Post Mortem | Fatal First Date
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Welcome back to Postmortem. I'm 48 Hours correspondent Erin Moriarty, and I'm filling in today for Anne-Marie Green, who's out in the field reporting on another story for 48 Hours. Joining me today is producer extraordinaire Paula Rosa. We're going to discuss our report on the shooting of Leslie Reeves and Chris Smith on the night before Thanksgiving in 2021. Leslie and Chris went on their very first date together, but by the end...

One was dead and the other struggling to survive. Paul and I have been talking about this ad nauseum for months, so we're going to share some of that with you. This was a tough one, wasn't it, Paul? Thanks for being here. Yes, it was. It's a tough story, given what happened.

But, you know, on the other hand, there is a survivor. So that's positive for once for 48 hours. It's very unusual. Now, before we get into it, remember, if you haven't listened to the 48 hours episode yet, you can find the full audio just below this episode in your podcast feed. Go take a listen and then come back here for our scintillating conversation afterwards.

Okay, this was an incredibly sad case, as Paul had said, where two people were just enjoying a first date together. They were getting to know each other. They went to a bar. They were having fun. But unfortunately, sometime in the early morning of Thanksgiving Day, they got caught in the crosshairs of a jealous ex-lover.

investigators almost immediately zeroed in on Leslie's former boyfriend, a man by the name of Bobby Tarr. And they soon charged him with murder and attempted murder. You have been, I didn't realize you'd been at CBS for 32 years.

I know you've interviewed your share of killers, but Bobby wasn't quite what we're used to, was he? Right. I mean, for one thing, it was not hard to talk him into doing an interview. He wanted to talk. Normally...

You have to go through defendants' lawyers. You have to convince them. And it's not always easy to do. It's like trying to really make them understand why it would be good for them to talk. Bobby Tarr was completely different. Like, I mean, he would text me all the time. He would call me all the time. We had video chats. I mean, he really, really wanted to talk. He felt he had a tale to tell and he wanted to tell it. Now, just to point out, so listeners realized

He's in jail when he's reaching out to you and you're having video conversations. I mean, I think people would be surprised to know that. I think they are. And, you know, it did surprise me at first. I think people like myself even find that astounding that they have so much access to the outside world.

Bobby was no exception. He could text me whenever he wanted to, more or less. He could video chat with me. We just had to set that up and he would call me collect. And, you know, I set up my phone so that I was able to accept his calls. The funny thing is a couple of times I didn't accept the call because I thought it was spam. And then I was kicking myself realizing it was him who was calling, but he always called back.

That was no problem. He always called back. Now, you had the first contact with Bobby Tarr. And then I had to go into, at this point, prison to interview him. I had never talked to him. My job was to just listen to his story, tell me what happened, Bobby, and not to challenge him at all.

because I didn't want to scare him into not talking to you. So that's a producer's role sometimes that the audience might want to know. I never asked him a really hard question. I let Aaron ask him the hard questions. And I was worried about that also, because I wondered if when he got Aaron, he was going to think, you know, he's been double-crossed or something. I was really worried about...

That when I went in and all of a sudden I was asking him tough questions, that he'd be angry. But he wasn't. This was very unusual for me. This was a man, no matter what, even when I questioned his story, his affect never changed. He was always that affable guy. You know, we call him in the hour unflappable. And he calls himself an easygoing guy.

Now, all that said, he shot two people in the head and that's not an easygoing guy. You asked him in the interview if he had snapped that night and he said, I don't snap.

I think, though, that was the benefit of interviewing him because he comes across like a charming guy. And we don't want to give a convicted killer a platform. But when you really push him and talk to him, you realize that there is a very dark side. I don't think anybody listening or watching our show understands

would think that this was an innocent man. Yes, because the evidence was against him. Well, one of the poignant details in this case, I think, is that the victim, Leslie Reeves, taught self-defense courses. She actually wanted to help women escape abusive relationships.

