My Husband Wants Permission to Cheat
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Coming up on the Dr. John Deloney Show. My husband says that he wants to be able to see other people, but one-sided. Where does he go? I'm just trying to imagine him bringing this up at my house. Like, I don't understand how that conversation would go. What's his logic? He watches a lot of Andrew Tate. Oh, God. Okay. Well, there you go. What's up? This is John with the Dr. John Deloney Show. Man, I'm so glad that of all the gajillions of podcasts...

After you listen to the first four you've already listened to today, you picked this one for number five or maybe number six or maybe number one. So grateful to have you. This show, we talk about your marriage, your mental health, whatever you got going on in your life. Kids struggling, trying to figure out what's the next right step. What do we need to do next in a world that is overly TikTok'd?

Where they've got every answer to every question in four bite-sized little chunks that take about 30 seconds to flip and with a dance. By the way, if you want to see Kelly's TikTok dance channel, it's all unhinged. But on this show, we don't talk about that stuff. We actually sit with hurting people and we try to figure out what can we do.

Next, you want to be on the show? Give me a buzz at 1-844-693-3291, 1-844-693-3291, or go to johndeloney.com slash ask, A-S-K. All right, let's go out to Phoenix, Arizona and talk to Emma. Hey, Emma, what's up? Hi, how's it going? I'm doing great. How about you? Doing okay. Excellent. What's up?

So I have been married for three years, and my husband says that he wants to be able to see other people, but one-sided. And I'm not joking. Awesome. Man, you picked him. You sure picked him. Yeah. Where does he go?

I'm just trying to imagine even bringing this up at my house. Like, I don't understand how that conversation would go. What's his logic? He watches a lot of Andrew Tate. Oh, God. Okay. Well, there you go. Yeah. You super picked him. Yeah. Does he just eat red jelly beans for dinner every night and meat? Just red pills and meat. Pretty much, yeah. Sweet. Nailed it. Wow. Yeah.

Well, good luck with that, Emma. Thanks for the call. I'm just kidding. So, I mean, what's your question? My question is, do I hold out hope for this? No, no. Because, hey, I promise you, this is not the first thing that's made you feel uncomfortable or out of bounds, is it? No. No. What's the first thing? Or give me some examples of some other things.

Um, well, I guess a good way to look at it is if I'm some things like just if I've been at work, um, you know, it's like, there's always been before I knew this and Heather has been, um, you know, just anxiety, I guess, like worry. And I can't always pinpoint it, you know, like why, um, I felt uncertain and it's kind of because I think it's,

Maybe because he's never been 100%. And I know it sounds dumb, but it's hard when you've invested time into somebody and then they try to change the rules. Emma, I don't think the rules have ever changed. I think you've been a hood ornament since the day he met you. What do you mean by that? You're something he can show off. You're not two people creating a life together. That's the whole movement, right? You're an object that he's proud of.

And he has it. Yeah. And he puts it in a trophy case and no one else can see it or talk to it. And he's going to go out and get another trophy and another trophy and another trophy. And he's been doing that since you were married. He's just become more overt about it. Has he cheated on you before? Yeah. Of course. Now he just wants to cheat under the cover of you know it. Right. And I, not that I would ever believe,

be interested in, you know, having multiple people. But for principle's sake, you know, I said, okay, well, I will too. And it's like, no, men are different. And I... Yeah, men are different because they think they can get away with watching some internet videos and being like, yeah, that's how the world works. And then try to go do that. And I think what's been hard is I have, you know, done...

I, you know, I really have always believed in marriage and, um, you know, it was very serious for me. So it's been very challenging to kind of come to the terms of, wow, this wasn't what I thought it was. And then how do I give up? How do I let go? Hold on. It is what you thought it was. It isn't. Sorry. No, I'm telling you, it is what you thought it was. It is important and it is valuable. It's, it's, it's extraordinary. Yeah.

And it's hard and it's worth every weird, awkward, awful, heartbreaking second of it. It's just that the person you married doesn't think it's worth the toilet paper he wiped his butt with this morning. And so you think it's super valuable and somebody is like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I do. And they're not upholding their end of the bargain.

So here's the thing. I, I, I am out of the business. I will never be in the business of telling somebody unless they're in a highly abusive relationship. You have to get out now. So I won't let you off the hook with blaming me. You're going to have to make that choice for you. Yeah. Okay. You have to make a grownup choice. Is it going to suck? Yes. Is it going to break your heart? Yes. But your heart's already broken. It already sucks. I think that's,

Right. And so it's like, I, and this isn't art that I already don't know. Like I know, I've known I need to leave. Um, it's more, it's like, I'm scared of being alone and I just don't know how to like get over that. How old are you? I'm 30. Okay. You're fine. Yeah. Well, I said that like, if you give me a number, you're suddenly not fine. Um, this awesome guy that comes here and gets cookies every evening, he's probably in his late eighties or nineties. He just got married. So he's,

There's people out there. I don't think that's the true fear you have. What's the true fear? I think part of it's fear of being alone and not knowing what to do with myself and then him meeting someone else and being everything I wanted.

