In Bed with Don Lemon
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So are we supposed to start the podcast? One, two, three. I'm Don Lemon.

Look at you gorgeous ladies. This is a podcast takeover. Yes. Yes. I've had it. Had it. And Jen and Pops are here. How are you? What's going on? Did I do okay with that? You did amazing. It was just like you were in my bedroom again. Yes. We have both spent so much time with you. So much decade. In our beds. I've slept with you. Yes. Many times. Or you've slept with me. I've never slept with you. Yes. But we've slept with you.

I've had the biggest crush on you for a decade. Thank you. And you're gorgeous ladies. But do you guys know how much I hear that? Guys will stop me and say, my wife goes to bed with you every night. Wait, I didn't mean it like that. Right. Totally. But it's true. You watch these people, especially during the dark Trump years, like I had to know what was going on. I couldn't just out of sight, out of mind. And you were my person. And every night I crawled in bed.

with my French Bulldogs and Don Lemon was on. - Right, I know. And then my sons. - Big hug. - And then my sons would come in, I'd be like, "Don Lemon's on." - Stop, stop. - I used to hear that. - My mad love with you. - Can I tell you something? I think that was a moment in cable news. Remember, I think that you have only a couple of those moments, but I think it's a moment that won't happen for a while because during the time that I was on, I think it was, and the zenith of CNN was you had a pandemic,

global pandemic, everybody was at home watching. You had the chaos that was happening with George Floyd, from the fallout with that. And then there was something else on top of it, I forget. And remember that crazy thing that like snowed in May in New York? It was crazy. But we had so much going on and people were just sort of sitting in, and you know, the Trump era, people were just kind of sitting at home watching. And there was a point where I could barely walk down the street. - Oh, I bet. - Yeah, it was crazy.

Before we get into the petty grievances, we have to talk about Kristi Noem shooting her dog. What the... Can I say the F-word? Yes, please. What the fuck is wrong with her? And why would you put... First of all, why would you do it? But why would you put it in a book and who would allow that? It's dumb. That's what I'm saying. It's cool and dumb. Nobody talked anybody off the ledge. Nobody talked anybody off the ledge. It was like nobody said...

this might not be good. Right. I don't know if we should put this in. So it's like, it makes you think her whole team is incompetent. Well, it makes you think that obviously they live in another world. Who, who would shoot a dog in the head? I don't get it. A sociopath. Right. Who would shoot it? Oh, look, if a dog is attacking you, I don't know. I'm just saying, but a 14 month old dog named cricket, named cricket.

Like, and, and I don't know, I mean, and put it in a book. Do you know, I was on the phone, on the phone doing a zoom yesterday with my book publisher and the team, the promotion team and all that, the marketing team. And we said, everybody said, Don, do you know how many eyes that had to get past? So you're right. Her whole team must be cruel or they didn't read her book or they think it's okay. I don't know who would think that is okay. I don't either. All of it. Or who would,

- Put it in a book. Like if it happened, don't admit to it. - Yeah. - Telling your kids would be the worst part. - I think that there is this side of the political spectrum

That is so bizarre. I like right before we came in here, Pumps, what she's constantly on the liberal algorithm. She's like, guess who's opening up for Trump today? I said, who? Mike Lindell. The pillow man. Like this is just opening up for him. Gosh, can he just take a nap? I think he does during court. I meant Mike Lindell on a pillow. Maybe Mike Lindell should get him a pillow for court. Yeah.

- And it also absorbs some of the farting sounds. - Mike Lindell needs to get a cell and then pad it with my pillow and get a little camera and pretend like he's just broadcasting from there because that's where he needs to be. It's crazy. - But think, it is crazy. Think about where we are when we have a president, honestly, regardless if you're a Democrat or Republican, I really don't care what party you belong to. But when you have a president that's involved in so many court cases and what he's found guilty of, of assaulting, libel of assaulting, like a woman,

It's just kind of crazy. And I think that somehow our politics have led to cruelty being okay. To meanness being okay. Where nothing really matters. So you get someone like a Kristi Noem who, you know, it's okay to shoot a dog in the head and then publish it in a book. But it's actually not okay. Right. You know what I mean? Right. It shouldn't be okay. It's a very weird time. I think after the Access Hollywood tape.

the Republican Party was exposed in a way and they all became so obsequious to all of the stuff that they had hidden. They started saying all the quiet parts out loud. And it exposed it in a way that it's just never, we've never come back from that. From that moment that the moral right, you remember during the George Bush years, it was I'm a compassionate conservative and family values.

There's all that veneer is off now. And then now there's just this punitive nature to the Republican Party that really deeply disturbs me. It disturbs me because there's a cruelty to their policy and they kind of brag about it. It's part of the process. It's now it's built. It's baked in now. It used to be like, oh, it's a side. Like, oh, my gosh, we didn't mean to be cruel. Right. We didn't know we were being cruel. Maybe they don't now. But yes, you're right. And here's the thing. Like people, you know, again, I'm not I'm an independent.

