"Michael Keaton"
01:08:40 Share

Hey, guys, well, really, your hair is really grown, growing.

and that is very long. Going to go head and let you start again. We need to live in more enthusiasm.

We're I, I. Hey, welcome.

You know.

Listener every once in a while, uh, well and shine. And I have to have a an an adult conversation. We have to do a little bit of assume we would need to talk about scary legal things. And we just had one of those before this record and sean got a real headful of steam gone in his legal process and talking about you know how he looked through these documents and aba aba and um and in walks in order of uh presumed ly from an off camera a Scott that's two frosted strawberry y pop arts and a half a glass of milk right and and he keeps talking and all is legal thing he started to choking on his fuck and frosted pop art offering legal advice to me.

Well, when pretty says you just with a Better, if you want to, I and I go, you don't even know the fucking and document the turning party.

good. Jason just .

got back from vacation. How lovely.

very lovely and relaxed will looks. Will looks like his back on vacation for six months. He's got, he gets new lighting and in the whisper booth there and and he's got a nice time from his long island condo.

The light is great out here in the condo. I was able to, you know, via the kindness of others, get out in place and golf. So have been in in spent a lot of time with the kids out here. We've been out of the .

beach with other names.

The current, don't .

filled .

current. You don't even have a girl.

It's four boys. O.

K, caring what? You're coming off guard.

How's everybody doing? I was feel like Jason and I will never get to see .

you .

anymore shon .

I face time in last night were like we haven't seen whenever gets to talk to jin anymore and even sometimes we do talk you but we never get to meet .

the real j anywhere he goes out on um I was talking about you guys um on my break about the fact that you guys do talk all the time and we never talk.

You're working fifteen hours today but even one. I'm not hate you.

not just not why i'm not that kind of a friend that like talks everyday to tell you because you're .

always working and when you have done time you just wanted be by yourself.

which I get you guys are so good about do you have like I mean, I know well you've got like a nightly chat with with the great job shotton yeah and and probably with Shawn p. haze.

I talked to a lot of people pretty much on the reg.

I talked to shine not a little .

once a week, probably twice a week, maybe. yeah. I talked to clave you every day.

I talked to e like, and Jason, I I was to text you first .

before we talk. But do you and sweet p gals would be great, best friends, because you guys like spending a lot of time alone. And, you know, we've got a .

bunch of balls with pins.

You know, you send me a nice picture from your trip with that bucket, that swedish surgeon .

to kini bucket and I shows was .

good use collection pops that you play with and they .

talked the time.

And you're also still really good friends with your gum mies.

yeah. Oh my god. I talked to them. They have never speak to me, but I am speaking to them all the time. Yeah, can we please just a give? I think the kids usually say I shout out .

to a whatever .

of our, of our, of our podcast, bad dates. A new host, joel kim booster is horia .

can be guiding us .

through all the legendary and saying true bad day stories, amazing guest reveal with all of their gory details. You season one yeah.

sound so natural and you say like that yeah. But now this is our smart less media show called bad dates. IT was jj a mill and notes with joe camboose er and it's going to be just as great. And you know everybody has bad dates.

Everybody can late to them. And J B, by the way, my initials fact check he's onna walk you through .

IT yeah so you can find new episodes and where you get your pig because you, we all know the worst states. I make the best stories.

Oh, we should which that should be a line, that should be tag .

line on the show. I'm almost as excited about that as I am about my guess, my guess today. And you guys, you guys, you can be excited tude. First of man, this is not because this is one of those people that I have and I know want to embarrassing any kind of knows that I don't know, but I super look up to him, which is not the most articulate thing i've ever said but IT is just yet I have been such a fan of what this guy does for so long and there's an authenticity to who he is and how he does not that i've always just really responded to and Frankly so have um so have audiences around million you well .

I think like .

he's been nominated like like for like a hundred and twenty awards is one seven of them .

and and everything .

seventy five choice to got the awards to independent spirit awards and T V movie awards, s sator awards. Teen choice awards from critics awards, Green actually the time time m awards, golden global words and afterwards and academi dish awards and the old school academy work. He doesn't have seventy wins.

I mean, he's good. That guy, but Chris bill, but this guy, this guy, you don't remember him from his first television appearance, which was on mister Rogers neigh's od way back in the way in the day. You might remember him as coasters ting with David letter man on the mary Taylor more hour.

You're more likely to remember him from things like mr. Mom gang. He, he, he is my bad man, you guys. It's Michael.

Welcome to the show, Michael.

You got sungars. Why do sungars .

forget whole authentic thing? I think now .

you going to wait out.

yeah. Well, this is interesting. No, thanks. hi. How are you? You the preamble?

yes. It's a yes.

I know. no. First of all, I was going to be a smart as, but after will be so sweet.

Now I can. Yes, I would think that there there is one area, one format, one, one could be a smart. This, yeah, yeah.

welcome.

Where are we finding you? Where's that pretty.

pretty wall that looks like account some sort? This is, well, this is my home in montana, the cabin of property, because the other houses being rebuilt and down, not down. But see what? See smart.

I can help that you're gonna have to bear with me.

Yeah, you through mount there nounce headful. So yeah and this little house was we assembled from from of the valley you're down the valley of the valley many years ago, but that's right and that's i'm sitting nice. But listen to the whole thing, the ote how you guys do this have .

so many .

questions, the validate.

or do.

do. Why your .

questions, why .

anybody listen to you? idio.

No, we can figure IT out.

