Colton Underwood: A CHD Exclusive (FBF)
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Hi guys, before we get into the episode, I just wanted to give you guys a trigger warning that this episode does contain references to suicide radiation and attempt take care of yourself studies I love you enjoy. What is your daddy game? IT is your founding father, alex Cooper, we've call her.

Daddy game, there is a lot of controversy surrounding this week's guest. I was debating, should I even have this person on the show? And my initial reaction was, I am going to put this person in the hot seat because he made a lot of border line unacceptable mistakes.

Our guests this week is cult on underwood. All you may know about him at this point is he was a dating twenty plus women at one time, trying to find his future wife on reality television. In that whole time, he was hiding a secret so big that he planned to die protecting IT.

Cottons left the bachelor with a serious girlfriend who he intended to marry, but his story took a twisted turn when they broke up and he broke down. SHE filed a restraining order against him. Someone tried to black male and threatened to reveal his secret in cotton, hit rock bottom and tried to take his own life.

When cotton woke up from that failed suicide attempt, he knew he was time to face his true identity. Kolton underwood is gay, and this is the very complicated and a story of his coming out. Dad, again, I urge you to listen to this episode with an open mind.

Maybe you'll hate the student, and you have no interest in why he made the decision he made. Or after hearing more of the story than just the headlines and articles that you've read, you may be able to relate to him on some level. That is for you to decide. Called an underwood. Yes, welcome to call .

her daddy be .

before watching your show, i'm going to be honest. I had my prehension ve notions. I read you in the media. I watch you on the bacheller. But watching your documentary, documentary, you calling you document ies.

I don't is a series series.

okay? It's a series to anyone that hasn't watched IT yet. Can you give a little bit of like the premise and like why you decided to do this?

Well, I mean, I went back forth whether I was going to do IT this way or not, mainly because I obviously had a lot of anxiety of coming off the shows that I did. But when I really SAT and thought about know my life and what really got me, hating myself, hating my actions, hating like just really the situation that I was in, he was because of all of these things that happened in my past, and I never had somebody to look at to be like a wait.

This is what i'm going through. So I think eventually, that sort of why I documented basically my coming out, walking through, you know, my upbringing in the church and then playing football, all of these really masculine, toxic, masculine situations that pretty much just shove to me in the closet for a long time. And I brought a lot of that on myself.

In no way, shape, perform was this process to shift blame or focus. I take ownership where I feel like it's important, but I also asking and calling on two communities that really have a lot of growing to do and our sort of the last in our society to really have acceptance. And that's the church and sports in .

the beginning, you start, you're coming out and you're coming out to your family and your friends. And during that process, I noticed that a lot of times one of the first question someone would ask you once you came out to them was, when did you know? yeah.

And your response was always like, about six years old. Six years old. I started to know what happened when you were six that made you start to like, realize, like i'm born interested .

in then I think so. Six I knew as different. I wasn't like the other kids or I wasn't like the other boys in my class and I couldn't really fully process IT until high school to really understand that like hey, i'm attracted to men to to other you know guys um so I don't think there was like one specific thing when I was six.

It's so hard but yet so simple takes because like just like you know you're straight. I thought I just knew something was different but I couldn't really be that because like you said groing, I went to kater great school too. Boys were just to be into girls, and girls were to be into boys. And that god's were supposedly, and there was all these signals from such a Young age that honestly, and I wasn't like this last year when I was first coming up, but i've had now a year under my built to really sit and figure out why, but I feel like I was almost reprogramed in those circumstances that I grew up in to really sort of try to require me. And I just didn't work well.

that's what I remember watching the dog when you were like, my brother didn't have to come out. You don't have to come out. So why I would should someone else have to come out? And that's something I think hopefully like a series like yours is going to start to try to Normalize.

Like IT couldn't be this. There IT should be everyone or no one. What when you're talking about when you're Younger, like was there something that prevented you from openly talking about this?

Oh yeah, I mean, you know, the catholic church know confession. I went to confession once a week. And you're taught from such a Young age that homosexuality is a sin and mastermaid as a sin. All of these all of these things that you know you're awkward anyway when you're that age and trying to figure out like know the first time you get a bone or or like you're turned on, you're like what is going on here with my body but you don't really have the space to explore IT IT sounds ds silly but like I just remembered like being turned on by boys and by other guys so I didn't know how to process IT that Young. That's why I said I didn't really fully hit me until high school, but I just knew that there is something different with me at that age.

And so you made a decision openly. You were opening like, i'm A i'm a virgin, yes. And do you think that that was half and half of like because you were raised catholic and also because you were drawing towards men or like was IT just fully one or the other?

I think I was just scared to go to the next step with know a woman or you know at the time a man ah because I was like way, you know I I don't want to get myself into this if i'm gay, but also I don't want to act on being gay because i'm scared of the repercussions in my worklife.

I mean, at the time there was no other other gay football players, and in college, I I had a very good career, and I didn't want to be destruction to the team and coaches and other players in the locker room weren't very friendly. I say, I say, I think in the show too, I like the lockers is extremely homopoulo, but it's also very homoerotic where it's like slapping of the ass, you commenting on each other, dicks and then all of a sudden being called a fag and queer and all these directories that you're like weight hold on. And eventually for someone in the class that you're like, this is really messed up.

Can you explain to me like what was like Young cultus experience in that lock, like navigating IT hiding?

I mean, I I wouldn't shower after practice because I was afraid of getting turned on in the locker room or in in the shower. And I mean, I never really was attracted to anybody who I played with her coaches. So I like it's sort of silly and say that, but I wanted to avoid any chance of being outed.

So I would not show. And with the rest of the team, I would leave. I would change in a corner or changing a stall.

There is just a lot of things that I sort of did differently than other players because I felt like I had to, because I just, I didn't want questions to start being asked. You know, I A drink and slept t and played football like that was pretty much IT. And I would not party.

I would slept in my own house parties in college. And it's because I was afraid that if I got drunk, I would begin like, I was literally that simple, but I didn't tell people that I was. As you know, i'm more focused on my career right now, that sort of how I leaned into IT.

I could never explain to the bachelor fans like why was a virgin? I never can give a good enough for reason because I wasn't. I am a man of faith, but i'm not a man of faith that level where it's like, hey, you know and I think people could read through .

that a little bit yeah .

but I never wanted to give them excuse to call me gave them because that's the next thing when you hear someone's a virgin is oh because they are gay or maybe they're questioning things and it's like I can't be the bachelor and in front of americans say i'm struggling with my sexuality like that. There's not that type of space for that audience in for that position. And I knew that that's why I signed up for IT.