But like, you know, with the Democratic Party and everyone talks about woke and all these things, I get it. Like, you know, some of those things are annoying and they're gone too far, but the intent behind it is good. And you can, there is a correction there that can happen. When the intent behind something is cruelty or, you know, something that's bad,

then that's problematic. Right. And that's harder to correct if you can't see the difference between right and wrong. That's a really good point. I mean, that's just a really good point because I think that like on universities right now, these kids feel compassionate and they feel empathy. Wherever anybody is on the position, their feeling is they want –

to fight for justice and a safer planet for everybody. And it seems like the other side wants to take away things. Like we live in abortion ban America. Our state is a full blown abortion ban and then we have this crazy superintendent named Ryan Walters. All he talks about 24/7, 365 are trans issues.

as though there are all of these trans people in Oklahoma. Such a small population. Exactly. And it's low-hanging fruit. Exactly. Why do you attack the people who are most vulnerable? Yes. That's what I mean. Exactly. And I always say, who in their right mind...

would choose to be trans in the middle of the Bible Belt. Nobody would do that. This is not something that's fun for them. - But the thing is, I have questions. I'm a member of the LGBTQ community. I have questions about trans people or whatever, but I think it's okay to be curious and to have questions.

But I don't think it's okay to be mean and cruel and to try to ostracize people and to use them as fodder for your political career or for your religious beliefs. Right. Yeah. Okay. Let's get a little petty here, Don. Yes. Let's do it. All right. What have you had it with? I have had it with people who contract words. Okay.

Like, and my partner, my husband does it all the time. He'll say, oh, that's a crazy sitch. And I'm like, what? He goes, oh, what's your ish? And everything he'll try to like, it just comes out of the blue. And because he's a millennial, right? Right. And I'm like, what the heck?

Why does everything have to be a contraction or a shortened word? Right. Can't we just talk like normal people? Why can't you talk like, you know, it's like even people have to contraction sometimes put, I mean, contraction, shortened words and a contraction, putting two words together. Like, I think it started with like Brangelina, right? People started contracting like a couple, Bennifer and that kind of.

Tell them about the one that you learned about. I've learned about Riz the other day. I had to ask what it was. Oh, it's like, yeah. Charisma. Yeah, Riz. And I was like, what's Riz? And they're like, well, if you have to ask, you don't have any. And I was like, oh, okay.

We got in trouble with the whole continent of Australia because we were like, Brekkie, like it's breakfast. Don't say Brekkie. Oh my gosh. I said I'd had it with Brekkie. Oh, I saw that episode. But it was a nuance of that. Brekkie. Talk about not understanding nuance. Australia, listen, we're going to roll out the Brekkie tour in January, but that's neither here nor there. My nuance with this was...

American influencers on their Instagram page are like, gonna go have brekkie with bae. I saw that. I was like, I've had it. Put a sock in it. Wait, did you talk about that on the Today Show? Was that the one you talked about it on one of the podcasts I saw? Yeah. So that's one. But I think then the Daily Mail comes out and it's like entire continent of Australia is mad with American podcaster and it was a picture of me. Oh my gosh. Oh,

Oh my gosh. Can I tell you a Daily Mail story? Yes. So I went to the Time 100 the other night and they seat you wherever. So they just, you know, you don't get to choose. And so I sat down

And I said, hi, I'm Don. And the guy said his name. I won't say it. And we started talking about what we did. And he goes, oh, yeah, I'm the publisher of the Daily Mail. And that's my dad. And it's been in their family forever. And I said, oh, that's interesting. Why do you guys write stuff about me that's not true all the time? And he's like, oh, yeah.

But they were actually very nice guys. They were very nice guys. So that's my Daily Mail story. Oh, yeah. Oh, my gosh. Why do you keep writing stuff about me? Okay. It's very sensationalizing to write the Daily Mail.

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you sometimes have had it with something, but you also are an offender.

Yes. And I think you have one of these, Don. Right after I wrote to you guys about what I've had it with, I found myself doing it on the way to the office this morning, on the way to the studio. And I had my briefcase, you saw it, right? My bag on one arm and I had my jacket on the other arm and I didn't have a chance to reach for my AirPods and someone called me from the office. I just grabbed the phone as quickly as I could and I put it on speaker and I was walking down the street talking to one of my producers on speakerphone. And I hate that.

I hate more than anything when someone's phone rings, like turn your ringer off, like a vibrator, a buzz or whatever, or call them back. Like I hate hearing that in public. Phone ringing at home, at your home, totally fine. But when you're in public, don't disturb everyone else's peace. And when people are talking on the phone,

or on speakerphone and you can hear their entire conversation. I don't want to hear that. Now, what about in a restaurant? But I did it. Oh my gosh, that is annoying. See, I think walking on the street, you kind of get a pass on that. But a restaurant, no. Restaurant, sometimes sitting at the table with you. Yes. It's crazy. And it's like, you're at dinner. Put on Do Not Disturb. Do something. Or get up and say, excuse me, I need to take this. Right. And like walk away. Yeah.

I had to do that this morning. By the way, Brekkie, you know brunch is an acts of contraction of breakfast and lunch. Yes, it is. Yes.

