Episode 324: 9800X3D Reviews Are In, Continued Intel Problems & More
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In this episode of the full nerd, the best CPU ever, intel s got more problems and your questions answered.

And welcome to episode three hundred and twenty four, the fuller podcast. I just grab the box for a new cps that came out. Invite me. I am your fillin host to antipatris k. mary. But I am not alone for the epsom on the line I have the glorious ale hello, and I see I see a little bit of a full .

nerd shirt .

peaking out. I, uh, speaking of really good shirts, bread chart kis is also on the line with a the the wars in the stars.

Yes, sir helped me internet. I'm hopelessly addicted the color duty.

yeah but on console.

it's all the same.

Now i've been split that up, but have been split that up. That is all the same.

A speaking to split up. We've we got will I .

don't know.

You're split up the .

brain cells. We're sharing the brain. Good to see you. And here I was last week, but yes, thank you were not good.

I like to give .

IT six great months before.

Een, you know, who always looks fresh, like controlling .

the vertical maker.

Everyone, happy toosday to see them. Sol, i'm so leaving the stash in the beer, it's feeling nicely and I switched .

my window.

Yeah, got to tune in for the the fresh growth. Last we had a full beard. The full beard episode ll forecast.

I was IT because I didn't have a beard to qualify. I keep saying i'm going .

to get one a first question for you to did brag, get a PS 5 pro。

No, I have an another place station as the police station too.

Now there go. Before we entered the show, we ve got a lot of interesting stuff to talk about, a lot of good stuff, but I, I, I want to kick off. I've tried to think of a way to make A A segment out of this is not like a city, but like the insurance show.

Sometimes we just fit in little things here. What if I call the the accessory box? I like the cat that I love accessory boxes. Just know they're not the main show when you get a new case but I always like looking, oh like what's the site here?

Some brand idiz? Yes.

I put I put some posted notes with a couple topics here. so.

because my tattoo shop.

where you can we'll give you a tatti for fifty box if you pick whatever you put into the bubble a machine take whatever they get out.

and.

And that's how I got the dolphin on the back wer on my lower back .

like a miami dolphin. What do we got?

Says oro coke.

okay. Well, H O sorry, I don't good handwriting, but you brought in last week, yeah regreted to bring in orio favorite of the flavor ite oria. We did some science, so if you didn't know this will have the phrase always .

be testing I invented.

I'm just going to say that didn't take back here on the full nerd always be testing.

I feel like they are going to get suit, but that's ahead anyway.

We did some science because we agreed when we first take these that we did not like them well.

But I just like usually as as the the explosion of products, consumer products has has sometimes it's good, sometimes it's bad. Orio typically does pretty well, like they would. They put pop rocks in the good. That's really good. Typically coca licious, I don't ever, never in my life have I had an orion thought, man, this would be Better if I put a bunch of coca coal in my mouth, right?

Which actually, yeah, the the oil flavor ite coke, I think is actually much Better.

But but like, you don't want the fans in the cookie bits ground in your moller. That's good. It's not what you're looking for.

Bread, elena, have you had the coca cola flavored .

or as no, right? I feel like it's one .

of those .

things where I can go anyway when in the first time you try you like I know about this and then you keep eating IT and either you end up loving IT or you end up .

really hating IT. It's grip. So one of the claims of fame is the the inside part, the the GUI center, the cream, yeah cream of the crop, a IT has like kind of pop up kind of things in IT.

So like it's like a fish, like a coca cola smell. So so that's interesting. But then also so the the black side of the of the orio is just Normal.

The red side of the cookie is different new. We did some testing. We did a lot of testing moly.

a lot of I I like i'm not listing.

We always say this .

here on the full erd always be testing. We kicked off the first like, hey, I just want to say the model of the show always be go back.

What's the take some and after after a lot of lot of testing, I realized it's actually the red part of the cookie that I do not like. IT tastes bad yeah so so if you if you eat IT with to a black cookies, then it's actually not too bad in my mind. Not so like, great. I question.

did you try dip in IT inside a coca co instead of milk?

I didn't. Number one, I didn't try milk because that's not really my jam. But I will I would love to try dependent coke cola.

I immediately .

heard .

you anyway. So yeah, was it's one little topic.

says coke on the red side. Yeah.

I know if I if I didn't have that, you would never know what was bad about the red part of the has weird, like singing kind of spice to IT IT. I don't know.

Like I it's not like fake .

cinema and liquor. H, yeah, it's together and almost too strong. Wish I was a little more setting.

very strong.

Know when you get some produce that that makes and this smells like one of my Christmas parties with family.

But like IT, IT tastes like, you know, those cook bottle things like the White y Candy that you suck to grow out of. Oh yeah, IT tastes like that stuff kind of but worse yeah, but worse yeah.

It's not good. We got another topic in here, so get into IT. This just in, I just saw this on on the internet. Uh, the gf, the n vid APP is out of beta g force experience is no longer. I just .

installed at the other day and I was 贝塔 then on saturday now a anymore.

have we wrote up on .

p yes of this morning?

okay. Well, well.

experience more.

They're still keeping IT around for now. They're not forcing people over with the drivers. It's available as an optional install with the drivers. But the expectation is probably early next year .

going to along with Allen person's experience. Now the due force experiences is retired.

I've been using the NVIDIA APP. And I like IT. I like IT. Yeah yeah. Like there's A A lot. I mean, not that the g force experiences bt APP was bad pursue, but this even just the simple fact like you don't have to log in and sometimes that there would be an update and they .

would log you out and they're to log in honey va part.

It's just like you would never think a little thing like that would be such a huge like changes.

That's a huge quality life difference for me. The fact that they're still not fully complete, but they're working in a bunch of setters from the invidia control panel too because the gf v slash and video control panel s spent terrible experience .

for five years yeah but that yeah yeah. I am honestly like the idea that they forced you to log into g force experience. To use g fourth experience implies they can track you effectively without logging in, which they absolutely can because they have a fingerprint of your computer.

They know who you are. They just don't know who who you are. They know that you're the same person over over like there's no like there's no upside to them requiring that logging and got that they dish the requirement. I hope they don't change that as a cause that debate.

yeah. So congratulations. If if you don't have the in video APP, um you can get IT now at local retailers. I know we want here. We two more in here.

Oh, 哦 OK like a pic one。 We don't .

have to mean these. These are topical stuff like a brand new steam deck. Okay, actually nice. It's just A A limited dish, a new limit edition varia cosme. It's a cosmetic, a wow.

spicy .

what? IT is White and is very White and gray.

And then the power.

But IT does like you.

How long is that? Gonna look at the p also.

IT does like a lot of White stuff. IT does essentially the large bezzle. So so I actually, I when I first saw that somebody tag me in disco so I can member, you might have been front the show causes c but would like, no. And I was like, but I really want IT and then the more I looked at, I was like, i'll number one, don't use my steam deck much anymore. Anyway, I number two, I like, actually I do like the look of IT, but the I have the other limit dish that the c three one, and I kind of prefer the c one.

So I like the Green button a lot, and I like the contrast on the red power button on the OLED with the White that looks really nice. But like this is this is like they're just trying to saw that up a little bit more to entice the people who haven't jump to yet.

right? Or or get nerds like me who would .

buy multiple version to C, T. All you know you to on cards is much cheaper than collecting steam deck.

should I? Yeah.

the wrong.

What about pog? I pog are coming back.

Look, everybody.

Pog, yeah, I saw an add on my instagram or something just like, oh, I I was like, what the .

notorious thing is, getting two out of hand. Let the children have their things, and we should let things say, our child, 哎。

look, I don't care what you say and i'm going on fire some baby des off the overpass to see what happens. Okay.

remember this and it's the baby. Tes now got the last, last thing in the accessory box beyond. See if you can read IT my hand writing .

about this one says.

oh yeah.

this Amberg yeah.

real .

Ambering ics.

a real word Amber neck. Okay, A N B E R N dick, I picked up the RG4XXVPGA .

thing that， no, no.

this is the based software emulation. Um there there is a big sale probably because they're literally coming out with new ones every week. So but as of right now, this is still one of the best ones for vertical orientation of retro game style h handles. K uh, so far I like IT haven't done the time with IT.

But what the place that they put the bumpers is really good. I was, I played some snow games. Not that I would encourage that kind of activity.

IT was your own wrong. I saw, yeah, I dumped the wrong. But yeah, like you could actually hit the bumpers. I'm on a lot of those vertical and hitting the bumper is hard in the dept.

The dept. Is actually really good. Uh, this is unna front of the show of Lewis sloss. Is isn't there a newer Amber nick thing? There is literally always a new Ambering icing yeah so every year, every quarter.

every yeah ah the one page .

I was the uh friend in the show, a ritual game core, uh has a video about this as a video about all the the handheld devices out there. Go sugriva. I love his channel.

Uh, I was watching a video about this. There is a new ricord pocket five. wow. Uh, anyway, one one of the top come into the video that I saw was somebody saying, hey, every time, every time I hear your interview music or no, every time I hear my my husband listened to your interior music, I know that our banking out is going to a get drained here's something at most that's pretty funny was like, yeah fortunately that .

kind of how IT goes. I just if can we get back to the team thing for just a second while we're talking about I like, I guess it's a new second rules, right? I if they're doing alternate color ways, this means that we're getting one step closer to like a game. Cube orange steam decks with a handle I made look like the color named key. Warne IT has to have a happy, right?

