Ep 231 | Kirk Cameron: Christians CAN Save This Country | The Glenn Beck Podcast
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Find the detail that moves you with immersive dining experiences from Sapphire Reserve. Chase, make more of what's yours. Learn more at chase.com slash sapphirereserve. Cards issued by JPMorgan Chase Bank and a member of FDIC. Subject to credit approval. And now, a Blaze Media podcast. My guest on today's podcast had to put on a bulletproof vest to read a book about God to children in a public library in America. In fact, our nation's capital.

Even still, he is hopeful that the challenges our nation faces today may be a divine setup for a spiritual comeback. You are in for an amazing conversation with the 2024 election looming. He has perspective and it's a heavenly perspective because it's full of hope. But it's real hope about America's destiny, but also yours personally.

Please welcome a man you know from multiple films and most certainly from the hit sitcom Growing Pains, the author of many books, his latest Born to be Brave. Welcome to the Glenn Beck podcast, Kirk Cameron.

First, before we get to Kirk, I want to tell you about the glasses that I have. I'm not wearing them today. I don't have a lot to read. I know we're going to be just having a conversation, but they're the best I've ever worn. They are called Rodenstock biometric intelligent glasses. They are available exclusively in the United States through better spectacles. Now, like progressive policies, a lot of progressive lenses don't work.

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Freshly made ravioli or hand-pulled ramen noodles. When you dine with Chase Sapphire Reserve, either will be amazing because it's the choice between a front row seat at the chef's table while getting a live demo of how to make ravioli or dining family style as you hear the story behind your ramen broth. This weekend, it's ravioli. Next weekend, ramen.

Find the detail that moves you with immersive dining experiences from Sapphire Reserve. Chase, make more of what's yours. Learn more at chase.com slash sapphirereserve. Cards issued by JPMorgan Chase Bank and a member of FDIC. Subject to credit approval. So you had to wear a bulletproof vest?

At a library? I debated whether or not to put that out there so that now people know. The next time I show up at a library. Yeah, I did. Because we've had so many stories in the media and people in the entertainment industry who just had the crazy show up. And...

I typically get kind of close to people to say hi and how are you? Because they're moms and they're dads and they're kids. And sure enough, we had people with backpacks full of things they should not have in lines. And so, yeah, we had the detail of the executive protection crews and the police were there at these places. How weird is that, that you were reading a book about the Holy Spirit and you have to wear a bulletproof vest? Yeah, that's right. That's right, because...

The, I mean, the way I look at it as the opposition is not playing around. They're serious as a heart attack about capturing the future.

and controlling and centralizing the power. And the biggest threat to that is Christianity and its application to the family and to all of culture. So they just can't have it. So Christians need to understand this isn't just a, you know,

Let's just have a good time, sing some church songs and look forward to heaven. This is a real battle here on earth. Yeah. The days of us just gathering with a guitar in our church and singing and then going home. Those are those are coming to a quick end. I mean, you still celebrate and everything else. But being a Christian in the future in America is going to come with penalties, I think.

Or could. Yes. Yes. I think so. And that often is the bravery, courage, character training that I think...

we as humans benefit from. I'm not wishing war or persecution on anybody. However, I know that it's always during the difficult, challenging times of my life professionally, personally, in my marriage or in my career, that is where my convictions are formed. It's where I realize my mistakes, my eyes open up and I go, what the hell am I doing? I've got to change this. I'm going to put my trust somewhere else. My strategy is going to be different. And

I think that these kinds of trials and challenges are actually good for us. I do too. Even if, you know, I want to talk about politics later, but even if the election doesn't go the way I hope it does, it's going to be good for us. Whatever it is that we're supposed to go through is going to put us exactly where we need to be. And I've lived exactly the same thing. I don't change when everything is going well.

I humble myself. I ask questions. What have I done? What have I done to cause these things? How can I change and return back to basic principles that are universal principles? And I feel that kind of happening. I mean, look at the hurricanes.

People are turning back to each other and back to first principles. You know, what's happening in Asheville and North Carolina and Georgia and Tennessee is really pretty miraculous. We haven't seen this kind of coming together, I think, since...

9-11. Just thinking that too. Yeah. We were speaking just a moment ago to the gentleman here and I've got a buddy who's up there who's got a group of volunteer men who have finally felt like they've got a bigger mission than the mini missions that they receive at their church or whatever.

at their job or whatever. And they feel like they're helping to rescue and rebuild and renew people's lives and their families. And I think that's what all of us want to be about. I think, I think having a sense of vision and mission is super important. I know that's what drives you. That's why, that's why Mercury studios exists. It's why you're doing all the different network things that you do is that you want to make an impact and a difference. And I think that, uh,

When times, when hurricanes like this happen, when, when nine 11s happen, when other things happen, when marriages begin to collapse, this then focuses us. It turns our heart to the source of our hope. And when we capture a vision of victory and we lean in to that, that, that courage that we can have knowing that there's a superintending hand working it all for good. I think that's when life gets exciting. Yeah. I think it's a,

Even if you don't, I happen to believe that we may be living in times. I know people have always said that, but that doesn't scare me. That excites me for one. But even if, even if, if not, what a privilege to live at this time, because especially if you're awake, because it's pushing you up against the wall. It's challenging everything that you believe. And if you don't,

Look away from it and you just deal with it. You become a much stronger, much better person. Yeah. You know, that that is incredible. And if it is the the end times, it's given me more of a motivation to spend the rest of my life building the kingdom. Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. Wow. What a what a cool thing. Prepare the way.

Has always been like, yeah, well, that's kind of distant. It's not. It's not. We should have been living this way the whole time. And we should continue living this way. But for me, at least, it has a new kind of...