It is. I do like a good brunch. What about brunch? Do you like brunch? I love a boozy brunch. Yeah. I love a boozy brunch. You hit it? But when I have a boozy brunch, like by like five o'clock, I'm done. I fall asleep and then I wake up at 10 o'clock at night and I'm like, oh. That's the way I was when I drank. I did not have any staying power. Yeah. I raged and then faded immediately. I did the rage and fade. You raided? And I could never rally. Rage, faded, you raided? Yeah.

Quite the sitch you were in. Okay. Because I had a lot of riz. Lots of riz. Okay. This is something that I just want to drag a dead horse out and beat the ever living shit out of. Let's hear it. Let's hear it, Jen. This is yours. Overly cheery people. Oh, my gosh. Can't stand it. Why don't you say how you really feel? Why does everything is like, you know, some... I'll say... Someone will say to me...

How's your day going? It's okay. Today's okay. Great. I'm okay. I shouldn't complain, but I will always tell the truth. But it's like, oh my gosh, it's so great. And I just hate it. Or if someone's, or just those little phrases like, you know, you'll be mad at someone. You should, everyone should have grace in this situation. I'm like, fuck you. I can't stand that. Fuck off. I hate it. Fuck off with that. Sometimes people are

assholes. Can't we just call it like we see it? Yes. Just like he was an asshole. I was an asshole. Yeah. Now we're fine. Now we're fine. Okay. Let's talk about this case.

What about the revisionist history when somebody dies? A total dick dies. Yes. Just a total asshole. You mean like OJ? Is that what you're talking about? No. OJ is a great example. OJ is a great example. But, you know, we've all probably been to these funerals and this just world-class asshole dies. Yeah.

And then they're saying all of these, you know, oh, he was a wonderful person. And it's kind of like, no, no, he really wasn't. You know what that comes from? They say don't speak ill of the dead. Yeah. Yeah. But I'm with like Betty Davis. Supposedly, Betty Davis said you should only speak good of the dead. And she goes, Joan Crawford is dead. Good. Good.

Right? That's a great one. Mommy Dearest is one of my favorite movies of all times. Yeah, really. Featuring Faye Dunaway. Okay, what about the phrase, this is one that gets in my craw and it has been sitting there for decades. Yes. Everything happens for a reason. Oh, God.

I hate that one. No, it doesn't. It's not true. Bad shit happens a lot. Bad shit happens too, right? Yeah. Bad shit happens all the time. And bad shit happens to good people. God never gives you more than you can handle. Well, God is a lot more faith in me than I have in myself because I can't handle this shit. No, I'm above my pay grade. Stop. I don't like the phrase either where something will happen and then the person will say, it was just a God thing.

like that there was divine intervention in their life. Like they might like have hit a yellow light instead of a red light. And I wanted to be like, either way, you were probably going to hit that red light. You know, that probably had nothing to do with it. But I don't know why people have a tendency to always want to lean into superstition or something, having order in all of the chaos that is the human experience. Because the human experience is very chaotic. Yeah.

Do you think God cares if you win an Emmy or an Oscar or a football game? I would like to thank God first. I mean, I get it if you're a believer, but it's like, I don't know. I'm not a believer at all. And so I really get irritated when like football players score and they're looking up. I'm like, what about the other 11 guys? Like, why did you get, why are you favored? Why does God like you better than us? Yeah.

You know, like, why did you make the touchdown and not the other ones? And so, I mean, we live in the Bible Belt, so there's a lot of it, which exacerbates. Sorry, I hate to cut you off. No, go ahead. How are you doing today? Blessed and highly favored.

If someone said that to me, I would die. People have said that to me. Haven't you heard that? I heard blessed, but not in highly favored. A guy at TSA, at Will Rogers World Airport, where we fly out of in Oklahoma City, just said that to me. I said, hey, how are you doing today? He said, blessed and highly favored. And you know what? Instead of me smiling, kind of walking off, I was like, God, what a dick. And he said,

And he's really a sweet guy. It was a sweet gesture. It is, but it's too syrupy. But I'm so cynical that I just, it irked me. Yeah. You've had it with TSA. I had it. Yeah, I saw that on your podcast. It's never ending. It's a never ending beehive of had it's. And you know they can see everything too when they scan you. Really? Okay, that's interesting. Like my IUD? I guess if they,

the thing they could probably, but I know that on guys, it's like, eh, you know. Like penis size? Oh, yeah. Really? I just went through with a guy where you do the hands up and the swoosh, and he came out and just, and he was like an older, unattractive guy, and his penis area lit up bright red, and I was like,

what's going on there? I wonder. Wait, what? What are the other passengers? The person behind me, I'm waiting to see if they're going to scan me. And he just had like red where his crotch would be, like kind of down low. Hot crotch? Hot crotch. Are they going to freshen? It was like a glowing red light? Yes, it was glowing red. And then they passed him on and I thought, well, I guess they're not worried about it being metal. Do you think it was like a penis pump? I don't know. His penis was blessed and highly favored. I mean...

I mean... Highly favorite. Wow. Yeah. I was so intrigued. Hot crotch. It couldn't be. What could it be? Like, not a cell phone. You know, sometimes you... But you can't go through with your cell phone. Right. No, and it was... I mean, it was, like, atomically correct. Like...