And as we reported, apparently she was taking steps to get out of her own, what her friends say, was a toxic relationship. But the more we looked into it, it's complicated, isn't it? It's complicated. She claimed that Bobby owed her $10,000, that she had left it in a safe in his house and he had used it to buy a motorcycle.

So she would ordinarily would have just cut all ties with him, but she wanted to get her money back. And so he would tease her with it. He would give her a thousand dollars and then he'd say, come over my house tonight. I'll give you another thousand dollars. And of course, he always wanted her to spend the night.

And Leslie's friend said one week before the shooting, he said, come over to my house again. I'll give you a thousand dollars. The usual story she did. And then she wanted to leave and he wouldn't let her, he blocked the door and she, because she is a self-defense expert managed to get by him. She was very strong by the way. I mean, she ran a Pilates studio, Leslie, and in the pictures, you can see the muscles in her arms. She was no pushover. Um,

She grabbed her car keys and went out into the yard and kept hitting the alarm button on her key chain so that it would go off. She knew that his parents lived nearby, other people lived nearby, and they'd come out and say, why is this car alarm going off over and over again? And eventually he gave it up. He brought out her purse, everything else she had with her, the money, and then she took off. Well,

Well, and I should point out that we only know this from Leslie's friends. Right. Because Leslie did not survive to really tell what happened. And so we've had to rely a lot on what her friends said. She had a close-knit circle of friends.

She was divorced. She had two children, but she lived with one of her closest friends. So she was not alone. And she told people these stories. And then we have to take what Bobby Tarr says with a grain of salt because he denied what her friends say. One of the reasons, I don't

Leslie was terrified of Bobby is that he was stalking her or so she thought. That's what she told her friends. A month before the shooting, it was around Halloween. She had another first date with a different guy and they were getting along and they were in a church parking lot when Leslie says Bobby showed up in his car.

Out of the blue. There was no reason he would know she was there. She wasn't in her hometown. How was he tracking her? That's never been fully established. The authorities say they don't know how he was stalking her and he wasn't convicted of that. Bobby always has an explanation for everything. And that was one of the problems that both you and I faced.

uh, encountered with Bobby Tarr is that both of us felt that because he talked to me after this trial, that he had taken the evidence and fashioned a story around it to make him look innocent. And so he admitted, he, he said, yes, I did stop and see her when she was on this first date, but he said, uh,

that he wasn't tracking her. He just happened to come across her. Now we know that there is in fact a text that Leslie sent one of her friends where she said, I'm paraphrasing, I have to cut off all contact with this guy or he could wind up killing me.

And that's a pretty serious text to send to somebody. And you asked him about that. I did. And he said, I just don't understand that text. I don't know why she sent it. So now let's go a little bit to the investigation into Bobby Tarr. You know, as we had mentioned, investigators had arrested Bobby Tarr right away. Well, if you consider the shooting happened Thanksgiving morning around 1 a.m.,

Bobby Tarr was picked up that Thanksgiving evening. Right. So it was hours later after the shooting. And I remember when I first saw that they had arrested him, which was basically because he lied to them, that it felt...

So premature. But as the prosecutor told us, and now this really makes sense to me, you know, they had one victim still alive. And they were so worried that if Bobby Tarr was the killer, he could finish off that victim if they let him go. But the problem was they arrested him before they had any results yet on any of their crime scene charges.

Give me your thoughts about the investigation. That was a problem for the prosecution. Yeah, it seemed it was a very bloody scene. The investigator said that Chris Smith was shot in the kitchen and he said the amount of blood in the kitchen was just astonishing. It was everywhere in that kitchen. So you start to wonder, well, if there's blood everywhere and the glass door was shattered, what?