And then, you know, giving up. It's like the fear of regret. But I already know what's going on. Yeah, he's already left you. I mean, he's already left you. He's just in the same house. And he says he hasn't. You know, he said, oh, I'll never leave you. You know, you're good with me. And it's like, how could I feel good? So I just, yeah, it's the fear of... Why don't you think you're worth...

working on honoring like going to get a degree if you don't have one like get the like like why don't you think you're worth those things um because i i see you in your head you think okay i'm out of a toxic nonsense relationship i put everything into it and i believed in this thing and i guess the image you have in your head is you just sitting around so do you work now yeah i do okay i'm

I'm a nurse, so... Yeah, well, dude. So, I mean, you can do anything. You can take a travel contract and go see the country. Yeah. Or you can do absolutely nothing and stay right where you're in the situation you're in right now. You know what I mean? Yeah. And that's the hard part is I don't want to stay. And then when I've asked him...

Hey, we need to take a break. I need time to think. Can you go stay somewhere else? He says no. Basically, it's like Groundhog Day, and I feel like I'm... Whose home is it? It's ours. Okay. Well, as a part of a divorce settlement, you'll have to sell the house, or somebody's going to have to buy the other person out. Right. Yeah. You want this whole...

You want the car just to run out of gas on the side of the road and gently come to a stop. It's not going to. Okay. You're married to somebody who cares more about how they look, how they appear to the world and what they want. And they will stomp over the person they looked in the eye and said, I do for the rest of my life. Stomped all over you. And so there's no reason to think that this person is going to be rational or kind or respectful. And as this thing dissolves, this will be a big blow to his red pill ego.

Right? Right. Because you're his property. You're a trophy that goes in the case. Yeah. And it's, it's, I don't, I know the term like narcissism gets thrown around left and right. Like, but I, I think there is some of that going on as well. And I would say, who cares? Yeah. You're spending a lot of time trying to figure things out and you already, but you already know your answer. You already know your answer. Yeah. Right. I'm sorry. Yeah.

It's okay. It's been really difficult. I know. And it's not okay. Yeah. It's not okay. I'm old school, man. I believe in getting married and duking it out and figuring it out as long as you can. Yeah, there's fear that I won't fit just because of what I've been through. There's no good men out there. There is. I work with a whole bunch of them. A whole bunch of them. Yeah. I do. They're my friends. I know them. They treat their wives honorably.

They're goofy and they're into weird things and they smell funny and yada yada. They listen to bad music, but they're great guys. They're extraordinary. There's a whole bunch of them. And whatever led you to this particular person, if that's not something you want, then you're going to have to be intentional about seeking out different things in the dating process moving forward if you choose to do that again. Right? Yeah.

Right. Go for... Fast cars and muscles aren't going to be, can't be the choice again this time. And flashy things can't be the choice this time. Muscles are good. Having a stable job is good. Shiny things are nice, but they can't lead the way, right? Right. They fade. And, you know, there's not the security that, you know, I would need. That's right. Yeah.

I'm sorry, Emma. I'm sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry. I wish I had some like better, I wish I had some better like ta-da for you. This one's on you. You got to make the call. What you're going to do next? Call anytime. It's going to be hard. And it's going to be, if you ever feel unsafe, make sure you've got people in your corner that you can walk alongside. Often people like this don't like to give up their quote unquote property or their ego, their respect. They don't like to, they want it all.

It doesn't matter who they're going to hurt in the path towards getting whatever it is they want. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I wish you peace, peace, peace in whatever you do next. We'll be right back. I cannot shut up about my Helix mattresses. My sister is staying with me this week, and she came down looking this morning like she just woke up from a coma. And her first question was, what in the world is that mattress? And I sang it to her, Helix.

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Go to helixsleep.com slash Deloney. That's helixsleep, H-E-L-I-X-S-L-E-E-P dot com slash Deloney. This offer won't last long, so go right now. Because with Helix Sleep, better sleep starts now. All right, what's up? Let's go back to Eugene, Oregon and talk to Kayla. Kayla, what's up, Kayla? Hey, Dr. John. How are you today? I'm good. How about you?

Not bad. I can't complain. You could complain, but then you'd be like, Kelly, all the time. So what's up? What's up? Oh, okay. So my mother-in-law believes in some out there conspiracy theories. And ultimately, I'm wanting to foster a good relationship between her and my four kids. But also, I want to help my husband stand firm with boundaries. And I want to know how I can be

Good at that role. What kind of conspiracy theories? Are they the good ones or are they way out there good ones? Yeah, kind of out there. Like everything from Flat Earth. Duh. Continue. But then we get into some that make my heart hurt. Like Jewish people are nefariously owning everything. And...