I don't know. Okay, Don, you're from the South, so you're going to know this phrase, a titty baby. Oh, yeah. You know what a titty baby is? You're a big titty baby. Yeah. A big cry baby. So I watched an interview recently with you and Elon Musk. Yeah.

And I immediately, I can spot a titty baby immediately. The stage five meltdown that he had, and I didn't even think you were being like, I've seen hardcore go hard in the paint, Don Lemon. Right. This was mild. This was mild, Don Lemon. Thank you. I'm so glad you said that. You're welcome. I don't know. I was like, why are you getting so upset? It was weird. It was bizarre. But the thing is, it's like, why was he getting upset about that?

public statements that he had already made. I was just because the, I was there, it's X or Twitter. And I wanted to know about the stuff that he did on his platform. So 99% of the questions were about his platform, but everything else were, was about statements that he put out. Like he taught, he put it out about his ketamine, right. On the platform. He talked about DEI on the platform. He talked about, you know, all, all, all,

All other kinds of things. And so I just asked him about that because I was doing a distribution deal with him, a content deal on his platform. I thought that I should get some answers, that everyone should get some answers because people want to know. If I had the opportunity, why do you say that DEI is like – why did you say that planes are falling out of the sky for DEI? He says he didn't say that. Well, he did – he responded to a tweet earlier.

that said that. And that's a DEI is a problem. I said, so what are you saying that women pilots and minority pilots are less intelligent, less skilled than white male pilots? And he was just like, he couldn't get it, but it wasn't a gotcha interview. No, it wasn't at all. Not at all. He just started, you know, he got defensive because he's wrong and he knows it. You think so? I think so. 100%. He's wrong. And he's a titty baby. He's a titty baby. Nobody ever says to him,

you can't say that or you need to say something differently. Or I don't think there's anybody in his circle that says, you know,

You know, I don't, I kind of disagree with that idea. Let's talk about it. Like, why do you, what's your point of view? I think it's all, yes, you're the most brilliant. You're the best. So he doesn't understand any type of, not even a criticism, just a question. But I've been surprised by his sort of bro sycophants who have been sort of twisting the interview, you know, to make it into a gotcha. Like Don Lemon was, it was a gotcha interview or you're an idiot or you were saying things that were wrong. And my facts were right on everything. Here's the thing about that.

How stupid is Elon Musk and all of the sycophants around him when you have Don Lemon? It's not like you're like pumps and me rolling up to Twitter interviewing him. You have a decades long storied career in journalism wherein everybody who has a pulse knows that you ask serious questions. And if he's going to get on his platform and say crazy shit, a journalist knows.

should check that. That is his thesis statement is the First Amendment. And within the First Amendment is Don Lemon, the journalist, asking questions to power. And he holds a lot of power with X. And so there's nothing more American than what that was. What I don't like, where American culture is going, is the stage five freak out from these quote unquote alpha males like Elon Musk, like Donald Trump.

And the minute you scratch just behind that veneer, they're the biggest titty babies on the planet. And so I'm happy that somebody finally sat down with him and questioned him. I mean, he has a big responsibility owning that. And he doesn't even know how I feel about D.E.A., not that it was his job to ask me. But obviously, I'm a man of color. I believe in diversity, equity and inclusion, right, especially for people.

underserved communities and for women. I mean, I hate it when, you know, when I would be in meetings and there would be one woman in there, she'd have a great, you know, idea and then everyone would ignore her. And then it would come around to a white guy and he would go, but he would just do like this with the same idea. And they'd go, that's great, Bob. And I'm like, but Cindy just said that like 10 minutes ago.

Do you know what I mean? - Yeah, happens all the time. - Check yourself, you don't understand. So there are issues, nothing is perfect. There are issues with diversity, equity, inclusion. There are issues with affirmative action. There are issues with everything. There are issues with the church, whatever. Nothing is perfect. So I think that there can be a correction in companies and you need to reassess every once in a while to see if you've gone too far, right? So I think that is a fair, like I said, nuance.

But to think that you should get rid of diversity, equity, and inclusion forever, or you should use it as a political cudgel during an election season or whatever, I just think it's absolutely ridiculous. And I think it's actually a sign of entitlement. Okay, I want to ask you, you were recently on Bill Maher. And I, being non-religious, raised in the Bible Belt by atheist parents, progressive parents, Bill Maher was a huge part of my life.

life, watching him, relating to him. And it seems like lately I'm like, what is happening with him? Yeah, religious, remember what he did on religion? He talked about it. Yeah, the hypocrisy. It was phenomenal. So then I saw this clip of you on there and you said that a lot of spaces that you're in, you're the only black man. And Bill seemed kind of dismissive of that. And have you seen, first of all, how did that make you feel? What?

Well, it was kind of weird because I thought in the moment he said, it's just the three of us. And I'm like, yeah, and one of us, there's one black person there. I'm surrounded by two white guys. But I don't know how the press read it. I thought he was just sort of making a joke. And then what I did was I looked out into the audience and I may have seen one black person. But I think people get – I think –

People of color and even women get used to being the only person in the room. And sometimes you'll look around and you go, huh, I'm the only woman in the room. I know that my women friends will tell me that. Or I'll go, I'm the only black person in the room. And for many years, I was the only black person in primetime on cable news.

