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What do I say? I don't know what I say. What do I do? All right, so I'm going to finish my peanut butter, which is probably really annoying to hear me chew a peanut butter sandwich. What might be a little better is this is my apple juice. Guys, if this episode of Smart List is as delicious as my lunch is right now, you guys are fucking set. Welcome to Smart List. Smart List. Smart List.
I have a 1.30 pickup and a 2 o'clock crew call and 2.30 shoot time.
Wow. So Jason's describing his first day of work, which is tomorrow at a fish market at two in the morning. He has to shoot in a real fish market that's smelly and stinky. Yeah. The hours of operation is two to 6 a.m. So that's when we have to be there. And, um,
You know, there was a time in my life when I enjoyed those hours of the day. Sure. But I don't anymore. So my first day is going to be, I'm going to try to be warm. I'm going to try to be welcoming. It's going to be rough.
That's two in the mornings, Ruff. Yeah. I don't know. I guess I'm going to go to sleep at six or something, try to sleep for a little bit. Or should I just stay up? Should I just go get a big fat bag of white and stay up all night, Will? Whoa, whoa, whoa. Let's pump the brakes on that. Should I just start counting days again? No, let's just pump the brakes on that. Okay. So I said to Jay, he was thinking of opening the first day gifts or whatever, you know, start gifts. And last night, I was with Will, Jason, and
I said to Amanda, I said, the cookie thing, there's like a new place in New York that makes pie cookies. Can you believe Sean knows about that? And they make... They also make croissants stuffed with cookie dough. It's amazing. Jesus Christ. Croissants stuffed with cookie dough. That's right. Yeah. And what do you think I said to that pitch as start gifts? Do you think it was a no or do you think it was a yes? Well...
i'm just trying to imagine your tone i bet it wasn't considered friendly no um it wasn't it was it was very judgy yes shut me down immediately we um yeah sean and i were talking on the weekend we saw each other last night yeah that's what sean just said yeah jason and we were with your wife and i spent a lot of time with your wife last night well a lot of time um
We started talking about, I've been freaked out this weekend. And Sean, I mentioned this to you. We started talking about it because you read, I sent you the article, JBI sent you the article about kids with smartphones. Yes. Yes. And it's been freaking me out. And that guy, Jonathan Haidt, wrote that book, Anxious Generation. Yes, this is crazy. And it's kind of, I spent the weekend like talking to my kids about it. And, you know, what this smartphone has done to this young generation and like the super increased rates of...
Depression. Anxiety. Anxiety. Even, sadly, suicide, of course. And it's like, it's really bummed me out. And I've just been like... What would the boys say about it? Well, you know what is funny? Did you talk to them about it? I did. I talked to them a little bit about it. And I said, you know, what you got to remember is that these, some of these companies are trying to, there are people out there who knew that this stuff would be addictive to you guys.
and they fed it to you. Like big tobacco. In a way, in a similar way. And I was like, how does that make you feel? Do you feel angry? And they were like, yeah, I feel kind of pissed off. Because I feel duped. Look, we're all guilty of it. We were talking last night. How many times you're talking to somebody and you've got your phone and you go, hang on, sorry, what? Your attention is divided. Right.
So I do it as an adult. And imagine what that does if you're a teen. It's even harder. And this is a moment where you're establishing your neural pathways. And I said to Sean, I go, the richest man, my 13-year-old, has the same phone as the richest man in the world. That's crazy. Yeah, they're all the same phones. I'm nervous about my kids like...
going out or walking around the corner or whatever, and yet I'll let them get on their phone and go to the far deep reaches of the Internet. I don't know. I've got to change. Anyway, that's been kind of dominating my thinking. Something to do, something to figure out.
So I'm going to figure out... How are they... Are they able to manage boredom? Like, do they have coping skills for, like, riding in an elevator and not doing anything except staring at the wall or sitting at a red light and watching traffic go by? You know, like, that's something we had no choice but to get comfortable with. And it has...
I'm glad I have that skill. I would be very anxious without the skill of managing boredom. And that boredom led to creative thinking, right? Thought, yeah, exactly. Do you want to hear my thoughts when I'm sitting at a red light? Can I guess? Yeah, you can guess. Is there a fart joke in here somewhere? The thoughts are, glazed or cake? Shut up.
Sprinkled or no sprinkle. Hot fudge, hot fudge, caramel, fuck it both. So I don't want a phone taking all that away from me. Hot fudge, caramel, fuck it both. Hot fudge, caramel, fuck it both. Fuck it both.
All right, anyway, look it. We're not going to solve it today, but it's food for thought. This is someone who's as delicious as glazed her cake. She is extraordinary. She is a hoot and a half, a real firecracker. She has a Starburst tattoo on her right foot. What? Yes.
As an actress, her body of work is ridiculously vast, and yet she's still younger than any of us. Known in Hollywood for her transformative character work and strength on screen, you might be surprised to learn that her fear of flying goes as far as needing to meet every pilot before takeoff to assess their skill set. When not in the cockpit, you could probably find her working on a Ryan Murphy project or 12 of them. It's the lovely and delightful and our good friend Sarah Paulson. Sarah, get your ass out here. Sarah Paulson.
Awesome. I covered the camera with toilet paper. Toilet paper. Sure you did. It would have been better if it was clean. By the way, use toilet paper. It's not clean. Are you in the bathroom? I'm upstairs. I'm upstairs. Yeah, near a bathroom. You live in your apartment in New York? Yeah.
I don't live in New York. I'm just here while I'm doing the play. But this is your apartment. We're visiting you in your apartment while you're doing the play. I'm actually staying at a friend's apartment, renting that apartment. Gotcha. And the play...
we should mention. Is that the Tabasco Theater, by the way? It's at the Spicy Tabasco Theater. That's really the Belasco. That's where Sean won his Tony. And Sarah's well on her way to hers. Tony, yes. For Tony.
Yes. It's the golden touch of that theater, Sarah, I'm telling you. In her incredible play called Appropriate. Everybody, if you're... No, no, Appropriate. Oh, really? Yeah, okay, so talk about that because we were like, it's spelled the same and I was like, oh, I didn't know this. It's true. So are we supposed to think that it's both appropriate and appropriate? Well, I think at the beginning of the play, there's that sign, right? That sort of drop in front of the curtain that describes all of the various ways in which... The noun and the verb. Yeah.
