Anna Delvey (FBF)
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Call Her Daddy. That is 50% off, Daddy Gang. Unlimited access to 25 language courses for the rest of your life. Redeem your 50% off at rosettastone.com slash callherdaddy. What is up, Daddy Gang? It is your founding father, Alex Cooper, with Call Her Daddy.

Hello, everyone. Welcome back to another episode of Call Her Daddy. I am your host, Alexandra Cooper, and I am here today to answer the question that everyone has been asking on the internet.

Who the fuck is Anna Delvey? She has family money. She's a European socialite. She's a trust fund. It's just tied up. She'll be good for it. She'll wire you the money. What is that accent? Oh my God. She's really high up in the art world, I heard. I heard that she's a German heiress.

Her real name is Anna Sorokin, but she changed her name to Anna Delvey when she arrived in New York City and she pretended to be someone that she was not. She inserted herself into the world of art and fashion and finance in the greatest city in the world, New York. Anna Delvey quite literally walked into bank

and convince these rich dick investors that her idea, an art club for New York society, was worth investing millions and millions of dollars into. Now you're probably thinking, why would they invest if this girl has no money?

because she forged bank documents and falsely claimed that she had $60 million in a trust, which she absolutely did not. Anna lived in fancy New York City hotels and she racked up over $30,000 in unpaid room charges. She promised she was going to pay them back, but she couldn't.

She was well-known, mysterious, convincing. Her life was a dream come true until it wasn't. Anna Sorokin was arrested on October 3rd, 2017 and rejected a plea deal and she stood trial.

Anna was convicted of eight guilty charges, including grand larceny in the second degree, attempted grand larceny and theft of service. Anna was sentenced to four to 12 years in prison, fined $24,000 and ordered to pay almost $200,000 in restitution. She went to prison for her crimes.

At the time of our interview on Monday, March 7th, so about a week ago, Anna was detained in upstate New York at the Orange County Correctional Facility. This was the first interview that I conducted with someone physically in prison. And I want to prepare you for what you're going to see and hear.

Due to COVID restrictions, I was unable to visit the prison. So I interviewed Anna over a video chat app specifically designed for inmates. The app only allows 15 minutes per call. So throughout the episode, you're going to hear us pause mid-interview because our 15 minutes were up and I'd have to wait for her to call me back.

Also at times you may hear other conversations happening in the background. Anna was in the common room with her inmates and we had no control over the noise level and who was coming into the room at the time. So also you're about to hear Anna talk about the fear of being deported. She does not want to go back to Germany. She wants to stay in the United States. But earlier this week,

It was announced that Anna Sorokin was released from jail and ordered to return to Germany. But apparently she also may not be getting deported or she's not on that plane because it's currently unclear where Anna Sorokin is. Everyone thought she was getting on a plane to go back to Germany and all the news outlets are saying she didn't. So where the fuck is Anna Delphi? Am I shocked that she didn't get on the plane and she got her way out of it?

No, not really. Nothing with Anna shocks me anymore. Daddy gang, this is Anna Sorokin. Bye! Anna, it's so nice to meet you finally. So nice to meet you too. To clarify, should I refer to you as Anna Delvey, not Anna Sorokin? Uh, sure, yeah. Are you ever going to legally change it?

I mean, I should if they like ever let me out of jail for longer than six weeks. You're like, the first thing I'm doing is going shopping. The second thing I'm doing is changing my fucking name. The only thing I'm going to do is laser my eyes because I'm so sick and tired of all these glasses for some reason. People think it's like an accessory, but like I'm blind. I can't see anything. What is your daily routine like right now in jail?

Well, there is none because here, like, in jail, you just kind of do whatever you want. So I kind of wake up, like, they bring mail super early. And I get all kinds of mail now. It's just so crazy. I have, like, people wanting to adopt me. I don't, like, get any haters. I guess they just go, like, to my IG or to Twitter. Have you gotten any love letters? Definitely more marriage proposals than I ever did before my marriage.

criminal career started you should be like let me see your w-2 and then we'll have a conversation I have a jail assistant so I'll have her do that you have a jail assistant can you explain what does a jail assistant do

We have tablets where I'm like video chatting you from. But the tablets die like all the time. So I'll go for like maybe two or three. But there are some people who don't use theirs. I'm buying tablets of other people and like their phone minutes because the phone is like so tricky. So I'm just doing all kinds of things. You're working the system as you know best.