And so you're often in spaces and people will make comments and you're uncomfortable, but you realize if you spent your entire life being offended, you'd be offended all the time. If you were offended by everything, you'd spend your entire life being offended. Or they would make, you know, gay jokes or they would say that's so gay or whatever. And just little things that happen, you know, daily. And it makes you uncomfortable. Sometimes you have to, I try to call it out in the moment without being, you know, preachy.

But yeah, and I think to dismiss that is to be unaware of how our society actually works. And I think that people have gotten too comfortable with that. Look around sometimes when you're in a room, when you're in church, when you're at a restaurant, when you're at a ball game, and look at the ethnicity of the people. Do you constantly surround yourself with people who only look like you? I don't. Look, I'm not saying, you know, I'm not saying...

i want to disparage anyone but i think we spend too much time doing that and i think we should we should go up to a person of color in the in the carpool lane and say you know

our sons play soccer together and we're having a cookout on Sunday. Maybe you should come over if someone is of a different ethnicity. I think you have to make an effort to get to know people. Otherwise, did you just invite us to the cookout? I did. I did. And Tim, my husband is more aware of it than I am after being in an interracial relationship. And he'll look at people's social media and he'll go,

Did you see the such and such? And I'm like, no. And he'll say, look at everyone at this party. And to us, it's foreign because we have every single, his best friend is Indian. You know, at our wedding, we had an Irish blessing and we jumped over the broom, which is an African tradition. And so we try to invite everyone in. So if you're not doing that in your life, this is a time to change it. And that would actually help our politics a lot. I think so too. I have a long...

complaint about the suburbs, because at least in Oklahoma City, the suburbs are very white. And everybody in the suburbs surrounding Oklahoma City is the exact same person. They're white, they're evangelical, they're Republican, and they all live in the same neighborhoods. All their houses look the same. There's no culture. They don't hear other foreign languages and xenophobia and racism and all of these things breed out there because they're never

confronted or around anything different. And then their algorithms send them more of this stuff. And I worry about it. And we've been traveling so much with the podcast and we're in these big international cities. And I love walking down the street and hearing a foreign language. And you live in New York, so you hear this all the time. We live in a very homogenous city. And I agree that that's why you see cities that are

most populous places are blue because people are more mixed in and more tolerant because you have to be to survive. It's kind of an evolution thing. And you get to know people. That's right. I always say like, you know, I know people think like the subway is the most dangerous place on

on Earth. We ride it all the time. I loved it. I call it the great equalizer. Totally. Because you get to see everyone there. And, you know, I used to spend, I had to during the Trump year, spend my life in the back of a, you know, a black car because I had death threats and all of that. But now that that's over, I'm not on, you know, the traditional television. I can go out in places. People still obviously recognize me, the taxi driver when I got here. People on the subway, they'll be like, hi, can I get a selfie? I don't want to do that.

But I don't feel like someone's going to come up and try to kill me anymore. So I call it the great equalizer. And I love walking down the street. And when I was late to come here because I was shooting something at my studio, I wanted to hop on the city bike and just sort of ride through the city and take it in. But I'm glad you reminded me of that. So what I thought in that moment with Bill Maher is that I think most people don't get a chance. They don't.

If the people in that audience were surrounded by, if they went into a group of only black people, right, or only Latino people, they would perhaps understand a little bit how I feel every single day. You know what I mean? Because you'd be like, oh, wait a minute. What's going on? Like if you went to an entirely black neighborhood. There are times when I go on the Upper East Side, everybody's white, right? I was in the restaurant last night and the only person that was black was me, were me and the hostess. You know, so...

I've just noticed with Bill Maher, it seems like... Oh, you asked me what was going on with him. It seems like he's kind of gotten grumpy old man-ish. I heard him talking about kind of disparagingly about drag queens and disparagingly about trans people. And then he said that

comment to you and I always really admired him and liked him and it was a big voice in my political upbringing you know in your 20s when you're figuring out who you are and what you believe and why you believe it the movie Religious and

And I think the problem is, again, when you have liberals that live in a blue state where they're protected by a blue state government, you have the luxury of thinking about the nuance of civil rights and, oh, these drag queens or whatever. But when you live in a red state and you see in red state government and you see the vitriol and you see it up front,

You know that you have to go all chips in on supporting the drag queens. You know you have to go all chips in on supporting trans rights because they use it and they abuse it. And we see these kids that are hurting and they're getting bullied by their governments. And so I've been really disappointed in Bill. And I saw the clip with you and I just thought, you know, that's not fair.

the bill that I watched for all those years. - It feels like you would think he would be more aware, and I think that Bill is, but it sounds like he's just not aware of the situation. It's empathy. - Right. - Empathy is the thing. And you know what, I'm glad you said that because my family comes to visit me, usually once a year, they'll come twice this year because they came for the wedding, or they'll come during the summer.