- The noun and the verb. - Yeah. What is Will doing? - Hi. - Hi. - He's working on his smartphone. - Well, we don't really know you. No, I got some notification to verify that it's me on my Google. I don't know, but I was listening and what I was thinking was-- - I mean, just exactly what we talked about. - At least I listened more than you did. At least I listened more than you did when you were going to see her play Appropriate.
Clearly. Thanks, Will. Both of you guys, you both missed it. I missed seeing the play. Now, Sarah, I don't really know you like these guys do, so hi. Then hush. Let us talk. Yeah. Go ahead. Go ahead. Weirdly, I wanted to talk to Will. I mean, I know you both. Great. Sean and I will take a tight five. More interested in that. Take a tight five.
But why is it appropriate instead of appropriate? I think appropriate could work just beautifully for that play. I think it could. And I think it's why he offers both options at the beginning of the play because all of it is applicable. But I think I did ask him directly. It is appropriate to.
All right. I think he's wrong. I think he's wrong. I'm going to tell him. Wait, so I want to do, so we went backstage. First of all, go see the play. It's amazing. You're phenomenal in it, especially that last monologue was incredible. You're standing on the stairs and it's like you're Scarlett whatever and you're just like, it's incredible. It's incredible. Thanks, Sean. It's really, really great. That's very kind of you, Sean. By the way, I love that thing too. People were like, you know, I was talking about it afterwards to friends and
that thing about it's too long to go into what the whole play is about because it's about a lot of things but your character with your two brothers go back to the home where your father died and you're sorting out business and you find all of these questionable things in his past like pictures of things and other stuff that
that bring up a bunch of questions about your family and your upbringing. And at the end of the play, I thought it was so profound when you were like, and please fill in the blanks, but you're talking to your two brothers and you're like, I'm the oldest of this family. I got to hold you and watch you and see all of the things that create your memories, but nobody's ever held me or was there for me. Nobody's left in the family who's done that for me. For me, yeah. I thought that was really powerful. Yeah. Well, it seems appropriate. Oh.
Oh, God. It's definitely not appropriate. This is why we hired Will. Oh, it's definitely not. Well, because that's a completely different meaning. No, I mean, Jason has a lot of skills, but this one particular assessment is not one of them. I tell you what, do yourself a favor. Don't ask either of them to define it because it'll be embarrassing for everybody. So moving forward. I want to talk about flying and your fear of flying, like why that is. Sorry, before we move beyond the play, Will, are you going to find some time to come see the play?
Yeah. I am. I'm going to see the play. What's the date on that? Just so Sarah can be ready. You know, I hate knowing when people are out there. She hates knowing. Just give her a ballpark. I'd say it, but she hates knowing. Yeah. All right. I wanted to, because I was going to say, I was about to tell you, and then she's like, I hate knowing. You've got until June 23rd, buddy, but I don't want to know. I don't want to know.
I don't like to know when people are coming. I don't care if it's your dry cleaner. I don't care if it's your dentist. I end up thinking too much about whether or not it's my codependent, my kind of hypervigilant way of being in the world. You're listening for their laugh. Yeah, I'm just wondering, like even any of my castmates, I don't want to know if your fourth grade teacher was there. I'm worried. I thought you were going to say, I don't want to know if you're in the play tonight. Well, that too. This is how I ended up with three kids.
Yeah. Because people didn't want to know when I was coming. Hey, listen. Let me tell you something, Sarah. Hey! Whoa! Let me tell you something, Sarah. That's terrible. Let me tell you something. Have you ever... Sarah, let me tell you something. Here's what I'm going to do. I want to show you. And I have so much respect for you as an artist. Unlike these guys. I do, too. Unlike these guys. Jason's quiet, by the way. I'm not going to... I'm not going to tell you. I'm not going to tell you when I'm going to come to see this show.
I'm not going to come and see the show, and I'm not going to tell you afterwards. So you won't even know I was there. Okay? Because I respect you. That works for me. Sarah, how is that at the end where, you know, for Tracy in Wisconsin, it is a practice, a habit, an obligation for anyone in the audience who knows a cast member, or even if you don't know them, you just happen to be famous. Yes.
Jason's obsessed with this. You are obligated to go backstage and introduce yourself to the cast and visit for a bit. And if you don't, apparently that's tantamount to giving it a bad review. And so how do you like that dance there at the end where you're done with the play, you're exhausted, and now you've got to socialize?
It's not my favorite. Yeah. Although I will tell you, we've had a couple of fancy famouses come and not come backstage. And we all collectively discuss that we think it means that they didn't like it. Yeah, sure.
But then we sort of think, well, but think about it this way. So you're so famous, you think somehow that the cast, whom you do not know, wants you to come backstage and announce yourself to bequeath them with your great... It's arrogant. It's so weird. So it's that, there's no way to win. Yeah, you can't win. But we have had discussions about
you know, there was like some fancy person who came who had worked with someone in the play who didn't come back. And I was like, well, no, that is a communication that they just don't like you. Yeah, yeah. Right? So can I ask you, if I... Maybe not the whole play, just you. Yeah. If before June 23rd, I find myself at the Tabasco Theater. Yeah. And I've seen the play and I've enjoyed it. And I'm the first one to my feet and my hands hurt from all the clapping. And I'm just, and I'm hooting and hollering. And then there's the moment.
If you guys find out that I'm there and I don't come backstage, do you and your cast want me there? And there's a thumbs up. I just want to really make a point of this. Do you guys, do you and your cast, do you guys want me there?
Yeah, I think we would discuss that we thought Will Arnett didn't like the play. Really? That's what we would discuss, yeah. What if he didn't like the play? This is all I want. What if he doesn't like the play and he comes backstage and he lets you know? He thinks he's got helpful notes for you. He says, yeah, yeah, no, I enjoyed it. However, like, has anyone come back there and popped off about how you can make it fucking better? Yeah.
That has not happened, although I would kind of welcome it, actually, just simply so I could discuss it with other people about the outreach. I did do a play once. I've gotten that. Jay, I've gotten that. I will tell you, I did do a play once. My last time I was on stage, I did a play called Tally's Folly at the Roundabout.
And thank you for the applause. And the actress, and I'm going to say this, and I'm not going to ask you to cut this out because I don't fucking care. This actress came to the play. What's her fucking name? Hi, Trish. Hi, Trisha. Trish Hawkins came to this play. Am I going to get sued? I don't care because I think this is outrageous. She came to the play. If it's true. And I proceeded...