That's the law. Game key born would be awesome. Or or, uh, uh, game boy. Color purple .

like to translate one.

Yeah, I like translate. I like translate. You could have a steam. That color would be.

oh, you know, now they've mentioned the translation. Thing I think i'd like to do up then is anyone still remember this um and sixty four translucent .

purple like .

I would want a like handheld that has that style was that .

is that the same colors? The game but it's a different color than the game boys and it's like lighter.

I think I remember actually but they are custom plates you can get for the steam decorator or like that Lewis, that female edition teamer. I like .

the problems. They all that I don't know.

usually they get around as long as it's the color way and the like. A A bit do does that all the time, but they simple. Well.

it's pretty easy to change like the button and stuff. Like if you wanted the japanese super fema ham color layout for for your steam deck buttons, that's an easy, that's an easy swap. The changing the front panel is harder. Changing the .

back panel if you change xs. cases bread what color if you could have one.

i'm all about that like miami vice braking purple some things and stuff like that so if they put one of those i'm actually on the market because i hope to bring one of these c.

s so well get on IT speaking to get in on that we should actually get to the three.

o podcast.

i know mabe in front i have the box that contains no CPU in IT but it's at least the box of the AMD rising seven ninety eight hundred extra i keep wanting to say rise in nine because it's nine thousand but notes rise in seven ninety eight hundred three t are all the reviews one up wednesday thursday no wedding day was embargo a thursday was the the launch day i would actually wanted to pick up another one but i got to a little later and i was gone.

they were sold.

out wow paper launch in my right actually toilet paper launch that seems ah yeah i would say at least i would say bread no i don't know what you would say but IT feels like the internet uh was almost all an agreement agreement here that the ninety eight hundred extra is a dem good CPU.

if freak rocks man like it's not entirely a fair fight because the core ultra nine twenty two eight five k and stone two hundred and eighty five but um IT regressed a little bit but this thing just spokes what intels hundred dollar plus chip more does like this the switch to second in b cash underneath the CPU dial has eradicated all of the drawbacks that we had with previous generations about IT not been able able to over clock clock and slower stuff like that thermal issues ah and i also made IT a lot more compelling for productivity tools so this thing you know you're looking for a gaming first sea for you that can also do smoking productivity this thing rocks.

it's kind of all around king right now right like give you if sixteen threads will do what you need not too better yes.

i feel like you people usually pretty say ah eight core sixteen thread is like the sweet spot for most people and i would tend to agree and yeah that was the thing so for me um so bread did a nice right up there's a link in the description h gordon took all the testing information and and did not some video go watch that if you haven't uh but yes for me i i can already knew i mean the seventy hundred extra ty fifty hundred extra day all those extra d parts are aimed gaming first but this one because of that second and uh v cah in having IT stacked on the bottom allows you to be in my mind more than just a gaming CPU because i always felt like and and you would hear this at launches people would be like at the rise and seven thousand launcher the rise and nine thousand launcher of the the non extra parts people people were like well why they even releasing these everyone's just waiting for the extra parts like well no actually non exact parts you know have plenty of reason to be there for for for people who don't just do gaming i mean but i hope they can also gain quite well uh but for me i was always like okay you've got you ve got the normal skills and then you ve got the the gaming specific excuse and sometimes IT wouldn't line up because i was like okay well we've got the you know an eight core part that does not have v cash but then an eight core part that doesn't v cash and in gaming the v cash version does better uh but in productivity workloads the non v cash version does better but the gaming one is actually more expensive usually so like i never fit in quite well um and which is also what.

i feel like that simmons was really smart honest on their part for a while because like you could basically get people who wanted to game to pay a little bit more right if you actually you wanted like really storm gaming performance than you would pay.

out for that well yeah but but now well and that's also why they they went away from having a non three d v cash version that had in eight in IT so IT was the seventy seven hundred x than the ninety seven hundred x and there was never a ninety eight hundred nor seventy eight hundred non x right and so i think they saw that as that as well but the the the weird thing for me is like okay you're paying more or sure you're getting more game performance but you're actually getting less performance than the CPU underneath IT for if you were doing other content creation of productivity stuff this takes that all the way in in IT like IT almost literally just makes the the stack just normal where it's like okay what you pay more and across the board you get more in for me the tag line if i would have made a review video of gordon video awesome if i if i would have made a review video of the title for me would be like it's not just a gaming CPU anymore and in here we we do a lot more productivity and content creation workloads because just what what we like to focus on for c p testing and especially for this one there was just like oh well should we do more game testing and like assure but we already kind of know that this gonna pretty good for gaming you know i know we did some gaming testing but for the most part i want to see how much better IT is for those other workload that's what i was excited about and what i was curious about and yeah i was just like oh wow a friend.

of mine who does game role and stuff was like hey what's the story on this thing is this finally the CPU that i can have like really best in class games and actually built my game that i'm working on on as well and i kind of want to go dig into that and run some benchmarks on the on the nine hundred now now that like and run the unreal compiles and public like that see how that goes.

see to me like i agree with everything you're saying i think that there's no longer the compromises that this had the past but i think if you're looking to go out there and do some serious heavy duty like productivity content creation production work like you you're just talking about you would still probably want to ninety ninety x or even an until two eighty five k like when i comes to multicourse stuff and things that just say all those course those are still there's a reason there one hundred box yeah but these things mashes in tells two ty five k by twenty five to thirty percent and games which is a beat down i have not i can recall seen that in decades in PC space it's funny.

because like the seventy hundred and three smashed to the two time.

yeah like it's partially intel problems which is the next segment but yeah i mean it's like the the other do the testing and i actually we had an open test bench so actually through in a fifty seven hundred ninety as well as seventy eight hundred x three to test against because i was like no well originally i want to get a fifty hundred extra ity but there no no longer viable says you know fifty fifty seven hundred extra is still vocal letter and in a lot of the gaming scenarios depending on what you want to do like i mean the ninety hundred extra is still a good bump but fifty thousand one hundred actually still pretty good but then when you look at contestation so if you just like oh okay it's leagues behind.

fifty seven six core.

it's a core talked at four point one it's two hundred and fifty dollars so IT is considerably cheaper but it's part so.

i was actually the big question for me coming out of your review now was actually the final section of my written review like do you think if you're a fifty eight hundred x three d you should upgrade you're a gamer if you're creator obviously if you're gamer what do.

you think i think i think you're still good right now.

mean depending on what you game and and what you do like like yeah i feel like i mean a lot of the numbers and testing that i i was just like hey this is this is a a great part i don't think it's an upgrade for the seventy eight hundred and fifty i'm sure you would get a really good upgrade for the fifty seven hundred extra but IT once again if you'd have to you have to figure out what you do there's copy out there because i still think IT is really a good gaming CPU still but if you're doing anything that others than gaming him then is just like oh okay you're definitely to see some beginning there.

well and i think i also think that depends if if you playing games that depends what video card you have like if you're not ring a forty eighty forty ninety you know your the CPU is going to do more than your video card you you're not going to be you're going to be GPU bound instead of CPU bound in a lot of cases and i think i think in this like yeah i think i think this is i think we're still we still have found the the the CPU that can make a forty c p u c p u bound or g p u bound so know if you're running in forty ninety putting a faster CPU and real prices and benefit.

yeah yeah so yeah that's my thought on IT yeah i was i was interested i was.

digin into the numbers for mind because everyone's like k i got the fifty hundred and thirty seventy eight hundred x three d obvious visibly wasn't worked than twenty eight hundred extra day because they get into IT the fifty seven hundred x three d numbers that you did and yes it's twenty five percent faster in gaming the ninety eight hundred thirty day but when you look at the actual practical frame rates like the fifty seven x the t seven hundred x 三 d is just as fast as that until two eighty five k like it's still a very potent ship so and to do the upgrade between the ddr five and the mother board or cost you eat least eight hundred dollars to upgrade.

to this i mean that's that's the thing i look at like like somebody and chat just a second ago arthur magnox said there are on a thirty six hundred and they're thinking about getting a fifty seven hundred TV that seems like an absolute no brainer versus and looking so central has risen ninety one hundred three days in stock but there are only selling man bundles of course so like to get with a other board with a motherboard so to get the four hundred eighty dollars CPU oh n m and a motherboard and RAM you're looking at eight hundred dollars total You're much Better off just going from you if you're on a name forward.

You're party looking at sixteen giggs around on your sir right now by by a cheap set of of sixteen by two RAM and put a fifty seven hundred x 3d and and you're good for another four years probably if if your video card is reasonable。 That's amazing for and for life. Man, yeah, I was going to say exactly .

where it's like everyone still kind of craps on A M for being around. But pan the value you get out of IT, it's unreal. unreal. Are all of those board like the .

thing I haven't got back to look at because there's a brazilian boards. I wonder how many getting bio updates for these new year CPU? Like I wonder if there if there's like legacy and foreboding ds that haven't gotten the microcode whatever update they need to run twenty seven hundred three days and stuff like that.

I remember when they first announced rise in five thousand, they'd said some of those first chip sets were not going to support, but then they walked IT back. And we're like h make work work. So yeah, I think there are some boards out there that still don't. But I mean but that's if you got in like on rise in one thousand, I remember what the chips that number was.

I would think that if you have a high end like one of the seventy e glass mother boards, at the very least they would still get the updates for that. Yeah.

oh, oh, man friend, the show said lives as h my son went from a sixteen hundred, so rising, the first hand, rising to a fifty hundred, three to a while back. He is still happy with performance. Oh.