And they'll say, Don, it's like two different worlds. They're in Louisiana, which is very red. And it's like two different worlds. They'll say, we've been here for two days and we have not seen one Trump supporter. We haven't heard the word Trump. We haven't heard the word MAGA. There's not been an uncomfortable space that we've been in. And it's a whole other thing. So you're exactly right about that.

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Ask your doctor about Addi today. That's addi.com. All right, should we play Had It or Hit It? Yes. Oh my God. Welcome to Had It or Hit It. I would hit it. Had It. I hit it every day, sometimes twice a day. Okay.

Okay. I love you guys. I love you, Don. I told Jennifer right before you came, I was like, my heart rate's like 170. I felt like we broke up for all this time. And now we're back together in person. And my heart is so full, Don Lemon. You just have no idea the crush that I've had on you for so many years. Oh, my gosh. So many years. I know you're married. I know you're gay. You're hot.

You're smart. I love your voice. I love when you talk about your mom. I mean, I just love everything about Don Lemon. So I'm going to hit it. You're going to hit it. We hit Don Lemon. Okay. Had it or hit it, coffee art. Coffee art?

Had it. Why do people think that's interesting? Had it. Why do you need that? Just give me my coffee. And why does it cost 20 bucks for a cup of coffee? Agree. Had it. Okay. Had it or hit it. Kellyanne Conway. This is going to be a surprise. Can I do both or do I have to do both? You can do both. I can do both. Kellyanne in person is one of the nicest, smartest people you ever want to meet. I've had it with her politics.

I feel like she gave us alternative facts. Yeah. Like she is ground zero. I've had it with her politics. As a human being, I would say hit it, but with discretion. Really? I'm so surprised. If you met her, you would like her. I would? If you met her, you would like her. Yeah. See, we got a lot of hate in the beginning because they thought we were like –

Kellyanne Conway look like, you know, middle America accent. I'm sorry, middle aged accents, blonde, like we must be MAGA. And then when we weren't, they just went bananas. So I just really don't like her. And I like that she is protective of her kids. And I love that her daughter is LGBTQ and she's completely supportive of that.

But politics, I've had it. I have a question about that. How are you how do you have an LGBTQ plus child as Kellyanne Conway does support and then support a man who puts these justices on the Supreme Court? And those terms are going to outlive the presidential term. And you have Alito and Thomas saying they want to overturn the gay marriage. And that just that type of moral duplicity.

Don, it fucking pisses me off. I will just say this and not specifically just for Kellyanne Conway, but ambition causes people to do a lot of things. It causes a lot of cognitive dissonance. Yep, it does. You know what I'm saying? I just wonder if it was power, but it's ambition. Ambition is a lot. Especially in the business that I'm in, ambition is everything and people will literally kill their grandmother if they had to. Is that why so many people compromise for Trump?

Yeah, you mean... They just like, they go morally bankrupt in his orbit. Yeah, you mean people on the pundits or just in general? In general, like the people that work for him? Yes. Okay. Very simple question. Absolutely. That's it. Power and ambition. And it's, by the way, it's the shortest line to the front.

When if you were, cause I remember, what's her name? Kaylee McEnany. She was on CNN. And I remember, oh my God, you guys laugh. What's going on? I have a nephew and he's a federal agent, but he's super progressive.

But he kind of would. Kaylee McEnany was on TV. He kind of had he goes, I kind of have this fucked up crush on Kaylee McEnany with her little cross. And I kind of like have these sexual fantasies about her. And I hate her and I hate everything that she says. But that's that's kind of he feels the way I feel about Kelly and Conway. I don't have a crush on her, but there are things about her that I find admirable. But for the most part, like you said, yeah, yeah.

Just every time I always think about him and his just moral dilemma and thinking she was attractive, but also hating everything she said. Yeah, well.

Yeah. I get it because there are some people who I find repugnant and I'm like, but they're really good looking. Yeah. But I don't want to hit it. I don't want to hit it. Right. Okay. So just when I say it's the shortest line to the front, there were a number of people who were like this. But I remember on CNN, she was a pundit and she was like a baby pundit or whatever. And they would –

There was a show called Get to the Point. They were piloting shows on CNN. And one, they needed a blonde conservative, someone who was cute, like to feel sort of, because you need different types. And so they chose Kayleigh McEnany and she was anti-Trump.

And she was anti-Trump. Really? I remember this. And then I feel when she figured out she got more clicks and it was more, she became more popular, it was the shortest line to the front. Yeah. She ended up becoming his press secretary. Right. Yeah. And just got out there and he just shit all over her every day and she had to lie, lose all credibility. But think about a lot of the Republican contributors and hosts who are on the air now,

Same thing. They're very thin resumes, but because they needed a Trump person, someone to sort of explain Trumpism and to be there to support Trumpism, they got the jobs. They skipped everybody else. Okay. This one I hate to do to you, but I have to because I'm spicy and salty. Had it or hid it, Nikki Haley? Oh, had it. Had it. They used to call me Judge Judy Diana because of Judge Judy. Yeah.

But then she endorsed Nikki Haley. And I was like, you can't call me that anymore. Yeah. Anybody who says racism is not has never been American. I'm just like, shut the fuck up. That's ambition.