Well, that was what I like. We're going to a get into that whole concept of being on reality TV making a decision to go in front of everyone. But let's go back to what was your first like sexual experience in high school.

Well, I had a girlfriend, and I was a stereotypical captain, football team captain in the trAiling squad. And SHE put her hands down my pants, had a boner. And I I was excited about IT.

But also, I just remember when IT happened, IT felt so wrong and IT wasn't wrong in the fact of like you're singing or you're doing something just like this is not what you're into like what is happening? Why are you doing this? Almost all that in the next day.

Then I sort of went back up with her. And then rumors are around the high school that I was gay because someone, you know, touched my deck. And then I was IT.

Was that moment, though, that I was like, okay, I either have to stop dating women and putting myself in this position, or I have to come out and figure this out. So I just avoided IT from there. Pretty much there are. Now.

what did you like, did you say anything to people that were like, oh, like your day? Like, why did you break up with her? Like.

did you combat at all? I really couldn't because I like, I was just wasn't right. I wasn't feeling IT like that was sort .

of my goal to when you came out. Like, did anyone have one of those moments that they were like, you know why I like, we did kind of know like that, was there any family members or friends, or was IT like such a secret that you, that no one had any inclined?

Two people, and one happened on camera with capacity, and then the other one was manana. And god, she's like, the moment I heard that you are coming home with cameras again I knew what I was about and I was like, oh my gosh pucker .

SHE had you on the show? Did you consider .

we filmed with her? And just there was some stuff with my leno's family that got IT. Honestly, i'm glad that I left them out to protect you know, bit in they didn't sign up for a whole lot.

A lot of people did IT. And that's to like to credit everyone who participated in the show like to give them an opportunity to sit with that type of thing. I tip my hat. That was one of the big things for me is like i'm really about to put a lot of people in my life an uncomfortable position.

The big moment was like, we were all waiting to see, like, what was your dada's reaction gna be and i'm sure so many kids like, would wish that their parent would act exactly how your father did like IT was like his support for you and him going to new york with you and being there for you. And oh my, I remember the moment where he was like, I will tell people if if you're getting sick of telling people like I will be the one like, how did that feel .

like when he said that I got goose mps because I played that conversation out in my mind millions of times throughout my life and you know, there was a version of like, I love you. I know he's going to love you. I'm going to support you I thought that was the best if you would asked me going into the question, what is the greatest action? But then he took IT to the next level, which I never would have expected in a millions years.

As a father who is a proud conservative republican like he has no problem missing that. That was a moment when I was like, holy crap, like this is, this is amazing. You know, my message to people, now that i've actually had a year of sitting with the is like, you have to give people a chance.

You have to give people an opportunity. And you know, he said that two years, like, I just wish you would have trust me with this earlier and you have regrets but than also it's like a yeah, I don't want to contradict your self because I like, I want to live my life and will I mess up? yes.

Will I make mistakes? yes. Do I have regrets? Of course, I can do million things Better. Yeah, that's one of on that. You know, looking back, IT would have been nice to maybe give him a chance earlier in my life to be there and support me and love me, but I think he stepped up and majority when .

I counted back to the locker. You discuss how the locked room can be one of the most homology and homophobic settings. Can you explain that concept in those terms?

yes. So I guess like the best example for me to use, and this is like a legit real example. You know, i'd be sitting in my knocker and a guy would walk by going to go to the shower and comment on another guys penis size you or just like saying that's big or know stuff like that or say like, oh, you like comment on a nice as and that's what i'm saying it's a little homoerotic or they talk about you the their sex lives, very proud, you know, publicly and in your sort of in your face and then within seconds, if you stare at the dig too long, it's what you do in fag, like all of us in the the flip switches where there's like an appropriate time that you can look. But if you take IT one second too, too long, you all of a sudden are gay. And IT was super confusing because i'm sitting in like weight maybe other men, especially in this locker er room, are questioning or struggling with their sexuality too and then as soon as like that flicker of hope for me IT flip to slice and homophobia, i'm like, uh, okay, never mind. It's just me.

Did you make those comments as well?

No, I stayed completely away from that. I kept my eyes locked on eyes all times. And I played IT very, I played IT very safe because I just didn't want give anybody a reason to come at me. It's really was a mindfulness .

and you never .

talk to anyone about IT. No, I I honestly, I probably had people in my life that I could have trust IT, but I didn't .

trust anybody early on, anybody.

Was there ever a moment in high school that you considered opening up to anyone?

High school now, college, not really even college either. My thought process was always the next stage of my life. So it's like in high school, I didn't want to lose my scholarship and then in college, I didn't want to lose a shot out being able to go pro.

I don't want to be a distraction. And then once pro, I didn't want to lose my job. And then after that, I had a lot going on and I wasn't sure what I wanted to do with my life.

And then I signed up for bachelor. And then after that, I didn't want to lose trust. I didn't want to lose. So just always, my thought process was always going on to, how is this going to affect me in my future?

How do you define internalized tophole .

a for me, IT was not giving myself any space to explore my feminine side. IT was not me giving myself any space to really experiment or emotionally connected with men. I say that because, you know, while I was closed, I did experiment physically, but I was, and still is, even to this day, like, I still talked my therapy about this.

I did IT just for pleasure, know. I did IT to get off and then back to my state life. That was sort of how I did things. So there was a lot of internalize homophily a in shame after I did hook up with men and sit with IT and I was like, okay, that's wrong, literally prayed and said, OK, i'm not going to do that again and then i'd get horning two weeks later.

And he was a cycle, right? But that's like the type of homophone a that I was sort of I sort of group in and around, and that's all that I really knew. So that's like when guys called mountain in one of the first is like, that is internationally homophily a and I was like, oh, wait, you're right. I am internally homophily c against myself and IT i'm still I will say that i'm still shaking and catching myself at times. I still have some homophily a internalized homophily a in my little hitches here in their .

like weight and how can not? Lt, like, you literally lived trying to suppress a natural feeling that you were having. And like, hating.

I'm massin about yourself being like you said in your serious you like, I was literally praying the game away. Like there were moments run like, please. Like, let this be the moment that I can turn straight when you talk about hooking up with guys. When was the first time that you had like a experience with a guys .

actually when I was twenty one and literally on my twenty first first day? But I will say this, like I only hooked up with guys when I was single, like there was never times when I was in a committed relationship and I was not very educated either on risks sexually with HIV and anything gay I didn't look at. So I never even educated myself, which I know now to do Better. And i've learned since coming out about all that. But i've want to make that clear to is like, there know I didn't when I was growing up and when I was going through all of that, I was making sure that I at least was trying to be as respectful, not only to myself, but whoever I was involved without the time.