No IT. Yeah, yeah. You all have either adapted or you always had that. Uh, you all now have, like a radio voice. Did you always have this radio voice .

earning from well will make millions with those times.

times .

seriously, just you got kind of calm, do you do you 这样 一个 mind .

is annoying .

in .

chicago？ No beauty. OK air comes well and well. Just can you know, I did know i'm sorry about this true when I would hear see those reasons. funny.

I know didn't know there was there's a few people out there i'm looking at right now. I saw, I watch. He is commercial.

I saw that the other day. He's so and a realist. He's so funny and so good in IT and and I was your your reminder of how hard IT is to crack out.

They have people see you to find a spot, you know? Yes, no, seriously. Yeah, we should have a question for you.

Did you and I not many, many years ago yeah, you are on nodding, right? We're met a long time. Go because you working for a night?

Yes, he's about to .

give you. He's just all ching.

Smile you right to the night.

Well you .

that's right. That is a super car you used to work for american used to work for um like A A keerin company or something is first the very first I worked at the restaurant .

called red and then part of that was to um you know sometimes i'm doing a wedding so I do like to make an extra hundred box I would help out like, yes yeah and I was yeah .

and I met you at a party didn't I said, who's this funny .

guy so that that that was like over thirty years ago yeah and and an impression .

and also .

but I kept making you over over and Michael, we can cut this if if you like so don't worry and I kept making you over and over because used to take .

you bowen in a minute. Yeah, I really great.

Yeah and I used to be friends, really born. And I was always run into ad party yeah.

And also we both know Julie boat, you could .

say that are.

you.

looking.

mi.

Was that I think IT was at who played goose in the in the original.

what is the and the words .

IT was at Anthony Edward's house and he .

was having a wedding for somebody I don't.

two.

Years member SHE .

was around and turns out he was hang and she's no but you but I must I will say every .

single time I ran into whether I was when I was around Julie or not, one of the nicest guys, always, always, always, yeah always and super funny and allowed me to be funny in front of you.

You're very gentle people.

my god. Don't know. Our mutually friend is quoting from years ago in front of us. And James was just on vacation with we're talking about and I remember saying the court I used to be this like ten years ago, I go. With my king, like I used to flip out because that I was such a family years for so long.

Yes.

and and and so I want, I want to get into, and that's getting my first language is two two things, two movies that to me were like, and they're not underrating because they were there were big hits, but first, well, mr. Mom, to me was a general changer, right? Nobody done a movie like that, and you did.

IT was such ease. And what the great part was, IT wasn't putting down a state home parent. In fact, I was pumping IT up .

hundred percent and IT was.

So to me, that was what was so interesting about IT. You don't mean like especially that those are different days back then, but you did IT in this way that kind of took that on and flipped IT on its head. What was IT like getting that, reading that script, getting that off, deciding whether to do IT shooting at all of IT. I've always loved that movie, man.

So i'm really glad your brothers up first well, and i'm let's get this other week because I can hate this place programs, giant and all through you guys. But but here's why that's a really good question. I'm glad you asked that because you know how sometimes when i'm doing, I do a lot of them, i'm doing an interviewer being interviewed or something like I would actually volunteered, mr.

Mom, for for a bunch reason to A I was ahead of its time. yes. And and how IT came to be and IT was, john uses first, yeah, there was the first script, soul.

wow. And john, yeah. John is. And I was sitting in, he even then have to picture, you know, you guys all will know this when you really scraped in.

Comedy scraped. And they don't. The good dbs don't come around very often.

no. And you laugh out love by yourself. Let say two, three, four times. Describe you go this that's you and .

that's exactly .

two two or three, four times yeah because amazing .

because that is amazing. And the average lament, let's say, would know that. But that's that's how work.

So I remember I member, actually one thing he did in IT was an area that I generally don't for fine. Funny was the baby had had a, had that, and my head went back. I was my hamby g so far at the wall, and that my head.

But because that was how how was presented, how was set up, and where IT came in the strip, you where he got me, you where you were that point, I went bomb right there. That thing kills me right now. So I saw, and I said he listened to him.

He was not without an ego and and I liked them, but I said, you should direct this thing, you know how to make this more a chicago and is a guy, you know. And so what I knew about IT was a was funny. And I also liked kind of the time I I the reason I thought I couldn't do IT was i'd looked like I was about ten years old.

And then I thought, and then we had to write that in because I thought, OK, let's say, marry Young. And how do we really believe this? Because as you are, you are three.

No, if you you know, if can be as outraged, you know, as funny like jim Carry or the crazy as guys are, they set up their own reality, right? So what? 2， you say, you know, you buy the premise, you buy the job.

So if you said you go, yeah, that's crazy, what is doing? But it's actually not crazy in his world, in right in world. Yeah so I said, how do we believe this guy? How do we? Because that's the only these things going to work.

And there was a lot of rewriting on the set, I will say, between me and my then manager partner, Harry colombian, and and in some other people, was a great cat. And and so what I done about IT was a was funny. I'd like playing a father because I like being a father.

I liked what I was about. And IT was ahead of its time in that at the time, the U. S. Economy was not very good. And I was hard, you know, the the unemployment was not great in, in, in the idea of a woman going out to the workforce crazes. The sounds in when I was shot.

And eighty seven, eighty three, eighty three was not like that unusual but I was fuck unusual to to but by comparison, right and i'd like know have three sisters and mom m have most people who work from their women. I didn't plan at that way. It's just did.