I know. Yeah, it's just like, did you have a hustle? Because I remember when I interviewed Amanda Knox, she was saying basically, like, your skills become your currency almost like, did you have a hustle at all at Rikers? No, not at all. It's like, if you have money, you don't really have to do anything. It's just like, I mean, and right, it's like, you cannot do your laundry. Like you have to like hand wash it. So you just pay somebody to do it. We so you were paying people off in jail to just like do your stuff.

Yeah, absolutely. They actually think I'm like super rich. Where were you getting the money to pay them? Well, they don't care about that. And you were getting money from your bank account. In Rikers, you kind of became popular among the inmates. What do you think they liked about you, Anna? That's a good question for them. I don't know. Do you think you're a likable character?

I don't know. It's not something I want to say about myself. I hope I am. I try not to be insufferable. I don't know. You told New York Magazine reporter Jessica Pressler of all the people that you met in prison, you found the murderers the most interesting. What do you remember about the conversations that you had with them? I guess the most kind of revelatory thing about it is like they're just normal and they're just like you and me.

So many crimes that just, like, happen in a moment, just like that. And, like, then your life is just, like, never the same. As opposed to mine, which was kind of, like, a buildup, and it was, like, years in the making. So, and that's, like, the difference. I imagine I would have been so much more upset if I, like, got mad and just, whatever, shot my boyfriend. And then I would just have, all my life would be taken away. I have to call you back. It's, like, three seconds. Okay, I'm hoping we can fucking hear her.

okay wait what do I do press use my balance to pay okay do not disturb okay we're back okay this is what you're asking what I need an assistant for holy shit okay let's go back to your childhood as a little girl what did you want to be when you grew up

I always wanted to be in fashion, definitely. I did not know what exactly, but I don't know. I grew up watching MTV, and I thought fashion PR is just the coolest thing. I remember watching Kelly Catron, so stuff like that. I don't know. I didn't really know. But I just loved print, and I loved magazines, so I either wanted to be on one side or the other.

And you were born in Russia. Do you still have family and friends there? Are they being affected by the war right now? No. Well, your parents and your family packed up and moved to Germany when you were 15. Why did your family have to move and did you want to go?

my dad owned like a business, like a trucking business. They were like, um, having like drivers go back and forth, transporting like goods across Europe. And he was partners with like some German person. And that's, um, how he relocated. Did your mom have a job? No, my mom, um, had like the second child, my little brother at the time. So he was pretty young. So she was like busy with him. Did you and your parents get along growing up?

On and off, I was never best friends with my parents. And they kind of let me do my thing, I'd say. What would you guys fight about, if anything? Well, I just hated to be told what to do. I hated on them to put any restrictions about any rules. I was just allergic to authority or to rules, especially when I thought they were unreasonable.

And like I just hated to explain myself because I was just so used to being given freedom. And then like when that was when they attempted to take it away or impose some kind of like restrictions on me, I did not really react. Like what would they try to take away if you were getting in trouble? Like my car. I could not let go and spend the night at my friend's house.

um, or just, yeah, like I could not go out or they would just like try to financially restrict me, especially my mom. And I hated that. I never wanted to be like controlled with money. Did you ever then consider at a young age, like getting a job since like you wanted to have financial independence? Yeah. Yes. And no, like none of my friends really had a job. That was not a thing. I don't know. Oh no, I actually had a job. So, um,

My dad was renting out, we had like this huge whatever, some kind of like industrial building and this like solar company was renting it from them. So they employed me and they like totally overpaid me. I got like a paid vacation after like just working for them.

For six weeks because they were like American and they didn't know like German boys. And they literally gave me like paid Christmas vacation. I got like 1500 just for doing nothing. But I was extremely overpaid. I was making like 30 euros an hour or something like that. Do you think you were more like obsessed with money than the average kid? I don't know. I just wanted to have the freedom that comes with it. What did you want to do? I wouldn't say...

I just want to like to do what I wanted. I don't know, just like go, I don't know, travel and go places and do things without having like, because if you ask your parents for money, like you need their permission, right? But if you have your own, you just go and do whatever you want. So I guess like money just always kind of represented freedom for me, not just like for the sake of the money. So were you closer if you had to stay with your mom or your dad?

I'd say I would stay with my dad because I would have more freedom and less oversight. And he would give me more money too, definitely. Where do you think your aversion to authority started? I guess it's pretty strongly worded, aversion to authority. I just, I don't know. I guess because my parents, like I was really good in school when I was younger, so they just trusted my judgment.