Were you nervous that like picking people specifically so that, like, what if I told someone you know? I mean, like, was IT people in college? Like, how did you navigate that? That were you terrified?

No, well, yes, I was terrified being the bachelor because it's like, oh, my, my faces, plasters everywhere.

How old are you when you .

became the bachelor or twenty six?

You were like, are these guys going to come forward?

totally? There was a lot of anxiety and sleepiness nights. And you know, I don't either got lucky or I was very careful. And to be honest with you, I don't care.

I'll just tell you IT, to be honest with you, a lot of the men that I hold up with where I think straight in their real life too, there are pretty close set in themselves. So I don't think there is any man that was going to be coming out to get me because they would be outing themselves as well. And IT wasn't like a ton of men. Yeah, that was like a few and they never had my real name. They never ask how put, like how sort of scared and secretive IT all was.

I remember your season. I remember I watched IT mashona nation and I remember people tweet being like, I don't know if he's a virgin, like booked that like everyone go fine, like a chick that he's fucked and so is fucking terrifying sometimes when you know if people will go to the end of the earth to find your shit. And I can only imagine, like, did the bachelor people be like, is there anything we need to know before you come on? And did you have to look at them be like, no, i'm average in I was very.

very concerned of very word OK. I did hear a rumor though, that one of the producers ended up finding out that I did hook up of the man, but captive secret or took care of IT. I don't know. I I can't verify that.

I mean, obviously that was terrifying to and it's also IT was also for me hard because I felt I obviously a lot of shame, but then I also felt shame and lying, deceiving yeah but then I couldn't really be honest to work through IT with people I mean, doing. I do think if I would have been up for an honest from the very beginning, people would have supported and been OK with IT. I think some people would have had a lot to say too and the other way around but .

it's like when you say like be honest, it's like that's why I want people to watch your show because it's like this is something you've been Carrying and people can call IT a lie. But like you've been Carrying this part of yourself that you haven't been able to one explore or accept so how the fuck are people going to be judge mental?

Anyone's process of coming out like you literally were like you just said internalizing how much you hated a part of yourself that is like everyone sexually. That's like our biggest coming of age moment when we're like in ten years, it's like how are we going to in the fact that you couldn't actually genuinely explore like that's fucking hard in your new show coming out, called him you go and you visit your coach. Tell me about your teacher's response to you going and coming out to your high school coach.

Well, first, like the reason I had the conversation with him is because I have so much love and respect for him and I said in in there, like, he's like a second dad to me.

Why did you love him?

He was always in my corner and always there for me in the most obvious ways, as me, as a player, me as know, the growth of me as a human being could have done Better at certains, of course he could have. And that was sort of what I had to get off my chest to him of saying, like, it's frustrating, but as I love you and care for you so much and have so much to thank you for, like you helps pay for my college education by allowing me to be such a good football player and having my back in talking to coaches for me.

But there's also this big part of me that you didn't know that some things that you didn't set in a loud, your coaching stuff and some of the players to say stuck with me and I mean, as much as you want to sit there, be like i'm brushed to for you for him yeah it's much bigger than one singular person. He is a good man with a good heart, and I will always say that about about him. But this is small town amErica threw through, and this is locker rooms through, in, through.

There was an opportunity that I would have love for him on camera to say, hey, i'm a coach. I affect players and students on a daily basis. How can I help shift this narrative? And he didn't do that, but he did pick up the phone and call me later that night. We spent two hours on the phone later that night, which is unfortunate.

No, but that is literally like helps clarify. And I think that some listen, someone that you look looked up to on camera, his reaction was like pretty dull and like a little distant. And there was a part of me that also was like looking behind your head in the camera and seeing sixty plus kids on a field. And half of them could be gay or struggling with their sexuality and it's like, yeah, that was such a missed opportunity and I know that not either of your duty to like you go and talk to these kids, but the party you wanted to be like, let's reintroduced the real column like, talk to these kids like, that could really help one of them. Like, what would you say if you had the chance to, like, stand in the locker room right now with those kids and be like, let me change this culture for you?

Well, it's not gonna one person that changes IT total. It's no matter what I said in that locker, I can't change IT as one man.

You know, it's a collective effort and it's conversations like this to help explained to people like what I went IT like that program and that school hung has had on me and my name for a while, while I was playing there and while I was playing in college and even know professionally, they would, you know, this is we're cultor played like that was said. But would they still say that if they knew I was gay? That was always my fear in my question.

I'll show this with you too. I cause I just happened yesterday. My small town is not very happy that I did this. They didn't know what I was about, and they feel like it's not a great representation, and they claim it's gotten Better. I posted on my instagram yesterday.

I had people from kenya, india, china, japan, international people banking me and saying, the sports culture in the religion culture, those episodes really stuck with me. And then i'm scoring through my messages. And I see bag with three colonial gies and I go to visit the kid's profile.

It's a student from my town that goes to my high school plays on our foobar team. I think i'm sharing that because it's it's important because people in my town and people in small town's like it's gotten Better and we're inclusive. No, i'm in a position and i'm surrounded by love and i'm surrounded by a support system that that does not get to me.

But I had to put trigger warning before I posted in an instagram to get down. But I was like, how can you message me that and you don't allow me to post this? Anyway, that affects people. Words hurt. Like words keep people on the closet and that's one student that maybe he's said that to two or three kids maybe you know to your point out of those sixty kids, maybe one or two of them are you know either by sexual, trans or gay. And maybe if the coaching staff and the captain of the i'm not going to put IT all in the coaching staff, but the other teachers, then I heard IT from teachers, I heard IT from, you know, big father like figures in in our society and in our town. But if they've sort of put their foot down and said, hey, let's not do that.

IT could help. You could help because like you're a hot dude and you are White and you are privileged. And so it's like the fact that you're using your platform, not everyone gets a netlik series.

You using your platform and showing people like this is my journey, but you're not you're not saying like mine is so, so much harder than everyone. It's just shutting light on like you. This is what's happening. And like, let's start the conversation and keep IT going.

And i'll say this of that because I see the criticism. I know that people are upset that I I have White privilege. I got a series after coming out.

I couldn't imagine what it's like to be someone from an underprivileged area to have to come out and not only risk losing their footing all but risk losing a house in food, in money. Those the real things, are we to a point in society where we can pick and choose and compare traumas. I don't think we are you.