So i'd like that whole set up in the premise, and I thought, okay, how do we make? Now let just make this funny. S so he was already funny, but there are things because the director who is talented a guy, but he was not a comedy guy, we had to work on, let's say, and there was a lot of rewriting going on. And as an example of the whole change thing came about on the morning because as we're get ready to do IT, there was there was no chain that there was no that didn't exist that he, Martin, the great, great lake, great Martin.

yeah.

comes in, says, you know, he's taken Terry off. I have so much to say about this .

because not enough .

credit is given the .

Terry guard was going. But but so, so that team was one thing, right? But what I knew was I said, but how does this going to feel? You know, how can you secure? I went seure.

Is he right now? And how I massu late is, is he right now? And what Martin walks in, just bucking cockshy, you know, just beautiful, played like looking so brilliant, really arrogant looking at me and and i'm thinking, okay, what would this guy do? What I his panic, he's not ready for the right? He get me like, I don't know, like he's pretending he's working on the house.

He like tools or something because he shows me changed. I go, yes, down yes, those gargles and I yeah that goes and get the goals and then and then and then we just played IT from there. You know, obviously insecure, obviously overcompensating and and he and and then the two twenty two, twenty nine was Martins .

IT was another line.

What was the line again? Say, yeah, everyone. Rei, the pregnant ware, the whole thing and mark, and that was the end of the 对 and Martin said， you know, you should say, Martin says something like how you gona wear IT and I go so you should say, you know, two, twenty two, twenty one, whatever takes that that's .

that's much .

more line, I keep telling people, was that was not me.

And by the way, you know, the movie did before that night shift. I watched over and over and over and over. My god, I love that movie and the one line that stuck out of my head, of course, is when you like, we could just feed the tuna the man, you don't have to get get to open. And as a kid, I was like this, such a genius s idea. My god, the ta now .

just listening to Michael .

talk IT .

IT strikes me that i'll bet you Michael kim is an enormous influence on your on your style I mean, you you actually you .

remind me one another yea to me oh yea, I know .

yeah and I meant .

IT when I said a huge influence I and I wanted get into, because then there were so many other films, too, that I thought deserved a lot of attention. One of them being cleaned in sober, which I think is a phenomenal film, not just because I could relate to what what he went through, but I just think it's a great with the great emmet wash. I mean, there's just some amazing mm fill, but I do want to type by tree.

Girl, for once I can because I also loved Terry gar. And yeah, what was that like? I am what? What an unbelievable talent.

And I right man. And he looked at all the really great, funny women. There are so many now, and, and, and there were kind of people speaking. So few .

didn't great part.

And I look at that man. He had everything, still has everything. He is so sweet I just love and .

I think dern day yeah and .

you looking so she's .

really and funny and seminar and masculine and all all that stuff and just could know just had IT know he has IT and yeah and helped me you know like you guys know you know can do that your own you .

know you need .

body for sure .

we'll be right back.

And now back to the show.

But Michael, your ability to to a to to find material or material find you and and cast and directors that find you and you find like your career is just like, I don't no one embarrassed you but you know like willie said, but uh your ability to to to jump from comedy to drama so seamlessly for so long your run, your relevancy is just it's it's been going for so long and continuing on this great escalating pitch that I I hope you are proud of as you deserve to be because you're just an incredible actor that knows how to make people laugh when you're playing apart and make people cry like you're not a comic you're not a you know like the so I just I can you talk a little bit about um how I won't ask you to explain how you see yourself but how do you what attracts you to certain stuff what's your what's your goal you .

know yeah well, I will speak Better but I I can't want to stop because that's just too good. I leave that thank you very well.

Just can't label you you know and that that takes a lot .

of yeah okay well that's let's start with that. So first well let's um thank good fortune and all that. I don't believe in luck. I never but I believe in good fortune.

I do I say to dude, I literally same really because .

it's true yeah true.

I say fortunate.

I'm not lucky. A lot of us, we all earned IT. We is off.

There's a lot of talented people out there that know you luck place a huge part of IT. Because if if everybody who was talented got the jobs, there wouldn't be any left. I mean, place a big part.

We're appreciate him with that. Yeah, but i'm grateful. Tel, yeah, so so there's the only plan.

And by the way, i'm breathing verified air right now. I realized that there are how many other guys. So I saw jeff ll, the bridges who was over the long range here.

not the one to actually like that.

Yeah, he, you know, I was saying, you know, there not many of us doing this, and I am, I want to keep doing that, but I want to keep doing that. I always want to do with how I want to do IT. I know that sounds arrogant, kind of selfish, but I I just know what.

Be happy as that way. And so every time I had a television show, that guy cancelled, which was two of them, three of them. I guess I couldn't tell you how happy I was because I fear to move on the next thing.

So if I had a strategy, and I don't know that was a strategy, IT was only this at right after night shift, there were some things offered to me. And when I think back a wow, 那 这个 fairly sizable set up ball， I said, no, I knew I won't do the mr. mom.

And then there are a couple others that I thought, I don't know. My, like all three of you am sure I would think you say, but I really have pretty big imagination and i've um I am curious, but a lot of things i'd like to play, other things i'd like to things i'd like to see. And if that doesn't work, then I know at least I have this for a few years.

I can maybe ground up five, six, eight years of room being that guy and I saw. But I think what will happen is people are going to get very bored very quickly with this kind of guy they saw in night shift at Sarah. And so I said, well, then let me lay down something early and see if that works, because that will potentially open up a wider range for me.

And I don't know if this you could do, but that was the only conscious thing. The other, the other is you just trust you. good.

And so I made certain decisions are only on, I was told, don't do something sober. I don't do pacificists don't do a lot of things. And I I said, yeah, but I want to do those things and I want to let you down.