And then just let me do whatever I wanted to. But then when I kind of started getting older, when I was like, oh, maybe I don't need to like spend two months studying this geography book because I'm really not that interested. So when I kind of like started to catch on to that and I started to like, oh, maybe we need to like get her to do something. I guess I just like stepped in too late.

like blame stuff on my parents but it's like if you kind of grow up like I guess when you're like 16 17 is not really the age to start imposing rules on somebody if you like fail to do so do you think you also got worse as a teenager to your parents once you moved to Germany and you started to like rebel a little bit more um definitely I think that's like the same for everybody you know like when you realize your parents are not all that like you

Yeah. People around the world are imitating your accent and it is one of the most popular sounds on TikTok right now. Did you know that? Oh, really? No, I did not. So what do you think? Do I sound the way like they portrayed me? You know, I think a lot of people are talking about it, how like the show Inventing Anna on Netflix is dramatizing your accent. Yeah.

Yeah. What has been the wildest thing that you've heard about your accent? When I heard Julia talking like me the first time, I'm like, oh my gosh, do I sound this insufferable? It's just so weird, like hearing. It's like the same when you just hear your voice being recorded. It's like totally different from the way you hear yourself when you speak. I don't know. At this point, I'm just so used to it. Like, I don't know. And to everyone that thought it was fake...

I mean, people just say so many things about me. I just don't care. It's just the way I speak. I don't know. I never put on any accents. It's just the way I talk. Did anybody ever hear me speak any different? Then they should like come up with the evidence. Whoever accused me of that. I want to see the proof. So then let's talk. Oh, no. 60 seconds left. Okay. When I close this out, I'm going to close the app and then you'll just call me back.

Okay, I'm going to hang up, and I will call you, like, in a few minutes. Okay, bye. Okay, we're back. Hey. That was easier than the first time. We kind of got it figured out now. Well, no. Okay, so. I'm from 1994, babe. There's someone in there. It's okay. Yeah, someone's on the phone. Is it too loud? Yeah, we can wait, like, a second. It's okay.

So it's just because I kind of like made her go away. You're fine. All right. Okay. So let's talk about your move to New York. Why did you move to New York? I'm having more friends in New York than I did like Paris or in Europe or like anywhere else. And I know I travel quite a lot. I never just like moved, moved. What did you love about New York?

just love the energy of the city and I just love like you can get anything done at any time it's like very different from Europe because in Europe like everything's closed on Sundays and

And everything's closed like after 5 or 6 p.m. You cannot like pay anybody enough to like get anything for you. And it's just different. Like I grew up in Europe, so I guess it was exciting for me. It's always about getting something with you, Anna. So you get to New York and you start going to all of these popular events and clubs. How did you introduce yourself to people?

I don't remember. I guess Anna Delvey. So you would just say your name is Anna Delvey. What would you say? Where were you from and what was your job? Well, I was from Germany, which was true. And I didn't really like no one ever asked me about my job. I feel like that's so interesting because I lived in New York and I feel like all anyone cares about is asking, what do you do for a living? And why did you change your name to Anna Delvey?

For no reason, really. I don't know. I really came up with it randomly. There's no good story behind it. I know people always try to discover something, but that's just not there. I don't even know. It just kind of doesn't really mean anything, and it was just random. You don't view Anna Delvey and Anna Sorokin as two different personalities? Absolutely not, no. I like it. There's absolutely no difference.

Because, like, in jail, they always call me, like, by my government name, which is Sorokin. It, like, literally doesn't feel like anything to me. There's just nothing, nothing in there. You don't have, like, a personal attachment to your birth last name? Absolutely not. I don't think I have attachment, like, to any countries, any names. It's just, like, not my thing. I don't know. This is not the way, like, I see myself or define myself. Do you ever wonder why? I don't know. It's hard to explain. I was just always like this.

If you could try, like how would you try to explain that to someone that doesn't understand, like not identifying with anything? I think it's like pretty small minded when you're like, oh, if you see somebody, oh, this person is from Germany or whatever, this person is from Russia. Like, let me. And I like them more than I like somebody who is, I don't know, from Japan. I don't know. I think I was just always kept.

trying to keep like an open mind or maybe because I'm moved around so much. I don't feel like I'm from anywhere. I feel like I kind of belong nowhere. That sounds kind of lonely, Anna. Are you ever lonely? But not like in a bad way. Wouldn't it be sad when you just like spend your whole life in one place? I don't think it's about spending your life in one place. I think it's about feeling like you belong to something and not feeling like you're wandering alone in this life. It can be pretty lonely. Yeah.