My mother brought her to the play. They were in some kind of like writing group together. And my mother thought it'd be great to bring Trish Hawkins to the play. I mean, this is a whole other conversation about my mom. Hi, mom. But she came to the play, proceeded to say, she looked at me and sort of up and down. And then she went, your dress is yellow. Mine was pink.
And I thought, what? Oh, she did the character before you. Cut to two days later, I got an email that was six pages long of notes and a communication to me about what she had done when she had done the play. Jesus Christ. What she recommended I do. Oh, my God.
Oh, my God. It was outrageous. Oh, my God. It was really outrageous. Trish Hawkins, I have not forgotten it, and I hope to see you never. You still have the letter? I have it. I do have it. And did you talk to your mother and say, please delete her numbers? I didn't. I sort of just, you know...
Put it back in the file of things my mother has done. That's good, though. You need to save that. Sarah, can I just say this? I need to say something. I need an interjection, if you don't mind. Yeah, okay. I don't know you as well as these guys, and I have a real feeling that you and I are going to be better friends than they could ever imagine. I love you for saying that so fucking much.
Oh, yeah. No, you two would be inseparable. Sarah, I have all the time when people and when they fucking deserve it. Now, by the way. This is the deal. You cannot come to, you want to, if you're my dearest friend and we go have a cocktail or a, you know, a little bread basket, Jason, or some air that we might eat, Jason. But, you know, post the show, some air. She knows you. Yeah, we might eat some air. Yeah.
Air is so tasty. Sounds like a good show, though. It's really wild how good it can be. But if you are a person that I love and admire, and I say to you, tell me what you thought, really. And give me some, especially like early days previews or something. All right, thank God. Okay, so here it is. So at the top of the show...
But I would say this for Trish. I will say this for Trish, Sarah. It's, we have- Trish is here, by the way. Trish is here. She's staying in your guest house, right? Yeah, my mom will probably trot her out. Try to bring her to the next play. By the way, Sarah, I also have a mom who says a lot of inappropriate stuff. What are you doing? We all do. My mom also, my mom's going to get so upset about this, but like Cate Blanchett came to the play the same night that my mother came, same afternoon that my mother came.
And Margo Martindale came also. And all these people that I love and I have long relationships with. And I've worked with Kate three times. I've worked with Margo more than once. And I, of course, was really happy to see them. And I was, I'm not saying I wasn't happy to see my mom. But it was like, maybe the range was a little like, oh my God, Kate. Oh my God, Margo. And it was like, hey mom. And she didn't like that? And I know,
And I don't think she loved it. And I think her retribution is to just give me like a little less than I would hope for. - Yeah, I know. - Because I think I'm giving her-- - She's gotta keep you in your place. - It's just gotta keep me a little, yeah. And she was like, I mean, I know we're supposed to go out. I don't know why I'm making my mom sound like this grand dame of Fifth Avenue or something. She's really like the grand dame of Woodstock. She's like a tambourine playing.
You know, hey, mom. I mean, I'm really sorry. I'm just disparaging you for my own comedy interests. No, no, no, no. But it's reality. It's my reality. I'm allowed to talk about my reality, right? Yeah. Trish Hawkins, my mom, they belong to me. And poor Trish. Poor Trish. Trish used to love Smartless. She'd listen to it every week. And I tell you what, about 25 million listeners per month. Trish is about to get the bombardment she never knew she had. She deserves, by the way.
The one she deserves. She brought it on. She's a fucking persona non grata. I'll put that email on Instagram faster than you can say Trish Hawkins. We're going to put it in the chat. And we will be right back. All right, back to the show.
Sarah Paulson, I want to talk about the fear of flying thing. You're my hero. Can I just say you're my hero? And you haven't even gotten into your shared fear of flying. Oh, you have this too. Yeah, yeah, of course. Oh, God, so we're best friends. When's your birthday? Hate to be, not to be too Amanda Anka about it, but when's your birthday? Oh, God, we're even better. May 4th. May 4th. May 4th, yeah. Okay. May 4th of May. All right, so it's coming up. What sign is that, Taurus? I just want to know what your sign is. Taurus, I'm a Taurus. And what's your rising? Do we know what your rising is? What's your rising?
Gemini. Oh, yeah. What's your moon? I'm a Sagittarius with a Virgo rising and an Aquarius moon. So, you know, do with that what you will. And you believe in all that stuff. I don't. I mean, I don't know enough about it to... I do kind of think it's a thing. But anyway, the fear of flying...
is very real for me. - Yeah. - There's a lot of weeping that happens if there's a tiny pocket of, like-- - Really? - Yeah. - You'll go right into-- - Right into the crying. - Mm-hmm. - Really? - The grabbing the stranger next to me. I know you guys haven't been on a commercial airplane in a very long time, but if you do-- - That's not true. I was on a Falcon last week. Is that not?
He doesn't like the falcons. The falcons he thinks are beneath him. The private planes are even scarier to me. I don't enjoy it. Okay, more room for us. Wait, Sarah, Sarah, Sarah, I want to talk. So here's my thing about pilots, and I love hearing that you like to meet the pilot before. What I do is I like to say to the pilots,
How are we looking, right, for our journey? Because what I don't enjoy is if you get on a flight and you have a bunch of turbulence and the pilot doesn't say anything. He doesn't come over. Correct. It's the lack of communication. I can't stand it. Just go, hey. Just say, hey. It's run-of-the-mill turbulence. It's not a big deal. We're all good. We're blah, blah, blah, blah. Then I'm good. But, Sarah, do you have this, too? Because I have a little bit of this, too. The second you hear that...
And right before the pilot speaks, you're like, oh, Jesus, what is this going to be? Just the thought of it makes me sweat. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They should come on beforehand, right? Yes. We've got some bumps coming up. If they come on and they give you a lay of the land, which is why I like to talk to them because I say the same thing, how are we looking? They often pull up the iPad with the route and they show me where the pockets of potential weather. This is there on Delta, United, American. I like Delta. Delta's a sponsor of Smartness.
Well, you know what it is? You know why? Because you know what it is? This is a relationship. And relationships really work with communication. So you need to have this communication. Hey, if you can't grow up, Sean, for a second, then take five, okay? Because Sarah and I are talking about relationships. You're back on a tight five.
