Courtney Stodden (FBF)
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What's up, daddy? Gay IT is your founding father back at IT again for another episode of call her daddy. Before I start this episode, I need to preface this with a trigger warning.

This interview contains references to abuse of a minor. Again, this is a trigger warning, and listener discretion is advised. If this episode is not for you, I love you and I will see you next week.

okay? Daddy gay, if you are familiar with today's guest, you probably know them from the headline. The media used to define them.

In two thousand eleven, courtney started a sixteen neural child bride, marries a man in his fifties. I was also sixteen when the story was on the front cover of every fucking tabloid. d.

This man was hired by courtney's mom to be courtney, acting coast IT turned predatory. Cortin's parents knew and let IT continue. And I remember when courtine sadden was signed away by their parents and granted permission to marry this dude in his fifties.

At the time, courtney received endless online hay, a negative media coverage. Again, courtney, a child received death threats, was stocked by the pope. Oi, sexualized, labeled a horr.

This was a sixteen year old. Meanwhile, if you look back at all the media coverage, it's like they forgot about the adult in the situation. The fifty year old fucking creep courtine married doug hutcheson. This washed up actor would have been a pedophile if he had pursued a relationship with sixteen year old courtney, but instead courtney's parents willingly welcomed, dug into their family and legally permitted the marriage after suffering abuse at the hands of countless adults and reality T V shows being exploited. Courtney is now twenty seven, gotten into therapy and started a recovery journey. A listen, I had not kept up with courtney studying, and sitting down with courtney, I realized the reality of how layer their story is and how deeply the media betrayed that sixteen year old child. This is a story of child abuse that began ten years ago, and after finalizing their divorce in twenty twenty, courtney is now beginning to process what that means to be a survivor.

What is your daddy game? IT is your founding father, alex Cooper, call her.

I will probably take five minutes to get comfortable. So sorry, I think it's just this large thing in front of my face. It's giving me a little P, T, S, D, maybe. They all look the same to me at this point on.

okay, let's drink our water. Would you prefer we were drinking? Actually, we could maybe get some drinks in here a little bit.

I am down OK. I mean, what do you like your show?

I'm down to drink. What kind of alcohol do you like?

Um i'll just do whatever .

you have revoked.

Tequila, right? Um I think voda probably tequila.

I like that. It's like welcome to color daddy noon on a wednesday and we are popping the bottles open.

We were out like getting some, like you are like a dev day. The entire place turned into a bar and like how long?

second? second? Why are we recording? okay. Yeah, maybe this will be the center of us just summing our drinks. Really get me some fucking in alcohol because .

it's about to get, I think, work and I needed for this. I honestly.

I yeah, forty five minutes later, courtine and I ve taken twelve shots. We have fix our fly away.

We've in the mike and I think we're ready for therapy, I think are ready for therapy. Cheers, just just so amazing to me.

We are the same age. And I remember seeing your story when I was like, fifteen, sixteen. I remember watching a kind of unfolding in the news and sense then so much has happened in your life. And I really appreciate you sitting down with me.

You live in a lie. Yeah, I live in brand wood. Oh, area.

Love that area. yeah. How long have you live there?

I've lived there. Are probable for lake here and a half now, and call a haris is my neighbor. So bushi pitch, I was, I was just really shocking because I am in the middle of studying for my license finally at twenty freaking seven years old, like finally you pass my permit like trying to get my license and i'm like trying to drive home and there is like so much traffic on the little street couldn't figure that out and then I like, I went too fast and one of these guys was like, I was like, I don't know. Like a security guard because you you don't feel down just trying go home and i'm just like what that well.

that's yeah that is right there. That's also L A like how fluctuations cash will the youth? Like neighbors with commoner?

Like what's up so crazy?

Have you seen her?

Um i've tried like sense then i've kind of like been this like i've been driving really slow with my permit you know like looking over their house.

There will be two miles an hour just like so creedy right I know .

what there's like security in front. So I think they're starting to kind of look at me like why is this so? But it's just, yeah, it's amazing.

I mean, I IT was the first time I ever voted in my adult life, and I voted for kalan. That's such a cool moment, president. Yeah.

come full circle. Now you discount the neighbors. You must live in a nice neighborhood. Caught me. You're like, no comment. absolutely. Did you always have aspirations to move to L A, like when you were a little girl? Did you want to be like famous as a good you want to be?

I've always loved music. I always wanted to pursue that at a really, really Young age. And my mom, SHE, was always very supportive of IT. I think that he found a lot of in retaining in supporting her daughter as well. Um and so her and I just kind of leg became the almost like a major to me and then you know was that mindset of helping her daughter.

When and why did your parents side to home school? You.

my, my father wasn't involved in that situation. He wasn't contributors add all to the decision to pull me out, nor did he really know that I was being completely abused and bullied at school. In sixth grade, I was pulled out because I was bullied.