I bet I jump .

anyway. Yeah so that's my thought. Um but also it's not like anybody can get a seventy hundred extra right now, uh, even if they wanted to to try to find some deals that sounds like those you are one ninety .

eight hundred three is going to cause you like fifty hundred box on ebay.

Those things are no so both gender .

out right now oh no you can .

get three versions of seventy one hundred three days at l has has been stock for three sixty nine right now, right? But it's the .

emersion not .

that's like twenty bugs off .

retail anyway yeah good launch. Um I remember back when the rise in nine thousand launch, a lot of people are like all the uplift is barely there. What this this means the spells dooming gloom for the extra parts when that that comes out. But yeah, things things have changed.

I really liked honest. Uh, I was away. So I was on vacation when all this happens when I was catching up on IT. As they gain some numbers for a different article that we did for the site. And one things I really liked about this was I feel like this still demonstrates AMD kind of commitment to slow study improvements over time.

So I think what are the narratives all about? You know, like what a come back we're like what a launch specially in this new year of kind of know disappointing flagship watches because of the copy ts that's kind of emerged from the initial testing and reviews. Um I just think it's so cool that like you know we started this talk talking about how you know initially I was like gaming only can figure out how to into the stack.

And I think that if you actually look at IT from a bigger perspective, I think this just follows that same path where AMD goes. Here is a product IT doesn't says we're IT does what we say it's going to do and IT does IT very well. And then over time, they just build on that, right? So they then move the V E. Cash position. Now we get this in more even performance across the board, and i'm kind of excited to see what they are gonna turn to next for this kind of approach because so far, they've been consisted enough with IT that I feel like we can so far, we kind of trust .

that process well. And I just realized um I think this is the closest that an extra part has launched from the Normal parts, right?

Usually there's a little .

bit more of there. Yeah yeah. So like I do wonder if like at some point, those things will overlap and it's just like, oh, no, you know here we go.

We we got the full stack on non three and the three or if if okay. So maybe IT doesn't completely line, but at least that alignment is gonna get closer. Um obviously, we don't have the rest of the stack out yet. This is just just the ninety hundred next 3d uh there's a rumors about when the next one， the end of the the other versions of the extra parts will come out.

But well, yeah. And then the other thing we haven't talked about really is the overall king on this because of the upside down. They are upside down, the cash they unlocked over clock. And the early results of that .

are kind of remarkable, which you do P B, O for the seventy hundred, which tech strike we saw a front of the show game's next is a in birded hardware, I believe, did over clocking streams been a while since they didn't want to lose. So they were reply, I I don't remember what they hit. Maybe somebody in .

the chicken they went to, no, I don't know.

I can break .

my dog. And if you want, if you want to get some extreme over.

the man I don't rip, feels like I, I, I get hurt, I don't know why. Yeah, I be all this liquid .

nitrogen .

stuff is a really well.

I mean, have you have .

you that well, I think like you said.

if I do something.

He does eat more Candy .

kind .

of a lot that to be .

a gun under my chairs.

it's actually got flavor.

Side note, when I was Younger, I used to put gun behind my ear to hold.

oh.

you're that kid. Oh my god, you the kid that that you can do that anything and they needed then go to hospital. Yes.

thanks so much. I never went the hospital. This is exactly why i'm the parent. I don't pick up that do not put get email.

Don't need the three of dog we are at for .

rest thing to check out the ergin at cds last year and their handed out like little mango flavor packets for water, whatever. No, he adam, like, hey, what happens by poor bunch of these? And to sandia code there, like all know hosts for water he's like, hey, let's do a quick short someone take a video i'll go to a dumper bunch of these they like mental exploded all over.

Yes, anyway. Yeah, so ninety eight, one hundred six, three wills put up a pole. I'm curious to see nine percent ordered one.

Oh yeah. interesting. yeah. no. I mean, hey, dam good part. IT feels like a lot of people are are happy to have a dam good part after a lot of these bad cp s this this year. Um I do .

think fused anche launches yeah .

also like I personally think there are still reasons that you might want to look intel. You still might want to look at like older generation stuff or non x 3d stuff like like I don't think this is like， oh, no of this is the only cp you should get. Nothing else should be considered. yeah. Ah IT IT always depends on what you we are going for. But for the most part, this is gonna heralded as like the ultimate CPU which is is still is still weird too because like for what you can get for this Price um even though there are CPU that are Better at other things, then IT still like I think people are just being like, hey, this is this is one of the best of the best you can get out there.

The vacuum though, right? Because I mean, as you just kind of hinted that intel has you know there are optimizations in certain software that work runs Better on intel hearts still, I would assume. So that's going to affect what's best for whoever is building that particular system.

Yeah like premier pro still favors intel. Like IT, like A M D is right there, at least in in our testing. So like it's not like it's like oh it's it's a clear winner, but premier pro still pretty loves intel, but does IT love and help because .

there's some more threats on the intelsat p user. Does IT love and help because of some inherent optimization in the in CPU course.

I think part of its the the quick sink um integration for sure, which i'm still surprised that they don't use the the dedicated encoder and the the AMD CPU for acceleration. But me just just .

did people don't music as the quality y's bad.

They know like like real time play back. Obviously not not for for export. But yeah yeah I mean if if you dig into the actual like what budget tests are you just I so i'm sorry sorry I don't remember .

sound hard .

but yeah like if you look at the subscribe h AMD does Better on um h on non compress footage, uh where intellect does Better on compress footage yeah so like if if you're trying to like real time play back or export compress footage, which I mean a lot of video professionals use like favorites, intel.

the things like and this gives back to everything we've been same for a while or at the point where were working for choice. You have a very special work pony like you can go out and look reviews and figure out exactly which had this is best for. And sure, if you're run in a forty, sixty years, something like that, you shouldn't go out and buy a five hundred dollar gave in CPU even though what is the best you wants to and more in line that you want. But with A N D put out in this package, IT should be held up as being some excEllent IT got rid of all of the weaknesses of the past products and IT just later beat down on until like they deserve their .

who was the perfect timing to because I feel like IT is just like, you know, AMD running over and kicking until what they are down .

because i'm so bad figured out the AMD windows eleven issues, which i'm sure to talk about the next citement, something I can tells going to some of its zone right now. But i'm glad we had those teaching pains with the initial rise in nine thousand things. They figured IT out twenty four, age two is here and now the extra .

I think we're still I think they're so the feeling I get and we'll talk with this in the intel side member. I think the feeling I got even from the AMD announcement is that there still there's still room for Better branch prediction and smarter branch prediction with windows and windows communicating which stuff goes, especially on the multi CD chips going forward, like there's still movement to be had. There is what the vibe I get.

That's a great point. I'm actually really interested to see how the nineteen nine fifty x 3d in equivalent shape up because the previous generations， like they only put the cash on the one ship because they had other issues, both between communication and the over clock stuff. And I really who cares to see what shakes up this round with the news. I can then be cash. They fixed a bunch of different things, and windows like you could be awesome.

And with those dull ccd ships, especially your thread schedule, had to say, okay, this is a threats that needs clock speeds. We're going to put them on the non va cash. This is when they goes on the va cash. And the solution was if you're playing a game, we're just going to turn off the non v cash course entirely. Park, I park, i'm not using the right .

lingo will turn turn off. I feel like you. okay.

So we're going to set them so that you can use them. And that works most of the time. But then sometimes IT doesn't. And IT was IT was a jankez fixed for a complicated problem. So hopefully see more elegant solutions that involved hopefully windows being smarter because my understanding that is that a lot of these problems don't insist on linux s because the linux terminal knows how to please send things to to different CPU like IT knows the different different CPU core types and can direct threads more appropriately, which windows doesn't .

really do as much yeah I mean that that is the last part of the equation what the rest of the x trd stack looks like um it's it's probably safe to say that the'd keep around the rising the top end there will be a ninety nine fifty six I be a ninety nine hundred .

x 3d this time yeah.

that's one of the questions I have because I feel like that SAT in a weird spot. But then again, I remember a list of a lot of people on discord actually kind of like IT like a like it's sad in a weird spot. But yeah, what what do we think you think they'll be A A ninety nine hundred x three part? Or do you think you will not to be .

the eight point six reminded seventy nine one hundred is a twelve core twenty fourth read. Now the question I have .

is is that two two, six core cc is that .

is that are those six core ccd are eight course, the two the course didn't pass, third they didn't bin, or those distinct dies that are built for six course from the beginning? A good question because parts IT didn't be, then we're going to see we're going to see as nine, nine, nine next three d because they don't want to just throw out all of those failed, failed cbs.

Yeah they just they make eight cords and then they just disabled cores to hit the six hundred years in their variants.

But but also in today's world where, you know current councils are all eight, eight core machines, and we're seeing a lot of games that actually are threatened and will hit seven, eight cores like you might. This is something we need to test. I'm really curious if there's a performance impact writing on a six core CPU versus an eight core CPU four games that are actually native for the current and councils right now because I bet I bet will I bet there there's impacts .

there well and you know I think you're on to something that yeah if those are being chips, why not have them as A Q yeah because there is also a seventy six hundred x 3d that is microsite。 Only Steve over game's nexus actually did get one in for microsite did some testing really good video over there. And IT comes close to the seventy, one hundred and thirty in the ways that you want IT to.