That's the ambition thing we're talking about. And to be, if you are going, if you're a person of integrity, I believe you cannot be all things to all people. So she tries to be all things to all people. And I think that if you're, be who you are, right? Don't say, you know, Donald Trump is, I don't think he should be president or he's awful or whatever. I'm paraphrasing. And then take a job in his cabinet.

Right. And then tell him you're not going to run and then run. You know, do you understand what I'm saying? And then say, you know, I'm not for abortion, but I, you know, it's just, it's like, but whatever we can get past. Yeah. It's a, but here's the difference. So I remember you were kind of, everybody had it melt down because Don Lemon said that Nikki Haley was a woman that was pastor prime. And I understand because when you have to sit and talk all the time, you say you have to say shit. You're extemporaneously speaking, you corrected it.

You apologized, you moved on down the road. And that's kind of how open-minded people with integrity operate, right? Because you can't always be perfect all the time. You can't say everything perfectly all the time.

Nikki Haley says that the United States is not a racist country. And I am like, how on earth? I know the people that she hangs around in the Republican Party because I live around them. They're my neighbors. I know these people and I know they're racist. They thought it was hilarious to call Air Force One Afro One when Obama won. Right.

You know, like I had never heard of that. And that wasn't that long ago. So the racist and it just but there's hardly ever a correction on their side to find empathy. And it just it feels so I get fatigue from it that one side has to have integrity. One side has to have, you

you know, do everything above the board. And the other side, it's just fucking throw red meat all the time. It drives me batshit. She knows better. Yeah. I think I forget the exact story about her father. I think her father could not get a job except for an HBCU or something like that. And there was a, some story like that. That's racism. And you know,

She changed her name for God's sakes. I was just going to say that. Her name is Nimrata. Right. And so, but Nikki sounds like she should look like you guys, right? Right. Hey, that's my friend Nikki, right? Yeah. So she knows better. Again, being all things to all people, I think she wants to, you know, cozy up to the MAGA or to the more conservative racist parts of the Republican Party. So she has to say stuff like that.

And, you know, to say, well, I knew was it's, you know, of course, the Civil War was about. Remember, she said that Civil War was about slavery. I knew better. But I didn't figure it was so obvious that you didn't have to mention it. It's like, really, like you said, if you're in those spaces, you've got to go all in. And sometimes you have to over explain things to people. So when you have that moment, that opportunity to be on a stage like that and someone says, what was the Civil War about? You say the Civil War was obviously about slavery. That's right. Right.

That's exactly right. Do not get it twisted. It was about slavery. That's exactly right. That's like the comment. Like I, you know, when you mentioned Nikki Haley, I said, I don't believe in that, but no one wrote about that. No one heard that. But I do. I misspoke or I should say I wasn't clear enough and I should be more precise in my language, especially as a journalist. And so.

it was made into something that, that was completely opposite of what I believe. And I do think because you are who you are, a black gay man, they are waiting in the wings to jump on the words that you say, you don't get a, you're not going to get away with Jack shit. The Tucker Carlson's and the Sean Hannity's, the scope of stuff that they get away with. I mean, it's a wide, wide range, but you missed up one time and they are going to hammer down the Daily Mail, Fox, all of them.

Do you ever watch Fox News? I can't. Okay. I never do. But we interviewed the vice president, Kamala Harris, Nebogdiel, not trying to brag, not trying to flex. But obviously that was a big fucking deal for us. So we interviewed her last month. Okay. We're so excited. It was so surreal. We get back from D.C. And somebody messages me, y'all are on Fox News. So I switched to Fox. And Jesse Waters said,

spent nine and a half prime time minutes from the start of his show until the first commercial break talking about the two of us with Kamala. I was crying, laughing. I couldn't believe it. I thought it was hilarious. And then I tried to stay with Fox a little bit after that. And it just was so vapid. And I was like, no wonder these people like...

That's what my mom says. They know what sells. They know what their audience sells. The next day, we go into the studio and we have death threats. I'm sure you're familiar with all this stuff. I was going to say, now you know what I went through for years. And even still, now I go through it. But what I was going to say is sometimes I am – I'll watch to see what's going on. I used to watch –

more often. Actually, this is gonna sound weird. I used to like to watch Bill O'Reilly because I thought he was a great performer. Again, I didn't believe in everything he said. I used to like to watch Megyn Kelly. I thought she was a great performer, right? And then it just got so crazy, I cannot watch anymore because they've just...

But sometimes the way that the guys talk to the women on that network, and I'm like, I'm shocked. - It's unbelievable. - It's unbelievable. Like, stop it, you shut up, whatever. And I'm like, okay, all right, but I'm the problem. - When I watched it, I felt like it was satire. I did not think it was real news. I couldn't believe it. But Bill O'Reilly, really quick, we talked about this right before we started, best line in all of broadcasting ever, fuck it.

Let's do it live. Let's do it live. And they rip off his jacket. I mean, I'm just like, he's fucking unhinged. It is the best. You got to give it to them. They know what their audience wants and they pander to that. They serve it up. They serve it up. Every night. It is not, it is too black and white for me. My worldview is a lot more gray, a lot more nuanced.