I mean, I got a lot of, like my old friends bullying me. And, you know, my my ARM was broken at one point. And I just was that kid that was really popular before I hit puberty. And then when I had purity, I was treated so differently. And as a child, like you really don't understand why you're being treated differently as all emails 再来 getting from the of the future middle school and staff， you know they're na knock my teeth down my face and you know they're going to you know just it's just gonna be a really horrible experience for me. So my mom pulled me out because of that.

Yeah, at that time your .

dad was not in your life, you know. I think in looking back at IT, I feel like my father completely left to me emotionally, abed. And I don't know if he is that type of men to be able to properly emotionally be there for their child. IT just doesn't seem that way, because history wouldn't have been the way IT is for me like my life, right? But all kind of falls back to that relationship.

So many Young women go through that, and then IT directly affects their romantic relationships. And we will be getting to you got married to a man in his fifties when you were sixteen. His name is dug.

Hutcheson, how did you meet? dug? Let's take corneys grabbing for the voda well call on.

Let's take a safe of our drain. Here we go. Let's get in the dug. How .

did you meet dug? dug. I met through a mutual friend, so the mutual friend manager introduced my family to dug because dug was teaching acting classes here in lay and I always kind of expressed you know interest also in singing but in acting and um that's how we connected was through email email yeah so you got connected .

with him on email and how what were the initial conversations you were having with him via email?

I think, I think you just need a little break. Yes, I yeah, take sorry.

no, take your time.

What's coming up for you right now?

I'm still healing from this. It's it's very um it's very, very, very fresh for me. I wear waterproof my scary specifically. I never wear waterproof. But we met through a mutual friend.

We started connecting through email and my mom and this you know our mutual friend, ten tips names tim Wilson, he didn't know about the exchanges that doug was having with me. Um my mom did. He was aware SHE was like over my shoulder the entire time practically or having me print out the emails and he was reading them, and, you know, nothing was sexual.

But I was definitely not about where IT was supposed to be about, which was about teaching me acting, you know, all of that stuff that you know professionally, just what you're doing. And then as a child, I didn't really see IT as anything predatory. I mean, something children have that capacity to really see that, especially if they are they they they don't feel like they have a proper relationship with their father.

You know there are questions like, you know what's your favorite color? And you know what, where do you see yourself in five years? And you let's play ten questions and and then we're going to a get to know each other that way first. You know after that then I can can help teach you you where I think you'd fall good and acting just all of this bias now I know in retrospect, right? It's just a way to to start figuring out the child and to get your cloth in them and you know, control them.

Did you know what you looked like because you were only communicating on email? Did he know your age and did you know what you look?

Did you knew what I looked like? My manager at the time sent him pictures, and he was very much aware what I looked like. But he claims that, you know, he's never known my age. You never knew my age, so not true. He did because my mom received a call from him and he said, you know so I really want to start teaching her daughter acting and he goes, okay, well, you know she's only um you know he just turned sixteen and he knew my end. Absolutely, he did.

Did you know how old he was?

I did yeah yeah.

So you're saying that your mom was like printing out the emails and looking over them with you. Do you remember your mom ever saying anything to be careful of? Or was IT? Was SHE condoning this during the time too?

My mom has always been a very protective mother. I mean, just just going back in kind of trying to shine a little light on my back story a little bit. My my mom has gotten a lot of hate, and I understand why.

I mean, you know, if I ever have a baby, and i'm breezing that baby from my own experiences, I would never sign my kid off ever to an adult man, you know, thirty four years old, that there's just no way that would happen. But I think that he thought he was doing something that was going to make me happy. Truthfully, I really believe that.

But in retrospect, x SHE knows IT was the wrong decision. She's even share, apologized to me so many times and has said enough I could just do anything to do over I would. I'm just so sorry when sign off on this.

how long were the two of you speaking online before you met in person?

We spoke online and on the phone for six months, and then I met him in person. He came to my hometown.

And what were the expectations of him coming like what was the purpose of that trip?

I believe IT was obviously to see his child and person verify that the parents are on board. I'm not gonna go to jail and I can get that free pass to molest a child. I just need that paperwork signed for me to get married because it's a loophole, right? And then a week later, we got married. So I basically just spent him in person one week. And then a week later, I married.

But just to get context, if you had fully had a conversation of this is a relationship before you met in person like that was art now in the works fully, and your mom was aware of IT.

I was already groomed before him at him.

Yeah, he comes into town. What was that like with him meeting your parents in everything I do remember for that week?

I do. But there is a specific moment that really stands out to me. After picking him up from the airport, my father was striving, my mom was there, felt like I had support.