Yeah. Does that make sense? Yeah, it does. It does make sense. And, and by, by the way, this is, I'm a little ADD at the moment. I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm kind of a bit of a fan here. I'm, I'm, I'm kind of knocked out that I'm on your show and we're talking about this stuff with you. No, well, you, you, you are a, a, a veritable giant in the space. And, and so I'm, I'm grateful to be here and I get to engage with you on this kind of stuff. I,

I agree with what you're saying. End times, that'd be a whole fun other subject. I rather think that the old covenant era was wrapping up and that whole world was coming to an end and that the new is beginning. It's a new dispensation at least. Rather than a new planet is coming. So we could talk about that later. That would be fun. And all my Christian evangelical friends will scream at me for my fringy beliefs.

And nobody's going to know the time, but if it does happen, we shouldn't be afraid of it. It's great. Well, I agree with you saying what you're saying about the perspective. There's a quote in the Lord of the Rings by Gandalf the gray. And he's saying to Frodo, who is terrified about the things happening to him. And there's so many good. I wonder if this is the one. And yeah,

He was talking about the evil and Frodo's, I wish this wasn't happening. And Frodo is like, yeah, nobody wants this stuff to happen, but we're not in control of that. And then he said this, he said, other evils there are that shall come for even Sauron himself is but an emissary or a servant. But it is not our task to master all the tides of the world, but rather to do what is in us for the help of those years wherein we have been set.

Uprooting the evil in the fields we know so that those who live after us will have clean earth to till. What weather they shall have is not ours to rule. I love that because these are the very moments that have been decreed for you and I to be on this planet and every mom and dad and grandparent and young person to stand on the stage of the world and do everything in you to uproot evil and plant seeds of truth, beauty, goodness, strength, honor, glory.

virtue, so that God is honored and that those who live after us will have a world to build on. I know there are really good people that have lived their life that whole way, but I haven't lived my whole life that way. You know what I mean? It took, you know, it's taken a long journey, but again, I just feel like I am more focused than ever. I don't think my generation is going to be the one to solve it.

I just know I have to do what I'm supposed to do right now. And how that turns out, whether that, I don't know what that is. I just know, Billy Graham told me one time,

I said, "Where's the next you, Billy?" And he was so great. Did you know him? - I've met him. - Okay. - When he got his star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame. - Okay, so Billy Graham with a Walk of Fame star. So he said, "God's tired of giving people like me credit."

He said, I've taken the credit. Believe me, anything good that I've been involved with in my life was his work. Anything bad was my work. And he said, but God isn't looking for a star this time. He is looking for...

for every single person just to listen to his voice and he's going to ask everybody to do something it could be very very little in fact most people will dismiss it as well that's not going to change anything why would i do that yeah he said but those who are faithful will do just that nothing more nothing less just what they're told to do yes and he said we're

When it comes time, the lights will come on and it will be a mosaic of things that only the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob could have assembled. Come on. And it will be apparent.

And he will finally get the credit. Amen. Isn't that great? That's so great. That's so great. And that gives significance to the mom who feels like she is thanklessly raising her children day in and day out, changing diapers, blessing and praying and feeding and cleaning and doing all of the things. And...

It all matters. I was having this conversation with my son yesterday. We just road tripped from Denver to Nashville. I drove a 20 foot U-Haul towing a Jeep behind the U-Haul through like five states. And it was a 17 hour drive. And we just talked the whole time. And we had this conversation of like the seemingly insignificant is massively influential from God's perspective. Think of the pilgrims.

Do you think that they thought getting on a little ship that was meant to go port to port in England with half their church having to stay behind because the other ship sprung a leak, leaving their pastor, going over with no army to speak of. They had some Bibles and some chickens and they land in the wilderness. And what did they do? They didn't see the fruit of

Correct. That was produced from laying their faces down in the mud and blowing bubbles so their children could step on their backs as stepping stones to get to a community that would shine as a light to the entire world. They had no idea. And either does the praying mom, either does the dad working three jobs, and either does the guy that made this microphone who now is allowing you and I to talk and share this message with millions of people. It all counts. It's like my liver.

I don't think much about it, but when it's not working, everything else shuts down. Everyone looks at the mouth and the eyes and the hands, but my hand is useless without an arm, right? Or an elbow or a shoulder. And that's what Paul says in the scriptures is that we have one body, many members. Each one is vitally important. And if we do our work with courage, faith, and love, I believe that we can realign our own hearts, our homes, and the entire nation with heaven's values.

I've seen it. I saw it in Nashville. I saw people come up and say, I don't know what I have to offer. I felt like I was supposed to be here to help. And what they had to offer fit perfectly with what was needed. It's just listening to the Spirit and being willing to serve. Like Billy said, God gets all the credit.

I don't want any credit. I don't need any credit. I'm just trying to serve. I'm just trying to help. Yeah. You know, and I'm willing to do anything. You want me to clean toilets? I'll clean toilets. Is that helpful? I'm there. Whatever. Yeah. And that is I'm seeing it happen, which is so exciting. I think we're in for a let me say it this way. God will have a humble people.

And he will have a people that really understand who he is. And that takes humility. And I don't know if we're humble enough yet for him. But at some point, we will be. And

I just think on that road, we're just gonna see miracle after miracle after miracle. And I think there's a real awakening coming. I do too. I really do. I hope so. I pray so. And there's wisdom in a parent who sees their teenager going down the wrong road. You know you can't control them. And ultimately you have to point them to God and to the front door. You can't make their decisions for them as adults.

And so sometimes life teaches the lesson that they will not hear from a parent. And I see that happening on a national level with us. And a good parent actually lets their child fall and hit the pavement if that's what they need.