That's less of a conspiracy theory, more just like a bigoted way to see the world. Yeah, yeah. And, you know, there's weird ones like viruses don't exist. And it's hard to have those conversations with her. And if you disagree with her, she gets really defensive and angry. Yes. So I have a rule that I only talk to people that when I can only speak when I can be heard.

And I've got, I joke, like my friend Rachel Cruz here, my closest buddy's here, she believes, like doesn't really believe in the moon landing. She's not a flat earther, but like big foot, like all into these wild things, right? But she's good natured about it and we laugh about it and we poke fun at each other. And I think conspiracy theories on the whole are a way that people sometimes try to make sense of a world that feels out of control.

If every dot is connected behind the curtain, then there's a clockmaker back there somewhere. And so it will feel good. You're talking about bigotry and you're talking about health safety. You're talking about madness. Yeah. And an inability to have a conversation about it.

I don't want my kids around that crap. Yeah. You know what I mean? But I don't want to withhold them. She is choosing to have them not around. You're choosing to keep your kids safe. She is choosing to not have her kids around. I mean, it's as simple as that. You wouldn't say, I don't want my kids to go out in traffic because, you know what I mean? It doesn't matter what I say next. You just don't want your kids playing traffic. I don't want my kids around somebody like that.

And by the way, I would let my kids stay with, I have let my kids stay with Rachel Cruz all day long. Right. It's not about, it's not about, um, uh, some beliefs go too far for me, but it's not about that. It's about being able to have a conversation, be able to laugh and being able to like, okay, and now I'm going to teach you. And does she try to talk to your kids about this stuff?

Mostly my eldest son. He's on the spectrum and he loves outer space science. And anytime he tries to talk to her about his newest favorite obsession, which has been the Kuiper belts of all things, shuts him down the Kuiper belt. Yeah. That's one of, that's one of, uh,

Audio Joe's his favorites. He's huge Kuiper belt fan. I'm just kidding. I don't know what that is. But it just, she shuts him down. Like, that's just a lie. That's fake. Don't talk about it. And it just, it hurts him when he's trying to have a conversation with his grandma. I hate that for him. Where's your husband in all of this?

very, very frustrated. Yeah. And he's the one who has the harder conversations because I believe that you deal with your people and I'll deal with my people when they're kind of being weird. I agree with that. So he's just increasingly frustrated and heart sick about it. That's it, yeah. And we're just

He works a lot and he actually works with them because it's a family run business. And so we're just kind of forced to be in it. So I'll challenge you on that. At some point you, I have chosen over my career to not be around certain people with certain beliefs. I've left. Sure. And I've chosen other opportunities.

And I know that's hard and heart sick. I love that you said that. That's, that's, I mean, he's grieving this thing. He had this picture of how this was all going to work out. He's going to have four amazing kids and I'm an awesome family business and yada, yada, yada. And his mom's increasingly saying wilder and wilder things. And now she's getting into highly offensive, highly illogical, highly unsafe language. And now she's trying to teach my kids. Yeah. Right. So you, you, you,

don't have a choice if you continue to take a paycheck from them and they continue to be the boss, then they run your life. Yeah. And at some point, he's got to choose, I want peace for my family, I want peace for my home. It's going to cost me something. That sucks. I hate that. I'm going to grieve it like crazy. Mm-hmm. Grieve it like crazy. Yeah, I think we already kind of sensed that coming. Yeah. So here's what I recommend. The earlier y'all can decide to make some hard choices,

before it turns into a car wreck, you're still going to be stuck in traffic for a while, but at least you're not going to be sitting on the side of the road with a car all smashed up. Just the idea that you would take away space from a 12-year-old on the spectrum, it's just almost borderline evil. It's just mean. You know what I mean? It's just mean. It's not helpful or useful. It's just mean. It's an older adult flexing on a kid. Why would you do that? Yeah. Why would you do that?

Right. And so I don't, yeah, I don't know, man. I don't have anything nice to say. Um, so my mom told me to just keep my mouth shut, but yeah, I mean you and your husband got to sit down and make some hard calls. Um, if it's my house and my mom was saying nonsense, stuff like that, um, I'd be looking and I worked for a family business. I'd be looking for work elsewhere. That's just what I would do in my house.

And I would be pretty clear with my mom and my dad, if you're going to make these statements, these generalized statements about entire races and groups of people or religious groups, or if you're going to completely deny any sort of scientific reality, I can't have my kids stay with you. I can't have my kids around you. If you're going to talk this way, they can't be here. Yeah. And your grandparent, I mean, your in-laws, they get to make the final choice as to whether your kids are over there or not. And they have a relationship with them.