And that was never my goal, too. And I never wanted to compare my trauma, anybody else. I just wanted to get my side out there, my story out there, to say, here, this is what i've been through. And if people, especially from rashin a nation, will tune in and listen to me, then I feel like i've done my part and starting the conversation. And there's so much more I can do.

So okay, we're done with locker room. Let's go into the bachelor or yes.

Work down with the locker room. Let's go into the bachelor. Or yes, how did you end up on .

the bachelor at well after a foobar? I was in a pretty public relationship. I got out of that, and I was going through a lawsuit then with one of my former teams about my shoulder. And I just made the decision with my doctor that I couldn't play again.

So i'm like, okay, well, i've been playing this for seventeen years, literally how I paid my bills and now what? And I asked my data, I said, hey, I just want to hear off like, I feel like i'm in a position. I feel like I and this like, let me just take a year off. Don't judge me. I just want to figure this out.

However, I asked for permission if I could take a year off.

but know a lot of i'm so good idea said that because a lot of my friends call me out for that because I always have to ask for approval. I was like, you have to realize I had a coach and multiple coaches that I had to get permission from further my structure of my day, my entire life, all we done in my classes. So I always ask for permission. And my dad and I.

as you know .

from the series, like we always more had a coaching relationship than we did. Father, son. So yes, I asked my dad for permission, age twenty four, twenty five, to take some time off, and ended up doing some casting things before you knew IT though, like they had me in front of a camera out.

Now I testing me for all these things, like, okay. And then at the same time that I was like, thank god this is my chance. I'm gonna hide in plain sight.

But also this is another way for me to convert myself to be straight. And that's truly, truly what I felt was like, this is great. I'm going to end up with a woman from the .

show now that you've also given us that background of like knowing I was gay but having like sports to be like but I got to go to the next thing I got to go and so I kept prolonged you for maybe like fully leaning and to be like, how do I get in tune with self acceptance? The fact that then football ends? Was there any bit of panic or like that immediately? Why you ran and to be like? Or what's the next thing?

Because then totally like football ended and I have a college degree, but i've never worked today in my life like an actual job. So I like, okay, great. I'm anna.

Go do this T, V. show. It's fine. Maybe, you know, something comes from this in, I have no problem saying this.

I loved television. IT was fun to share. IT was fun to record.

Sometimes I go back and forward with everybody he's like because the bachelor, same as saying as right reasons. Is he here for the right reasons? Nobody on this.

Everybody is here because they want to have a good time. And if finding love comes from IT, then great. I think we can all, yes, hopefully stop with the smoking mirrors or that now. So I just realized, hey, we're here to have fun, but why does that have to be one .

or the other as IT has progressed like everyone is gone on there, get instagram famous, let's be call what IT is like IT used to be that like, let's go have done like, I don't know. I'm doing I in my well .

for me I got to travel i'll say this like did I know was going to give me instagram callers? Yeah.

did I do IT for that? No, I yes. Now i'm saying now it's really instagram heavy, but actually for you guys that was fun. And like, use IT take yeah.

I played a foot all year round. So that was my first time on my bachelor season to go to asia to be travel like I did, and to have the experience in, to be honest with you, was really nice, because that was the one thing I missed from football, was the melting part of cultures for me to be on a cast with men from different parts of the country gave me that familiar that I had from foobar of being, okay, we have this bond, but you are so different than me. You were born and raised completely different. But like, that's what I loved and missed .

from cool was the dynamic at all, though, like a locker room. Like, was there any homophobia?

No, honestly, no. Because, well, one Jason shared early on from my season. His brothers were both gay. No, i'm sorry, his brother was gay. OK just one, but is married. So I like, I think people and people knew that in the house to I don't think there is even a chance for any know homophobic things to go around.

But also, I feel in the entertainment industry, more than the sports is so common, a lot of the producers that work on bachelor or gay, there was never any moments in the house. But I will say I was a little nervous and scared at times that somebody's gate, I would be really good around me. And maybe IT wasn't. They didn't feel comfortable .

saying or asking anything. Was there ever on your and a feeling of like, fuck like, I wish I was here to be dating these dudes and not like, and then you of this one woman that you're going to date, like how did you navigate being literally saturated by men again, who are way more accepting than your former t mate?

totally. I mean, did I find some of them, the men not on my season, attractive, but maybe because i'm I was really, really good at compartmentalise ing you, like, I was so good at telling myself you have a job to do. This is what you here for.

This is what's happening. Like, stay focus. Did I find some of the like producers attractive? yes.

Did I find? Obviously, I can find people attractive. Never acted on any of that. Never did, or made advances or moves or anything like that.

I was so good at compartment ali zing my life, and I just knew that obviously i'm here to on a show that is looking for my wife. yeah. So this is what I have to do. I cringe now even looking back at some of like how good I wasn't manipulating situations and apartment in alizon. But i've been doing this since I .

was sick and I don't think you should cringe the cotton because of .

how you survived yeah until I almost didn't. I mean, that's truly IT sounds terrible but like that was my survival mechanism all way to the point of so far.

And as I think you know now like how many people in the community are like same. So it's like it's something that needs to change socially and culturally rather than you shouldn't feel shame. That's literally how so many people have lived. So so you're on bachelor at and I need to understand your mentality of like you so you d genuinely were like if I am the last one like i'm onna marry this person and like.

yeah yes and no okay i'll .

ll never discount .

my relationships with women because it's true I had feelings and I was attracted to females so I know that sometimes hard for people to understand or get. I think there is always a hesitation for me. And I like the safe play. I mean, I obviously you saw that conversation with .

on ea two of like I just a total I would have known in a second eat.

I love the idea of a super strong woman who's very my bullsh, but at the same time being a closeted man having to navigate that that also scared at the show.

Yeah, I didn't work at the time. No, now you can surround yourself with them, but at the time you're like, who's going to just like and chill and very being .

weird that festival my is literally a bunch of strong bad as women and also like tired, lovering and nurturing and weirdly not catty or competitive or inadequate. Al, it's just i'm finding out like the baLance of masculine and feminine. There's posing, constable. But at the end of the day, you you'll got up her hand. I'll i'll just .

think I love you. Thank you. So you got eliminated. And have you talked to back .

a sense not since coming out. I to be honest with you, I distance myself from the french chi's pretty heavy age just because because around this said I just went through a lot mentally like my struggles and asked for help for them, didn't get IT and just there was a lot of bad blood on my and and barna I just IT was not a healthy relationship so I really distance myself from that franchise completely .

you get eliminated yeah did you even know immediately you were onna potentially be the bachelor?