Sarah, why don't you invite... Wait a second. When's the last time you had a bunch of passengers stop by the cockpit and ask for... No, Jason, when you walk on the cockpit, it's open. It's right there. Yeah, but if everybody stopped and asked to look at the iPad for the routing... I'm not asking to look at the iPad. I'm asking how we're doing. And they often pull out the iPad as a way of saying, here's what we're doing.
I ask them how the plane looks, who did the checkout, like who went around and checked out the plane. I want to know how long they've been flying. You ask for a little hint as to what chair the marshal's sitting in just for fun? Sometimes I've done that. What if it's Sarah? What if you're like, how long have you been flying? And some 20-year-old is like, I'm just flown for one week. Today's day one!
Well, I want you to know that it's literally every single pilot joke that is made to me every time I ask them. I'm like, oh, today's my first day. I'm like, no, no. Not funny at all. Wish me luck. I just was lobotomized. Yeah. And sometimes there are, you know, the young co-pilot has fewer years and fewer hours. How about this? How about I don't like to meet the pilots because if I meet the pilots, it becomes too human to me. And I don't like to imagine the fact that a human being is even possible.
You can't fly a plane, right? I like to think that there are superhuman intelligent people up there that wouldn't even spend a minute with me. Like they're doing adult work up there. He sits down, he sits in a seat and he plugs a type C device
plug into the side of his head and it goes into the side of the plane and then he just power down. He started speaking. Don't power down, Jason. Exchange information. Just like a software. Reboot in five hours. So, Sarah, are you also a type of gal who likes to chat with the Uber driver?
Nope. Don't want to talk to the Uber driver. You have that already clicked on your profile there? No chitty chat? Oh, no, I don't. I did see that, but I thought that was rude. To click on it to make a point of it? To click on it to make it like a rule for them. Yeah. I'd rather just let my behavior and my demeanor communicate that. So if you got on the Uber and the guy started asking you a question, you would just stop him and say, check my profile. Yeah.
Right? Well, yeah, no, exactly. I mean, think about the kind of vibe you got to kick out to him. I guess that's true. To get him to be quiet is more rude than him being pre-warned that this person's not up for a conversation. I guess I think I feel really uncomfortable in general in a car where someone's driving. I have to chat senselessly just to be clear. What if there was a box for smart list and you just checked it, I'd rather not chat today. Yeah.
So wait. If they try talking to me, I always go, why won't you talk? And I just go, sorry, man, my leprosy is flaring up. You know what I mean? Wait, Sarah. So I love this stuff because you're not only afraid of flying, but clowns, sharks, bees, and then you have, what is it? Bees? Trypophobia? I have that trypophobia thing where I can't, I don't actually know how it's pronounced. Like Jason doesn't know about appropriate appropriate, but it's,
It's trypophobia, trypophobia, I don't know. It's a fear of tryptophan. Is it fear of tryptophan? No, it's not fear of tryptophan. It's fear of holes. It's fear of like... Holes. Like a group of holes. A grouping, a whole grouping. I've heard this before. Like a natural sponge makes me like actually, I have to, or a coral reef, not interesting. What about an English muffin?
No, it's not. Those are nooks and crannies. Those aren't holes. Those are nooks and crannies. Those are nooks and crannies, Sean. Swiss cheese wrecks your night? No, because they're not close enough together. It's about when they're packed tight. Right. So a loofah. No, thank you. I don't like a loofah at all.
So what's the reaction? It makes my skin crawl and I have to run away. And Ryan Murphy decided that this was so funny that he decided to make a season of American Horror Story about a character that I played who had this disorder. So then I was constantly all day long having to look at these things and run from them. Clowns as well and things. That sounds like bullying. That sounds like bullying. Exactly. Did that get you past your fears or did it make it worse? It just...
It kept it at a steady place. I'm not... Yeah, kept it on high. But the bee thing, you know, I've never been... Not to bring up my mother again, but my mom... You know, that's what this is about. She locked me outside...
She deserves it. One day, my mother determined that the bees should be something I should get comfortable with because, you know, obviously they do a lot for our planet. They're wonderful. They're great. I had never been stung when I was... Yeah, exactly. Dirty hippie. And so I had not been stung at that point, and I still, at the ripe old age of 49, have not been stung by a bee. Because I will drop a baby. I'm not kidding. I will...
I will drop a baby, a tiny baby and flee if a bee... I'm not kidding. Equally afraid of bees. You are not. Are you really? Oh, yeah. I really don't like them. That's my kryptonite. I'm allergic.
Have you been stung though? I've been stung twice, I think. I think I might be making it into something that is, or I'm actually deathly allergic and it's my, you know. No, mine's gotten less as I've gotten older. But the thing for me is that you can't feel them when they land on you. And so the shock of the sting is just going to come out of nowhere as opposed to,
you know, if I'm like, if I'm in a fight with a bee and he gets better at me, then I'm not going to be, you know, I'm going to get stung. What if you had super tiny boxing gloves on and they did too and you're just like,
God, that's a great idea, Sean. You stupid fucking dick. You guys want to hear my ultimate kink? My ultimate fantasy? Uh-oh, here we go. It's I'm getting stung by a bee while I'm sitting on a big sponge going through turbulence. With clowns. With a clown pilot. With a clown for a pilot. How are we looking? Pretty good. Okay.
All right, Sean, start your fucking questions. I got some. We're 40 minutes into this thing. You haven't answered a question yet. You're the worst interviewer ever. You've got nothing. I've been trying to start. No, I want to talk about, but I like this stuff more interesting because everybody knows who you are. Everybody knows your work. So, and I want to talk about that, but I want to talk about your tattoos first because. Oh.
You have a lot of them, and I want to know. I did not know this. We've got a little freak on our hands, huh? I like a lot of tattoos in all kinds of places. She's all tatted up. I got tats everywhere. I was just saying yesterday, I was just saying, nothing says don't hire me like a neck tattoo. Yeah.
Well, she doesn't have them on the neck. I have one on the back of my neck. That's okay. It's the face forward. It's the face tattoos and the neck tattoos. It's like, and I'm sure there are people like, like the comments like, neck tattoo saved my life. I don't care. But...