And if they choose their theories and their nonsense and their joy busting and their bigotry over having a relationship with their kids, that's a heartbreaking choice that y'all are going to have to grieve. It sucks. Yeah. But it's reality. Yeah, I get it. And there's too many people. There's too many awesome people at your local church. There's too many awesome older folks. Yeah.

My son does this thing with, I don't know how it works through a school, but they do something with old folks. So I'm like, there's some amazing people that would talk to your son till the cows come home about the whatever, whatever Orion's belt thing that you talked about. Like that would just let him talk about science and run with it and make eye contact and be engaged. Right. And that's what that kid deserves and needs. Yeah.

Yeah. You know what I mean? He, yeah, we, we do go to a local church here and he does have that with some older, older people. Invite them over to your house for a meal. Invite them over. Let them see what that looks like. And, and I know it's heartbreaking, but invite them over. Um, and at some point,

Hopefully sooner rather than later, your husband's got to make a hard call, hard decision. And yes, I agree with you. That's his call to make. Those are his parents. That's his call to make. And good on him. We've had multiple calls over the years on this show where husbands are too cowardly to address their own moms. And so their wives have to take it on and it becomes a disaster. Yeah, you're going to have to make some pretty significant life changes. I hate that for you. But bigotry has got no place in my house. It just doesn't.

Everybody, everybody's welcome at the Delaney house. That's how it's going to be. And I might make, make mistakes going full steam ahead, but I'm going to make mistakes when it comes to health and safety. I'm not listening to some Yahoo on a YouTube channel. It's got 12 followers. He's in the trunk of his car somewhere in the Mojave desert telling us things that we really know. Right. I'm just not going to do that.

I'm not gonna do that. And here's the deal. If I find out when I'm 85 that all of science was, I mean, all of this space was faked. What if it was all faked? None of it's real. None of it's real. NASA is a huge front for a weapon system. It's going to bring the one world government, whatever. And bring Bigfoot back to life so he can ride on a sloth or I don't know, not a sloth. What are those big elephant things? Mr. Snuffleupagus. What were those things?

Like woolly mammoth? Woolly mammoth, not a sloth. A woolly mammoth, I don't know. I'm just trying to, you know what? I'll go like, man, missed that one when I'm 80. I'm not going to live my life like that every day. I got a couple of little kids that I love too much and I want their imaginations to absolutely stone run wild. People need to get off the internets unless you're listening to this show. I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. Kayla, we'll be right back. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp.

So my wife and I were meeting the other day about the back-to-school madness that is about to be on us. We've got my travel schedule, her work schedule, our daughter's new school and clothes and forms to fill out and all these online portals and my son's sports schedule and he's got to have shoes every two weeks because his feet won't stop growing and how are we going to pay for all this and on and on and on.

And when we step back and look at our schedule, it's so packed and we haven't even put in the things like exercise, date nights, counseling appointments, church and holiday trips and big home projects. And these are the things that make life worth living. And I listened to y'all. This is your life too. And here's what I've learned. When it comes to taking care of me, my family and my work, I have to begin with the things that matter most and the things that keep me well and whole so I can wade into the chaos and be sturdy and present and strong.

you too. So as you're planning your upcoming end of summer and fall plans, make sure you don't skip date nights, don't skip regular exercise, and don't skip your regular therapy appointments. Yes, therapy can be hard work, but can also help make the rest of your life possible.

When it comes to therapy, I want you to consider calling the team at BetterHelp. BetterHelp is 100% online therapy staffed with licensed therapists. It's convenient, it's flexible, and it's suited to fit your schedule.

With a good therapist, you can learn things like positive coping skills, how to set boundaries, how to deal with all the chaos going on in your life, and how to be the best version of yourself. In this upcoming season, make sure you put on your oxygen mask first. Never skip therapy day. Call my friends at BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com slash deloney today to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp, H-E-L-P dot com slash deloney.

All right, let's go out to the City of Angels, Los Angeles, California, and talk to Nora. Hey, Nora. Yes, Nora. What's up? I know that's not your real name, but yes, Nora. Hey, sounds good. Sounds good. So what's up?

Hey, Dr. John. Super excited and quite a bit nervous to be talking to you. So anyway, I'm a little scared of what harsh realities you might have for me. Yeah.

But in the same breath, I need someone to be brutally honest. So I really appreciate that you're taking my call today. I kind of lied to the last caller a little bit, so I'm going to hedge it a little bit. I didn't lie, but I wasn't as mean as I could have been. So I will put on my brutally honest hat. All right, let's do this. All right. I appreciate it. So I married my boyfriend of about two years in February, and I hate to say it, I did it for immigration reasons. Okay.