I think I had an idea after like paradise just because like there is those conversations of, you know, the typical entertainment industry of like we need to continue your story like you can't go from getting broken up with, you'd d need to go and talk to T N now, right and then from there your story art can go like, I know there is like this bubble that amErica wants, think the acacia Operates in, but like, let's be real to there's very real moment, of course but the entire like you don't walk in to like this magical fair.

Like obviously hope people understand that but then also like to be drama. There has to be given, take there. And like, I think honestly, that sort of why I got the gig is because I was very transparent. My meetings have been like, look, let's make a good show but it's into the day like, this is what I need and i'm masking from you guys and like, that's business. That's right.

Everyone can relate to at least this like when you all of a sudden tell A E and then all of it's spider relying and you're like, IT wasn't meant to get this big because all of IT was like the virgin bat.

There was a spider web of lies.

And yeah, every time did you read that art like headline of yourself.

were you sick? yeah. At first I had no choice but to lean into IT because that sort of what the network literally was marketing me as. And then I started get sick of IT and fighting IT.

Because no matter what my explanation was like, there was, there was like after I came, I just wish I would have been like, i'm questioning my sexuality. Does that satisfy your answer? Why am emerging? Like I didn't want to go there with women because I didn't know this was in my cards. I had played and hoped and wish that I would be, but I didn't know and there just was not that room. And I don't think I would have been well received if I did.

Yeah, I remember watching IT and people would always speak, so where are you a virgin? Like, i'm Christian and you know, just my I didn't have time .

because I was an athlete. That was literally one of my answers. I do not like, oh my god, s people are actually buying, like buying the athlete thing.

Okay, so you become the bachelor. Yeah, bringing in your head in that moment.

I, honey, honestly, I was thanking god. IT sounds so crazy. But I remember like when I got the call, I remember I was playing a pickup game of basketball and they call like, hey, you are going to be on a plane to new york this afternoon and we're going to not see tomorrow as a bacheller and on the way home, driving home to pack my suitcase, I was literally are praying and saying, thank you, lord, for making me state, like, thank you for giving me this opportunity to find my wife.

Because my whole theory in IT is I can get rid of all of these lies in the spider web that I created. If I went on and gotten fiance, it's going to make me little more straight. And then once we get married, i'm definitely gonna committed, and I want to be straight.

All these urges to want to be man are going to go away. And then once I have a kid, for sure, that's game over, like I can't risk losing a family. So is always leveling up yeah, leveling up all of my like things that I could lose in a risk I thought was going to keep making me more straight .

IT makes sense. Now like hearing you from start to like i'm playing sports IT was like, I can do this because I got to go to college, in college to the nfl and then you get into the bad world and it's the same thing of but then I can find the wife and then I won't be gay and and then I have kids and then I can't begin and it's like you're constantly running from something and so that makes sense how you get down this rabbit hole of like, hold on. What if I ever did want to come out like, what is that? IT looked almost probably impossible at times.

Well, and I wanted that. I wanted IT to be impossible. And I think, I mean, obviously now.

And so great IT wasn't, but that was IT was, you're exactly right. IT was just a different game like I was. Same environment is different circumstances during your season.

I remember people tweet speculating your day. Did you ever read those .

tweet and think I remember kramm o actually on twitter posted something about maybe being gay. And that one hit me the hardest is like, oh my gosh, I actually has a following and he's comme out. And at the time we have the same stylist, I was like, why is he doing this to me? Like trying to figure out, like what was going on here. I think I got defensive. I don't fire anything off to, but I always got frustrated when people called me gay because I was like, i'm hiding IT well enough totally.

Do you ever have, like, P, R, people come? Do you say something to this? Or that was .

you just there was, I mean, towards the end, right? Like before I came out, there was a couple of things that happened that my and that sort of how the show even came to be is because of the circumstances of being blackmailed and stuff. My team new and my publicist was the one who actually, I told first because he was on a call a podcast that I did and they ask me about the asked me about the old t .

ah um and .

I stumbled with the answer very similar to like what I did with you there and I got nervous and yeah he was like we need to redo that answer like, is everything okay because I didn't want to be affirming enough because I don't want people to come at me. But I also wanted to make sure that like people knew I was loving and accepting IT just was like IT was A I fumbled the answer so bad that I public like that was not a good answer. What is going on here?

You've learned how to act, and you've got these two sides to yourself. And you know, when you need to, like, dip into this one that you've use your whole life, which is trying to your straight and even you saying in a pod caster like I needed to answer when they asked me about the L G P T Q community not so like, yes, I love them because they're like a is he gay or then it's like not be like um well, so it's like you to find this baLance that's just like exhAusting .

you're always on. You're like I was always on, I was always on edge. I was always like looking over my shoulder towards the end of my breaking point.

I was so and I was so break down. I was so heavily medicated. Just trying to like, keep this thing in the bottle at the time was twenty years of, like, the culmination of my line to get to that point. That's something, you know, the show I left the, I left the black man completely out of the show yeah and just because like I don't want to give whoever that was any power.

Do they want money or what do they want?

They just had a specific list of demands that were weird to me. I just weirdly enough, i'm thankful because I don't know if any of that, if I would be sitting here today out if that hadn't started to happen. People publicly saw me really not healthy.

Yeah, like I was. And I can say that I was seeing a psychiatrist st. In a therapy after my break up. Know once every week both of them I just want .

to say koodoo to you for not allowing someone that's black mAiling you to like IT would have maybe easy to try to like fuck, I just have to go and do everything that they're saying. The fact that you have found the strength to be like not not i'm not going to like go towards that and if anything, fuck that person. One, I love that you didn't put IT in and to I think it's empowering that you're like actually i'm just going to do with myself.

You then can't have power over me. Okay, back to bachelor fantasy sweets. okay. Did you go on a fantasy sweet with becca?

No, no. I got eliminated for there OK. And then imparadise t ni joke. Because he only room like air conditioned on that is the boom bom room. So like.

that is a name, the boom.

boom, boom. yeah. So I always knew like how that would be edited. So I never did that. I sacrificed a lot of hours asleep because I cannot sleep in the hotness, the heat. And then my season, I did the one with Tasha.

Did you not do to others?

No, I remember. I saw I ended up breaking up with tape and hanna, and yeah, chose cash.

So so you went into one fantasy sweet. Can you walk me through just because we have to do a batch age? Like what are you thinking going into that anacafe?