So yeah, that part is proud. Ly, because they had a bunch of one hundred three days that no, not quite good enough. Not not quite good enough. So yeah, okay, okay.

I we're ably answering my question that then I guess the other question is that I I I keep hearing a lot of people be like, oh yeah, next time they're put them on both ccd baby, all they know all both both cores, both cashes. Let's go. I am here to say no, I I don't believe that they will.

I mean, unless they figured out a way to to have that died, I latency be reduced because I remember when the seventy nine fifty x 3d came out and IT was only only one core， everyone was pissed. They were like, what the hell? Why not give IT on both course? That's my perfect CPU I want IT named, came out straight up and and said time and time again in public and even behind closed doors they were like, listen, we've tested that. You don't want that. It's going to be so much more expensive and that actually .

performed worse .

than a lot of, yes. yeah. So if you're thinking that there's a game that maybe once ten cores also, it'll take IT over here and then two over here, that is gonna a horrible experience. You don't you don't want that and the Price is going to be prohibitive. So I yeah I do I don't think they'll be cash on both court.

The Price is the reason, I think not without a being ridiculous because if you look at the ninety ninety seven hundred x, it's like three hundred and twenty box seven month course. The ninety eight hundred x 3d is clock a little higher but add in those v that vee cash turns to that in two of four hundred and ninety dollar part or what everyday。 So it's one hundred and seventy dollars mim for the cash. I don't think they're to roll that out across all the chips in the future.

I mean, like look, if you want the v cash on multiple chips, that that a thousand six or later thing, like if they if they find a way to make the v cash glue, the two two ccd dies together. Like, I mean, until does this with there are three, right? Like if they can put the vacation and goes on both ccd and then they both share the same cash so that they have they can talk at the speed of cash, that's magic.

I think that's fantastic. I don't think we're there yet. It's not going to happen this go around. I don't think also.

once again, like how how many how many games actually do need more than eight course. And I think that's the question that you're asking to .

make a game that require that this shows the precious benefit of more than eight course right now given the the market. yeah. The other thing the thing is interesting to me about all of this release, this launch.

Is that AMD has stuck with this this dull ccd, the dual computer die thing, despite IT being kind of problematic for reasons that are complicated and and don't I don't see like a fix fix. I see like a series of band is going to make you get Better, Better over time. Intel has all of their computer stuff on one die still, even on the, even on the triplet design.

So their benefits are in manufacturing efficiency and cost, not necessarily in hay. We can put even more cars on these chips because because of you, the scaling them up beyond certain point gets difficult. So like they avoid all of these computer computer die lencs problems in all of this up by just keeping all the CPU on one die.

And i'm curious if we're going to see down the line in tell desktop CPU that have multiple computers les, in the same way that we see like nine thousand and one thousand, nine hundred and fifties, with multiple ccs on the chip lets on the AMD sign. And I I don't know, I ve end up the situation where everybody has the same problem, where they have not all CPU are exactly equal, but for completely different reasons. And it's a weird I think that's part .

of why windows get so screwed up these days like that is CPU are so much more complicated than they used to be yeah .

in windows in a lot of ways is still living in a world wear all CPU cores like windows just barely understands hyper threading at this point. So like you know.

speaking of problems in intel, his problems, we're going to talk about IT. So there's actually kind of gathering of stories that I want to break up in here because a bunch of a little stuff h has been coming uh over the the past week links into description for for uh a couple of articles over IT at A P C world dock, if you heard of IT. But you can point any web brother to P, C world dot com and IT.

It'll get there, hopefully. So what for kids?

That's my hand. yes. Uh, so you you can go see an article right now that features will ls hand. I'm holding A C, P, A, A. The article was written by mark, is not mark sand .

is actually will hand .

H I get hand credit actually why?

I'm sorry. Wow.

just don't tell the lawyers. So yes, there's one article. Let's start off here. Intel pledges to fix area lake after launch quote didn't go as planned. Uh so uh Robert hallock, which h we've had on the podcast from the show, uh got on the hot hot ware hot hardware podcast with from the shows over there um and was talking about you know what I launched in ghost planned you know may maybe agree them. I mean.

I think I think if nothing else, they are power stuff is definitely not what they intended APP. And the other stuff down, down, I think they didn't mean to lease to see you you that underperformed prety much everything else on the market. I think that's fair to say.

right? Uh, so here, here's direct quote from a hello, xing quote. Here's here's this old adage that we've talked about with journalists and hardware companies alike than the new platform is hard anytime you radically overhaul anything that presents new and sometimes unexpected chAllenges.

And I think what people have have been interested to hear is what happened. And I can't go into all the details yet, but we intel um we've identified a series of issues. Uh multifactorial are at the O S level.

They're the BIOS level. And I will say the performance we saw on reviews, to be very clear through no fault reviewers, was not what we expected, not what we intended. The launch just didn't go planned.

And that's been a humbling lesson for all of us. And this kind of inspired red, a fairly large response internally to get to the bottom of what happened and to fix IT. Quote, sorry, was A A long thing, but you know what? Lots to dig into. hear. I mean.

that's one of many quotes. Yeah, check out there are even Better yet hardware video, yeah.

I mean, it's it's the thing we said ages ago, like new platforms are hard. It's it's empty. Had the same problem, had similar problems with their expected review like they they bent.

Everybody has has this stuff internally to death. Just to be clear, it's not like there. These chips are coming off the faber. okay? Well, chips are done to send them right out to the reviewers and let's see how IT goes.

And a lot of its theoretical testing too yeah to figure out like, okay, what what should what do we think we should be hitting .

yeah but like the systems, like the system and I say the system, I don't mean like abc, I mean the system of the computer, all the bits and pieces that make up a computer now is so spectacularly complicated.

And one or two small changes from reviewers to what they're testing internally can have an enormous impact, right? And and I do not envy the people who have to who run their testing labs that their phones were lighting up in, the embargo lifted, they were OK everywhere. These benchmark numbers are off.

i'm sure. Yeah, yeah, so interesting stuff. I mean, that sounds like, uh, that they will have something to report. What is this either by end of november, early december and then work to fix IT. So know hopefully in the next couple months, something i'm curious to see what they can identify, how that actually translates to fixes and if that can help around some of the the the odd, very odd numbers that we're seeing, especially in gaming. I feel like in a lot of productivity stuff, we saw some good stuff, but especially in gaming, IT was just like, oh, again.

i'm not surprised by the game in results because again, for generations, theyve just been duced in the how out of rap, their wake rocket and stuff like that. This is the switch to a more energy and one, but on pulling back on a macro o lover for a second leg, I gently hope they have success. Uh, AMD recently went through this as well, say, and they get the windows eleven update out in a couple other updates and things are looking great.

We're sitting her praise in the ninety eight hundred and thirty day until itself just went through this with intel arc. Like those drivers were a hot mess when they launched. But right now, like I won't necessarily tell someone to go look for an art car but someone gotten knock card, I wouldn't be like you should go change that out.

So I hope, I hope that I actually washed them well. I hope they do have success. Yeah, I am getting super tired. I've all of these huge lunches just been broken and lunch.

And I think it's partially the the chip companies fault for just introducing new stuff all the time without communicating lockstep with windows. I think part of its microsoft t for not being able to keep up with th Epace o f i nnovation t hat t he C PU a re d oing. But IT spent up. It's spent a trying year or the microsoft .

the speed at which microsoft moves on, like good reason, like they move slow on kernel changes and a lot of this stuff is current kernel, like really, really low level changes. Um I hope and just be clear, the microsoft problem is that they support billions of users, right? And what they change needs to work and be reliable for billions of users.

And the millions of new machines that are shipping to support these new CPU are a blip in there in their overall markets. So they're not incentivize to move quickly, right? As opposed to linux, where intel, an aid, you can just provide engineers that make the kernel changes and then they get tested and shipped out to everybody. So if you know, this is why if you want to really support the latest hardware, you should be all in on linux. Baby.

just yeah.

yeah.

yeah. Twenty twenty five you I like comment in uh chat here from .

Francesco and tesco ah so sounds like video games which is a comment I think I made on a previous show which is like this feels very much like when video games started going to the day one patch era IT just didn't work right away. You got to run that software update and I will alcove at here. It's sucks to see hardware and moving in that direction for me.

I would say the part that sucks most is kind of from a more pragmatic point of view, the consumers actually will have a difficult time making an informed choice about what to get right. Um like all of us are more plugged in. So we know like okay like these these are tiv pains.

There's going to be some growth because I mean, none of these companies want to leave their launches as they are. They want to have a product that people will want to buy. But the question then becomes for a consumer, well, when is he going to improve? How fast will that happen? I don't know what improvements are going to be.

So now what do I buy? Because do I and because we always help people don't buy based on projections, right? You have to buy on based on what you get. So it's nice that we have the nine eight hundred xd, because that is something you can you know unequivocally recommend to somebody if that's the right thing for their for their budget and for their use you know use case. But for everybody else, it's a little like um like what do I tell you to get when you ask come to me for advice or if you don't have someone to advise you, what do you tidy make this decision when you're trying to go through all these articles and making informed choice about what you're putting your money right? So that's the part for me that sucks. Um like I think brad speaks really well about the kind of like the more kind of intellectual theoretic goal we're watching this almost like a sports scheme kind of perspective but for my perspective is the the day kind of ah what what do you do when you go got to buy something? I think that succeeding harder because affects so many more people than just those of us who like to wash like .

a sports game for Better or worse. A lot of the narrative is driven at the beginning. There's the launch, there's a lot of buzz and that something could get solidified in the brain even even if you know things kind of go on to to get fixed.