Don't know if you can pick up my accent. I am not from the U.S. I thought you were from Nebraska. Right? I know. Everyone says, you are from the South, right? And I'm like, I am. Fantastic. Really, really far South. Way, way, way far South. Awesome. Really, really far South. Wait a minute. Hold on. Our immigration policy and process here is like...

Clean as a whistle. Yeah, it's just smooth and simple. Everybody's on the same page. I know I hate to do this, but... It's amazing. I know, right? Amazing. You know, I've been here over 12 years, and they're like, come on in. Please stay. Please stay. Oh, my gosh. I'm so sorry. All right, so you've been here 12 years. You married this guy, and I'm assuming it's not going great.

It is not going great. It is going terribly. How come? We fight all the time. And this is before marriage. And our lawyer, who is wonderful, obviously we didn't say, hey, we fight all the time. Should we get married? She's like, great idea. She obviously gave us all our options, said, look, this is the best one. We were like, great idea. Let's do it. Anyway, we do. We fight all the time. Every other week, probably.

um, at a minimum and it's just toxic. It's so unhealthy. And I, I don't know what to do because if we divorce, I'm, I'm done. Everything I've built, my friends, my, my business, everything, I, I'm done. I, I go home with my tail between my legs and I have to start again. And it's not even a tail between my legs. It's,

This is now my home. Everyone's like, do you miss home? And I'm like, yeah, sure, I do. But I've built my whole life here. I graduated college and came here. And it's not even that. I love him too. So why do y'all... This is going to sound like a strange question, and I'm choosing my words carefully. Why do y'all choose fighting? I don't know. I don't know. We don't communicate. That is something we have...

We both know we don't do. Hold on, hold on, hold on. Why do you choose to not communicate? We've discovered that we are afraid of each other. So we both have a lot of past trauma. And something I've learned from listening to your show is

the GPS pins. And we definitely do that to each other. He has a pin on me from past trauma and I have a pin on him. I'm like, you're going to do what all these people in my past have done to me. And he's like, you're going to do all the things that these people in my past have done to me rather than going, Hey, maybe I should trust you. And, and maybe you're not going to do that, but we don't give each other the opportunity. Okay. But you hear that though.

All of these things. Your nervous system is not a choice. It's working behind the scenes day and night to save your life. But everything after that, y'all are choosing. What are you scared of? Me personally, I'm scared of being abandoned. That's my past. And so you're going to fight and scratch and claw until he abandons you and you go, yep, told you. I knew it. Why? Yeah. Why would you do that? I don't know. I know I'm making it sound so simple and I know it's not, but like...

Just come up 30,000 feet above this with me. Like, why are you choosing this? I don't know. And honestly, I do. And, and you will not be surprised when I tell you every time we fight, I'm out. I run every time. Why? And his, his, his issue is, um, what's, what's his issue?

He was lied to by his family up until he's in his 40s. And up until about five years ago, he found out that his dad is not his dad. Good gosh. So everything he knows is a lie, right? It's not, but that's the way it feels. Yeah. And so he does not like lying, obviously. So if I even give a mistruth, like I'm wearing blue socks and they're actually black. He's like, you lied to me. Yeah. But that's his nervous system. Yeah. That's his body going to war. It's fight or fly instant. Mm-hmm.

Yeah, like I I'm making it sound so trite and I know that okay i'm doing that on purpose We don't have a ton of time together But yeah, if you call and say this dude is super abusive or I hate this guy. I did this just for this I hate the guy. I don't like being around him. His breath is terrible. He's gross. He's he's an awful Like romantic he's just he's the worst. Um, I would tell you yeah, you got some really hard choices ahead but let's take take

In a way, it's going to sound awful. In a way, I'm kind of glad you have this huge cliff in front of you because it's making you think twice about abandoning this relationship. Because I think you actually do like this guy. I do. I love him to death. Now, that's just what people say about their puppies. Yeah. I love it to death. I think you actually like this guy. I do.

I don't think you'd be calling if you didn't. And you're too wise. You're smart, but you're wise. And I think he likes you too, huh? Yeah. Yeah. And so it's not uncommon to be married. Y'all, what, nine months in, 10 months in now? Oh, no, I'm sorry. Four or five, huh? Four. Four months in, yeah. Okay. What does it look like to sit down from each other and say, okay, we can't keep doing this? One or both of us are going to have to risk getting hurt really bad and say, I love you. I'm going to stop fighting.

Is that possible? He's 40. How old are you? I'm almost 40. He's in his mid-40s. Y'all have been living by yourselves for a long time, right? Y'all are pretty independent people. From my perspective, it feels like something y'all could figure out and choose. I'm going to choose healing. I'm going to choose the discomfort instead of choosing to run and fight and scratch and claw and push people away and then point at them and go, see, I told you. I knew you would do this.

