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He's the most terrifying serial killer you've never heard of. Haddon Clark has confessed to several murders, but investigators say he could have over 100 victims. At the center of the mayhem, a cellmate of Haddon's that was able to get key evidence into Haddon's murder spree across America...
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Warning. The following podcast is not suitable for all audiences. We go into great detail with every case that we cover and do our best to bring viewers even deeper into the stories by utilizing disturbing audio and sound effects. Trigger warnings from the stories we cover may include violence, rape, murder, and offenses against children. This podcast is not for everyone. You have been warned. Back in the 1970s, young men started going missing around the greater Chicago area.
33 young men to be exact. And I don't even know if calling them young men is the right word, because some of them were boys, no older than 14, and they had their entire lives ahead of them. Some of these boys went missing while looking for a job in the city. Others were last seen near the Greyhound bus station or walking along the roads outside of Chicago.
and all of them were manipulated and murdered by a man named John Wayne Gacy. But their killer wasn't a mysterious man that laid low and operated in the shadows. John Gacy was well known not only by his community, but within Chicago politics as well. He was successful, charming, respected. He even hosted neighborhood barbecues and dressed up as Pogo the Clown,
where he would go to children's hospitals and make the kids smile. And everyone knew he was a little strange, but no one could have ever suspected that within the crawlspace of his small Chicago home were the bodies of dozens of young men in all different stages of decomposition. And it wouldn't be long until the entire world knew the name of the man responsible. This is the story of John Wayne Gacy, the Killer Clown.
And this episode is about his life and everything that led up to the horrible crimes he committed over 50 years ago. I'm Courtney Browen. And I'm Colin Browen. And you're listening to Murder in America. ♪♪
the 1970s was a very popular decade in terms of true crime it's the decade of the watergate scandal and the jonestown massacre it's the decade in which a number of serial killers murdered their victims including the golden state killer jeffrey dahmer ted bundy btk son of sam you name it the 1970s was riddled with crime it was a time where everyone hitchhiked getting into cars with random strangers
where people trusted a little too easily and drug use was at an all-time high. And that was especially true for the people of Chicago in 1972.
It was a few days past New Year's, on January 3rd, and the Greyhound bus station was full of young people returning home from their New Year's celebrations. There were also a lot of teens who hung out outside of the station with nowhere to go. You see, at the time, the drug use in Chicago was at its worst, and it wasn't uncommon for teenagers to run away and go on benders.
and many of these teens would find themselves at the Greyhound bus station, getting a ticket to wherever they could find a job or shelter. It was also a place where people would go if they had been rejected by their families.
In the 1970s, being a part of the LGBTQ community wasn't as accepted as it is today. And many times when young men would come out to their families, they would get kicked out of the house with nowhere to go. So many of them came to the bus stations hoping to create a new life somewhere else. And because of this, it was the perfect hunting ground for a 28-year-old Chicago man named John Wayne Gacy.
Gacy was married with two children at the time, but women weren't really his preference. He was very attracted to young and vulnerable underage boys, typically ones that were slim and had light hair. And on this particular night, January 3, 1972, John drove around the station, keeping his eyes peeled for the perfect victim. And it wouldn't be long until he spotted him. It was a 15-year-old boy named Timothy McCoy who was on his way home from a Christmas vacation.
It was about 1am at this point and Tim had a 12 hour layover until his next bus ride. So he decided to step outside for some fresh air. And it wasn't long after when a friendly looking man in a black vehicle pulled up beside him and rolled down his window. Hey, you need a ride? The man asks. Timothy tells him that he actually has to stay the night at the station because he has a bus to catch the following day.
But the man in the car assures him that he can come stay at his place for the night and that he would bring him back to the station the following morning. Timothy thinks about it for a second and ultimately decides to take him up on the offer.
After all, this guy seemed nice, and he was offering him a place to sleep for the night, which was better than having to sleep at the station during Chicago's cold winters. So Tim loaded his stuff into the back of the car and hopped in the passenger seat, having no idea that he was about to become the first victim of one of America's most notorious serial killers.
Once Tim got into the car, John Wayne Gacy was excited. After all, his wife and kids were gone and he had the entire place to himself, so no one would ever have to know about what went on between him and this 16-year-old boy. Along the car ride, Gacy asks him a number of questions. What's your name? How old are you? Where are you from? And he learns that his name is Timothy McCoy and that he's 16 years old from Glenwood, Iowa.
But after a few minutes of small talk, the questions become more intense. Like, "How often do you have sex?" or "Have you ever been with a man before?" Gacy never knew if the boys he picked up were gay or not. But this is how he would introduce the idea. He would ask them questions about their sexuality, and if they seemed comfortable, he would push a little further.
And even if they didn't seem comfortable with his inappropriate questions, that didn't stop him from asking them. But once the two get back to Gacy's house, he makes them some drinks and after a few moments he brings up the sex questions again.
Now, it's unclear whether or not Tim wanted to, but after a few drinks, the two would end up performing oral sex on one another. It's likely that John made the boy feel obligated to perform oral sex. He may have even told them that it could be payment for letting him stay there that night. But regardless, this boy was a minor, and there's no such thing as consent when it comes down to a grown man and a teenage boy.
He was taken advantage of that night and John Gacy specifically picked him out of the crowd because he was young and vulnerable. But after this sexual encounter, the two went to bed and like we mentioned, Gacy told him that he would take him back to the bus station the following morning. But that is not what ended up happening.
You see, the next morning, as a thank you to Gacy, Tim woke up and decided to make him some breakfast. It was the least he could do since he let him stay there that night. So he's in the kitchen making breakfast and once he's finished, he walks over to Gacy's room to let him know it was ready. Gacy would later say that he woke up that morning to the sound of Tim coming into his room.
But almost immediately after he opened his eyes, he saw Tim, the boy he invited over to his house, standing in the doorway with a butcher knife. He said that his immediate thought was that Tim wanted to kill him. So he went into attack mode. Gacy sprung from his bed and he grabbed for the knife that Tim was holding. The two then fought for the supposed weapon. Meanwhile, Tim probably had no idea what was happening.
and Gacy never gave him the chance to explain himself. The two wrestled for the knife for what seemed like forever, and Gacy is a big guy, so it wasn't hard for him to get the knife in his hands. And once he had it, he turned it around and stabbed Tim four to five times in the chest. Gacy looks down at his hands that are now covered in blood, and the reality of the situation is settling in.
He had just murdered his first victim. And the feeling he got from that murder was the best feeling he had ever felt. For the next six years, John Wayne Gacy would chase that feeling, murdering boys across Chicago and hiding them in the crawl space under his home. Timothy McCoy would be the first boy thrown like garbage into that dark, wet, cramped space. But he surely wouldn't be the last.