My judges said he needed to meet him in person, and then he could just sign off on IT, which in retrospect makes me extremely angry. He was, in his very own fragile state, reminded that point in the marriage with my mother. My mother was in a very bad place with my father. So this was like a perfect, like, you know grooming situation for someone um like dog.

I remember being picking dug up from sea tag, driving about in our and a half to a cafe and I thought maybe at least we'll take the entire weekend for my father and then talk to me and say you I don't know if you, I feel like I really did want a merry job because I thought I was in love with ham. But there was also something in me as a child that made me question if my father really loved me. So IT was like this, you know, decode omy.

And so when we got to that dinner, we had a little lunch. My dad, immediately before they either lunch, tacked up outside and said, you know what, you have my blessing. He didn't even see him for maybe an hour.

They didn't talk. My dad was driving that was in the back seat, and he gave dug the blessing to take his child away from him. You know, even if he did feel like his family was falling apart in of these things, like I feel like he did choose himself.

Did your dad ever pull U S. And ask how you were feeling?

He did um before we met tug but I was just five minutes and my bedroom room kind of took my hands as IT is is what you want. I know he was, I know he was arguing with my mom.

I could hear them screaming, you know, throughout the house and he he just, but I just think he gives up so quickly that just the kind of person he is, he just kind of lake runs away from issues and his, so, I mean, you know, IT just makes sense why this happened, right? And IT happens to so many other children in the U. S.

A. I mean, about three hundred thousand children under age. Children were married to adults between the, between the years of two thousand and two thousand and eighteen.

And eighty six percent of those children are girls. And it's in this country. We think of child brighter, some foreign situation, but IT is.

So it's so present in the U. S. A right now, and it's terrifying. And some as Young as ten years old.

Did dug treat you like an adult, or did he treat you like a child?

I think that it's pretty obvious that he looked at me like a child, but wanted to treat me like some kind of object.

How did he pitch you on getting married? Why couldn't you guys just date?

I grew up in a really Christian family, and I was a virgin when I had dog. And, you know, because of my mums own again, I mean, i'm going through this in therapy, so i'm not yet healed from all of this. But, you know, he believed that this guy would really take care of me and really love me.

And SHE was also in a position to feel um like he could believe him. I mean, SHE really dead. You know, i'm just gonna say that when I went through this divorce process with dug, I found out that right after I left him, he started pursuing a fifteen old girl.

U. K. And I have all of the proof, I have all of the emails. I. God connected with in x assault victim and he was doing the same thing to another fifteen year old girl while I was going through this process. Um the tissue i'm still working through all of this.

So you're going through the divorce and you find out he's already on to his next victim.

Yes, I found out through. I I found out through A P, A step mother who reached out to me on instagram and. I just I can't tell you how how much that broke me like even after all of like the control I felt I didn't even have a control over my own body, my own finances.

I couldn't sign any legal documents in that marriage. I couldn't um you know sign off on my own marriage like I was just so controlled. But then I think that there's this uma bond that happens when you're that age late rate you have like this.

I don't want to stock consent because they but IT there is this glooming is the effects and the mental effects of grooming ing where I didn't want to a believe, you know, right? I means few people reach out. I just didn't wanna believe that I just, you know, it's not what how he made me feel.

He made me feel really released special and unique. Go just really believed him and then just finding out everything is just it's just, you know, horrible. And then reading that you know, that he's doing, he's ready to make another minor.

I just help with the attorneys there. Get this little girl away from him. IT just became my mission because I know exactly what he was doing. I saw the emails.

They were the same emails to me, and they were the same letters, because in ninety six, the same letters he was writing in his hand, writing to this other fifteen year old girl IT. Just click that I was with the a predator, and I never, I never, I was just so groomed. I never wanted to believe .

IT legally, how were you able to marry doug?

I was able to marry doug because my mom signed off on the paperwork.

Did your parents priors that any adult have a conversation with you of like, this is what's going to change in your life if you marry this man?

Did anybody have that conversation with me?

Yeah like hey, if you get you're about to get married at sixteen like this is what's gonna en now? 嗯 no。

I mean, I really didn't even know what was onna happen on the honeymoon. I'd had no idea, really.

your wedding day, you are walking down, that I all, what do you remember feeling on that day?

I was beyond nervous because I just wanted to play the part for him, like I wanted him to be impressed with me. Like I was a woman. Me, I was a kid, so if I feel like I was playing drosse up in a sense, but I was so madly in love with him that I just like, I don't know, IT was just this really strange feeling that I always Carried with me. And I mean, the photo of my father walking me down the aisle is really interesting to me because he has this look on his face. And you can google like this, he has a look on his face where he's just so angry, but he's still doing IT, which which was really, you know which is I don't know .

how doesn't make you feel when you .

look at that photo angry yeah I I definitely know like the more awareness and therapy and the more I come to terms and let go through all of these things, i'm seeing things so much more clearly. It's so hard to see something so clearly when you're the one who is in you know that spotlight and you get so much you know, support but hate and like all of that, like it's so hard to just make sure that you're listening to a healthy amount IT all I believe that like, I just got to a place where I wish listening to so much negativity because that's that's really, I mate really didn't have that much self worth.