I guess like I choose people, like I choose people, the ones I choose to relate to. They don't have to be my neighbors or like I don't have to grow up with them for me to want to be friends with them. How would you have described your friend group when you were living in New York? I think it's like what was mostly fashion and art people. There's like always somebody like people in New York that always travel. Somebody's like always gone for like a couple of months and they come back. So it's like,

Like, New York is pretty anonymous. That's why it's just so bizarre to me. It's like how these people, like, just assume they know so much about me. It's like, I didn't know anything about you either. Like, neither do I care. Like, nobody asks you, it's like, who are your parents and what do they do and how much money they make? It's just outrageous.

So I was going through your Instagram and back in 2013 and 2014, you were posting mostly like art and beautiful views and you would rarely post yourself. Your face was usually covered. What was your strategy behind that? I love that you like assume there's a strategy behind it. There was none. I don't know. I'm just kind of like posting what I saw. And, um,

That was like the beginning of Instagram, right? Right. And I guess I was just trying to, I was like still hanging out around a lot of like art people. So I was just like posting a lot of. I say strategy only because I think every single person on Instagram can admit, like we are all trying to make people feel a certain way about us. Did you feel pressured to keep up with the rich people in New York City?

I mean, yeah, I guess. Like, who isn't? I always wanted to, like, get more stuff or, like, go there, eat at that restaurant. So I guess, yeah, it's fair to say that it was. Do you think you would have had the level of social success that you had in New York without social media? I don't know. I already saw my social media as, like, a big part of anything, to be honest. People just assumed I was trying to impress anybody with whatever, $40, $50, $60 million. Yeah.

It's borderline poor in New York. There are just so many rich people in there. You can't impress anybody. It's not even like you had that. So it's like Instagram was kind of like the path if someone's going to look you up from a vibe they got. It definitely reiterated like, oh, I feel like this girl looks kind of wealthy, like art and exhibits and planes. So it does help the persona a little bit.

I guess, yeah. But there was just, like, always, I don't know, thousands of people who did. So, I never saw myself, oh, am I, like, the only person who posts something like that? There's just, like, always somebody with more followers, somebody better. So, it's, like, I never saw myself, oh, my gosh, I'm kind of killing, like, at this. So...

So you went to jail for crimes committed while you were trying to launch the Anna Delvey Foundation. If you could have selected three people to be at the opening of your foundation, who would you have selected? Oh my gosh, this is such a hard question. Three people alive or dead alive, right? Yeah. I mean, Anna Wintour...

That's what fashion and then somebody in tech like Steve Jobs. If you take somebody who's dead. Do you care at all about like influencers like the Kardashians or no? I mean, that's too many of the Kardashians. So it wouldn't fit the three people. But would you invite them all? I mean, sure. I don't want to discriminate. So. OK, 27 seconds left. I mean, let's hop back off and then get back on. OK. I mean, I started, I think, push her a little bit more.

When I was like, well, you didn't have that money, so. When she said I have no, what was that what she said? She was like, I have, I feel no connection to anything. Okay, here we go. Okay, let me record. Okay, let's get to the bottom of the rumor that you were a German heiress. Did you ever at any point in your life tell someone that you were going to be inheriting money? No. No.

No. Like, no one introduces yourself like that. Like, what kind of sentence is that? It's completely ridiculous. People kind of, like, put together this story after the GGA's office released the original press release from when I got arraigned, like, in October 2017.

I guess, like, that would be my assumption. But I don't know. It's hard for me, like, to track this because I was just in jail that whole time. Right. But even prior to you having anything to do with the law, like, how did people think that you were supporting this very expensive life in New York? Like, I cannot, like, testify to what people are assuming about me. I don't know. So when you're picking up tabs, like, no one's... No one ever asked you, like, where do you get all this money from? I mean...