I wonder like the ninety one hundred extra, um probably uh most likely a came out the way that I did because of all the teething pains, the rising nine thousand launch, right? But I wonder if the rise in nine thousand launch is still kind of um like looks bad in people's mind and just think that the ninety hundred extremes just a Better saying not realised ing that one let to the other and there has been updates to the rise and nine thousand launch yeah because a lot of times, I mean, just you just hear that that index narrative and then it's hard to break IT. And I mean, I wish as our viewers, I wish we had time to three benchmark stuff know every month, but we don't so wAllen .

keep IT that us like every so often checking on art that that was super cool.

Yeah well, really helpful.

And the the I mean, on the other hand, of the people who care about the stuff of the most are probably the ones who are the x 3d customers anyway， right? So if you're if you're in the range for a twitter dollar below in desktop CPU, you're probably not like shopping benchMarks. You're looking at Price and looking at what video card comes with that machine and whatever. And it's the equivalent of walking into best buy or microsoft and just buy in the one with the good R G B lights. I think, I think.

like makes you go faster. We hundred percent.

the science is there. We should test that. Also, always be testing, always be testing the model of not say.

always said that I .

like IT yeah yeah I don't know. This has been the word CPU launch cycle. I think I ever remember, for what it's worth, like like rising one.

Yeah, like rising. When rising came out, I remember every bb, like, man, that's a lot, of course. Wow, this computer, this real gene and and .

that was very good til .

was just like he we're didn't think, well, I do this you got the course, you wit and rock's all that nobody gets fired for money in delhi think gd says.

yeah well, I mean, here's here's the next thing. There is an article I linked to in the description believe this is also written by one mark coggin, but this article .

does not .

seem to feature will's hand. A lot of it's the the head is a md this top CPU share source ten percent tage points in a year. So um I will say intel for a deathtrap A C P U share.

This is A A report broad by mercury research, a going into the the actual market chain stuff and lone behold which which we knew uh intel actually still does hold a commanding lead over A M D. Um the what is so q three twenty twenty four market share stands at seventy one percent. Intel an AMD twenty eight percent.

But that is is up from nineteen percent year over a year for for AMD. So they they have ve done a lot right and they have made a ten percent swing in market chair, but still until has has A A very largely lead out there. So yeah.

but I mean, this is a trAiling what is business people said a trAiling indicator, lagg indicator, something. This is one of those ones that like if AMD is the only if AMD is the only company that sells desktop CPU this quarter, they're going to move in like two percentage points to three percentage points at outside. So this this is a big deal.

Yeah yeah, definitely. I mean.

especially because they they clock back three percent and laptops to which has traditionally been very hard bravely yeah right.

It's funny because like the laptop, the laptop rollout was much more stable and there's real clear there's clear direction there, right? Like if you want power battery life, you buy intel and you sacrifice a little bit of power.

If you want a little more power, you buy the AMD one, you just take us a little bit of battery life and if you want to be able to run like eight tens of your software that maybe think about and pass on the on the rest of that. Um so like like it's a it's a much easier proposition, I think. Then then say the deaths p stuff is which until the X D rolled out was like, hey, these are both kinder, okay, but they got some weird stuff. And if you like.

you know IT is legging desktop though. So uh if you look at the q three twenty twenty three um the market share split between intel and AMD on both the top and mobile was almost identical, eighty percent intel on both and nineteen percent AMD on both. But in that year time, a desktop a shut up to twenty eight percent, where mobile shot up to twenty two percent. So not the same kind of climb, but I definitely climb.

But but also the refreshes hadn't laded yet, right? So for these numbers to count, probably maybe these include the tail end of the refreshes, but lunar wouldn't have .

ended yet yeah lunar like only .

is just started to come out on the laptop .

over yeah just very like .

this is mean this is rap league I think is the last .

yeah which you would think out off of the the media lake launch that more people would have been looking at A M D, for sure. Media look at.

I mean, well, but I have seen a bigger difference.

I feel like we should have seen a bigger difference based on media like stuff. But once again.

I think we say here, venters man.

yeah like there there's all that there's all that ground works that until continues to be the the market, you know dominator and in both segments for for a lot of reasons like we're we're not going to see a flip of that for for many, many years if that if that happens.

the other fundamental problem with this kind of like we have limited data here, right, right? We have market share, but we don't have volume sales for those quarters. And like I would be curious if sales are down in twenty, twenty four, two, two because everybody he's kind of waiting and seeing to see what go like, like, good, like corporate customers don't wait and see because somebody starts they knew a new laptop. You buy a new laptop, right? But I think home consumers, like retail laptop purchases, probably the informed customers were kind of like him, and i'm going wait and see as media like things seems man because .

they they said that overall for CPU, like they were modestly up year over year but well below season norms, which still doesn't get into volume specifics. But it's a CPU. We're still kind of compared to last year.

To me, this really reflects that you know we're seeing an intel stock Price in my off and and stuff like that like they got caught out with a bader for CPU like a media lake was not garbage, but IT was not great. Like when we went to see last year, we were talking a laptop venters like, yeah, we're put down immediately yeah, I started to come in. but.

What you really want a way for his lunar league when that comes out around compute texts can be dope IT turns out that one percent true. And meanwhile, for these numbers, A D is right in one thousand and just launch. So that's obviously gonna give A D as like but at the same time we're all say and hey, nobody buy intel cbs because they're electric te themselves like between those two things are not surprised to see andy make a massively car yeah I mean.

that's a really good point because like there was appeared to time there if you were buying a high and unlock CPU, you just like, man, don't buy a thirteen nine ark, fourteen hundred k because they're catching on fire and we don't really know why .

leaving your mind are lower. And one of every PC game inside that you read, every PC site that you read to say, and hey, man, just don't buy and to right now, it's not worth that even if you're buying to go through you're quartier Y, I think you .

kind of listen well and they still knocked on on that right is there's .

a class now there's there's .

a lawsuit against until for somebody that bought thirteen and seven hundred k or something like that, that's like, you know they're trying to make get a class action, which is you knew was coming here.

We actually published the post on that this week as well. It's because part of its transparent troubleshooting process until was actually like, yeah, we identified this problem last year that was a limited batch. So we didn't do a recall. We just replace those ones like that kind of stuff.

So the bowers attention, the premise is that they launched the fourteen thousand series, knowing that there was a problem with that gap. Yeah.

yeah. So get all that in the court. No, that's a full boy. yeah. That that is another adding to another of intel's troubles court cases.

I mean, all I know is looking at these lunar lake and and the rise and A I nine stuff. If I had d bought a media like laptop in the start of this year, i'd be really bummed ed out right now.

I think yeah especially they don't only even get copilot you want copilot but actually be a .

feature yeah like the last lap time.

You can buy without copilot ably a selling point for a large ant audience.

Right here you go. You ve got to buy this. It's not going to a get copy.

You got got to get on that. But but I also that really has to hurt into the they were about these laptops and then microsoft roles at this giant marketing initiative that, that doesn't support the laptops that they have for three months, like that's going to impact those numbers to do so.

Yeah, well speaking, the impact in numbers, the there is another article that I have here that I I linked in the description what's a copy and payout so opens up a and h intel had their financials. Uh, recently I thought, good news. And one mark .

hawkins .

typewriter, he ching, the one hand, I mean like birds on his shelters and disney cess.

yes. And he's also yes. So good. Yeah so the the title here is intel lost more money then IT made last quarter subset is intel piled on the accounting change charges as IT goes through restructuring process. So yeah, high, high level. We did only into the details of necessarily financial stuff, but that's probably not good if a company doesn't make more money than IT spends.

I mean, what are the the losses are in investment and restart? Well, know this depreciation, but there's a lot of stuff in here. I mean, the till the are in until for a long time has been hay, their investing in fabs in the united states and theyve got some government money to help with that in their they're spending a lot of money to make money in the future in these long bets.

in these big long bets put pat keeps talking .

about the people going be .

even Better because looking so, so yes.

but but like they gonna a while yet before chips started rolling off the ata line. And in the meantime, they're in money to T, S, M, C for all of their new computer. Les, I actually I think all the tiles in in arrow lake are except the base tile are made by tsf. C so yeah like, yeah it's I don't know, man IT feels rough.

Yeah they've definite good stuff in yeah I mean, at the end of the day, to go back to something we're charging earlier, I think the the hard part for a lot of consumer confidence at least is IT like we've seen what at least what is this four launches now where it's launched the until has had really rough launches to the point where they've had to come out and be like, oh, yeah, we we agree this is a rough launch. We're going to work on IT.

We're going to learn from IT. And it's like how how many how many times can you come out and say that? I mean, it's good.

Listen, just people who work at in just you know just people trying to do their job get the stuff and stuff isn't lining up. There's obviously a lot of stuff that, that they're dealing with. But at the the end of the day, it's hard to have that that same narrative once again to be like, hey, we missed up.

We want to learn from IT. We're going to try to fix IT. You know how how many times can the general consumer market kind of go through that kind of stuff?