But before we get into Gacy's other murder victims, let's talk about who John Wayne is and what led up to this first murder.
John Wayne Gacy was born on St. Patrick's Day, March 17, 1942, at the Chicago Edgewater Hospital to parents John and Marion Gacy. Marion mostly worked as a stay-at-home mom for her three children. Two years before John was born, they had their firstborn daughter named Joanne Gacy, and two years after John was born, they would have another daughter named Karen.
So, John Wayne Gacy was a middle child and the only boy of the siblings. Gacy's father, John Gacy Sr., worked as an auto repair mechanic. He was also a World War I veteran and a symbol of masculinity. You see, he didn't believe in mixing feminine and masculine roles within the household. Men were supposed to bring home the money, provide for the family, and be the disciplinarians, while the women were supposed to take care of the children, clean up the house, and always have a nice hot dinner prepared when he got home.
And if Marion ever went against these rules, John Gacy Sr. would give her the beating of her lifetime. He was an angry man, and much of his anger was fueled by alcohol. But for Marion, one of the first memorable angry outbursts from her husband took place on a summer night in 1944. At the time, John Wayne Gacy was just two years old, and his mother had just come home from the hospital after giving birth to his younger sister,
And for whatever reason, John Gacy Sr. was angry as they all sat down to have dinner that night. The children began to eat their food and after a few moments of silence, John Gacy Sr. grabs his plate of food and throws it into his wife's face across the table. Food goes flying across the room and broken shards of glass cover the kitchen floor.
And for a moment, everyone's sort of in shock, trying to figure out what just happened. John Gacy Sr. then stands up, walks over to Marion, and begins hitting her in the face over and over again. Marion is defenseless against her abusive husband, and all she can do is sit there and take it. But after a few blows, she can feel that her nose is broken, and there's blood pouring out of it.
At this point, all of the children are screaming and Marian knows that she needs to run out of the house and get some help. So she stumbles out of the front door of their home with her husband right behind her. Luckily, a neighbor would see Marian fall to the ground and they yell out, "Don't hit her again, I'm calling the police!" John Gacy Sr. walks back into the house and when he comes back outside, he's holding a gun.
Then he just leaves, walking out into the darkness. Marion quickly runs back inside to see the kitchen in a mess and her children in hysterics. They had just watched as their father broke their mother's nose at the dinner table. Law enforcement eventually comes to the house and they advise Marion to take the kids and leave.
Marion didn't have any money, so a neighbor ended up giving her $2 for a cab, and she and the kids left to go stay with her brother for a few days, until John Gacy Sr. cooled down.
Marion wanted to leave her husband after this incident. She even visited the domestic relations court to see what her options were, but they weren't looking good. Her husband would have to pay child support, and she would have to go get a job, and Marion wasn't ready for that. She was a stay-at-home mother with barely any work experience, and she had three children, one who was just weeks old. Marion wouldn't have the means to support them on her own. So, like many women in her time, she decided to go back to her husband.
But just like any good housewife, Marion quickly got to work cleaning.
She picked up the broken glass on the floor, cleared the table, did the dishes, and then she prepared her husband's favorite meal, boiled meat and potatoes. When John Gacy Sr. got home from work that day, he sat down at the table, ate every last bit of his food, and then got up and went to his man cave without saying a single word to his wife and kids.
There was no apology, no let's work on our marriage, nothing. They just went on with life as if it never happened. And unfortunately, this wouldn't be the only encounter that the Gacy family had with violence at the hand of John Gacy Sr.,
Like we mentioned, John Gacy Sr. had a lot of toxic masculinity, and when he and Marion found out they were pregnant with a boy, he was excited to raise a son, his only son, and he set his expectations pretty high. He wanted John Wayne Gacy to grow up and play sports or learn to work on cars, just like he did when he was younger.
They even decided to name him after the manliest guy in Hollywood at the time, John Wayne. But it wouldn't be long until the Gacy's discovered that their son was not the masculine man that they wanted him to be. Even as a child, John Wayne Gacy was a sickly boy who was a little on the chubbier side, and his father never missed an opportunity to tell him that he was a disappointment. One of Gacy's first memories was when he was about four years old.
His dad was outside working on a car and he wanted John to watch so that maybe one day he could grow up and be a mechanic too. Now, John Gacy Sr. was a very particular man who had to have things go his way. And while he's out there working on the car, he has all of his tools perfectly aligned in the way he wanted them.
And while he's under the vehicle, he yells out to four-year-old Gacy, Hand me the water pump. John quickly does what he's told, but again, he's four. So when picking up the part, he accidentally rearranged the tools. Upon seeing this, John Gacy Sr. grabs him by the arm and angrily walks inside of their home. And there, on the wall hanging from a nail, was the razor's drop.
John and his sisters knew very well of this razor's drop and were often at the end of it whenever their father was angry. Even over the smallest of things, John and his sisters would get a beating. And that is exactly what was about to happen to John for rearranging his dad's tools. John Gacy Sr. rips it off the wall and beats his four-year-old son for his mistake.
This was one of John Wayne Gacy's first memories, and he would spend the rest of his life trying to gain his father's approval, but he would always fall short.
When John Gacy Sr. wasn't beating his wife and kids, he spent most of his time in the basement drinking. And this basement was like his man cave. Under no circumstances were his wife and kids allowed to go in there. And they couldn't even if they wanted to. It was all locked up, and he was the only person with the key. And no one really knew what John Gacy Sr. would do in the basement, but his kids would later recall hearing him talking in different voices while down there. And anytime he would leave the basement, he always came out drunk.
John Wayne Gacy would later say it almost seemed like his father lived down there, barely ever coming out to spend time with his family. And this will come into play later on when John Wayne Gacy reaches adulthood. Because, as you'll see, he had a little man cave of his own. Except he would use his to sexually assault and murder young boys. And as we walk you through the life of John Wayne Gacy, you'll see that his father's parenting had a big impact on the person he would later become.
John Gacy Sr. was a big disciplinarian, and he had very strict rules for their home. For one, when Marion would make dinner, no one was allowed to call for John Gacy Sr. to let him know it was time to eat. Each person had to wait, no matter how hungry they were, until he was ready to come upstairs for the meal. Only then could they eat.
And it seemed like he was always in a bad mood, ready to blow up on everyone at the snap of a finger. The family felt like they were always walking on eggshells every time they tried to strike up a conversation with him. And under no circumstances could you ever correct John Sr. on any mistake. If he said the sky was green, the sky was green. No ifs, ands, or buts.
