there. There's great people in every generation. However, the, and can you, I want you to talk about your book here.

Donald Trump, just talking politically, because he represents cultural trends, is doing better with younger voters, better with black voters, better with Hispanic voters. I was just with Scott Rasmussen, who backed me up on this. The only demographic where Joe Biden is doing better than his 2020 numbers substantially is with boomers. Why is that, Helen Andrews?

I think because boomers have been running the country almost for as long as they've been alive, and they've set up the system to favor themselves. So a lot of boomers look at America and they say, America's already great because it's going great for them. They have all the houses and they're in all of the positions of power. So because the system is set up to favor them, they don't feel like America needs revolutionary, really pressing, dramatic change.

When for everybody else who's living in the world the boomers made, the need for change, dramatic change, Trump change is pretty obvious. Yeah. And so is there a reluctance essentially towards revolutionary change in that generation? Or at least things are actually going pretty well.

Oh, they were very much into revolutionary change back in the day, back before they were the ones in charge. Well, that's why I interrupt. So help me understand. So why is it like, I mean, they were, if it feels good, do it, you know, turn over the tables. But now it's like, we don't want any changes whatsoever. Help me understand. It's not something that happened since 2016. It's something that's been going on since 1980. Think about what you call to mind when you hear the 60s.

And then think about what you call to mind when you hear the Reagan era. You think of them as being opposites. The 60s were liberal. The 80s were conservative. The 60s were anti-capitalist hippie. The 80s were all about money and Wall Street.

Actually, in both cases, the people who gave those decades their defining spirit were exactly the same people. They were the boomers. They were teenagers or in their 20s during the hippie era. And so they did the things that young people like to do. They did drugs and slept around and listened to music. And then when they got a little older, they thought, I need to make money. I need to get mine.

And once you realize that those were the same people, it starts to come into focus that actually the philosophy of both of those eras isn't so different. It's still very individualistic. It's very self-centered. It's very unwilling to make any kind of sacrifice or engage in any self-discipline. So the 60s and the 80s are really two sides of the same coin. So now you just need to apply that same principle to where the boomers are now, which is nearing retirement.

It's the same case. They want things to be nice and easy for themselves. And they've been the largest demographic, which means the largest voting bloc, the largest bloc of consumers, which means that advertisers and companies want to attract boomer customers because there are more of them than there are of anybody else. So they've really been flattered and coddled by the political system, the economic system. So they don't have any reason to want to take into account the way other people might see things.

So, Helen, what is your response to some of the audience members that say, we are the greatest generation, we've sacrificed so much as boomers, and you who are not boomers are not allowed to criticize us? I say, look at the civilization that you've handed off. All of the institutions that were intact when the

when they were handed over to the boomers, are now broken and in need of repair. Our political system is one that no voters trust anymore. Trust in our political institution has collapsed. Nobody trusts the economy anymore. The churches are in decline now that the liberals of the boomer generation have gone in and monkeyed with mainline Protestantism, which is in a state of total demographic collapse.

So just look at what's happened to the Episcopal Church or the Methodists, and you can see what a generation of boomer leadership leads you with. Is what you're handing off to your children better than what you inherited from your parents? That's the questions the boomers really need to look into the mirror and answer. Helen Andrews, excellent work. Thank you so much. Thanks so much for listening, everybody. Email us as always, freedom at charliekirk.com. Thanks so much for listening, and God bless. For more on many of these stories and news you can trust, go to charliekirk.com.