It's just, I mean, you got to choose your heart here. Yeah. And you can choose hard, like figuring out how to find a new life in a new country, a new old country and let everything go or choose hard. Like I'm going to choose to be relationally vulnerable. It's going to scare me to freaking death.

But I, for whatever reason I did it, I said, I do now here. Like I haven't looked at the data in a couple of years. And so I'm, I'm talking about old data, but the last time I took a cursory look at it, arranged marriages do as well or a little bit better as marriages that are for quote unquote romance, romance and ooey gooey. People just choose we're married. We're just gonna figure this out.

So I've got a ton of hope for you guys if y'all both sat down like adults and said, all right, I'm going to quit fighting. We're acting like children because our nervous systems are still children. And I will never, ever, ever lie to you again. Ever. Yeah. And I will never run from an argument ever again. Yeah. Here's what I want. Here's what I need. Yeah.

And it's interesting you say that we tried to talk yesterday and it started off as two children fighting and it ended as two adults. And it was probably the best argument, quote unquote, we've had. And I did. I said that. I was like, we are acting like...

We're acting like children fighting and we are, you know, I'm nearly in my 40s. You are in your 40s and this is ridiculous. And you're both asking the same childhood question that haunts us all. Now that you see all of me, do you still love me? Mm-hmm. And when your body gets asked that question, you haul ass out of there. And when his body gets asked that question, he's like, I'm untethered to everything. My dad's not even my dad. Mm-hmm.

And so you'll have to know that. That's a 17-year-old or 16-year-old response to that question is to run and hide and pout and be mad and withhold and be angry and all those things. That's a normal 17-year-old response. It's not a 40-year-old response. 40-year-old response says, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, I'm putting both hands on the table and my body feels super scared right now. Are you in this with me? Yes. Okay, give me one second. I'm going to breathe through this and we're going to keep going. Yeah. All right, and we're going to keep going.

Yeah. I mean, and so as I'm saying this out loud, does the thought of this give you peace or is the thought of this like, ugh? No, it gives me so much peace. Like my heart rate has just come down. Okay. What if you have to go first? Yeah. And here's the deal. Here's what sucks about this. The great Esther Perel says this, all relationship, whether you've been married for four months, you've been married for 45 years, every morning you get up and you present yourself to somebody else hoping that they still love you.

Yeah. It's a risk. And so you can sit down tonight and say, okay, I talked to this moron on a podcast and here's what, here's like what I want to try. This part is hard living every day. Like we're in tension, like we're fighting, we're scratching and clawing. This is hard. And both of us choosing that we love each other and we are going to gently and quietly and sometimes vigorously figure this thing out. Will you do that with me? Yeah.

I think that sounds amazing. He can look at you and say, screw you, I quit. He can do that. Yeah. Right? Yeah. And the worst case scenario is you have to pack up and move. And it's already, already the worst case scenario is already the worst case scenario. All right. Okay. Let me ask, let me flip this around. How's the romance? It's actually pretty good. Pretty good or like we're 40 and we still got it. Oh no, we're 40 and we still got it. Okay. That's what I'm talking about. There's still passion there, right? Yeah. Yes.

Yeah. What do you do for a living? Give me a roundabout. I'm in the medical field. Okay. What about him? He runs his own business. Okay. In construction. He's successful? Yeah. You're successful? Yeah. All right. You got two highly successful, highly opinionated alphas sitting down and their 14-year-olds are running the show. Stop. Fair? Yeah. Yeah. And I also want you to make space for that 14-year-old that's still scared to death of getting a heartbroken. And I want him to make space for that 14-year-old

39 year old that just found out his dad's not his real dad. I made the call yesterday to my wife on the way to work. I am sorry that I just acted like a child and I took out my shame as a husband. I was late, late, late, late so much so that my wife started grabbing her purse and grabbing her shoes to take my son to school. I was beyond normal John late. And then I got ashamed and I was like, what are you doing? And she was like, I'm taking him to school. I was like, I'm going to...

And then on the way to work, I called and said, I'm so sorry. That's my biggest, like, I suck as a grownup because I'm late everywhere. And it just is embarrassing to me that you're about to blow your whole morning to take him 40 minutes out of the way. And she laughed and said, I forgive you. I said, I'm still growing. That's going to still happen. It's still part of it. Yeah. And I hate to say it's good to hear that other people, you know, that seem so perfect on the outside have... Me? Yeah.

Nora, you could have listened to the show twice to know how perfect there is. There is. No, man. I am super fun to be married to and I am a nightmare to be married to. Yeah. Right? And so it's both and. Everyone is. Everyone's got their stuff. Yeah. But I think it's just deciding like, hey, we can make a choice. Yep. Our bodies are going to take off on us and our bodies are going to go to fight or flight. They're going to try to protect us at all costs.