Think that part of IT is driven by the ambitious schools that they have because they keep saying and we want five notes s in four years, they've been on pace for that. And you know when you're russian trying to hit, those are very training with deadlines when you're making new computer processors from scratch out of sand and all the other little bits that go into IT. But when your russian stuff out like that to try to hit a milestone like that, like more team pains are bound to happen, I think so I hope to get caught up soon and take a look at more time to not necessarily rush out all these. Just I also .

wonder how much of IT is also related to the fact that, you know, we had some very unusual working conditions for at least a few years. So I I kind of I mean, this continues. Obviously, you can't attribute IT to you know trying to have to work fully remote or hybrid for a while.

And you know IT the chips one of intended the chips are just falling where they do. Um but I do wonder if we will start to see more stability and what's released from both intel honesty, you know AMD given how the figures gone as we get kind of past that error because you know some of this road max stuff like happens years before, right. Um so I am not giving anybody a past, but I just wonder how much of that is also a factor in all of .

this also yeah I mean um first in the show data has a good point there. The general know josh moo who goes into the best buy and buy the laptop is going be like h intel if there having problems. So like going and they're looking in a laptop, they're buying something and they I wish that they would look more at spects or you know research a little bit more over to PC old 点 com， you know for laptop buying advice.

but yeah you know or paste review over one hundred thirty different laptops this year.

So if you want to go pick IT up and it's new, this look breads back without ruining the the T V. Yeah no. So that is a good point.

I do wonder, I mean, they still have a commanding market chair. Uh, seventy seven percent has told nothing this needs at, uh, they do have uh, ambitious goals. I do think they have a long runway.

I don't think intel is just all the sudden going to you just go out of business. So I do think they have time, but yeah, it's they need to continue to work on IT need to continue to be transparent. I do like that.

I do like that, robby. I like when on the podcasting and most transparent, that's that's at all. Good stuff for sure.

Well, in the other thing to remember is that, like, we are harvard, like these are finance problems, right? Aren't these aren't like, hate that your computers not going to work. Problems, this is not. Hey, intel is not going to be here in five years. Problems, this is, I M, I mean, maybe, but this is, this is sixteen million .

dollars a corner.

No, no. They only lost three billion. They made fourteen billion. They lost sixteen. So, you know, I an account now, yeah, it's not like there's until us had two different problems. The one is that their chips are slow compared to the other guy's chips. The other is that they have spent a lot of money building up new infrastructure to do chips for the future.

And that that stuff, unfortunately, building a fb ozon, something you can do in a quarter, right? Like when you look at spending billion of dollars on these fabs and upgrading old fabs and whatever, I think the ata one is IOS some place. This stuff takes a long time and it's going to a take billions of dollars spent over a period of years and the market is like a man, why are you losing so much money? They don't care that they're buildings that's going to pay off this investment over twenty years. They just care that your numbers are not right this quarter and jim cramer yells about stuff on cnbc and then your stock goes down.

Capitalism, baby. Yes.

look, but at at least we ve got .

coke flavor ite ori as .

it's not good.

And your favorite coke.

many of favor, but mix IT to try that had terribly always be testing.

That's the theme of the podcasts we love the gest. yeah. So patience, other things.

this is rough times, but I don't think the spill the end for until in the but the stories, the stories is far from over. There's a lot, a lot of questions about feature stuff. And we did get one question in that I want to get to, which let's let's move over to the Q N. A, shall we questions yeah and answers.

If you get a question right now at the fuller podcast in the chat, this kind of the easiest way for us to see IT or if you're watching your listeners later, there's a link uh to the the discord go to hang out some fine folks over there and there's a channel that you can put a question in that hopefully you will get your your question read on on the next show that we're gonna. But we just got one in from from the show. Liquid r is twenty twenty five, the year of battle mage. Speaking of intel.

I mean, they didn't. They intel care and say, hey, we want big integrated CPU GPS.

Now yeah, there was that there was that, quote, simple ict trying to trying to diminish discrete GPU. What would you get from that bread?

Yeah, I think there's so good to be becoming. I don't have a lot of insights to how their perform yet. I would assume that d be in the same, you know affordable region as the initial art cards.

That quote gave me a lot of repetition um like IT might only be one or two graphics cards or affordable people. IT makes a lot of sense to try or chip makers to try to integrate graphics and get rid of the b two hundred dollar graphics cards to me. But yeah, this IT doesn't know good with everything else until that going on these days.

This this is the kind of quote you heard like six months before they killed labby, if I remember right? It's like, yeah, you know we're really optimistic about our CPU in our integrated graphics performance. And then they just don't they just that is kind of stop talking about the other one and and be fair.

the igp performance on leader like is is pretty good.

Yeah, there are rules that we might see battle age teeth. At least next month, we will see um if they rush out the teeth ahead of see yes, I feel like that would seem to me that I has not super great confidence against AMD and and videos next year stuff because I would expect to see d and and videos next change stuff at C S. So I mean, really we'll have to see they've done a lot of great work building up those cards.

They offered great value once the driver started working, I hope, is not the death of IT. To me, GPU are very important even for the data centers and businesses. We're until struggling right now like the whole big picture of .

they need GPS more now than ever before.

yes. So I hope I really hope he keeps going. But that's that's not super throw enough .

closed yeah I I mean, look, if they're going to roll out of GPU, given unless they unless they they have magic performance juice inside their GPU, it's going to make them beat everybody. The time to do IT is before everyone else does. And that seems like that window is closing. So I mean, in this december launch, baby, that's that's when you make your money in the G, P, U. game.

I didn't we say this last time too.

Look, I wasn't here last. I was very good point.

but I do think there's they're still like bread said they're gonna aiming at different markets. AMD sounds like AMD and video you're going to be a baby and video or is going to be aiming for for the moon in video or a AMD is still kind of in that, that mid range. I don't think they're going to roll out the lower end. But if if in token can come out in the low end focus on there, then you've got you know I think less competition, if that makes sense. Where in video is like you are aiming up to there and intel seaming down here and being really good Price for performance of fully yeah .

english cross.

we will see if IT to be determined. If twenty twenty five is the year of battling more.

competition is Better. So I would love for battle. May to come on, just kick us.

X two. The architecture that beat made based on is also the corner stone of the graphics inside of lunch, a lunar lake. Graphics, depending on the laptop they are in, are awesome. So that gives me hope that that of age might be significantly Better than that was.

No, uh, i'm going to get back to some super chats. And where were asked earlier? Uh, x pot x gave us five dollars. Thank you so much. Thank you and said this is actually one for well, every go do you think do you think an I nine ninety nine hundred k will handle a fifty ninety fully at four k one hundred and forty four hits ultra uh, hundred twenty five to one hundred fifty percent render in color duty modern world for nineteen vanguard's ta.

no, I do not think that I have an nine hundred gates, my stream machine.

You just put a fifteen and you got.

you got fifty. I need a power supply of great ability to run forty eight in that thing.

This is obviously a very pointed question, and we don't know what the fifty is. But can ten ninety one hundred k get bottle neck by a forty ninety right now?

Yeah, hundred percent. I got when I, so I was running of ninety nine hundred k is my main insistent. The forty nineties came out and I had to borrow a CPU in order to test that thing and get actual numbers that made sense out of IT because IT was bottle next like crazy on the ninety and eight.

Just I think probably the memory memory in that machine was like thirty six hundred mega transaction. So IT was IT. IT was slow and that was probably then like last gas present for like right present three probably was fifty eight hundred, was at fifty hundred.

I don't think seventy hundred experts were out yet. The the body was still yeah so I probably I think I tested on a on intel twelve nine hundred five to guess and that was that was 2 it's but I mean， at the same time, it's gonna fast. You're going to get you're .

going to when you get four k one hundred forty four hours with hundred .

render in color duties tty I don't not super familiar with modern worth is mother worth at one thousand the two versions ago? I think now .

no .

ah I think they're saying what .

the next years you're going to .

get if you have a forty ninety or fifty ninety whatever uncalled duty, whatever you could put in in in in a sky lake and you're gonna get OK performance probably because the way color duty works.

I can't remember you somebody had testing on youtube where they tried to match a forty ninety with the lowest GPU like modern G, P, U. I. I can't even remember what G, P, U wasn't like just to see how much a bottle CPU. Yeah sorry.

Here's here's a thing about this question though, like it's very specific to this berry game. To me that game is five years old yeah like I would not be surprised. The CPU is the bottle up there. If you get a fifty, fifty nine or forty ninety, that will not be the body. This is the CPU definitely will be the question is though that game is five years old, can not even handle if you drop in in ninety eight hundred x 3d is IT the engine possible to run that high？ Like I would try to go look for youtube videos and see if there's someone else who are looking for this exact thing in that exact game because, yes, upgrading your CPU with theoretically give you higher frame rates in those older card games, but there is no guarantee that the engine can keep up with that anyway.

Well, and the fundamental problem with the forty ninety, much less the whatever five thousand series and video comes out with, is that it's always CPU bound. IT is really hard to make video games not CPU bound with a forty ninety to the point that like we put forty nineties in our CPU test beds so that everything is CPU bound. Ah it's just .

a also I have to have to cricket myself. I thought I thought they were making a joke like monitor for nineteen like you know, in the future. Now they meet for three from twenty nine. okay.

So I think .

that they were .

just saying like the guard .

when guards the the leg ever day, I think it's the word or two one that .

they're making a joke on. To work for in nineteen ah I think we're .

already passed on to work for in nineteen.