Could it be that God in heaven is allowing his children, the family of faith, to actually experience the consequences of taking prayer out of school, taking the Ten Commandments out of our legal system, taking gender and making it a social construct, mutilating children's bodies and murdering children and say, that's really where you want to go to fit in with whatever it is that's giving you benefits?

Well, let's just have that and just see how you like it. And that's often the times when great awakenings occur. When politically it's awful, economically there's a collapse, morally it's disgusting, spiritually it's cold. Then all of a sudden...

People say, what have we done? And I'm hoping that that is going to be the case here in our country again. It's the gods of the copy book headings by Rudyard Kipling. He wrote it after World War I. And basically he's saying,

We rejected truth because it wasn't exciting. And it didn't promise us that horses had wings and pigs were wishes. And so we went our own way.

But all of these truths will return one way or another because they're true. That's right. And I think we're beginning to see that. You know, I hate to keep bringing up the hurricane, but I was encouraged to see two different theories. One is let FEMA come in and take care of us.

Well, they didn't. And the country learned, you know what? It's actually good for us to be the ones who are the first responder. FEMA can come in as the second responder and help us help them. But we have to do it as people. And it's good. Yes. And it's uplifting. Yes. And then...

With all of the disorder in the world, here comes Ron DeSantis and says, I've already got the trucks lined up. You get out. You do what you have to do. And once the trouble is passed, then you can come out. But I've already taken care of this, this, and this. And FEMA is not our first responder. No. And you see the order change.

You see the sheriff coming out yesterday saying, by the way, we have shelters. But if you're a sex offender, you cannot go to these shelters. But we have another shelter for sex offenders. Okay.

That shows again, order that we don't even get at our border now. And there was no hatred for the sex. It was just like, look, you're in a different category. You go here, you go here. Yeah. And it, it works. Yeah. And it works. It's just not chaos. That's right. That's right. I think, um,

Again, my son and I were having this conversation. It's so cool when kids are old enough to have adult conversations with them. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then you start to learn from them. And he's saying, Dad, there's a certain comfort in communism. As crazy as it sounds, decisions are made for you. There's a lot less stress in the sense that, well, I don't have to go out there and figure it out. They're going to just tell me what I'm going to do or they're going to provide for me. But then there's also obviously the great danger of it. But the whole American idea of...

self-governance that FEMA will never be my first responder. Mm-mm.

FEMA, I'm sorry, the Department of Education is never going to be the first responder with regard to what my children think, how they operate. The government should never be the first responder with healthcare. They should never be the responder with all of these things. The food supply, the medical supplies, all of this. We can do this better because we love one another as neighbors. We know each other. We're family. We're friends. We're a community. But we've got to have character.

And Alex de Tocqueville was quoted as saying that America is good, not because of her government or her money or her harbors or her commerce or even her constitution or even the democracy. It's because her pulpits were aflame with righteousness and America is great because she's good. If she ever forgets and stops being good, she will never be great again. So we've got to have moral character and we've got to have courage to stand up against the enemies of

of truth and freedom. And that's what I'm seeing. Eyes are opening, ears are hearing, people are beginning to stand and begin to do the work themselves. And that is a great threat to the big network monsters that want us all to be dependent. So let me take you back to the beginning of our conversation.

You were wearing a bulletproof vest because they cannot allow this to happen. We're seeing Donald Trump under attack. Elon Musk, he was the darling of the left until he disagreed with some of their policies. Now he has to be destroyed. So what...

I know you believe, and so do I, you've got to live your life. You've got to be engaged. And you don't want to doom scroll all the time. No, can't do it. But you have to be aware of what we're facing. Yes. How do you blend that to where you're not too far one way, too far the other way? Yeah. Well, great question because I wrestle with that every day. I heard a quote once from somebody, Glenn, who said...

I wake up every morning torn between two strong desires, to savor the world and to save the world, which makes planning my day very difficult. That's great. And that's how I feel. And so I've got a personal strategy just to remain sane. And that is...

I imagine my spheres of influence and responsibility and then keeping everything in its place. So like I'm putting this mug in the center of a round table and imagine this small circle in the center. It's small. And I say, I want to savor the small things of my day. When I wake up and see my granddaughter's face, I want to just enjoy that and kiss my wife and enjoy a cup of coffee. And then I want to make much of the medium, right?

The medium is the stuff I can get my hands on and do like this book or a kid's TV show or go, you know, do a talk show or whatever. And know that that will be multiplied if it's good and right. I'm going to let go of the large, which is decisions that Kamala Harris is making, decisions that the UN is making. I,

Maybe some people have influence there. I don't. I got to let go of that. And then I'm going to celebrate the cosmic, the largest circle of all of them, knowing, which you said earlier, that God is the blessed controller of all things, working it all for good for those who love him. And so that allows me to work hard, face the challenges with courage and

And also take heart when I look around and see that the enemies appear to be much bigger than me. Correct. It's because I know that there is someone whose size is so magnificent that he makes the giants look like midgets. Right. And he's not surprised by any of this. No, that's right. There's a plan. Let me take and speak directly to, based on what you just said, because you could take that one of two ways.

You're saying, I'm going to do the things I can that's on the table. But there's a lot of Christians that'll say, I'm just going to pray. I'm not even going to vote. Yeah.