So I passed up certain movies that turned to be great movies, and I want talk about them, but, but they would turn to be great things. And I probably, in retrospect, one or to those probably should up. But I was fearful that, look, I always feel like in this is my own, but I need to talk somebody about this.

I always feel man of them. In two moving year, people going to go enough already. We are so fragile circuit, you you know, we just like enough.

And and so I had that and that that's not a healthy thing. But I just wanted lay down of as the potential possibility that will we do meter now I don't know what to do with them. And the risk is, as you guys know what I could, that could be dangerous. And I just roll the dice because I always bet on .

me don't why but you also you have this great combination between leading man and character actor that's that's what I for me just as as as a consumer of you of a fan um you you never you never really took the the junk food, the celebrity stuff. You always were just playing an actor. You are either a character actor or a leading man.

And turn this great ratio between both and comedy and drama and then and then for my money, like this incredible, you know, validation and birdman. But you know, at a moment with where a filmmaker and an an actor come together um sort of in this incredible little recipe between the two that you wouldn't Normally put together. And then like I know there's there's been a few combinations like that, that was just so excited to that combination. And then of course, the film itself and the concept of the film as well, just everything coming together and just a rocket ship and IT was so exciting for me to see ah just that the story in the community and then also the film .

itself well but also also Michael, like you know, as Jason said, you can defy genre in that you couldn't be putting anything. You've got to be a movie star on your own, on your own terms. You've got to kind of know in a time where there there really aren't really movie stars in that way anymore.

I mean, there are, but it's it's different. But you you're in like the height of the movie star era and yet you were able to kind of think about and that you were talking about like doing stuff you wanted to do in one thousand eighty eight, you did beetle juice and clean and sober yeah. Now you want to talk about two movies on different ends of the okay. And then the next year you did the first film and we're going to get into batman in a second because it's it's the one thing that I feel a real .

kinship but but you are part of a lot of first like like wills kind of think, like, mr. Mom, nobody was doing a comedy like that. You were the first one to do a comedy can like that and then beetle juice and then batman, you were the first to do a lot of things. Is that something you look for? Like.

and I was going to say, so you do that in that one year. You do build you and clean and solar. What was that year like for you?

Any agent? Must you? Major agent? Look, fantastic tic that you .

know exactly IT. Meanwhile, that's right. And at the time, that's not what happened as you guys know what didn't happen that way to tim sort me out because we had he he saw me, he said that i'd like to start to that and and so yeah that you know, when I also credit a Elvis mitchill whom and maxi ga.

Speak with later and Elvis ended up working for for me in my partner ery for a couple years because we we read this guy, we thought he was we just dog what he was about and and like him. And he worked for us for a minute. And and I credit Elvis.

I don't think there was, I don't know what they work was was either new york. I know what IT was near your film critics or film critic. There was something they didn't have an event and what kind of said, excuse me, what will just said basically and then they said, okay, sure, we will give you to him. And then there is summer a piece of paper or something.

But that income, the that came from tim asking about me about wanted to meet me about beer juice through David given and the cleaned everything came and that was another thing that people said, you want to do that that's not my agent literally at the time said, I don't think you should do that and I said, yeah, bridge should just because I want to. This is a really well written script. You guys know this.

I mean, it's hard to read defines something that the writing will drive everything ultimately right now, whether it's comes together, that's another story. But so so i've run through the same sorry of and so that in one year, I didn't plan any that that just happened. I just said, man is got to burn.

I should. He is something I just I don't know what he is. I just know for sure he's something. And I when I tried to explain the juice to me, I said, they said, bridget thing I said, I don't know what that is.

I don't know what I I have not understand that I I like that guy and he said he wants talk to you. You just come on. I go. Yeah, alright, go me again and I go talk to him and I, I, I said, yeah, helps. Still the same.

I still don't understand he, I say this about him to love I I would say in his life, he is not a declare of sentence, you know, with the subject of verb, you know, and an period at the end of, i'd say he's completely, maybe maybe eight declare of simple senses. He just doesn't think like that. He's not, he's not that guy.

And so I ve made a money. Go OK. I'm getting closer.

Then he said two things to me, and I went, alright, I think this guys worth IT. So I said, give me, give me minute. And I went home and I started thinking about IT. He said a couple of things that I ask for war group from every period of time to go to my house. I was running this house the times empty, I know furniture in, and I just started to hand picking stuff.

And then I, there's something about that I found kind of spoke in creepy about like that teeth and some, my broken nose and a walk, and said, what? And then I just started going to work. And I said, you know what? There's something about this guy I really did.

I know, I don't know. Does this work. And so that happened. And then clean just .

another script that was a Michael, the character of people just first half the movie. You like, like old timmy prison garb, right? okay. And you've got this bucket and you'd like, you ve got like mascara on the cover to have your face, yeah, your hair is thinking up and you know, and you've got his voice and go, yeah, there you want to talk about taking a big fuck and swing.

I mean, how do you go? How do you show up day one? Or they like, okay, guys, this reheard, we're going to black this in my that's like, what does fucking is go with this I mean, it's a lot and fucked in your .

drilled did in a way that .

did for ten before the first no, I didn't. And that that was the beauty of and that is the beauty of working with him. You really just making stuff like, let's go make stuff, you know.

And so so we talked and no one who was paying attention that the budget was small and no one was paying attention. And I and we've done on all studios and and I said, OK, I don't know here's what's wear, but I think of this, we never tested IT. We never, we never tested IT I said, I said, it's like I said, here's one wonder.