But as John Wayne Gacy got older, he learned how to deal with his father. But that didn't mean he wasn't still afraid of him. He did everything in his power to get his dad's approval. But he learned pretty quickly that he was never going to be the person his father wanted him to be.
John Wayne Gacy had always been a little overweight, and he was born with heart problems, so he was never able to play sports. And because of this, his father always reminded him that he was nothing more than a sissy. But John Wayne was determined to prove his dad wrong. He might not have been able to play sports, but his father loved fishing. And so John tried to get into fishing, hoping that maybe they could bond over that.
John Wayne was around 11 years old when his father took him on his first fishing trip, and he was excited about it at first. But when they took the boat out that first day, it was clear that John Gacy Sr. was not in a good mood. For one, the weather was bad and the rain was scaring away all of the fish.
So John Sr. pulled out some liquor and began to drink. And the more he drank, the more angry he became. As the alcohol ran through his veins, he began to believe his son was to blame for the bad weather. And he starts yelling at him as if he had the power to change it.
And it was here where Gacy realized he would never win with his dad. Even if the weather was nice, his dad would have blamed him for something that went wrong. And these feelings of inadequacies would follow him throughout his life. And according to Tim Cahill in his book Buried Dreams, John Wayne Gacy would later say, "So I was a disappointment to my dad because I was weak and he was strong."
He hated the weak person, even in emotions. We'd go to funerals for someone in the family and he'd never get tears in his eyes. At a party, he'd never laugh. A strong, somber individual, emotion was a weakness. Physical illness, even when it couldn't be helped, was a weakness. As you can imagine, John Sr. was also very homophobic. Gacy's mom once acknowledged that her husband told her if he ever found out their son was gay, he would have killed him.
John Sr. was already disgusted by the fact that his son wasn't as masculine as he would have liked. Instead of running around and playing sports with other boys his age, John Wayne preferred to help his mom out in the garden. Then afterwards, his father would always call him a sissy. And the name calling got even worse when John was 7 years old. It was 1949, and one day John and Marion were getting ready to go somewhere.
And Marian couldn't find any of her underwear. She looked all over, even asking the kids where they were, but no one knew. And it wasn't until she looked under the front porch when she finally found them. You see, there was this sandbox under there that John Sr. had specifically built for his son, so they knew that John Wayne was the culprit. When confronted, John Wayne was mortified, and he told his parents that the only reason he took them was because he liked the feel of the fabric.
And as you can imagine, John Gacy Sr. was furious. What was his son doing with women's clothing? And it wouldn't be long until he comes around the corner with his razor's drop, ready to give his son a beating. He also forced John to put on the underwear in front of everyone, which was humiliating. John Sr. figured that in doing this and beating him, it would teach him what he should like and what he shouldn't like.
But that's not really how it works. And this wouldn't be the first time John Wayne would get caught with his mother's underwear. The next time they found him was when he was about 13 years old. His little sister Karen was making John's bed when she found them under the covers. And again, John Sr. was furious, calling his son all of the homophobic names you can think of.
Now, something else that is pretty relevant from John's childhood were the multiple instances of molestation. The first one happened when he was just 5 years old. On that day, he and his mother went over to a family friend's house. And while he was there, their 15-year-old daughter brought John up into her bedroom. She then pulled his pants down and began touching him.
And both her mother and Marian actually walked into the bedroom while it was happening. And John watched as the girl's mom walked over and slapped her across the face.
The second time John was molested was, again, by a female neighbor. This girl was Norwegian, and according to John, she was intellectually disabled. In this instance, the girl took John out to the prairie, where the grass was tall and no one could see them. And it was there where she began touching him. Now, John would later go home and tell his mom, and he said that afterwards there was some commotion in the house, long old man yelling and angry about something.
In another instance, John was about 7 years old when he and two of his neighbors, a boy and a girl, all got naked together. Then afterwards, he and the boy started touching the girl, and he got a big beating for that one. And I want to take a second to note that all of these things that are happening in John's childhood most likely had a part in the person he would later become.
And we aren't saying that you should feel badly for John Wayne Gacy in any way because what he would go on to do is horrific, but it's clear that he didn't have the best upbringing. Not only was he severely abused by his father, but he had multiple sexual experiences at a very, very young age, which is definitely going to affect the way he views sex as he grows up. And this next instance is especially horrific.
It took place when John was about 7 or 8. John Gacy Sr. had a male friend that was a contractor in his mid-30s, and he started coming around pretty frequently. John remembered that any time he would come over, the man would offer to take him to get some ice cream. But strangely enough, he never wanted John's sisters to come, only him.
And he remembered that this man was always overly friendly, horse playing with him, tickling him, and finding any so-called reason to touch his body. Then, as time progressed, Gacy remembered that the man would always get him to put his head in between his crotch. And once this started happening, Gacy hated going on these ice cream trips.
He would later say that he ended up telling his dad that he didn't want to be alone with the man anymore. And that was the end of it. John Sr. never asked why and he probably didn't want to know the answer.
And like we mentioned earlier, John Wayne Gacy had a lot of health problems growing up. Apparently, when he was born, the doctors had to remove his bowels for some reason, and according to Gacy, it almost killed him. He was also allegedly born with an enlarged bottleneck heart condition, so he was never able to do strenuous activities. In fact, his condition got so bad that John would frequently just pass out out of nowhere. But instead of feeling bad for his son or wanting to help him,
John Sr. just thought he was faking it, lying about his illnesses. John was about 8 years old when it started happening and at the time, he was attending a Catholic school. He never seemed to do very well in school though. Shortly after, he and his parents would move, and they transferred John to a public school, but he didn't do that well there either. He kept randomly passing out, sometimes for 30 minutes at a time, and no one seemed to know what was wrong with him. Because of this, he had to miss a lot of school.
John would later say that between the ages of 14 to 18, he had spent over a year in the hospital trying to figure out what was wrong with him. At one point, when John was about 15, he started telling his parents about an excruciating pain in his stomach. They brought him to the doctor, but they weren't able to figure out what was wrong with him. And to John Sr., this just supported his belief that his son was lying.
But the very next day, John Wayne was in so much pain that his mother took him to the doctor again. And this time when they looked, they saw that Gacy's appendix had ruptured. Then, when Gacy was 16, he had what looked like a heart attack. His friends thought he was dying. When his mom arrived, she found a priest giving her son his last rites. The paramedics eventually arrived and brought Gacy to the hospital in an ambulance. And he ended up staying there for three weeks.