I was doing like anything so super crazy I feel like there's just people who are like spending who were spending way more money than I did I feel like going to a hotel and spending $63,000 like that's kind of a lot Anna yeah well that was not like a daily basis that was just like a one-time thing but even living in a hotel that's that's in New York City that's a lot of fucking money

I actually don't feel that way because I know so many people who live in a hotel and it's actually cheaper in an apartment where you have to commit for like a whole year and you can't travel. Did you choose to live in a hotel because in New York City like you have to show your finances if you're gonna get a lease and like that would have been hard? Well I just didn't want to like commit for a year because I knew I was not going to be in one place for one year. Like even

Even because of my visa, because I had to leave all the time. And I just didn't want to like, yeah, being just stuck in one place. So you think that everyone around you just assumed this girl's really rich. We don't know where she has this money. And you never explained where you got all the money from. I never asked anybody where they get their money from. So I never wondered about how anybody's paying for their bill. So I just assumed people would be like,

Right. I really don't care. Yeah, no, your New York experience is very different than mine. So no one ever asked you point blank about how you had any money. No, absolutely not. Like you'll have like, you'll have a different friend circle. Oh, imagine it's like the people I remember people like being pretty secretive. I don't know. It's just nobody's business. I know people who like still I don't know their husband is paying. They love whatever this puzzle support is.

Like some of the things you just don't want to be vocal about. But see, even you just knew they were getting their payment from their partner. Like you kind of still know. It's shocking that no one was ever like, where the fuck are you getting this shit, Anna? Nobody was asking me that to my face.

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How do you think though, this whole narrative that you did have all this money, like how do you think that benefited your life? It's just easier like to ask somebody, I don't know, for 20 million. So it was easier for you to walk into a room and ask for more money because people assumed you had a lot of money. I guess, yeah.

Other than changing your name, what about your life when you were living in New York did you lie about? Did you lie about like your family's background or wealth or how much money you had? I guess I did. I mean, I cannot like tell an exact instance, but I'm sure. But I never told any senseless lies unless it were like a bank. So the purpose of you lying though was to get something that would benefit you. Yeah, so it's like if I were just to meet, I don't know, like

some girl in a social situation like I really don't care what someone thought first of all it's none of their business second of all there's nothing you can do for me you just like

walked through these fucking doors into some of the world's largest financial establishments, asked for money, and they gave it to you. When you would walk into these rooms with these men, Anna, like, what was your vibe? Like, were you super outspoken and loud and confident, or were you kind of coy about it, and you kind of let, like, the accent and the mystery speak for itself? I don't even know. I think I'm, like, the same. I am.

right now with you. I don't know. There's just like no Anna mode. I'm not like a performer. You are. You're very confusing. Really? Yeah. There's nothing else behind this. I don't know. Nothing else behind it, Anna. Absolutely nothing is behind this. Yeah. But like, okay, so let's pretend we're in the room with you. So you're saying you would kind of just do this. Like your vibe is just chill and you're just pitching them your vision. Take it or leave it.

Yeah, and I would always kind of show up underdressed because I thought like if I were to like show up like, I don't know, in heels or like, I don't know, with some kind of like, I don't know, with a tight dress. Even like this, I don't give a fuck, which was like pretty much accurate because if it wouldn't be them, it would be somebody else because in the end, they are like all disposable. There's just so many financial institutions in New York.

So you purposely would dress not as nice because you thought it would insinuate what? Like, I didn't really care much to impress them and they should be the ones trying to impress me. I'm going on your right. Okay. Okay. Okay. Now we're fucking getting into it. Oh shit. Do not disturb.

We're back. Yes. Okay, so we were just talking about your... You would dress really raggedy. You are so confident, but we're all human. Have you ever felt insecurities? I feel insecurities, like, all the time. What are some of your insecurities? I don't know. Everything. Paranoia that I ever was. And just about, like, things going bad. Just everything. So try to explain that. I don't know. It's just, like...

Now I feel like I'm at the mercy of public opinion and I'm trying to stay away from seeing myself the way other people see me, but it's just really hard. And I feel like my case is just being thrown into my face every day. There's no way that... For some people, they commit a crime and they go to jail and...

and that's it they have like a way to move on and to forget about it and not having to deal with it i don't like having a felony on your record like it will never be like that for me just never ever in my life like it will always follow me and one in some way so um i've been getting back to your question about insecurities it's just everything and it's like i'm so scared to like kind of up again and for everybody to say oh she was a fraud all along and when

Why would anybody give her a chance? So that's always there. Yeah, just things like that. You're choosing to do interviews. Is there an angle you're trying to take so that people can get to know you more? But I'm also writing a book and I'm working on my own podcast. Who is your dream podcast guest? Who is my dream podcast guest? Oh my gosh, I have so many. Cyrus Vance. I'd love to speak to him. The prosecutor, he'd never go for it. He's...

like you know like to my prosecutors i would love to speak to them it's just like i don't know don't you want to like find out why why a person who like hates you i don't i wouldn't say like the word hates you but like who has so much negative stuff on you or like whose job it was to like kind of um get you like imprison you like right just what they really think of you like you um engage with your haters on like social media right it's like can you tell me why you hate