It's like he he's stuck his finger in a thing. He starts here and he goes up from mary. It's never like there's no art, right?

Goes from ten to .

fifteen and and and I said, and I don't know why I don't have an actors explanation for any new ship like the great thing, but this thing is you can you never can say my character would do that.

right?

The rules, there are no rules. There are no rules. The freedom is unbelieved.

So will yeah that that's unsafely because I go. Tim had the suit. Tim had the eyes. Tim had the pill makeup and he said something about he's from all different. He he appears all of time and no, you know, in the twenty years in the and there's no he's not connected anytime or then he might go under ground for years until his released.

So I said and and I said, how about mold? Let's do some mold up the face, you know and then and then I said, okay, you know, the hair is like IT has to did stick all the way out in with the strike suit with tim's of vision. He start showing pictures of all his stuff and so on.

That day when I showed up, I went, I don't know, here we go. And soon though, I first saying, you can see him, his eyes get picking and lights up and he goes, yes. And then, you know, is the ultimate yes.

And because, so, oh, I didn't we going to that? Hold on that. If you can do that, let me show you something.

See when you go there. This is what that kind here explained to me, what was going to happen. And I went, oh, I I think .

I get IT because of the visual .

effects yeah .

because the visual is so yeah ah that you're out on a fucking ledge and you don't know where you're fucking going. That to me is don't that's my fuck and dream no, it's so hard to tell .

to you guys but because there's almost three people who know .

kind of know what. I'm wardrobe is just people have being raw and like i'm being on mike and walk in with unked and two box and .

glow yeah how many people over the years to come up .

to you told you they clean and so had a profound effect on their life.

Lots and boys, that means me, you know? So I say, there's what people i'm so blessed that I get to do some things that everyones somewhile that will happen. You, how many people have that job? But you know, a lot of people would like that job.

I have them that job. That's why I did worth, yes, that's why I did. You know, my life, my life and you go you to do these things that you got, the harder you have been given us. You be given this thing, you know, yeah, I understand I can also given IT so so if you can do through everybody a salad, I can do IT you when going .

makes some money. So you speaking of which speaking to make money, you go in the ninety nine ah you once again um team up with ton burton and you do balin yeah and that is the fuck in game changer yeah that's the game changer of ginger and A I mean in a lot of ways you doing that a lot. Me to make some money.

So how.

you.

You did the first.

the first I am by way, I give you my my dress dress demo .

IT just to them more. Yes, I just got .

at a high .

school when when that came out, when that man came out and I was like, wait, the guy from night shift that I i've signed million times and mister mom, he's back me in like and I did. Hang, wait for IT and then you saw, I even saw the trailer was like, oh my god, I can't he told me.

name red in the poster for member poster, just the semble of the bad man and and I was like, what was like, what tough fuck is this .

so I about some credit to tim yeah for going, yeah that guy and people want about your mind no, that guy so I don't think enough because when giving him me, I went, we are, we are the meaning I sad. He said he takes his home and read, tell me, you think and I remember where I was sitting, where the window was, I was talk and and I said, well, so he was the right thing, but nobody is going to do that and he went that exactly right.

And so he had to go to them and saying, no, that guy and his credit, boy, you know, you know, he changed everything. He changed everything. I guess how might .

be marvel exists all of IT because of that?

Yes, a lot, a lot of money. Jack Shawn .

has noted over a thousand times to marvel movies .

because of that movie.

Thousand nine.

There's that yeah is that yeah you can put a Price on that.

You can. yes.

But I did IT launched the, you know, in ever since then, we've been we've all been fucking on under the tyranny of IP. But you know we but IT, yeah, but you did. You did start with 了 我的 and IT was， I stole that from somebody.

But but right but it's true. But but but you guys started you in ten britton. But you is the face, tim is incredible, obvious. Like you said.

well, you kind of invented the whole, we will just said, like the whole thing, like the tone in the field and the look and .

that there there was humor to IT, but I was also serious and there was action and IT was dark yeah because.

you know, well, there was very little humor. And you maybe .

had moments though.

no, I mean, in the original script, in the original score? yes. And so so you know, maybe it's just an instant, but but there were seen because even that, man, that pressure is on, tim.

So big pressure was on all of us. And you felt at every day, you know, studios, people flying, you know, because this was a big swing ferry, but there wasn't. And I don't know that the instant cannot know a good feeling saying, but we know a lot of this kind of darkness.

I mean, maybe, maybe, maybe not so much. So show is an example that seeing where the big, long table where va welcomes over, and I have a date, i'm so nervous. You know, I go, do I tell you I until I can't learn? No, but I really like this woman and SHE sit there and he asked me about the room and I said, tim, you know, would be funny, never couple of these moments. I said, you know, if he goes, yeah, yeah and I realized, I don't think I ve been in this room before, which says everything about the character I know you go, yeah who's this lonely guy? He rambling around the house, you know, yeah ah it's great.

Sort of like, hello of him ah.

yeah I love, I love that kind that kind of awareness of IT in and that not taking himself too seriously really in that moment there's a way that that could come as as as a dick and IT wasn't you got to know IT all fell within the context of a guy who is really .

parents urged and .

but you the one wasn't like when that movie came out, I was, as you said, IT was a big swing for everybody, big swing for you and your career, big swing for ton burden, big swing for the studio. They put a lot of money into the books have been written this movie and how that made, it's there. And when that movie comes comes out and it's a fucking and smash hit. How many how many high fights did you have to manage your hand from the high fives?