That to me is insane. I think it's insane and I think it's immoral when you think about it. And I don't want to say this. This is not a smackdown. Like I wrestle through all these things myself. And I get it. People don't want to vote between the lesser of two evils or they say, I don't want to hitch my truck to that guy or that girl. But at the end of the day,

we have been given the great privilege that people in North Korea don't have. We get to legally vote to select our representatives. But,

If we just sit it out, that means that the worst of the two options has one less vote to get to get into power to just destroy the future for our children. So we've got to go with we're always last time I checked, Jesus wasn't on the ballot. And so we're always going to be voting for one of two broken people and nobody's perfect. And so we've got to go with the best option that we have available to us, knowing that

The president can't fix the problem anyway. Yes. That's our job. That's what we're talking about earlier. It's the guys that are doing in Nashville what FEMA is not doing. The first responders need to be moms and dads building culture in their homes. And then the executive branch can provide some air cover. Right.

If they're doing their job to keep the evil away so we can do the good from the inside out. And that's where the vote comes in. Yes. You need the air cover. Right. We need the Iron Dome. We need the F-15s. Correct. We need that branch. Correct.

And if you don't pay attention to that, the air cover can suddenly become enemy fire. Yes. Now we have our own air cover firing at us. Yes. And parents who are removing their children from pornography infested schools are being called domestic terrorists. Yes. Parents who are not even aware that their child is wanting a gender change surgery are being penalized and

And laws are being put into place that will take those children away from them and have the parents pay for their surgery in a safe house. I mean, we have senators in California where I used to live that are saying, if you love your children, flee our state because they've been there for 10 years and they've seen where this is going. Yeah. But like you said, this could be.

Our finest hour. This could be the story. Everybody loves a comeback. This could be tomorrow's history books looking back going, they got to the point where they were calling murdering babies reproductive care and they were mutilating children. It got so crazy. This was like pagan times again. Nasty. And then you know what? Good people died.

They stood up. They remembered who they are, whose they are. They captured a vision of victory that it was actually possible, like heroes of the past. And they leaned into what was true and beautiful and good. And you know what? God came to their aid and there was a massive turnaround. What a great story. I want to be a part of that story. I want to be part of the vanguard of that, possibly, if I'm allowed to, in my lifetime. Yeah. It's interesting to me that, you know, when you say the...

lesser of two evils. As you say, you're never going to have a clean choice on that. But to allow someone to make the decision for your children's future, we are...

creating the future. It's not about today. It's about tomorrow and the next day and the next day. And if I vote for Donald Trump and he suddenly starts going off the constitution and becoming a dictator,

Yeah, I voted for him, but then it's my responsibility to stand against him. Yes. Yeah. And you kind of forget that you just think people vote and they think, well, that's a blank check. No, it's not. No, it's not. They work for you. Yeah.

You know, if if if Kamala Harris became a dictator, I would, of course, stand and I would hope that others that voted for her would stand together and say unconstitutional. Yeah. Now, I don't know if we do that, you know, in mass because people are so hypnotized by these parties and. Yeah. And division. It just it has to be about right and wrong.

and our principles. That's right. It really does. It has to be that. Our constitution is only for a moral and religious and educated people because it gives people too much freedom. And if you don't know right from wrong and you're not rooted in your convictions, if you're not driving stakes into the ground saying, here I am, here I stand, God help me.

We're so easily manipulated and people will give up their guns. They'll give up their freedoms. They'll give their they'll they'll sacrifice their own children at the altar of the new secular church, which is public schools. And they are taught evil is good and good is evil. And the new secular.

provider and protector is the state, the government, rather than the God who gave us these beautiful blessings and freedoms. But that's not everybody's fault entirely because we're not even being taught those things anymore. Where it used to be step one. I mean, it was in the water. It was in the air. Our founders told us that. And you know that more than anyone. It's amazing how...

We, how Satan has just taken everything and perverted all of it. I heard somebody talking the other day, you know, that on Sundays you go to church and you, to remember him, and my belief is to read, you know, commit to your baptismal covenants and ask for forgiveness, you bless the bread and the wine, right?

And this is my body. This is my blood given up for you. The left is now saying, this is my body and I'm going to give up that body, that child for me. That is such a clear version of the gospel, which is that's, that's how you know that

I mean, it's crazy. It really is. What a striking way to position that. I'm going to lay down my life so you can live, Jesus said. I'm going to lay that life down so I can live. That's right. I can have the abundant life. Yeah, that's flipping truth and beauty and goodness on its head and selling people evil in the name of what's good.

loving and inclusive. You, how do you answer people on a couple of things? You just said this gives people too much freedom. I think it gives ignorant people freedom.

Too much freedom. That's why you have to self-educate and be responsible for yourself because you're an idiot with a gun. Yeah, right. You know what I mean? Or with a wife or with a child or with anything. With anything. You can really cause trouble. Correct. But that's...

Up to you to be respond to recognize that responsibility. Yeah. You talk about conforming our culture and everything closer to biblical principles. And people say, how dare you? How do you how do you how do you explain that to people who don't necessarily understand?

are good people, but don't believe in the Bible. Yeah, I understand. I understand. And ultimately, so let me just restate the question. I talk about wanting to have heaven's values, which I believe are the biblical values of

influencing all spheres of society. And that is simply a return to the principles that created this country and that has led to our unprecedented blessing and success. And that's good for everybody. Unlike other countries, you're going to have some philosophy or worldview that creates a culture that is usually going to benefit certain classes or groups of people and others. But

But more people want to come to the United States. There's more freedom, more opportunity for business, for education, for religious freedom. More success. No matter what you are. You can be an atheist, a Buddhist, a Hindu. You can be black or you can be white, all these things. Now, we revert back to our lower natures and we stray away from the biblical principles and then we suffer and we injure one another. I'm talking about getting back to the good ones. And what I loved was a quote from Richard Dawkins. Hmm.