However, the cause for the pseudo-heart attack could not be found, so his dad signed him out of the hospital. They ended up concluding that he may have had a form of epilepsy, and it wasn't long after he got home from the hospital when he started passing out and having more epileptic seizures. One was so bad that the doctors came to his house, put him in a straitjacket, and took him to the hospital.
This time, Gacy was in the hospital for a month. The doctors were at a loss as they tried to determine what happened. They even asked Marion to take her son back to the Cook County Hospital for a psychiatric evaluation. When Gacy found out he may have to go to a mental ward, he begged his mom, Please, I'll be good. I don't want to go. Don't make me go there.
But the problem is, no one can control when seizures occur. Gacy wasn't making the illness up, but his father was more sure than ever that his son was lying to get attention. John Wayne Gacy had another seizure a little later when he was bowling with friends at Fireside Lanes in Chicago. During the seizure, he kicked one of his friends in the neck and broke another friend's glasses. So it's clear that he wasn't faking it.
First responders eventually arrive, strap Gacy to a stretcher and take him to the hospital. But still, no one was able to find the cause. And interestingly enough, years later when Gacy was evaluated, medical officials could not find any trace of heart disease. Now, the seizures and passing out would continue for years, but John Sr. never believed his son no matter how often it happened.
and he continued to be violent with his family. It seemed like the older Gacy got, the more he and his dad fought. John tried to please his father any chance he could. He would even offer to do things around the house so his dad didn't have to. One time, John remembered that his dad said that the window trims needed a fresh paint. So John took the initiative and started to paint them for his dad.
But instead of being grateful or proud of him, John Gacy Sr. just criticized his work and repeatedly called him dumb and stupid, which were two words he often used to describe his son.
In another one of these fights, which was a lot more violent, John Wayne Gacy recalled, I thought one time he was going to kill me. He was swinging on my mother and I yelled something at him. He told me to mind my own business or he'd take care of me too. I hollered right back and he came for me, swung on me right there. But he was drunk and he hit the refrigerator. He turned and came at me again. I pinned his arms to his sides and pressed him up against the wall. I couldn't hit him. I just couldn't hit him.
John would later say that this interaction with his father, where he had this control over him, kind of aroused him.
And it's instances like this where we start to see a window into who John would later become. But one thing Gacy had working in his favor was that he was an incredibly hard worker. He was young when he got his first job delivering papers and mowing lawns in his neighborhood.
But by the time he was 14, he got his first real job delivering groceries for the local IGA store. And those that worked with Gacy always had great things to say about him. He was always respectful, punctual, and always tried his best to help people out. He even did yard work for his elderly neighbor once, free of charge. And that's the weird thing about John Wayne Gacy.
A lot of times when we look into serial killers past, we see them killing animals, destroying property or ruining people's lives at a young age. But that's not the case here. John was a good kid. He liked helping his community and at one point, he even considered becoming a priest.
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And now let's get back to today's story.
His brief religious stint started when he bowled with the St. John Backman's Parish Holy Name Society. His mom, Marion, bowled with them too. He had fun with them and he always enjoyed the company. And soon enough, John became a member of the Holy Name Society. But there weren't any other members his age. And he felt like there was a big disconnect between the church and the younger generation. So he decided to create a young adults organization at the church called the Chiro Club, which was geared towards 18 to 22 year olds.
and he was heavily invested in this club. He even organized a military-style winter dance called the "Snow-Tillion." Gacy loved to be deeply involved in his community, a characteristic that would follow him throughout his life. He assisted in building carnival booths. He even joined the parish building committee. When he discovered the church building needed repainting, he nominated himself so that they wouldn't have to pay for professional painters. It was also said that Gacy was constantly going into church to confess his sins, which
which was strange because most guys his age would just wait, count up all their sins, and then come in every once in a while. But not Gacy. He did it often. He loved the clean feeling it gave him, going in and getting a fresh start in the eyes of the Lord. Several times, the priest who was in the confessional would recognize Gacy's voice and start small talk, saying, Hey Gacy, how's your club going? Is your mom doing okay?
The clergy was impressed with him. He had a compassionate, pure heart. One Sunday night, when Gacy was playing cards in the rectory with the parish priests, someone suggested, "John, have you ever thought of becoming a priest yourself? You'd be great at it. Besides, it's almost like you live here already." And John actually considered it for a while. He loved the idea that people would have to refer to him as "Father Gacy." They would have to come to him if they needed advice.
And knowing what we know now of Gacy and his sexual preferences, he probably would have fit in really well as a Catholic priest, but I digress. Now, Gacy recognized that most men his age weren't interested in becoming a priest, and it was mostly because of the whole chastity part, but that wasn't a big issue for John.
He would later say, "I was dating broads and getting laid, but there wasn't anything serious. And why would you want to get married? Why take on the burden of having some stupid broad around you day and night?" What a gentleman. Gacy also said that because he was so sickly, he didn't really have a big sex drive. But this is most likely contributed to the fact that Gacy didn't like women. So obviously he wasn't super upset that he wouldn't be able to have sex with them.
And this became very clear one night when he was about 18 years old. He had met a girl that he thought was pretty, and she seemed to be interested in him as well. And one night they were alone in his car and she came on to him. Before he knew it, they were making out. It was clear to Gacy that the girl wanted to have sex. She even started removing all of her clothes.
But just when things started to progress, Gacy said he became repulsed by the idea of having sex with her. So much so that he actually passed out in the car. A few minutes later, he woke up to the girl putting her clothes back on and she was clearly in a panic. What the hell happened to you? She asked. We were in the middle of making out and you just slumped over. Gacy didn't have an explanation for her.
and he just told her that sometimes he does that. Now, Gacy's desire to be a priest was short-lived. And keep in mind, he's still in high school at this point, but because of his health condition and attendance, he was failing a lot of his classes. So his parents decided to transfer him to a vocational school where he worked with machines. And this type of school was a lot better than public school for Gacy because he liked hands-on learning rather than just sitting in a classroom.
And when Gacy switched schools, people could really see a change in him. He worked ahead in all of his classes, which meant school officials could allow him to work in an office. And he even became the civil defense captain of the school, where he would organize things like fire drills. But Gacy would never end up graduating from the vocational school. Although he really liked it, he was still suffering from his health problems.
and the school's officials began to worry that it may be a liability. They were worried he would pass out while working on a project or trying to build something. He could hurt himself or someone else. So, they ultimately didn't let him graduate, which was a huge disappointment to his father, John Gacy Sr. John Wayne desperately still wanted his father's approval.