But we can make a choice as to what to do next. And I'm always going to choose you. And I'm always going to choose honesty. And I'm never going to run from you. And I need you, honey. Yes, you found out a bombshell. I need you to go to counseling and work through that. And not everything in your life was a lie. Not everything in your life wasn't true. I'm here. I'm not a lie. And yeah, a little bit shady about why we got married, but we're going to make the sucker run. Yeah. Is that fair?

Yeah. And he does, he goes to therapy, but he did tell me a while ago that he isn't always honest with her. And I don't know what that means. So dumb. Tell him to stop wasting his money. Tell him just to mail the money to me and I'll buy some cool like hunting gear with it. I'll make it way better use. I said that too. I was like, why are you wasting money? Or she only costs $15 because of his insurance. I was like, oh my God, I can't win this argument. Like, geez, whatever. But you know, and a long time ago, probably a year now, we had an argument about

him saying that he wasn't mad at his mother, his parents about the whole lie. And finally, one day it like, this is the year ago it, he broke down and he did admit that he was very angry. And I was like, finally, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. What did you win? Well, not, I didn't win. In your guts, you needed to win that exchange. Cause you know, what did you win?

Just that I needed him to admit that he did. Why did you need that? Because he kept on saying that like. Why did you need that? I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Of course you're, of course you're right. Of course. A hundred percent you're right. But why did you, why did you need to win that exchange?

I wanted him to understand that keeping it inside or just feel that keeping it inside was killing him. It is, it is. It was killing him. Okay, so you can fight him or you can say, you can put one hand on the back of his neck and one hand on the side of his face. And by the way, that calms the nervous system. Okay. And you can say, I love you. And I don't see a possible way in the world that if somebody did that to me that I wouldn't be enraged.

I also know that's scary to say out loud. I love you. And never forget, secrets will kill you. I'm always a safe place. And you walk away. Because it's not an exchange. If you, like, you versus him and you win, you both lose. Yeah, that's true. And so, like, I'm not going to fight you. On that one, I know I'm right. I know I'm right. And I'm going to be here whenever you're ready. And eventually he was ready. He just had to take a loss for it. And so he's got to make up for that loss somewhere else.

The same as at his company when the pipe comes in more expensive, he's got to make cuts over here on the wood, right? He's got to figure it out how to balance the sheet. I'm balancing the sheet with my wife. We're on the same team. Yeah, that's true. Is that fair? And you're right because I felt guilty afterwards. Like it's, you know, it's like having siblings and you...

you take something from them and you know, when you're a kid and you're like, ha ha, I got the red crayon. And then you're like, that doesn't feel as good as I thought it was going to. Exactly. And if you're like most of us, you make him feel bad for making you feel guilty. Yeah. Don't do that. All of these are grownup choices. All of them. Yeah. I, here's what, here's what my hope is. My, my, my most sincere hope. I hope you and him call on your one year anniversary.

Okay. And we will, we will cheer. We'll cheer the crap out of it. We will, we'll celebrate you so big. It'll be amazing. Okay. Or better yet come to Nashville. How about this? Better yet. Better yet. Okay. You can be my guest at the money and marriage event in Nashville, Tennessee in October. Be my guest. I'll pay, I'll pay for your tickets. Oh my God. That would be amazing. Y'all got to come down, but, uh, I'll pay for your tickets. All right.

Is that on? Stay on the line. We're going to get your number if you want to stay. It's completely sold out. We'll find somewhere in the building for you. I even try to get my friends and they're like, yeah, we have no... But we'll get you in the building. You're in if you all want to come down to Nashville. And y'all are wealthy enough you can afford it. And you can come down and it'll be a blast. You're amazing, Dr. John. Thank you so much. I really appreciate you. In six months, we're going to have a celebration on this show for your one-year anniversary. If you choose to stay.

And for everybody listening, it does sound like I tried to pressure them to stay. I'm biased, 100%. And that pressure came from, I believe, in her guts that she wants to figure this thing out. Not just because she doesn't want to get deported. She wants to figure this out because I think she actually likes this guy. I think he might be actually worth the fight to figure it all out. It's going to be hard. You've got two adults who are entrenched and successful, and they've been doing their life their way for a long time. I think they can figure it out. Man, what a story this will be.

What a story this will be. Thanks for the call, Nora. You're rad. We'll be right back.

I want you to join us here in Nashville for this amazing event. Married couples know that time that is quality spent, time together is so important, but it's impossible to prioritize. And that's why this getaway is so important. It's a long weekend away for the two of you to intentionally focus on each other and on the marriage you are building together.