Famous atheist, probably one of the most famous proponents of atheistic Darwinian evolution. And he was asked the question, and I had to go read the quote myself from the source. And he was asked the question, what kind of civil, what worldview produces the best kinds of civilizations? If you could choose a Muslim country, an atheist country, a Marxist country, he said, oh, undoubtedly a Christian civilization. That's where I'd want to live. He said, because

any other types of civilizations, I could potentially be in trouble. I could have my head cut off. I could be all these other things. He's like, they definitely produce the most family oriented, best fruit. And that's where I'd want to live. Now, I don't, I don't care that church attendance is declining because I think the whole premise is just a fairy tale. But I like those saying that you want to only live in a Christian civilization and culture country, right?

but don't care that church attendance is declining is like saying, I love produce and I want lots of it in the grocery store, but I'm not concerned that all the farms are shutting down. Correct. That's what produces it. You can't neglect the faith, the story, the philosophy, the worldview that produces the fruit and expect for the fruit to stay sweet.

It doesn't. That's not how it works. Try it in your garden. You know, like like ignore the roots. Just snip them. Don't don't feed them. Don't water them. See how long your beautiful apple tree stays beautiful. That's what's happening in America. And we got to get back to those values. Some would say that that's Christian nationalism. Kirk, how dare you? What, Chris? You want a you want a Christian prince?

Yeah, I got one. He's in heaven. He's not here. He's not running to the United States of America. That's not what we want. They don't, they don't, people don't understand the concept. You talk about it in your book of two citizenships. That's right. That's right. We have two citizenships, a citizen. I'm a citizen of the kingdom of heaven and I'm a citizen of the United States. You know, it's interesting. The word citizen, I learned this from my friend, Bill Federer, William Federer historian. He pointed out that the word citizen is very important. We're not subjects in America.

Isn't that interesting? We're not subjects of a king. We are citizens, which literally means to be a co-king. We are ruling together as we, the people and those who are in office are our representatives. They're not even our leaders. They are to represent the leaders who are us. And, um,

We I'm talking about the two citizenship. What was the first part of the question? I just said, people don't understand that, you know, we have two citizenships, Christian nationalism. Oh, Christian nationalism. That's what we were talking about. That, you know, do you know who hates nationalists?

Globalists. Globalists hate nationalists. They hate patriots. They hate the whole concept. Christian nationalism is just a slur that has been thrown at people who love God, who love their family and love their country. It used to be called Christian patriotism. That's what we that's what we love. We wave the flags and we say, God bless America. And I'm thankful for my grandpa who fought in World War Two.

Now they call it nationalists and they want to be white because at the very top, what they want is a giant global power structure that controls all the food, controls all the money, controls all the everything's and everything.

That's their marketing campaign. Take the good guys and just turn them into little Nazis. You see what they're talking about with food, with farming, with the control of a centralized power. Yeah.

It'll never work. I mean, I just don't know how they've convinced themselves that, oh yeah, no, we got this one under control. This would never work. Yeah, well, but I'm sure they're having fun trying. I mean, man, they got so much money, so much. And you've got these giants. I wonder what their cocktail party and dinner parties are like. I actually don't want to know. But...

But again, this is an opportunity for us, I think, as, you know, I'm not a big, you know, I'm not a giant mover or shaker. I'm not pulling big levers that are affecting culture. Right. But...

What I do know is that God can feed 5,000 people with a couple of loaves and a couple of fish. I know that he multiplies what he loves and that some little baby in a cradle somewhere was raised by a woman and he turns into George Washington or turns into one of the pilgrims or turns into somebody who makes a giant difference. And going back to our conversation, it wasn't just...

He just didn't, you're George Washington. It came from the seeds planted by the pilgrims. That's right. And their children and their children. And then you get a George Washington. That's right. And then even his character has to be formed by going through the valleys and the, and the fires. And then you get to do what you're doing. So,

If we can start with that kind of thinking, I think that then frames the future for us, gives us ground to stand on, put steel in our backbone, wind in our sails, and we can say what David said. I'm coming and I'm representing the God of heaven. I don't care how big you are. Even if all my brothers are over there, their knees are knocking and they're shaking in their boots.

I know that there is a cause for which God will help me. And my prayer is, Lord, keep me humble and my eyes focused in the right direction. And I know you're going to take care of the rest. Back with more with Kirk in just a minute. First, I want to talk to you about pre-born. Imagine if you had the ability just to wave your hand and abortion would no longer be legal. Imagine the lives that you could save in that moment.

Okay, we don't have any magic wands. And also, if you would wave the magic wand where it would be illegal suddenly, we'd still be in trouble because we have to change people's hearts.

And that takes work. And you can save lives and change people's hearts by donating to the pre-born ministry. They empower young expectant mothers in crisis to choose life, empower them. First, they've rescued hundreds of thousands of babies through ultrasounds. This is why Planned Parenthood doesn't want ultrasounds around.

Because when you go to a pre-born center, she gets to hear the baby's heartbeat and see the child on ultrasound. And that changes everything, doubles the chance that mom's going to choose life. But then you also have to have compassion for the mom because a lot of these moms, they don't think they can handle it. They don't have anyone in their life supporting them. They don't have the money, whatever.

This is where Preborn comes in on the second level. They help with everything for the first two years. I've seen this in action. I've seen lives changed. Will you help rescue babies? Donate at pound 250. Just say the keyword baby. Pound 250. Keyword baby. Or you can go online at preborn.com slash Glenn.

Oh, it's such a clutch off-season pickup, Dave. I was worried we'd bring back the same team. I meant those blackout motorized shades. Blinds.com made it crazy affordable to replace our old blinds. Hard to install? No, it's easy. I installed these and then got some from my mom. She talked to a design consultant for free and scheduled a professional measure and install. Hall of Fame's son? They're the number one online retailer of custom window coverings in the world. Blinds.com is the GOAT!