So he even tried to get into the military, but they wouldn't accept him either because of his debilitating health issues. And this was an even bigger disappointment to John Gacy Sr. because he was a World War I veteran, and he never missed an opportunity to call Gacy "dumb and stupid" or "a sissy." Gacy knew that whatever he did, he would never be able to live up to his father's expectations.
He couldn't play sports, he couldn't graduate from school, he couldn't get into the military, and John felt like a failure. So at 18 years old, he makes a pretty big life decision. He was tired of his dad's control and the way his life was going. So one day, he decided to pack up his stuff and move to Vegas. He said that it felt like he was running away from home, even though he was an adult.
And in many ways, it did seem like he was running away because he never told his family he was leaving. On the day he left, he walked up to his mom and told her that he was going to put air in his tires. But once he hit the road, he had no plans of turning back. And this time in Vegas was a very interesting time in John's life.
When he arrived, he only had about $36 to his name. And it was hard for him to adjust. For one, he wasn't used to the sweltering heat. And on his first day there, he actually blacked out in front of a crowd of people. Someone ended up calling an ambulance and he was transferred to the local hospital. But unfortunately for John, the ambulance ride cost him all of the money that he had.
And this is where you'll see John Wayne Gacy's charm. After losing all of his money, he goes into the ambulance office
and explains to them why he couldn't pay the bill. Now, usually they would just tell you to figure it out and send you away. But somehow, Gacy left there with a job. He was their new ambulance driver. Now, this job didn't end up lasting very long because eventually they found out he was only 18, which was too young to drive ambulances.
So instead, they transferred him to Palm Mortuary, where he worked as an attendant. And John Wayne Gacy actually lived at the mortuary, sleeping on a cot in the back room. At the time, it was a good deal. He was making money and he didn't have to pay rent. And this is the place where Gacy got really comfortable with death. He worked with it and around it all day long for weeks.
He would later say at one point, he even crawled into one of the coffins and slept next to one of the dead bodies.
But Gacy's time in Vegas was short-lived, and after three months of living there, he decided to return home. And coming home made him feel like even more of a disappointment than before. His father was right. He wasn't able to make it out in the world on his own. But he used the shame and disappointment in himself as fuel to work harder than he ever had. He was determined to make something of himself, and he would for a period of time.
Even though he didn't have a high school diploma, Gacy somehow talked his way into attending classes at Northwest Business College. And after a year, he graduated and got himself a job as a management trainee at Nunn-Bush Shoes.
And by the time Gacy was 21 years old, he was one of the best salesmen there. The company eventually transferred him to their location in Springfield, Illinois. And while he worked there, he lived with his aunt and uncle. During this time, Gacy was working on bettering himself, making money, and climbing up the ladder of success.
And after a while, he even found himself a love interest. Her name was Marlon Myers and she was Gacy's co-worker. He had never really had any luck with women at this point in his life, but he and Marlon seemed to really hit it off. And it wasn't long until he asked for her hand in marriage. The only issue was that Gacy couldn't deny the fact that he was still interested in men. And he was about 22 years old when he finally admitted to himself that he may be bisexual. He came to this conclusion after meeting a man named Richard Stewart.
One night, Richard and Gacy were out drinking at a bar, and their goal was to pick up women, even though Gacy was engaged to Marlon. But after drinking for hours and hours, the men weren't having any luck. Girls didn't seem to find Gacy attractive. He would later say that some even referred to him as a sack of potatoes. So with no luck, the men just kept drinking.
And at one point, Richard turns to him and says, you know what would really help you get laid? If you were bisexual. When you're straight, you only have half the population to work with. When you're bisexual, you have twice the chance of getting laid because everyone's fair game. Gacy thought for a second about having sex with a man and he wasn't opposed to it.
Later that night, him and Richard went home together and Gacy said the next thing he remembered was that he woke up and Richard was performing oral sex on him and he liked it. And at that moment, he knew there was no way he could deny the fact that he liked men, but he would keep that to himself for now. After this sexual encounter, Gacy said he felt immense guilt for months.
It was one of the worst periods of his entire life. He was so depressed, so shameful, not because he cheated on his fiancée, but because he hated himself for liking men. He didn't want to be gay, so he repressed that side of him and continued planning his marriage with Marlon.
The two would get married in September of 1964, and Gacy was excited because Marlin's father's name was Fred Myers, and he was a very successful businessman. He actually owned three Kentucky Fried Chicken restaurants in Waterloo, Iowa.
And Marlon's father wasn't crazy about Gacy, but he did recognize that he had a good work ethic. So he ultimately gave Gacy the job of managing all three of his KFC restaurants. Now, the restaurants were in Waterloo, Iowa, so that meant that he and Marlon would have to move there. But Gacy was happy to do it, especially because her father had actually bought them a house there. And for the first time in Gacy's life, he really felt a sense of accomplishment. Not only was he married, but he was now a homeowner and a businessman.
And the salary of this job was impressive. He was said to make $15,000 a year with 20% of the profits, which today's time is over $130,000 a year. And even further, shortly before he took the job, he and Marlon found out that they were pregnant with their first child. Gacy was slowly becoming the man that his father always wanted him to be, even if it was all a facade. It was also around this time when Gacy started getting involved with a group called the Jaycees.
which is a leadership organization for men ages 18 to 35. And the group basically just helps out in their community and does charity work. Gacy originally got involved back in Springfield and among his duties was running the largest Christmas parade in central Illinois.
But in 1965, when he moved to Waterloo, he became a JC member there. And not long after, he was appointed as the group's chaplain, where he would pray over their meetings and meals when they got together. Many people in the group said that Gacy was a very hard worker. He took the job very seriously. If the roads in his community needed to be plowed, Gacy would go out there and do it.
He would change light bulbs for elderly people that couldn't do it themselves. And it was said that in just one year, Gacy worked on about 40 different projects for the organization. He was becoming a pillar in his community of Waterloo, Iowa. The other members of the Jaycees said that it was obvious that Gacy was trying to make his way to the top. And eventually he would make it pretty far. That year in 1965,
Gacy would become the Jaycees' first vice president, and he absolutely loved the recognition he got from this position. He felt powerful, important, like he finally proved his father wrong. And surprisingly, John felt as if he had finally reached a point where his father treated him with respect. These were the best years of Gacy's life.
He was managing the KFCs, making a lot of money, he was involved in his community, and he was growing his family. Everything was exactly the way it should have been, but this was all right before things started to take a turn for the worst.
Because eventually, the other members of the Jaycee organization started hearing some strange rumors about John Wayne Gacy. For one, he was always hanging around teenage boys. Another thing that was strange was that he always drove around in his black Oldsmobile with a red light on his dashboard, almost like he was trying to be a cop.
and an incident that occurred in 1967 would prove that Gacy was not the man everyone thought he was.