Did you ever ask your dad seeing that photo? Like why did you then walk me down the isle?

Note, my father has completely disowned ed me. He texted me and said, you were not my daughter. This was about three years ago, so I don't have a relationship with that man.

What triggered red him? This owning you.

my marriage to dug, because I was obviously old enough to make that decision. My mother, not wanting to be with my father because of my decision, he wanted to go with me. And that broke up their marriage.

He obviously hit the the bottle pretty hard。 I think he he's, he runs away from a lot of things. He's kind of always been like that, but he's, I really believed to like underneath at all.

He has a really scar, amazing, gentle man. He just doesn't know how to deal with any of this properly. I mean, you know, even serve killer parents like never do. There I do.

You mention that you were a virgin when you met dog, and you mentioned that you had no idea what the honeymoon was going to entail. What do you recall about that night and losing your originality and the whole experience?

I mean, for that whole experience for me was so like insane I mean, coming from a released like I grew up for her, cobain grew up and IT is like the most depressing freaking town. Nobody does anything like IT. You know, like it's insult from that to being pulled a week later into this.

I mean, I just, I just shut down. I disassociated myself. I tried the best I could to put on that that role. You know, because that's where grooming is. really. I you came from really small town, and then immediately lake right up in the hollywood hills, and you know, the honeymoon is going to be scheduled at the shutt home marmont paint house.

And I remember writing into the bathroom, shutting the door and just looking in the miring crying for, I don't know how long I was just crying, and I know I was feeling stuff that I wasn't necessarily letting myself process or IT wasn't old enough to process or something. I don't know. I take my bra off.

I was wearing those bomb shell Victoria secret brows to me without was like two big cup sizes. And then inside of that I had a cutlet, so they were like, and I was so freaked out to address, because i'm like, he's just, he's not gonna love me like this. Like he like, how? Like I looked like a kid. Like, I looked like a twelve year old with my cloth off. Little did I know IT was a fantastic night for him, but I was a complete nervous rock you were patristic .

to get on dressed.

Patch fy, yeah.

once you dad, did you ever loosen up? Or did you feel uncomfortable the whole time? Like, how did he handle well?

He gave me a little wine before when I went into the bathroom. So had a little wine at sixteen .

before you have sex for the first time with just .

a little yeah, were you without .

the first time you'd had to?

I had a coroner the day I arrived to doug's house with my family before we got marry, before we all judge after vegas the next day, remember, opened this verge and i'm like, i'm fucking a mancipation. I'm having a corona so that he was like my first corona ever so I started drinking when this yeah .

so at sixteen, starting to drink, right? Being married, you go to this honeymoon. Ask words, what was early marriage life like for the two of you?

I just remember waking up the morning after at the chatty, and I I was grown up with such a religious household. And I remember looking down at the sheet, the White sheet, and I was just, I was praying to got, I was like, please. And if for some reason I kind of felt like the one that wasn't good enough all the time, like, you know, like, please, I pretty god that there's some Cherry on there because if there's no freaking Cherry, like i'm not, I am not gonna good enough for this man.

Like, literally.

how sick is that? Like, I mean, i'm not putting down anybody's beliefs, but like for me, I just look back at IT and I just feel it's so sick and I I saw I was like, I felt like, okay, so this is ordained by god. Like this is in our daan situation.

How was he towards you after that first night together?

I have never seen him. So on top of the moon, I mean, I woke up and he had his little leg out on. He was playing the piano like, you know, he he just was, I mean, he just got to my less a child legally.

With a thirty .

four year .

difference between you and dog back then, what was presented to you that you guys had in common?

He would know he would always answer this question. So whether we would do like, you know, our media around, or he would do an interview I would interview, I would always kind of fall back on what he would tell everybody, like my dad and like, oh, yes. Okay, so that's that's how I answer this media question.

Would you have in common? We love, I love Lucy. You know, we love the honeymooners. We love you know you know A C D C and you know jack White in all these like bans that we really love. And it's it's so crazy how much we have in common. So that was like the how he would connect IT for people to be like, you know what i'm like a back door of life. She's like front door like we meet somewhere .

yeah with TV shows .

and music yeah what we're like.

dinners like between the two of you drinking .

all the time, drinking, drinking, drinking. And he condoned IT.

If anything, he pushed IT on you. I mean, you said the first night.

he never told me no.