I mean, I think it's a little different because I think they probably just wanted to like correctly punish you from the crimes you committed. It's America. There are laws, you know. So one of your iconic trademarks was tipping $100 bills everywhere to everyone. As someone attempting to start a business, why did you so freely give away your money? So like in a hotel.

somebody who always helps me with something like it's totally okay for me to like tip them couple hundred every now and then I did not just like throw hundred dollar bills or like random people you know I just like I had so many people in service like who were just so nice to me and like they literally make all the difference so do you think that you'll continue doing that once you are free I feel like now I have to I know you gotta protect your money girl

Everyone's going to keep trying to wait on you anytime they see you at a restaurant. She's keeping the tradition alive. I can't disappoint. You should worry about your bank account. Okay, so have you ever admitted to committing any crimes? No, I went on trial, so I never pled guilty. Sorry, the car's not just so loud. Okay, okay, okay, bye. It's going to be like 15 minutes.

It's okay. It's okay. Don't worry. Okay, sure. Your phone? What kind of phone do you have? Oh, my gosh. Okay. Dude, that's so bad. I had to... It was too... It's so loud. I think the issue is that she's having this awakening that, like, it was at least some insight, the fact that she said, I don't want to come out and people be like, oh, she... Like, she's... Her ego is now like, oh, I don't want people to think, like, oh, it was a flop. Like, she's not... And it's like...

Okay. Is it quiet now? Everybody's gone, so. Okay, so what was going through your head that first night that you spent in jail? God, I don't even know. It was kind of terrifying. I blocked it off. It was just awful. And there were, like, so many people there. There were, like, a lot of people for DUIs, a lot of, like,

sex workers. It was interesting. If you had been granted bail, where would you have gotten the money? I wouldn't find a way. If you weren't yourself and you knew about Anna Delvey, would you loan Anna Delvey money? I would definitely because like I felt like I would definitely go out of my way to pay somebody back. But did you ever pay Rachel back? Well, she got paid back

I'm not allowed to reach out to her. I put it out there. If she feels like I owe her any money, she knows ways to reach me. So what was it like to face Rachel for the first time in court? It was great. It was very exciting. She did not look my way a single time. Like, well, I have to identify you as like, if I'm the person that was the only time she looked my way, which was, I guess, telling if you feel so defrauded and if you're so righteous, like,

Wouldn't you want to look your abuser, quote unquote, or whatever the people are called? Did you just stare at her the whole time? Absolutely, yes.

Do you ever feel any guilt that Rachel was left with that $63,000 tab before Amex obviously refunded her? I mean, I was always saying that it was a really unfortunate situation. And I was like, I never said, like, I'm so awesome and I did nothing wrong. It was just like a really unfortunate situation. And I did let her pay it. I knew there was a chance I could not repay her. But like for me at that point was like,

I was going to go through with my project and everything was going to work out. So for me to say, to tell Rachel, it's like, oh, hey, maybe there is a chance that I'm not going to pay you back. It would be the same for me as to admit my project is not going to work out. It would be equal admitting failure on a bigger scale.

You know, it was like very psychological for me, you know? Like, I never invited her on this vacation thinking, oh, maybe Rachel's going to pick up the tab. If you could say anything to Rachel right now, what would you say? Gosh, I don't know. Well, I hope she makes the best out of the moment. I don't know. Like, I don't even, I try, like, not to think of her. How do you feel about her new book? I don't feel any kind of way because I'll never read it. I've heard it's pretty bad, so...

I haven't read it, so I can't attest to that either. What is your current relationship with your parents? I talk to them a couple times a week. What do you guys talk about? Just, like, I kind of give them an update, what's going on with me. I'd say, like, they're letting me do my thing. They just basically said, or, like, it's not, you're not, it's not because of us that you're there and, like, you chose to, like, live in New York and do all these things, right?

But they are supportive. It's like they send me things or like whenever I need anything, but like send me money or like books and magazines. So they're supportive in that way. Time is up. Okay, wait, you can call me right back. Okay. I'll be right here. Well, I'm about to hit her with a, oh, well, your dad said this about you.

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Okay, this is the only other thing. You keep saying like, I was gonna pay it all back. Like, unfortunately, Anna, like that's not the way the world works. And you keep you keep saying that. So, um, okay, let me just record. Okay, so I was just asking, oh, about your parents and your relationship. Do you have a good relationship with your brother?