It was a cold January in Waterloo, Iowa, and Gacy was out working late at one of his KFC locations. The year before, in 1966, he and Marlon had just welcomed their first child, a son named Michael, and Marlon was pregnant with their second, a daughter they would name Christine. But Gacy wasn't a very loving and attentive husband.
In fact, he spent most of his time working long hours, and when he wasn't working, he was up to no good. On this night in January of 1967, an employee of his, who we'll call David, was on his way to the KFC location to pick up his check, and in the car with him were two of his friends, one being 18-year-old Steve Nemmers, and we'll call the other guy James.
Now, David, Steve, and James all had plans in Iowa Falls the following day. So they were going to pick up David's check from Gacy in Waterloo and then afterwards start the hour drive to Iowa Falls. So they pull into the KFC and there they meet Gacy, who's really excited to see a bunch of young men pile out of the car. He hands over David's check, but before they leave, he asks them if they want to go hang out that night. Gacy tells them,
My wife and son are in Chicago tonight, so if you want, we can all go to my place and play some pool and party for a bit." And the guys were interested. I mean, free alcohol was a hard deal to pass up, so they ultimately decided to go.
Steve said that his first impression of Gacy was that he was really nice, friendly, but, honestly, unremarkable. When the boys got to Gacy's middle-class suburban home, he led them down into his basement. It was almost like a man cave, just like his father used to have. There was a pool table, a TV, and a built-in bar in the corner of the room. And Steve thought to himself that it was a nice little setup.
Gacy started making the boys some drinks while Steve grabbed a cue and started playing pool. And he was actually really good at the game. Gacy was impressed and he told Steve, How about we start playing for money? A dollar for each game? And considering Steve was really good, he agrees. And for the next hour, the boys play pool and load up on drinks. And as soon as one of their glasses was empty, Gacy was quick to refill it. And as the night went on, they all began to get really drunk.
and while they play gacy is bragging about himself the entire time telling the boys that he's this successful businessman with a lot of connections he bragged that he was good friends with the mayor of chicago and the chief of police he even said that he often brought the entire police station buckets of fried chicken and in return he was kind of invincible
Steve also noticed that there were certificates all over the walls of his home, one being from the Governor's Board of Sex and Health. When Steve asked about it, John said he was on the board of people who studied homosexual people. Now at this point, David and James start talking about wanting to leave. They had already been there for a while and they were ready to start the drive to Iowa Falls.
But Steve knew that his friends were really drunk, and he didn't want to get in the car with them. Then all of a sudden, Gacy butts in and says, "Well, I have an extra room. You can just spend the night here, and I'll drive you to Iowa Falls tomorrow." Steve weighed his options for a moment, and although he didn't want to stay the night with Gacy,
He figured it was better than getting in the car with his drunk friends, so he agrees to stay the night. Once David and James left, Steve said that everything seemed normal and he and Gacy continued to play pool. But then Gacy made a comment that didn't sit well with him.
He tells Steve, hey, in this next round, why don't we turn it up a notch? Instead of playing for money, if you win, I'll give you a blowjob. And if I win, you give me one. Steve was disgusted with the suggestion and he takes a step back telling him, absolutely not. We will not be doing any kind of sex acts with each other. In response, Gacy begins to laugh.
and there's an awkward energy in the room. He then asks Steve, "Have you ever watched a stag film?" A stag film is pornography. And yes, Steve had watched them, but he didn't want to talk about that with this stranger. But Gacy didn't care. Instead, he whips out a projector and starts setting it up on the table. He even pulls out a big screen, like this is something he always does.
Then, as soon as the stag film started playing, Gacy just leaves the room. Steve sits there for about five minutes feeling a little uneasy when all of a sudden he hears a click. He slowly turns his head around to see what the noise was and when he does, he sees Gacy standing there pointing a gun right at his head. I'm sure at first Steve thought that this was all just a sick joke.
But when he took a closer look, he could see bullets in the chamber. And it was at that moment Steve knew this wasn't a joke. Gacy then tells him, take your pants off. And Steve does what he's told. But he's crippled with fear and he begins to cry, begging Gacy to let him go. He said he stood there in a panic for what felt like an eternity, telling Gacy, please don't do this. Please, I'm begging you.
and Gacy just stares at him for a few moments and then starts laughing. He then tells Steve, "Pull your pants up and go over to the bar. You see, you fell for it. I love to put psychological pressure on people to see how they react in those types of situations. You were scared. I was analyzing you that whole time." Steve was still weirded out, but he felt a huge rush of relief knowing that this guy wasn't a predator.
He just had a weird sense of humor, that's all. Afterwards, Gacy directs him to the room that he would be sleeping in that night, and he tells them that they can leave first thing in the morning for Iowa Falls. Once Steve is in the room by himself, he gets into bed and he tries to fall asleep, but something was keeping him up. He tossed and turned for what felt like hours, but just when he was about to fall asleep, he felt a hand caress his thigh.
Steve quickly opened his eyes and there on the bed was John Gacy with the light of the moon illuminating his face. And he was just sitting there, touching his leg and watching him while he slept. Steve would later say that even all these years later, that image of John's face still haunts him to this day.
But before Steve could even react, John leans forward and holds a knife up to Steve's throat, all while he's still caressing his thigh. And he whispers, "We are going to finish what we started down in the basement." Steve's reaction was a lot like his reaction earlier that night. He starts to cry and begs John to stop. And once again, John starts laughing.
And he tells Steve: "I'm just frustrated with myself that I wasn't able to break you earlier. I thought that psychological experiment in the basement surely would have gotten you. I just wanted to give it another try." But Steve knew this was no psychological experiment, and that something was seriously wrong with this guy.
As soon as Gacy leaves the room, Steve puts on all of his clothes and he decided that the remainder of the night, he was going to stay awake. He didn't trust falling asleep under John Wayne Gacy's roof. He thought about leaving, but he had no way of getting home. So he just sat there all night long, going over every strange thing that had happened.
The next morning, as soon as he saw the sun rise through the horizon, he walked over to Gacy's room, banged on his door, and demanded that he drive him home like he promised. Steve said that along the drive there was obvious tension in the car.
and Gacy eventually breaks the silence by saying, Look, I know you're upset with me, but I want to make it very clear that if I find out you told anyone about last night, I will come for you. I'm so well connected, all I have to do is pick up my phone and make one call, and someone can be at your house tomorrow to kill you. You understand that? Steve heard him loud and clear, and as soon as he was dropped off, he went home and tried to put the entire situation behind him.