How come there was nothing in Bobby Tarr's car, no sign of blood, no sign of glass that he stepped on with his shoes? He did wash his clothes afterwards, but they found no blood on his clothes. I mean, how did that happen? And there is an explanation. The prosecutors claim that

It was not a bloody scene when Bobby Tarr was there. He shot Chris once in the head. He stepped to the next room, shot Leslie once in the head, and then he left. After he left, that's when Chris was still alive and sort of wandering around the kitchen, bleeding from a head wound, which bleeds a lot. And he had bled for 12 hours before being rescued. The kitchen was covered in blood. But it wasn't like that, prosecutors say, when Bobby Tarr was there. Yeah.

But not mentioned in the hour, the defense said investigators did not extensively test the evidence found. There was blood on Leslie's pajamas and another speck of blood on the kitchen counter. They didn't test that either. I mean, it was tough for the prosecution, I think, at trial because they did have to deal with that. But what they had was, of course, evidence.

incredible number of lies from Bobby Tarr. He lied about going to the gas station, for God's sakes. And they had enough phone records that indicated that he did not stay at home all evening, like he had said. And they knew he was lying also because they had picked up his car on license plate readers, which they got immediately. There's so many digital trails out there.

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After seven years, the adventure continues with our immersive travels feature. Explore distant cultures and engage in exciting experiences. There's always something new to discover. Are you ready? Download June's Journey now on Android or iOS. Welcome back to Postmortem, where we tell all those details we didn't get to put into 48 hours. Probably among the most damaging pieces of evidence was the fact that Bobby's own family

testified against him. His dad, his son, and his own daughter. That was the big thing that...

He told the police a story. And then he said, you could ask my daughter. She was home the whole night with me. So, of course, they did. They went and got his daughter. And her name was Shelby. Shelby, we have her interrogation also in the show. And her mother, who's a paralegal, told her, tell the police the truth. That's all you got to do. So she did. She told the police the truth that her father had left

Three times that evening. And it contradicted Bobby's story and what he had told the cops. Here's something that we didn't have time to put in the hour. So right before Bobby Tarr's daughter was about to testify, he texts her. And so if you talk to the prosecution, they think he was trying to...

to intimidate her or make her think twice about testifying against her dear old dad, he said to me he knew it was hard for her to testify and he was just, you know, hoping she was OK. I don't know which one I believe, but it was an interesting detail. Well, it's possible in that case he was telling the truth because it was sort of a

nice in quotes a text it was like i know this is hard for you i i hope uh you know you're doing okay paraphrasing that's what it was our producer at the trial mark goldbaum was having lunch with shelby and her mother when her father bobby tar sent that text and they were like oh my god and they immediately told the prosecutor and when they went came back from lunch they

you know, they told the judge and it was a point against him. So Bobby, if he had this story he had to tell, you would have thought maybe he would tell the jury. He did not. He chose not to. But then he did speak at his sentencing. Now, I didn't attend that. Tell me what you thought about that, Paul. Well, he went on and on before the judge for about a half hour or so. So telling his story, I believe that

He figured out a way to tailor his story to fit the evidence. And he tried to sell that to the judge.

And the judge at some point cut him off and said enough already because you had your opportunity to testify. You chose not to. And I don't want to hear any more of it. And sentenced him to 85 years. So in this case, the other victim is a man by the name of Chris Smith, who was unbelievably shot in the head and really, truly miraculously survived.

Paul, you actually talked to him way before I got to meet him. So tell me your thoughts.

Chris is a great guy and he has a piece of a hollow point bullet in his brain. It's too dangerous for doctors to operate in that section. So they left it there. He is paralyzed on his left side. He has to use a cane and a wheelchair a lot of the time. But otherwise, he's the Chris who was there before the shooting. And the first time he ever texted me, he said, hey, it's me, Bullet Boy.

referring to the bullet in his brain. So he has a sense of humor that he never lost. He was in the hospital for almost two months. And when he came to, he could barely speak. He didn't know what happened to him. He remembers nothing at all of the shooting or Leslie Reeves, which is really interesting when you consider that

Leslie and he had been speaking on the phone, texting with each other for two weeks before the date. And it's interesting how the brain works. It just excised the shooting and Leslie completely out of his brain. Now, because he couldn't remember anything, not only could he not testify, I'm sure that was a big disappointment for the state.