Shop blinds.com right now and get up to 45% off select styles. Rules and restrictions may apply. You bring up David. I don't like the way, like in 2016, a lot of people, and I saw it happen. Trump was elected. Oh, he's going to take care of all the problems. He's not our savior. And equally, I don't like the idea of so many Christians saying,

Well, he's not perfect. David wasn't perfect. Moses was slow of speech. It's never, it's, I believe...

It's just the guy who will stand up and do what he's asked to do. You know what I mean? And he may not even know it. He may not even know it. But when I saw Trump get up off the stage and that bullet missed him by that, I mean that I'm sorry, it was a God thing. Yeah. And, uh, and, and it did humble him. It really, it changed him. Uh,

But he's just the guy who will just get up again and say, keep going, keep going. That's what the Lord needs in all of us. Somebody who will just do it. Yeah. Just do it. Right? Yes, I believe so. And I have...

I have witnessed as I've been going to schools and libraries and churches and places that people have been scared to the point where they kind of think maybe we can't turn this around. Maybe that maybe there's no hope. You know, I have some people will say I have long term optimism for, you know, goodness in the ether. But I have short term pessimism when it comes to our chances here in this country.

And I don't like that because that negates all the stuff that we've been talking about right now. The way that God often uses unlikely people with nothing to offer but a willingness to stand and do what's been put in front of me to accomplish the greatest tasks. I believe that...

People need to stop thinking that the opposition is so great. Big tech, big pharma, big medical, big government, big everything. That's their Achilles heel. Yeah, it is. And I see the fear in their eyes. And they feel bad that their children were born in such a time as this. You know what that reminds me of? It reminds me when Moses was taking the children of Israel into the promised land and sends 12 men in to the land of Canaan. And they come back and they go...

No, no, no, no, guys. We picked the wrong place. The walls are huge. There are giants in the land. There's no way we can do it. But then there's one named Caleb who says, no, remember what Moses said. He said, you might think that your enemies and opponents are too big for you to drive out the land. But remember what the Lord did to Pharaoh and to Egypt.

Well, he had sent the plagues. He parted the Red Sea. He demonstrated his faithfulness and power. And he's like, we got this. Not in arrogance, not in presumption, but on humble dependence and a courageous willingness to do what was put in front of them. I think that's what we have to do. Gandalf said it as well. Just do what we've been called to do in the years wherein we have been set. Starting in your heart, getting it right in your home,

Not perfectly, but increasingly, locally. And if we all do that, it spreads like a California wildfire and it's uncontainable. It's also a rejection of the Lord's prayer. Yes. Thy will be done. I don't know what he's doing. I have no idea. With my life...

I've done stuff because he asked me to do. And I'd be like, there's no way. There's no way that's going to work out. And it does. And then he told me to do some things that didn't work out.

Until later, I was like, oh my gosh, if that wouldn't have happened, I wouldn't be. So it's his will. We're just supposed to do what he tells us to do. Yeah, I think so. And then he does the picture. He knows what it is. I don't know what it is. Do we save America? Do we not save America? I hope we do, but I don't know. Yeah, I agree with you. And I think our thinking about this is important. You had...

mentioned end times, last days, things like this. I meet so many people who actually have been able to somehow in their mind use that as an excuse for apathy. Hey, the Titanic is sinking. Let's not polish brass on a sinking ship. Good culture is just not going to happen. Well, again, they've been predicting the end of the world for so long now. The late great planet Earth. The apostles did. Yeah, that was 2000 years ago. They said it's coming quick.

But you know what we also can do is that if we do have a mindset that this is all the good we do today, Glenn, all you're really doing is you're just postponing the inevitable. You're postponing it in the inevitable. And a lot of Christians feel this way, that the whole thing is going to end in a cosmic dumpster fire. Right?

Well, then how hard are you really going to lean into restoring and redeeming and revitalizing culture for the next 500 years, a thousand years, if you think Jesus is coming Tuesday and that there's no point, therefore, to really lean in?

And I know people wouldn't verbalize it like that, but in the back of their mind, that's kind of the operating system. And you create a self-fulfilling prophecy. If I told you, I don't think my marriage is going to work. I've blown it so bad. It's not going to. It's not going to. Because why should I try? She hates me. I'm going to go find somebody else and get on with my life. Can I ask you? But then you're never going to fix your marriage. I have friends, and I don't know what you believe, but I have friends who believe in the rapture. Oh God, I wish that was true. Right.

Maybe it is, but I wish it was true because I don't want to be here for all of the bad stuff. However, when I look at this story,

It makes me want to make the culture and everything else stronger. And it motivates me to make sure that my kids and everything surrounding that we shore up this culture as much as possible because that's gas in our tank. Our kids are going to need that gas. Yeah, they will. You know, one way or another, he comes, he doesn't come. They are going to need to know what's true. We need to strengthen all of that stuff. Yeah.

So they have some muscles to flex. Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. Because other evils will come. Yes. They surely will come. And...

Even if it's not, even, you know, I don't know how you lived except for the, you know, the signs. I don't know how you lived in the 1930s and didn't think this could be Jesus coming back. This is so evil. That's right. You know what I mean? And World War II tanked everybody's hope. And if everybody would have just said, well, Jesus coming back, it's going to fix itself. It wouldn't have fixed itself. Right.

You have to get involved and you have to know the difference between good and evil. Because, you know, we look at blacks, you know, these black, you know, booted thugs come in. Well, that was a snappy uniform made by Hugo Boss. You didn't look at that Nazi SS uniform and go, oh, they're the bad guys.