I didn't want to I had a real conversation with the producers of like this is I can't do this like I don't want to there is no part of me and I mean, I have no disrespect to tasia, but I slept into what pants in a switcher and I didn't want to be rude but like I was literally I didn't sleep the entire night. I did not sleep because out I was nervous. I mean, obviously when you sleep with some of the first time, you nervous that you're onna far or do something where to silly so I had all those regular Normal nerves, but then I also read the nerves of like this does not feel right and I was literally like shaking and like sad and just emotional in that moment.

Consider just being like i'm done with all of this are relic. I got to to stay the course like I have to make IT to the end of this yeah.

But at the end of the day, I was so good at comparing, analyzing things. I was so good at saying, here I have a job to get done, like my football program remain kicked in being, like, get through this.

You've got this. Did you say anything to take you? Like, sorry, like us again.

You had been like a very, couldn't really like. But like, what do you say in that situation? I mean, I could have obviously broken every rule, but like, they tell you this is how I has to happen. And like, you can't just break up somebody off camera because in the viewers because something happened that night and then the speculation in the drama is there. So like, I don't want to cause any scene.

Do you think he knew something .

was really are totally yes.

How do you heard from her at all?

No, no.

okay. Can we talk about the infamous wall incident? Because IT makes a little bit more sense. But like you in the season, and you're like, holy forecast is leaving and you witnessed wall and you're like, i'm onna, jump over this wall and you ran away from the camera and the crew and everyone what actually was happening in that moment?

I think that was just me being so frustrated not only with production, but myself yeah for some foremost, now that I can be completely transparent is like, I think there is moments. So i'm just like, why am I doing this? What am I doing is not working? IT is working.

But wait, I only want her, but I have to put the show on and there is just so much going on in those moments. And then when he decided to leave, I was like, this makes no sense. Like I i'm just trying to be straight in like I finally found somebody who picked my interest.

I remember, you know, people's tweet of being like, that's a problem. Matic, why is he holding on so tight? And I will, if only you knew that, like, this is the only one out of third that I thought I could change me. I went all in and those that was sort of what LED to the quitting the show are running away from the show at the time.

What was IT about, casey, that you thought like this? This person could change me.

I just, I mean, just her, her in general. I mean her, our connection, our friendship. Minories ms, everything like that.

I mean, we did, you know, we did date for a year and a half after, and she's a good a very good person and a good human being. And I IT was easy, like that was the best way he was easy. And for me, I don't never want to take this to diminish a relationship, but he was also safe.

That's not a negative in any way they perform. But for me, IT was a safe place to hide and was a safe place for me to like slow my role, to then keep inching forward of being a little more straight. You know.

did you have sex?

I mean, I think it's pretty obvious yeah so that that parts I mean obvious but also. Confusing for me yeah because it's like, you know, how do I IT makes IT very real and hard for me to explain the people of like, well, you knew you were gay, but also you're attracted. How is this a thing? And I was like, have you guys ever heard of like a spectrum and like scale? And I truly firmly believe that i'm still identify as a game. And but i'm still there are still a part of me that is attracted to women.

I think a lot of people in the world would be like me too call in like I don't think you're alone in that, and I don't think that's a crazy concept at all. Why does IT end? Well, covin. I mean.

cove IT really, for me, put a lot of things in perspective. And I ended up getting IT, and I was containing, so the first time since pretty much the show, our life slowed down and yeah, stopped. And I think that was for a lot of people, you could not run, you could not hide, you could not distract yourself in any other thing. You had to really sit and talk through things yeah and I mean, look, i'm not speculate, but I think know some things were hard and not adding up for her or some things weren't happening, I don't know. And I ended.

were you forcing yourself so like VS sexual you could be or was IT just like you aren't having a lot of sex?

No, honestly, none of that was mainly the issue. And and look, she's asked not to be like brought back into the media stuff. So I always want to respect that.

But at the same time, I know I have things that I needed to address and talk about and there's a lot of layers to those things. There's a lot of things that are private. And I just, I mean, obviously would give people more of the context of what was going on, but are not really appropriate for me to share.

So I tried to do my best right now, balancing of lake staying. And can I say this like SHE has every right to do that? Absolutely should.

Like he has every right to say, I know longer want to be, you have no access to this. I'm shutting IT off. I'm drawing ing boundaries because I ve learned boundaries this year too and that's its way healthier.

So I like i'm trying my hardest right now to give respect and the boundary that he asked for and do that. But at the same time, like I I mean, I obviously see the media, I see the reports, I see like the the words associated with me. And it's like it's hard at times to have to .

swallow and just feel okay. SHE deserves her privacy and you fucked up. And so you wanna without talking about her, like you deserve to be able to like, yeah, make sense of what you did was at the last episode in your new show coming out, called him you meet with the mutual friend of yours.

And casey IT was a pretty heated conversation. And I thought I was powerful as as a gay man he was like, listen, I get IT like you are you were doing anything to keep your secret, but what you did to her is, so fuck up, walk me through that moment on the show. Like, how did you feel when he was? I mean.

I took IT in and listened, and I think that was like sort of the first time that I was like, okay, I need to hear this out because I know I had my site and I know I have I, but my sisters will got me into this trouble in the first place.

So just listening to him sort of talk can be, like, look as another game, man, but we all have a road to this like I I get IT, but also you have to realize, like this is not okay either ah so I just SAT there and listen and I like if I took anything from the show, it's to listen more. And since coming out, I guess I don't have to overcompensate anymore. I don't have to have the most to say in a room or like to hide in plain site, like I can just really take things in and slow down and stop having to distract myself. And that is peace. Have you talked .

to cati since to your netflix special? There are people who are critical of what you've done, and there are people probably listening who are not even going to watch the netflix because they're like, fuck cam, I don't agree with what he's done. I don't agree how he handled things.

They're probably saying he knew you along manipulating women. He used coming out as a way to deflect from the restraining order. Xyz, what would you like to say to the people right now that are listening, that are having a hard time separating the harassment and you're coming out as gay?

I would say that there is a lot that went into that version of myself. And since coming out, I in no way, shape or form, and trying to make people look the other way or forget about anything. I will own my mistakes, and I own who I was at that time in my life.

Anything is important for people to hear is like me doing the show is never to flip the page or start a new chapter. IT was for me to say like and to show like. I fucked up.

I made mistakes I did, and I will always own those. But there are so many layers to this that got me to this position. And I will own what I have to own. But also there are other people and other things going on who i'm asking for help from to because if I got myself into this position and got to a point where I was self harming, where I was harassing and hurting other people. I can't be alone that this has to be going on in other parts of our country and our world.