The threat alone was enough to keep Steve quiet, but he was also embarrassed and ashamed of what happened. He would later say in the Netflix documentary called "Conversations with a Killer" the John Wayne Gacy tapes: "I was a young 18-year-old kid, and I have a grown man making me pull my pants down and a grown man putting a knife to my throat and rubbing my thigh. That's not something a young boy wants to talk about."
It's unclear whether or not this encounter with Steve was Gacy's first attempt at sexually assaulting someone, but it surely wouldn't be his last. And the threat that Gacy made to Steve was partly true. He was very well connected. And because of these connections, he didn't ever think he would get in any trouble. But that's where he's wrong. John Wayne Gacy would end up getting caught.
all from an incident that occurred in the summer of 1967. At this point, Gacy was 26 years old and still an active member in the Waterloo JC organization, and he had big plans to keep climbing up the social ladder. In fact, he would later say, "I was thinking of running for alderman. After that, I wanted to go for mayor, and if that worked, I was going to run for the state senate. I didn't see any limits."
And there were a lot of Jaycee members with the same mindset. One man, named Don Voorhees Sr., would even go on to be a part of Iowa's state legislature. And his campaign manager was John Wayne Gacy himself. Both Don and Gacy were hard workers and they had a vision, so they seemed to make a pretty good team. And while spending all of that time together, Gacy couldn't help but notice that Don's son, Don Voorhees Jr., was exactly his type.
Don Jr. was young, just 15 years old, slim, with light-colored hair, a lot like Steve Nembers, who had luckily escaped John Wayne Gacy.
And Gacy never planned to hang out with his co-worker's son, but one day in August of 1967, he saw Don Jr. hitchhiking on the side of the road while he was on his way to work one day. So Gacy pulls up beside him and asks if he needs a ride, and he did, so he hopped in his car. Don Jr. told Gacy that he was just at his girlfriend's house and the walk home would have taken forever, so he appreciated the ride.
And Gacy couldn't help but think about how he wanted to bring Don home. After all, his wife and kids were out of town, so they'd have the house to themselves. So he starts talking about sex. Have you had sex with your girlfriend yet? He asks. And after talking about that for a minute, Gacy claims that Don starts talking about stag films. Apparently, the Jaycees were known to all watch porn in a big group together, and Don Jr. was well aware of it, telling him.
The two then drive over to Gacy's house, and he sets up a stag film for Dawn down in the basement.
And obviously watching these types of videos is going to get the 15 year old aroused. And Gacy uses this to his advantage. It's unclear exactly how the conversation went about, but Gacy starts asking Don if he had ever been with a man. Then one thing led to another and the two ended up performing oral sex on each other. Gacy claims that it was consensual.
But again, there's no such thing as consent when it comes to a grown man and a 15 year old boy. Gacy always feared that Don would tell people about their sexual experience. But he figured if he did ever get caught, he could just talk his way out of it. After all, it would be his word against a 15 year old's. But he was still paranoid that it would eventually come back to haunt him. And it did.
In March of 1968, Don Voorhees Jr. would tell his father about what happened and Don Sr. went straight to the police. And he told them all of it, about the stag films, the oral sex, everything. And soon enough, the cops were knocking on Gacy's door to retrieve the stag films as evidence. And from here, Gacy knew that everything was about to come crashing down.
Now that they had evidence, it could no longer be his word against Don's. And he was so scared about John Jr. testifying against him, Gacy eventually involves another young man named Russell Schroeder. Now their encounter wasn't sexual, just criminal. Russell was 18 years old, and he had been an employee at Gacy's KFC for the last two years.
And one night, Gacy asks Russell if he would join him on a joyride around town. But this was no joyride. Instead, the two would end up breaking into local businesses around Waterloo using an iron bar that Gacy kept in his car. Once the two broke inside of these businesses, they would steal money from the coke machines or grab anything of value that was lying around.
Russell said that he had never stolen anything in his entire life, but his boss was telling him to, so he did. The two would end up driving around for about six hours, listening to the police scanners breaking into buildings and stealing hubcaps off of people's cars.
And this is an interesting story because it's not like Gacy needed the money. It was almost as if he just liked the idea that the two of them got to keep a little secret. It was also along this ride where Gacy brought up Don Voorhees Jr. and he told Russell that he wanted him to beat him up, intimidate him so he wouldn't testify against him. Gacy even offered to pay off Russell's car loan if he would do it.
So, Russell agrees. A few days later, Russell shows up at Don Jr.'s school, and he leads him out into the woods with the promise of alcohol. But once they get out there, Russell sprays him in the face with pepper spray and starts beating him up, all while screaming, "'Don't testify against John Gacy.'" Not long after, the police show up at Russell's doorstep with some questions.
they knew that Gacy had put him up to it. And this story is important because as you'll see in part two of this episode, Gacy loved to use young boys to do his dirty work for him. But this intimidation tactic that Gacy tried to use against Dawn didn't work. And on May 10th, 1967, the police came knocking on John Wayne Gacy's door with a warrant for his arrest for sodomy.
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And now let's get back to today's story.
It didn't take long for word to spread about Gacy's arrest, and everyone was completely shocked. Gacy was a respected member of their community. He was friends with all of the influential people in Waterloo. And sure, everyone knew him to be a little weird, but a sodomy charge on a minor? This was big news. And it wouldn't be long until other young men came forward about their experiences with John Wayne Gacy. Some claimed that he got them really drunk and made them play Russian roulette with his revolver.
Others say that Gacy would offer up his wife in exchange for blowjobs. He even convinced some young man that he was a scientist who studied homosexuality and that he had to conduct experiments on them, all in the name of science. But after his arrest, Gacy was taken in to get a psychological evaluation, and there they diagnosed him with antisocial personality disorder.
and said that he even has psychopathic tendencies. Dr. Eugene F. Garan would later write in his report, "John Gacy was very pleasant, friendly, highly talkable in the interview. He prided himself on being a good talker and felt this was a desirable quality which pays off in sales work.
There was an element of control in his girlishness, and he talked extensively only about what he wanted to talk about. It was apparent that John would twist the truth in such a way that he would not be made to look bad. He would admit to socially unacceptable actions only when directly confronted. My general impression was that he was both a smooth talker and an obscurer who was trying to whitewash himself of all wrongdoing.
They also said he was in "total denial of responsibility" for anything that happened to him. He can produce an alibi for everything. He alternately blames the environment while presenting himself as a victim of circumstances and blames other people while presenting himself as a victim of others who are out to get him.
Although this could be construed as paranoid, I do not regard it this way. Rather, the patient attempts to assure a sympathetic response by depicting himself as being at the mercy of a hostile environment. A major objective is to outwit the other fellow and take advantage of him before being taken advantage of himself.