Or or was that the opposite IT was IT? This is gonna a level of exposure and responsibility now that, that could change things and IT might .

not be comfortable more than they.

Have and say, think people .

I have just son.

Now i've got ta talk to my R. Good news, good news.

good news for you. Now, did you guys know? Did you guys know about the chemistry would work like Jason bring is, you know, if everyone I needs to do what he just did, did you guys go go .

in the good fortune guys, i'm going to say, of being friends for twenty years. So we have, we knew .

don't .

touch IT.

It's like the guys on tbs argues someone .

touched.

we'll be right back.

And now back .

to the show um but did you you must have was IT just was .

IT not what Jason .

I you think .

about the deal you are woke up next morning.

got a tattoo, a batman tattoo.

And you .

how you will want what true, you know, I actually did investigate getting for one time. Yes, I, yes, he did. And I and I remember thinking i'm too lazy. So the amount, work and effort to put into this.

and yes, that's much .

careful what really drive really work you i'm blessed that I don't need a stuff because I am just lucky that I need a lot stuff. Yeah, yeah. And not so cool. I didn't know an interest.

I love you thinking through the practicality of vi, yeah, I know I got.

you can feel like.

what do you do? Good or nice at the least?

Interesting most unfun guy. Oh, I don't know .

if this is practical. Put back sea.

Yeah, I and you must have been elated and I must have felt like a good, vindicated. And look, you'd had a lot of success before, but this was like a different, this was a different thing.

I I let myself enjoy you.

let you know you .

and and also what Jason called the down. And let's just no a little bit of that. I was a lot. I don't love this.

you know yeah and sometimes knowing you, knowing who you are now, in all your success, with all of the unbelievable your resumes, just one of the most impressive ever really is just incredible.

I always you don't think about, well, that guy probably had he had an audition like like I just see was a movie star but when you when you're Younger, you had an audition and start out you know just like out all the rest of us and it's hard to imagine you walking into a room. What made you? Didn't you grow up? And where did .

you grow up?

Got to L, A. made. You want to.

Do we go? You have ten .

minute.

For this one.

for this one .

answer OK right? Yeah, just a couple times.

What I, what I was, I was a kid.

I started get IT very interested. I thought a person do this. And yes, because I come from so on that background, except my funny family, my funny brothers and sisters and a big family and Youngest.

So there's that right? So when I went to school I was I was curious because my friends and I were my the guys I hung with tightly and Young women um were funny and and i'd like to be around them and I knew what my taste was in and so I I was not a feder kid. However, I did take theater classes so I was clearly curious about this and I was very good.

I don't think in addition from play, I got a little room and play in school, didn't really do anything for me, and then I dropped at a school to make some money to go back to school. And in the interview, I was doing this play in pitch burg sticks and bones, and at the same time working at the P. B.

S. Station where I do everything in everything, and at the same time I was, well as in school, I was really into the lampoon, and I was really into everything funny. And I was just, and so I started writing, and I thought, I don't know if I can can even do the other of thing, if I would try that, maybe I could write this.

Just a kid trying to figure, figure things out, right? yeah. So I said, I liking this. I just, this is, this is you can happen or not happen.

So I started to go to york, where I was about to move in the last minute, and I went to california. I only stay there for slummer. And I was writing, and I start performing, stand up and doing a play.

And the stand up thing worked in new york like like that after bad. I mean, when I say work to didn't work, IT worked in that. I got to ask back the first time I showed up, and that's a big deal.

So you did that and I went. I really love this because I was steer to get to the auditioning part. So now going to go to california, and i'm going to do with that. And i'm sleep on floors like everybody else, crash with bodies and working in restaurants and doing all thing, parking cars, doing everything everybody does, the thing that turns around and turns the audition process was, I was an OK auditioner. But what, and I tell when Young people ask me, I tell them this all the time, forget, I want, I want, I need, forget.

throw that out. Your fact.

you have the job. The job is for the next fifteen minutes. Your work addition is job. That's the gig, right? So you ve got to go to work today for teen minutes.

You know it's creating it's a horrible set up for no, it's nothing good about IT, but that was the once I said i'm not going to look at this like I gotto get this I turned the corner. I said, you know what men? I felt very good today about what I did.

So i'm just, onna, look at like a three thirty at the empty m two years. Where are ready? Yeah, yeah, i'm going to, i'm going to work.

And so, yes, my twenty minutes. And then I went my regular job and I said, I don't know. That freed me up.

totally freed up. Of course he did. And I like the idea of also telling that the Young, active people, they asked me for advice all, all the time.

And I always say, you know, fuck off. So now I have something that I can say. I came up with.

get that camera. I M. I.

you fuck. Who gave you? My parents know your parents. Shut up. fuck. Yes, no, but but that is a created I think the other thing is if kind of fall the same line of like once you realize once you get older and you've done a bit more and in doing what we do, you start and you get to the other side, you have a chance to direct jb and produced stuff in whatever you realize when they that they are looking to solve a problem, right, that they want somebody to come in. They want, what you don't know is .

the Young are side on your side.

They want you to pick up this job because they got .

another character to cast.

Yeah, yeah. I figured that out. I was like, and I remember casting something with max and being like, and people coming in and going like, fucker, I hope this study good, man. And I used to think that they're like a show. Me, no, we're like .

fucking .

I I cor, so you know you know what that feels like, right? Yeah you you want something. There's no married .

in watching somebody I feel .

terrible thing I want .

to talk about because you made me think of another subject. No, i'm just getting. No, is that a? Is that? And you about M, C, M, you did.