That was like our Marines. Our Marines. Yeah. Right? It was a good guy at the time. The games that are played with the human mind, only the spirit can break through that and go, no, no, no, no, no, no. Bad guys. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, one of the things I appreciate about you, Glenn, is that you do stuff. You don't just talk about stuff. You report on the important things and others who are doing things to be solutionaries.

and then you go do them yourself with all of your initiatives. And that's one of the things that I'm really focusing on these days is saying, guys, let's not just be reporters, let's be reformers. - So explain that, it's a great part in the book. - There's two groups of people that I find, and that is those who like to report on all the bad things happening in culture. And the conservative right tends to do this a lot.

point out all the hypocrisies, use satire to expose the foolishness and absurdities of the premises of the extreme left. And all of that is reporting. And I'm always wondering from the big brained guys on the right. Okay, I got, I'm on board. I believe what you're saying. What do I do? How do we do this? How do we fix it? What's our plan? And, and,

Then there's another group who are the actual reformers. They don't just talk about the bad things happening. They work to find creative solutions and alternatives that are better for people and promote human flourishing. And...

Those are the people that are the heroes of history. I mean, King Alfred of Wessex was not a reporter, he was a reformer. Martin Luther was a reformer. Noah was a reformer. The pilgrims were reformers. They weren't just whining and complaining.

The pilgrims had it far worse than we did. They had a king who had declared himself God on earth, head of the church and head of the government. No freedom, no education, no nothing. And what did they do? They didn't tuck their head between their knees, pray for the rapture and cry in their Chick-fil-A soup. Right.

They got ahold of their Bible. They read it. They faced poverty. They faced betrayal, imprisonment, uh, weather sickness, death. And they went across an unknown waters and had a five-year plan to build a community that would shine as a light to the world. They were reformers. That's what we were born to be. In my opinion, if we've received, uh,

a regeneration of our heart and soul by the spirit of God. We're not to be professional complainers. We're to be creators of the culture, not just reporters, but reformers of bad things. And we can do that with the tools that God has given us and the people he surrounded us with. I have to tell you, I struggle with that so much because I really believe my calling is, we all are, but a watchman at the gate, right?

And, you know, Ezekiel's warning is heavy when you've got a huge footprint. Yeah. Like you do, like I do. It should be heavy on everybody. But he's been very clear with me. Warn, warn, warn, warn. Yep. And I hate that, you know, because it's like, can I, some solutions? And so I try to balance it.

But I don't find the balance. I know a lot of people that listen to me go, I get it. He's not been... The only thing he's been clear with me on is after, right before the collapse, in between Bear Stearns and Lehman Brothers, right? Lehman Brothers was the big collapse. In between that time, I had a falling out with him. I was arrogant and...

He had told me to risk my career on warning of a collapse. And I did. And I followed him and I did exactly what he said. And then Bear Stearns collapsed and nothing happened. And in my arrogance, I said, really? I've lost stations. I've lost credibility. I've lost everything. That was it? All of that for this? He stopped talking to me for like a month and a half. And I really felt I had lost my best friend. I was lost. I didn't know what to do.

And he finally started talking to me again after I was humbled enough. And the first thing he said to me was, build the framework of hope. I don't even know what that means. I still don't. But that's why I started Mercury One. And that's what I, for the first time, it's taken 11 years to build it into something that has the

Strength in the legs to be able to provide it. Yeah, but that's what I saw in the hurricane. I saw nobody showing up for these people and when we showed up with our helicopters our food our medicine hope was there yes, and

"Man, I'd just like to do that full time. "I'd like to stop the reporting and just do the reforming." - Well, God bless you for all that you are doing and you're inspiring so many of us, me included. You are an inspiration. Your courage is contagious. And we have to remember that cowardice is also contagious. And there is a very important role for the watchman on the wall.

If the watchman doesn't blow his horn and let everybody know that the enemy is coming, the blood will be on his head. Oh, no, you don't have to remind me. I know. Sorry. I didn't mean to. I got that. To beat you again with the Ezekiel stick. But what you're doing is so important. And I think of...

I go, why doesn't the family of faith get a bigger mission and vision? You've got it. You've got Mercury One and so many other things that you're doing. - I think it is starting to happen. - It is, and this is the very crucible that I think produces bigger vision, vision of victory, the need for personal integrity training and strong families. These are the hard times that produce strong men. - Yes.

Yes. We've gone through easier times that have produced weak men. I love how Jordan Peterson says, if you think strong men are dangerous, get ready for what weak men can potentially do. They're dangerous. And this is where we are. I saw all these strong men in Hurricane. I saw all these men who were former SEALs. They were airborne. They were just vets. And they all came in and they were like,

Yeah, that's not going to work. Here's what we do. And it was strong men standing up and taking charge of their own communities with grace and dignity and humility. Yeah. But taking charge and being men. And it was inspiring to see. It is so inspiring. I love it. I feel the rumblings of a new generation.

spiritual cultural awakening in my heart. I see people's eyes opening up and they're getting, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're on mission moms, dads, grandparents. Um, and, and they're standing up, they're speaking up, they're leaning in. I love seeing the homeschool movement. I love seeing people pioneering something and taking back the sacred role of parenting and,

and not farming that out to other people. And whether it's homeschool or a great private school or a co-op or a network or whatever it is, don't farm the most...

and precious gift you've been given out to other people who want to use them as useful idiots to advance their nefarious causes at that sounds extreme, but it's what they're doing. They they're literally chopping up children's bodies and telling them that good is evil and evil is good. So, um, courageous being courageous, uh,

starts in the little things. And when we're faithful in the little things, God then gives us opportunities to be in charge of greater things. And I think that's why you've been in charge of such a great big operation like you have here is because you have been faithful in smaller things and you can be trusted with bigger things. Well, I give the credit to God and the people who are running everything. They're so powerful.