Did you have to have sex with him, like on his a schedule?

I still have scars on me physical scaring. 扫描。

When did you start to realize? This may not be what I want to do forever with this mon.

I was way too Young to be crying on the kitchen floor every freaking night with a bottle of wine and opening another one I felt like I didn't have at that point in time, like seventeen years old. I didn't feel like I had anybody in my corner. I felt like because I was being told to commit suicide at sixteen.

And I mean, every moment I would turn around, there be another hit piece, you in the grocery store, some roles, you know, people talking about him, dressing or behaving. And little did they know that that that is a part of grooming. I was trying to be that part, right? Yeah, that that part really did a ducey on my myself worth, really.

When did you realize he had a drinking problem?

Gradually because when we when he first was reaching out to me, you know, he was claiming that he was getting sober and he wanted be sob and he was cleaning up his life and things like that. And I believe, tim, I don't know anything really about IT anyway, and I know my dad drink a lot, but I wasn't really like close with him. So I wasn't something like alarming thing. But IT became an issue probably two months into our relationship when I started noticing like jacket and hide. Okay, you know.

like what was IT like living as a child with an alcoholic ult in a house together.

which time with my daughter dug? I okay. Um there there are so many account. I mean, that IT was almost every night, I mean.

for years. And were you scared in the house?

yeah. There was a gun. I mean, I yeah, I mean, you know.

did he everyone, he was .

drunk. Take IT out. I, I, I don't want to legally talk about that right now.

Was dug physically and verbally abusive.

He was extremely emotionally abusive to me, at times physical, but mostly emotionally and abusive because I think that that the ultimate power a rumer has over a child is that emotional um abuse and control.

Yeah where you always playing the car and then behind the scenes kind of trying to figure out at one point in the escape plan.

we separated a couple times. But every time we separated, I just felt like I currently without him. I mean, I was reaped a few times when I left him and I and I go back to him and he just kind of like, what what do you expect?

Yeah, you left me like, you know, i'm the one who loves you and the one who takes care of you. And so that's why IT took so long. You know, the media is always onder where IT takes so long.

That's what was happening. Is this abuse as emotional abuse? And I think too, like so many victims and survivors, blame ourselves.

We blame ourselves because we think it's our fault. But the full picture is the the abuser is the one who is controlling. That is not your fault at all. And I wish I could have told myself these things in those moments. Yeah, this is a deep one.

amazing.

seriously. So I feel like i'm on opa right now.

You did bring up during the me too movement those sexual assaults. Can you explain what happened?

Just more, more adult men exploiting either a minor or a very Young teenage girl at that point in time.

When you when this happened to you, because you explain you are on a break with dug, like your initial reaction was to run back to him, which if people aren't educated, theyd be like what the fact that makes so much sense?

I got that a lot. You know, when I chose to go back with him the first time, I, in even some salary, friends were like, what the fucker you doing like wiring the hello, you doing that in? It's so hard to explain this to somebody who hasn't been .

through IT now, knowing like what are some tangible red flags to look for that indicate room me.

I feel like you can google le a sociopaths get the exact same definition, charming intelligence. In a path someone who can disarm you, disarm your family. And that's the scary part. It's like you don't how can you always, you know, spot that .

the public hate you are getting, not only just from like random people, like celebrities. You got courtney love called you publicly a horr Anderson Cooper shamed you on national television and Chris egan took IT to a new level. SHE publicly wished you dead.

And at the time, IT seems .

like no one gave a fuck. No one saw anything wrong with IT. Some of her tweet, I hate you, go to sleep forever. What drugs make you do that with your mouth?

Asking da.

asking for a friend who really wants to know how to look like an idiot. Thanks to confirm. Have you ever met Chris again?

Not have I only not met her, but I ve never spoken to her in my life. Like, and I actually really liked her. Like, I followed her.

I mean, obviously I love john legend. Like, I love. I just was like, I was following them.

And then I started seeing this on my timeline and I was like. But I love you. I just like this feeling, but I really like you. But like other than that, at that time, because I was so Young, I don't think I processed how deeply that LED to my future depression.

I mean, you're literally getting publicly shame for .

but at that point time as a kid I was just like I was just like, oh, he's SHE sexualized toddlers and SHE are is like, oh, big deal because I was a kid, right?

I mean, he was shaming lenzing loan SHE was struggling with a lot of you know, her own staff and I just I just freaking love linsey like, you know, I think Christy was in a really SHE had to have been a really dark place to tell these child, children and women you know these things too, I don't know, make yourself feel Better about herself. I know now you know she's she's saying she's doing the best he, canada really hope that SHE means that, you know, if that stuff continues, were just gonna see more suicides. Unfortunately it's not gonna help.

Those were public tweet. Did SHE SHE privately message you right?