So I think that is what I would say is I give in an opportunity to pick through my lands, in my mistakes, in my life to try to find something that you might relate to in yours. IT doesn't have to be coming out. You can be going through something similar where you are really mean to somebody that does not deserve IT.

But you're projecting or you are overcompensating or you're just not dealing with a specific trauma that you've had to go through in your life. And IT doesn't make IT right or wrong. I just makes you human.

And I know that i'm a public figure and I know that i've been on people's television screen from multiple things over the last two or three years, but I also hold a responsibility for a platform in a privilege that I have to try to do right, not only to my past communities, but to my future ones and to the communities that I belong to now. So that's, I guess, what i'm trying to say is we're human beings. We're complex. We're good and bad at times and is what we do and how we grow from there that know makes us human.

What was your lowest point? Was there a specific moment where you felt like this is rock bottom?

Yeah, I think the morning that I woke up that I didn't think I was onna, wake up. I. I had never had anything like that happen like I ve gone through depression and anxiety in head to a side of thoughts of like, you know, driving in the mountains and color to of my car goes over this Cliff and I never thought anything of those, you know, of those sites.

All of a sudden, this weekend in which I was getting through IT wasn't really eating. I was as takings anax and as I wait, why? Why am I living? living? And that's sort of the moment that I woke up with vomit next to me on my bathroom floor.

Was the moment like this is not good or okay and I need help. And that was sort of the game changer for me, and sort of the step, a step in the direction of recovering. But t even get to that point.

You know, there was a lot of private things that I was dealing with, obviously emotionally, mentally, but also just like clear wise of, you know some things happening behind the scenes that nobody will ever understand or no and it's not anything I want to revisit there. That's why it's like hard when you see these headlines are what people have to say. It's like that stage of my life was so dark and so really traumatic as hard as like how we got me there.

But I also know that i'm not the only one that's been there before. There's people that are they're now and there's people that are going to get there. But if they can know IT gets Better, then there's hope had you .

been abusing zane's itself and then that was like a big day that like then you just took IT too far. Like, did you want to kill yourself?

I mean, yeah, that's why what I thought I was taking enough and I didn't. Or I just, my body didn't react to IT like I IT was going to. I don't know.

I mean, I was prescribed IT to deal with social anxiety because I I had that from the show and I was in therapy. But I never, I never really came up to a therapy. I never really trusted anybody with IT. So there is just a lot that built up to that. But I found comfort in mumming myself in the best way for me to say it's like zen x to me put me in a different world like IT allowed me to sort of like have this out of body experience of lake okay, you you're fine.

Like you're good. The fact that you said, do you feel comfortable coming out to a therapist? The paranoid.

well, I was paranoid. I live in hollywood. And do you know how much money of therapies somebody a stores can make and sell IT to like that? I don't want to say poor me because I put myself in that position.

We're talking about that web yeah you say one that one lie and then you take your career to the next level. And all the second night you have to worry about this person selling IT to tmc or whatever know thousand, they can make so much money off of that. And I knew that because I understand the business and he scared me.

You said I never thought I was going to come out. I thought I was going to die with the secret. When was the moment you realized i'm coming out?

Who I mean, I could tell you exactly where I was when I first came out to my first person. I was walking on my driveway or my grandma driveway back in illingway, and my houses called me. And I mean, he had a lot of different pieces to the puzzle as far as you know, being on the call with the podcast, he had a copy of the blockhouse emails and he just asked me the question.

And I just remember sort of like breaking down and pausing for like a good forty five seconds. And he point, point was just like, I think I know what's going on. Like, are you gay? And like, I was in that moment that I said yes for the first time. And then from there, you know.

what do I feel like he felt so good?

And like he comfort in this, like everything that you can be OK, we're going to be fine. We're going to go through. And then, you know, from there are now with everything that was going on behind the scenes, the rest of my team had a note, too. So with every person that I came out to and the love and support that I got for my professional team sort of gave, gave me this build up of this momentum, because I know i've also read a lot of stories and messages from people saying, you know, I came out to my friends before I came out to my family. That's a very common because I want to test the waters and stuff like that in, I can truly say, like coming out to my professional team before my family gave me confidence and sort of get like allowed me to really feel good in doing IT were .

either of your parents or even just whoever, and you ended up telling on the series where any of them afterwards, like frustrated to have that private moment made public?

I don't know how safe frustrated my dad. My dad has been quoted already, I think he said IT to the york times, like, great dad, thanks. He just doesn't come from this world, so he doesn't really fully understand IT.

He was like, what I have wanted me to be off camera. Sure absolutely. He's sort to put me in a wear position, which I think we could all be like, yeah and I was like, yeah, I agree with you, but also you're a champ.

Thank you for allowing me this space. And you know, my mom does not like cameras, but I think that IT all go. And my brother hates cameras too. So but I think that all goes to show you how much love and support I have. And it's not last on me like these people in my life, they joined me yon this really we're doing IT because they love and supported me because they saw what I went through yeah after my falling out of the spotlight in TV and sort of what I went through. And I think that they knew they needed to step up and be there for me and they .

were did the the internet and public opinion rob, this moment from you, a lot of IT was like, this is a publicity stand. Like he's just doing this to cut. How do that feel?

I mean, as much as people can be skeptical about this, the show leaking was night. Like, I didn't want to announce a show until we were done like like until netflix are who ever wanted to announce IT. So is getting leagued I feel like was the main from negative feedback of people like this is A P R. stone. He's just doing this because he has a show and it's like that was never supposed .

to happen but when you said on good morning morning amErica like i'm gay and then people like I remember reading tweet of people being like fuck this like not that only you know there was like no is nap but I know some people like this is so fuck and fake like you're trying to like divert the attention how did that make you feel after you've had this secret and you're like finally relinquish ing control of IT you're saying IT out loud and the .

people like now fuck you I mean I I understand where they were coming from because they only know me what they, they only know me or of me from what they seen of me. Which i'll go on record and say, like the A B C version of me isn't me there is definitely parts of me like which I wasn't acting or anything like that but like who that was was not a comfortable version of myself. I have obviously sympathy for those people who are like, okay.

like is there anything you see online that people like make fun of you on your season that you're like I know i'm cringing to like this there or anything you do that you're like what I do that should I mean.

the easy one for me is like the virgin story line that got sort of a wrapped up and taken out of my hands. And they ran with IT. That one is a little cindi.