Casey didn't view himself as the perpetrator in all of this, but rather the victim. And after this evaluation, John was thinking of his family and how everything was quickly taking a turn for the worst. He had everything he had ever wanted in life. A good job, a nice home, money, a family, the approval of his father. But that was all about to go away.
He even pleaded with the courts to take it easy on him since this was his first offense. He told them that he had never gotten into any trouble before and it was all just a slip-up and it would never happen again.
Gacy even changed his plea to guilty, hoping that this would work in his favor. But when his sentencing trial came around, they were not as forgiving as he would have hoped, sentencing him to 10 years in prison. Gacy said that he couldn't believe it. He truly thought they were going to be more lenient, just giving him a little slap on the wrist for sexually assaulting a minor. But luckily, they weren't, and Gacy was taken off to prison to serve his sentence.
He would serve his prison sentence at the Anamosa State Penitentiary, and it wasn't long after he got there when his wife Marlin showed up to the prison with divorce papers. I can't imagine what she was going through during this time, having to find out that your husband and the father of your children is a predator, sexually assaulting boys under your own roof.
In fact, Gacy had actually assaulted Steve Nemmers while Marilyn was in the hospital about to give birth to her second child. And with her husband's arrest, she was ready to take the kids and never have to see him again. Luckily for them, after Gacy went to prison, they would never keep in contact. But as for Gacy's time in prison, he admitted that he was scared to be there at first.
He didn't really know what to expect, but he would later say that if he was going to spend the next 10 years of his life here, then he was going to make the best of it. And before long, Gacy became very popular among the inmates. He worked as the prison's cook, and because of his experience in the restaurant business, he felt like it was the perfect job. And being a cook gave Gacy a sense of control within the prison.
You see, the prison's cooks kind of have authority over the kitchen. And if you had a problem with him, he had no issue serving you nasty food. Or you might see little brown specks in your mashed potatoes. That wasn't pepper, but mouse poop. So Gacy had a lot of control over the prison inmates. During his sentence, Gacy made a lot of friends. He did a lot of puzzles.
and he was even given the title Man of the Year at the men's reformatory because while he was there, he built a mini golf course outside for the inmates.
One interesting story from Gacy's time in prison was when he saw two inmates performing sex acts on one another. As you may know, this is pretty common in prisons, but for some reason, seeing this made Gacy angry. So much so that he walked over and started kicking one of the guys in the face over and over again, breaking his jaw. Something about it triggered him, like he was angry with homosexuality.
After all, in his mind, that was kind of the reason why he was in prison in the first place, because he couldn't control his homosexual urges. But from what we could find, it seems like this was Gacy's only violent interaction while being locked up.
And something you'll notice is that Gacy was very much the same person inside of the prison walls as he was outside. He was still a natural leader, coming up with ideas and organizing events any chance that he could. On Christmas, Gacy was even in charge of organizing a Toys for Tots event.
But it definitely wasn't a Christmas worth celebrating. Because on that Christmas day, Gacy found out that his father had passed away. And this was devastating for him. He had spent his entire life trying to please his father, and shortly before his arrest, he felt like they were on a good path.
And as you can imagine, when Gacy went to prison for sodomy, his father was more disappointed in his son than he had ever been before. Gacy felt a lot of shame, knowing that now he really did live up to his father's expectations of him. He was a screw-up, and now that his father was dead, he would never be able to mend their relationship. Gacy asked the prison if he could get out for a day to attend his father's funeral, but they wouldn't let him.
And according to his fellow inmates, after this, Gacy was not his normal, happy self. He was depressed and he didn't laugh much after that. That summer, in July of 1970, after serving just 18 months of his 10-year sentence, John Wayne Gacy would be released from prison. After he got out, he had to serve his parole in Illinois, but he knew he couldn't go back to Waterloo. Everyone there knew his dark secret.
and Gacy's reputation meant a lot to him. So he decided to move to the suburbs of Chicago, in an area called Norwood Park. At the time, the National Crime Database was brand new. It wasn't easy getting people's records, and the police stations weren't communicating with each other, so Gacy was able to move there and have a fresh start. No one in Norwood Park knew his past,
and he would be able to move there and live the life he wanted. Gacy was determined to turn his life around, and in August of 1971, he even purchased a small home in a nice suburban neighborhood. It was a safe area where parents let their children run freely through the streets. No one had any suspicions about the friendly-looking man that moved into the small house on 1831 Summerdale Avenue.
Gacy's house was about 1,000 square feet, built in the 1940s, and in the living room closet, under the floorboard, was a crawlspace. The people of Norwood Park had no idea that in just a few years, that very crawlspace would be filled with the bodies of dozens of young men who had gone missing around Chicago.
and that their unassuming neighbor would go on to be America's most prolific serial killer. Join us next week as we tell you the story of John Wayne Gacy and the 33 boys he would murder in that small home in the suburbs of Chicago.
Hey everybody, it's Colin here. Thank you for listening to this week's episode of Murder in America. Courtney and I are both so proud of how big our Murder in America family has grown over the past... It's almost been two years, guys. It's going to be our two-year anniversary in January, so that's crazy that that's coming fast. But first, I want to shout out our new patrons this week. Charles Carroll, Raven, Batasha O'Connor, Aubrey Archuleta, Morgan Poole, Sarah Keith, and JRodriguez224.
Thank you all for becoming patrons. If you're wondering what Patreon is, basically we post our episodes ad-free on Patreon as soon as they go live on all streaming platforms. So if you don't like the ads, you can sign up for very cheap to become a Patreon. All of the money from Patreon helps us continue to produce the show. And yeah, we can't thank everybody who signed up to Patreon enough, but we also can't thank everybody else enough because thank you for listening and thank you for sticking with us on this crazy ride.
obviously the John Wayne Gacy story is one of the most disturbing stories that personally we've ever heard in our lives. And there's so much more that we're going to explore in next week's episode, but again,
Halloween is about to happen. So I guess since this is the Halloween episode, happy Halloween, everybody. Halloween is my favorite day of the year by far. I absolutely love everything that comes with the month of October. Everything's spooky. By the way, if you're looking for something dark and eerie to watch this Halloween, go check out my YouTube channel, The Paranormal Files, that Courtney and I host together. And also follow us on Instagram. If you want to see photos of Courtney and I, you want to see what we look like, you want to see photos of us,
Photos from the cases that we cover. But yeah, we're going to end this here. And once again, everybody, happy Halloween. Stay safe out there. Always be careful. And we'll see you next week.
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