You're so much better than I am. So how do we choose? How do you get out and break the cycle of pessimism? Because it is critical. That's what's killing us. We don't believe we see Goliath and we don't understand Goliath.

We don't understand a single rock will bring that thing down. We don't understand the, the clay feet idea. It's just, it's too enormous. And so we dismiss ourselves. We talked about that. How do you, how do you get past the, we're not going to make it. Faith, faith. You've got to, you've got to see the bigger picture, right?

And you've got to trust that there is a bigger cause than what's right in front of you. Think of the stock market. I look at a graph. I mean, they do this with lots of things to deceive people. But if you look at a graph over time, if you narrow the field of view, you can get everyone thinking that the earth is getting colder. The earth is getting hotter. Culture is declining and it's never been this bad ever before. Right?

But if it's like the stock market, it's like, it's like a recession zoom out. And he's like, Oh my gosh, this has happened before. In fact, this is actually pretty good compared to how it was a long, long time ago. And when you look at, I call it a white cap on the top of a tsunami, right?

The good that is advanced in this world over time, over the last 5,000 years is so massive. It's so good. The quality of life for people, the opportunity, the freedom, the wealth, the length of life, all of that has been

swelling and growing like a tsunami. And what we're experiencing with our myopic view is what's happening right now, right in front of me. And it looks like a perfect storm. And it's really a white cap on top of a tsunami that's washing over the earth, in my opinion, that there is this victory that is so inevitable of good over evil that

of, uh, of hope over despair that we've, we've, we just need to, we need to get on our surfboard and, and ride that white cap. And God's going to take us on his program to a great ending to this whole story. I don't know how all the details are going to work themselves out, but if we have a vision like that,

then it starts to make sense why David was able to do what he did, why Caleb was able to do what he did, why Moses was able to do what he did, while King Alfred up against the Vikings who were just slaughtering everybody and all of England was able to stand with his men and capture Guthrum and instead of cutting his head off,

He deployed Christian principles and made him a ruler of a portion of the kingdom. If he would agree to the treaty of Wedmore, which forced him to treat Saxon and Scandinavian equally under the law, he was baptized as a Christian, was given a Christian name. And he then,

Worked as an ally with Alfred to return England to that golden era where they loved the scriptures and their law was based off of the Sermon on the Mount and the Ten Commandments. He revolutionized everything when everyone thought all hope was lost. Why? Because he saw my trials are a white cap on the top of a tsunami of God's sovereignty and his faithfulness. And I think we can do the same today.

I barely heard what you just said because I was having something happening in my own head. I was told once. That happens with my wife all the time. But don't tell her. I'll tell you. I know. I was told once a guy who I really respected came into my office and said, where are all your heroes? Where are the pictures of your heroes? And I said, what do you mean?

And he said, when you're in really tough times, you're not going to make it unless you have some people that you look to. Yes. That you say, I want to be like that. Yes. And you can immediately connect. Decisions are easy. He wouldn't do that. What would he do? Right, right. And Dietrich Bonhoeffer has been one of my heroes. Raoul Wallenberg is my number one. Also, and I can't remember his name, he was the priest that was put into –

the concentration camp that was just turning everybody and just like everybody was happy around him because he was happy. And they finally put him in a hole underneath one of the barracks where it was absolutely miserable and like six people in there. And you could hear the wailing and everything else of these people in there. Well, they put him in there expecting they're going to make him miserable. And instead, within a day, he had all of them singing.

It was so the opposite that they actually had to just shoot him or inject him with drugs to kill him right away because he was turning even the most miserable happy to God. And I'm listening to you speak and I'm looking you in the eyes. And I was thinking about, I was thinking about asking you, who do you want to be? And I realized, I think I want to be you.

I think you are a remarkable, remarkable man. Wow, Glenn. Those are such strong words. I'm not prepared to know what to say. But I agree that heroes are important.

That's what I look to. I have a friend who recently died. His name is Dr. Marshall Foster. And he wrote a book called "The American Covenant." And I taught through that book when I was locked in California in my backyard during the pandemic because our governor wouldn't let us go anywhere. And I just made a campfire every night. I called it "The American Campfire Revival." I remember. And I taught through that book and it told me about all these heroes of the past.

And it's on their shoulders that we stand. And the governor of the pilgrims is one of those William Bradford pilgrims.

Pastor Robinson, who sort of shepherded that flock, Alfred was one of them. St. Patrick was another one of them. Sold into slavery at 16 years old from England, goes off with these Druid priests and he's tending sheep somewhere. And he eventually gets this vision. He escapes. He finds his way out. And then he hears these voices, I imagine in an Irish accent. Mm-hmm.

you know, young boy, come back and free your people. I'm sure they didn't sound like that, but he ends up taking some friends and a Bible and he goes back in there and he challenges the Druid kings who would have just cut his head off and he makes a fire on top of a hill breaking all of the laws and then he goes in and ends up converting the king and now you have these Irish missionaries going out to the rest of the world. I love that story of him. Wow.

This is a 16 year old kid who was off into slavery. And I think heroes like that, the scriptures even tell us these stories in the Bible of our heroes, they were written for our examples. There is the faith hall of fame. And those are all the heroes that give us stamina and staying power today. Mm hmm.

Thank you for coming, man. Thank you for having me here. Great discussion. Thank you for letting me just interact with you over these principles. Name of the book is born to be brave by Kirk Cameron. Thank you, man. God bless you. Just a reminder. I'd love you to rate and subscribe to the podcast and pass this on to a friend so it can be discovered by other people.