I mean, obviously just being the bat bachelor in general now after coming on like why I put myself through that, but also I don't know I would be here if if I didn't do that. So it's like I can't even play those games. But you know, look, I have been a position of my life now.

I have nothing i've Carried shame for being gave for so long that I don't really get embarrassed. I don't really like look at things. Of course, I could have said things Better.

I could have done things Better. I have things in my life in position that I would love to take back in radio. But I don't get to a point where i'm just like, I just like that is where IT is at this point. You have to you just have to honor at this point.

I know you mentioned you saw a therapist and a psychiatrist prior to coming out after the events surrounding your relationship with casey. What were the main lessons about yourself that you learn from that experience?

Just to be more honest with myself of how i'm feeling at what i'm going through, I think I thought I was protecting myself by telling myself I was going to be OK. You know, this is Normal and say it's not Normal to have social anxiety to the point where I cripples you or depression to where know I was taken lexie o for a long time too and I had nearly side effects for me but having time to reflect, to show myself some forgiveness in some levin stead of being so hard on myself and maybe that comes from me playing sports too I don't know there's a lot of trauma that i'm like unpacking in this last year. I am like, oh, wait, that has to do with that that's been these big moments and mythic py sessions where my therapy is great and he's drawn these lines and he goes, no da this and i'm like, oh, you say that so casually, but I just blew my mind at twenty nine.

That was the scene when you were a nash fill and your friends were throwing you like a coming out party. You had said that you were like a little uncomfortable being in a room full of gay men. Like, can you explain that a little bit?

Well, as I never had to be in a ROM full of game men before as me, i've never really had a conversation in which the other man knew I was gay and knew I was called underwood. So it's like really my first time of being vulnerable in the space of having to be hit on or having to make a flotations comment and really being comfortable. And I was not I was very uncomfortable.

Now if I go back and have that, that same environment, I would be that scene would read completely a different, trust me and i'm still, i'm still the process of this so of like, what part of me, right, do I bring in to this new version of myself? And what part do I leave in the past? Like what was healthy and what makes me feel good and what doesn't? So still going through that.

you have a boyfriend. I do. How did you to meet?

We were in the same front group, and I was not looking for a boyfriend at all because I was just like, I wanted take some time and there was more of a friendship than IT was .

anything at the beginning? How has this relationship been different emotionally than the ones that you've had with women?

It's been healthier for sure if there has been no hedges. As far as, like you with women, I would always look for a way out or try to find an escape plan, or I was planning everything out like next step. This, we need to be engaged by this we need to be here, hopefully of kids by this year. And that's ah that's truly how my relationship with this one I feel like I have like a best friend and i'm just we just compliment each other other's lives and just hang like that sounds so casual but we just hanging out having a good time. But there is no pressure.

There's no secret.

There is been moments i've done something in front of him and then like I look and you can see like for something like but he's going to say something he's going to break up with me and like, I love that part of you I was like, what he goes amErica doesn't know that you're like, like this and I was like, I know, but like that the purpose of us having a relationship is because you get to see me like this. And nobody is .

how crazy that so you're almost like a rediscovering a new yourself.

I A permission to do like things that i've never had permission to do in my life, like.

give me an example.

will just like be outward. I know I just I never could give any excuse away like yeah that's where the cause I made you know a comment when we are going in for the hug guys like now you know all my warehouse in high school, yes, she's about the only one who i've really felt like. I entirely be myself around pretty much my entire life yeah because she's always giving me permission to be goofy, weird and feminine.

IT was never allowed in my social circles of the past. So like having those moments and know he said something to me that actually meant a lot. He goes like, you are the perfect baLance of masculine and feminine that i've ever seen and he's like you like for me like I never knew that you would have you had this in you and I was like, all IT IT was pretty cool to hear that and he's been out for a long time so it's a really good baLance for me.

He's older, right?

yeah. And he would be like like, he's defensive, very defensive and protective of me and he said, what you need to say this and I was like, that might be true to you, but I ve been out for like a little over year now and publicly, not even for like seven months or eight months, but I don't even remember what months I came out publicly. I was like, I don't know that yet like you are so well articular and so well composed, but you've also been out for twenty years, you know and what .

is IT so nice to have a part of that that has that experience so that you like it's kind of your own training wheel right now. You're like, you have someone .

to like like that rock because he also checks me on a lot of things where he has helped also with the internalized amoy a too where he's like White like that's okay. I O IT is yeah you know so it's it's a really healthy baLance.

Has your family everyone deserves to feel fully themselves when they are in love, but first you got to love yourself. And like, I know that probably it's still a journey are working on, but to know that it's started for you, what would you say to anyone struggling right now with self acceptance? IT doesn't even need to be sexuality just like this shame and guilt feeling and and having a hard time. Like what would you say now with your experience in the journey?

我 sh my limited experience with this， but I think for me it's giving yourself permission to explore. And that goes way beyond a sexuality IT goes beyond with like really, truly sitting with what makes you feel good. Because I got into the position that I got into, because I was doing things that weren't for filling and making me happy, and I turned me into a miserable person.

And then I projected that other people, and that is like the biggest take away that i've had from this last year of, you know, I had a little bit, i'm not a lie of a friend urge of, like, you do not make me feel good. I do not enjoy hang out with you, but I kept doing IT for whatever reason. No, i'm not. I don't want to hang out and coming out pack gave me more and more confidence. So like giving yourself permission to say no, giving yourself to permission to say yes to some things that have been scaring you, that would be my advice to anyone, is just like having that gives you freedom and happiness.

of course, in underwood. Thank you.

Thank you.

OK douai getting it's your father. We're alone. Let's get comfy cozy halls will have let's have a post interview conversation.

I'm sure you you're all in your fields. Everyone's feeling something different right now. It's kind of do a little deep brief. So it's common knowledge that cult couldn't discuss some of the details around the legal staff, which was not ideal for the interview because, trust me, I wanted to ask. But this interview shed some light on his way.

Cotton has to live with what he did to his x girlfriend, and his pain does not justify the harassment this woman shouted, have had to go through any of this. Golden was living a lie, and he chose her to complete this heteronomy tive story lines that he pledged his life too. He spent a web of lies to conceal his true sexuality, but to say that the homophobia in our society didn't contribute to his behaviour would be wrong.

Collins taking accountability for his actions, but the people still Operating on the belief that love can only exist between a man and a woman need to wake the fuck up and realize that homophobia is unacceptable and that their study beliefs affect more than just their study fucking cells and that big picture. But when IT comes to cult, daddy gay, I guess that's for you to decide. I'll see you fuckers next one day.