By the time you go home, you'll walk away with new tools to not just talk about, but to actually utilize. You're going to learn how to communicate. You're going to strengthen your sex and intimacy, and you're going to deepen your connection with each other. Plus, you're going to take part in a bunch of Q&A sessions with me and Rachel Cruz, where we will give you real-life answers to your tough questions.

There are a few VIP tickets left up for grabs that include a meet and greet with me and Rachel Cruz. And we are so jazzed to meet you all in person. There's not many tickets left, so don't wait. Please don't wait. Please come. Go to RamseySolutions.com slash getaway to get your tickets. That's RamseySolutions.com slash getaway. All right, we are back. Hey, it's Kelly's birthday. Woo!

Thank you. This is a big one. It is a big one. It's like a big one. Like we put new parking stripes out there for your walker and we're so excited. You can roll right up to the studio now. That's so good. It is a big one. It's the big 5-0. Your husband kissed a 50-year-old lady this morning. Yeah, but he's 59, so he's pretty dang lucky. Well played. Well played. Ew. You've kissed a 50-year-old man before? Well, no.

Yeah, because I'm 50. We should just stop that. It's going to get off. You and I are going to get off the rails quick. It's going to get real bad real fast. Well, so what are you doing for your birthday?

So, he was going to make dinner tonight, but he's home sick, so I told him please not to. That's such a man thing. I know. It's so good. What a good move. But we've got some friends going out on Saturday night. We went to lunch on Sunday, and then we've got some friends going out dancing on Saturday night. I will truly feel my age on Sunday morning. Oh, for sure. 100%. You and both of your new hips. Uh-huh. And my knees. Yes. Shoulder. Dang, dude.

Well, congratulations on making 50. I bet your childhood liver didn't think you'd make it this far. So congratulations. My childhood liver? Your college liver. College, that's fair. Your college liver is like, we're not going to do 50. Yeah, probably not. We made it. Here we are. Yeah. Congratulations. Thank you. Awesome. Okay, so what do we got? We have an Am I the Problem. Okay, Am I the Problem. All right, this is from Tracy in Alabama.

Am I the problem for asking my mom to include me or to go through me when making plans with my preteen kids? Yes, yes, yes, yes, and yes, and yes, and yes. We have a kid's cell phone that they are allowed to use to text a limited number of people on. She will text them on that phone regarding activities and then expect the kids to talk to me. No. But I am requesting that she contact me as well. She says I'm trying to put rules on her and that I'm being difficult. Am I the problem? I would...

Tell her if this happens again, i'm gonna block you. Is that her mom or her mother-in-law? Her mom Yeah, if it's my mom, I would say mom if you ask my kids for I can't even do this My mom is so respectful like respectful of our boundaries and we got some crazy ones But like yeah, i'm gonna block you. You can't text my kids or preteens. Good gosh. What? That's so insane Parents stop being insane. I don't have words for that. Good grief

What about you? What do you think, Kelly? Oh, I 100% agree with you on that one. Give me some of your ancient wisdom. Chip it into a tablet for us. Seriously. Y'all hear this. This is what I deal with all day long. No, I think you're right because it's one thing if grandma texts the kids, hi, I love you. Of course. Yeah, because my kids have done that with their grandparents. Mine too. But I could not imagine my in-laws, I don't have my parents anymore, but they would never have done that if they would have said...

Oh, we're going to go here. Hey, they don't know what we have planned. They don't know what it's just. No, my parents don't ask me to plan things. They go straight to my wife because they know you're, you're, I mean, I've met your parents and your mother. I know. Knows you. Exactly. She would not. And I'm far beyond preaching. Like I just, it's such a power move.

Like, I'm going to take over the raising of these kids. It's so gross. I hate it. I hate it. I hate it. Let me put it this way. Nobody should be texting your children. No adult should be texting your children other than in-laws.

And maybe somebody, I'm going to say no. Even like my buddy, I've, Hank's got a mentor that I, a guy that I just adore and love. He texts me. He CCs me when he texts my son because it's inappropriate for an adult to text kids. All these stupid apps that coaches have, like you have to texting your kid. No, no adults are texting my kids. That's insane. And

If it's your parent, at some point they cross a line and they become just like every other adult if they don't abide by your boundaries. It's madness.

The only exception we have is my son goes to the beach with my sister-in-law every year. And every year he goes. But, I mean, he's also, you know, he's 18. He's 18. Yeah, yeah. But, I mean, she'll text him, hey, here's the dates we're going this year so that he can ask off for work. Sure. And he can make a plan. And then she always lets me know, hey, I told Nathan here's the dates. You know why? Because she's a functioning adult. Right. So, yeah. Oh, my gosh. Lord, take the phones away. All of them.

Bring us the box back on the wall with the squiggly little cord attached to it. Please, please. Oh, geez. Help us all. Love you guys. Bye.