I wasn't killing in my intro. You were on that two different iterations of the very one called mary and the other called mary. Really mary. Tell them .

more with .

dave leman .

bailed after the first.

I stuck around so and they were in the fucking and cast together.

Know that in one thousand nine.

seventy aides michabo.

Jimmy.

Jimmy ji, 对， Jason, you know, one of my favourite jobs ever, I was really like gary gold. Bert.

yeah, yeah, yeah.

I was really like good guy and and his wife and dana courtney actually .

was just singing his praises two days ago at at the same time. And SHE was .

singing yours ah yes. Well he gained. I talk you about the same thing thing bit.

One of my favorite things ever did was this character I did on a tony rano had to show from minute a couple shows. I get many shows, but but he had think of turning around shown. And gary golden g.

Hired me because he had seen me do something. I think he gave me the job, but my conditioned, but where night school IT was called a eds night school, I think in tony metal type law at a night school. And I played this kind of, dude, you and you know, like kind of a little dance, which is always fun and hard to play, have no problem at the sweets.

Anyway, so I played this thing and and on a side I learned as much about comedy from watching turning Randall, because he would kind of direct, because he knew more than anybody anyway. And he his precision was so and I was about, like, I thought, no man, you know, free whiling. His precision was so impressive.

They remember going to a, wow, pay attention to that. You know where you? Where in the how? And I was just really an education. So yeah, when I was, when I was still that and I apparently .

forgotten .

the question. But bail after the first, we all thought I was gonna a little something. And SHE was wonderful lady, really like her.

And and and the guys who were part that group, who was jay parsis and tom, know those guys, they were part that. So we went well, their categories are really good. And IT wasn't quite what we thought I would be, and they've failed.

And I stuck around for the second iteration, which was so I could. I remember driving to work on the M. T.

M. studios. Second, there is no way this could get Better.

There's no way yeah Better. And member, no. And IT wasn't much killing me. Any little apartment is relatively cleaned yeah, my god and you man, so you just .

something that sweet part of that you guys know too like you get that that first gig where you go like i'm fucked in doing this.

I'm doing and i'm .

paid and i'm doing this.

And I remember with the first year, and Grace is twenty seven years old, I was like, i'll get fire next week. Sure .

matter, Michael.

I want to go back to .

the beetle juice too.

Yeah.

so incredible. Yes, when you got a amazing, when you got the, when you ve said yes to doing that, what you like the first day in the makeup really like why I put this, I got put, I say yes, I put the weekend. I got to put the fuck and dirt on my face. I put the black circles, or you like, know, this is awesome.

IT was, knows the second that was like, this is awesome. Because you have to understand this is, this is a long time in the making.

but not right yeah because everybody I knew for years, or like why they do A O I.

because you can recreate what we made. You can write IT the matter, trying to write IT when a lot of the writing just happened, you know, IT was not on the page so much, even though some of IT wasn't. Something was terrific and the world was terrific.

You do that again. You then work like that, even in the most well written. You know, you can take a very golf, a meal time, or any of the brilliant writers, and try to duplicate, try to plica you never, when you couldn't do again.

So imagine trying to do that. So obviously, that we were never going to do that. Tim, I worked so well together, and I like him so much that everyone's, I would go.

What do you think the answer was that? And then IT started getting more interesting to me, and I suggest that i'd like to do that again. Then that time passed, and then I thought that was done.

So when I came around again, we would would see scripts now. And then, you know, they just didn't work and then these guys cannot get that. And we, wow, this could be good. So tim start talking me about that. He had to finished him.

And so to answer you a question, when you then you say, I am in, I done a bunch, I direct this movie, and I act in another movie and another one, and I was a little tired, thought two months, just a chill, and didn't let's go do IT. So we went to go make IT. And as i'm sitting in that makeup trailer that you mentioned, I remember gone, this is really fun and i'm really excited.

I'm nervous because I go, can you can you pull this off again and can you do IT because don't do IT if you don't look stupid and not just for me this thing, right? And so would hit me was I was sitting the makeup trial go on yeah here we go that's right and trying to explain the the woman now the head, it's got not quite talking through that and then we were get there and getting ready to do IT. And about three days and I went, there's something wrong. I don't know what's wrong. That wasn't .

horrible. I .

so funny.

He's so funny.

But wait .

this and .

is fun and have fun. What is about me? I looked in mere and I went, I got, I know what that is, and I don't.

I know about you guys, but I want to make up anymore. I should go check more off in the monday. I know i've made you just by not.

I don't. I don't look at things anymore. Just go, do IT I go home? I looked at me and I went.

I got, I know what that is, this thing we created came out of nowhere IT just IT just came out of this nowhere. When I looked in the mayor, I saw toys. I went, this is fuck up. I saw I know me as a little beer, juice, toys like IT look like a like yeah key chains and like mugs and the commercial .

part and wasn't a bad .

IT was the perception is yeah we've seen because we've seen in on t shirt.

we think I go. So did you change the look at all?

No, that's interesting. I did know a little bit there was some of the hair that wasn't work, and I went. Now that that never really looked exact like that, then you try to like, then you go get that whatever takes to get that idea brain, just go back to what made you even .

think of this faiza tive bason based on an impression. Remember seeing that with with writing on who would go always you describe. And they go, and they have your character do something in a way, oh, they want me to do IT based up because they saw me do this another times.

But they don't realize that another times my character detect is that was organic to what was happening. Now they just want to see the trick. They don't want to see .

what LED up to the trip.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Mean.

do IT as well.