And I just, it's not for me. I'm glad you said nuance. There's no nuance. I told you that, right? I've had it with no nuance. Yeah. Everything is, you have to choose a side. Everything is not binary. Like you can, we can hold two thoughts. We can hold more than one thought in our mind at the same time. That's really what becoming a somewhat sane adult is, is learning how to manage and juggle multiple thoughts that, and- And sometimes they conflict. That's right. Sometimes you're like, God, I don't know. I mean-

I want to feel this way, but I just don't. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? If I was a good person, I'd feel this way. Yeah. But I must not be a good person because I don't. You're a terrible person, Pop. I know. It's awful. Okay, Don. Our last one. Oh, my gosh. This is it. I know. We have to go to LaGuardia. I know. I know. I have a five o'clock show that I do live. Yeah. I know. Fuck it. Fuck it. You're going to die, Don. Fuck it.

I love when I get lost in conversation like this. I got lost in conversation with Scott. Scott Galloway came on my show to talk about his book. And we just started talking. And then he called me up 30 minutes after we finished taping. And he said, Don, my publisher is going to kill me. I said, why? He goes, we forgot to talk about the fucking book. I'm like, oh, my God, we totally did. Sorry. I'm sorry. OK. All right. Last one. Had it or hid it. Gay marriage.

Speaking of nuance, I'm going to say hit it. But I'm also going to say that I am a man of a certain age. I'm old enough to remember when it was kind of unique and it was a bit different. And so while I'm happy that people are being treated equally, I'm

I don't think that gay people should aspire to be heteronormative all the time. And I think marriage is sort of an institution that does that. But I did it because I think it's important that same-sex marriage be legal.

And I got married and I had the United States ambassador to the UN officiate our wedding. - Oh, that's cool. - It was amazing. And we did it in a church because I'm a believer, you're not a believer, but that's totally fine. But I have a book coming out by the way, you have to come back on.

I mean, you want to come on the show and talk to me. You can come on my show and interview me about the book or however you want to do it. - I would love it. We'll have you back on. - But I have questions, right? And I think you're supposed to question, and I have doubts.

about my faith and about my religion. And that's okay. You cannot say that to a Christian, like to an evangelical. They're like, wait, what the hell are you talking about? Or what the heck are you talking about? But I believe, I like the tax benefits. So I think everyone should be treated equally under our system. But

Could I have never gotten married? Sure. But I would want to be with my partner for the rest of my life. I think you guys are entitled to the same level of misery as everyone else. Well, that's the whole point. I'm like, hey, I don't have to get married. But then I fell in love with someone. Of course. Of course. Hit it. Any groomzillas in that wedding?

No. Really? Speaking of the Daily Mail, I said that to the Daily Mail guys. I said, you guys called me a groomzilla. Oh, they did? Oh my gosh, yeah. I was a groomzilla in the wedding because it fits their thing. Do you know how much I had to do with the wedding? I showed up. That was it.

Tim was, Tim loves to plan. And also I know that Tim is a good planner. Right. And so I, whatever he said, I'm like, okay, that's fine. Okay. That's fine. He knows I had, I was starting a new show. We had just moved into an apartment. I was starting a production company. There was a big transition. There was a lot of tumult in my life. And so he said, you know, I will handle this. Right.

All I said was to him that may have been, and that's not even a groomzilla. It's like, this is costing a fucking lot of money. Right. And who doesn't do that? Right. Like keep the cost down. That's all I said. But I had the furthest thing from a groomzilla, but I'm a groomzilla because I guess that, you know, it gets quick. It fits their narrative. All right. So I've had it with that. Had it.

Listeners, you can find Don Lemon on YouTube. On YouTube, on the Don Lemon Show, on Spotify, on iHeartRadio, and on what's the other one? YouTube, Spotify, iHeartRadio. No, that's YouTube, Spotify, iHeartRadio. Excellent. And Apple. I am so happy that now I can put you back into bed with me. Thank you. I love Apple.

I love going to bed with you, even though I didn't know who I was going to bed with. You were going to bed with so many people every night. And now you're back. It's a little early for bedtime, but we like to go to bed early. I hope that this is the first date of many. Many dates. We've slept together so much. I would hope that, but I've had it with you guys. No, I'm kidding. Hit it. Hit it. We will hit Don Lemon. Hit Don Lemon. All right, listeners. Thank you. Pumps, tell them. We will see you next Tuesday or Thursday or both. I'll tell you what I've had it with.

Do you like drag? Do you like fragrance? Do you like frying the small fish? I'm Delta Work, a regionally celebrated drag queen and the host of Very Delta, a podcast for the woman whose social battery is on 10%, but her phone battery is fully charged. Each week I go off in my monologue about things that irk me before inviting my guests to chat on the couch with me. Past guests include Margaret Cho, Bob the Drag Queen, Orville Peck, Trixie Mattel, Katya, and more.

You can listen to VeryDelta wherever you get your podcasts and watch full video episodes every Monday on the Mom Podcast YouTube channel.