SHE privately message me a lot. IT was like, sometimes IT was like, really late, like two in the more like, you know, and I don't know what I was. IT wasn't just like one or two tweet, you know, like cotton of, you know, just coming a horb deal.

love you too. But Chris IT was like, IT was over. Wasn't IT over, like two years of her was .

a really long time. What was SHE .

privately messaging me? SHE privately message me.

I specifically remember red this one because I was, I was just like, so shocked, right? IT was really early in the morning at some point. This was a really, I mean, this was a frequent decade ago.

I know a lot of people can change in that time frame, but I didn't hear from her when he apologized. I was blocked from everything SHE message me. Um I cannot wait for you to die. And that was just one of them that I remember. And then publicly issue was saying, you know, dirt nap or something, you know, I can't wait for you to take a dirt nap and he was just obsessed with seeing me die.

If you could say something to Christy tegan right now, like what would you say to her if you saw her?

I, I really don't have anything to say to her. I don't need to speak to region a George. It's not something I need. I don't need that. I'm linsey.

Like I will push you in front of a bash. No, no. I I think that's a very mature of you. So you were on multiple reality shows. How did you make the decision to enter reality television?

I didn't. My pedophile husb is the one who decided to. Sign me up for things because, you know, he needed the money.

Another misconception, as people thought I was a gold digger, I marry him for money. I'm the one who was taking care of him. That's why I entered reality TV. Because I felt I had to I mean, he controlled the bank account.

I didn't even know how to write a check so whenever I was sent him to something that felt almost like a conservative ship right away um but yeah I I was the one making the money and that's why I would do the show. I think I would get so sick before the shows. I know my mother, daughter, I was so underweight.

I felt so anorexic before that. I mean, I went on the show. I was throwing up right when I got there. I was throwing up nothing. I have anything to eat in a few days.

I was in eating on sad, you know, I, I just, I got to a point where I was so freaking sad. And I was sent to the hospital on the show because of the, because they just, I was gna fin like I was so sick. But really, doug Carried about me finishing IT out and getting the money, and then returning IT to him so you would get the money.

and then he would take care of the finances. Do you think that the the amount of hate you are getting even bonded you more with dog because it's like.

absolutely we felt like bonding. And clyde, I mean, that's what he would tell me ah you know he was like, you know we're boney and client baby, it's you and I and there were things that would bond us together, right, that only we would know an abusive tacs said he would put into play throughout the ten years.

Can you give an example with or anything he would say if he .

got to a point where he would have to convince me just just to do IT like he would be pushing me, like, literally, like pushing like the conservatives. Or you have to go collect this money. You know, you are the, what did he call me something all the time? He called me the golden goose.

You're the gold in. Gosh, you got, you know, we're gonna have got to pay the run. You know, that's that's, that's what IT is. And then he would guilt treat me if I didn't want to do IT if I said I was too sick or at not mentally, I can't know. I need a break.

You were on celebrity big brother when you were eighteen. This was the first time you were really apart from dug. yeah. Can you take us through what I was like moving into that house and what that experience was like?

When we got to london, I remember being on a hotel room in the room. I'm just I have this trauma right now that i'm just even thinking about this. But he was standing there, doug was standing there, and I IT was holding on his legs, and I was just crying my eyes out because I knew the producers were gonna pick me up.

And this was the first time I ever truly away from him. I couldn't breathe like being away from this man. That's how room room I was. I I didn't know how the hell I was gonna get away from him, to be away from him for a few weeks or month, a month or whatever. And I was so destroy, and I was so depressed.

But then by the time I got on the show, and by the time I you became friends with dust and diamond like he, he was the one who was in there that kind of made me realize some things in my relationship with dog. And by the time I ended the show, I knew I, I, I didn't want to be with him anymore. I knew there is something not up right like that, that wasn't right.

And by the time we got back to the U. S, I told them I wanted a separation. And that's when I finally fell free enough to get away from him, strong enough to get away from him. I was assaulted and then I went back yeah.

that's a pretty big moment to realize what was helping you process that.

Space, I mean, really space, you know, I kind of felt like college for me, or something like I when I went away to college. And I IT just means me really, as I don't I don't need him controlling me outside of this. Like, I don't I don't need that. But at that point time, I felt completely impossible to get away .

from your experience on a celebrity. Big brother was the first moment you had to see, like, what life would be like without dug. Then a few years later, you wind up on another reality show that focuses on your relationship with your mom. The mom and daughter experiment when you went on the show, what was the status of your relationship with your mother?

At that point, I hadn't spoken with my mom for two years. IT was such a really hard situation, because dug was isolated me from my entire family at that point time. So I blamed her for a lot, and I was just in this really confused mindsight.