You're not anyway maybe yeah uh very special question. Uh, from the show, my quinton gave us a ten dollars per chat. Think so much. Our our intel CPU sold mostly on desktops or laptops, meaning mobile in real terms.

What is AMD market chair increase in servers? How close is a ammo to taking away in lls total PC or server market chair? That report actually did get into server stuff.

Let's see if I can find IT a quick a server CPU share. A third quarter twenty twenty four stands at seventy five percent intel, twenty four percent A M. D. So that number .

varies depending on which analysts is looking at. IT f AMD. Rising epic processors are not rising, have up to a third chair and many reports of detailed or .

overall market bread, sorry, of new sales or of overall .

market new sales, it's tending towards it's getting bigger. The more reason that is intel, predominantly, not predominantly, but the biggest slice of the pie is laptops. Most people via laptops, most people don't buy that top is businesses and gamers are different.

So it's definitely laptops. That's the part where amy is lag in behind, but he has been making big in roads and over the last few generations. But I feel like if A N D continues to, you keep gabbling up server share, getting all the IT or done their side keeps scowling up desktop share, P, C, gamer share, getting the gamer enthusiast on their side. Like I feel like glad bs are sure to .

follow in simple yeah yeah so yeah yes, you're right. Laptop far and away the larger largest amount of devices like it's sold. But .

there's a reason that .

we reveal one hundred and thirty yeah I like IT get to some more questions over here on the discord um a wow I don't know saying .

this .

A A lyric yeah new questions hot off the press uh welcomed discord. So uh Price forecast for in videos fifty series we we talked about that recently a during the wood maybe three weeks ago I came about .

us yeah we were talking .

about rumors. But has that changed for you at all? I don't remember what you are Price that you are aiming for that bread. Has that changed for you at all since then?

Doesn't to me. I can see IT going from twenty five hundred and thirty five hundred dollars. And I explain all my thoughts why in that ninety rumors edict .

that i'm still sticking .

with two thousand, they sell, they sell the black world parts for fifty thousand dollars to data centers.

It's a deal. The more you buy, the more you save is what I had to yeah .

and I mean the T L B R is the file. Nineties came out of fourteen and ninety nine. We have been seen them sold for less than two thousand dollars.

The fifty and .

nineteen ninety.

whatever was a hundred. But yeah.

it's all the same. Like the real answers is if you have to ask kids, probable probably you're out of the range.

But the rumors say the memory is double lyn, which is going to make IT super awesome for developers, nai enthusiasts and people who want to mind another bitcoins going and and that you can find on GPU. But that kind of stuff, and I think that in video realizes that they Prices IT too low. Seen the sad Price of ninety nine can buy a less than two thousand books. They're to want some of that money back. So I think the fifty ninety is gonna be a piece of a card that most people cannot afford unless you're using their work.

yeah. And I I still I still feel like the fifty ninety Price will change. I mean, we're kind of debating on how much should will change, but I still feel like the rest of the stack doesn't change that. The fifty, ninety, they just push further out and be like y, if you really want one of these and you really want one of these, the rest of the deck stays the same.

I mean, why would they leave money on the table though? If they can argue that it's gonna more performance, then why I would they leave money on the table?

Already pushed. And so .

I mean, said companies are in business money.

Officer, yeah, but in video is in the unique position of this market being relatively miniscule compared to the place that they make real money now.

And therefore, you know like what what's there if they if they jack Prices up twenty percent on customers like they did last go around, it's not going to impact their bottom line at all, right? Like like when they're seven, these gp s for for A I data centers at fifty K A op, this is this is like there's no up. There's yeah it's we're insignificant.

So and here's here's a thing I think a lot of people don't realize because you don't talk with representation from the video and intelligent amy, the way that like we do, they really care about their public perception at in video like I was pretty harsh on the forty series and like why the hell is this two hundred and thirty dollars more than the last one for five percent more performance? And I think that sort of criticism when they had a lot of questions around IT, they're like, hey, let's talk about this level, level. But but then the super series also did come out because they don't want negative press like that lights all the headlines. I think that's the reason we saw the super a series now as the reason we saw the super series for the twenty series because I was the same complaints, I actually agree with adam.

And in the forty eighteen did drop in Price for the super. So don't. yes.

yeah. So yes, I don't think they're completely immune. E, I don't. Yeah, that is my my guesses is that the the fifty nine just could push out further the rest of Priceless. Ld.

well.

the rest of them, real people have to buy, and not that A I developers and what that are not real people, but gamers have to buy. And trying to justify more than a grain on the graphic card .

card would be in with you. You're paying for IT and know companies pay for IT. Yes.

well, but but also AMD is signal that they're they want to get the fat part of the curve, right? They want to get that mid range part. And like the thing in video doesn't want to do because you don't keep your stock prize nicer high seating market share. So so they're gone to do whatever they have to do .

to maintain that, that market share. Oh, but I mean, I think there like eighty percent, but not much much .

are the but okay, so there's a business school and tide that people share about sterno. Sterno is a can heat product that you know it's it's like fuel in a can you use IT for fund U E dishes and chasing dishes up like that really, really popular in the global south.

The time and IT IT had ninety five percent of the global market and the company that own sterna was like, hey, man, every division of our of our company is going to increase market share this year. They were like, dude, we got ninety five percent. How are we're going to do this? And so they paid a whole bullock of consultants to come in and figure out how to car two point five percent out of whatever other Candy products existed in the market.

They don't they are going to do whatever they can to not lose market share. And if that means that they been out, some failed blackwells for for mid range gaming cards that light the world on fire, it's no skin off for there to those things were going to go in the recycling. But anyway, so it's going to be this is a i'm widely curious ous, to see how these cards perform on all, all three fronts.

And b i'm curious if this maybe we we'll have A A launch that everybody doesn't the numbers don't come and everything like, oh, no, these numbers are lower than we respecting something jacked up on testing because theoretically, GPU are at least a little bit similar than than everything else. Yeah I don't know. It's weird.

Yeah we're going talk. We're to all that testing um yeah so um from the show yeah a plastic said I asked, what are the second and third largest PC slashed consumer components that utilizes the fastest speed PCI sixteen slot can offer IT? Seems that all we know these days only a GPU sits on that slot, not not including severe grade components. So essentially asking what else can you put in A A by sixteen slot that is gonna actually use by sixteen? That is not a some weird like like A A bread um shoemaker kind of so well.

some people put some there's high speed next, high speed internet connects for next and then there's also weird st slots that have like yeah or yeah that have like yeah five five by four m two yeah five five PCI five or four PCI five m four m two slots that are four lanes each can fill sixteen slot card. That's what this is.

This is four M D two slots. So yeah um of P C I five ah yeah so yeah I think I think there's a lot of people who use these kind of things. I don't think Normal people use these. I think is more for nerds like us to need a lot of storage and things like that.

Genuine question, how about video capture cards .

that they are like one way days.

even I want to say even that i'll gotto that what the ones that are like .

four by four thousand.

there .

are four.

Yeah, they are used by four, but they really only need by one.

Same thing with audio cards. The small minority, they left the network.

network can can use more than four lanes. But it's not you don't, you're fine.

Yeah yeah. Would say extreme network and extreme storage is the real true answer to this. Yeah, yeah.

yeah. So I mean, yeah, other than real weird edge cases, do .

thunder's. What about thunderball? If you, if you have a thunder five board, do you have to have a um do you eat a slot with that or that just have a weird on the back of the motherboard as support you.

So because for a .

while there .

you're thundering my issues my like x what was x eight ninety or whatever the ninety k has a daughter card is the underbid. I think it's about one.

Oh yeah .

anymore. Yes, for .

yeah for no.

people don't say that anymore.

We are all here. go. Here is a good question from A A trave.

The first first question suggestion for the full nerd. welcome. Thank you so much. I'm excited. Get to this.

Gordon wonders on as ninety eight hundred extra review, how would a dull excrete chip perform in content creation workloads? I think that the highlight followed question for the cp review. Could you guys discuss a bit more on the podcast?

So we kind of hit this a little bit.

But yes, but I I want to make sure i've read the question. They just kind of follow up. They were talking about tdp stuff, which we didn't not get into because the ninety eight hundred x three, definitely A I I have a video i'm working on right now. I'm putting IT through to th Epaces o n A A r eally l ow p rofile a ir c ooler. And the seventy one hundred x 3d does not hit T J max or tdp h IT。 IT is not hitting the the max even under that that scenario a at stock the nine nine hundred and thirty d does so it's it's definite using more power is definitely you using more of the juice, especially compared to ninety seven hundred x which uh in in the video I I tested at both sixty five one which is the default but also then the over uh the over clock or not over clock the optional one hundred and five what in the so I tested both and definitely made IT a big impact um so yeah I do wonder that that does in my mind mean that a ninety nine fifty extra is definitely probably gna juice harder than a seventy nine fifty fifty if that makes sense.

I I also wondered if the upside down be cash is going to make a difference on the tool die tool ccd chips because like if if IT was that, hey, fast, slow, fast, fast, no cash, slow, lots of cash. Like if if IT was that, there was making the dull ccd chips not make sense or if I was hay doesn't make you just don't need that many cores with the vast cash that made sense of so we .

will see you I am gonna call if that does happen.

it's gonna at least one hundred dollars more than the city.

It's going to be a real expensive.

But either way, I embracing myself for whatever that nine hundred and fifty x three d comes at that i'm sure i'm sure that it's going to eat up more juice and require more cooling.