- I have a tattoo saved my life. - But on your right forearm it says, I love this, this is Stephen Sondheim lyric. - I know that Jason's gonna make fun of this. - Okay, but I love it because I love this song. - Does it say I'm just a storyteller? - No, but it's not that. - You're safe.
You want to say what it is? You want to say it? I want to say it because I love it. It's from Sunday in the Park with George, right? Five, six, seven, eight. Anything you do, let it come. Anything you do, let it come from you, then it will be new.
Yeah. See, Jason hates it. I love it. Can I punch it up a little bit? Is it too late? Well, he's dead, so he might have an opinion. No, it's not temporary. It's on the box. Can I add to it? I could add to it, but there was actually a line that I took out of it because I thought it was too pompous. What's that? What was it? Which was give them more to see as if I could do something like that.
So how would the quote have been? It would have been, anything you do, let it come from you. Then it will be new. Give them more to see. This is a musical about George Seurat, the painter. Mandy Patinkin played, Bernadette Peters did. And it's basically her singing to him
It's from a song called Move On. You know, get out of your sort of... That is a beautiful quote. Get out of your artistic rut. That's nice. If you want to sort of take it away a little bit so it doesn't seem too pompous, you could just put comma JK. Okay.
You know what I mean? Could you imagine? All right, let's get into Sarah Paulson and how you started. And I want to know, like... Sarah, I'm so sorry about your decision today to be with us. Florida, right? We're in Florida. Florida, Tampa, Florida. You were born? And how old were you when you moved to Maine? I was born in Tampa, Florida.
We moved to Maine when I was in the, how old were you in the second grade? - Seven. - Seven. - Seven, yeah. - So I moved there in second grade. But we moved to New York first. It was New York when I was five. - And then Maine and then back to New York? - And then Maine and then I went back to Florida, then back to New York where I moved a lot of places. My mom was a young mom. - This is fascinating. Your mom worked at Sardi's on Broadway, which is right next to the Hayes Theater. - That was her first job when she moved to New York. - That's crazy. - Wow. - I was working at Sardi's. - I mean, was she an actress as well? - No, a writer.
Oh, wow. And she was a young mom?
21. She had me at 21 and my sister at 23. So, you know, we can kind of forgive the Trish Hawkins situation because she doesn't know what to do. And daddy, if you don't mind me asking. Dad, also a young dad. No, in the picture, still in Florida. Really? You know? Were they ever married? They were married. They were married very briefly. Divorced by the time I was two and my sister was 10 months old. Still could have been your fault though. Sorry. Yeah, definitely. If you were colicky or something like that.
Yeah, he was like, God, this colicky baby. I always wanted to sing these Annie songs. Uh-huh. Wait, so Sarah, so telling me about that story about your mom singing? Telling me about the story. Telling me about the story. Telling me about the story. Telling me about the story. Uh-uh.
About your mom seeing a psychic at some point and telling what? And saying what? I knew you were going to say that. No, your mom when you were a kid. My mom went to a psychic when she was, when I guess I was young. And she said something like, you know, your daughter's going to live a really long,
non-traditional life. - Yeah. - And she's not gonna do things sort of by the book. - And did she tell you that's what the psychic said? - She told me that, but after I was older and fell in love with a woman, and then she was like, "Well, I had the psychic tell me that this was gonna happen." Because to her, that was sort of living a non-traditional life, which, you know, it is. - Not the acting part. - Not anymore. - Not the acting part. Yeah, exactly.
And so, but you knew at such a young age because you went to the FAME school. FAME. Wait, didn't Aniston, didn't Aniston went there, didn't she? Aniston went there, yeah, she did. Were you guys in the same class? No. No, she graduated a little bit before I did. Oh, shit. Oh, snap. We will cut that out. We will cut that out. Are you kidding? Cut it out. We're going to fucking loop it and we're going to send it to Jen immediately. It's just, these are just the facts. This is not, you know, it's not a, I mean, nobody looks better than Jennifer Aniston. That's a fact. That's a fact.
- That's the fact. - That's the fact. - So, you know. - So wait, Sarah, so your, but your sister's a casting director, you're an actress, brothers and sisters? - I have another sister, my dad remarried. I have a half sister named Rachel. We don't know what she does. - Okay, but why-- - She actually teaches acting classes that she, I mean, I'm literally-- - Is this true?
We can cut the whole episode. Okay, Sarah. Wait, wait, wait. I mean, everybody's involved. Everybody... Come on, everyone gets it. So I moved to LA. There we go. And then my sister... So here's the truth. And everybody has this in a family, I think, to some degree. I mean, I don't know what your stories are. And frankly, I don't care, but I... Don't get me started. My family's normal. But I'm just saying, I...
I wanted to be an actress from the time I feel like when I was in utero. Like, it feels like I came out of the womb wanting to do this. Yeah. My siblings, I think, had more, I think, less of a clear idea about what that particular passion was and are probably better at a lot of things, whereas I have one thing that I can do, you know, whereas my sister's great at math and all this other shit that I can't do. Right, right. But, I mean, I don't think it's that strange, is it? Or maybe it is. Like, are all of your siblings, like,
None. I have three other brothers and a sister. But did they all know what they wanted to be, whatever it was they wanted to do? Well, my sister kind of had a... Yeah, my sister did a little bit. She knew she wanted to be a cop. She was. Are you kidding? Your sister's a cop? Yeah, she was a cop. And she is a cop. Well, she was. She's not anymore. She'll kick your ass. She'll kick your ass, yeah. By the way, Sean's sister yesterday, I want to say this to Tracy. Tracy lives in Wisconsin. Tracy, listen up. A beautiful red... Beautiful red golf shirt. Wisconsin Badgers golf shirt. Yeah.
-Yeah. -Which was very generous and very-- And with a beautiful note that was so nice and-- She's a very nice person, Sean. I don't know why she deserves what you're saying behind the scenes always. Clearly, you got her wrong. You have her wrong. Tracy is a wonderful person. Anyway, I wanted to-- You should give her another shot, Sean.