So the producers kept my mother off of the first night, off of the property. Everybody else could be on the property hiding my to my, you know, natrolite non's mom and, you know, real housewives. They could all be there, but my mom couldn't be there because they knew of what a fragile situation IT was.

And then the next episode, the introduced ed turn in IT, was just so IT IT was so difficult for me to finish this. The to finish, I was completely under way. I was so sick.

I was taking too many things, you know, because my mom would be telling me one thing, and then I would be telling me another. And then the whole world, celebrities and strangers and france would be telling me other thing. So I just completely disassociated myself for myself, and that made me really, really sick. So i'm surprised I got through that entire reality, showed to tell .

the truth on the show. We find out that your mom was having an emotional affair with dug your husband at the time, and that dog had sexual fantasies .

involving here. We, with. This is a heavy one.

We find out that dug had sexual fantasies involving the three of you. What was your mom's relationship with dog?

I'm still working on that therapy.

okay. And do you know when when those things were set on the show?

Yes.

are they true?

When I met dug, he would go up and kiss a friend of mine on the lips mediately IT wasn't anything that was like, you know, like, you know, anything like that, but he was very charming. Oh, how are you? And I was nice, you know, and i've had so many people tell me that I just made them feel so uncomfortable.

They felt assaulted bright. But in his head I would talk him about IT. And in his head it's like, what you mean? I'm just greeting them.

I'm greeting them. Oh yeah, actually. So, oh, you know, oh, all right. But IT IT felt like that for a lot of women. And he did the same thing to my mother.

Did doug talk about your mom and sexual ways?

never. I, I personally never OK never, never heard that.

So when you were addressing your mom on the show saying, you know, I know you're having an emotional fair with dog, where did you hear that information from dog?

Again, my mom has had her own experiences in life. I really, we have seen her fall in love with my husband through me. So IT was like this, you know, I don't know.

I mean, shavin told me, a we, you and I like some twins, whatever you feel, I feel. And so I was a kid, and he was going along with her kid with this situation, right? I'm still healing from this.

Do you know if they ever had a sexual relationship?

You know, I, I would never know. You know, usually I would say absolutely not. You know, that's crazy, but my life has been, I mean, when I got to sleep, my dreams are so Normal.

And then when I wake up, my life is so freaking insane. So I just like to sleep most of the day. I got up early for this. Okay.

I D be sleep, appreciate. Okay, so you does IT does IT haunt you a little bit that you don't have .

that answer. I'm hunted by a lot of shit. Um it's not on the top of my agenda right now because I have so many of the things that like i'm i'm dealing worth than going through and trying to make sense of. I definitely think eventually it's obviously I mean, i'll get to IT what .

impacted reality T V have on your body image.

I don't know those necessarily really. T V, I think was mostly the media when I shot into like this cannabis, like I was everywhere overnight. I, you know, when your teenager, you see yourself certain way in your mayor, right? You're listening to work and tray songs, listening to you just think, yeah, am I A good and then, you know, you see yourself every angle in the media.

And IT completely shared red me. So I had my briston right when I turned eighteen. Like that was something that I needed to do for myself, because everybody already thought that I had these big bubs. And, you know, I was already bullied for them and you know, you know, when a doctor drew.

can we talk about that? Because I watch that clip. I don't know how that just got passed everyone at to anyone that's not watched IT you're sixteen years old, you go on doctor jew show and quite literally, my mouth drop when I watched IT this morning of you on a table in front of a live audience and they're basically doing like an ultrasound on your boobs to see if they're real because people didn't believe they were real at the time.

I like sixteen, right?

Who made, yes, who made that decision for you to go .

on the show that did?

And how would he present those ideas to you?

money? At that point in time, I completely was like, okay, I guess this is, you know what I need to do I mean, that was the thought of a child. I feel like, you know, it's clinic that's that's what he wants me to do when I was so far in deep already that I just I just kind of like became that persona when you talk .

about getting your breast on at eighteen, what was the decision to get them done?

I wanted to be the woman everybody expected me to be, you know, from strangers and media and everything else. I just felt like I I needed to put that persona yeah right. And dug kind of benefited from there as well.

Like, you know, all look at me. I'm not just with a kid, just like a kid. So many people fell for that.

I am so ready to get them. I mean, like, I have so many massages every week. I am so much pain.

I loved having them. I'm not against plastic surgery. I think right if if you want to do something to your body, that is your old breaking choice. I don't have anything wrong with that at all. But my back feels like a ninety old woman like i'm so tired .

things .

ah yeah so all of .

these shows, I mean, there's interviews on interviews with U N dog. And eventually the relationship ended. How did you end? And how did you tell him you wanted IT to end?