I dollars flat. That's how they get the big dub as they make a fifty dollar, the best CPU you can possibly buy and only fifty box for fifty two, fifty box.

I think I was in charge.

That's what I would go. yeah. Remember when yet when the foot two came out, that thing was two hundred and ninety nine dollars, and IT was the first gp, goodbye. Good time. Two hundred box.

Thank you. done. What's the was is a comment, not a question from front of the show? Coffee gave us six ninety nine canadian dollars. Thank you so much.

What's frustrated about the R, T, X forty ninety is that IT offers good Price to performance, you know? Yeah, yes, IT IT does. But IT does not matter if you can't afford IT.

But if you care about noise, if you care about noise, the best thing you can do is by a forty ninety, lock your frame rate to sixty hearts and the fans are never going to spend up when you play your video again. Or forty, forty.

I love the ninety ninety. What's first rating to me about IT is in past generations, like though you being for book, I got worse. The higher up the skill that you went.

If you bought, uh, thirty eighty, then spending more on the thirty ninety wouldn't make sense basically. But if you want that last five to ten percent of frames, that's what you had to spend you to spend the extra twenty percent. For the forty serious generation in video launched the forty ninety like said that as a base for the value for all the rest of IT. If you look at the the elle non super parts and look at the performance to get versus the forty ninety IT matches up like almost perfectly like the forty eighty is seventy percent of IT or whatever and the forty sixty eight like images screwed up presence. We are the generation.

Yeah come more caution to good dad here front of the show. Crack on. Has one for elena, you're ready. yeah. Does only to think the nine thousand extra d CPU are a value if they are premium Priced and out of reach for a poor gamer? Or must we buy last years extreme or even two years ago?

I would actually like to hear that question again.

Does the lame to think the nine thousand hundred, the nine thousand series of extra CPU are of value if they are premium Priced and out of the reach for a poor gamer? It's kind like what we are just talking about with the forty ninety is like, oh, hey, really good press reformers, but you still need to spend almost two thousand dollars.

So, so is a question.

So IT really boils down to you, how do you define the word value, right? Is value something to you? Where is just really cheap and you get a ton for that? Or is value that you get a lot for the amount that you paid, right? So if you're somebody who wants that performance, you may find IT a very like high, like you ve got a lot of value out of that trip because for the amount that you've spent, you feel like you get so much for IT, right? But if you're somebody and and I think for this particular question because they added that kolia, that for poor gamer, they're basically saying their value, their definition of value, is how how can I get a ton for very little money? So is this going to be a good value for me? And then for you specifically in this question, no, that's not good value because you can afford IT. And so therefore, you've overspent basically to get something that's I just a bit a lawyer, a kind of answer, I guess um but that's kind of what I asked you to twice because I was like, you do I feel like I feel like is that is really good and asking .

me this question would be doing the bill clinton boys .

right now you actually .

heard that when I was say, I can do we do you find value?

And IT makes a lot sense. Like if you if you are in a tight budget, like to be the best value right now is to go get one of those fifty, seven hundred and three days. But the hundred days, the hundred x three d you can find IT, but you can put the seven hundred x on A M four with D D R four. You may you have an a rockin game machine for chief, but we are talking about the ninety eight hundred x three day like it's twenty five percent faster in games to thirty percent faster in IT back in several punk we stop forty five percent faster than the two later five k um in that chip cost like one hundred and thirty more dollars. So compared to that, like ninety eight hundred extra, a screaming value IT all depends on what you trying to buy me.

IT was .

the first in the word poor， right? Like somebody so like we get we do get some international you know, commenters sometimes. And somebody who's in india, like their budget is completely different.

And someone who considers them a poor sells a poor gamer in the united states. So again, it's just so relative. That's why, that's why people ask me for advice. I always asked them, what are the specifics to your situation? I need your budget and you know you you you're desired like frame rates or you know otherwise what your other goals are and like how much will when you have in your budget like we'll start there and then will go go from that.

Yeah uh last question here from front of the show. Borry is zero, uh, because is interesting. Uh, since we're on the verge of another bitcoin boom, we actually didn't .

know we are ready there.

No culture. great. Do you think? Do you expect GPU mining apocalypse three point out to swallow blackwell in r DNA four? Or do you think there's been A D coupling between the two? No, no.

But my understanding is that the current popular cyp dou stuff isn't really minded with gp s anymore.

You have to have specialized six. Oh, really? yes. no.

Where the black well changes you I don't know. But but my my understanding is is that like you have been mining big coin on a GPU effectively in a half a decade almost at this point right?

Exist when a theory um like the bigger ones are like that .

theory of of proof work and that changed for them. Rain, yes yeah.

that the smaller niche ones are the ones you'd have to worry about if that want to come back big. I my persons, i'm more worried about just the raw like wafers being allocated to A I chips rather than gamer chips than I am about miners taking gaming graphic starts.

Yeah yeah. Do you wonder how much how much stock is going to be allocated for for these new, these new parts?

yeah. The last of retrograde has the right, the last crypto boom. And the recent video cards were really hard to get in twenty, twenty, twenty, twenty into the pandemic was because the theory um was explicitly made to be GPU friendly for mining after bitcoin. Wed and so yeah anyway .

yeah right I .

am before you in .

the show we miss one super chat this back when we are talking about the ninety eighty hundred eight back in the days uh friend to show forty four, give us eighty nine danger close. Thank you very much. Uh, just a comment to say, use eight course and go to the park with the rest and see three d trees, three dees with .

trees in .

game instance episode .

predicted .

that one point. So we might see .

that real talk during the pandemic. I was staring at screens for so much of like my waking life because I was just wasn't going outside that I literally had a thought one time when I was looking at my cat. Now I was just like, wow, the dynamic range on this is just amazing.

Look at the fur rendering. It's perfect .

in my home and .

just I was like, I need to go sign tech dress like I just put a Price on and just go on set of grass. My brain, my brain going to is a weird place this .

year when my cat runs by the one percent loser, really nici loaded up.

I loaded up the intendo music gap in one, my daughter and wife in a storm, taking something up the day I started playing the animal crossing music. And they vote. Both have like full on pandemic flashbacks, and my daughter still play the animal crossing, but they were like, no man, you can't play the animal crossing menu music in the car. That's not okay.

Yeah, sometimes speaking in, sometimes everyone should go have some fun times. That's another. The other thing we here .

the funny is that .

everyone .

should go have. He got the whole thing in his mouth, which is no head too.

Yes, a takes good after the third.

I bet you wish you had a nice coke to wash down with milk.

And I were a .

little.

That's A, I love that .

you're still in YSL .

still going.

Why should around your mouth fill those pops is very minimal pops. And if you put in your mouth.

no.

we know, oh.

good is your .

mouth is pretty fast.

Js is right. Adam is an oral shill. They're here. I will eat, but more, more of coke show. I tell you, these are the .

first arias in my life that we've ever thrown out. Some that were uneven, like usually you have despite not loving .

that or you.

but the .

box is pretty empty. How much did you test in day one? I want to know .

it's four years last four.

It's a box yeah .

like .

those guys who spent five thousand .

hours honesty game and steam and then give IT A I was .

played three thousand. I say I would .

say they know best.

but they are sure bread they are so sure you .

got to have a large enough sample size. And I had the sample.

Dota two, this game was great until they nerve my main guy. No more jungle for me. Thumbs down. Ten thousand hours play.

You know what? Ivan has a right fuller sponsorship by orio twenty twenty five that's ago for nars labs.

but we probably .

shouldn't spend our day dumping .

on their coco.

But then but then also I just ate how many sixty? So six. I I one yes.

So there eight, fourteen.

Put those or use an ice cream for science. For science always be testing, always be testing as what we say here on the full nerd that rapped IT up for this week. Ah check back next week for this uh, for your fix of PC talk here on the fullard to listen to us on the ghost scrap to us on pocket cast. Uh, apple podcast, spotify, youtube music, anywhere you can .

point you are we're on these are now we, I don't know, probable .

got the nerd, this desert still a thing.

I I don't know, dessert still around my .

pod cases .

on desert because somebody asked for IT.

Oh no, the end of week. Be thanks for making me do more work.

I just wanted to get some are for the kids.

for the kids, kids. All the kids are on desk also. All, all the kids described to us over on a tiktok.

Know we got a former tiktok over there. Check IT out. Yeah, all the kids do this to .

behind the scenes. Actually.

I ve been done behind the scenes yet. Or hot takes, mostly just clip from the show OK. But we were going to expand IT to be fun. If anyway, if you are on any of those services, including desire, I guess, in the future, then please leave a review. Every time you do a new oil flavor comes out that I get to try.

that's actually the first time you've .

been something true.

But yes, actually correct.

I want to thank the people who join me on today's episode that includes a linee by everyone ah that also includes bread chirky.

Hey, it's me, idea, internet.

Good look. Good look also to William smith.

Thank you for help me. As always, it's pressure to be here. I'm a William. No, my middle. Me Williams is my middle name for you.

And thank you especially to the foodie himself, Wilson lai, who controlled the version and horizontal and thank you everybody in the chat, we will see that. Thank everyone. Uh actually I uh glad that adam you are testing uh oils in the lab safely here with with people not randomly on shower floors off the floor, you know so don't be keep and say thank you very for trying and we will see you next time by. Just realize, well, as you're not going to be with me this, but see yes to stop me now 点。