So, and by the way, Sarah, do you play golf? If you play golf, I'll say, my sister sent you a shirt. I don't, I don't play golf. Okay, great, moving on. I still want the shirt. Is that bad? Yeah, no, that's okay. I still want it. I sleep in it. Okay, great. And now, a word from our sponsor. And now, back to the show. So wait, I want to know about, um...
about Holland, the love of your life. Well, it's wedged just north of Belgium, just south of Denmark, considered part of the Benelux countries. I want to know the fun story because
I know a little bit of it, but you were at a dinner party and you hoped she wouldn't be sat next to you or something. Yeah, you know, I went to this dinner party that a friend of mine hosted where it was really kind of for Buck Henry who was there. Wow. Yeah, it was a wild night. And I was at this dinner. It was a long, long table and there was one empty seat and Holland Taylor comes sort of
you know, bustling in and her hair just like throwing her hair back and just, oh God, sorry I'm late. Which, you know, late people, when they're really that late, it does end up making it sort of all about them when they arrive, you know? So she was really doing a like kind of grand, oh, I'm so sorry I'm late at all. And I looked up and I thought, that is really a very beautiful person. And I found her to be intimidating sometimes.
She's really smart and has a kind of formidable presence. She, yeah. And she's incredibly talented. And I just, I was young at the time, guys. I was 35, 36. Wow.
And she sat down next to me and I thought, oh, God. And then, you know, we just chatted a little while and then really never saw each other again except for on the back lot where I was doing Studio 60 at Warner Brothers and she was shooting Two and a Half Men. And she rolled her window down and said, hey, Blondie, do you need a ride? Oh, boy. That's what she said to me. I don't know that. Right. And I was like, oh, no.
I'm okay. I can walk to stage 19 myself. And we never saw each other again. And then we ended up doing a little PSA for Martha Plimpton's abortion thing.
This is not going well, guys. This is not going well. By the way, I know this is the story about how you and Holland got together. Yeah. For me, it's the details of it are the fucking meat. They're really the meat of it. Because the Buck Henry dinner and the Martha Plimpton abortion. This is like the fucking Olympics for me. This is incredible. Jeez.
She has an organization called A is For, which is an abortion, reproductive rights organization. And she asked us to do this PSA. So Holland and I happened to arrive on the same day. Holland was getting ready to come to New York to do her production of Anne, which she wrote that was going to be done at Lincoln Center about Governor Ann Richards. Oh, that was the prequel to Annie. Is it not? Yeah. Well, it was probably Annie, like when Annie, like.
He's finally a grown up. She grows up. Grows up to be Governor of Exodus. It was a really hard knock life before that. Yeah, exactly. Hard knock life. Yeah, and we saw each other there and then we followed each other on Twitter and I literally DM'd her when I was shooting in New Orleans. Yeah, I slid into Holland Taylor's DMs. Wow. Wow, look at that. And then I sent a picture of her to a friend of mine and I was like, can I date her?
a 70 year old woman. Right. And my friend was like, absolutely not. And I'm just kidding. She was like, yes, you can. She was like, fuck no. Are you insane? And I was like, I think I'm going to do it. I fucking do it. Why not? And so I did it. And you guys have now been together for how long? Almost 10 years. Over nine years. That's so awesome. That's amazing. That's so cool. Did you say 19 years? No, nine years. I'm 66. Okay. I don't know. I'm not paying attention. And she's 110. She's 110. She is.
- I love being around you guys too. You can just tell how like comfy you guys are with each other. - Yeah, very easy. - That it's one plus one making three. It's just that you're both individuals, but you got the overlap. - Yeah, we don't live together. That's the sort of secret. - You know, Sean's married to a man. - I do know that. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. - Sure is. - They don't sleep together either. - Holland and I, we spend plenty of time together, but we don't live in the same house.
Now, talk to me a little bit about that. Are you serious? Tell me about that a little bit. And again, okay, this is, I'm divulging too much, but I said to Alessandra recently, who also, you'd like her tattoos. She has a lot of great tattoos. On her neck, right?
-No, no, no. -On her arm. She does have one on the back of her neck. And I said to her recently, we started talking about the idea of separate beds. -Jeez. -Yeah. And somebody wrote this-- Not in the same room. Somebody wrote this thing, she sent it to-- She sent me this article 'cause I kind of joked about it. Because sleep is so important. We're big sleepers. We're 915-in-bedders. And so-- Yeah, yeah. And that's why I am 65.
And that's why I look so incredible. That's why I look so confused. And I'm taking the words out of your, I feel like I'm cutting you off. No, you're about to say something nice. No, she didn't say how great you look. Okay, okay. But sleep and hookers. Keeps you young. No, but we start talking about this idea. And so then we made a joke, and we're not going to do it, but this joke about like living separately, living in another house, there is a certain wisdom to it on some levels, right? Yeah.
I mean, we've been together for a long time now. And I think part of it has to do with we're together when we want to be and we're not when we don't. But instead of just challenging it, instead of living in separate dwellings, what about just living together but then sleeping in separate rooms? No, because my favorite thing to do, we fall asleep holding hands, Holland and I. We sleep holding hands. We're very, I like to sleep near her. I don't want to be around her the rest of the day.
Just kidding. Sure. It's the daylight hours. You know what I mean? It's the daylight hours where I'm like, you can go. But no, I mean, I think we both, you know, Holland before me had not been in a ton of long-term relationships, whereas Holland is my sort of third, you know, more than five-year relationship. So I tend to do that and have more experience doing that. Holland has it. And so
her life and to get to be her age and sort of not having really cohabitated with someone for a long time, I think it was a lot to sort of all of a sudden have me and all my meanness
in her space. But if you live separate days, you've got something to talk about, right? Where in Canada are you from? If you live separate days. Separate days. I think that, you know, like I spend a bunch of time away as you guys do as well when you're working and it's kind of, it's nice to be able to fill your partner in on that which they have not experienced with you. It gives you something to fucking
talk about. I thought you were going to go somewhere else with that, but yeah. Honestly, it's one of my favorite things is to come home after a long time and fill my partner in. I was going to make the same joke, and I just want you to know that that was the joke I was going to make. I knew you were. And I appreciate you, Will, and I appreciate that I'm not the only one with the mind. Of course not. The size of a tiny pea. Now, Sean, I will recommend to you something that Amanda and I do, is that we do share the same...
We do share the same bed, but we have two different duvets. Therefore, when she rolls over or I roll over, there's not a duvet drag that wakes up the other person. That's what I'm getting at. That's great. But Jay, my thing is snoring. Do you snore or Scotty snores? He could bring down a building. Right. And I...