How you fix mi, how? How .

do you make a? Yeah, no, no. We want to go and said, go, what was the thing originally? Was the thing originally? Just go. Be that .

yours again?

yeah. Make good yours ago. Make good. Like, how did we come up with this crazy thing? And what was heard about that was there were certain things in this look, man, i'm on record saying how good this thing is.

I'm not going to go around. It's so good. But when I go on said, there are things in the script shows you more.

I am that I member in the script go this, this, this could work. I go, dad and tim, like, think that I just got three of them. I was wrong on all three I was wrong about. I was dead wrong when I saw .

he's just a remarkable file maker. I mean, to think he's never done anything easy, not once. no. And yes.

I is degree difficulty.

He takes on and just drill IT every single time yeah.

except for Carol nail clip feet. Do you do you think do what so you guys .

do so you do this .

and you end like you gone on the record thing is going to be great. I mean that there's a lot of pressure, right? Yeah you have this thing, this iconic thing, guys. correct? And you're like, i'm sure when you're reading IT or you're doing IT, you're think like fucking man, if we don't drill this, we are we got a target on our fucking back people who could have come for .

us yeah honestly.

what is team sports, right? You don't really take do you take IT on you know individually know right? I mean, don't you sort of do you get that sense when you're working on something that we're all kind of rolling in the same direction and and that it's not really .

on you because if you're healthy.

yeah, yeah, yeah. You find yourself in in that position as often as you want to mentally.

Good, good question. Yeah, mostly I think I think I think there's part of me and alas, i'm not being human. There's part is just plain stupid.

I think there's import goes. I don't know. I don't think of some of these things. Other people think and I don't know what that comes from, but I just don't sometimes I do and I certainly was nervous about going back and only to say, can I do this not just do IT and get through IT, but go can you can you get there because it's deserving of you yeah being good you know you you need to be be good.

And in terms of what me talking about, I tell you when I say I don't care when anybody else thinks of IT, i'm willing to say what I think about IT because this is just how I feel about IT. There's a movies i've seen, a new guys i've seen that people have hated. And I went, not me.

I love this movie or I or other movies years ago. I don't get what people are reading about me. I don't care.

Every person I ever run to do for the rest of my life could say, boy, that second beauty is really like that. Go not to me. Yes, I mean, yes, I mean, that has so many elements is so beautiful first physically and it's you kind of care. And i'm telling you, every flux and person is funny in this and just and is funny Catherine is funny than SHE was in the first.

And just for the just for the unit is is a biotech.

Yes, yes. Thank you. yeah. thank.

You character .

is ross lens.

D man, well, like we say, we've taken up too much of your time.

but I could talk to, well, yeah.

I know really and we just what a throw to have you mean on the show? You're just I just love that location said that you're still doing IT, that you're still rising. You're still doing incredible stuff. You keep surprising us.

And in mind, I add, that you look fucked in fanta. Look, six teen .

thirty years know crazy. I hope i'm not .

crazy .

ever. And you've done at all I .

mean, the show every day .

what I did this yeah no, not really. She's usually just want that's .

a fucking and good question, by the way, that's a good question. We turn on you pretty quick.

I like to rej and I was that mean i'm not probably that .

we turn on each .

other doesn't think much for us to turn on each other yeah.

immediately we'd put your rightness.

Do you'd get IT as hard as video? Yeah but what a thrilled man was so great to talk excited.

thanks. Come on. Back out of my time and coming out with us.

right? Thank you, honey.

Thank you. Thank good to see you .

to everybody say. You've been stealing Michael kitten shit for years.

I know I want to embarrassing as well because, you know, got to know, just to say hello. The last five, six years of something, we'd see each other stuff. And I always talked to jb cold's Christ's party.

you're going na get invite this year again.

mention his name to me.

But but and I was talking to about stuff ff, and I was tell how any big hockey is big penguins fan. So we talk hockey and and then later I was really kind of me, something really nice about me on on cobell about my eyes and which was a fucking and three love life anyway. So we yeah and and I I just love the way does IT and it's the only impression i've ever done and I don't want to and he doesn't this is of him and but the impression of him from gung ho. They're going the japan's, they about the they ought the car plant.

That's really good .

people see.

you see, it's .

really good. close.

Yeah um yeah, I just been such a fan. He is. And like you, I mean, jay, you point me out. I mean he just seamlessly between comedy and drama and absurd ism and just everything I.

me and my .

life worth my life no.

I think I probably .

had its a fucking it's so great and sad and oh my god so good anyway.

Well, just that he's he's reached such a an enormous height of of success and relevance yet he can still go to the market ah yeah and he can still get a finances like it's really .

hard to could yeah .

I I could go to the market for sure because he's not a celebrity, is just a really, really well respected, very famous actor that you can do anything and people go to see yeah and I .

like what you suggest about the you can't really nail him down like you can't or maybe you said, well that you you you can't yeah you can't live them yeah I love that is so true that movie .

my life is about a guy who's gona die and make any sons going to be born is with the coking and thing any he leaves videos for his son because he's not going to meet him out. You want to and how to live IT like what to do and how to do something.

You looking to get rid of any tears. I guess he just .

got that up. I would wish I could hung you guys right now.

Some.

hey, on that ranch that he was looking on. Do you think there are a lot of animals around there? animals?

cricket?

Wait, no, like this, like cows, like .

bigger.

My my smart.

Smart last, smart less is one hundred percent organic and artisan, handcrafted by benet barbecue, Michael grant Terry in, rob ARM, jeff smart less.