Yeah, I guess. He's like way younger. He's like 18 now. So I never really had like much in common with him because of our like huge age difference. But yeah. Has everything that's been happening with you at all like affect his social life or anything? No.

little bit yeah I guess he like kind of care a bit less like he's like a bit older now but um I know like teachers know that I'm his sister definitely they used to like ask him if that's if he's my brother so how does that make you feel um I don't know like I'm not sure if that's negative so it's hard to say I mean what do you think would be positive the teachers would think positively like what would that look like

I mean, it's hard to spin like crimes in a positive way. I mean, as long as it's just not negative. Do you think there's any way it wouldn't be negative? I haven't spoken to him recently, to be honest. Okay. So I don't know. Your father was quoted in a newspaper saying, naturally, we're very worried about her. She has such a selfish character. We can't do anything about it. We gave her a normal upbringing.

Is it true that your parents gave you a normal upbringing? I mean, if they think so. Do you think so? I mean, I wasn't crazy, but I would say yeah. Do you think you have a selfish character like your dad explained? I guess if he says so, I don't know. I try not to be selfish, but like, it's just kind of the thing my parents always say, like, whatever I try to do is like selfish, so.

How do you feel hearing that insult from your dad where he's, like, telling that to, like, a public magazine? It doesn't feel any kind of way because he just would tell that to me in my face every other day. So it's not surprising. Does it feel hurtful? My dad is, like, very sarcastic. And I guess he just doesn't know how to, like, he doesn't speak to media, like, on a daily basis. So he was being sarcastic.

I hope he was, yeah. Did you ever ask him like not to speak to the media? They're actually reluctant to speak to the media. There's just so many people who like want to interview them and they refuse. If anything, like I have whatever my own show with Yonem, like I'll have to convince them to speak to them. So I don't see them going out of their way speaking to the media. Yeah, they should come on Call Her Daddy. We can have a whole family reunion.

Can you imagine? Okay, so if you do get deported back to Germany, how do you envision your life? Are you lonely now?

I mean, definitely in a way I am. I like I try to keep myself busy, but it's just like not the same as like being around friends or just like being around people I choose to be around because I'm stuck in here. So, yeah, I'm very introverted, I think. So it's like if anything, it's by choice. It's like I ever felt lonely. Yeah. Who knows the real Anna best?

I guess I had different people who, like, know different bits and pieces. There was just, like, nobody really around me who would have, like, the whole picture. It's hard to say. So you have no close, like, friends that really know you? I do, yeah. But it's, like, my friendships, um, so it's, like, I have friends who are, like, they are, like, during my free time, but they don't really know what's going on.

Like, with the projects I'm working with, you know? They just, like, don't really know the full picture. So I guess it would be fair to say nobody, like, really knows everything about me. I think there's a Wi-Fi issue. We're frozen. Maybe let's just cancel out. Hi. Okay, so we were talking about your friend groups, and you kind of mentioned, like, you feel like...

No one really knows the real Anna. And do you think that you like purposefully maybe would like compartmentalize your life a little bit so that no one can really know the real you? I ended up being like that, but it was never on purpose. A lot of people do that. It's just like you kind of have family.

You have like people who just don't know about all the areas of your life. So for me to say somebody just knows everything about me would be to assume it's like somebody who just spends the whole day with me or like also works with me and lives with me. I feel like very few people can say that. Parents, my parents know me in like one way, but they have not been around the past year. So they cannot really say like what I'm doing in New York or like my friends. Like everybody just has different opinions.

Parts of information, I guess. Do you consider yourself a con artist? Absolutely not. To people that are saying you are, what do you think is the difference between you and a con artist? Well, I never, like, intended permanently to permanently harm anybody, you know? I literally cannot come up, like, with a single example where I'm like, yeah, let me fuck this person over and they'll never see, like, their money ever again, so...

So you think like in the grand scheme of things, it was all with good intention what you were doing? Yes. I just like didn't choose the best means to go about it. Who has hurt you in your life? I don't know. Wi-Fi issues? I'm just like, this is what it starts doing. It's okay. Okay. So to finish the question I was asking you, just like who has hurt you in your life? I don't know. Never complain, never explain. Is that a saying you live by?

have to yes are you worried people aren't going to think you're smart because you got caught somebody thinks that way I don't care because my goal was never to get away or like not to get so okay even like hear people in jail say oh I have like you're not that good of a criminal because you didn't get caught it's like I've never tried to be that way so it doesn't hurt me in any way so it doesn't it doesn't hurt your ego

Were you embarrassed at all?