Well, you know, do what Amanda does. You just slide your hand underneath the shoulder just a little bit, create a little bit of a wedge, and they roll over. You get that guy on his stomach, and he's not going to snore. What about earplugs? Nobody gets a guy on his stomach like JB. Hey, guys. Hey, you know what? No, but then he's got the thing.
You know what? The snoring is a real thing. Does Scotty have a CPAP machine? No, he's going to get the newest, the greatest latest. He's going to try it. But he also has what we call the pot of life on his arm because of diabetes. What's that? So what, that means he can't roll over? Well, then he's like, it's on his shoulder. So then he's like... Hey, do they not have lemon laws in California? What's going on? You still got the receipt on that guy, right? Fuck, man. Jesus Christ.
That's not really funny. That's not funny. Anything else on the list, Sean? Anything else about my career? Well, let me check it with Will. Will, can I move on to the career or no? Hey, wait. Sarah's not done alienating more people in her personal life.
You've got a minute, 20 seconds left to ask a fucking question. I got, wait. No, we're just getting started, Sarah. I'm here all day, right? I've got a ration of food here. We bought a double booking. If this interview's over, I'm FaceTiming you because this cannot end.
Wait, I want to know, like, I was going to go through all your stage stuff, like you did the Glass Menagerie opposite Jessica Lange. You were in a show with Jessica Lange. That's so amazing. And did Ryan Murphy see that and that's how he cast you in American Horror Story or did he see you in something else? Yeah, what's going on with you and Ryan? What kind of stuff do you have on him and will we ever see him?
I got nothing on Ryan. Ryan's an open book, man. Everything I got on Ryan, you know about Ryan, you know? You know I've never met him. I'd like to meet him. You've never met him? No, never. I don't think I have either. I met him maybe decades ago. You're keeping him all to yourself. Why don't you share him with us for Christ's sake? I share him, but I love him. He's, you know, he's been very, very good to me. Like the first person in my working life I felt who really...
saw me you know like he continued to say I'm not I don't know why I always use sports analogies when I don't watch any sports but he continually threw me the ball just always and thought I could do things I didn't even know I could do and so for me he's just an absolute hero in my life both as a friend and a professional and so you really felt seen I really felt seen well yeah
Yeah. Did you feel... But then like Nicole Wallace in Game Change. Yeah. Fucking phenomenal. Absolutely incredible in that. Wait, Nicole Wallace? I played Nicole Wallace before Nicole Wallace was the MSNBC lady. Yeah, she's my hero. Yeah, I played her in Game Change where... You gotta see Sarah play her. She's an unbelievable performance. Incredible. What is it? It was when Julianne Moore played Sarah Palin. This was that HBO thing where Ed Harris played McCain and Julianne Moore played...
You literally played Nicole Wallace. I did. No way. Did you ever meet her? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. No way. I'm such a big fan of hers. I watch her every single day. It was a very, very traumatic thing that happened. I mean, you should watch them. You should watch. Sean's right. You should watch. It's amazing. What's it called? Game Change. Okay.
- She was really traumatized by the whole thing, the Sarah Palin thing. It was really-- - Yeah, I'll bet. - Yeah. So much so that she didn't vote for her own candidate. She didn't vote for John. She couldn't vote because of it. - Wow. - It was really wild. - And then when you played Marsha Clark, phenomenal in the OJ Simpson's thing,
You know, actually, I've got a couple of notes on that one. You got a couple of notes? You got a couple of notes on that? Yeah. Are you guys locked on that? Because if so, I won't give you the notes. Okay. You should probably not because it's already here. No, you are... I don't... I think I can safely say you've never sucked. Ever. Yeah. Never been bad. Yeah. I got a couple of things in my closet that I think you'd be like...
This wasn't the... Probably on three-quarter-inch tape, right? Yes. Not even in the days of... VHS, VHS. Yeah. Fucking guys, can I just get a little bit of credit? You got to go? No, I didn't jump in when I was teed up with Suckton in the closet, and I didn't say a fucking word. Yeah, you didn't do it. I didn't either, so I bought it. I didn't say a fucking... I just sat here like a good fucking student. It's a cheap gay joke, you know? But you refrained. No, I didn't say anything. Sorry, I read that after the OJ thing...
Marsha Clark, you couldn't watch yourself anymore. Is that true and why? Yeah. What? Yeah, I can't watch myself now. Well, I actually decided to... I think for me, the Marsha Clark thing was the first time I had done anything where I felt so much connectivity to Marsha the person and so much...
It just was the first time there felt like a real creepy actress-y kind of melding of like, almost like a visitation where you've been sort of embodied by a person you don't know. I mean, how it happened. I'm waiting for your joke, Will, about being embodied by... You don't got one? He's writing it. Just be patient. He'll get there. He'll get there. That's okay. It's just an opportunity missed. It's not a big deal. But...
But it was the most connected I ever felt to anything I'd ever done professionally. And I thought if I watch this and also it was in conjunction with the most celebrated I had ever been about my work. And so I think I thought if I watch this and everybody thinks it's great and I hate it, I'm going to sort of ruin my experience that I'm having that has never happened to me before of feeling really...
Yeah, I understand that. You know what I mean? Like I just thought I'm going to go in there with my hypercritical way and tear this apart. And that would be a shame because this is the first time I feel like anyone is giving a shit about my work or what I'm doing. And so I thought I should try to enjoy it. And then I just kept it. You should check it out. It's pretty fantastic. All of it. And you should also remember that nobody is going to be more critical about your work than Tricia. Yeah.
Trish Hawkins. I'm surprised I haven't gotten an email from her. Like, if everything that's ever come out, I'm just shocked. So is that still your policy is to not watch your work? Yes, except for when I have been EPing things, I do watch it, but I try to watch it in a kind of...
Right. A way where, you know, because I'm giving notes and doing other things. Well, you're depriving yourself of incredible performances, but that's just me. That's really nice, Jason. I have one last thing and then we're all going to let you go. So, Nicole Wallace, Marcia Clark, and then Linda Tripp. Crazy transformation. Incredible. Look, you completely disappeared as Linda Tripp. That was... And so, are you... I'm watching your career from outside going, oh, she's so phenomenal at...
at playing as a character actress, is that your go-to comfort zone? - I feel like the vanity component of this industry, particularly for women, but for all of us, like I feel so hyper-focused on this shit, the face and the body and the hair and the weight and the thing and the wrinkles and all this shit, that I definitely feel a kind of freedom when I can hide behind
these other things, whether it's Marsha's wig or Linda's, the prosthetics to play Linda. And I can hide. It's a way of hiding that I think ultimately- She died. She did die. She died right before we started. No way. Yeah. Wow. Wait, Sarah, before we go, before we go, I just want to know, because you're a creature of the theater like I am, super fast.