I just started shutting him out. Okay, I just distance myself from him so much to the point where I, I, I didn't let him in anymore. I grew up and I started releasing what what was happening to me. I don't think I would be sitting here right now if I wouldn't have .

divorced him. When did you tell him you wanted to .

divorce and how? I don't know if I ever did.

Kay.

I was at a place where, you know, I knew he was in such control. I felt like I had grade acquaintance, but no one who I can relief completely open up entries. So I just, I fell into myself, and I was just always prying that he would leave before I was too late for me.

I, I just remember praying in waiting and hoping he would leave, which he eventually did. He eventually laughed. He went to michigan, moved in with his dad, who is like, freaking eighty or something.

And, you know, dugan, have anything? And I felt responsible for that. Somehow you made me feel responsible for that. But I kept, I just kept my eye on the prize. And that was my health, setting good boundaries for myself, being strong, even in those moments where I didn't want to make IT anymore. I mean, really, I just, you know, there are so many times, but then you would always have to put on that brave face for everybody, because everybody would see me differently. So I would have to really, you know, just like like a light, they go into that character.

I mean, anyone that has a fucking brain should be like, this girl needs help. She's a child he doesn't know.

But I also think society now, like, has changed so much. I mean, this marriage took place before I meet you, before IT times up, I feel like in this generation right now, this was so public, I feel like going to army of people would become, like, know, being on my door, dragging me out. But then the scary part is to me too, is that it's still freaking happening to people who aren't as high profile as me and who don't have those resources.

What were the next few months of your life? Like trying to like, figure out life without him because you had been with him for over seven, eight years.

He was ten years. But the time we are are divorce yeah wherever you go there you are right. So my trust issues are so.

Prevalent in my current relationship, I engaged I mean but also with my friendships with my my family. I just have these severe, severe, severe trust issues with so many different people. Um but IT IT definitely affects my my ability open up to people in a genuine way. It's really hard for me to do that because I was so crush at as as a child you know and and especially so publicly .

publicly abuse like you are a survivor, you are you came in and immediately like ob take my phone I don't want doug to call. What can you explain what's going on?

I blocked him recently because he's been reaching out to me. You know, he knows that i'm moving on. He knows i'm I am trying to and I am happy and I find moments of happiness and i'm finding myself and I mean, the most recently thing, he just reach out to me a few months ago asking me for his guitar that he wants back and it's almost like that x calling and say, hey, I left to sock at your about eight years ago. You think you could not like, maybe send IT back to me, you know, but like I was just, you know, IT just so obvious that he is still trying to victim claim control. You know, even after just knowing that he was just doing this to a fifteen year old girl less than a month and a half .

ago moving forward, how are you going to handle that relationship with dug?

I am never going to seeking him again, like I get like, ever, ever. I, I, I, I will never let him in. And I like, I feel like I have a really .

good .

predator rate are now like I am, I am probably way to hypersensitive but like I can see someone that walks in a room and I can just i'm so hypersensitive i'm an an path and I just, yeah yeah.

Do you think that doug should be in jail?

I think he should be. Looked into way more then he has been.

And that. Will determine .

whether he needs to be you know yeah but based on everything i've heard, based on everything I mean.

yeah fifteen year old, that should be more than looked into. What is as we wrap up, everyone going to see courtine start in. What is a misconception about you if people are listening, that you would not even like to clear up, that you're just like that.

This is not who I am. This is who I am because we've seen so much of you through your youth. And IT was obviously skill. yeah. What do you want people to know?

I was not a child bride. I was a child who was exploited. I think that dad is something that people should think about um .

you're writing your book, which we've heard about. We're going to keep an eye out for IT and and you've talked to about how you want to help through this book. Others that are going through anything similar to your your struggle. What do you hope readers, when IT does come out, take from .

your book every detail? Like, be very afraid.

You know who you are. Are you going to use names in your book? Good for you. Can you give us one?

You think so? Oh, my. G he's married.

So, you know, her husband is not the best man, just say that.

Are you writing details about what happened? How does IT make you feel to is IT like a recent laming moment for you?

IT is but I think that it's reality.

I am excited for the world to hear you in this light and and through a new voice, which is your voice is not someone else is it's not sued by an abuse or because your your phenomenal and you're survivor and your and you're incredible and you're smart and you have you have the rest of your life in front of you and the fact that you're in the therapy journey, you're open about, you know the hardships that you been through but also the way you're so positively talking but also realistically talking, like it's not easy some days I don't want to get out of bed. So many women are going to relate to this story and probably find the strength that you're talking about within themself to like get through another day and just take IT.

That's the only reason why I am doing this honestly like I don't think I could find the strength to do this for myself. And so I mean, we're so pro women now. I think that is so importantly, we should have been, but it's so important right now.

And it's really the only reason why I find the strength to speak out near about, ask yourself. So I felt so safe to sit down with you today. So thank you.

Thank thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.