Sure, I guess, yeah. I mean, it's not pleasant getting arrested. Definitely. So I'm assuming you haven't watched Inventing Anna. No.

No. So I watched like Beats and Pizzas, but I didn't watch the whole thing. Okay. So the show is all about Anna Delvey. And in every single episode, the title card that reads is every episode. It says this whole story is completely true, except for all the parts that are totally made up. And so everyone watching it, we don't know what is real and what is made up. And so I wanted to get Claire's,

Clarification from the woman herself. Here is an example. In episode eight, they show you intentionally setting yourself up to overdose. But right before you do, you call room service so they will come up before you die. And they then show you at Cedars-Sinai in the hospital on a 24-hour psych evaluation. Did this actually happen? Absolutely not.

What kind of drugs was I supposed to be over? I'm not sure. So you never attempted suicide? No. So you're currently waiting to find out if you will be deported. Do you have any indication of how long you have to wait until they make the decision? Well, I do. I just fired my lawyers and I got somebody new. So hopefully they will get me out of jail. Why did you fire your lawyers? Because they weren't adequate. She's...

So they just weren't getting you an answer. So do you have any timeline? Like, is it going to be more like years, months? Like, do you have any idea? Well, no, it's definitely not going to be years, but I'm sure it's going to be a couple more weeks. What do you think the chances are of you staying in America? Say anything, just we'll see what's going to happen. Yeah. Are you interested in dating? No.

Sure, when I'm out of jail. On February 20th, 2021, you tweeted, willing to marry Kanye West for a US green card. Would you date Kanye now that your friend Julia Fox has been there and done that? That's a tricky question. That was a joke, that tweet. I don't know. He doesn't seem to be getting the best reviews, so I don't know. That made me crack up. I will give you that.

Okay, years from now, Anna, what would you like to be remembered for? Well, definitely not for my crimes, hopefully. Well, I'm just trying to like to turn my story around and hopefully I'll be able to like create something good out of all the attention I'm getting. Okay, you can't say you don't know to this question. Why do you think people are so captivated by Anna Delvey? Gosh, I'm just like ever since...

And I'm like, oh, this is how I did it. And I knew this is, it just was really a surprise to me that people would be like so interested about the things because it just made so much sense to me. And it's like, it's really natural. So this is what I'm trying to figure out. I don't know. Out there is like a caricature. So it's not like I'm trying not to see myself like as this person who is being like portrayed out there.

it's not like I see it, whatever is being written in the media. It's like, yeah, that's me because I felt like I'm more comfortable. Right. So in the interview, you kept mentioning that you had a plan. You were going to pay everyone back, but you also, obviously you went to these banks under false pretense for whatever reason. And you,

they thought you had this money. Like, do you now see where the intention of paying people back? Like that's just not how the world works. I mean, I, I definitely do. Yes. I do see like what I did wrong. It's also so many people are just do worse things. One of my last questions, have you ever heard the phrase? What about ism?

Do you want me to give you the definition? Okay. It is the technique or practice of responding to an accusation or difficult question by making a counter accusation or raising a different issue. Would you say whataboutism is your best friend? Not an accusation. I've never interviewed someone that said, I don't know more than you and then flipped it back on me. Have you had media training? No. No, it's all me. Okay.

Oh my God. Okay, well, I truly... Oh wait, let me make sure this is recording. Oh my God. I can't thank you enough for coming on Call Her Daddy. I know... Are you there? I swear to fucking God if that last one didn't fucking record, please fucking call back. Dude, that's so fucking annoying. Dude, watch that just be the end.

Okay, guys, well, I'm currently waiting for her to call back. I'm unsure if Anna's going to call back because I think that last question may have pushed her over the edge. But she's calling. Hello, this is a prepaid debit call from an inmate at the Orange County gym. To press zero. To refuse this call, hang up or press one.

This call is from a corrections facility and is subject to monitoring and recording. Global telling. Hi. I'm not letting me call back anyone and I can't. No, don't worry. I just wanted to say thank you so much and I really appreciate you coming on. So nice meeting you virtually. Wish I could have been in person, but maybe we'll meet in person one day. Bye. It's fucking episode.

I don't know if I feel smarter or swindled. I don't know. But what I can say is, you fuckers. Next one. Say goodbye. Holy shit. We all have that friend who wakes up early to go get everyone McDonald's breakfast while the rest of us sleep in.

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