Funny, tragic theater story. Anything happen either in this play or another one? Funny or tragic theater story? I mean, I don't know if there's a more tragic story than getting notes from an actress who played a play 30 years ago. Okay, fine. That's your story. There you go. Like something going wrong. Well, two things happened recently, which is, you know, in the play, which you guys saw, we can discuss this later. Sure, sure. In the first act of the play, I am having an argument with the black sheep of the family played by Michael Esper.
- The great Mike Lassper. - The great Mike Lassper, who I think you've worked with. - And the great Corey Stoll. - He's incredible, and he's the great Corey Stoll. And I leave the room in a big huff, and I'm very upset, and I've just blown up and screamed at everybody. And I leave the stage, I slam the door, and his line is, "What happened to her?" And someone from the balcony went, "You!" - No.
Oh, it's a balcony for you. Yeah. And then the other thing that happened that was kind of cool the other day, which is I'd never experienced that. And I don't know if you ever have either, Sean, but we had an actress get sick in act one and then the understudy went on for act two. That's never happened, but I've always wondered about that. It was like days of our lives or something where like someone was decapitated in season four and in season 10, they came out with it. Did you have to make an announcement or you just did it? Yeah. Uh,
Yeah, they make an announcement and everyone just clapped. And there's something very special about the theater where like people are willing to believe anything you do up there as long as you kind of commit to that world. And you like a good pilot, let them know what the fuck is going on. Not to bring it full circle for you guys, but I gotta say. - That is incredible. It's a relationship between you and the audience. It's a relationship. - It's a relationship. You gotta communicate. It's the key to everything, you guys. - Listen, lady, early congratulations on your Tony Award.
Yes, exactly. Incredible performance. We love you and thank you for even showing up today. Will, I just met you, but you're my favorite. Now you're my favorite. That's all the time we have. What an absolute, what a delight, Sarah. I've never been so delighted. Oh my God.
Thank you. And I really do want you to... Also, at the Tabasco Theater, Sean, you live on there. I think... Have I told you this? First of all, your poster is down in the room. Did you talk about this on the show at all? About the elephant? No. The elephant room? The elephant room under the Tabasco Theater. Did you talk about this? Am I boring? Everybody's already talked about it. You say it. But there is... I mean, it's really cool. They call it the elephant room because Houdini, right? Used to have this massive...
underneath the stage that could hold an elephant. Because he was going to do a big trick where he was going to disappear an elephant. Yes, where he raises the elephant from the thing. So they call it the elephant room. And so that's down there and there's a big poster of Sean down there. So you're calling me an elephant. Well, I'm just saying like there are a lot of posters that are not down there. There's two posters down there and yours is one of them. And also every night when I walk backstage to get to my entrance, there is a cork board on the right-hand side that the prop guys have up and it just says Oscar Levant on it.
I love that. So I sort of think about you every day when I'm there. I love that, honey. That's very sweet. Thank you. And I'm so glad you're there and I'm so glad we saw it and I can't wait to root you on. You were really great. I really appreciate it. You wrote me a lovely text. I didn't hear from you, Jason, but...
I'm confident I will. No, check your spam. No one's in there. I'm confident I will hear from you, Will, when you come backstage or when you don't. And then, yeah. I had a terrible joke and I didn't say it. I just had another terrible one. I saw your whole, I want it. Please give it. Get it out. Get it out. And it's fucking killing me. And I said that Houdini was going to do the, he was going to do the trick with the elephant. It was too long. So they asked him to,
Fuck you guys. Fuck you. Fuck you all. Look what you made me do. Look at you. You did this. I'm in shorts. Strangely, I have to go. I mean, I just have to go now. You gotta rest your voice. I gotta rest my voice. We love you. Sarah, love you. Thank you, guys. Bye, honey. Goodbye. Goodbye. That was great.
That'll start your week. Happy Monday, everybody. You have a great Sarah Paulson to give you a nice little jolt of love and energy. She is the best. Is she something else? She's funny. And by the way, and everything she's done, like you said, Jay, she doesn't, I know we say it a lot about a lot of people, but never- Never terrible.
Never terrible. She's one of those people who's always good no matter what she does. Yeah. No matter what she's in. She's also just like, just to be around is, as you can see, it just makes your day, makes your night. And you put her and Amanda Peete together, a couple of best friends there. Yeah. You know, you're just flying for a week. Are they old school best friends? Yeah. You watch them as like a ticket to a free show. They just like go, go, go, and it's fun and engaging and charming. Yeah, it's great.
Well, I know. I said it already to her, but I'm really excited about her and the award shows coming up for her in New York. I think she's going to kill it, and I'm so glad she was here. Oh. Are you waiting for a bye? No, no, no. I didn't know. Because you were just... Usually when you take the initiative, you've got a head full of steam going towards the bye, but not today. And then it was just an absolute peter out. Yeah. Just a fucking... Oh, is there an elephant one? No, no, no.
I was like, let's see. Let's see. Let's see. So we think the Tonys, Trish, and then that one. Let's see. Trish. Monaco. Lewinsky. Nothing about the elephant, right? Okay.
I know about movies versus theater. She's with Ryan Murphy. Well, she's on New York. She's in New York. She's also in Los Angeles often, so maybe she's bi-coastal. Oh, yeah. We've done it a few times. We've done bi-coastal quite a bit. We've done Biden. Have we done a Biden? Yeah, we've done a Biden. We did. You know, I know one. Okay, go ahead. Hey, Sean. Hey. So, what's up?
Hey, Sean. Hey. You know, the theater, the Tabasco Theater that she's in is actually... It's actually the Belasco. Yeah, the Belasco, sorry. The Belasco Theater she's actually in isn't one of those big theaters like where you... No? Yeah, you can see everything in close. You don't need to sit in the back with one of those opera, you know, things, those... You know, where they use the... To see real far in the theater, you can pull up... Oh, oh, uh... Like, um... Binoculars! Binoculars. Wow, Will's really low on the binoculars.
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