But he didn't even go to the trial because he thought he'd be so angry. But he did give an amazing impact statement at sentencing. We weren't allowed to bring cameras into the courtroom, but he did speak outside. And I want to share that with you here now. It might be a little hard to understand simply because he's outside the court. But listen, it's really worth listening to. I want to live my life normal, go back to work,

I'm just a normal guy. That's all I want to get out of my life back. And basically that's what my impact statement was this time. What happened, I've had six brain surgeries. I've had two plates in my head. I'm on the second one. Pray to God it's the last one. And just everything I lost. Lost my house. Lost my truck. Lost my dog. I mean, I've literally lost my life about being killed.

That is so hard to hear he's right. When he says he lost everything, he's not kidding. He had three strokes in the hospital. He was placed into a medically induced coma. He had to relearn how to walk, relearn how to stand, how to talk. It wasn't easy. Looters came in when nobody was watching the house and they stole everything in his house, including his above ground pool.

He had to move back in when he was 50 with his mother and her new husband. And by the way, we should mention Tiki the dog. Tiki was home when the shooting took place.

And the first EMT who came through the door happened to be a friend of Chris's. And he told Chris that Tiki was huddling with him and he thinks kept him alive during the 12 hours that Chris lay on the kitchen floor. The glass door was shattered. So the cold from the November wind was getting into the house and

But because Tiki stayed right next to Chris, probably helped save his life. And he now cannot live with Tiki. He couldn't really take care of her. And when he moved in with his mother, there were two big male dogs there. So he had to give Tiki to a neighbor, but he still saves Tiki. I mean, that to all of us would be a serious loss. That's hard for him. To me, what I think, though, is the most important part of this hour is that we take a look at what Chris did.

is doing now. I mean, how would you describe where he is in his journey for getting back to his life? Chris showed me a picture of himself just before this happened. He was absolutely ripped. I mean, he had abs of steel and, um,

He's trying to get back there. He goes to the gym every morning now to try to regain muscle. He was in a rock band, Chris. He's back singing in the rock band, but he used to play guitar. He can't play guitar now. He's a remarkable person. And the fact that he still has a sense of humor says something. He is determined to get as close back to the Chris that he was as

And he even turned to the camera and he said, if there's any doctor there who has new treatments, I'm ready to try them. I hope he does hear from somebody. That would be really great. And he wants to be a motivational speaker. That's what he could be. He's launching a business as a motivational speaker because he's

He feels he has a story to tell and he can inspire people. That's another thing he says in our hour, never give up, just never give up. And I think we're both going to take that with us. But before I let you go, Paul, I want to ask you about the new 48 Hours NCIS podcast that just came out on the case of Aaron Corwin.

You originally reported on this case for 48 hours, and you are prominently featured in this podcast. So tell me about this work on the original story and why this case mattered to you. Well, it's one of my favorite stories. Erin Corrin was a young Marines wife, and she was out in a town called 29 Palms, which is near Joshua Tree National Park. It's an absolutely beautiful desert-like area, and

And Aaron wound up being killed. There are a lot of abandoned mines out in the wild around Joshua Tree. And they found her in one of those mines after a two-month search. And I met Aaron's mother. I spent some time with Aaron's mother. And we brought her with us when we went back to the mine. She wanted to come. She asked us if she could come. And we went out to the mine with her and she said her goodbyes.

And I'm still in touch with her. See, I love the fact that we can do podcasts about these stories that, you know, because we never can put enough in to 48 hours, but you can talk about those kind of things in this podcast, Postmortem, and in this new NCIS podcast. Paul, thanks for joining me today. Thank you for having me.

So if you like the series Postmortem, please rate and review 48 Hours on Apple Podcasts and follow 48 Hours wherever you get your podcasts. And you can also listen ad-free on Amazon Music, Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, or with a 48 Hours Plus subscription on Apple Podcasts. Thank you, really, all of you for listening.

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